Trent Edwards Better Than JP? (1 Viewer)

[TheOriginalDoubledown]

It seems pretty obvious that the Bills have given up on JP and are moving forward with Edwards as their starting Qb. I'll admit that I wasn't able to watch many Bills games last year, and certainly not enough to watch the team with each QB under center. I know stats don't always tell the whole story but this is what I see:

JP Losman

YR TM G CMP ATT PYD Y/A PTD INT RSH YD Y/R TD RATING

2006 BUF 16 268 429 3051 7.1 19 14 38 140 3.7 1 84.9

2007 BUF 9 111 175 1204 6.9 4 6 20 110 5.5 0 76.9

Trent Edwards

YR TM G CMP ATT PYD Y/A PTD INT RSH YD Y/R TD RATING

2007 BUF 10 151 269 1630 6.1 7 8 14 49 3.5 0 70.4

My original thought before looking at the stats was that perhaps Losman had the better arm strength, but wasn't as cerebral as Edwards when it came to reading the defense and making the safe throw vrs. forcing it into Evans when in double coverage. Maybe Edwards just made better decisions. My assumption was based on the fact that Evans' stats suffered when Edwards was in and were much better when Losman was under center. I figured perhaps Losman was more risky in trying to get the ball into Evans' hands, but the 7.3% better completion rating of Losman over Edwards last year doesn't really support this theory. Td/Int rating would help a little to support this but it doesn't seem that much different when you consider that Losman gets credit for 9 games, but registered no stats in 1 of the 9 games and had only 4 attempts in another.

On paper it seems that JP had the better stats in nearly every statistical category including QB rating. An exception would be sacks. JP was sacked 47 times in 2006 and 14 times in 2007. Edwards was only sacked 12 times in 2007. Was JP holding onto the ball too long, whereas Edwards was throwing it away, thus skewing the difference in completion percentage between the two of them. An alternative could be that as the season went on, the O-line starting playing better together which Edwards would benefit from since he started the last 5 games of the season.

Would really appreciate some insight here as to why Buffalo has chosen to go with Edwards. The stats seem to say that JP should be getting the Nod, but as they can be misleading, I'd love to hear what I've been missing by not being able to see these two Qb's in action last year. Hometown insight would be great. I'd also love to hear what the FBG experts have to say.

FYI: I don't own either of these 2 in FF, nor do I own Evans. In fact, I've been fairly successful at keeping my team clear of all Buffalo players.

 

[Riffraff]

Most important 2007 stat line:

Edwards 5 wins 4 losses - as a rookie

Losman 2 wins 5 losses - as a 4 year veteran

 

[FUBAR]

a good question, I always thought Losman had better potential to be a franchise QB, while Edwards would be a game manager.

The coaching staff just may think Edwards is a better fit in their offense.

 

[yhayes]

Losman has always seemed to be a fairly inconsistent Quarterback. He would probably work out better than Rex Grossman did during Chicago's super bowl run in terms of keeping a lead in a game where he has no pressure. Losman played well at the end of the 2006 season, but seemed to fall back into making very poor decisions at the beginning of the 2007 season.

I'm not sure how much of this was the horrible play calling by the Bills' OC. The playcalling seemed over convservative.

That being said, I don't think Edwards was allowed to use as much of the playbook as Losman could. The game against New England where he took over when Losman was injured, Edwards stepped right in and was able to confidently move the ball. Losman seemed incapable of stringing together an offensive possession -- which is much the same problem he has had throughout his career in Buffalo.

I don't think Edwards arm is too weak, I think the playcalling was deliberate to not let him get into too much trouble slinging the ball out.

I don't think they are planning on playing Edwards because he played better than Losman last year, but because he played at about the same level and they believe that he will show marked improvement over Losman's play this year.

The Buffalo defense had an incredible number of injuries last year, making some comparisons between 2006 and 2007 somewhat inaccurate.

 

[EBF]

It's not really fair to compare the performance of a first year QB to that of a fourth year QB given the colossal learning curve at the position. Losman had a QB rating of 76.9 with more INT's than TD's and a yards per attempt average of 6.9. That's terrible for a fourth year passer. He's had plenty of chances over the past three years and the best he's been able to muster was mediocrity. They know they can't win with him, so they're giving the young guy a shot.

Edwards didn't have a great rookie season, but he was better as a rookie than Losman was as a second year player. I think he's smarter, more poised, and more accurate. I think he just might have the "it" factor that all the good ones in the NFL have. Yes, he was mediocre during the regular season, but he generally played well enough to keep the team in games and he was lights out in the preseason. I think he has a much better chance of developing into a franchise QB than Losman does.

Losman is sort of like Kyle Boller. He has the big arm and the physical gifts that scouts love, but he doesn't have the mental makeup of a winning NFL QB. He's inconsistent and he makes dumb decisions with the football. He'll never be more than a tease. The fact that the Bills haven't been able to find a trade partner tells you what the NFL thinks of him.

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

 

[Warhogs]

I do recall thinking to myself last year why the heck they made the decision to go with edwards because up to that point I thought Losman was the better QB at that time. I was a bit surprised by the choice but it is what Buffalo had decided and they seem committed to Edwards at this time.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Most important 2007 stat line:Edwards 5 wins 4 losses - as a rookieLosman 2 wins 5 losses - as a 4 year veteran

That's probably the most important stat line to telling you how happy the two QBs made Bills fans last year, but it's got no value in telling us which QB will be the better one in 2008, 2009, and 2010 (in light of our knowledge of tons of other facts).

 

[FUBAR]

Most important 2007 stat line:Edwards 5 wins 4 losses - as a rookieLosman 2 wins 5 losses - as a 4 year veteran

That doesn't tell the whole story.Edwards beat the Jets twice, Miami, Baltimore, and Washington (barely). In 4 of those 5 wins, he threw a total of one TD. He dominated the fins though. Losman should get the credit against the Jets week 8, as he threw the only TD, which won the game.Losman only beat the Bengals and fins, so that's not overly impressive either. He played against better teams, NEx2, Jax, Denver, and Pittsburgh. The Bills were just not good last year, they just didn't suck as bad as some teams. Neither QB gets much credit from me, as their D and Lynch were the reasons for wins. (where have we heard that before?)

 

[Chase Stuart]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

 

[Football Jones]

It's pretty evident (at least to me) that JP will never be a quality starter. Edwards has a decent chance to be a good player in this league. By rookie standards, he had a nice year. I believe what you're going to eventually get in Edwards is a smart & accurate QB with a much better arm than advertised.

 

[FUBAR]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

How do most of these "go the other way"?The decision to go with the unproven Brady over Bledsoe is what made the Patriots dynasty. (please leave the cheater comments out)

 

[EBF]

Here are their stats from their first seasons as starters:

JP Losman

QB Rating - 64.9

Completion % - 49.6

Yards/Attempt - 5.9

TD/INT ratio - 1:1

Trent Edwards

QB Rating - 70.4

Completion % - 56.1

Yards/Attempt - 6.1

TD/INT ratio - .88:1

Edwards was better overall despite the fact that Losman was actually a second year player when he compiled these stats, having sat on the bench for his entire rookie year.

I have been targeting Edwards as a QB2/QB3 in dynasty drafts because I think he has a chance to be MUCH better than people expect. He is an impressive individual off the field whose game is reminiscent of Matt Hasselbeck, Marc Bulger, and maybe even Tom Brady. You could almost see the excitement in Jauron's eyes when he talked about Edwards in post-game press conferences last year. This team knows he's their guy right now and their best hope to return to contender status. You never really know if a QB is going to regress or take the next step forward, but I like what I have seen from Edwards so far.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

How do most of these "go the other way"?The decision to go with the unproven Brady over Bledsoe is what made the Patriots dynasty. (please leave the cheater comments out)

Because the coaches chose to go with Bledsoe over Brady.

 

[EBF]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

The big difference I see with some of these examples is that once the backup got his opportunity, the team realized what it had and shuttled the starter out of town. Brady, Romo, and Manning are starting for their original teams. Once they took over as starters, the organization never looked back. That was also the case with Pennington and it's certainly what happened in Buffalo last season. So far from contradicting my point, I think most of your examples actually support it. FWIW, I think Quinn will have a better career than Anderson and it's a bit premature to close the book on Leinart.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

The big difference I see with some of these examples is that once the backup got his opportunity, the team realized what it had and shuttled the starter out of town. Brady, Romo, and Manning are starting for their original teams. Once they took over as starters, the organization never looked back. That was also the case with Pennington and it's certainly what happened in Buffalo last season. So far from contradicting my point, I think most of your examples actually support it. FWIW, I think Quinn will have a better career than Anderson and it's a bit premature to close the book on Leinart.

Oops. I meant Frye/Anderson.

 

[EBF]

Just for comparison's sake, here's what some other prominent QB's did during their first seasons as starters:

Peyton Manning

QB Rating - 71.2

Completion % - 56.7

Yards/Attempt - 6.5

TD:INT Ratio - .93:1

Tom Brady

QB Rating - 86.5

Completion % - 63.9

Yards/Attempt - 6.9

TD:INT Ratio - 1.5:1

Drew Brees

QB Rating - 76.9

Completion % - 60.8

Yards/Attempt - 6.2

TD:INT Ratio - 1.1:1

Matt Hasselbeck

QB Rating - 70.9

Completion % - 54.8

Yards/Attempt - 6.3

TD:INT Ratio - .88:1

Donovan McNabb

QB Rating - 60.1

Completion % - 49.1

Yards/Attempt - 4.4

TD:INT Ratio - 1.14:1

Ben Roethlisberger

QB Rating - 98.1

Completion % - 66.4

Yards/Attempt - 8.9

TD:INT Ratio - 1.55:1

David Carr

QB Rating - 62.8

Completion % - 52.5

Yards/Attempt - 5.8

TD:INT Ratio - .6:1

Joey Harrington

QB Rating - 59.9

Completion % - 50.1

Yards/Attempt - 5.3

TD:INT Ratio - .75:1

Byron Leftwich

QB Rating - 73.0

Completion % - 57.2

Yards/Attempt - 6.7

TD:INT Ratio - .88:1

Some thoughts here:

- By and large, first year QB's are bad. Of this group, only Roethlisberger and Brady had QB ratings above 80 in their first season. So don't be too quick to call a QB a bust just because he has a weak first year. Lots of Pro Bowlers had weak first years.

- First year QB stats are not necessarily a great predictor of future success. Leftwich was good as a rookie and McNabb was horrible. On the flipside, Roethlisberger was great and Harrington was horrible. It seems you never really know what to make of a QB's first season. One thing I noticed is that the only two guys on this list who were exceptionally good in their first season (Roethlisberger and Brady) became elite Pro Bowl passers. It's a mixed bag for everyone else. Some of them progressed, some of them regressed, and some remained mediocre.

In terms of stats, Trent Edwards was similar as a first year QB to Drew Brees and Byron Leftwich. Whether or not his career more closely resembles Drew's or Byron's remains to be seen, but I'm optimistic because of his intangibles. I think he'll work hard to maximize his abilities and I think he has the mental skills needed to be successful.

Matt Schaub is another QB high on my "value" list this year. In his first year as a starter, Schaub had a QB rating of 87.2 with a completion percentage of 66.4%, a yards per attempt average of 7.8, and a TD:INT ratio of 1:1. Those are very good numbers for a first year passer, putting him in Roethlisberger/Brady territory in all categories except TD:INT. I suspect Schaub will be ranked 5-15 spots higher on dynasty lists at this time next year.

 

[OldMilwaukee]

A key reason Loseman is on the bench,will not be found in stats or even the players abilities.

The fact that he was drafted by the previous regime, did factor into the switch at that postion.

 

[FUBAR]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

How do most of these "go the other way"?The decision to go with the unproven Brady over Bledsoe is what made the Patriots dynasty. (please leave the cheater comments out)

Because the coaches chose to go with Bledsoe over Brady.

You must mean as a rookie. During his 2nd year, he started after Bledsoe got injured. Bledsoe then healed and Belichick had to choose whether to go back to his proven vet or stick with Brady, he chose Brady and history began.

 

[DawnBTVS]

Weren't there also rumors that Losman struggled as a "leader" at Tulane leading up to the NFL Draft? Something IIRC about how Losman had issues with trust from teammates/struggled with command in the huddle. That could also be an internal reason for why the coaches chose Edwards over Losman.

 

[Bri]

Edwards looked confident. Losman seemed to labor thru alot IMO.

I'd want that confidence if I were deciding between the two

One other thing, what has Losman done in 4 years to prove year 5 won't be like years 1-4?

 

[Bri]

Last time I looked Edwards was at the Bills facility, Losman was not. Can't recall what it was but IMO he should be there "fighting" for the job.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

How do most of these "go the other way"?The decision to go with the unproven Brady over Bledsoe is what made the Patriots dynasty. (please leave the cheater comments out)

Because the coaches chose to go with Bledsoe over Brady.

You must mean as a rookie. During his 2nd year, he started after Bledsoe got injured. Bledsoe then healed and Belichick had to choose whether to go back to his proven vet or stick with Brady, he chose Brady and history began.

I meant during his second season, when Bledsoe was named the opening day starter, even though Brady was clearly the better player even back then.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

Weren't there also rumors that Losman struggled as a "leader" at Tulane leading up to the NFL Draft? Something IIRC about how Losman had issues with trust from teammates/struggled with command in the huddle. That could also be an internal reason for why the coaches chose Edwards over Losman.

IIRC Mewelde Moore mentioned that in several interviews when he came out.

 

[TheOriginalDoubledown]

It's not really fair to compare the performance of a first year QB to that of a fourth year QB given the colossal learning curve at the position. Losman had a QB rating of 76.9 with more INT's than TD's and a yards per attempt average of 6.9. That's terrible for a fourth year passer. He's had plenty of chances over the past three years and the best he's been able to muster was mediocrity. They know they can't win with him, so they're giving the young guy a shot.

I agree that comparing 4 years of experience to a rookie is a bit shaky, however, I think that Losman's stats are a bit on the low side considering that he played less than half the season, with Edwards getting many of easier match ups. I think it's likely that had Losman started the whole season, his stats would've been closer in line to 2006 stats.

Losman is sort of like Kyle Boller. He has the big arm and the physical gifts that scouts love, but he doesn't have the mental makeup of a winning NFL QB. He's inconsistent and he makes dumb decisions with the football. He'll never be more than a tease. The fact that the Bills haven't been able to find a trade partner tells you what the NFL thinks of him.

Boller seems like a pretty good comparison physically, although Boller was never fun to watch, whereas there were games in 2006 where Losman to Evans was great to watch. So do you think it's his instincts that are poor, or is his work ethic in question when it comes to studying film and making adjustments to his decision making?

As far as the Bolded statement goes, without knowing specifics of what they were asking for him and who they were talking to, I don't know why the Bills haven't found a trade partner. I do know that he obviously isn't the Qb of the future in Buffalo and teams know the Bills want to move him. I also know that he is in the Last year of his rookie contract. That seems like a bad situation to be in when looking for compensation for a player.

Maybe the Bills were playing Edwards after Losman was healthy again because they were out of contention and wanted to see what Edwards could do before they had to decide whether or not to resign Losman?

 

[FUBAR]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

How do most of these "go the other way"?The decision to go with the unproven Brady over Bledsoe is what made the Patriots dynasty. (please leave the cheater comments out)

Because the coaches chose to go with Bledsoe over Brady.

You must mean as a rookie. During his 2nd year, he started after Bledsoe got injured. Bledsoe then healed and Belichick had to choose whether to go back to his proven vet or stick with Brady, he chose Brady and history began.

I meant during his second season, when Bledsoe was named the opening day starter, even though Brady was clearly the better player even back then.

Ok, the whole analogy is dubious. Bledsoe was a possible HOF QB, Brady a 6th round pick. I was thinking about Belichick's decision to stick with Brady despite many critics thinking Bledsoe was the smarter play. I honestly don't remember Brady playing "obviously" better in camp that year, it sure wasn't obvious to many fans and critics that Brady should be the starter, even after he put together a few nice games.Again, the analogy is far from perfect. Losman/Edwards is more akin to Grossman/Griese or Pennington/Clemens.

 

[TheOriginalDoubledown]

Most important 2007 stat line:Edwards 5 wins 4 losses - as a rookieLosman 2 wins 5 losses - as a 4 year veteran

That's probably the most important stat line to telling you how happy the two QBs made Bills fans last year, but it's got no value in telling us which QB will be the better one in 2008, 2009, and 2010 (in light of our knowledge of tons of other facts).

Agreed. Just by glancing at the surface, there's no doubt that fans are happier with the one getting more wins, but after looking a bit further into the situation, I find it hard to believe that the coaches were basing their decision on this stat.

 

[DarabZarrabi]

I think Edwards is going to be a qb that doesn't kill you, but I dont think he has the arm strength to play in the cold windy conditions in Buffalo in the winter (hence it being called a west coast offense), and while Losman may make some bad decisions and hold on to the ball too long at times, he didn't have much to work with either, they had Lee Evans and not much else offensively. That said I dont think Buffalo is a winner with Edwards at the helm unless they have a boatload of other talent, but with Losman he has all the talent in the world, but is the riskier play

 

[Boston]

Every time I watch Losman I see a QB who doesn't seem to have a full grasp of the position. You always hear pro athletes talk about how the game slows down as they gain experience. In Losman's case it appears the game is still going to fast for him. He just doesn't see to have a grasp as to what it takes to be a quality NFL QB. The fundamentals seem to be lacking and from everything I've read it doesn't appear he's got great leadership qualities.

As for Edwards...it's still very early but he looks like he knows how to play the position. I don't think he'll be the type of guy to put up big numbers but he looks like he has the potential to be a quality game manager that has the trust of both his teammates and coaching staff. There's more to the QB position than pure stats and Edwards could be the type of QB who's value will be greater in real football than fantasy football.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

How do most of these "go the other way"?The decision to go with the unproven Brady over Bledsoe is what made the Patriots dynasty. (please leave the cheater comments out)

Because the coaches chose to go with Bledsoe over Brady.

You must mean as a rookie. During his 2nd year, he started after Bledsoe got injured. Bledsoe then healed and Belichick had to choose whether to go back to his proven vet or stick with Brady, he chose Brady and history began.

I meant during his second season, when Bledsoe was named the opening day starter, even though Brady was clearly the better player even back then.

Ok, the whole analogy is dubious. Bledsoe was a possible HOF QB, Brady a 6th round pick. I was thinking about Belichick's decision to stick with Brady despite many critics thinking Bledsoe was the smarter play. I honestly don't remember Brady playing "obviously" better in camp that year, it sure wasn't obvious to many fans and critics that Brady should be the starter, even after he put together a few nice games.Again, the analogy is far from perfect. Losman/Edwards is more akin to Grossman/Griese or Pennington/Clemens.

Losman/Edwards may be, but Leftwich/Garrard isn't.There were rumblings that Brady should have been the starter over Bledsoe, just like there were rumblings about Romo and Bledsoe years later. The overall point is coaches don't always get it right, and just because they did with Garrard/Leftwich, doesn't mean they get it right at a high rate.

 

[EBF]

Boller seems like a pretty good comparison physically, although Boller was never fun to watch, whereas there were games in 2006 where Losman to Evans was great to watch. So do you think it's his instincts that are poor, or is his work ethic in question when it comes to studying film and making adjustments to his decision making?

Succeeding as an NFL QB is as much about mental makeup as physical skills, which is why guys like Manning and Brady dominate while guys like Boller and Leaf falter. There's something intangible, a sort of sixth sense, that separates the great ones from the guys who just don't get it. Look at someone like Roethlisberger. Yes, he's a big dude with a strong arm, but above all he's a playmaker. He stays calm, he finds the open receivers, he makes throws, he moves the chains, and he leads his team on touchdown drives. He just has a sense for the position. You know that every time Pittsburgh gets the ball, there's a very real chance they'll score a TD. All great pro passers have that top notch confidence, poise, and presence of mind. I don't see any of that in Losman. I don't see him making gutty plays under pressure. I don't see the fire or the confident playing demeanor. He's not a leader and he doesn't make the critical plays to sustain drives and score points. He's just another physical specimen whose mind is a step slow and whose mental makeup just doesn't fit the mold of an elite professional quarterback.

 

[FUBAR]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

How do most of these "go the other way"?The decision to go with the unproven Brady over Bledsoe is what made the Patriots dynasty. (please leave the cheater comments out)

Because the coaches chose to go with Bledsoe over Brady.

You must mean as a rookie. During his 2nd year, he started after Bledsoe got injured. Bledsoe then healed and Belichick had to choose whether to go back to his proven vet or stick with Brady, he chose Brady and history began.

I meant during his second season, when Bledsoe was named the opening day starter, even though Brady was clearly the better player even back then.

Ok, the whole analogy is dubious. Bledsoe was a possible HOF QB, Brady a 6th round pick. I was thinking about Belichick's decision to stick with Brady despite many critics thinking Bledsoe was the smarter play. I honestly don't remember Brady playing "obviously" better in camp that year, it sure wasn't obvious to many fans and critics that Brady should be the starter, even after he put together a few nice games.

Again, the analogy is far from perfect. Losman/Edwards is more akin to Grossman/Griese or Pennington/Clemens.

Losman/Edwards may be, but Leftwich/Garrard isn't.

There were rumblings that Brady should have been the starter over Bledsoe, just like there were rumblings about Romo and Bledsoe years later. The overall point is coaches don't always get it right, and just because they did with Garrard/Leftwich, doesn't mean they get it right at a high rate.

Who's this thread about? Not many coaches will bench a possible Hall of Fame QB for a guy who wasn't even supposed to be the best QB from his school. There may have been rumblings, I don't remember hearing them. The search here doesn't appear to let us go back to 2001. Google doesn't seem to either. But, for the sake of argument, I'll concede that back in 2001, there were people who thought Brady, a 6th round pick with one completion to his name, should have started over Bledsoe, who had 7 straight seasons of 3,000+ yards, a rating over 75, and had a chance for the Hall of Fame. All I'm saying is they were not the mainstream, more likely they were people who wanted to point fingers for a 5-11 season.

Sure coaches aren't perfect, they're still better at their jobs than their critics.

And yes, they do get it right at a high rate, the times they erred simply shine brighter.

 

[Thorpe]

Losman is not an NFL caliber QB, while Edwards may be an NFL caliber QB. Losman always has a high completion percentage, but that is because he will take the sack. Losman is basically the second-coming of Rob Johnson.

Last year, the offense was so conservative, no QB would have put up good stats. Hopefully, this year they will show some imagination, and throw the ball on 1st down on occasion.

And Losman was in camp today. I think he just missed a day or two for personal reasons.

One other thing - I give Losman a ton of credit last year for not being a lockerroom cancer afetr being benched. He asked for a trade after the season, but during the season he was a team guy.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

How do most of these "go the other way"?The decision to go with the unproven Brady over Bledsoe is what made the Patriots dynasty. (please leave the cheater comments out)

Because the coaches chose to go with Bledsoe over Brady.

You must mean as a rookie. During his 2nd year, he started after Bledsoe got injured. Bledsoe then healed and Belichick had to choose whether to go back to his proven vet or stick with Brady, he chose Brady and history began.

I meant during his second season, when Bledsoe was named the opening day starter, even though Brady was clearly the better player even back then.

Ok, the whole analogy is dubious. Bledsoe was a possible HOF QB, Brady a 6th round pick. I was thinking about Belichick's decision to stick with Brady despite many critics thinking Bledsoe was the smarter play. I honestly don't remember Brady playing "obviously" better in camp that year, it sure wasn't obvious to many fans and critics that Brady should be the starter, even after he put together a few nice games.

Again, the analogy is far from perfect. Losman/Edwards is more akin to Grossman/Griese or Pennington/Clemens.

Losman/Edwards may be, but Leftwich/Garrard isn't.

There were rumblings that Brady should have been the starter over Bledsoe, just like there were rumblings about Romo and Bledsoe years later. The overall point is coaches don't always get it right, and just because they did with Garrard/Leftwich, doesn't mean they get it right at a high rate.

Who's this thread about? Not many coaches will bench a possible Hall of Fame QB for a guy who wasn't even supposed to be the best QB from his school. There may have been rumblings, I don't remember hearing them. The search here doesn't appear to let us go back to 2001. Google doesn't seem to either. But, for the sake of argument, I'll concede that back in 2001, there were people who thought Brady, a 6th round pick with one completion to his name, should have started over Bledsoe, who had 7 straight seasons of 3,000+ yards, a rating over 75, and had a chance for the Hall of Fame. All I'm saying is they were not the mainstream, more likely they were people who wanted to point fingers for a 5-11 season.

Sure coaches aren't perfect, they're still better at their jobs than their critics.

And yes, they do get it right at a high rate, the times they erred simply shine brighter.

You can keep typing over and over again that Bledsoe was a possible HOF QB, but in 1999 and 2000 Bledsoe was a below average QB. He had a sack problem and an INT problem, and he was downright bad in 2000. I suspect coaches get it right at a higher rate than their critics, but it's purely subjective and anecdotal to say they get it right at a much higher rate than the critics. There are only 3 or 4 legitimate QB controversies a season, where it's really a coin flip call. I don't think coaches get it right anywhere near 70% of the time in those situations.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Losman is not an NFL caliber QB, while Edwards may be an NFL caliber QB. Losman always has a high completion percentage, but that is because he will take the sack. Losman is basically the second-coming of Rob Johnson. Last year, the offense was so conservative, no QB would have put up good stats. Hopefully, this year they will show some imagination, and throw the ball on 1st down on occasion.And Losman was in camp today. I think he just missed a day or two for personal reasons.One other thing - I give Losman a ton of credit last year for not being a lockerroom cancer afetr being benched. He asked for a trade after the season, but during the season he was a team guy.

Rob Johnson: 14.8% of his pass attempts plus sacks were actually sacks.J.P. Losman: 9.5%Trent Edwards: 4.3%Losman last year: 7.4%Edwards may prove to be better at avoiding sacks, but Losman isn't in Rob Johnson territory.

 

[Bri]

Everyone criticized the Jaguars for dumping Byron Leftwich in favor of David Garrard, but the coaches made the right decision. The coaches interact with these guys on a daily basis. In theory, they know their talent far better than sportswriters and FF junkies. I think the Bills recognized early on that Edwards is a better QB than Losman and I think time will validate their opinion.

It's easy to point to one example, but there are certainly many others that go the other way.See Brady/Bledsoe, Romo/Bledsoe, Quinn/Anderson, Testaverde/Pennington, Manning/Warner, Leinart/Warner, Grossman/his backup.

How do most of these "go the other way"?The decision to go with the unproven Brady over Bledsoe is what made the Patriots dynasty. (please leave the cheater comments out)

Because the coaches chose to go with Bledsoe over Brady.

You must mean as a rookie. During his 2nd year, he started after Bledsoe got injured. Bledsoe then healed and Belichick had to choose whether to go back to his proven vet or stick with Brady, he chose Brady and history began.

I meant during his second season, when Bledsoe was named the opening day starter, even though Brady was clearly the better player even back then.

Ok, the whole analogy is dubious. Bledsoe was a possible HOF QB, Brady a 6th round pick. I was thinking about Belichick's decision to stick with Brady despite many critics thinking Bledsoe was the smarter play. I honestly don't remember Brady playing "obviously" better in camp that year, it sure wasn't obvious to many fans and critics that Brady should be the starter, even after he put together a few nice games.

Again, the analogy is far from perfect. Losman/Edwards is more akin to Grossman/Griese or Pennington/Clemens.

Losman/Edwards may be, but Leftwich/Garrard isn't.

There were rumblings that Brady should have been the starter over Bledsoe, just like there were rumblings about Romo and Bledsoe years later. The overall point is coaches don't always get it right, and just because they did with Garrard/Leftwich, doesn't mean they get it right at a high rate.

Who's this thread about? Not many coaches will bench a possible Hall of Fame QB for a guy who wasn't even supposed to be the best QB from his school. There may have been rumblings, I don't remember hearing them. The search here doesn't appear to let us go back to 2001. Google doesn't seem to either. But, for the sake of argument, I'll concede that back in 2001, there were people who thought Brady, a 6th round pick with one completion to his name, should have started over Bledsoe, who had 7 straight seasons of 3,000+ yards, a rating over 75, and had a chance for the Hall of Fame. All I'm saying is they were not the mainstream, more likely they were people who wanted to point fingers for a 5-11 season.

Sure coaches aren't perfect, they're still better at their jobs than their critics.

And yes, they do get it right at a high rate, the times they erred simply shine brighter.

New England fans have always had a weird fascination with backup QBs. It goes back a long time. Matt Cavanaugh and Eason were darlings while Grogan was the "no good" starter. I still to this day am fascinated with Michael Bishop, the backup darling before Brady. Furthermore, when Brady was the starter it was Bledsoe who was the darling backup that got em' into the Supe when Brady got hurt in the AFCC.

 

[Donnybrook]

Boller seems like a pretty good comparison physically, although Boller was never fun to watch, whereas there were games in 2006 where Losman to Evans was great to watch. So do you think it's his instincts that are poor, or is his work ethic in question when it comes to studying film and making adjustments to his decision making?

Succeeding as an NFL QB is as much about mental makeup as physical skills, which is why guys like Manning and Brady dominate while guys like Boller and Leaf falter. There's something intangible, a sort of sixth sense, that separates the great ones from the guys who just don't get it. Look at someone like Roethlisberger. Yes, he's a big dude with a strong arm, but above all he's a playmaker. He stays calm, he finds the open receivers, he makes throws, he moves the chains, and he leads his team on touchdown drives. He just has a sense for the position. You know that every time Pittsburgh gets the ball, there's a very real chance they'll score a TD. All great pro passers have that top notch confidence, poise, and presence of mind. I don't see any of that in Losman. I don't see him making gutty plays under pressure. I don't see the fire or the confident playing demeanor. He's not a leader and he doesn't make the critical plays to sustain drives and score points. He's just another physical specimen whose mind is a step slow and whose mental makeup just doesn't fit the mold of an elite professional quarterback.

The latter description reminds me so much of the traits displayed by David Carr. I gave up on Carr sooner than most after seeing him play a Monday night game vs. Green Bay. Carr had none of the fire and confidence that was displayed by Favre in that game. It was like night and day.

 

[schooner44]

I'm a Bills homer relocated to Albuquerque NM and watched every game since JP was drafted. Since I'm not in Buffalo, my views are not skewed by local media so I think I can offer a pretty good assessment of the situation.

Besides all the stats referenced above there are other points that need to be mentioned. Losman has arguably the best long ball in the game but physical tools alone do NOT make a great QB (insert Rob Johnson reference here). JP makes bad decisions at the worst times and has done so since being drafted. Edwards is a heady QB who doesn't have the arm strength that Losman has (very few QBs do) but makes the smart plays to not hurt the team. Edwards also seems like a much more natural leader on the field than Losman and it can be seen in how the team plays around him. The combination of these points along with the fact that the Bills have a very good RB to carry the load makes the decision to go with Edwards an easy one. Edwards will manage the game, minimize mistakes from the QB position and move the chains.

 

[TheOriginalDoubledown]

Besides all the stats referenced above there are other points that need to be mentioned. Losman has arguably the best long ball in the game but physical tools alone do NOT make a great QB (insert Rob Johnson reference here). JP makes bad decisions at the worst times and has done so since being drafted. Edwards is a heady QB who doesn't have the arm strength that Losman has (very few QBs do) but makes the smart plays to not hurt the team. Edwards also seems like a much more natural leader on the field than Losman and it can be seen in how the team plays around him. The combination of these points along with the fact that the Bills have a very good RB to carry the load makes the decision to go with Edwards an easy one. Edwards will manage the game, minimize mistakes from the QB position and move the chains.

The first couple sentences is very close to what I was thinking about JP. Great arm, bad decisions. A lot has been said about him not having confidence. I think he is confident in his ability to throw the ball, to a fault perhaps, that leads to relying on arm strength too much and not working things like making his reads and seeing the whole field. ( read1 Lee isn't open yet, read2 Lee still isn't open, read3 crap c'mon Lee, get open), and this is where he ends up making the ill advised pass that gets intercepted or goes for a 75 yd TD reception or he gets sacked.I'll admit that he hasn't had a lot to be confident in other than Lee Evans when it comes to receivers, but I wonder if this is something that can be fixed with the right coach working with him or is that out of the question. Anyone have his score for the wonderlic?I can't really comment on the leadership skills, but if that true, he's done. If you can't be the leader on the field and in the huddle, you can't be an NFL Qb.

 

[css2373]

To me it is all about the hope of the uncertain. The Bills knew what they had in Losman, they did not know what they had in Edwards.

I know Losman played a little his rookie year, but aren't we comparing Edwards' rookie year vs. Losman's 2nd year, usually a big difference for a QB.

Losman will never be all that accurate, his completion percentage in college was around 57%, usually a barometer for NFL struggles.

I'm really not sold on either QB, Edwards' windup and delivery look off to me.

 

[GroveDiesel]

A key reason Loseman is on the bench,will not be found in stats or even the players abilities. The fact that he was drafted by the previous regime, did factor into the switch at that postion.

Absolutely. I also think that the Bills prefer a game manager rather than a gunslinger and that played a large role as well.

Every time I watch Losman I see a QB who doesn't seem to have a full grasp of the position. You always hear pro athletes talk about how the game slows down as they gain experience. In Losman's case it appears the game is still going to fast for him. He just doesn't see to have a grasp as to what it takes to be a quality NFL QB. The fundamentals seem to be lacking and from everything I've read it doesn't appear he's got great leadership qualities.As for Edwards...it's still very early but he looks like he knows how to play the position. I don't think he'll be the type of guy to put up big numbers but he looks like he has the potential to be a quality game manager that has the trust of both his teammates and coaching staff. There's more to the QB position than pure stats and Edwards could be the type of QB who's value will be greater in real football than fantasy football.

I still think that Losman got kind of a raw deal in Buffalo because the only time he played behind a decent offensive line was during the second half of 2006. That happens to be when he was putting up the best numbers as well. His O-line was terrible the rest of the time including the first half of last season. It's tough for a young QB to learn the game and have it slow down when defensive players are in his face all the time and he's always in 3rd and long situations.That being said, Edwards looked much more comfortable right from the beginning last year. He makes much quicker decisions and isn't dancing around all the time. I do think that he'll negatively affect Evans's numbers though because I don't think that he can throw the deep ball anything like Losman. But I think the Bills will be in a lot less 3rd and 9s with him behind center.

 

[Banger]

any idea who the TE/#2 Wr are expected to be this year? Is Royal still slated to be their TE?

 

[munchkin]

New England fans have always had a weird fascination with backup QBs. It goes back a long time. Matt Cavanaugh and Eason were darlings while Grogan was the "no good" starter. I still to this day am fascinated with Michael Bishop, the backup darling before Brady. Furthermore, when Brady was the starter it was Bledsoe who was the darling backup that got em' into the Supe when Brady got hurt in the AFCC.

New England's supposed fascination with backups is not unique; think J-E-T-S jets, Minny, KC, Miami, Arizona, Atl (Vick & Schaub), etc. Fans across the board get impatient when a QB is not producing on the field up th THEIR expectations.

As for Grogan/Eason; Grogan was a great field leader but not a very accurate passer. When Eason came on Grogan was in the tail end of his career and Eason had played better. Part of his problem was he couldn't take a lickin' and keep on tickin' as Grogan could.

 

[switz]

It's not really fair to compare the performance of a first year QB to that of a fourth year QB given the colossal learning curve at the position. Losman had a QB rating of 76.9 with more INT's than TD's and a yards per attempt average of 6.9. That's terrible for a fourth year passer. He's had plenty of chances over the past three years and the best he's been able to muster was mediocrity. They know they can't win with him, so they're giving the young guy a shot.

Only one season as a full time starter, in which he showed promise, is not to me, "plenty of chances." He almost got the team to the playoffs the only year he was the FT starter. He passed for over 3,000 yards, 62.5% completion, 19TDs, 14INTs, 84.9 rating. Great? No, but pretty good for first time starting. Mind you Losman also had a different OC his first three years.

IMO, he has all the makings to be a better QB than Edwards, he just needs some better coaching, and patience.

 

[switz]

Losman will never be all that accurate, his completion percentage in college was around 57%, usually a barometer for NFL struggles.

He was over 62% in completions that last two years. To put that in perspective:- it's better than Brady has been 5 times in his 8 years.- it's on par with Peyton Manning's first 4 yearsHe may not be a 68% completion passer like some of the elite QBs, but he is FAR from a bad passer as far as completion % goes.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

It's not really fair to compare the performance of a first year QB to that of a fourth year QB given the colossal learning curve at the position. Losman had a QB rating of 76.9 with more INT's than TD's and a yards per attempt average of 6.9. That's terrible for a fourth year passer. He's had plenty of chances over the past three years and the best he's been able to muster was mediocrity. They know they can't win with him, so they're giving the young guy a shot.

Only one season as a full time starter, in which he showed promise, is not to me, "plenty of chances." He almost got the team to the playoffs the only year he was the FT starter. He passed for over 3,000 yards, 62.5% completion, 19TDs, 14INTs, 84.9 rating. Great? No, but pretty good for first time starting. Mind you Losman also had a different OC his first three years.

IMO, he has all the makings to be a better QB than Edwards, he just needs some better coaching, and patience.

I like JP better. But of course that was the previous regime, so Buffalo's brass probably like Edwards game management and "less mistake" football.

JP is more a gunslinger and I think he is clearly the better option of us FFL'ers. Maybe he can move on after this off-season.

 

[EBF]

It's not really fair to compare the performance of a first year QB to that of a fourth year QB given the colossal learning curve at the position. Losman had a QB rating of 76.9 with more INT's than TD's and a yards per attempt average of 6.9. That's terrible for a fourth year passer. He's had plenty of chances over the past three years and the best he's been able to muster was mediocrity. They know they can't win with him, so they're giving the young guy a shot.

Only one season as a full time starter, in which he showed promise, is not to me, "plenty of chances." He almost got the team to the playoffs the only year he was the FT starter. He passed for over 3,000 yards, 62.5% completion, 19TDs, 14INTs, 84.9 rating. Great? No, but pretty good for first time starting. Mind you Losman also had a different OC his first three years.

IMO, he has all the makings to be a better QB than Edwards, he just needs some better coaching, and patience.

He's 27, he's been in the league for 4 years, and he's still painfully mediocre. The people who have watched his games over the years have already laid out the reasons why he isn't a quality QB. He doesn't have the "it" factor at the position. He has deficient instincts and sub par mental skills. Edwards is far superior to him in those categories, which is why he'll be the starter on opening day. Losman is just another in a long line of Boller, Leftwich, Harrington, Ramsey, and Carr. People will make excuses for him, but in the end, he just isn't a very good NFL quarterback.

 

[Warhogs]

I think Losman could still be a decent QB but then again I still believe that Joey Harrington gets more of a bad wrap then he deserves too.

 

[munchkin]

It's not really fair to compare the performance of a first year QB to that of a fourth year QB given the colossal learning curve at the position. Losman had a QB rating of 76.9 with more INT's than TD's and a yards per attempt average of 6.9. That's terrible for a fourth year passer. He's had plenty of chances over the past three years and the best he's been able to muster was mediocrity. They know they can't win with him, so they're giving the young guy a shot.

Only one season as a full time starter, in which he showed promise, is not to me, "plenty of chances." He almost got the team to the playoffs the only year he was the FT starter. He passed for over 3,000 yards, 62.5% completion, 19TDs, 14INTs, 84.9 rating. Great? No, but pretty good for first time starting. Mind you Losman also had a different OC his first three years.

IMO, he has all the makings to be a better QB than Edwards, he just needs some better coaching, and patience.

I don't think it's out of the realm of possibilities that he gets another chance to start here. If not, he will likely get a chance to start somewhere else. I don't think you can fairly judge that he will be a "better" QB than Edwards with the limited exposure that Edwards has had to the pro game. To me a better QB is one that wins and Edwards has not had much of an opportunity to prove that he can/can't do that.

 

[T Bell]

Every time I watch Losman I see a QB who doesn't seem to have a full grasp of the position. You always hear pro athletes talk about how the game slows down as they gain experience. In Losman's case it appears the game is still going to fast for him. He just doesn't see to have a grasp as to what it takes to be a quality NFL QB. The fundamentals seem to be lacking and from everything I've read it doesn't appear he's got great leadership qualities.As for Edwards...it's still very early but he looks like he knows how to play the position. I don't think he'll be the type of guy to put up big numbers but he looks like he has the potential to be a quality game manager that has the trust of both his teammates and coaching staff. There's more to the QB position than pure stats and Edwards could be the type of QB who's value will be greater in real football than fantasy football.

This is a good summary of my impressions of both guys as well.Losman, if he's going to be successful, is going to resemble Brett Favre's risk-taking, free-wheeling, gun-slinging style, but what Losman seems to lack that Favre had was good command of the offense and game sense. Edwards seems like a guy who is more studious, to make up for his lack of physical gifts relative to Losman. The advantage he has is that he's a lot more predictable from a coaching standpoint, and that means you can build around him. The hope is that he turns into a guy like Trent Green or Hasselbeck, but more realistically he's probably going to fall within the range of John Kitna/Kerry Collins on the high side, and Gus Frerotte on the low side. With some tools around him, he can succeed in the NFL, but I just don't like him much as a fantasy QB. If he's more than a QB3 on your fantasy team, you're a bit thin at that position.

 

[alg]

It's not really fair to compare the performance of a first year QB to that of a fourth year QB given the colossal learning curve at the position. Losman had a QB rating of 76.9 with more INT's than TD's and a yards per attempt average of 6.9. That's terrible for a fourth year passer. He's had plenty of chances over the past three years and the best he's been able to muster was mediocrity. They know they can't win with him, so they're giving the young guy a shot.

Only one season as a full time starter, in which he showed promise, is not to me, "plenty of chances." He almost got the team to the playoffs the only year he was the FT starter. He passed for over 3,000 yards, 62.5% completion, 19TDs, 14INTs, 84.9 rating. Great? No, but pretty good for first time starting. Mind you Losman also had a different OC his first three years.

IMO, he has all the makings to be a better QB than Edwards, he just needs some better coaching, and patience.

Right on. The Bills may have one of the worst cases of what munchkin refereed to as the fascination with backups. JP had a serviceable OL for all of 8 games in 2006 (when they moved Peters to LT) and had us in the playoff hunt. He is a fiery leader, a big play machine, has a very strong arm, and is a real hard working guy and teammate. That fellow Bills fans have thrown him under the bus after 3 OCs and inept coaching is borderline sickening.

I remember watching as Buffalo almost upset the Cowboys last year. Edwards, the darling of Buffalo and the 'second coming' led us to 3 points. 3 points! And all anyone could talk about afterwords was how 'poised' he was. If JP had been in that game we would have kicked the tar out of them. He led us to another 3 (or 7) in the Jets game, only to be won by JP in the 4th on a big play.

What does not get mentioned enough is the philosophy of the coaching staff. They appear to favor a QB that can lead them to a last minute FG to win the game 6-3. Problem is, that just doesn't work. Not if you want your team to exceed the dead center of mediocrity. But a guy like JP, who can get the ball stripped, pick it up and run around for 2 minutes, and then throw a 60 TD pass just makes them too nervous. I'm really afraid our offense is doomed by Juron's philosophy.

But I have a feeling this is going to be a moot point. Aside from the broken leg in his 1st training camp (and last years cheap shot on his knee) Losman has been extremely durable. Probably the toughest QB we've had since Kelly. Edwards OTOH spent the majority of his college career in the training room. Relative to JP he is a delicate flower that will crumble far too often to have a consistent starting gig. If JP doesn't beat him outright in TC, then look for him to start the majority of the season filling in for an injured Edwards.