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UFC wagering: no longer stuck with the old thread title. The window to change it is here! (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter AhrnCityPahnder
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EYLive
Footballguy
I 100% agree.
However, I'm curious as to why she can't make weight with 2 months notice. George Lockhart should be able to get her to 145 in that time, no?
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
Not seeing the blame for the UFC here. They offered her the fight with plenty of notice. Her weight cut is not their responsibility.
Aldo was different situation.
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
The only reason they're creating the belt at all is probably because they need a headliner for an event, same as the fake FW belt. It's gone full pro wrasslin' now. There aren't really even enough good 135ers to make that division worthwhile -- 145 is going to be a joke.
EYLive
Footballguy
Abrantes
Footballguy
We don't know how much time would be plenty for Cyborg to recover from the previous cut to 140 and then get to 145 fighting shape. She does, though, and argues that two months would be pushing it. She said she'd fight in March, so it's not like she's ducking anyone, but apparently the UFC decided they just had to have a sham title fight in February instead, even though Holm/de Randamie isn't exactly going to be a needle-mover. It's just plain silly.
100% this. I can't imagine any other fighter turning down a title fight on two month's notice.
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
Again, her recovery/cut is her problem, not the UFCs. 2 months or so seems pretty standard for fight announcements. They feel the need to put on crap events and sham titles help sell those crap events.
I remember when Peyton Manning needed an extra month to get ready, so the NFL moved the Super Bowl back.
I remember Conor McGregor clamoring for a lightweight title shot and then turning it down because he only had 46 days notice.
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
Breakdown of days notice for title fights:
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2016/12/15/13956936/ufc-cris-cyborg-rushed-title-statistical-analysis-holm
It turns out that, yes, 60 days is on the short end of time, but it’s not unusual.
The average time that a fighter usually has to prepare for a championship fight is 87.92 days.This is based on the last 50 championship fights that were announced and fought without injury delays, short notice replacements, TUF coaches or rescheduling.
Conor McGregor and Eddie Alvarez fought at UFC 205 on 46 days notice. The two other championship fights on the card (Woodley/Thompson and Jedrzejczyk/Kowalkiewicz) were fought on 57 and 50 days notice respectively. Amanda Nunes and Ronda Rousey’s fight was announced 48 days before UFC 207, and Dominick Cruz vs. Cody Garbrandt takes the cake with 36 days notice.
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2016/12/15/13956936/ufc-cris-cyborg-rushed-title-statistical-analysis-holm
It turns out that, yes, 60 days is on the short end of time, but it’s not unusual.
The average time that a fighter usually has to prepare for a championship fight is 87.92 days.This is based on the last 50 championship fights that were announced and fought without injury delays, short notice replacements, TUF coaches or rescheduling.
Conor McGregor and Eddie Alvarez fought at UFC 205 on 46 days notice. The two other championship fights on the card (Woodley/Thompson and Jedrzejczyk/Kowalkiewicz) were fought on 57 and 50 days notice respectively. Amanda Nunes and Ronda Rousey’s fight was announced 48 days before UFC 207, and Dominick Cruz vs. Cody Garbrandt takes the cake with 36 days notice.
EYLive
Footballguy
The funny/sad thing is the UFC chose Holm (coming off 2 losses and 0 MMA fights at featherweight) and de Randamie (whose only career featherweight win was in 2012) to fight for the championship.
It's such a sham, as there are plenty of women in Invicta that are more deserving.
It's such a sham, as there are plenty of women in Invicta that are more deserving.
Abrantes
Footballguy
I was trolling a bit, but what about the other example with McGregor?Abrantes said:
Santos has been wanting a 145-pound division, and the UFC wanted her to immediately fight for the title. She can't ready in two months. How can a fighter - who isn't injured - not be ready to fight in their preferred division in two months? She fought three months ago - at 140 - but now needs three months to be ready to fight again - at 145. She obviously has let herself get too heavy since her least fight. Like many fighters (Gastelum comes to mind), she needs more discipline with her weight management between fights.
Seriously, though - can you imagine any fighter saying "No, thanks" to the UFC if offered a 60-day camp to fight for the title in their preferred division? Imagine the backlash that would be heaped upon McGregor if he would have declined the lightweight title fight. Who cares if it's a made-up sham title. It's for the championship in her division. Santos getting sympathy for this incident absolutely boggles my mind.
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
I agree that it is pretty ridiculous that Cyborg can't get ready to fight in 2 months -- but that doesn't make a 145 pound title fight between two 135ers that don't come close to deserving it any less awful. Playing these games with the belts in order to help sell crappy cards to the casuals really hurts the legitimacy of the sport. If Holm wins, then she's going to be promoted as a two division champion the equal of Couture, Penn, and McGregor to set up the Rousy rematch "super" fight, which is an absolute effing joke. It's terrible and totally short-sighted to do this stuff IMO.
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Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
I get why they're making these fake titles with the huge debt but these really putting up fake titles isn't a needle mover. "In the blue corner UFC lightweight champion _______.. In the red corner the WME-IMG lightweight champion ______________"
Re: Khabib-Ferguson, nothing is signed. 209 has been discussed but not a done deal. Interim 155 title also discussed but not 100% either.
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
Come on
McGregor expects to be out for what, 10 months?
McGregor expects to be out for what, 10 months?
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
I guess it must draw in the casuals when they can say there is a title fight on the top of the card, but this is beyond ridiculous at this point. We're about to have three total fake FW belts between Aldo, Max, and whoever wins the women's fight. Cormier's belt is fake (even though I love Cormier and hate Jones, Jones is still the champ IMO until he loses in the octagon), and now they want a fake LW belt too? Sage Northcutt vs. CM Punk for the "UFC Intercontinental Championship" soon, watch. Or maybe Sage and PVZ as the Mixed Doubles Tag Team Champs. Almost getting ridiculous enough for me to just not want to watch at all anymore...
I completely understand the idea of these belts being ridiculous.Coeur de Lion said:
I have no idea why it would keep you from wanting to watch the fights. I would watch Holm vs de Randamie for a made up title or as a Fight Pass prelim. Regardless of what the UFC says is on the line, I still don't think either could defeat Santos.
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Pretty sure she is randomly tested, so that wouldn't matter. I just think she lets herself go between fights. She is very big for 145 and should be more strict between fights so that the cut isn't so strenuous on her.
Yeah she is huge. There are some funny pics of her next to Frankie edger. And one with her and Dominic cruz where it looks like a mom and her son.
GOB
Footballguy
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
This 100%.
Titles hold such little meaning nowadays with so few dominant champs. Give me a Cerrone, Diaz, Maia, Lauzon, Lawler, etc fight any day over all these "title fights". I'm not even sure who the HW champ is right now. Still Werdum?
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
A big part of what appeals to me is the purity of the best guys in the world fighting each other. It's not always, or even usually, that anymore at all. It's more about who runs their mouth and can sell PPVs and skill is secondary. Started with Lesnar, Sonnen made it worse, and now McGregor and Rousey. It's far less interesting to me than it was when we had guys like Hughes, Liddell, GSP, and Silvia just beating the #### out of a huge string of tough #1 contenders every few months.
Being totally honest, the watering down / over-saturation plays a big role too -- but I'm only ordering a handful of PPVs / year now when I used to never miss one.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
I havent checked the validity of it but heard a comment that Invicta 145 Top 10 has a fighter with like 2 pro fights.......and full of older ladies that are near the end and/or already been destroyed by Cyborg. It'd be like CM Punk getting a shot.
UFC 145 is just 135ers jumping up a class. Bad when Holm (loser of last 2 fights at 135) is getting your first snot for the title. I really don't mind the division (125 obviously makes more sense right now.....and probably will be created very soon) but seems like there's not much of a plan right now beyond moving up 135ers to eventually feed Cyborg. I really don't have any sympathy for Cyborg but don't fault her either after UFC has been telling her for years & years move down to 135 (and there would never be a 145 division). She can fight when she wants
She's one of the very very very very few headline attractions UFC has right now.I'd much rather see Joanna moving up for a 125 shot/double champ right now as opposed to Holm vs. whomever she's fighting. New ownership is desperate to find money cards/fights. I just don't think creating fake titles is the answer. UFC 206 was awesome.......but doubtful many bought it.
Creating an interim 155 belt on a card (reportedly UFC 209) less than 4 months after Conor defended the belt is just idiotic.
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sheerterror
Footballguy
sheerterror
Footballguy
Agreed entirely regarding all of these belts. It's becoming boxing, without the 43 governing associations to justify all of them.
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
Im not sure how you can say they dont fight the best
CM is fighting tough fighters
What has Ronda done to be in that group?
maybe im missing something
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That makes sense. I happen to think they still fight tough guys, but I get what you're saying.
Dedfin
Footballguy
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
Tough guys, sure. But the champions / guys promoted as the best in the world should be taking the stiffest challenges available, period. Somehow McGregor has been able to completely dodge anyone even remotely resembling a dangerous grappler with the exception of Mendes who stepped in on short notice. We'll see who he defends against eventually, but I'd bet an awful lot that it won't be against Khabib, who is a stylistic nightmare for him. Henderson's title shot was equally awful. The UFC is being run as sports entertainment instead of a sport. I understand why, and they're certainly making more money doing so, but it definitely turns me off. YMMV.
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
scoobus
Footballguy
I don't love McGregor (don't dislike him either), but:
Holloway, Brandao, Poirier, Siver, Mendes, Aldo, Diaz x2, Alvarez
I didn't like him holding up the FW division to fight Diaz twice, but I mean come on, that's not fighting tough competition? Diaz and Alvarez don't remotely resemble dangerous grapplers?
Holloway, Brandao, Poirier, Siver, Mendes, Aldo, Diaz x2, Alvarez
I didn't like him holding up the FW division to fight Diaz twice, but I mean come on, that's not fighting tough competition? Diaz and Alvarez don't remotely resemble dangerous grapplers?
I only really have a problem with Henderson getting a shot. Nurmagomedov has been hurt a lot and only recently actually deserves a shot at the title. If he beats Furgeson, I'm sure he'll get the next fight against McGregor. Anyway, it seems people who aren't fans of McGregor always think there's a fighter - or maybe a style of fighter - who would give him problems. He keeps winning, though.
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
That's not what I said at all.
Diaz and Alvarez are very good. They're both tough outs for anyone most of the time. They're also way easier fights for McGregor than an Aldo rematch or Edgar at 145, or Ferguson or Khabib at 155. McGregor has been gifted two title shots and allowed to hand pick opponents and it's silly to argue that he hasn't.
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
I am a fan of watching McGregor fight actually. What I'm not a fan of is Aldo not getting a rematch, Edgar not getting a shot at him, getting a FW shot by beating Siver and a LW without ever fighting at 155, the useless rematch against Diaz, and just now deciding that he finally needs a break and not defending against Khabib or Ferguson. He's still yet to defend a belt; it's truly absurd.
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
Faber's most recent shot at Cruz was really weak too, actually; he got the title shot strictly due to the storyline.
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
well judging by how he dominates the champions he fights to win the belts id say he more than deserved those title shots ...fighting Diaz TWICE was an amazing decision on his part...all risk with zero reward.....hes been one of the most active fighters in the game right now...he deserves a nice break...his wife asked him to take a vacation while shes pregnant...whats the big deal...we have no idea who he will fight when he comes back in 6 months ...if i had to speculate,because thats all we can do, speculate, id say he fights the number 1 contender whomever that may be at the time...i guess people just see the same things differently ...oh well
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Dedfin
Footballguy
I guess I just don't see Diaz is that great of a fighter. Before the CM fights, I considered him to be a journeyman. Aldo - great job. Alvarez - good job. It's not all his fault I guess. I suppose I was more annoyed at the manufactured rivalry between CM and Diaz instead of giving an all timer a rematch on a 10 second knockout punch. We were all robbed on that imo.
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
What? All risk? He got to keep his belt while fighting a journeyman LW at WW -- there was zero risk there at all.
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
he was set to fight Dos Anjos for the title who backed out with an injury...conor takes a fight on short notice ..AGAIN...he didnt need to do that ...he ends up losing and everyone starts talking #### about him as usual...then he asks for an immediate rematch and wins .....none of which he needed to do...thats called Risk ...he gained nothing but money from those fights ...no titles on the line...just fighting a larger and very capable fighter ...so the only reward was money
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
Does Anjos is a pretty solid grappler who McGregor signed up to fight
Don't know who he's ducked. Why fight Khahib or Ferguson when he could fight for the title? The "he hasn't fought anyone" or is "hand picking fights" shtick needs to stop.
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
a voice of reason...thank youDoes Anjos is a pretty solid grappler who McGregor signed up to fight
Don't know who he's ducked. Why fight Khahib or Ferguson when he could fight for the title? The "he hasn't fought anyone" or is "hand picking fights" shtick needs to stop.