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The Greatest (1 Viewer)

Ozymandias said:
No. Jim Brown was.
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I think Payton could play today and still be the Greatest. Im not sure I could say that about Jim Brown. Jim Brown played in an era when the players werent as big or as fast as they ar now (or in in the 80s for that matter). i think Brown may have been a great RB, but he was nowhere near as versatile or as durable as Payton.Edit: I do think JB is great, no doubt. I'm just not sure he was the "Greatest". The greatest, I would think by todays standards, would need to catch the ball too.
 
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Easiest question to answer. Yes. Nobody was as well rounded a player. He also had a ton of numbers to argue being the best running back of all time.

Most old schoold Bear fans say Gayle Sayers is the best running back they've ever seen.

 
Walter Payton was the greatest football player period. Jim Brown might have been a better runner. RIP #34

 
Simply put no. Brett Favre is the greatest player ever.

Toughness ... check

Longevity... check

Record Breaker ...check

Nfl MVP ... check

Nfl MVP ... check

Nfl MVP ... check

Hardware ... check

 
Ray Finkle - Laces out

Jim Brown was the greatest football player in history. He was also the greatest Lacrosse player of all-time. I could go into why, but it's been done to death, so do your own reseach if you want to know why. Obviously those who saw Payton play, and not Jiim Brown, can't relate to Jim Brown, etc. etc.

 
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Shermanator said:
Barry
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:no: Barry was a great runner - Payton was the better running back. He could catch, block, pass - everything.Jim Brown was simply bigger/faster than most who played during his era. Today, he'd be a good - great RB, but not nearly as complete a player as #34. The answer to the question is a definite, "YES"
 
Jim Brown is like Wilt Chamberlain, men amongst boys. They were great in their time, and would probably be today, but never to the level of dominance they displayed. BTW greatest pure runner ever BARRY.

 
Payton was a great player but I am not sure the greatest. A name I would consider would be Jerry Rice for how he dominated his position and rewrote the record books.

 
That is a fantastic video. It really highlights Payton's versatility and athleticism. This was a man who would do whatever you asked of him, and do just about all of it better than anyone else could.

People need to remember his toughness and strength as well, and this was not emphasized in this video. Payton was one of the pioneers of the "stiffarm," and many times he was able to gain an extra 2-5 yards by taking on hits instead of ducking out of bounds.

IMO, he was the perfect combination of power, elusiveness, speed, agility, and awareness that teams look for in a RB. All of this was evident when watching him play, but like another person said, he also has the stats to back it up. Brown and Sanders were great, great players, in fact second and third in my mind, but there is no other RB I'd rather build my team around than #34.

As for Rice, well, there is no other player who dominated his position as much as he did. You can certainly make an argument for him along those lines. He is to the WR position what Gretzky is to hockey players, lapping the field, so to speak. You might not like my argument, but I tend to give these RBs more credit due to the rapid burnout rate at the position.

And yes, you probably can tell, Payton was my (sports) hero growing up. It almost felt like losing family when he passed. So maybe you can't take my argument too seriously, considering my bias. :mellow:

 
Noahs Troopers said:
Greatest football player ever was Jerry Rice.
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Rice was no question the best player at his position, and you can't really say that about any other player. If I had to have a running back to carry my team, I would take Earl Cambell, although Barry was much more exciting to watch.
 
My vote goes to Jim Brown, but to me it's enough to be arguably the best.

Also worthy of consideration is LT (the first).

 
jon_mx said:
Noahs Troopers said:
Greatest football player ever was Jerry Rice.
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Rice was no question the best player at his position, and you can't really say that about any other player. If I had to have a running back to carry my team, I would take Earl Cambell, although Barry was much more exciting to watch.
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That depends on what you like to watch. If you like to watch jukes and cutbacks, then Barry. As for me, I like to watch people get run the f over. Earl Campbell is my all-time favorite player. Walter Payton was a close second. I remember when Payton and Tony Dorsett both came into the league and everyone was so high on Dorsett. I watched a long run by Payton his rookie year and said to myself, that guy's better than Dorsett and is going to be great.
 
I've never seen Jim Brown play, so I'll continue to contend that Payton was the greatest football 'player' of all time.

He was a complete player, from a speed, power, blocking, receiving, running, throwing, durability, team philosophy - and he never held out for more money.

 
Sabertooth said:
Simply put no. Brett Favre is the greatest player ever.

Toughness ... check

Longevity... check

Record Breaker ...check

Nfl MVP ... check

Nfl MVP ... check

Nfl MVP ... check

Hardware ... check
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Egads. Did Fla\/\/ed put you up to this? :P Favre isn't even the greatest QB, let alone the greatest player to ever lace 'em up......

 
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As far as RBs go:

Jim Brown was the best pure runner, Barry Sander was the most elusive runner, Walter Payton was the most complete RB (although Tomlinson has to be in this discussion), Eric Dickerson was the smoothest runner I ever saw, Earl Campbell was the most bruising back, Emmitt Smith had the best vision, Marcus Allen seemed to have the best nose for the end zone.

I wouldn't necessarily say any of these guys was the best player of all time, but if I had to pick one, I would go with Sweetness.

 
Noahs Troopers said:
Despyzer said:
Emmitt Smith had the best vision
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Perhaps, it's funny cause he could have ran blindfolded through some of the 16 foot holes he had in front of him most of his career.
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To be fair, Emmitt's holes weren't always truck-sized on every play, but he always managed to find where the biggest gap was going to open up and hit it with authority. I truly beleive he got the most yardage in the most efficient manner almost every time he had the ball.Please stop making me defend Emmitt Smith.
 
I enjoyed watching Barry Sanders more than any player in the history of the game but no way is he the best. He's one of the best, but you can't award the elite title of the best to a RB who could not get you short yardage runs or consistently move the chains.

If I had to weigh a player of his entire career I'd say Walter was the best. That being said I think Earl Cambell and Eric Dickerson were as good as any back who ever played the game while they were in their prime but there longevity just did not hold up.

 
For many years I've answered this question with an emphatic "Sweetness" response. Hard to argue with it.

I am a big fan of the LT , Rice, Reggie White nominations....it is the best football player ever criteria. NO love for a QB? Certainly the most important position on the field. Let us consider Johnny Unitas in this conversation....all you could ever want from any player ever.

 
Sportin said:
For many years I've answered this question with an emphatic "Sweetness" response. Hard to argue with it.I am a big fan of the LT , Rice, Reggie White nominations....it is the best football player ever criteria. NO love for a QB? Certainly the most important position on the field. Let us consider Johnny Unitas in this conversation....all you could ever want from any player ever.
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Favre
 
We had a poll on this a year ago, it was:

Who is the best football player ever at any postion

Results were

Jerry Rice 82%

Anyone else on the planet 18%

 
Noahs Troopers said:
We had a poll on this a year ago, it was:Who is the best football player ever at any postionResults wereJerry Rice 82%Anyone else on the planet 18%
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If it was "Best Football Player at His Position," I would completely agree. Do you have the link?
 
Noahs Troopers said:
Despyzer said:
Emmitt Smith had the best vision
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Perhaps, it's funny cause he could have ran blindfolded through some of the 16 foot holes he had in front of him most of his career.
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How come no one else on any of his teams could run through those "16 foot holes". It seems everywhere he went there was always someone they wanted to take over for him but who would never could perform to the level of Emmitt.
 
I want to know how anyone can watch that Jim Brown footage and not be floored by his talent level. Holding the level of competition he played against is not a valid reason to diminish his greatness. I think the only valid way to compare players from different eras is to see how much better they were than their contemporaries. I am curious how many of those who hold Jim Brown's era against him consider Babe Ruth the best baseball player ever.

I think there are a few guys who need to be in the mix when talking about the greatest football player ever. For me, those guys are Jim Brown, Jerry Rice, and Lawrence Taylor.

For the record, Walter is the best RB I've ever seen play.

 
Hairy Snowman said:
Noahs Troopers said:
Despyzer said:
Emmitt Smith had the best vision
Click to expand...
Perhaps, it's funny cause he could have ran blindfolded through some of the 16 foot holes he had in front of him most of his career.
Click to expand...
How come no one else on any of his teams could run through those "16 foot holes". It seems everywhere he went there was always someone they wanted to take over for him but who would never could perform to the level of Emmitt.
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Give it up. As a 49er fan and seeing Emmitt many times going through holes the that were 16 feet wide on many occasions in playoffs and regular season, trust me, he had some huge holes. Being in a room with 20 other 49er fans who were screaming "What the F***, a G damn Truck could drive through that hole".It's a fact, Emmitt had huge holes, maybe thats why all 5 of his Oline, FB and TE ALL made the pro bowl. Come on now, I'm not saying Emmitt is bad or anything bad about him, he did have huge holes, I wasn't imagining all of the cussing going on watching him play.
 
Just a quick reply to all the feedback -

You can make a good case for Jerry, but was he as important to the success of his teams as the West Coast System he ushered in. Im not sure.

LT was on drugs. Farve throws way too many Ints.

Barry. Barry was great. Makes me think about Thurman Thomas too (a guy that never gets enough credit). I think Barry was, if not the greatest, one of the greatest runners (along with Gayle Sayers), but A) he could have been better at Blocking and Receiving and B) He Quit - which left a bad taste in my mouth.

Emmitt is a great running back too, but never close to walter in receiving ability.

Jim Brown, Earl Campell and Jerome Bettis were all just big, and in Campell and Browns case, fast guys who were able to run over mostly smaller players. And I did see all of them run and play. The game changed so fast when Brown ran that he may be the single most important player to have played, but I can't say the greatest. Obviously, all of these guys have 40 lb hearts.

Then there is OJ. Unfortunately, since he killed his ex-wife, being mentioned is about as close as OJ gets to this.

Dickerson and Bo Jackson IMO didn't have the durability to be considered.

I think Reggie White definetely belongs in this conversation. He changed the way defenses were played until people realized you couldn't re-create Reggie. I watched him single handedly wreak havok. I don't think I ever saw anyone effect a game like he did.

Well, thats just my 2 pennies worth.

I also think Thurman Thomas might be considered in this conversation, even though his teams didn't win.

Also - I included Jim Brown game film for people who havent seen him run.

 
Noahs Troopers said:
Hairy Snowman said:
Noahs Troopers said:
Despyzer said:
Emmitt Smith had the best vision
Click to expand...
Perhaps, it's funny cause he could have ran blindfolded through some of the 16 foot holes he had in front of him most of his career.
Click to expand...
How come no one else on any of his teams could run through those "16 foot holes". It seems everywhere he went there was always someone they wanted to take over for him but who would never could perform to the level of Emmitt.
Click to expand...
Give it up. As a 49er fan and seeing Emmitt many times going through holes the that were 16 feet wide on many occasions in playoffs and regular season, trust me, he had some huge holes. Being in a room with 20 other 49er fans who were screaming "What the F***, a G damn Truck could drive through that hole".It's a fact, Emmitt had huge holes, maybe thats why all 5 of his Oline, FB and TE ALL made the pro bowl. Come on now, I'm not saying Emmitt is bad or anything bad about him, he did have huge holes, I wasn't imagining all of the cussing going on watching him play.
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1st - that was the 49ers we were talking about. Years they could stop the run they went to superbowls.2nd - after the first superbowl most of the lineman left. In the end there was Larry Allen and a bunch of scrubs. 3rd - What about in Arizona? He had NO line and still got 1000 yeards there - in his upteenth season.4th - arent you the guy who has been touting McGahee the last 2 years? You may want to read more and talk less. ;)
 
Hairy Snowman said:
Noahs Troopers said:
Hairy Snowman said:
Noahs Troopers said:
Despyzer said:
Emmitt Smith had the best vision
Click to expand...
Perhaps, it's funny cause he could have ran blindfolded through some of the 16 foot holes he had in front of him most of his career.
Click to expand...
How come no one else on any of his teams could run through those "16 foot holes". It seems everywhere he went there was always someone they wanted to take over for him but who would never could perform to the level of Emmitt.
Click to expand...
Give it up. As a 49er fan and seeing Emmitt many times going through holes the that were 16 feet wide on many occasions in playoffs and regular season, trust me, he had some huge holes. Being in a room with 20 other 49er fans who were screaming "What the F***, a G damn Truck could drive through that hole".It's a fact, Emmitt had huge holes, maybe thats why all 5 of his Oline, FB and TE ALL made the pro bowl. Come on now, I'm not saying Emmitt is bad or anything bad about him, he did have huge holes, I wasn't imagining all of the cussing going on watching him play.
Click to expand...
1st - that was the 49ers we were talking about. Years they could stop the run they went to superbowls.2nd - after the first superbowl most of the lineman left. In the end there was Larry Allen and a bunch of scrubs. 3rd - What about in Arizona? He had NO line and still got 1000 yeards there - in his upteenth season.4th - arent you the guy who has been touting McGahee the last 2 years? You may want to read more and talk less. ;)
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Point 1, pretty much moronic comment, Yeah, it is the 49ers we are talking about, during that time they stopped the run. Point 2, I don't believe you about all of the linemen.Point 3, Didn't put up 1600-1800 yards in zona did he, 1000 yards isn't the big benchmark, Olandis Gary had 1k.Point 4, You're probaly right. ;)
 
Ozymandias said:
No. Jim Brown was.
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There is no way Jim Brown was a better all around football player that Payton. Brown may have been a better runner, Sanders was for sure, but no one is a better player than Payton. The guy could throw, run, catch, return kicks, and block like a son of a #####.A player is always measured by statistics, but what his peers say, in mind also holds weight, and although I looked for the source and could not find it, as it was a long time ago, there was a survey of 3 generations of football players asking who they thought was the greatest all around football player, and Payton was the clear winner. Sanders/Brown were at the top as better runners, but Payton was clearly the best RUNNING BACK, and arguably is the best all around football player ever. Rice will get many votes, and so will Brown. but if we are talking all around player in all facets, how can Payton not win.Payton had to take brutal hit and after brutal hit and played for a lot bad teams and always put his team first. Rice had a stellar supporting cast and lets face it, WR do not take the same kind of punishment. Walter played for one team, had the greatest heart, and would do anything for his teammates. Rice was awesome as well, and could be considered the greatest ever, but Payton was the real deal...sweetness best ever....I think so.
 
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The Scorpion said:
Ozymandias said:
No. Jim Brown was.
Click to expand...
There is no way Jim Brown was a better all around football player that Payton. Brown may have been a better runner, Sanders was for sure, but no one is a better player than Payton. The guy could throw, run, catch, return kicks, and block like a son of a #####.A player is always measured by statistics, but what his peers say, in mind also holds weight, and although I looked for the source and could not find it, as it was a long time ago, there was a survey of 3 generations of football players asking who they thought was the greatest all around football player, and Payton was the clear winner. Sanders/Brown were at the top as better runners, but Payton was clearly the best RUNNING BACK, and probably is the best all around football player ever....period.
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When Barry and Jim ran out in a pass pattern 2 or 3 guys followed. What poiont was there to leave these guys in and block? Better yet, who cares if they had that kind of effect anyway?
 
jurb26 said:
The Scorpion said:
Ozymandias said:
No. Jim Brown was.
Click to expand...
There is no way Jim Brown was a better all around football player that Payton. Brown may have been a better runner, Sanders was for sure, but no one is a better player than Payton. The guy could throw, run, catch, return kicks, and block like a son of a #####.A player is always measured by statistics, but what his peers say, in mind also holds weight, and although I looked for the source and could not find it, as it was a long time ago, there was a survey of 3 generations of football players asking who they thought was the greatest all around football player, and Payton was the clear winner. Sanders/Brown were at the top as better runners, but Payton was clearly the best RUNNING BACK, and probably is the best all around football player ever....period.
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When Barry and Jim ran out in a pass pattern 2 or 3 guys followed. What poiont was there to leave these guys in and block? Better yet, who cares if they had that kind of effect anyway?
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Who cares if a RB can block? In the 50's/60's when Brown played maybe, that is my point. Best player ever, not best RB. Payton's blocking, helped the QB pass to win, helped him to an MVP, helped his team to a 15-1 season, helped his team to win a Superbowl. That is the kind of effect that has, it is called team play and heart.
 
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