True Detective: Tom went in to listen to the Cardinals game...in November. Mmmmmhmmmm... (2 Viewers)

[Aaron Rudnicki]

True Detective: What Went Wrong

What went wrong? We’ll find out eventually, the internet being what it is, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the culprits weren’t ego and time: Too much ego, not enough time. In the aftermath of season one’s success (deserved, I’d say), Pizzolatto, a literary-fiction writer by trade, became an overnight wunderkind showrunner philosopher-king. He parted ways with season one’s sole director, Cary Fukunaga, and hired a bomber crew of guest directors (including Justin Lin, who helmed the first two*). In interviews like this one, he seemed to go out of his way to assert primary authorship — perhaps understandably, considering that most of the positive attention paid to season one had to do with the show’s direction, photography, music, and acting, while most of the complaints (including the ones about sexism) were about the writing. Pizzolatto committed to solo-writing season two fast enough to get it on HBO just 15 months after the season-one finale. Given all this, it’s not hugely surprising that the result feels like a first or maybe second draft rather than a polished final product. The break in the middle (after the shootout) makes the final four play like a redo, and there aren’t enough mirrored elements to make it seem as though it’s all part of some grand design, the intricacies of which will be revealed if you stare at the thing long enough.

I’m not ready to write off Pizzolatto, though, because if this season was a failure, as I believe it was, at least it was a singular failure, a morose pastiche of neo-noir, the civic corruption story, James Ellroy’s crime fiction, and ham actor fantasies of “edginess.” (Cocaine! Knives! Molestation! Arson! Sex parties!) I wish Pizzolatto could have had another year to work on it, but only if he’d hired a writing staff experienced in untangling a spaghetti-blob of plot threads, and perhaps a powerful showrunner unafraid to tell him that he isn’t good at everything and that there’s no shame in moving over and letting other people drive sometimes.

 

[The Gator]

Glad they finally showed the non lethal bullets, I was wondering why Velcoro didn't die.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

While I'm sure there are worse shows/seasons of TV out there, this is probably the worst I've watched through its ending and probably the most disappointing. It didn't just fail to meet expectations though. It was plain old bad.

Watch the last two/three seasons of Dexter through to the finale sometime, you'll want to pour acid into your own eyes.

This was worse.

 

[heckmanm]

Grantland take

Pizzolatto tried to shove a David Lynch movie into a crime novel and adapt it into an eight-episode prestige cable show that was often paced like a 22-episode network television show and performed like a screwed and chopped soap opera. All the 10-gallon hats and shopping bags full of land deeds and hard drives couldn’t fix the damage. In the end, Pizzolatto tried to recap his own show — weighing down characters with the burden of explaining his own story, and then discarding many of those same characters, just to try to steal back some gravitas.

 

[bigmarc27]

While I'm sure there are worse shows/seasons of TV out there, this is probably the worst I've watched through its ending and probably the most disappointing. It didn't just fail to meet expectations though. It was plain old bad.

Watch the last two/three seasons of Dexter through to the finale sometime, you'll want to pour acid into your own eyes.

This was worse.

No way - Dexter was just brutal at the end. No way you've watched both if you thought this was worse. The last few seasons of Dexter was some of the worst TV I have ever seen.

 

[Raider Nation]

Good shtick here. Wish I had thought of it.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

While I'm sure there are worse shows/seasons of TV out there, this is probably the worst I've watched through its ending and probably the most disappointing. It didn't just fail to meet expectations though. It was plain old bad.

Watch the last two/three seasons of Dexter through to the finale sometime, you'll want to pour acid into your own eyes.

This was worse.

No way - Dexter was just brutal at the end. No way you've watched both if you thought this was worse. The last few seasons of Dexter was some of the worst TV I have ever seen.

The end of Dexter was terrible, but at least I cared about the characters. This had worse dialogue and I didn't care what happened.

 

[QuizGuy66]

Grantland take

Pizzolatto tried to shove a David Lynch movie into a crime novel and adapt it into an eight-episode prestige cable show that was often paced like a 22-episode network television show and performed like a screwed and chopped soap opera. All the 10-gallon hats and shopping bags full of land deeds and hard drives couldn’t fix the damage. In the end, Pizzolatto tried to recap his own show — weighing down characters with the burden of explaining his own story, and then discarding many of those same characters, just to try to steal back some gravitas.

The biggest example was the protector guy explaining his loyalty to VV. Just thrown in there "oh by the way this is why I seem to be the only guy VV trusts implicitly - now off to Venezuela!"

-QG

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Grantland take

Pizzolatto tried to shove a David Lynch movie into a crime novel and adapt it into an eight-episode prestige cable show that was often paced like a 22-episode network television show and performed like a screwed and chopped soap opera. All the 10-gallon hats and shopping bags full of land deeds and hard drives couldn’t fix the damage. In the end, Pizzolatto tried to recap his own show — weighing down characters with the burden of explaining his own story, and then discarding many of those same characters, just to try to steal back some gravitas.

The biggest example was the protector guy explaining his loyalty to VV. Just thrown in there "oh by the way this is why I seem to be the only guy VV trusts implicitly - now off to Venezuela!"

-QG

You get to Level 60 on Bubble Witch yet?

 

[belljr]

Ok I do have a serious question...

I thought I understood everything but I don't get who killed the mayor and why was the doctor killed?

 

[QuizGuy66]

Grantland take

Pizzolatto tried to shove a David Lynch movie into a crime novel and adapt it into an eight-episode prestige cable show that was often paced like a 22-episode network television show and performed like a screwed and chopped soap opera. All the 10-gallon hats and shopping bags full of land deeds and hard drives couldn’t fix the damage. In the end, Pizzolatto tried to recap his own show — weighing down characters with the burden of explaining his own story, and then discarding many of those same characters, just to try to steal back some gravitas.

The biggest example was the protector guy explaining his loyalty to VV. Just thrown in there "oh by the way this is why I seem to be the only guy VV trusts implicitly - now off to Venezuela!"

-QG

You get to Level 60 on Bubble Witch yet?

Nails, whatever the hell his name was - I mean they said it like, what, 3 times the whole series.

Figure I'll put as much effort into remembering the character's name as Pizzolatto did in filling in back stories.

-QG

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Ok I do have a serious question...

I thought I understood everything but I don't get who killed the mayor and why was the doctor killed?

The doctor was killed by Jesse because he wouldn't stop creeping on his girl.

 

[shadyridr]

Ok I do have a serious question...

I thought I understood everything but I don't get who killed the mayor and why was the doctor killed?

The Mayor's son killed him and made it look like a suicide. Not sure about the second.

 

[The Football Freak]

Glad they finally showed the non lethal bullets, I was wondering why Velcoro didn't die.

But why were they sitting there so long after they were used? Lots and lots of very convenient moments interspersed with amazing coincidences during the season. I agree with the critic up thread who said it felt like we were watching a 1st or 2nd draft.

Next season should begin with a proper orgy scene as a mea culpa to the fans.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

I like how he just had the crow's mask hanging on the wall.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

I like how he just had the crow's mask hanging on the wall.

Why throw away a perfectly good crow mask?

 

[Good Posting Judge]

I keep my crow masks in a dresser. Having them on the wall is "LOOK AT ME!!!" behavior.

 

[gump]

I like how he just had the crow's mask hanging on the wall.

Right next to the white mask he used to burn the stolen car.

 

[JerseyToughGuys]

Wasn't terrible. They built up some decent suspense. You knew Ray and Frank we're going to die, it was just a question of when.

However, the part where they throw their wedding rings out he door was just ####### terrible. How does that not get an edit?

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Wasn't terrible. They built up some decent suspense. You knew Ray and Frank we're going to die, it was just a question of when.

However, the part where they throw their wedding rings out he door was just ####### terrible. How does that not get an edit?

Or Frank sticking his diamonds in his knife-wound for some reason.

 

[Raider Nation]

So does Frank have any prayer of walking to civilization in his boxer shorts in that heat before succumbing to dehydration if he gives up the suit?

 

[pantherclub]

So does Frank have any prayer of walking to civilization in his boxer shorts in that heat before succumbing to dehydration if he gives up the suit?

That entire scene was just bizarre. I am guessing is that Frank knew he had the diamonds and they were his last hope so he couldnt give them up. Not sure why he just didnt shut up after the Mexicans were getting in the car. Just weird.

 

[mquinnjr]

Good shtick here. Wish I had thought of it.

Right in the Chris Brody alias tier.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Pretty sure Frank was toast no matter what. They're going to just drive him back to town and think they'll just part as friends?

 

[JerseyToughGuys]

Wasn't terrible. They built up some decent suspense. You knew Ray and Frank we're going to die, it was just a question of when.

However, the part where they throw their wedding rings out he door was just ####### terrible. How does that not get an edit?

Or Frank sticking his diamonds in his knife-wound for some reason.

Holy #### totally missed that.

As an aside, I did wonder if the desert winds would eventually scatter the diamonds to the point where no one would ever find them.

 

[Raider Nation]

This fine thread fell to page 2. Don't let it happen again.

 

[Bob Magaw]

TD season three needs to return to the formula that made the first season so successful.

Deranged serial killer twins Will Ferrell and John Reilly are tracked by inept FBI profilers Jim Carrey and Jeff Daniels.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Saw it on Uproxx I think, but the dream that Ray has after getting shot, where they're in the bar and his dad tells him how he's going to die, that's how he actually died. There's trees, you feel small, too slow, cut to pieces, etc.

 

[shuke]

I was eating an apple trying to make bites around the little produce sticker with the number on it. I got distracted from reading posts, looked down and the sticker was gone. Am I going to die?

Who the #### doesn't take the sticker off an apple before they start eating it?

Who the #### goes around quoting posts that are two months old?

People that eat fruit correctly, apparently.

 

[Raider Nation]

Saw it on Uproxx I think, but the dream that Ray has after getting shot, where they're in the bar and his dad tells him how he's going to die, that's how he actually died. There's trees, you feel small, too slow, cut to pieces, etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0Fn7GZjR0Q&feature=youtu.be&t=3m38s

 

[ghostguy123]

So is this show worth binge watching?

I loved it last year

 

[shuke]

It's a funny thing, the filament. It gets hot, makes the light bulb brighten. Hey, a light bulb just went over my head. I have an idea, muchacho. How about you tell me where the girl is, or I'll make sure your light gets turned off. Forever.

My father used to take me to the zoo. I feel like one of those animals right now, caged up, antsy, sickened by the never-ending smell of waffle cones. I need this trip to end soon, baby. I can't stay in the shark exhibit until the park closes.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

It's a funny thing, the filament. It gets hot, makes the light bulb brighten. Hey, a light bulb just went over my head. I have an idea, muchacho. How about you tell me where the girl is, or I'll make sure your light gets turned off. Forever.

My father used to take me to the zoo. I feel like one of those animals right now, caged up, antsy, sickened by the never-ending smell of waffle cones. I need this trip to end soon, baby. I can't stay in the shark exhibit until the park closes.

https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?/topic/729625-rejected-frank-semyon-lines/?view=getnewpost

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

So is this show worth binge watching?

I loved it last year

no. God no. #### no.

 

[Chase Stuart]

I thought this was spot on by Sepwinall:

So Ani and Jordan lived while Ray and Frank died, the two women now taking care of Ray's baby — to go along with Emily raising Paul's baby, and Gena discovering that Ray was Chad's biological father, leaving a trail of fatherless children — and none of it mattered in the slightest, because the character work had been so broad and rushed in order to make room for a plot the season did such a poor job of laying out.
Read more at http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/review-trying-to-make-sense-of-the-ridiculous-true-detective-finale#yQGCdcc4SBTD5EGb.99

You can almost see the vision Pizzolatto maybe had, or the central idea he was trying to communicate: something something about fatherless sons/children (add in Stan's kid, too). Throw in VV's stuff with his dad, we got a little of Ray and his dad, and a lot of Ani and her dad. But it still felt like this father/kid thing was completely glossed over, and to the extent it wasn't, I have no clue what the message was supposed to be.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Also, how much did Pizzolatto and HBO get from JW for all that Blue product placement??

 

[Chase Stuart]

While I'm sure there are worse shows/seasons of TV out there, this is probably the worst I've watched through its ending and probably the most disappointing. It didn't just fail to meet expectations though. It was plain old bad.

Watch the last two/three seasons of Dexter through to the finale sometime, you'll want to pour acid into your own eyes.

This was worse.

No way - Dexter was just brutal at the end. No way you've watched both if you thought this was worse. The last few seasons of Dexter was some of the worst TV I have ever seen.

My favorite part of the last season of Dexter was the thread here. So many people saying "I can't take another episode, I'm out", and then other people saying "Only 5 episodes left, I can't quit now." Then the next week, like a quarter of group 2 became group 1: "I can't take another episode, I'm out", and the holdouts kept coming back with "Only 4 episodes left, might as well stick it out."

I think someone quit with just the finale to go. And he was so much smarter than all of us who died a little inside sitting through that last episode.

Yeah, no way this was worse than the last season of Dexter.

 

[eoMMan]

Also, how much did Pizzolatto and HBO get from JW for all that Blue product placement??

Or from Audi, especially in the last episode?

 

[RUSF18]

I thought this was spot on by Sepwinall:

So Ani and Jordan lived while Ray and Frank died, the two women now taking care of Ray's baby — to go along with Emily raising Paul's baby, and Gena discovering that Ray was Chad's biological father, leaving a trail of fatherless children — and none of it mattered in the slightest, because the character work had been so broad and rushed in order to make room for a plot the season did such a poor job of laying out.
Read more at http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/review-trying-to-make-sense-of-the-ridiculous-true-detective-finale#yQGCdcc4SBTD5EGb.99

You can almost see the vision Pizzolatto maybe had, or the central idea he was trying to communicate: something something about fatherless sons/children (add in Stan's kid, too). Throw in VV's stuff with his dad, we got a little of Ray and his dad, and a lot of Ani and her dad. But it still felt like this father/kid thing was completely glossed over, and to the extent it wasn't, I have no clue what the message was supposed to be.

Ohhhhh I see what he was going for now....

WHO THE #### WOULD EVER WANT TO WATCH THAT??!??!

 

[psychobillies]

Saw it on Uproxx I think, but the dream that Ray has after getting shot, where they're in the bar and his dad tells him how he's going to die, that's how he actually died. There's trees, you feel small, too slow, cut to pieces, etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0Fn7GZjR0Q&feature=youtu.be&t=3m38s

That just reminds me how pissed I am that Conway is dead.

 

[Emerson Biggens]

Also, how much did Pizzolatto and HBO get from JW for all that Blue product placement??

What is JW and Blue?Never mind, I know. It worked on me, made me buy some to try it.

 

[sartre]

Saw it on Uproxx I think, but the dream that Ray has after getting shot, where they're in the bar and his dad tells him how he's going to die, that's how he actually died. There's trees, you feel small, too slow, cut to pieces, etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0Fn7GZjR0Q&feature=youtu.be&t=3m38s

That was season 2's only great scene. The rest was a series of disappointments.

 

[shadyridr]

Also, how much did Pizzolatto and HBO get from JW for all that Blue product placement??

What is JW and Blue?Never mind, I know. It worked on me, made me buy some to try it.

elixir of the gods

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Kinda interesting note re: Season 1!

I'm listening to the Grantland podcast "The Lambert Account", and the titular Ms. Lambert relayed a story that she knew crew-members in LA. They told her (so mind you, this is a Ferris Bueller puking at 31 Flavors level of hearsay here) that the original plan, the plan that all of the main players signed on for, was dark. Cohle is killed in the end, and Marty, depressed, commits suicide.

Last minute, Pizzolatto changes it up and goes with the happy ending. Everyone was apparently pretty pissed.

 

[psychobillies]

Kinda interesting note re: Season 1!

I'm listening to the Grantland podcast "The Lambert Account", and the titular Ms. Lambert relayed a story that she knew crew-members in LA. They told her (so mind you, this is a Ferris Bueller puking at 31 Flavors level of hearsay here) that the original plan, the plan that all of the main players signed on for, was dark. Cohle is killed in the end, and Marty, depressed, commits suicide.

Last minute, Pizzolatto changes it up and goes with the happy ending. Everyone was apparently pretty pissed.

Probably would have been better. I hated the ending of S1.

 

[heckmanm]

Very angry right now that "Blue Balls in my Heart" is too long for a Yahoo FF team name

 

[Notorious T.R.E.]

Who was the black guy in the train station? Was that the first time we have seen him on the show?

Seriously? There was one black on the whole show! Vinci police chief and Ray's boss, Paul took him hostage last week underground, etc.

Don't forget Grandmaster Flash and the Furious Five talking #### to Frank in the desert.

Would have been perfect if one busted out a headspin there.

 

[Rohn Jambo]

I am watching more true detectives... BBC's Sherlock S3.

 

[Notorious T.R.E.]

i have never watched one single second of this show but i bet it is about a billion times better than sons of anarchy that show sucked some serious you know what bromigos take that to the bank

I made it through 3 episodes of Sons of Anarchy. The carny fist fight was the end for me.

You missed out.

On bad stuff?

The thread was fun. It was like all of the shtick of this thread without the 300 different posters whose "critiques" are the same thing over and over.

Maybe also a huge regrettable waste of time.

Also, I started watching last week, so the thread wouldn't have worked for me.

In the end Jax apparently realizes he can't ever separate his lives of being an outlaw biker and family man and does the logical thing and rides straight into a semi truck, in Jesus Christ pose. And it's obviously a green screen.

And the truck is driven by Michael Chiklis. I swear I'm not making any of this up.

This could not have been a waste of anybody's time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElnNwsgw9A0

HFS

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Real talk. You guys have no idea what bad television is.