The Chris Johnson Hype machine (1 Viewer)

[shader]

CJ is a rookie and leads the AFC in rushing.

Yeah Lendale is vulturing touchdowns. That's keeping him from being a top 5 player.

But he's still going to finish the year in the top ten among RB's which is all I said all pre-season.

The scary thing is that he hasn't even broken out yet. He's so close, but if you've watched the games, you know it's coming.

I think he'll get 1500 rushing yards, add about 300 receiving yards and score 10 total TD's.

Right now Fisher isn't running him into the ground because he's got the playoffs to worry about, and rookies are known to hit the "rookie wall".

And if you've seen how crappy Lendale is, you know how much trouble the Titans offense would be in if CJ has to sit in January due to being overworked.

 

[millertyme1]

 

 

[hotlanta]

The less I see of LenDale's little endzone dance the better.

 

[Banger]

Look who came out to play today. It's the Chris Johnson haters attempting to shovel dirt on his season because he was "held" to 25 more yards than LenDale White on the same amount of carries.

Keeping coming in here and knocking Johnson without watching him play. Seriously, keep coming in here. For the last two weeks, the critics were as sparse as parked cars at 3AM in an open-all-night supermarket. Now he's held to 83 total yards on the same day that Adrian Peterson is held to 77 total yards, and we find out that Johnson was all hype all along.

At the desperation to crawl out of the woodwork in Week 3 to bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

I don't think it's the haters coming out, but the facts, White has 4 TD's CJ 1. It will continue to be a 50/50 split, as it makes teams to prepare for both backs. CJ will get the yards, White the TD's which is the better back, well in my league white has 37 points CJ 36. Neither of these guys are going to win you a FF trophy alone.CJ is a nice #3RB or flex, but the hype is overblown based on the facts.

Well, there ya go...3 weeks of facts and the verdict is in. For White to keep up he'll need to score 21 tds this year and somehow I doubt that happens. CJ is 14th in my league despite scoring only 1 td. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed that White has vultured as many TD's as he has but the fact that CJ is still so productive in spite of that is pretty amazing. Also, Tenn isn't going to be ahead every minute of every game all year and when they're down they aren't going to rely on #25 to move down the field...he'll be planted firmly on the bench. The situation as it is now is much better than I anticipated when I drafted both CJ and White. I was thinking that as the season wore on Johnson would take on a larger role. He's started much stronger than I anticipated and I find it remarkable that CJ on 50 carries has run for 276 (5.5 ypc) and on the same number of carries (one less) White has 148 yards for a 3.0 ypc. I've got both White and CJ and I'm trying like heck to deal White.

 

[Fear & Loathing]

Look who came out to play today. It's the Chris Johnson haters attempting to shovel dirt on his season because he was "held" to 25 more yards than LenDale White on the same amount of carries.

Keeping coming in here and knocking Johnson without watching him play. Seriously, keep coming in here. For the last two weeks, the critics were as sparse as parked cars at 3AM in an open-all-night supermarket. Now he's held to 83 total yards on the same day that Adrian Peterson is held to 77 total yards, and we find out that Johnson was all hype all along.

At the desperation to crawl out of the woodwork in Week 3 to bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

I don't think it's the haters coming out, but the facts, White has 4 TD's CJ 1. It will continue to be a 50/50 split, as it makes teams to prepare for both backs. CJ will get the yards, White the TD's which is the better back, well in my league white has 37 points CJ 36. Neither of these guys are going to win you a FF trophy alone.CJ is a nice #3RB or flex, but the hype is overblown based on the facts.

To quote my man SSOG in the Dynasty Rankings thread: "TD's are insanely volatile from week to week and from season to season. . . . TDs are drastically overrated in fantasy football, because they are the single thing that MOST impacts past performance, and also the single thing that LEAST predicts future performance. Given two players with similar usage patterns, I'd rather have the one averaging more yards and fewer scores than the one averaging more scores and fewer yards."

Oh, and I highly doubt it will continue to be a 50/50 split. I think Chris Johnson will continue to see more touches and far more yardage than LenDale White. In my leagues he's been a great RB2, so I don't know why you'd limit him to flex status when he's outperformed guys like LaDainian Tomlinson, Steven Jackson, Brandon Jacobs, and Jamal Lewis.

 

[Fear & Loathing]

White's production relies on CJ's production.....End of story.

Well said.

 

[scrumptrulescent]

Look who came out to play today. It's the Chris Johnson haters attempting to shovel dirt on his season because he was "held" to 25 more yards than LenDale White on the same amount of carries.

Keeping coming in here and knocking Johnson without watching him play. Seriously, keep coming in here. For the last two weeks, the critics were as sparse as parked cars at 3AM in an open-all-night supermarket. Now he's held to 83 total yards on the same day that Adrian Peterson is held to 77 total yards, and we find out that Johnson was all hype all along.

At the desperation to crawl out of the woodwork in Week 3 to bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

I don't think it's the haters coming out, but the facts, White has 4 TD's CJ 1. It will continue to be a 50/50 split, as it makes teams to prepare for both backs. CJ will get the yards, White the TD's which is the better back, well in my league white has 37 points CJ 36. Neither of these guys are going to win you a FF trophy alone.CJ is a nice #3RB or flex, but the hype is overblown based on the facts.

To quote my man SSOG in the Dynasty Rankings thread: "TD's are insanely volatile from week to week and from season to season. . . . TDs are drastically overrated in fantasy football, because they are the single thing that MOST impacts past performance, and also the single thing that LEAST predicts future performance. Given two players with similar usage patterns, I'd rather have the one averaging more yards and fewer scores than the one averaging more scores and fewer yards."

Oh, and I highly doubt it will continue to be a 50/50 split. I think Chris Johnson will continue to see more touches and far more yardage than LenDale White. In my leagues he's been a great RB2, so I don't know why you'd limit him to flex status when he's outperformed guys like LaDainian Tomlinson, Steven Jackson, Brandon Jacobs, and Jamal Lewis.

Are they really insanely volatile? Guys like Marion Barber and MJD that are in or have been in a RBBC but are the full time goal line guys on good rushing teams? Why then have guys like Barber or MJD been ranked higher on preseason RB lists geared toward TD heavy leagues?

 

[Northern Voice]

Chris Johnson should be a solid RB2 on yards alone this season (even if he only mixes in 4-5 TD's all season long). If he starts to add more consistent TD's, he becomes an elite fantasy RB.

To the naysayers in this thread, what do you consider his downside?

Assuming he plays all season, an absolute minimum of about 1400 total yards and 5 TD's is about as low as I could see him go. I don't see any chance he's not a top 20 RB at the end of this season, regardless of format.

 

[big0mar]

CJ will get more touches, including GL, when they need them. White will touch the ball when they dont want to risk their best player being on the field.

 

[jurrassic]

CJ will get more touches, including GL, when they need them. White will touch the ball when they dont want to risk their best player being on the field.

I started them both and got 30 points.

 

[Alluro]

As far as immediate downside, the next three weeks are Minnesota, Baltimore, Bye...If you plan on trading for chris johnson, you have a pretty nice 3-4 week window here.

 

[scrumptrulescent]

CJ will get more touches, including GL, when they need them. White will touch the ball when they dont want to risk their best player being on the field.

And what has brought you to that conclusion other than Johnson is on your FF team?

 

[Buck Bradcanon]

CJ will get more touches, including GL, when they need them. White will touch the ball when they dont want to risk their best player being on the field.

And what has brought you to that conclusion other than Johnson is on your FF team?

This 32 page thread.God Bless CJ3, and God Bless the USofA.

 

[switz]

... bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

Could it be that defenses actually have some film on him and have learned how to negate some of his speed? I'm just curious as to why he's declined in stats each of the first three weeks....I still think he has the ability to be a playmaker, but he's definitely not on pace to live up to all the LBJ hypers hype. Why?Not looking for a flame war... rather, I'm interested in viewpoints on the subject...

 

[big0mar]

CJ will get more touches, including GL, when they need them. White will touch the ball when they dont want to risk their best player being on the field.

And what has brought you to that conclusion other than Johnson is on your FF team?

The fact that Johnson is a better player

 

[big0mar]

... bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

Could it be that defenses actually have some film on him and have learned how to negate some of his speed? I'm just curious as to why he's declined in stats each of the first three weeks....I still think he has the ability to be a playmaker, but he's definitely not on pace to live up to all the LBJ hypers hype. Why?Not looking for a flame war... rather, I'm interested in viewpoints on the subject...

I think part of it is the coaches trying to keep Johnson fresh. The last two games haven't been very close, hence Lendale's usage.

 

[StrikeS2k]

Do you think that if Chris Johnson eats a lot of buttered popcorn he could meet your BMI requirements to be a full time RB?

 

[shader]

Look who came out to play today. It's the Chris Johnson haters attempting to shovel dirt on his season because he was "held" to 25 more yards than LenDale White on the same amount of carries.

Keeping coming in here and knocking Johnson without watching him play. Seriously, keep coming in here. For the last two weeks, the critics were as sparse as parked cars at 3AM in an open-all-night supermarket. Now he's held to 83 total yards on the same day that Adrian Peterson is held to 77 total yards, and we find out that Johnson was all hype all along.

:X At the desperation to crawl out of the woodwork in Week 3 to bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

I don't think it's the haters coming out, but the facts, White has 4 TD's CJ 1. It will continue to be a 50/50 split, as it makes teams to prepare for both backs. CJ will get the yards, White the TD's which is the better back, well in my league white has 37 points CJ 36. Neither of these guys are going to win you a FF trophy alone.CJ is a nice #3RB or flex, but the hype is overblown based on the facts.

Well, there ya go...3 weeks of facts and the verdict is in. For White to keep up he'll need to score 21 tds this year and somehow I doubt that happens. CJ is 14th in my league despite scoring only 1 td. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed that White has vultured as many TD's as he has but the fact that CJ is still so productive in spite of that is pretty amazing. Also, Tenn isn't going to be ahead every minute of every game all year and when they're down they aren't going to rely on #25 to move down the field...he'll be planted firmly on the bench. The situation as it is now is much better than I anticipated when I drafted both CJ and White. I was thinking that as the season wore on Johnson would take on a larger role. He's started much stronger than I anticipated and I find it remarkable that CJ on 50 carries has run for 276 (5.5 ypc) and on the same number of carries (one less) White has 148 yards for a 3.0 ypc. I've got both White and CJ and I'm trying like heck to deal White.

This is the key right here. When the Titans get in some close games, CJ will be on the field. If the Titans ever get down, CJ will be on the field.

Lendale's only real role right now is to keep CJ fresh. You don't give a rookie 25 carries a game when you want him to help you win a super bowl.

It's a shame that the Titans don't have a back that can compliment CJ better than Lendale does, but he's all they have and his 3 ypc average will have to do until they can upgrade him.

 

[shader]

... bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

Could it be that defenses actually have some film on him and have learned how to negate some of his speed? I'm just curious as to why he's declined in stats each of the first three weeks....I still think he has the ability to be a playmaker, but he's definitely not on pace to live up to all the LBJ hypers hype. Why?Not looking for a flame war... rather, I'm interested in viewpoints on the subject...

Well I kind of anticipated a little bit of a slump in stats. The guy probably isn't going to average 6 yards per carry. That seems a little unrealistic.BUT I do agree with you that his stats will start to suffer a little UNLESS Kerry Collins can consistently throw the ball. Collins actually had some nice passes and the receivers actually did something! Maybe it wasn't all the fault of the WR's.However, it's clear that both Cincy and Houston swarmed CJ whenever he was on the field. I really think the Titans should leave CJ on the field and use him more as a decoy when he's not going to get the ball. Defenses are gearing up to stop him, and at some point they will. However, CJ is going to have alot of 2 yard gains. Why? Because he simply isn't big enough to plow through people. That's no slam on him, it's simple physics. I've actually been impressed with his ability to slide off hits and get extra yards.But if he gets the slightest crease, he's gone for 10 yards every time. I can't wait until the Indianapolis game. The Jags and their makeshift offensive line absolutely destroyed Indy. I honestly think CJ will get 200 yards versus Indy.I think the Titans will learn how to use CJ. The Saints are finally figuring out how to use Bush. Once the coordinators figure out his strengths and weaknesses a little better, he's going to be very hard to stop.

 

[Gopher State]

Look who came out to play today. It's the Chris Johnson haters attempting to shovel dirt on his season because he was "held" to 25 more yards than LenDale White on the same amount of carries.

Keeping coming in here and knocking Johnson without watching him play. Seriously, keep coming in here. For the last two weeks, the critics were as sparse as parked cars at 3AM in an open-all-night supermarket. Now he's held to 83 total yards on the same day that Adrian Peterson is held to 77 total yards, and we find out that Johnson was all hype all along.

At the desperation to crawl out of the woodwork in Week 3 to bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

I don't think it's the haters coming out, but the facts, White has 4 TD's CJ 1. It will continue to be a 50/50 split, as it makes teams to prepare for both backs. CJ will get the yards, White the TD's which is the better back, well in my league white has 37 points CJ 36. Neither of these guys are going to win you a FF trophy alone.CJ is a nice #3RB or flex, but the hype is overblown based on the facts.

Well, there ya go...3 weeks of facts and the verdict is in. For White to keep up he'll need to score 21 tds this year and somehow I doubt that happens. CJ is 14th in my league despite scoring only 1 td. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed that White has vultured as many TD's as he has but the fact that CJ is still so productive in spite of that is pretty amazing. Also, Tenn isn't going to be ahead every minute of every game all year and when they're down they aren't going to rely on #25 to move down the field...he'll be planted firmly on the bench. The situation as it is now is much better than I anticipated when I drafted both CJ and White. I was thinking that as the season wore on Johnson would take on a larger role. He's started much stronger than I anticipated and I find it remarkable that CJ on 50 carries has run for 276 (5.5 ypc) and on the same number of carries (one less) White has 148 yards for a 3.0 ypc. I've got both White and CJ and I'm trying like heck to deal White.

This is the key right here. When the Titans get in some close games, CJ will be on the field. If the Titans ever get down, CJ will be on the field.

Lendale's only real role right now is to keep CJ fresh. You don't give a rookie 25 carries a game when you want him to help you win a super bowl.

It's a shame that the Titans don't have a back that can compliment CJ better than Lendale does, but he's all they have and his 3 ypc average will have to do until they can upgrade him.

... bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

Could it be that defenses actually have some film on him and have learned how to negate some of his speed? I'm just curious as to why he's declined in stats each of the first three weeks....I still think he has the ability to be a playmaker, but he's definitely not on pace to live up to all the LBJ hypers hype. Why?

Not looking for a flame war... rather, I'm interested in viewpoints on the subject...

Well I kind of anticipated a little bit of a slump in stats. The guy probably isn't going to average 6 yards per carry. That seems a little unrealistic.BUT I do agree with you that his stats will start to suffer a little UNLESS Kerry Collins can consistently throw the ball.

Collins actually had some nice passes and the receivers actually did something! Maybe it wasn't all the fault of the WR's.

However, it's clear that both Cincy and Houston swarmed CJ whenever he was on the field.

I really think the Titans should leave CJ on the field and use him more as a decoy when he's not going to get the ball. Defenses are gearing up to stop him, and at some point they will.

However, CJ is going to have alot of 2 yard gains. Why? Because he simply isn't big enough to plow through people. That's no slam on him, it's simple physics. I've actually been impressed with his ability to slide off hits and get extra yards.

But if he gets the slightest crease, he's gone for 10 yards every time.

I can't wait until the Indianapolis game. The Jags and their makeshift offensive line absolutely destroyed Indy. I honestly think CJ will get 200 yards versus Indy.

I think the Titans will learn how to use CJ. The Saints are finally figuring out how to use Bush. Once the coordinators figure out his strengths and weaknesses a little better, he's going to be very hard to stop.

The CJ love is so CJ is a supremely fast but potentially inconsistent running back starting for any FF team. It's pretty clear that there's plenty of risk involved in going with a guy like him because he's not and never will be an every-down back. He's either going to have a couple of big runs, to save the day for your team, or if not will be inconsistent causing disappointment. The goal line TD's will never come for him either.

I can't wait for the Vikings game to see what this kids got.

 

[big0mar]

Look who came out to play today. It's the Chris Johnson haters attempting to shovel dirt on his season because he was "held" to 25 more yards than LenDale White on the same amount of carries.

Keeping coming in here and knocking Johnson without watching him play. Seriously, keep coming in here. For the last two weeks, the critics were as sparse as parked cars at 3AM in an open-all-night supermarket. Now he's held to 83 total yards on the same day that Adrian Peterson is held to 77 total yards, and we find out that Johnson was all hype all along.

At the desperation to crawl out of the woodwork in Week 3 to bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

I don't think it's the haters coming out, but the facts, White has 4 TD's CJ 1. It will continue to be a 50/50 split, as it makes teams to prepare for both backs. CJ will get the yards, White the TD's which is the better back, well in my league white has 37 points CJ 36. Neither of these guys are going to win you a FF trophy alone.CJ is a nice #3RB or flex, but the hype is overblown based on the facts.

Well, there ya go...3 weeks of facts and the verdict is in. For White to keep up he'll need to score 21 tds this year and somehow I doubt that happens. CJ is 14th in my league despite scoring only 1 td. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed that White has vultured as many TD's as he has but the fact that CJ is still so productive in spite of that is pretty amazing. Also, Tenn isn't going to be ahead every minute of every game all year and when they're down they aren't going to rely on #25 to move down the field...he'll be planted firmly on the bench. The situation as it is now is much better than I anticipated when I drafted both CJ and White. I was thinking that as the season wore on Johnson would take on a larger role. He's started much stronger than I anticipated and I find it remarkable that CJ on 50 carries has run for 276 (5.5 ypc) and on the same number of carries (one less) White has 148 yards for a 3.0 ypc. I've got both White and CJ and I'm trying like heck to deal White.

This is the key right here. When the Titans get in some close games, CJ will be on the field. If the Titans ever get down, CJ will be on the field.

Lendale's only real role right now is to keep CJ fresh. You don't give a rookie 25 carries a game when you want him to help you win a super bowl.

It's a shame that the Titans don't have a back that can compliment CJ better than Lendale does, but he's all they have and his 3 ypc average will have to do until they can upgrade him.

... bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

Could it be that defenses actually have some film on him and have learned how to negate some of his speed? I'm just curious as to why he's declined in stats each of the first three weeks....I still think he has the ability to be a playmaker, but he's definitely not on pace to live up to all the LBJ hypers hype. Why?

Not looking for a flame war... rather, I'm interested in viewpoints on the subject...

Well I kind of anticipated a little bit of a slump in stats. The guy probably isn't going to average 6 yards per carry. That seems a little unrealistic.BUT I do agree with you that his stats will start to suffer a little UNLESS Kerry Collins can consistently throw the ball.

Collins actually had some nice passes and the receivers actually did something! Maybe it wasn't all the fault of the WR's.

However, it's clear that both Cincy and Houston swarmed CJ whenever he was on the field.

I really think the Titans should leave CJ on the field and use him more as a decoy when he's not going to get the ball. Defenses are gearing up to stop him, and at some point they will.

However, CJ is going to have alot of 2 yard gains. Why? Because he simply isn't big enough to plow through people. That's no slam on him, it's simple physics. I've actually been impressed with his ability to slide off hits and get extra yards.

But if he gets the slightest crease, he's gone for 10 yards every time.

I can't wait until the Indianapolis game. The Jags and their makeshift offensive line absolutely destroyed Indy. I honestly think CJ will get 200 yards versus Indy.

I think the Titans will learn how to use CJ. The Saints are finally figuring out how to use Bush. Once the coordinators figure out his strengths and weaknesses a little better, he's going to be very hard to stop.

The CJ love is so CJ is a supremely fast but potentially inconsistent running back starting for any FF team. It's pretty clear that there's plenty of risk involved in going with a guy like him because he's not and never will be an every-down back. He's either going to have a couple of big runs, to save the day for your team, or if not will be inconsistent causing disappointment. The goal line TD's will never come for him either.

I can't wait for the Vikings game to see what this kids got.

Have you watched a Titans game this year?

 

[EBF]

Do you think that if Chris Johnson eats a lot of buttered popcorn he could meet your BMI requirements to be a full time RB?

He's 23 years old with a sprinter's body. He needs a lot more than popcorn if he's going to get big enough to be a full time three down back. http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80737544

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80738aad

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d807373de

Therein lies the problem with Chris Johnson. No doubt he's a phenomenal athlete, but he's also acutely undersized.

 

[PumpusX]

Do you think that if Chris Johnson eats a lot of buttered popcorn he could meet your BMI requirements to be a full time RB?

He's 23 years old with a sprinter's body. He needs a lot more than popcorn if he's going to get big enough to be a full time three down back. http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80737544

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80738aad

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d807373de

Therein lies the problem with Chris Johnson. No doubt he's a phenomenal athlete, but he's also acutely undersized.

...and Lendale White is matching him in scoring in most leagues, surpassing him in TD leagues. What's gonna change this year? I can't even get a 3rd tier WR for him in a PPR redraft...

 

[Football Jones]

It's just amazing to me how people keep saying CJ is a part-time player when he's already getting 20 touches a game. LOL. He's on pace for about 320 touches. Westbrook didn't get that many touches until '06 (in his 5th season). 20 touches is all CJ needs (even tho he'll get more touches as he matures as a player). I believe the kid leads the AFC in yards from scrimmage (with an outstanding YPC). Without looking, he's probably among the leaders in the NFL, as well. Look how long it took Westbrook to become a top FF RB (as well as countless other RBs).

It's also funny to me when I hear people saying how he does against the Vikes will determine if he's actually for real??? MIN totally shutdown Jonathan Stewart, who many of these same people love (who don't like CJ). And Carolina at least has someone to draw attention away from the running game (Steve Smith). Come on, guys. All a lot of us ask is for those who don't believe in CJ, to look at his numbers at the end of the season & compare them to other top RBs their rookie year. Wouldn't that be a good measuring stick? Not only that, I think you'll find his numbers will be good for any RB, rookie or not. When you look at his numbers at the end of the year, I believe you'll come to the conclusion he's, indeed, a special player (especially for a young guy).

 

[two_dollars]

Do you think that if Chris Johnson eats a lot of buttered popcorn he could meet your BMI requirements to be a full time RB?

He's 23 years old with a sprinter's body. He needs a lot more than popcorn if he's going to get big enough to be a full time three down back. http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80737544

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80738aad

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d807373de

Therein lies the problem with Chris Johnson. No doubt he's a phenomenal athlete, but he's also acutely undersized.

...and Lendale White is matching him in scoring in most leagues, surpassing him in TD leagues. What's gonna change this year? I can't even get a 3rd tier WR for him in a PPR redraft...

CJ will be inconsistent, but decently productive at times. So will Lendale. Problem is they play on the Titans. No QB, no WR's. If they had Brees, and decent WR's, then CJ could put up much better numbers.And side note: BMI is crap.

 

[Archie Bunker]

... bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

Could it be that defenses actually have some film on him and have learned how to negate some of his speed? I'm just curious as to why he's declined in stats each of the first three weeks....I still think he has the ability to be a playmaker, but he's definitely not on pace to live up to all the LBJ hypers hype. Why?Not looking for a flame war... rather, I'm interested in viewpoints on the subject...

I wouldn't base any conclusions on 3 data points. He had big runs in each of the first two games. That's not going to happen in every game. You need to base decisions on more data, which could be more game stats or actually watching him play in a couple of games. I've watched some of the last couple of games and it is obvious the kid has very good skills and lightning speed. Right now the split is 50/50. Worst case for Johnson is that it stays this way the rest of the season. Considering he is a rookie, has better speed than White, and is a better pass catcher, you would think his role will likely increase over the course of they year.

 

[Archie Bunker]

The CJ love is so CJ is a supremely fast but potentially inconsistent running back starting for any FF team. It's pretty clear that there's plenty of risk involved in going with a guy like him because he's not and never will be an every-down back. He's either going to have a couple of big runs, to save the day for your team, or if not will be inconsistent causing disappointment. The goal line TD's will never come for him either.I can't wait for the Vikings game to see what this kids got.

What would that tell you? Seriously? No one runs on the Vikings. Green Bay had a good 1st half against them. Since then, opponents have combined for abotu 100 yards. Last year, teams rarely were effective running against them as well. If Johnson flops against the Vikings, he'll just do what most other backs have done. If he excels, then the bandwagon gets bigger. Either way, it's a no win for a Johnson detractor.

 

[Johnny Ice]

... bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

Could it be that defenses actually have some film on him and have learned how to negate some of his speed? I'm just curious as to why he's declined in stats each of the first three weeks....I still think he has the ability to be a playmaker, but he's definitely not on pace to live up to all the LBJ hypers hype. Why?

Not looking for a flame war... rather, I'm interested in viewpoints on the subject...

I wouldn't base any conclusions on 3 data points. He had big runs in each of the first two games. That's not going to happen in every game. You need to base decisions on more data, which could be more game stats or actually watching him play in a couple of games. I've watched some of the last couple of games and it is obvious the kid has very good skills and lightning speed. Right now the split is 50/50. Worst case for Johnson is that it stays this way the rest of the season. Considering he is a rookie, has better speed than White, and is a better pass catcher, you would think his role will likely increase over the course of they year.

I just don't understand this conclusion that is shared by so many. White and Johnson both have roles on the team. As I stated earlier if White was such a pathetic piece of garbage Fisher would not be wasting his time with the guy. Yes, Johnson is blazing fast, quick, and dynamic in the open field but none of that takes away from what Lendale can do because his skill set is different. Johnson will be used in certain scenarios and Lendale in others. I see their roles staying exactly the same all year long.

 

[ImTheScientist]

Look who came out to play today. It's the Chris Johnson haters attempting to shovel dirt on his season because he was "held" to 25 more yards than LenDale White on the same amount of carries.

Keeping coming in here and knocking Johnson without watching him play. Seriously, keep coming in here. For the last two weeks, the critics were as sparse as parked cars at 3AM in an open-all-night supermarket. Now he's held to 83 total yards on the same day that Adrian Peterson is held to 77 total yards, and we find out that Johnson was all hype all along.

At the desperation to crawl out of the woodwork in Week 3 to bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

Do you think that if Chris Johnson eats a lot of buttered popcorn he could meet your BMI requirements to be a full time RB?

He's 23 years old with a sprinter's body. He needs a lot more than popcorn if he's going to get big enough to be a full time three down back. http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80737544

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80738aad

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d807373de

Therein lies the problem with Chris Johnson. No doubt he's a phenomenal athlete, but he's also acutely undersized.

EBF, what a joke. Why do you bother even posting in this thread. Your arguments are ridiculous. Nice videos, what does CJ, Stewart, and Mendehall have in common? Nothing.....CJ is the only one producing on the NFL level currently. Why are you so caught up on "Full time Back"? How many of those are there in the NFL? Maybe 1, LT. 20 Touches per game is all he needs.....especially when he averages 5.5 yards per carry.

 

[Banger]

... bang on a rookie playmaker who is leading the AFC in both rushing yards (at a gaudy 5.5 YPC) and total yards from scrimmage even though he hasn't even blown up yet. The best is yet to come, so, please, keep coming in here.

Could it be that defenses actually have some film on him and have learned how to negate some of his speed? I'm just curious as to why he's declined in stats each of the first three weeks....I still think he has the ability to be a playmaker, but he's definitely not on pace to live up to all the LBJ hypers hype. Why?

Not looking for a flame war... rather, I'm interested in viewpoints on the subject...

I wouldn't base any conclusions on 3 data points. He had big runs in each of the first two games. That's not going to happen in every game. You need to base decisions on more data, which could be more game stats or actually watching him play in a couple of games. I've watched some of the last couple of games and it is obvious the kid has very good skills and lightning speed. Right now the split is 50/50. Worst case for Johnson is that it stays this way the rest of the season. Considering he is a rookie, has better speed than White, and is a better pass catcher, you would think his role will likely increase over the course of they year.

I just don't understand this conclusion that is shared by so many. White and Johnson both have roles on the team. As I stated earlier if White was such a pathetic piece of garbage Fisher would not be wasting his time with the guy. Yes, Johnson is blazing fast, quick, and dynamic in the open field but none of that takes away from what Lendale can do because his skill set is different. Johnson will be used in certain scenarios and Lendale in others. I see their roles staying exactly the same all year long.

You can't say that though. White's role has been the best case scenario so far. He's scored one or more TD's in each game (which isn't going to continue), also the Titans haven't trailed for 1 minute yet so that enables White to stay in the gameplan and allows him to get garbage time handoffs. All bets are off IMO when the Titans trail since CJ is the better receiver and runner and has the explosiveness that White clearly lacks. So I agree that as long as the Titans win every game and lead in every game that White's role will remain unchanged but somehow I doubt that happens. White is not going to disappear but his role will be more effected by the score/opponent than CJ's will.

 

[habsfan]

White's role has been the best case scenario so far. He's scored one or more TD's in each game (which isn't going to continue)

I'm a Johnson owner so I'd like you to be right but you lost me here. Why isn't it going to continue?

 

[Banger]

White's role has been the best case scenario so far. He's scored one or more TD's in each game (which isn't going to continue)

I'm a Johnson owner so I'd like you to be right but you lost me here. Why isn't it going to continue?

you think that White is going to get 21 tds this year? I certainly don't.

 

[habsfan]

Ah.. I misinterpreted as "not going to continue getting those opportunities vs CJ3".

 

[Buck Bradcanon]

Maybe splitting hairs here.. But I think I like the distribution of touches. I am not sure I want CJ3 getting 70% of the work...ie will he hold up and such.

What we are probably saying is that with their share of touches staying the same, some regression to the mean is to be expected. Simply put, I still expect CJ3 to score some TDs though I expect Lendale to continue as the goalline back.

 

[EBF]

EBF, what a joke. Why do you bother even posting in this thread. Your arguments are ridiculous.

Actually, my argument is pretty solid. No RBs who are as small as Chris Johnson have become elite FF backs in the past decade. Therefore I find it unlikely that Chris Johnson will become an elite FF back.

Nice videos, what does CJ, Stewart, and Mendehall have in common? Nothing.....CJ is the only one producing on the NFL level currently.

I posted those videos to show the dramatic difference in size between Mendenhall/Stewart and Johnson. Johnson is noticeably skinny. Yes, he's the only one of the three producing consistent stats right now, but I'd argue that part of the reason for that is because his competition for touches is much weaker. He's the best offensive player on the Titans. That wouldn't be the case if he was on the Steelers or Panthers. He might not even be the best RB on those teams. Opportunity is a necessary ingredient for production. If Mendenhall and Stewart had the same opportunity as Johnson then I think they'd be producing pretty respectable numbers.

Why are you so caught up on "Full time Back"? How many of those are there in the NFL? Maybe 1, LT.

Winning FF leagues is often about having difference makers on your roster. In order to become a difference maker, a RB usually has to receive the lion's share of his teams carries. Consider the elite difference maker FF backs of the past decade:LaDainian Tomlinson

Marshall Faulk

Ahman Green

Larry Johnson

Priest Holmes

Clinton Portis

Emmitt Smith

Shaun Alexander

Tiki Barber

Ricky Williams

Jamal Lewis

Fred Taylor

Eddie George

Barry Sanders

Frank Gore

Brian Westbrook

By and large, RBBC is not what comes to mind when you think of these players. Yes, some of them split carries at some point in their career, but none of them reached the truly elite levels until they became the unquestioned bell cow for their team.

20 Touches per game is all he needs.....especially when he averages 5.5 yards per carry.

If he continues to get 20 touches per game then he'll continue to be very useful to FF teams. That said:- He's been losing crucial goal line touches to LenDale White. He won't be an elite FF back unless he gets those touches.

- We don't know that he can survive this workload over an extended period of time.

- It's possible, but unlikely that he'll sustain a 5.5 YPC. I have a hunch that his YPC might dip as he wears down over the course of the season.

Chris Johnson is a dynamic player. He has the potential to help FF teams for a long time (just like Warrick Dunn has). However, I don't think it's wrong to be skeptical of the idea that he's the next great FF back. Physically, he doesn't really resemble the guys who were able to put up multiple monster seasons and sustain elite production over an extended period of time. That tells me he probably won't be able to match their achievements and should be viewed more as a committee type.

This is not really that controversial of an argument. When he was drafted, most pundits pegged him as a speedy complement to White. IMO people who are selling the idea that he's a future workhorse have turned him into something he's not. Only time will tell if I'm right.

 

[Banger]

Actually, my argument is pretty solid. No RBs who are as small as Chris Johnson have become elite FF backs in the past decade. Therefore I find it unlikely that Chris Johnson will become an elite FF back.

how many have had his speed and ability?

 

[EBF]

Actually, my argument is pretty solid. No RBs who are as small as Chris Johnson have become elite FF backs in the past decade. Therefore I find it unlikely that Chris Johnson will become an elite FF back.

how many have had his speed and ability?

There are plenty of fast, lightning quick 197 pound athletes in the NFL. They're called cornerbacks.The reason small guys don't play RB is not for lack of supply, but rather because they can't handle the physical rigors of the position.

 

[Banger]

Actually, my argument is pretty solid. No RBs who are as small as Chris Johnson have become elite FF backs in the past decade. Therefore I find it unlikely that Chris Johnson will become an elite FF back.

how many have had his speed and ability?

There are plenty of fast, lightning quick professional athletes.They're called cornerbacks.The reason small guys don't play RB is not for lack of supply, but rather because they can't handle the physical rigors of the position.

are there ever exceptions?

 

[jwinston2]

EBF, what a joke. Why do you bother even posting in this thread. Your arguments are ridiculous.

Actually, my argument is pretty solid. No RBs who are as small as Chris Johnson have become elite FF backs in the past decade. Therefore I find it unlikely that Chris Johnson will become an elite FF back.

Nice videos, what does CJ, Stewart, and Mendehall have in common? Nothing.....CJ is the only one producing on the NFL level currently.

I posted those videos to show the dramatic difference in size between Mendenhall/Stewart and Johnson. Johnson is noticeably skinny. Yes, he's the only one of the three producing consistent stats right now, but I'd argue that part of the reason for that is because his competition for touches is much weaker. He's the best offensive player on the Titans. That wouldn't be the case if he was on the Steelers or Panthers. He might not even be the best RB on those teams. Opportunity is a necessary ingredient for production. If Mendenhall and Stewart had the same opportunity as Johnson then I think they'd be producing pretty respectable numbers.

Why are you so caught up on "Full time Back"? How many of those are there in the NFL? Maybe 1, LT.

Winning FF leagues is often about having difference makers on your roster. In order to become a difference maker, a RB usually has to receive the lion's share of his teams carries. Consider the elite difference maker FF backs of the past decade:LaDainian TomlinsonMarshall FaulkAhman GreenLarry JohnsonPriest Holmes Clinton Portis Emmitt SmithShaun AlexanderTiki BarberRicky Williams Jamal LewisFred TaylorEddie GeorgeBarry SandersFrank GoreBrian WestbrookBy and large, RBBC is not what comes to mind when you think of these players. Yes, some of them split carries at some point in their career, but none of them reached the truly elite levels until they became the unquestioned bell cow for their team.

20 Touches per game is all he needs.....especially when he averages 5.5 yards per carry.

If he continues to get 20 touches per game then he'll continue to be very useful to FF teams. That said:- He's been losing crucial goal line touches to LenDale White. He won't be an elite FF back unless he gets those touches. - We don't know that he can survive this workload over an extended period of time.- It's possible, but unlikely that he'll sustain a 5.5 YPC. I have a hunch that his YPC might dip as he wears down over the course of the season. Chris Johnson is a dynamic player. He has the potential to help FF teams for a long time (just like Warrick Dunn has). However, I don't think it's wrong to be skeptical of the idea that he's the next great FF back. Physically, he doesn't really resemble the guys who were able to put up multiple monster seasons and sustain elite production over an extended period of time. That tells me he probably won't be able to match their achievements and should be viewed more as a committee type.

Problem is you have some serious flaws to your argument, I have already pointed out the problem with your statistics, as your pool is too small for you to make the claims you are making, by the way what is your confidence interval? I wouldn't be surprised to find it is very low. With that being said you could be right about CJ3 but you are still ignoring facts such as how many players his size have been put in the position he has? If you look at the last decade I have a feeling a majority of the RB's are of the larger size and thus you are much more likely to have successful larger backs based on statistics alone. I will leave you with one thought as I know nothing of your background, but in stats and science remember the golden rule "correlation does not imply causation."

 

[EBF]

Actually, my argument is pretty solid. No RBs who are as small as Chris Johnson have become elite FF backs in the past decade. Therefore I find it unlikely that Chris Johnson will become an elite FF back.

how many have had his speed and ability?

There are plenty of fast, lightning quick professional athletes.They're called cornerbacks.The reason small guys don't play RB is not for lack of supply, but rather because they can't handle the physical rigors of the position.

are there ever exceptions?

There haven't been many in the past decade.People will cite players like Brian Westbrook and Barry Sanders, but they're not small. They're just short. The closest physical comparisons to Chris Johnson are probably Warrick Dunn and Reggie Bush. Those players probably represent a best case scenario for Johnson. That's encouraging given the way Reggie is playing right now, but he's historically been a RBBC guy and that comparison is slightly muddy.

 

[switz]

Actually, my argument is pretty solid. No RBs who are as small as Chris Johnson have become elite FF backs in the past decade. Therefore I find it unlikely that Chris Johnson will become an elite FF back.

how many have had his speed and ability?

There are plenty of fast, lightning quick professional athletes.They're called cornerbacks.The reason small guys don't play RB is not for lack of supply, but rather because they can't handle the physical rigors of the position.

are there ever exceptions?

There haven't been many in the past decade.People will cite players like Brian Westbrook and Barry Sanders, but they're not small. They're just short. The closest physical comparisons to Chris Johnson are probably Warrick Dunn and Reggie Bush. Those players probably represent a best case scenario for Johnson. That's encouraging given the way Reggie is playing right now, but he's historically been a RBBC guy and that comparison is slightly muddy.

Bush is bigger than CJ# as well...

 

[habsfan]

With that being said you could be right about CJ3 but you are still ignoring facts such as how many players his size have been put in the position he has? If you look at the last decade I have a feeling a majority of the RB's are of the larger size and thus you are much more likely to have successful larger backs based on statistics alone. I will leave you with one thought as I know nothing of your background, but in stats and science remember the golden rule "correlation does not imply causation."

Perhaps players his size haven't been put in this position often based on what NFL decision-makers think they know about productive RBs?You can go around in circles on correlation and causation but neither correlation nor causation carry footballs into packs of large, angry men.

 

[Banger]

Actually, my argument is pretty solid. No RBs who are as small as Chris Johnson have become elite FF backs in the past decade. Therefore I find it unlikely that Chris Johnson will become an elite FF back.

how many have had his speed and ability?

There are plenty of fast, lightning quick professional athletes.They're called cornerbacks.The reason small guys don't play RB is not for lack of supply, but rather because they can't handle the physical rigors of the position.

are there ever exceptions?

There haven't been many in the past decade.People will cite players like Brian Westbrook and Barry Sanders, but they're not small. They're just short. The closest physical comparisons to Chris Johnson are probably Warrick Dunn and Reggie Bush. Those players probably represent a best case scenario for Johnson. That's encouraging given the way Reggie is playing right now, but he's historically been a RBBC guy and that comparison is slightly muddy.

did he have problems as a result of his size in college? did he have injury issues?

 

[EBF]

With that being said you could be right about CJ3 but you are still ignoring facts such as how many players his size have been put in the position he has?

You bring up an interesting question.Why haven't more small athletes been put in the position Johnson has?

Do you think this is random luck or some sort of vast conspiracy against small running backs?



The simple size of undersized elite athletes is not small. It's absolutely staggering. Every year there are millions of teenagers playing high school football. These players come in all shapes and sizes. There's no shortage of sub 200 pound players with blazing speed.

but in stats and science remember the golden rule "correlation does not imply causation."

This is where we disagree. Out of a pool of millions of football players, the RB position has a clear selection bias for speedy backs roughly between 5'9"-6'2" and 200-235 pounds. This is not a random lottery just like it isn't random that Wall Street firms might have a preference for intelligent, hard-working individuals with Ivy League degrees. It's not like these people randomly end up in the position they're in. There's a reason why they're chosen.The RB position in the NFL requires a specific skill set that seems to be found almost exclusively within a very narrow range of body types. You don't see 197 pound running backs for the same reason you don't see 6'8" centers in the NBA. They don't possess the physical traits needed to perform their job. It's not correlation. It's causation.

 

[EBF]

did he have problems as a result of his size in college? did he have injury issues?

Does it matter? Brian Calhoun had something like 350 carries in his final season at Wisconsin. He's been a walking injury in the NFL.Chris Perry once handled over 50 carries in a single game. Does this mean he's the picture of NFL durability?

College is not the NFL. What someone did in college is not a perfect predictor of what they'll do against vastly superior competition.

That said, Johnson wasn't a workhorse in college. He never had more than 236 carries in a season.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/profile?playerId=162658

 

[jwinston2]

With that being said you could be right about CJ3 but you are still ignoring facts such as how many players his size have been put in the position he has? If you look at the last decade I have a feeling a majority of the RB's are of the larger size and thus you are much more likely to have successful larger backs based on statistics alone. I will leave you with one thought as I know nothing of your background, but in stats and science remember the golden rule "correlation does not imply causation."

Perhaps players his size haven't been put in this position often based on what NFL decision-makers think they know about productive RBs?You can go around in circles on correlation and causation but neither correlation nor causation carry footballs into packs of large, angry men.

Agreed, but in stats and science a well thought out study does not allow for circles. To further your point maybe players of CJ3's size choose to play a different sport for whatever reason, more money, less wear and tear, etc.The point I am trying to make is EBF is using statistics to make an argument. He can have his opinion all he wants but when he starts to apply statistic incorrectly I feel obligated to point it out.

 

[Banger]

With that being said you could be right about CJ3 but you are still ignoring facts such as how many players his size have been put in the position he has?

You bring up an interesting question.Why haven't more small athletes been put in the position Johnson has?

Do you think this is random luck or some sort of vast conspiracy against small running backs?



The simple size of undersized elite athletes is not small. It's absolutely staggering. Every year there are millions of teenagers playing high school football. These players come in all shapes and sizes. There's no shortage of sub 200 pound players with blazing speed.

but this one has been vetted by the college process and come out successful. Then was reviewed and selected very high in the NFL process. Now he's got a shot on a solid NFL team and 3 weeks into his rookie season, despite his size, he's leading the AFC in rushing and total yards. I'm not suggesting he's going to start a wave of undersized backs coming into the league but there are exceptions to every rule and just because something hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't especially when contrary evidence is staring you in the face.

 

[jwinston2]

With that being said you could be right about CJ3 but you are still ignoring facts such as how many players his size have been put in the position he has?

You bring up an interesting question.Why haven't more small athletes been put in the position Johnson has?

Do you think this is random luck or some sort of vast conspiracy against small running backs?



The simple size of undersized elite athletes is not small. It's absolutely staggering. Every year there are millions of teenagers playing high school football. These players come in all shapes and sizes. There's no shortage of sub 200 pound players with blazing speed.

but in stats and science remember the golden rule "correlation does not imply causation."

This is where we disagree. Out of a pool of millions of football players, the RB position has a clear selection bias for speedy backs roughly between 5'9"-6'2" and 200-235 pounds. This is not a random lottery just like it isn't random that Wall Street firms might have a preference for intelligent, hard-working individuals with Ivy League degrees. It's not like these people randomly end up in the position they're in. There's a reason why they're chosen.The RB position in the NFL requires a specific skill set that seems to be found almost exclusively within a very narrow range of body types. You don't see 197 pound running backs for the same reason you don't see 6'8" centers in the NBA. They don't possess the physical traits needed to perform their job. It's not correlation. It's causation.

EBF if you disagree with this you don't understand statistics, simply put this is one of the foundations of this field of study. I understand your interest but I have a feeling your getting your feet wet in a pool with out ever learning how to swim. For a little information on this read this.

 

[EBF]

With that being said you could be right about CJ3 but you are still ignoring facts such as how many players his size have been put in the position he has?

You bring up an interesting question.Why haven't more small athletes been put in the position Johnson has?

Do you think this is random luck or some sort of vast conspiracy against small running backs?



The simple size of undersized elite athletes is not small. It's absolutely staggering. Every year there are millions of teenagers playing high school football. These players come in all shapes and sizes. There's no shortage of sub 200 pound players with blazing speed.

but this one has been vetted by the college process and come out successful. Then was reviewed and selected very high in the NFL process. Now he's got a shot on a solid NFL team and 3 weeks into his rookie season, despite his size, he's leading the AFC in rushing and total yards. I'm not suggesting he's going to start a wave of undersized backs coming into the league but there are exceptions to every rule and just because something hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't especially when contrary evidence is staring you in the face.

I never said he couldn't have value to an NFL team or justify a first round selection. All I'm saying is that he appears highly unlikely to become the type of true workhorse that carries FF teams for multiple seasons.

 

[EBF]

EBF if you disagree with this you don't understand statistics, simply put this is one of the foundations of this field of study. I understand your interest but I have a feeling your getting your feet wet in a pool with out ever learning how to swim. For a little information on this read this.

I have a degree in neuroscience. I think I know a thing or two about correlation vs. causation. Needless to say, I don't agree with your take.