Interseptopus
Footballguy
We have 5 bench spots, 1 IR. I own Engram and already have Guice on IR (round 8 keeper value). Dropping Engram never crossed my mind. Olsen was IRed but if he were released I would have grabbed him
You're set
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
TE Evan Engram, DEN (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
You're set
rockaction
Footballguy
It's kind of hard to believe I'm ninth in my league until I realize that I got drunk at my draft.
eta* I kid. They're pretty good. We've got seven guys at 2-2. There's parity there.
Last edited by a moderator:
Concept Coop
Footballguy
I’m not expecting much this year. Barkley’s targets aren’t going anywhere. Like you, I’m holding if I can’t get good value in dynasty. But I’d love to add to him for Ertz/Kelce or “downgrade” to Njoku/Howard/Kittle.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
I'm not expecting a lot... but he has talent and defenses are certainly going to shift everything towards, OBJ, Saquon and Sterling. 
Has to be about 11th ROY at worst. And 7th seems about right when you consider all the fluctuating factors of the others listed higher.
Has to be about 11th ROY at worst. And 7th seems about right when you consider all the fluctuating factors of the others listed higher.
buck naked
Footballguy
I'm hoping someone can explain to me how Engram got only 17 snaps in week 11, getting out-snapped by a guy named Simonson (18) and by Rhett Ellison (40). I'm dumbfounded.
Last edited by a moderator:
shadyridr
Footballguy
Giants OLine is a mess. They need blockers. Engram is not a blocking TE. Hes droppable at this point.
The Frankman
Footballguy
Simple. Rhett Ellison is an excellent blocker and can catch a bit. Simonson is a rookie TE who can't catch worth a damn but can block. Engram cannot block if his life depended on it. Basically Shurmur is trying to matchup Engram more on plays he can line line up wide and doesn't have to fake a block, because he's bad at it and it just slows him down. He's a 2nd year TE whose usage got blown up with no one around. What makes life problematic for Engram is the emergence of WRs not named Beckham Jr. or Sheperd. Corey Coleman and Bennie Fowler are getting target now, and keep in mind Eli isn't passing 30 times a game most weeks.
Last edited by a moderator:
tombonneau
Footballguy
Snaps in this game aside, I think the Checkdown Eli + Barkley combo has a lot to do with it. I still love EE as one of the best pass-catching TEs in dynasty. The next few seasons might not be super great, but I see him having a 3-5 year stretch at some point where he is a year-in-year-out Top 3 fantasy TE.
I'd continue to have some trepidation, this was a tweet yesterday, not sure how much OBJ news alters things, maybe none if they want to try and run the ball more.
Evan Engram is set to return vs. Redskins. Role should be similar to what it was prior to the hamstring injury, which is as a passing-down TE playing about half the Giants offensive snaps.
https://twitter.com/JordanRaanan/status/1071113135577280513
bb7278
Footballguy
I appreciate that, just thinking if ODB is out and Norman is on Shep since this yesterday news it might have changed, he should be lined up as a WR more also, besides Barkley hes their most talented player warts and all.
Different regime but Engram did well when Beckham was out last year.
Last edited by a moderator:
If you isolate Engram's 4 almost full games that he played with Odell last year he actually did just as good with him as without him and on same amount of targets per game.
I'd looked at that this last off-season and figured you also had Marshall getting 21 targets those 4 games so I was not concerned with Barkley as I figured he'd be about a wash. Might go without saying but I was big on drafting Engram and telling people this off-season the Odell concerns were overblown.
While drafting Engram was a major mistake on my part I still think the Odell concerns were overblown. Barkley getting a little more use in passing game then I expected is one issue but the big issue, why I'd not be so quick to assume Engram benefits, is in fact the regime.
I hope you are right in your belief and it works out for you and I can have confidence putting Engram in my lineups next week but he'll remain benched this week on numerous teams.
Jello_Biafra
Footballguy
In the same way that Brady has been ignoring Gronk. The Giants O runs through Barkley, he now has him to dump off to. Brady dumps off to White and they run it with Michel. Last year the Giants didn't just lose Beckham, they lost Marshall and Sheppard and they had no Barkley, so Engram was the focal point of the offense. I think long term Engram will be fine, if the Giants improve their OL. For now, blocking TEs make more sense for the Giants O.
tombonneau
Footballguy
I agree. Stinks that after the fast start it's probably gonna be year 4 before he really to peak. But talent is still there. In the right offense he can be an 80-90 catch guy.
Milkman
Footballguy
Yeah and the offense sucks. Funny how that works. Teams don't use their best players and their offense tends to struggle. Eli is the main problem.......hopefully they move on from him this offseason.
dickey moe
Fingerpicker
This guy killed my teams this year.
tombonneau
Footballguy
The offense is great if the staff gets compensated on Barkley's fantasy points. Not so much for Ws and Ls though.
Jello_Biafra
Footballguy
You've watched many Giants games, then? Because I'd like to know why you think Eli is the main problem. I must be watching something else. Eli is a warrior. Not many QBs would make it through the multiple seasons of porous OL play. Granted, a mobile QB might be able to avoid some sacks, but blaming Eli for the offense is just wrong.
The Frankman
Footballguy
https://www.rotoworld.com/article/odds-and-ends/fantasy-fallout-odell-beckham-traded-cle
Evan Engram just went from a bit of a late rounder to possible Top 5 TE value, and that's being conservative.
Evan Engram just went from a bit of a late rounder to possible Top 5 TE value, and that's being conservative.
Milkman
Footballguy
Agreed. Think Engram would have had a good year last year if he hadn't got hurt. He closed the season very strong once he got healthy.
Over his last 3 games he averaged
6.3 catches
81 yards
.33 TDs
8.6 targets
That prorates to a 100-1296-5 season
Ilov80s
Footballguy
I just look at the Metcalf, Fant, Engram athletic profiles on playerprofiler and think they have so much in common.
Milkman
Footballguy
Fant and Engram are very similar. What we don't know is if whoever drafts Fant will use him right away like the Giants did Engram.
BigTex
Don't mess with Texas
He helped we through my playoff and Championship run. I’m all in on anyone that helped bring home the $$$$$!
Tex
Grabbed him cheap in one league while he was still injured last year. Received a lot of low ball offers this offseason now that OBJ has been traded but I am not selling him short. He stays healthy I think he'll be a top 5 TE, not Ertz/Kelce level of course but enough of PPG difference to seperate himself materially from the rest of the TE scrum in the 7~15 range.
BigTex
Don't mess with Texas
Wow! As an Engram owner those last two articles are very interesting and bring up something to consider. He has a bright future ahead.
Tex
Raptors409
Footballguy
Would be very happy to have him as my TE. Great player and has the potential to be for the next 8-10 years.
Of course, who knows how many of us will be around in 8-10 years?
Of course, who knows how many of us will be around in 8-10 years?
Biabreakable
Footballguy
A lot of people have been looking at Sterling Shephard or Golden Tate picking up the opportunities that used to go to Beckham.
I am not really seeing it that way. I think Golden Tate picks up a slice of what Beckham used to do and that Shephard stays pretty much the same as he has been.
Barkley had 120 targets as a rookie. It is hard for me to see him getting even more targets than this, although I suppose its possible.
In 2017 Odell Beckham only played in 4 games. It was Elis worst season since 2013 and Eli missed a game that year as well. In that situation Engram led the team in targets as a rookie,in the 15 games he played.
Eli actually had a bounce back year in 2018 where he threw the highest completion percentage for a season in his career 66% a big part of that is because of Barkley but Pat Shurmurs offense very favorable to QBs Bradford and Keenum as well.
Eli Manning the last 3 seasons
2016 16 598 attempts 377 completions 4027 yards 26 TD
2017 15 games 571 attempts 352 completions 3468 yards 19 TD ( pro rated for the missed game 609 attempts 375 completions 3699 yards 20 TD)
2018 16 games 576 attempts 380 completions 4299 yards 21 TD
3 year average 16 games 594 attempts 377 completions 4008 yards 22 TD
If Barley maintains his targets from last year that is 120
Shephard has averaged 6.8 targets per game over his first 3 seasons which over 16 is 110 targets
Engram has averaged 6.8 targets per game over the 26 games he has played in, but given that he only has about 1.5 seasons worth of games there is room for this number to go up in Beckhams absence.
Golden Tates numbers with the Lions and Eagles last season were similar to what he has done before in terms of yards per reception and catch rate. He just didn't get as many targets as he had been for the 3 seasons prior with the Lions. He will be 31 years old.
He had 113 targets last year which is a similar rate as Shephard and Engram.
So if it splits evenly like this that would be a total of 450 targets going to these 4 players and there is still another 150 targets remaining for throw aways and targeting other players. I don't really see Rhett Ellisons target rate going up
He did have 34 targets last year, however 12 of those were in games 11 and 12 where Engram was out. Once Engram returned to the line up his targets dissipated.
I think there is still substantial opportunity left for any of these 4 players to get more opportunity than what they have averaged in the absence of Beckham. It could be evenly distributed or maybe one of these four gets more than the others. They did still throw to Gallman 22 times and 3 other WR combined for 67 targets. So considering something similar will happen again although the majority of opportunity goes to the top 4 players there are about 50 or so targets left, although half of those will likely be throw aways.
Engram saw his efficiency stats improve on his rookie season. His catch rate improved to 70% from 55% his rookie year and his yards per target went up to 9 which is very good. That was only 6.3 as a rookie. If Engram maintains that with 110 targets over 16 games it would be 77 receptions 990 yards and some TD.
The TD upside with Eli has been poor as he only thew 21 TD last year and 19 the year before, but if Engram is healthy he should have a lot of receptions and yards.
I am not really seeing it that way. I think Golden Tate picks up a slice of what Beckham used to do and that Shephard stays pretty much the same as he has been.
Barkley had 120 targets as a rookie. It is hard for me to see him getting even more targets than this, although I suppose its possible.
In 2017 Odell Beckham only played in 4 games. It was Elis worst season since 2013 and Eli missed a game that year as well. In that situation Engram led the team in targets as a rookie,in the 15 games he played.
Eli actually had a bounce back year in 2018 where he threw the highest completion percentage for a season in his career 66% a big part of that is because of Barkley but Pat Shurmurs offense very favorable to QBs Bradford and Keenum as well.
Eli Manning the last 3 seasons
2016 16 598 attempts 377 completions 4027 yards 26 TD
2017 15 games 571 attempts 352 completions 3468 yards 19 TD ( pro rated for the missed game 609 attempts 375 completions 3699 yards 20 TD)
2018 16 games 576 attempts 380 completions 4299 yards 21 TD
3 year average 16 games 594 attempts 377 completions 4008 yards 22 TD
If Barley maintains his targets from last year that is 120
Shephard has averaged 6.8 targets per game over his first 3 seasons which over 16 is 110 targets
Engram has averaged 6.8 targets per game over the 26 games he has played in, but given that he only has about 1.5 seasons worth of games there is room for this number to go up in Beckhams absence.
Golden Tates numbers with the Lions and Eagles last season were similar to what he has done before in terms of yards per reception and catch rate. He just didn't get as many targets as he had been for the 3 seasons prior with the Lions. He will be 31 years old.
He had 113 targets last year which is a similar rate as Shephard and Engram.
So if it splits evenly like this that would be a total of 450 targets going to these 4 players and there is still another 150 targets remaining for throw aways and targeting other players. I don't really see Rhett Ellisons target rate going up
He did have 34 targets last year, however 12 of those were in games 11 and 12 where Engram was out. Once Engram returned to the line up his targets dissipated.I think there is still substantial opportunity left for any of these 4 players to get more opportunity than what they have averaged in the absence of Beckham. It could be evenly distributed or maybe one of these four gets more than the others. They did still throw to Gallman 22 times and 3 other WR combined for 67 targets. So considering something similar will happen again although the majority of opportunity goes to the top 4 players there are about 50 or so targets left, although half of those will likely be throw aways.
Engram saw his efficiency stats improve on his rookie season. His catch rate improved to 70% from 55% his rookie year and his yards per target went up to 9 which is very good. That was only 6.3 as a rookie. If Engram maintains that with 110 targets over 16 games it would be 77 receptions 990 yards and some TD.
The TD upside with Eli has been poor as he only thew 21 TD last year and 19 the year before, but if Engram is healthy he should have a lot of receptions and yards.
Last edited by a moderator:
Jordan Raanan @JordanRaanan
Other practice observations:
TE Evan Engram looks really good. Deadly with YAC
DeAndre Baker up and down of late. Beaten deep (even tho inc.) by Cody Latimer. Life not easy for rookie CBs.
Rookie TE C.J. Conrad continues to shine, even w/a drop. Can block + catch.
This next one was posted in the training camp thread courtesy of @Bracie Smathers
Raptors409
Footballguy
I reach for him in every draft. I don’t play the TE carousel.
Young and upside. Draft early and enjoy.
Young and upside. Draft early and enjoy.
The Frankman
Footballguy
I don't reach for TEs, and I certainly can't in a 16-teamer. But if Engram is still around in the 6th round I definitely gotta think about it.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Faust said:
dipandglide
Footballguy
Talent (x)
volume (x)
3rd year (x)
Engram is going to win leagues if he stays healthy.
volume (x)
3rd year (x)
Engram is going to win leagues if he stays healthy.
