US Bombs Doctors Without Borders (1 Viewer)

[Insein]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

 

[msommer]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

It would probably help if there would be no attempt to sweep this under the rug

 

[Fennis]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

It would probably help if there would be no attempt to sweep this under the rug

that's what the military does in these situations. Civilian oversight is mostly cursory. Would be nice for Congress to do their job here. We will see.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

It would probably help if there would be no attempt to sweep this under the rug

that's what the military does in these situations. Civilian oversight is mostly cursory. Would be nice for Congress to do their job here. We will see.

Oh really?

 

[Doctor Detroit]

You obviously don't understand who sets DoD policy.

 

[Fennis]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

It would probably help if there would be no attempt to sweep this under the rug

that's what the military does in these situations. Civilian oversight is mostly cursory. Would be nice for Congress to do their job here. We will see.

Oh really?

OK, I could be wrong. I look forward to the results of congressional investigations in this incident.

 

[msommer]

BENGHAZI!!!

/Saintsinthedome

 

[The_Man]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

Yep, oh well.

Onto the next wedding party, or hospital, or whatever other innocent people we kill on the other side of the world because it's somehow keeping our homeland safe.

As long as we're secure in our knowledge that we're the good guys, it doesn't matter if we screw up every now and then.

 

[CBusAlex]

So you go from a "guess" to ashamed and disgusted with this country. Seems reasonable.

Darn autocorrect

There is no doubt we bombed it. There is no doubt we did so despite knowing the exact location and there is no doubt we continued despite being told we were bombing a hospital. I started out disgusted and ashamed and I have yet to see any reason for that to change.

My only guess is why we picked it as a target.

Afghan special forces have raided this hospital at gunpoint before. Apparently they're not a big fan of its "treat all the wounded no matter which side they're on" policy.

And FWIW, Fox News has some unnamed "senior defense official" claiming that it was US forces that called in the airstrike.

 

[Short Corner]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

And we wonder what motivates these radicals to put on a vest or hijack a plane.

 

[HellToupee]

False flag operation

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

And we wonder what motivates these radicals to put on a vest or hijack a plane.

Yeah Islamic Fundamentalists, the same who burn schools down and kill innocent children every day, are probably pretty pleased by all this.We did their work for them.

When I was in Afghanistan in 2002 we stopped on a convoy and I got to see four Danish medical workers who were skinned alive by the Taliban. No outrage, no front page news. Why? We just expect it. Without our assistance tens of thousands more people would have died in Afghanistan.

 

[Short Corner]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

And we wonder what motivates these radicals to put on a vest or hijack a plane.

Yeah Islamic Fundamentalists, the same who burn schools down and kill innocent children every day, are probably pretty pleased by all this.We did their work for them.

When I was in Afghanistan in 2002 we stopped on a convoy and I got to see four Danish medical workers who were skinned alive by the Taliban. No outrage, no front page news. Why? We just expect it. Without our assistance tens of thousands more people would have died in Afghanistan.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

And we wonder what motivates these radicals to put on a vest or hijack a plane.

Yeah Islamic Fundamentalists, the same who burn schools down and kill innocent children every day, are probably pretty pleased by all this.We did their work for them.

When I was in Afghanistan in 2002 we stopped on a convoy and I got to see four Danish medical workers who were skinned alive by the Taliban. No outrage, no front page news. Why? We just expect it. Without our assistance tens of thousands more people would have died in Afghanistan.

Glad you are entertained by death and destruction. Good for you.

 

[Short Corner]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

And we wonder what motivates these radicals to put on a vest or hijack a plane.

Yeah Islamic Fundamentalists, the same who burn schools down and kill innocent children every day, are probably pretty pleased by all this.We did their work for them.

When I was in Afghanistan in 2002 we stopped on a convoy and I got to see four Danish medical workers who were skinned alive by the Taliban. No outrage, no front page news. Why? We just expect it. Without our assistance tens of thousands more people would have died in Afghanistan.

Glad you are entertained by death and destruction. Good for you.

Says the guy whose reaction to us bombing a hospital is "oops my mistake". I don't find the death and destruction entertaining, but your clinging to the notion that our presence there is somehow part of the solution.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Yeah that's what I said.

It's reality tough guy, try to get a view of it from your ivory tower.

 

[Fennis]

Yeah that's what I said.

It's reality tough guy, try to get a view of it from your ivory tower.

Elephants are endangered. I think the term should be your bio-degradable, energy neutral shared housing unit.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Yeah that's what I said.

It's reality tough guy, try to get a view of it from your ivory tower.

Elephants are endangered. I think the term should be your bio-degradable, energy neutral shared housing unit.

I'd save the elephant in this scenario.

 

[johnnycakes]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

And we wonder what motivates these radicals to put on a vest or hijack a plane.

Yeah Islamic Fundamentalists, the same who burn schools down and kill innocent children every day, are probably pretty pleased by all this.We did their work for them.

When I was in Afghanistan in 2002 we stopped on a convoy and I got to see four Danish medical workers who were skinned alive by the Taliban. No outrage, no front page news. Why? We just expect it. Without our assistance tens of thousands more people would have died in Afghanistan.

Ooof... Gnarly. No wonder soldiers get PTSD.

 

[jon_mx]

Glad to see the hate America crowd not disappointing us with their usual rhetoric

 

[Homer J Simpson]

Glad to see the hate America crowd not disappointing us with their usual rhetoric

Personally, I think it's ridiculous that we don't blow up more hospitals.

'MERICA!!!

 

[The_Man]

Glad to see the hate America crowd not disappointing us with their usual rhetoric

We blew up a hospital. It's just so comical!

 

[jon_mx]

Glad to see the hate America crowd not disappointing us with their usual rhetoric

Personally, I think it's ridiculous that we don't blow up more hospitals.

'MERICA!!!

I was talking about those assuming this was intentional, but you probably knew that.

 

[[icon]]

Again, ac-130 doesn't use GPS coordinates. Yes, dwb gave the us its location. But did that get transferred to everyone's hard map?

Right now it seems we hit the intended target. The Afghans said the Taliban were using the compound as a base and firing at friendly forces in and around that locale. We have a FOB there but I'd guess we didn't have troops on the ground, definitely no FACs. So AC-130 was in area to support Afghan ops, they called it in to say were the enemy was, U.S. cross-referenced and probably had old data on what was in the facility, authorized the target, bad #### happened. Or we can go with NCC's explanation and just say America is awful and did this on purpose because we wanted to kill a bunch of innocent doctors, nurses, and patients. BECAUSE WE ARE SATAN LIKE IRAN SAYS WE ARE!!!!!!

Does it really matter? Because that's going to be the spin the enemy will use and they will have plenty of juicy visual evidence and quotes to back it up for a change. Just fuel for the fire. Making ISIS job easier.

Probably not. We screwed up, some innocent people died, war sucks. Can't change any of that.

And we wonder what motivates these radicals to put on a vest or hijack a plane.

Yeah Islamic Fundamentalists, the same who burn schools down and kill innocent children every day, are probably pretty pleased by all this.We did their work for them.

When I was in Afghanistan in 2002 we stopped on a convoy and I got to see four Danish medical workers who were skinned alive by the Taliban. No outrage, no front page news. Why? We just expect it. Without our assistance tens of thousands more people would have died in Afghanistan.

Are you implying the people of Afghanistan were better off before we arrived? Please explain, specifically, how you saw things playing out had we not intervened.

 

[[icon]]

Does anyone here really think there is anyone in this thread who doesn't loathe the fact that a hospital was bombed?

Really?

 

[The_Man]

It's not the loathing, it's what you think should happen as a result. Some people think it's the kind of unfortunate but acceptabe collateral damage that results from keeping America safe. Others think it's a sickening emblem of America's perpetual war machine gone amuck that calls for those responsible to face consequences.

 

[Rove!]

Maybe it's just me, but when we wind up bombing known hospitals based on shaky Intel, maybe we are being a tad overzealous.

 

[timschochet]

It's not the loathing, it's what you think should happen as a result. Some people think it's the kind of unfortunate but acceptabe collateral damage that results from keeping America safe. Others think it's a sickening emblem of America's perpetual war machine gone amuck that calls for those responsible to face consequences.

But what consequences should there be?

If it was unintended (as most of us suspect), then whoever's responsible should be chastised, perhaps demoted (depending on a evaluation of their overall competence). Our government should apologize and do what we can for the victims and the victims' families. And that should be the extent of it.

If it was somehow deliberate then whoever is responsible should be tried for a war crime, no matter how high up, and punished accordingly with prison or death.

This should be obvious to everyone. What else is there? Should we re-evaluate what we're doing in Afghanistan? Of course we should always do that. But not because of this singular event.

 

[[icon]]

Maybe it's just me, but when we wind up bombing known hospitals based on shaky Intel, maybe we are being a tad overzealous.

And, is anyone disputing this was a mistake?

 

[[icon]]

It's not the loathing, it's what you think should happen as a result. Some people think it's the kind of unfortunate but acceptabe collateral damage that results from keeping America safe. Others think it's a sickening emblem of America's perpetual war machine gone amuck that calls for those responsible to face consequences.

Has anyone said there shouldn't be an investigation into the cause, and if there was negligence.... Repercussions?

 

[Slapdash]

It's not the loathing, it's what you think should happen as a result. Some people think it's the kind of unfortunate but acceptabe collateral damage that results from keeping America safe. Others think it's a sickening emblem of America's perpetual war machine gone amuck that calls for those responsible to face consequences.

But what consequences should there be?

If it was unintended (as most of us suspect), then whoever's responsible should be chastised, perhaps demoted (depending on a evaluation of their overall competence). Our government should apologize and do what we can for the victims and the victims' families. And that should be the extent of it.

If it was somehow deliberate then whoever is responsible should be tried for a war crime, no matter how high up, and punished accordingly with prison or death.

This should be obvious to everyone. What else is there? Should we re-evaluate what we're doing in Afghanistan? Of course we should always do that. But not because of this singular event.

So we should find a scapegoat instead of identifying the failures of systems and processes that enable us to blow up a ####### hospital? Typical.

 

[timschochet]

It's not the loathing, it's what you think should happen as a result. Some people think it's the kind of unfortunate but acceptabe collateral damage that results from keeping America safe. Others think it's a sickening emblem of America's perpetual war machine gone amuck that calls for those responsible to face consequences.

But what consequences should there be?

If it was unintended (as most of us suspect), then whoever's responsible should be chastised, perhaps demoted (depending on a evaluation of their overall competence). Our government should apologize and do what we can for the victims and the victims' families. And that should be the extent of it.

If it was somehow deliberate then whoever is responsible should be tried for a war crime, no matter how high up, and punished accordingly with prison or death.

This should be obvious to everyone. What else is there? Should we re-evaluate what we're doing in Afghanistan? Of course we should always do that. But not because of this singular event.

So we should find a scapegoat instead of identifying the failures of systems and processes that enable us to blow up a ####### hospital? Typical.

Not at all. If there are systemic processes out there that led to this result, we should find them and correct them. I have no idea what those are, and I'm not going to just assume that they exist. But if there is evidence that they DO exist, then in that case we should fix it. And I don't want to scapegoat ANYONE.

 

[Slapdash]

It's not the loathing, it's what you think should happen as a result. Some people think it's the kind of unfortunate but acceptabe collateral damage that results from keeping America safe. Others think it's a sickening emblem of America's perpetual war machine gone amuck that calls for those responsible to face consequences.

But what consequences should there be?

If it was unintended (as most of us suspect), then whoever's responsible should be chastised, perhaps demoted (depending on a evaluation of their overall competence). Our government should apologize and do what we can for the victims and the victims' families. And that should be the extent of it.

If it was somehow deliberate then whoever is responsible should be tried for a war crime, no matter how high up, and punished accordingly with prison or death.

This should be obvious to everyone. What else is there? Should we re-evaluate what we're doing in Afghanistan? Of course we should always do that. But not because of this singular event.

So we should find a scapegoat instead of identifying the failures of systems and processes that enable us to blow up a ####### hospital? Typical.

Not at all. If there are systemic processes out there that led to this result, we should find them and correct them. I have no idea what those are, and I'm not going to just assume that they exist. But if there is evidence that they DO exist, then in that case we should fix it. And I don't want to scapegoat ANYONE.

Sorry, I was confused by your own words saying we should find a scapegoat and then that would be the extent of it.

 

[Insein]

Maybe it's just me, but when we wind up bombing known hospitals based on shaky Intel, maybe we are being a tad overzealous.

And, is anyone disputing this was a mistake?

Mistakes have consequences. We don't just say "My bad" and move on.

 

[Insein]

See this is why I don't pay attention to world events. I get worked up over stuff that I have zero affect on.

 

[timschochet]

It's not the loathing, it's what you think should happen as a result. Some people think it's the kind of unfortunate but acceptabe collateral damage that results from keeping America safe. Others think it's a sickening emblem of America's perpetual war machine gone amuck that calls for those responsible to face consequences.

But what consequences should there be?

If it was unintended (as most of us suspect), then whoever's responsible should be chastised, perhaps demoted (depending on a evaluation of their overall competence). Our government should apologize and do what we can for the victims and the victims' families. And that should be the extent of it.

If it was somehow deliberate then whoever is responsible should be tried for a war crime, no matter how high up, and punished accordingly with prison or death.

This should be obvious to everyone. What else is there? Should we re-evaluate what we're doing in Afghanistan? Of course we should always do that. But not because of this singular event.

So we should find a scapegoat instead of identifying the failures of systems and processes that enable us to blow up a ####### hospital? Typical.

Not at all. If there are systemic processes out there that led to this result, we should find them and correct them. I have no idea what those are, and I'm not going to just assume that they exist. But if there is evidence that they DO exist, then in that case we should fix it. And I don't want to scapegoat ANYONE.

Sorry, I was confused by your own words saying we should find a scapegoat and then that would be the extent of it.

Hmm, I don't think I used the word "scapegoat". I think I wrote that whoever is responsible should be held to that responsibility. If it's systemic, then obviously there is no one person responsible. But thank you for your interpretation.

 

[Slapdash]

It's not the loathing, it's what you think should happen as a result. Some people think it's the kind of unfortunate but acceptabe collateral damage that results from keeping America safe. Others think it's a sickening emblem of America's perpetual war machine gone amuck that calls for those responsible to face consequences.

But what consequences should there be?

If it was unintended (as most of us suspect), then whoever's responsible should be chastised, perhaps demoted (depending on a evaluation of their overall competence). Our government should apologize and do what we can for the victims and the victims' families. And that should be the extent of it.

If it was somehow deliberate then whoever is responsible should be tried for a war crime, no matter how high up, and punished accordingly with prison or death.

This should be obvious to everyone. What else is there? Should we re-evaluate what we're doing in Afghanistan? Of course we should always do that. But not because of this singular event.

So we should find a scapegoat instead of identifying the failures of systems and processes that enable us to blow up a ####### hospital? Typical.

Not at all. If there are systemic processes out there that led to this result, we should find them and correct them. I have no idea what those are, and I'm not going to just assume that they exist. But if there is evidence that they DO exist, then in that case we should fix it. And I don't want to scapegoat ANYONE.

Sorry, I was confused by your own words saying we should find a scapegoat and then that would be the extent of it.

Hmm, I don't think I used the word "scapegoat". I think I wrote that whoever is responsible should be held to that responsibility. If it's systemic, then obviously there is no one person responsible. But thank you for your interpretation.

There is obviously a systemic issue here. Your simplistic bull#### in this quote doesn't help.

 

[timschochet]

If it were "obviously systemic", we'd be bombing hospitals left and right. The fact that this is a news story, and a shocking one at that, makes me believe that this is NOT systemic. But we'll find out, hopefully.

 

[Psychopav]

Tim's right on this one. Slapdash, I think you are being unfairly harsh in this particular instance.

 

[GroveDiesel]

The suspicion that militants are operating nearby does not justify strikes that put at risk the lives of so many innocent civilians.

Should we be held to that standard?

 

[AnonymousBob]

As long as it was an accident and we're all really sorry/upset I see no reason we can't carry on with business as usual.

 

[Cjw_55106]

Don't worry, it will get hashed out. Obama said the investigation would be transparent.

Reminds me of a leader who once claimed his administration would be the most transparent in history. Even though it wasn't, he still claimed it was. Anyways, I digress.

 

[SWC]

See this is why I don't pay attention to world events. I get worked up over stuff that I have zero affect on.

you and me both brohan watching the bad news just makes me sad and mad nothing good comes of it just try to follow the path of the brohan and be good to others that is the best you can do take that to the bank bromigos

 

[whoknew]

At some point even Tim has to agree that there should be an independent investigation, right? And that maybe the US committed a war crime?

Link

A U.S. warplane shot people trying to flee a burning hospital destroyed in airstrikes last month, according to the charity that ran the facility.

"Thirty of our patients and medical staff died [in the bombing]," Doctors Without Borders General Director Christopher Stokes said during a speech in Kabul unveiling a report on the incident. "Some of them lost their limbs and were decapitated in the explosions. Others were shot by the circling gunship while fleeing the burning building."

The hospital in Kunduz was bombed on Oct. 3 as Afghan government forces fought to regain control of the city from Taliban insurgents.

After the U.S. gave shifting explanations for the incident — which Doctors Without Borders has called a war crime — President Barack Obama apologized to the charity. The U.S. and Afghan governments have launched three separate investigations but the charity, which is also known as Médecins Sans Frontières (MSF), is calling for an international inquiry.

 

[AAABatteries]

At some point even Tim has to agree that there should be an independent investigation, right?

Really? When exactly did Tim imply there shouldn't be one?

 

[jon_mx]

We are fighting a legitimate enemy. My guess is this was a terrible mistake driven by either incompetence, carelessness, or being rushed. It needs to be investigated to determine what went wrong, but I would bet heavily that it was not the intent to bomb a legitimate hospital. Calling it a war crime at this point is premature. Understandable, but still don't know enough to say that.

 

[The Big Guy]

At some point even Tim has to agree that there should be an independent investigation, right? And that maybe the US committed a war crime?

Link

A U.S. warplane shot people trying to flee a burning hospital destroyed in airstrikes last month, according to the charity that ran the facility.

"Thirty of our patients and medical staff died [in the bombing]," Doctors Without Borders General Director Christopher Stokes said during a speech in Kabul unveiling a report on the incident. "Some of them lost their limbs and were decapitated in the explosions. Others were shot by the circling gunship while fleeing the burning building."

The hospital in Kunduz was bombed on Oct. 3 as Afghan government forces fought to regain control of the city from Taliban insurgents.

After the U.S. gave shifting explanations for the incident — which Doctors Without Borders has called a war crime — President Barack Obama apologized to the charity. The U.S. and Afghan governments have launched three separate investigations but the charity, which is also known as Médecins Sans Frontières (MSF), is calling for an international inquiry.

If a strike is called in on a location, I am glad that they are accomplishing it correctly. Granted, the location here is probably not a good choice, but maybe the Taliban fighters are taking a lesson from the Palestinians and using the hospital as a shield for their people and operations.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

At some point even Tim has to agree that there should be an independent investigation, right? And that maybe the US committed a war crime?

Link

A U.S. warplane shot people trying to flee a burning hospital destroyed in airstrikes last month, according to the charity that ran the facility.

"Thirty of our patients and medical staff died [in the bombing]," Doctors Without Borders General Director Christopher Stokes said during a speech in Kabul unveiling a report on the incident. "Some of them lost their limbs and were decapitated in the explosions. Others were shot by the circling gunship while fleeing the burning building."

The hospital in Kunduz was bombed on Oct. 3 as Afghan government forces fought to regain control of the city from Taliban insurgents.

After the U.S. gave shifting explanations for the incident — which Doctors Without Borders has called a war crime — President Barack Obama apologized to the charity. The U.S. and Afghan governments have launched three separate investigations but the charity, which is also known as Médecins Sans Frontières (MSF), is calling for an international inquiry.

If a strike is called in on a location, I am glad that they are accomplishing it correctly. Granted, the location here is probably not a good choice, but maybe the Taliban fighters are taking a lesson from the Palestinians and using the hospital as a shield for their people and operations.

They got bad intel here, likely from Afghan's on the ground. I thought we learned our lesson from this because in 2002 and 2003 in particular, we bombed a lot of places based on faulty intel. Afghans love fighting their proxy village-to-village wars using U.S. forces when those forces are actually on their side.

I would guess this facility used to be a location used by the Taliban so we had intel saying as much. We didn't cross-reference the Dw/oB info, and some Afghan source said this was the Taliban HQ because he didn't like what was going on inside. Something as simple as this hospital treating a family member of his hated rival is enough, I mean these people don't think like we do.

I no longer work for the DoD so I'm not as in-tune with these operations, but it sounds like something that has happened so many times in this war that it seems pretty easy to figure out what happened.