Tim Tebow - 8.17.21 Waived By Jacksonville (4 Viewers)

[werdnoynek]

Mark Herzlich"#Tebow is the most famous white Bronco since OJ's car"

 

[werdnoynek]

Great win for Denver no doubt but no Keisel, no Hampton, no Clark, no Mendenhall not to mention gimpy Pouncey and Big Ben. It was a nice win but they didn't beat last years Super Bowl runner-up exactly.

Denver was down Decker, that's it and Thomas has always been the far superior receiver even if not so many people recognize that. It was a nice win and good for Tebow for averaging 15 yards/attempt and 31 yards/completion, but it was still 47.6% completions (another sub 50% game) and none of those numbers will not be sustainable in the NFL for long. I guess I could be wrong about that but it hasn't happened in the modern era so IMO it won't happen now. He is going to need to show big improvements in his accuracy before I think he will be a big time difference maker at QB. Right now when he is at his best he is the kind of guy who will pull out close games more often than not but he also will not yet be the guy who will bring his team back from big deficits or create insurmountable leads against an opponent.

All I'm saying is let's not close the book on his career, in any way, this year. Regardless of what happens next week we all need to take a step back and wait until he has a full season under his belt (preferably three) before we can really see everything he brings to the table.

Wrong. Denver was down Kuper, Dawkins, and several others.

Anyone as significant as Pouncey, Clark, Hampton, Mendenhall or even Keisel? Dawkins I can see, he is the field general. Kuper may be on the level of Keisel but is anyone going to argue that Denver missed Knowshon? Decker has been getting killed in this thread. Hell I have been one of the ones defending him now he is an integral part of the offense? Come on. The injuries for each team are hardly comparable. Just enjoy your victory and hope the Tebow keeps developing and eventually develops consistent throwing ability.

Stay classy Steeler fan! There's always next season right? I think there's a Steeler thread to discuss what could have happened.

If the Steelers had won I would be in that thread trying to temper their enthusiasm. There just seems to be a basic denial of reality going on in here.

You can only beat who the other team lines up. I haven't seen any Denver fans (seriously) proclaiming this the start of a Super Bowl run, we're just enjoying winning a playoff game for the first time in while.

but at least he admit's that he's denying reality. we have to give him that.

 

[Chaka]

FTR when Denver gets crushed by New England I won't consider that an "I told you so" moment. They should get crushed by New England, I also thought they should beat this Pittsburgh team in a close game. If Tebow beats New England I will start to reevaluate my opinion of him but right now I think that almost nothing that happens in the 2011 season playoffs will change the nebulous situation Denver has at QB going into 2012. I think I have been pretty consistent with that opinion in this thread.

I also have believe, and have said in this thread multiple times, that Tebow could develop into "The Guy" but you will never convince me that a sub 50% passer will be a consistent winner in the NFL (unless you can also convince me that the sub 50% passer will consistently hit 15 yards/completion and 30 yards/attempt and good luck with that).

Expressing reality doesn't make one a hater. I have defended Tebow plenty in this thread.Try to keep up.

 

[Abraham]

I don't think anyone sees them as formidable. But the defense is good and they Have shown the ability to protect the ball. Will it beat new England? Probably not. But its not the worst formula in the world of you don't have Brees, Rodgers, or Brady.

 

[Chaka]

Great win for Denver no doubt but no Keisel, no Hampton, no Clark, no Mendenhall not to mention gimpy Pouncey and Big Ben. It was a nice win but they didn't beat last years Super Bowl runner-up exactly.

Denver was down Decker, that's it and Thomas has always been the far superior receiver even if not so many people recognize that. It was a nice win and good for Tebow for averaging 15 yards/attempt and 31 yards/completion, but it was still 47.6% completions (another sub 50% game) and none of those numbers will not be sustainable in the NFL for long. I guess I could be wrong about that but it hasn't happened in the modern era so IMO it won't happen now. He is going to need to show big improvements in his accuracy before I think he will be a big time difference maker at QB. Right now when he is at his best he is the kind of guy who will pull out close games more often than not but he also will not yet be the guy who will bring his team back from big deficits or create insurmountable leads against an opponent.

All I'm saying is let's not close the book on his career, in any way, this year. Regardless of what happens next week we all need to take a step back and wait until he has a full season under his belt (preferably three) before we can really see everything he brings to the table.

Wrong. Denver was down Kuper, Dawkins, and several others.

Anyone as significant as Pouncey, Clark, Hampton, Mendenhall or even Keisel? Dawkins I can see, he is the field general. Kuper may be on the level of Keisel but is anyone going to argue that Denver missed Knowshon? Decker has been getting killed in this thread. Hell I have been one of the ones defending him now he is an integral part of the offense? Come on. The injuries for each team are hardly comparable. Just enjoy your victory and hope the Tebow keeps developing and eventually develops consistent throwing ability.

Stay classy Steeler fan! There's always next season right? I think there's a Steeler thread to discuss what could have happened.

If the Steelers had won I would be in that thread trying to temper their enthusiasm. There just seems to be a basic denial of reality going on in here.

You can only beat who the other team lines up. I haven't seen any Denver fans (seriously) proclaiming this the start of a Super Bowl run, we're just enjoying winning a playoff game for the first time in while.

Agreed. They did what they should have done. Barely, but they did it.

 

[Chaka]

Great win for Denver no doubt but no Keisel, no Hampton, no Clark, no Mendenhall not to mention gimpy Pouncey and Big Ben. It was a nice win but they didn't beat last years Super Bowl runner-up exactly.

Denver was down Decker, that's it and Thomas has always been the far superior receiver even if not so many people recognize that. It was a nice win and good for Tebow for averaging 15 yards/attempt and 31 yards/completion, but it was still 47.6% completions (another sub 50% game) and none of those numbers will not be sustainable in the NFL for long. I guess I could be wrong about that but it hasn't happened in the modern era so IMO it won't happen now. He is going to need to show big improvements in his accuracy before I think he will be a big time difference maker at QB. Right now when he is at his best he is the kind of guy who will pull out close games more often than not but he also will not yet be the guy who will bring his team back from big deficits or create insurmountable leads against an opponent.

All I'm saying is let's not close the book on his career, in any way, this year. Regardless of what happens next week we all need to take a step back and wait until he has a full season under his belt (preferably three) before we can really see everything he brings to the table.

Wrong. Denver was down Kuper, Dawkins, and several others.

Anyone as significant as Pouncey, Clark, Hampton, Mendenhall or even Keisel? Dawkins I can see, he is the field general. Kuper may be on the level of Keisel but is anyone going to argue that Denver missed Knowshon? Decker has been getting killed in this thread. Hell I have been one of the ones defending him now he is an integral part of the offense? Come on. The injuries for each team are hardly comparable. Just enjoy your victory and hope the Tebow keeps developing and eventually develops consistent throwing ability.

Stay classy Steeler fan! There's always next season right? I think there's a Steeler thread to discuss what could have happened.

If the Steelers had won I would be in that thread trying to temper their enthusiasm. There just seems to be a basic denial of reality going on in here.

You can only beat who the other team lines up. I haven't seen any Denver fans (seriously) proclaiming this the start of a Super Bowl run, we're just enjoying winning a playoff game for the first time in while.

but at least he admit's that he's denying reality. we have to give him that.

Have you even read this thread? I have defended your Lord and Savior plenty. I'm not FavreCo.

 

[werdnoynek]

Great win for Denver no doubt but no Keisel, no Hampton, no Clark, no Mendenhall not to mention gimpy Pouncey and Big Ben. It was a nice win but they didn't beat last years Super Bowl runner-up exactly.

Denver was down Decker, that's it and Thomas has always been the far superior receiver even if not so many people recognize that. It was a nice win and good for Tebow for averaging 15 yards/attempt and 31 yards/completion, but it was still 47.6% completions (another sub 50% game) and none of those numbers will not be sustainable in the NFL for long. I guess I could be wrong about that but it hasn't happened in the modern era so IMO it won't happen now. He is going to need to show big improvements in his accuracy before I think he will be a big time difference maker at QB. Right now when he is at his best he is the kind of guy who will pull out close games more often than not but he also will not yet be the guy who will bring his team back from big deficits or create insurmountable leads against an opponent.

All I'm saying is let's not close the book on his career, in any way, this year. Regardless of what happens next week we all need to take a step back and wait until he has a full season under his belt (preferably three) before we can really see everything he brings to the table.

Wrong. Denver was down Kuper, Dawkins, and several others.

Anyone as significant as Pouncey, Clark, Hampton, Mendenhall or even Keisel? Dawkins I can see, he is the field general. Kuper may be on the level of Keisel but is anyone going to argue that Denver missed Knowshon? Decker has been getting killed in this thread. Hell I have been one of the ones defending him now he is an integral part of the offense? Come on. The injuries for each team are hardly comparable. Just enjoy your victory and hope the Tebow keeps developing and eventually develops consistent throwing ability.

Stay classy Steeler fan! There's always next season right? I think there's a Steeler thread to discuss what could have happened.

If the Steelers had won I would be in that thread trying to temper their enthusiasm. There just seems to be a basic denial of reality going on in here.

You can only beat who the other team lines up. I haven't seen any Denver fans (seriously) proclaiming this the start of a Super Bowl run, we're just enjoying winning a playoff game for the first time in while.

but at least he admit's that he's denying reality. we have to give him that.

Have you even read this thread? I have defended your Lord and Savior plenty. I'm not FavreCo.

i was referring to how you kept talking about what could have happened tonight instead of talking about what really happened, as if it actually didn't happen. i think most of your posts in this thread are great. i don't like how you keep talking about how denver shouldn't have won. carry on!

 

[Chaka]

Great win for Denver no doubt but no Keisel, no Hampton, no Clark, no Mendenhall not to mention gimpy Pouncey and Big Ben. It was a nice win but they didn't beat last years Super Bowl runner-up exactly.

Denver was down Decker, that's it and Thomas has always been the far superior receiver even if not so many people recognize that. It was a nice win and good for Tebow for averaging 15 yards/attempt and 31 yards/completion, but it was still 47.6% completions (another sub 50% game) and none of those numbers will not be sustainable in the NFL for long. I guess I could be wrong about that but it hasn't happened in the modern era so IMO it won't happen now. He is going to need to show big improvements in his accuracy before I think he will be a big time difference maker at QB. Right now when he is at his best he is the kind of guy who will pull out close games more often than not but he also will not yet be the guy who will bring his team back from big deficits or create insurmountable leads against an opponent.

All I'm saying is let's not close the book on his career, in any way, this year. Regardless of what happens next week we all need to take a step back and wait until he has a full season under his belt (preferably three) before we can really see everything he brings to the table.

Wrong. Denver was down Kuper, Dawkins, and several others.

Anyone as significant as Pouncey, Clark, Hampton, Mendenhall or even Keisel? Dawkins I can see, he is the field general. Kuper may be on the level of Keisel but is anyone going to argue that Denver missed Knowshon? Decker has been getting killed in this thread. Hell I have been one of the ones defending him now he is an integral part of the offense? Come on. The injuries for each team are hardly comparable. Just enjoy your victory and hope the Tebow keeps developing and eventually develops consistent throwing ability.

Stay classy Steeler fan! There's always next season right? I think there's a Steeler thread to discuss what could have happened.

If the Steelers had won I would be in that thread trying to temper their enthusiasm. There just seems to be a basic denial of reality going on in here.

You can only beat who the other team lines up. I haven't seen any Denver fans (seriously) proclaiming this the start of a Super Bowl run, we're just enjoying winning a playoff game for the first time in while.

but at least he admit's that he's denying reality. we have to give him that.

Have you even read this thread? I have defended your Lord and Savior plenty. I'm not FavreCo.

i was referring to how you kept talking about what could have happened tonight instead of talking about what really happened, as if it actually didn't happen. i think most of your posts in this thread are great. i don't like how you keep talking about how denver shouldn't have won. carry on!

Again I wonder if you have actually been reading my posts. I said repeatedly that Denver did what they should have done.But I am trying to temper the enthusiasm with the reasons why I feel that way. I don't think Denver wins if both teams are at full strength. Do you?

 

[werdnoynek]

Again I wonder if you have actually been reading my posts. I said repeatedly that Denver did what they should have done.

But I am trying to temper the enthusiasm with the reasons why I feel that way. I don't think Denver wins if both teams are at full strength. Do you?

I really don't think so. But what if the Steeler's had everyone healthy and the Bronco's had Calvin Johnson on the other side of BayBay and LeSean McCoy at running back, could they beat the healthy Steeler's?

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

But I am trying to temper the enthusiasm with the reasons why I feel that way.

Why?

 

[Arsenal of Doom]

FTR when Denver gets crushed by New England I won't consider that an "I told you so" moment. They should get crushed by New England, I also thought they should beat this Pittsburgh team in a close game. If Tebow beats New England I will start to reevaluate my opinion of him but right now I think that almost nothing that happens in the 2011 season playoffs will change the nebulous situation Denver has at QB going into 2012. I think I have been pretty consistent with that opinion in this thread.I also have believe, and have said in this thread multiple times, that Tebow could develop into "The Guy" but you will never convince me that a sub 50% passer will be a consistent winner in the NFL (unless you can also convince me that the sub 50% passer will consistently hit 15 yards/completion and 30 yards/attempt and good luck with that).Expressing reality doesn't make one a hater. I have defended Tebow plenty in this thread.Try to keep up.

I agree to the extent that sub 50% completion percentage probably can't be sustained even with the extra intangibles Tebow brings, but you don't have to look hard at all to find QBs who struggle with that particular stat early and then go on to be great. As I noted above, the difference between sub 50% and 60% is just a handful of completions per game. The key to me is whether or not he can improve reading defenses, get a few more passes out in rhythm instead of holding the ball and ditching it on the run. Related to that, can he be more aggressive in the passing game and still keep the Int% low?

 

[Ghost Rider]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

 

[Chaka]

Again I wonder if you have actually been reading my posts. I said repeatedly that Denver did what they should have done.

But I am trying to temper the enthusiasm with the reasons why I feel that way. I don't think Denver wins if both teams are at full strength. Do you?

I really don't think so. But what if the Steeler's had everyone healthy and the Bronco's had Calvin Johnson on the other side of BayBay and LeSean McCoy at running back, could they beat the healthy Steeler's?

Okay you and I agree that at full health Pitt wins. You and I also agree that under these circumstances Denver should have won. Not sure what the bizarre add ons are all about but we're on the same page so let's leave it at that and wait for New England to shellack Denver next week, which I promise you will upset me greatly even though I am not a Denver fan. I also think a loss in circumstances where they should lose will not be an indication about Tebow's future on any level.

 

[werdnoynek]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

or both. what majority of the tebow haters seem to ignore is what he's doing to this team's attitude. the turn around from the bronco's after the bye is nothing short of amazing. the guy is a leader and a winner in every sense of the word. the intangibles and ability are there to be great... IF tebow can keep improving i think he will be.

 

[Chaka]

But I am trying to temper the enthusiasm with the reasons why I feel that way.

Why?

Why not?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

Today was impressive.And I'm drafting Demaryious Thomas next year. I pledge to learn to spell his name correctly by then also.

 

[EBF]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

And last week he went 6-22 for 60 yards in a must-win game against a mediocre team. A week ago he was garbage and now he's a great leader and a winner?Doesn't work like that.One game is only one game. Time will reveal the real Tebow, for better or worse.

 

[Ghost Rider]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

And last week he went 6-22 for 60 yards in a must-win game against a mediocre team. A week ago he was garbage and now he's a great leader and a winner?Doesn't work like that.One game is only one game. Time will reveal the real Tebow, for better or worse.

Yep, at his worst, Tebow can be miserable. But at his best, he is now clearly capable of torching the best defense in the NFL. That alone makes him significantly better than his harshest critics ever thought he'd be.

 

[zDragon]

FTR when Denver gets crushed by New England I won't consider that an "I told you so" moment. They should get crushed by New England, I also thought they should beat this Pittsburgh team in a close game. If Tebow beats New England I will start to reevaluate my opinion of him but right now I think that almost nothing that happens in the 2011 season playoffs will change the nebulous situation Denver has at QB going into 2012. I think I have been pretty consistent with that opinion in this thread.

I also have believe, and have said in this thread multiple times, that Tebow could develop into "The Guy" but you will never convince me that a sub 50% passer will be a consistent winner in the NFL (unless you can also convince me that the sub 50% passer will consistently hit 15 yards/completion and 30 yards/attempt and good luck with that).

Expressing reality doesn't make one a hater. I have defended Tebow plenty in this thread.Try to keep up.

I agree to the extent that sub 50% completion percentage probably can't be sustained even with the extra intangibles Tebow brings, but you don't have to look hard at all to find QBs who struggle with that particular stat early and then go on to be great. As I noted above, the difference between sub 50% and 60% is just a handful of completions per game. The key to me is whether or not he can improve reading defenses, get a few more passes out in rhythm instead of holding the ball and ditching it on the run. Related to that, can he be more aggressive in the passing game and still keep the Int% low?

You mean like smart throws out of bounds to avoid a big sack? Saw at least 2-3 of those today. Not sure why some are harping on a stat that doesn't tell much at all.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

Many (possibly even most) of his critics in here have admitted he has flashed potential to be a very good quarterback. It's simply a matter of how likely you believe he is to consistently reach it. Hell, even FavreCo has grudgingly given Tebow a bit of credit at times. I'm still extremely skeptical he's going to hit that potential. If he's putting up good stats and/or winning games for them in 2013 I'll be ready for my crow. What does Elway do with the draft? Totally commit to Tebow? Draft a late round qb?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

And last week he went 6-22 for 60 yards in a must-win game against a mediocre team. A week ago he was garbage and now he's a great leader and a winner?Doesn't work like that.One game is only one game. Time will reveal the real Tebow, for better or worse.

This game looked more like what he did under McDaniel. He's definitely got the inconsistency of a young QB, but then there has also been quite a bit of variation in the gameplans he's been utilized in under Fox.

 

[QuizGuy66]

Ya know what would kinda be awesome? Tebow goes on, wins the Super Bowl 16-3, is game MVP and then retires to "walk the earth"



-QG

 

[TebowCo]

I would think even the naysayers would have to admit that he has exceeded their expectations - he is not horrible and has proven he can compete in the big league.

I'll give him all of that but I still don't think he's the answer at QB.

Haters gonna hate.

 

[wiscstlatlmia]

Fair enough--he hasn't proven he can consistently play like he did today. But most "talking heads," here and elsewhere, said he couldn't do half of what he has already done. How many playoff wins did Cutler deliver in Denver? Orton?

Lots of people expected him to play poorly and that's exactly what he did. You are attributing the team's success to him. Mark Sanchez has more career playoff wins than Matt Schaub. This is not because he's a better quarterback. It's because of coaching, supporting talent, and luck. This is not really a difficult concept to grasp. Trent Dilfer won more Super Bowls than Dan Marino. This is not because he's a better quarterback. It's because he had the benefit of playing against a relatively weak NFC contender on a team with an incredible defense. Again, correlation vs. causation. Tebow's presence on an 8-8 playoff team does not mean he caused an 8-8 playoff team. It's not really possible to quantify a quarterback's role in his team's win-loss record. We don't know where the Broncos would be without Tebow. Maybe they're winning because of him. Maybe they're winning in spite of him. The fact that his passing numbers rank near the bottom of the league suggests to me that it's probably the latter though. I think this is a case like the Sanchez Jets or the Dilfer Ravens where the circumstances have been so favorable that virtually any QB could yield decent results with this opportunity. That doesn't mean the QB gets all the credit. Put Matt Moore or Andy Dalton on a strong team in a cake division with a cake schedule and you'd probably get something like 8-8 as well. Doesn't mean they're great players or that they're proven anything. The 49ers were 13-3 this season. That's an elite record. Does that make Alex Smith an elite QB? No, of course not. He's only one piece of the puzzle and it's highly likely that the team would've produced similar results with any number of other players under center. Overall, Tebow played poorly this year. That his team has still managed to win some games and luck their way into the postseason doesn't make him a proven commodity or a respectable NFL QB.

Your Joking right? Trent Dilfer? really pulling out trent Dilfer...who had the second best defense of all-time lol... you wanna play that game?who had a better year there first year as a starter?Tim TebowPeyton ManningMatthew StaffordDid Mark Sanchez ever throw for 300+ yards with two Passing TDs and one rushing TD? Did Mark Sanchez ever have better than a 125.6 QB rating in a playoff game? Regardless, to make the claim that he had even a solid supporting cast on offense is absolutely ridiculous....It just isLance Ball, Matthew Willis and Daniel Fells were some of the main cogs in the offense this year...The defense has played great, but only since he became the starter, they were horrible with Orton. If your denying Tebow's ability to motivate this team this year... your again, being absolutely ridiculous. They just beat the freakin Pittsburgh Steeler's in the playoffs....

 

[EBF]

Not a lot of sense in comparing this season to Stafford and Peyton's first years since those guys both started as rookies. If it helps, Peyton had a better completion percentage and yards per attempt as a rookie than Tebow did this season. Stafford had a better completion percentage, but was worse overall. And yes, Sanchez has had a 125+ QB rating in the playoffs. Last year against New England.

The supporting cast looked pretty good to me today. Demaryius Thomas just put up 200+ yards, many of which came after the catch. The game winner was a nice throw by Tebow, but also a great individual play by Thomas to run 80 yards. Few receivers in the league score on that play.

I don't know why I'm wasting my time with this thread. Every time Tebow lays an egg, his fanboys go quiet. Every time he has a decent game, it's the opposite. There seems to be no reasonable middle ground here and no give-and-take. I've never said that he can't become a good starter, but he isn't one right now. The stats support that position. Andy Dalton had a better year than Tebow in almost every meaningful way despite having a year less experience in the league, and yet there's no fanatical hype thread for him.

If you want to look at win-loss, then yes Tebow had a good rookie year. If you want to look a objective metrics of QB performance, he was quite poor. I'm done arguing about it.

 

[Truman]

Some of the sharks saw this developing

If not I'm pretty sure Denver will be interested in Tebow.

Tebow ended up in the right hands and will be a stud for years. I feel like it's just become the popular thing to say: "He's not an NFL quarterback". They'll be a lot of crow eating and I'm pretty sure it won't be happening in this thread. Tebow's got winner written all over him. Denver has a bright future.

 

[Ghost Rider]

There is no way to defend how bad Tebow looked today, but keep in mind that the Chiefs defense played lights out under Crennel. Heck, they held the Packers to only 14 points (a team that averaged 36 points per game in their other 15 games), so struggling against that defense isn't exactly shameful. Either way, I expect the Broncos to run all day against the Steelers next week. Pittsburgh's run defense hasn't been as impenetrable as in years past, so I think they'll have some success. Enough to win? Not sure, but it sure be another low-scoring, boring game.

It's pretty ironic that this exact finish 4 seasons ago got Skeletor canned but is being celebrated now.

Who is celebrating it?

I expect them to run all day against the Steelers, too. For about 2.4 yards per carry. Teams don't make a good living lining up against the Steelers a running it down their throat. If Ben's ankle is strong enough for him to be remotely close to his normal-self, the Steelers win by 2 touchdowns. If he's immobile again, the Steelers win by 7.

3.9 YPC and 131 rushing yards. Told you that that Steelers run defense wasn't as great as in years past. Also, here are some of FavreCo's gems from the last week:

Steeler's front line is old and crusty.Ryan Clark's misshapen blood cells won't let him play in Denver.Polamalu has a trillion concussions by now.LBs are still hurt, and Harrison has brain damage from the roids.Mark Pouncey and Big Ben have 1 good ankle between them.Mendenhall is OUT.

....Steelers still win. What's that tell your about your Tebow?

Well, look what he him now. Bottom feeder. Your not backpedaling. You just don't know FF and can't judge NFL talent.

But usually the QB in question has made some throws that make you go wow. I'll say this. Newton has done that this year. Tebow has yet to do it. There is no wow factor in The Tebow.

 

[DoubleG]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

And last week he went 6-22 for 60 yards in a must-win game against a mediocre team. A week ago he was garbage and now he's a great leader and a winner?

Doesn't work like that.

One game is only one game. Time will reveal the real Tebow, for better or worse.

You do realize that this line has been used for like 6 different games this season already now, right?True, 1 game is only 1 game. But people were saying "It's only 1 game" when he beat Oakland by rushing and passing for over 100 yards each - and putting up 38 points when people were saying he couldn't keep up with a "real" offense. Then it was only 1 game when the Broncos beat the Jets and their vaunted defense. Then it was only 1 game when he again posted 30+ against the Vikings. Then it was only 1 game when he went up against the Bears defense and won that game too.

Those "one games" added up to enough wins to get the Broncos into the playoffs - and they just won "one game" against a very good defense - and Tebow threw for more yards against the Steelers than had been put up on them all year.

Is he the second coming of Elway? It's way too ealry to tell how could he can be. But I think he's demonstrated enough positive attributes to be given the benefit of the doubt - something many in this thread refuse to extend him. Is he a great NFL QB? No. But he is off to a fairly impressive start - and the more "only 1 game" performances he logs like yesterday, the more promising his career path appears to be.

 

[GeauxTigers]

I honestly believe that the biggest factor in their success is the play of the offensive line. The difference between the play of the Broncos offensive line versus the Steelers offensive line was dramatic. The Broncos were getting pressure even when they rushed three. The Steelers weren't getting pressure no matter how many they rushed.

That is because the Steelers were told to contain Tebow and not let him escape the pocket.

 

[Area51Inhabitant]

The its a one game argument is absolutely valid since it can be used by both sides of it. Last week, people were breaking ankles jumping off the bandwagon and now those same people are crowing in this same thread. The bottom line is that last week we can safely argue that he couldn't possibly play worse and his passing efficiency numbers reflected it. Yesterday his efficiency numbers were off the charts good and I'll give Tebow full props for his performance but you'd be mad to assume that he can continue that level of play to the following week. He's just too inconsistent and has too much wild fluctuation in his performance to make a proclamation about him as a QB either way.

 

[FavreCo]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

And last week he went 6-22 for 60 yards in a must-win game against a mediocre team. A week ago he was garbage and now he's a great leader and a winner?Doesn't work like that.One game is only one game. Time will reveal the real Tebow, for better or worse.

Tebowners love to go nuts on wins and claim victory. See Ghost Rider's latest. Then when he loses they all clam up and disappear.

 

[AmosMoses]

There is no way to defend how bad Tebow looked today, but keep in mind that the Chiefs defense played lights out under Crennel. Heck, they held the Packers to only 14 points (a team that averaged 36 points per game in their other 15 games), so struggling against that defense isn't exactly shameful. Either way, I expect the Broncos to run all day against the Steelers next week. Pittsburgh's run defense hasn't been as impenetrable as in years past, so I think they'll have some success. Enough to win? Not sure, but it sure be another low-scoring, boring game.

It's pretty ironic that this exact finish 4 seasons ago got Skeletor canned but is being celebrated now.

Who is celebrating it?

I expect them to run all day against the Steelers, too. For about 2.4 yards per carry. Teams don't make a good living lining up against the Steelers a running it down their throat. If Ben's ankle is strong enough for him to be remotely close to his normal-self, the Steelers win by 2 touchdowns. If he's immobile again, the Steelers win by 7.

3.9 YPC and 131 rushing yards. Told you that that Steelers run defense wasn't as great as in years past. Also, here are some of FavreCo's gems from the last week:

Steeler's front line is old and crusty.Ryan Clark's misshapen blood cells won't let him play in Denver.Polamalu has a trillion concussions by now.LBs are still hurt, and Harrison has brain damage from the roids.Mark Pouncey and Big Ben have 1 good ankle between them.Mendenhall is OUT.

....Steelers still win. What's that tell your about your Tebow?

Well, look what he him now. Bottom feeder. Your not backpedaling. You just don't know FF and can't judge NFL talent.

But usually the QB in question has made some throws that make you go wow. I'll say this. Newton has done that this year. Tebow has yet to do it. There is no wow factor in The Tebow.

Tebow 1:8 says "Do not mock those who do not know #### about football, for they are children. Instead embrace them and teach them.

 

[GeauxTigers]

We don't know where the Broncos would be without Tebow. Maybe they're winning because of him. Maybe they're winning in spite of him. The fact that his passing numbers rank near the bottom of the league suggests to me that it's probably the latter though.

Guy, really? Really? First of all, Tebow's passing is only HALF of what makes him a good QB. I love how conveniently people leave out the fact that he is a RUNNING QB. If you only look at his passing, then most games it is below par. But Tebow is unique in that he runs the ball and you have to factor that into his QB skills and contribution.And you really thought he didn't pass well against the Steelers.HE THREW FOR MORE YARDS AGAINST THE #1 RATED PASSING DEFENSE YESTERDAY THAN ANY OTHER QB THIS SEASON....AND HE ALSO RAN FOR 50 YARDS AND A TD.

 

[Ghost Rider]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

And last week he went 6-22 for 60 yards in a must-win game against a mediocre team. A week ago he was garbage and now he's a great leader and a winner?Doesn't work like that.One game is only one game. Time will reveal the real Tebow, for better or worse.

Tebowners love to go nuts on wins and claim victory. See Ghost Rider's latest. Then when he loses they all clam up and disappear.

See, it really helps if you would pay attention, which you obviously do not. I did not disappear last week. In fact, I was pretty vocal about how poorly Tebow played against the Chiefs. And I have never been a Tebow lover (Tebowner) or hater; I have always been on an even keel with him, never going too over the top with praise when he does well or criticism when he does not. If you paid attention, you would know this, but you are such a harsh critic, to you, anyone who doesn't adopt your harsh view of Tebow is automatically a Tebowner.

 

[GeauxTigers]

What does Elway do with the draft? Totally commit to Tebow? Draft a late round qb?

I think he drafts a late round QB that runs a very similar style of offense and is a big QB who can take a hit. Like that QB for Kansas State. I can see Denver taking him in a late round to back up Tebow.

 

[munchkin]

Tebow put the ball where he needed to in critical situations yesterday. D Thomas looked like the athlete/receiver the Broncos hoped he would be when they drafted him in the first round. Kudos for him. He has stayed healthy after suffering a couple of injuries that many thought would threaten his career as an explosive receiver.

The TD to Royal was poor pass defense by Gay. He was in position to make a play on the ball but like too many DBs he waved helplessly. Again, the pass was right where it need to be and the receiver made the play.

We don't know now how consistent Tebow can be as a QB. He may never be elite but with a good OC and a strong team around him he may be able to make enough plays over the course of a season to win more than he loses. In the NFL that's enough to win a weaker division or at least make it as a Wild Card contender.

Playing in a division with the poorly coached and managed Chargers and Raiders the Broncos have a shot every year.

 

[cheese]

We don't know where the Broncos would be without Tebow. Maybe they're winning because of him. Maybe they're winning in spite of him. The fact that his passing numbers rank near the bottom of the league suggests to me that it's probably the latter though.

Guy, really? Really? First of all, Tebow's passing is only HALF of what makes him a good QB. I love how conveniently people leave out the fact that he is a RUNNING QB. If you only look at his passing, then most games it is below par. But Tebow is unique in that he runs the ball and you have to factor that into his QB skills and contribution.And you really thought he didn't pass well against the Steelers.HE THREW FOR MORE YARDS AGAINST THE #1 RATED PASSING DEFENSE YESTERDAY THAN ANY OTHER QB THIS SEASON....AND HE ALSO RAN FOR 50 YARDS AND A TD.

This is really what makes me believe that some people in this thread will just never get it. I cannot believe that people are still pointing to completion percentages and ignoring rushing yards, lack of turnovers, big plays down the field, performance at the end of close games, red zone efficiency, and more as if that isn't part of a QB's job. And thats completely ignoring the obvious leadership qualities that are important to the QB position.

 

[cheese]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

Many (possibly even most) of his critics in here have admitted he has flashed potential to be a very good quarterback. It's simply a matter of how likely you believe he is to consistently reach it. Hell, even FavreCo has grudgingly given Tebow a bit of credit at times. I'm still extremely skeptical he's going to hit that potential. If he's putting up good stats and/or winning games for them in 2013 I'll be ready for my crow. What does Elway do with the draft? Totally commit to Tebow? Draft a late round qb?

Yes and Yes. He has 1 QB on the roster right? He needs someone from somewhere to back him up.

 

[DoubleG]

I'll be shocked if the SB winner is not NO, GB, NE or NYG in that order.

Not to hijack this thread but this was funny. You'd be shocked if the SB winner was not one of three teams that had the 3 best records in the NFL AND are the three highest scoring teams on the NFL? Way to hedge your bets. I think most people would be shocked if one of the first 3 teams you listed didn't win the SuperBowl - especially since most people have been prediciting for months that the Super Bowl would likely consist of two of those three teams - and two of those teams are the #1 seeds in the respective conference and have homefield throughout the playoffs. Not to mention that you picked 4 teams when there are only 8 left - and took 3 of the 4 NFC team remaining. Way to go out on a limb there tough guy. [/hijack]Continue with the funny.

 

[The Dude]

Not a lot of sense in comparing this season to Stafford and Peyton's first years since those guys both started as rookies. If it helps, Peyton had a better completion percentage and yards per attempt as a rookie than Tebow did this season. Stafford had a better completion percentage, but was worse overall. And yes, Sanchez has had a 125+ QB rating in the playoffs. Last year against New England.

The supporting cast looked pretty good to me today. Demaryius Thomas just put up 200+ yards, many of which came after the catch. The game winner was a nice throw by Tebow, but also a great individual play by Thomas to run 80 yards. Few receivers in the league score on that play.

I don't know why I'm wasting my time with this thread. Every time Tebow lays an egg, his fanboys go quiet. Every time he has a decent game, it's the opposite. There seems to be no reasonable middle ground here and no give-and-take. I've never said that he can't become a good starter, but he isn't one right now. The stats support that position. Andy Dalton had a better year than Tebow in almost every meaningful way despite having a year less experience in the league, and yet there's no fanatical hype thread for him.

If you want to look at win-loss, then yes Tebow had a good rookie year. If you want to look a objective metrics of QB performance, he was quite poor. I'm done arguing about it.

Good - because your argument is equally invalid. Collectively, the teams Tebow beat were vastly better than the teams Dalton beat.

 

[squistion]

Fair enough--he hasn't proven he can consistently play like he did today. But most "talking heads," here and elsewhere, said he couldn't do half of what he has already done. How many playoff wins did Cutler deliver in Denver? Orton?

Lots of people expected him to play poorly and that's exactly what he did. You are attributing the team's success to him. Mark Sanchez has more career playoff wins than Matt Schaub. This is not because he's a better quarterback. It's because of coaching, supporting talent, and luck. This is not really a difficult concept to grasp. Trent Dilfer won more Super Bowls than Dan Marino. This is not because he's a better quarterback. It's because he had the benefit of playing against a relatively weak NFC contender on a team with an incredible defense. Again, correlation vs. causation. Tebow's presence on an 8-8 playoff team does not mean he caused an 8-8 playoff team.

It's not really possible to quantify a quarterback's role in his team's win-loss record. We don't know where the Broncos would be without Tebow. Maybe they're winning because of him. Maybe they're winning in spite of him. The fact that his passing numbers rank near the bottom of the league suggests to me that it's probably the latter though. I think this is a case like the Sanchez Jets or the Dilfer Ravens where the circumstances have been so favorable that virtually any QB could yield decent results with this opportunity. That doesn't mean the QB gets all the credit.

Put Matt Moore or Andy Dalton on a strong team in a cake division with a cake schedule and you'd probably get something like 8-8 as well. Doesn't mean they're great players or that they're proven anything. The 49ers were 13-3 this season. That's an elite record. Does that make Alex Smith an elite QB? No, of course not. He's only one piece of the puzzle and it's highly likely that the team would've produced similar results with any number of other players under center.

Overall, Tebow played poorly this year. That his team has still managed to win some games and luck their way into the postseason doesn't make him a proven commodity or a respectable NFL QB.

Your Joking right? Trent Dilfer? really pulling out trent Dilfer...who had the second best defense of all-time lol... you wanna play that game?who had a better year there first year as a starter?

Tim Tebow

Peyton Manning

Matthew Stafford

Did Mark Sanchez ever throw for 300+ yards with two Passing TDs and one rushing TD?

Did Mark Sanchez ever have better than a 125.6 QB rating in a playoff game?

Regardless, to make the claim that he had even a solid supporting cast on offense is absolutely ridiculous....It just is

Lance Ball, Matthew Willis and Daniel Fells were some of the main cogs in the offense this year...

The defense has played great, but only since he became the starter, they were horrible with Orton. If your denying Tebow's ability to motivate this team this year... your again, being absolutely ridiculous. They just beat the freakin Pittsburgh Steeler's in the playoffs....

This falls under the category of intangibles, which EBF and the other number crunchers have a hard time coping with, since by definition they can't be quantified statistically - I always have the feeling that EBF thinks intangibles are something found in the deli section of the market. The problem is that people are using traditional statistics to judge the first starting season of a non-traditional QB. That said, I can't predict the future and would not be surprised if next season Tebow falls flat of his face after opposing DCs figure out how to neutralize him.

However, in the meantime I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, which his critics appear unable to do. He seems to have the unmeasurable quality of being able to elevate the play of his teammates, which won't be enough in itself to overcome the deficiencies in his passing game, but IMO he should be able to improve in that area and seems to have the aptitude to do so. And, as Aresenal of Doom mentioned earlier at those pointing at the low completion stat:

It's an overrated stat in general, but also one that probably has the most potential to advance quickly. At 25 attempts per game, which is probably Fox's sweet spot, the difference between 48% completion percentage and 60% is just 3 extra completions per game. It's not Tebow's delivery that's holding him back, it's his ability to read defenses and to a certain extent the game plan and play-calling. With a full off-season working with his receivers and continuing to refine what they want to do on offense he should easily be in the 55-60% range next year.

 

[fightingillini]

Not a lot of sense in comparing this season to Stafford and Peyton's first years since those guys both started as rookies. If it helps, Peyton had a better completion percentage and yards per attempt as a rookie than Tebow did this season. Stafford had a better completion percentage, but was worse overall. And yes, Sanchez has had a 125+ QB rating in the playoffs. Last year against New England. The supporting cast looked pretty good to me today. Demaryius Thomas just put up 200+ yards, many of which came after the catch. The game winner was a nice throw by Tebow, but also a great individual play by Thomas to run 80 yards. Few receivers in the league score on that play. I don't know why I'm wasting my time with this thread. Every time Tebow lays an egg, his fanboys go quiet. Every time he has a decent game, it's the opposite. There seems to be no reasonable middle ground here and no give-and-take. I've never said that he can't become a good starter, but he isn't one right now. The stats support that position. Andy Dalton had a better year than Tebow in almost every meaningful way despite having a year less experience in the league, and yet there's no fanatical hype thread for him. If you want to look at win-loss, then yes Tebow had a good rookie year. If you want to look a objective metrics of QB performance, he was quite poor. I'm done arguing about it.

EBF, nobody in this thread thinks that Tebow is a good NFL QB right now. Nobody. He was horrible against KC, but a lot of the blame has to go with Fox, who coached that game like Tebow couldn't win it....they were playing not to lose. Yesterday, Fox coached to win the game.....made Tebow have to make plays to do it......and he did. That pass to Thomas in OT was money.....it was a bullet right on the money and Thomas didn't miss a stride.He has a ways to go until he's a good NFL QB, but yesterday proved that he's capable of it. He needs an offseason to improve his accuracy and improve his decision making......he still holds the ball too long.If he can improve his accuracy and his decision making, he can be very good, and DEN's offense could be pretty hard to stop. Imagine near the goalline. Spread out 5 WRs....how do you cover them all AND spy on a Tebow QB keeper?We'll see what happens next year. If he regresses next year, then the critics can have a good argument.

 

[munchkin]

Not a lot of sense in comparing this season to Stafford and Peyton's first years since those guys both started as rookies. If it helps, Peyton had a better completion percentage and yards per attempt as a rookie than Tebow did this season. Stafford had a better completion percentage, but was worse overall. And yes, Sanchez has had a 125+ QB rating in the playoffs. Last year against New England.

The supporting cast looked pretty good to me today. Demaryius Thomas just put up 200+ yards, many of which came after the catch. The game winner was a nice throw by Tebow, but also a great individual play by Thomas to run 80 yards. Few receivers in the league score on that play.

I don't know why I'm wasting my time with this thread. Every time Tebow lays an egg, his fanboys go quiet. Every time he has a decent game, it's the opposite. There seems to be no reasonable middle ground here and no give-and-take. I've never said that he can't become a good starter, but he isn't one right now. The stats support that position. Andy Dalton had a better year than Tebow in almost every meaningful way despite having a year less experience in the league, and yet there's no fanatical hype thread for him.

If you want to look at win-loss, then yes Tebow had a good rookie year. If you want to look a objective metrics of QB performance, he was quite poor. I'm done arguing about it.

Good - because your argument is equally invalid. Collectively, the teams Tebow beat were vastly better than the teams Dalton beat.

Chicago without Cutler and Forte, Minnesota without ADP: neither team beat a playoff team. The term vastly could be considered a bit misleading; just saying.

Until yesterday, of course

Personally, I think the Texans have a good chance to go all the way.

 

[TobiasFunke]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

The number 1 defense in the NFL had Brett Keisel, Casey Hampton and Ryan Clark in the starting lineup. They also play half their games at home.

 

[Jagerbomber]

This is the first time that Tebow looked like a legit passing threat. John Fox had held him back a lot during the regular season until he had no choice. Yesterday they finally took the training wheels off early in the game and it paid off. I was impressed, for what it's worth (not much).

People keep mentioning that Steelers were injured but there's enough depth on that team to make up for the injuries if Tebow is such a subpar mediocre QB.

Fun times for the Denver faithful. Enjoy it.

 

[Leroy Hoard]

What does Elway do with the draft? Totally commit to Tebow? Draft a late round qb?

I think he drafts a late round QB that runs a very similar style of offense and is a big QB who can take a hit. Like that QB for Kansas State. I can see Denver taking him in a late round to back up Tebow.

This makes sense, use the early rounds to build up depth on defense, maybe another target for Tebow.

 

[Two Deep]

What does Elway do with the draft? Totally commit to Tebow? Draft a late round qb?

I think he drafts a late round QB that runs a very similar style of offense and is a big QB who can take a hit. Like that QB for Kansas State. I can see Denver taking him in a late round to back up Tebow.

This makes sense, use the early rounds to build up depth on defense, maybe another target for Tebow.

Seriously; If they go with Tebow, which at this point he has earned it, they better have a back up plan. I'm not sure he can get through an entire season without sustaining an injury that causes him to miss portions or whole games. I've never seen a QB get bloodied every game like Tebow does.

 

[TobiasFunke]

This is the first time that Tebow looked like a legit passing threat. John Fox had held him back a lot during the regular season until he had no choice. Yesterday they finally took the training wheels off early in the game and it paid off. I was impressed, for what it's worth (not much).

People keep mentioning that Steelers were injured but there's enough depth on that team to make up for the injuries if Tebow is such a subpar mediocre QB.

Fun times for the Denver faithful. Enjoy it.

Out of curiosity, are you a Steelers fan or a full time media type or something else where you live and breathe Steelers football? If not, I seriously doubt you have a working knowledge of the Steelers' backup defenders, certainly not enough to know how the loss of three every week starters might impact them. Don't mean to trash your post- personally I barely know the names of the guys who back up my own teams' defensive starters, particularly on the line. If you have a working familiarity with the Steelers' backups that allows you to make a statement like that, more power to you.

 

[Reepicheep]

If torching the number 1 defense in the NFL in a playoff game doesn't convince anyone that Tebow can't be a good NFL quarterback, then they are either stubborn or just plain stupid. He still has tons of room to improve, and consistency is something that all good QBs need, but he is getting there.

Today was impressive.And I'm drafting Demaryious Thomas next year. I pledge to learn to spell his name correctly by then also.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

People need to stop confusing the people supporting Tebow in this thread with the casual "omg Tebow best evah!!!" crowd. Stop getting into an argument with Maniacal Johnny Fratboy who thinks Tebow should be MVP at your house and posting your response in here to people that aren't making that argument.

Tebow hasn't been an all-star this year, but he's played well in spurts and has far exceeded what the pundits thought he would ever do in his entire career, much less one year. The bottom line is that Tebow gets too much credit from the casual crowd and too little credit from the hardcore crowd. The analysts and message board all-stars do nothing but doubt and deflect credit.

Comparing Tebow to guys like Sanchez, Dilfer, and Grossman is disingenious because those guys all played with top 2 defenses. People were drafting those defenses in the 5th-8th round of fantasy drafts and they were even better in real life than they were in fantasy. Denver's D has had some good games but overall they're 24th in the NFL in scoring defense. They've been a little bit better (22nd I believe) since Tebow took over but it's not like he inherited some great team that any horrible QB can win with. Unlike those other guys, we've seen this team with other QBs and they were much closer to finishing with the worst record in the league than they were to winning a playoff game.

New England is constantly regarded as having an awful defense that they win in spite of, yet they've allowed 48 FEWER points than Denver, who has only won because of their defense. On what planet does that make sense?

Denver does have the #1 rushing offense in the NFL but Tebow is a big contributor to that himself. If you take QB rushing yards out of the equation they're 10th. So you've got a team with the #24 defense and #10 rushing attack and that's a team that you can just plug "the worst quarterback since the invention of the facemask" into? I don't think so, nor do I think this Denver team is in any way comparable to a Jets team that was 1st and defense and 1st in rushing.

Still, there's no doubt that Tebow has gotten a lot of help along the way. Yet even when he doesn't, he still isn't given credit for it. Every single analyst after last night's game was quick to pull out the "let's be fair here, this was a great TEAM win for the Broncos" card. Of all the games Denver has won this year, this was by far the least team oriented of all of them.

Denver's defense gave up 23 points against a defensive football team that has struggled offensively in the last month. Only one team has scored enough points against Pittsburgh this year to beat them when giving up 23 points (Baltimore), and that team's RBs ran the ball for 170yds and 31 carries (5.5ypc). Denver's RBs last night contributed 72 yards on 23 carries (3.1ypc) with a crucial fumble thrown in for good measure.

You don't give up 23 points against the Steelers and win. You definitely don't give up 23 points and have your RBs contribute 3.1ypc and 2 fumbles against the Steelers and win. Yet, that's exactly what the Broncos did. People keep saying this was a "team" win. You can argue that about past games, but how was this a team win? Tebow and Thomas played well. That's it. You can argue the offensive line as well if you want to get technical, but the bottom line is that the defense gave up too many points to beat Pittsburgh and the running game was ineffective other than when Tebow ran it himself. Tebow is not a great quarterback, but he played great last night. He and Thomas were the only ones on the team that did.

If Big Ben had played the exact same game that Tebow did and won people would be clamoring over how he threw his team on his back and carried them to a win, and use it as an example of something that Tebow will never be able to do. Yet when Tebow does it, it's a good team victory. Heck, it already happened in Super Bowl 43 when Big Ben led Pitt to a victory with a mediocre point total against a bad defense and was given all the credit. Pittsburgh's defense gave up 16 net points in that game (23 points allowed, 7 points scored themselves on a defensive TD) which was the 2nd lowest total against Arizona all year, yet Big Ben takes the credit. Meanwhile, Denver beat Pittsburgh last night despite the defense giving up more points than Pitt has allowed in all but one game this season and it's a total team victory. It's unfathomable.

I understand that it gets frustrating when the casual crowd attributes every good thing that happens in Denver to Tebow (it snowed today...TEBOW!!!), but it's equally as frustrating for us to see the know-it-all haters contrive their own realities and deflect all possible credit because they are so determined to convince themselves that their maniacal assertions of how historically awful Tebow would be haven't already been rendered completely invalid.