When Carolina takes Cam Newton (1 Viewer)

[Blackjacks]

When Carolina TAKES Cam Newton, sorry for the misspell in the topic

There is NO way Newton starts this year. The playbook is going to be way too much for him to take in considering he probably wont get it til late June or early July (at earliest). So if we agree on that we agree Jimmy Claussen starts the season. If that happens one of these two things are going to happen for the Panthers.........

1) The Panthers are going to be awful with Claussen under the helm and be picking again in the top 5

2) Jimmy Claussen improves on an underwhelming rookie season and improves there record to close to .500

One of these 2 are gonna happen ( I would be open to other scenario's.

When one of these happen what are the Panthers going to do.

If 1 happens you have (more than liely) 2 elite qb prospects coming out in Barkley and Luck. You cannot take one of these guys, you have to stick with Cam.

If the 2nd option happens you are torn to put in a qb that played up to his potential or the guy making his money and starting all over again.

Either way, Carolina comes out looking bad here. Do the smart thing here and take Dareus or Peterson.

Its not gonna happen, they are taking Cam but I dont know what their hopes are for next year.

 

[SproutDaddy]

I will believe it when I see it. I don't think there is any way they take him. As a Saints fan, I could only hope they do.

 

[cobalt_27]

I will believe it when I see it. I don't think there is any way they take him. As a Saints fan, I could only hope they do.

I agree. I actually don't think they're that stupid. But, we shall see.I hope for Panthers fans' sake, they are vocal enough in begging/pleading the team to look the other way on draft day.

 

[Captain Hook]

When Carolina TAKES Cam Newton, sorry for the misspell in the topic

You CAN edit the title of the thread

 

[SproutDaddy]

The only way this team isn't in the Luck sweepstakes is if somehow they let Matt Moore start and draft AJ Green. I don't see either of those happening. They could win a few games in that scenario. Why not draft Green, Peterson, or Dareus and still have a great chance to land Luck? As you said, Newton probably wouldn't start, and the team won't be good. Why blow that pick on a project QB? Wasted pick IMO.

 

[Go deep]

i agree, and said the same thing about the Bills. I like Fitzpatrick, but even if i end up worng, and he ends up being no good, the Bills get another top 5 pick and a chance at a real QB in 2012.

 

[massraider]

This is an absurd topic. If Newton gets drafted, he is going to play.

We have no idea how well he can assimilate a playbook, no matter what anyone thinks they discovered in a 30 second sound bite with Jon Gruden.

And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again?

If the NFL was that easy to figure out, people would make a lot more money gambling.

 

[azgroover]

This is an absurd topic. If Newton gets drafted, he is going to play. We have no idea how well he can assimilate a playbook, no matter what anyone thinks they discovered in a 30 second sound bite with Jon Gruden. And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again? If the NFL was that easy to figure out, people would make a lot more money gambling.

agreed. cam will be the starter from day 1.

 

[pantherclub]

Clausen will never ever be a .500 qb in the NFL. The dude is too small, too scared and his arm is too weak. Hurney should have been fired on the spot for picking him.

 

[Eastwood]

if Panthers take Newton, they will have the 1.1 pick next year. I guess Newton would make a fine clipboard holder for Luck

 

[IvanKaramazov]

And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again?

This argument keeps coming up, and it keeps making me want to pull my hair out. It's highly unlikely that Carolina ends up with the #1 pick next year. All it takes is one or two fluke wins to knock a team out of the running for #1, and the NFL is random enough that it's silly for assume that any particular team will finish dead last this far out.

 

[fightingillini]

And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again?

This argument keeps coming up, and it keeps making me want to pull my hair out. It's highly unlikely that Carolina ends up with the #1 pick next year. All it takes is one or two fluke wins to knock a team out of the running for #1, and the NFL is random enough that it's silly for assume that any particular team will finish dead last this far out.

I agree that this is true, but that still doesn't make the argument for taking Newton at #1. IMO he isn't going to be a franchise QB. Take the DL, pencil him in for the next 10 years, and then see if you have shot a Luck or Barkley next year. CAR will have as good of a shot as anybody.QB isn't the only need that CAR needs......they need DL, OL, WR, DB, TE......in other words....they have a lot of holes that they need to fill.

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

For a team to properly rebuild - and make no mistake, that's what Carolina is doing - they have to take a player that they deem as the QB of the future as soon as possible. It takes >1 year for him to grasp the offense and learn to lead the team properly. Only on rare occasions can a player lead a team to the postseason as a rookie (Matt Ryan, Big Ben, Joe Flacco, Dan Marino) and in those instances the supporting cast was outstanding. The team made up for any shortfalls at QB and any reductions in the playbook.

Carolina is not as talented up and down the roster as those four examples. They must get a QB and teach him the system so that in Year 2 they can be competitive. Now, the real question is this: Is Newton (or Claussen, or any other rookie QB this year) considered by that organization a QB of the future? If they really believe in Newton then they should select him. If not then the only hope for 2012 is to put as many pieces of the puzzle together to bridge them to getting that QB either in the next draft or via free agency or trade.

I think they're going to gamble on Newton, but I also question his "QB of the future" role in doing so. A QB pick at 1.01 can propel a team forward or set it back. The only good news is if there is a rookie draft salary cap in 2012 then taking another QB next year won't be an expensive proposition if they have to re-boot again.

 

[massraider]

And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again?

This argument keeps coming up, and it keeps making me want to pull my hair out. It's highly unlikely that Carolina ends up with the #1 pick next year. All it takes is one or two fluke wins to knock a team out of the running for #1, and the NFL is random enough that it's silly for assume that any particular team will finish dead last this far out.

I agree that this is true, but that still doesn't make the argument for taking Newton at #1. IMO he isn't going to be a franchise QB. Take the DL, pencil him in for the next 10 years, and then see if you have shot a Luck or Barkley next year. CAR will have as good of a shot as anybody.QB isn't the only need that CAR needs......they need DL, OL, WR, DB, TE......in other words....they have a lot of holes that they need to fill.

That's not the argument for taking Newton. No one said take Newton because you might not get Luck. The argument here seems to be: Pass on Newton and take Luck next year. That makes no sense, and I really hope no one thinks NFL teams actually think like that.

 

[pantherclub]

And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again?

This argument keeps coming up, and it keeps making me want to pull my hair out. It's highly unlikely that Carolina ends up with the #1 pick next year. All it takes is one or two fluke wins to knock a team out of the running for #1, and the NFL is random enough that it's silly for assume that any particular team will finish dead last this far out.

While I agree with you I would have to add that the Panthers have to be the favorite to be the worst team in the NFL this year. I understand you cannot predict this type of stuff but hear me out. If they pick Newton then they are going to sit him and then Claussen starts again. Trust me when I say this, the kid is horrible utterly horrible. I would have to think they trot him out over some vet just to see if he can play but I dont see Claussen winning many games this year. If for some bizarre reason they trot Newton out to start then I would almost guarantee the Panthers are sitting at #1 this time next year. Newton would not have enough practice time to make a dent as far as wins go. Your athletic ability will only take you so far as a QB in the NFL. Add that in with the schedule that they just got handed, the aging of its existing stars and multiple players returning from injury I just dont see how Carolina wont be able to pull off a top 3 pick next year. Like someone else said they would have Barkley or Luck more than likely.

 

[flc735]

1) no matter what happens, their not going to give up on their #1 overall pick after 1 year no matter how good/bad cam plays. they pass on luck/barkley here

2) QB controversy for 3 years then clausen is traded. usually more proven guy is traded/released in these cases. brees/rivers, kolb/mcnabb, leftwich/garrard, bledsoe/brady, bledsoe/romo, favre/rodgers

 

[Lab]

For a team to properly rebuild - and make no mistake, that's what Carolina is doing - they have to take a player that they deem as the QB of the future as soon as possible. It takes >1 year for him to grasp the offense and learn to lead the team properly. Only on rare occasions can a player lead a team to the postseason as a rookie (Matt Ryan, Big Ben, Joe Flacco, Dan Marino) and in those instances the supporting cast was outstanding. The team made up for any shortfalls at QB and any reductions in the playbook. Carolina is not as talented up and down the roster as those four examples. They must get a QB and teach him the system so that in Year 2 they can be competitive. ...

I agree with most of your post, but since Carolina has so many holes, it doesn't seem like their rebuilding project can be complete in Year 2, or even substantially underway enough to make them competitive in Year 2. It really seems like their target should be Year 3 or beyond, in which case they have a little bit of luxury in when to choose their future QB (and even whether that QB should be a rookie). The tougher question is whether ownership and management can agree to target Year 3, and thus plan to focus on rebuilding for the next two years.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

This is an absurd topic. If Newton gets drafted, he is going to play. We have no idea how well he can assimilate a playbook, no matter what anyone thinks they discovered in a 30 second sound bite with Jon Gruden. And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again? If the NFL was that easy to figure out, people would make a lot more money gambling.

Cam is already very limited in knowledge and process as real NFL QB's go. On top of that he's likely going to miss all of the off season, pre-season with coaches and playbook. How do you think he's going to be able to start his first season?No team is going to tailor their entire playbook and season after the auburn playbook, especially since it can't be used long term or expanded upon for NFL use.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Panthers should grab a vet QB and continue to develop Clausen. "but Clausen sucked in 2010" yea, and so did the rest of the team. And everyone is expecting Newton to suck his first season. If Clausen doesn't work out in 2011, grab a QB high in the 2012 draft. There are 3 QB's likely to be in next years draft better than Cam. They don't need the first overall pick.

You don't gamble with the 1st overall in a rebuild. I know every pick is a gamble, but Cam having never proven he can play as a real QB is more of a gamble than many others.

They need to either trade down this season, or grab BPA. Then grab a vet in FA, and try to develop Clausen further.

 

[Runningman]

All I see is Denver getting that great big ole d lineman! Pick one anyone. Please!

 

[Runningman]

Panthers should grab a vet QB and continue to develop Clausen. "but Clausen sucked in 2010" yea, and so did the rest of the team. And everyone is expecting Newton to suck his first season. If Clausen doesn't work out in 2011, grab a QB high in the 2012 draft. There are 3 QB's likely to be in next years draft better than Cam. They don't need the first overall pick.You don't gamble with the 1st overall in a rebuild. I know every pick is a gamble, but Cam having never proven he can play as a real QB is more of a gamble than many others.They need to either trade down this season, or grab BPA. Then grab a vet in FA, and try to develop Clausen further.

On topic I agree with this line of thinking. I can't see Cam being a certified number 1 overall pick except that he is a QB. Grab the player with the most talent and least chance of failure and move on to the second round.

 

[Warpig]

You people are letting your fantasy teams cloud what really happens in the NFL.

Sure, Newton may not be the next best QB to grace an NFL roster. But he is a phenomenon! The guy is as big as a LB, has a cannon arm, can run and is nimble, he can run through tackles, he is a winner and a leader! He was super successful in the most talented conference in the NCAA against elite talent and he was absolutely unstoppable. His measurables are off the charts. He is without a doubt the #1 qb in this draft.

For those of you thinking Gabbert is the #1 qb...PUH-LEASE! He is the suck. Guy could't fight his way through a wet paper bag and he is easily rattled, inaccurate, didn't put up any good stats, couldn't win a meaningful game, and he was far from a leader. I got to see a lot of his games and I hear the Mizzou fans say how surprised they are that he is even considered a 1st round talent. Other than looking good in shorts, he is crap.

Newton is the most dynamic player that is not a WR in this draft. IF Carolina selects Newton, it will be because they see the obvious and that with some seasoning, he can be a great QB.

And for those of you saying Carolina will have the #1 pick next year...check yourself. They have a good O-line, a great running game, and a great young defense that is getting healthy during this offseason. Teams have proven recently that you can win a lot of games with a subpar qb as long as you have a good defense and good running game. I seriously doubt they will have the #1 next year. They'll probably end up with atleast 5 wins.

Some of you need to be slapped to bring you back to reality.

 

[two_dollars]

The entire draft is weak. I give Newton a 50/50 on better career numbers than JaMarcus.

 

[cobalt_27]

The entire draft is weak. I give Newton a 50/50 on better career numbers than JaMarcus.

I'll take the under.

 

[Sweetness_34]

An obvious scenario that is not being taken into account here is: Panthers take Newton; land up with the top pick next year and then they trade that pick to someone like the Browns; Bills; Niners; Vikings etc and get a boat load of picks back. Not saying Newton will ever amount to anything but if they take Newton this year, no way they will take Luck next year and in that case, they will be stupid not to trade down and get more picks ....

 

[pantherclub]

An obvious scenario that is not being taken into account here is: Panthers take Newton; land up with the top pick next year and then they trade that pick to someone like the Browns; Bills; Niners; Vikings etc and get a boat load of picks back. Not saying Newton will ever amount to anything but if they take Newton this year, no way they will take Luck next year and in that case, they will be stupid not to trade down and get more picks ....

They would be stupid to not take the best QB prospect since Elway. Luck is cannot miss.

 

[Blackjacks]

An obvious scenario that is not being taken into account here is: Panthers take Newton; land up with the top pick next year and then they trade that pick to someone like the Browns; Bills; Niners; Vikings etc and get a boat load of picks back. Not saying Newton will ever amount to anything but if they take Newton this year, no way they will take Luck next year and in that case, they will be stupid not to trade down and get more picks ....

They would be stupid to not take the best QB prospect since Elway. Luck is cannot miss.

And Barkley aint too shabby either

 

[zadok]

This is an absurd topic. If Newton gets drafted, he is going to play.

End of thread.

 

[zadok]

And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again? If the NFL was that easy to figure out, people would make a lot more money gambling.

Exactly. Who even knew who Cam Newton was this time last year?

 

[massraider]

This is an absurd topic. If Newton gets drafted, he is going to play.

We have no idea how well he can assimilate a playbook, no matter what anyone thinks they discovered in a 30 second sound bite with Jon Gruden.

And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again?

If the NFL was that easy to figure out, people would make a lot more money gambling.

Cam is already very limited in knowledge and process as real NFL QB's go. On top of that he's likely going to miss all of the off season, pre-season with coaches and playbook. How do you think he's going to be able to start his first season?No team is going to tailor their entire playbook and season after the auburn playbook, especially since it can't be used long term or expanded upon for NFL use.

There was nothing professional about Sam Bradford's college offense either. And now Cam's likely to miss the offseason, and the preseason?

The difference in our thinking is, you are taking opinions, and assuming them to be facts. Based on what, 10 seconds with Jon Gruden on TV?

He didn't have a complicated offense at Auburn, 'tis true. That's not the same thing as not being bright enough to pick up an NFL offense. Which we have zero evidence of. If Cam Newton were to be the #1 overall pick, I would place the Over/Under at percentage of QB snaps taken at about.....40. It'd be more except for the uncertain labor situation. People are taking a TV soundbite, and the startling revelation that Cam played in a spread offense, and going way, way overboard.

I really cannot believe the massive assumptions people are making here, and then using them as facts to make an argument. Just so I am clear here: Panthers are 'most likely' to be in line for the top pick next year, Andrew Luck will be the #1 QB/prospect in the draft, and the lockout will extend thru the preseason, do I have that right? Can I bet against all three of those somewhere?

I truly don't mean to sound like a #### here, but anyone telling me how long the lockout is "likely" to last is insulting my intelligence, or, even more alarming, actually believes they have a clue.

When was the last time a team had back-to-back #1 overall picks? Has it ever happened?

And finally, when was the last time the presumptive #1 pick the following year actually was the #1 pick the following year? Heck, the last quarterback? Jake Locker, Brady Quinn, Brian Brohm, I remember quite a few guys getting talked up entering their last year. None were #1 picks, and some weren't even 1st rounders.

 

[pantherclub]

/\ A few things.

Our opinion goes way beyond Grudens soundbite. That is just another example or icing on the cake if you will that Newton doesnt possess the intelligence to be a top pick QB.

I will bet you anything want that no matter what happens from here on out Andrew Luck will be the #1 pick next year. This is the biggest lock of the century. He is just that good, the best prospect since Elway. Watch the Orange Bowl and you will see why. How many times did he audible at the line for long passes or TD's. At least 10, something Newton has yet to do.

I dont think anyone has said the Panthers are "most likely" to get the top pick next year. I think everyone recognizes that they have a ton of holes, old vets and a tough schedule to go with a couple of green qb's and that makes the chances of them getting another high pick next year more than likely.

Newton does not deserve the top pick IMO. Every year a team falls in love with a players physical attributes and disregards the play on the field. Dude, Newton didnt audible (his words) or read defenses at Auburn. Those are fundamental to a NFL qb. Could he learn it, sure, but is it worth risking your #1 pick when he has shown no signs at any level at doing so.

Comparing Newton to Bradford pretty much shows your lack of knowledge on this subject. Those dudes couldnt be any more different.

 

[cobalt_27]

The difference in our thinking is, you are taking opinions, and assuming them to be facts. Based on what, 10 seconds with Jon Gruden on TV?

You've been living in a cave, if you think the concerns about Cam didn't exist until this past week.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

You mean Cam Norton, right?

 

[menobrown]

I do think the Panthers draft Newton but if they do or don't my money on their opening day starting QB is going to be Billy Volek who is a FA, familiar with the offense and should jump at one last chance to get a starting QB spot. I think Cam will probably start games for them before the season is over and possibly within a few weeks but not to start the year.

 

[eakfootball]

Has there ever been anyone who won the heisman, national championship, and was the 1st pick in the draft all in the sme year?

 

[Dave Larkin]

I don't want us to take Newton at all. I would despise the pick off the bat. And like someone else said, I'll believe it when I see it. Until Roger Goodell actually utters the name "Cam Newton", I will be in denial.

 

[massraider]

/\ A few things.Our opinion goes way beyond Grudens soundbite. That is just another example or icing on the cake if you will that Newton doesnt possess the intelligence to be a top pick QB. I will bet you anything want that no matter what happens from here on out Andrew Luck will be the #1 pick next year. This is the biggest lock of the century. He is just that good, the best prospect since Elway. Watch the Orange Bowl and you will see why. How many times did he audible at the line for long passes or TD's. At least 10, something Newton has yet to do.I dont think anyone has said the Panthers are "most likely" to get the top pick next year. I think everyone recognizes that they have a ton of holes, old vets and a tough schedule to go with a couple of green qb's and that makes the chances of them getting another high pick next year more than likely.Newton does not deserve the top pick IMO. Every year a team falls in love with a players physical attributes and disregards the play on the field. Dude, Newton didnt audible (his words) or read defenses at Auburn. Those are fundamental to a NFL qb. Could he learn it, sure, but is it worth risking your #1 pick when he has shown no signs at any level at doing so.Comparing Newton to Bradford pretty much shows your lack of knowledge on this subject. Those dudes couldnt be any more different.

I was comparing Newton's college offense to Bradford's. I think its a fair comparison. If there's another place I compared them, let me know. Otherwise, maybe don't put words in peoples mouths.

 

[pantherclub]

/\ A few things.Our opinion goes way beyond Grudens soundbite. That is just another example or icing on the cake if you will that Newton doesnt possess the intelligence to be a top pick QB. I will bet you anything want that no matter what happens from here on out Andrew Luck will be the #1 pick next year. This is the biggest lock of the century. He is just that good, the best prospect since Elway. Watch the Orange Bowl and you will see why. How many times did he audible at the line for long passes or TD's. At least 10, something Newton has yet to do.I dont think anyone has said the Panthers are "most likely" to get the top pick next year. I think everyone recognizes that they have a ton of holes, old vets and a tough schedule to go with a couple of green qb's and that makes the chances of them getting another high pick next year more than likely.Newton does not deserve the top pick IMO. Every year a team falls in love with a players physical attributes and disregards the play on the field. Dude, Newton didnt audible (his words) or read defenses at Auburn. Those are fundamental to a NFL qb. Could he learn it, sure, but is it worth risking your #1 pick when he has shown no signs at any level at doing so.Comparing Newton to Bradford pretty much shows your lack of knowledge on this subject. Those dudes couldnt be any more different.

I was comparing Newton's college offense to Bradford's. I think its a fair comparison. If there's another place I compared them, let me know. Otherwise, maybe don't put words in peoples mouths.

Again your lack of knowledge on this subject is evident. Their offenses in college were not even remotely similar.

 

[massraider]

The difference in our thinking is, you are taking opinions, and assuming them to be facts. Based on what, 10 seconds with Jon Gruden on TV?

You've been living in a cave, if you think the concerns about Cam didn't exist until this past week.

I am not referring to the concerns about Cam. I am referring to the theory that he can't learn an offense because of his Auburn experience. If you can point me to the discussion regarding this pre-Gruden, I'd appreciate it.I am not even a Cam guy. Not defending him, and I question if he'll be any good.

 

[pantherclub]

The difference in our thinking is, you are taking opinions, and assuming them to be facts. Based on what, 10 seconds with Jon Gruden on TV?

You've been living in a cave, if you think the concerns about Cam didn't exist until this past week.

I am not referring to the concerns about Cam. I am referring to the theory that he can't learn an offense because of his Auburn experience. If you can point me to the discussion regarding this pre-Gruden, I'd appreciate it.I am not even a Cam guy. Not defending him, and I question if he'll be any good.

Lets flip that around, is there any evidence that he can learn an offense not predicated on his physical attributes? I see no evidence so far and surely not enough to warrant the #1 pick. The theory that he cannot learn a NFL offense is the concern for Cam. Dont try and kid yourself.Also there are about 3 threads on Newton on the last 2 pages if you want to catch up. Only you and Auburn fans seem to have faith in this guy.

You seem to be hung up on the Gruden segment and between his question to Cam about calling a play and Cams diagram of his one read throw it was cringeworthy at best. He basically said he doesnt call audibles, just relays the play and in that particular pass play he says "all I am waiting for here is for the safety to break one way or another". Thats a little unnerving to me since he is considered as the top pick.

 

[menobrown]

Only you and Auburn fans seem to have faith in this guy.

Seems silly to say that when people who I tend to trust think if he does not go #1 he'll go #3. Agree or not the people running Carolina and the Bills are not Auburn fans.

 

[cobalt_27]

The difference in our thinking is, you are taking opinions, and assuming them to be facts. Based on what, 10 seconds with Jon Gruden on TV?

You've been living in a cave, if you think the concerns about Cam didn't exist until this past week.

I am not referring to the concerns about Cam. I am referring to the theory that he can't learn an offense because of his Auburn experience. If you can point me to the discussion regarding this pre-Gruden, I'd appreciate it.I am not even a Cam guy. Not defending him, and I question if he'll be any good.

I think it's a combination of things. There's a cloud of entitlement to start off with (e.g., laptop, dad/Auburn exchange). He's had 1 year in a very simple offense. We've seen the story of physically-gifted QBs excelling on great teams (e.g., Young, Leinart, Russell) and failing miserably at the next level because of maturity and lack of a cerebral approach. The Panthers have a ton of needs elsewhere.Just a big fat wasted pick, if you ask me.

 

[pantherclub]

Only you and Auburn fans seem to have faith in this guy.

Seems silly to say that when people who I tend to trust think if he does not go #1 he'll go #3. Agree or not the people running Carolina and the Bills are not Auburn fans.

There is a reason that the Panthers and Bills stink every year. I will let you figure out why.If you draft Newton you are drafting on potential. That is not a good way to build a team.

 

[menobrown]

Only you and Auburn fans seem to have faith in this guy.

Seems silly to say that when people who I tend to trust think if he does not go #1 he'll go #3. Agree or not the people running Carolina and the Bills are not Auburn fans.

There is a reason that the Panthers and Bills stink every year. I will let you figure out why.If you draft Newton you are drafting on potential. That is not a good way to build a team.

Personally I would not touch Cam with a top 20 or maybe even first round pick but it's just not accurate so say the only people who have faith in him are Auburn fans.As for drafting for potential. To a degree every team drafts for potential but in Cam's defense it's not as if he's just a workout warrior or something. I mean he did just win the Heisman and National Championship in his only year so it's not as if he's not got some skins on the wall.

 

[massraider]

The difference in our thinking is, you are taking opinions, and assuming them to be facts. Based on what, 10 seconds with Jon Gruden on TV?

You've been living in a cave, if you think the concerns about Cam didn't exist until this past week.

I am not referring to the concerns about Cam. I am referring to the theory that he can't learn an offense because of his Auburn experience. If you can point me to the discussion regarding this pre-Gruden, I'd appreciate it.I am not even a Cam guy. Not defending him, and I question if he'll be any good.

Lets flip that around, is there any evidence that he can learn an offense not predicated on his physical attributes? I see no evidence so far and surely not enough to warrant the #1 pick. The theory that he cannot learn a NFL offense is the concern for Cam. Dont try and kid yourself.Also there are about 3 threads on Newton on the last 2 pages if you want to catch up. Only you and Auburn fans seem to have faith in this guy.

Hey, dont bother reading my posts, it's more interesting this way. Look, if people want to argue with someone about Cam, and will settle for me in lieu of an actual Cam fan, fine.

My position, and it refers to the OP, is that making assured statements about what is going to happen in a draft 12 months from now, and claiming Cam isn't going to get any PT next year, are ludicrous.

And this notion that Cam is going to have to sit a year because of his Auburn offense, that whole thing blew up after Gruden. Anyone saying otherwise isn't fooling anyone.

 

[pantherclub]

/\ dude you are all over the place now

 

[massraider]

Actually, I am not. I am saying the same things I said on my first post in the thread. You and others assigning a stance to me so you can rant about Cam's draft prospects doesn't make me all over the place.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

This is an absurd topic. If Newton gets drafted, he is going to play.

We have no idea how well he can assimilate a playbook, no matter what anyone thinks they discovered in a 30 second sound bite with Jon Gruden.

And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again?

If the NFL was that easy to figure out, people would make a lot more money gambling.

Cam is already very limited in knowledge and process as real NFL QB's go. On top of that he's likely going to miss all of the off season, pre-season with coaches and playbook. How do you think he's going to be able to start his first season?No team is going to tailor their entire playbook and season after the auburn playbook, especially since it can't be used long term or expanded upon for NFL use.

There was nothing professional about Sam Bradford's college offense either. And now Cam's likely to miss the offseason, and the preseason?

The difference in our thinking is, you are taking opinions, and assuming them to be facts. Based on what, 10 seconds with Jon Gruden on TV?

He didn't have a complicated offense at Auburn, 'tis true. That's not the same thing as not being bright enough to pick up an NFL offense. Which we have zero evidence of. If Cam Newton were to be the #1 overall pick, I would place the Over/Under at percentage of QB snaps taken at about.....40. It'd be more except for the uncertain labor situation. People are taking a TV soundbite, and the startling revelation that Cam played in a spread offense, and going way, way overboard.

I really cannot believe the massive assumptions people are making here, and then using them as facts to make an argument. Just so I am clear here: Panthers are 'most likely' to be in line for the top pick next year, Andrew Luck will be the #1 QB/prospect in the draft, and the lockout will extend thru the preseason, do I have that right? Can I bet against all three of those somewhere?

I truly don't mean to sound like a #### here, but anyone telling me how long the lockout is "likely" to last is insulting my intelligence, or, even more alarming, actually believes they have a clue.

When was the last time a team had back-to-back #1 overall picks? Has it ever happened?

And finally, when was the last time the presumptive #1 pick the following year actually was the #1 pick the following year? Heck, the last quarterback? Jake Locker, Brady Quinn, Brian Brohm, I remember quite a few guys getting talked up entering their last year. None were #1 picks, and some weren't even 1st rounders.

Cam ran more than he threw, has 1 year experience at QB, his one year experience was very limited in anything an NFL QB does or needs to know, he doesn't/hasn't called plays, he can't read def's, he can't audible, he's a 1 read QB, has trouble with timing on passes, his arm may be strong but fairly inaccurate....

But he's an amassing physical specimen... then again, so is every Olympic athlete..

The guy has too much to learn, and not enough time to learn it. It'll be at least a year before he's a confident starter, at least... It'll be at least 3 years before he's a competent starter.. And I doubt he'll ever be a winner

He's great for a gimmick/gadget type offense. Maybe someone could go full wildcat and he'd fit in... As a passer, which he'd need to be at some point, not looking good..

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Only you and Auburn fans seem to have faith in this guy.

Seems silly to say that when people who I tend to trust think if he does not go #1 he'll go #3. Agree or not the people running Carolina and the Bills are not Auburn fans.

Neither the Panthers or the Bills have picked, and neither team is going to let the public, or the media know who that pick will be until it's picked. So anything you hear saying Cam to Panthers or Bills is speculation.

 

[massraider]

This is an absurd topic. If Newton gets drafted, he is going to play.

We have no idea how well he can assimilate a playbook, no matter what anyone thinks they discovered in a 30 second sound bite with Jon Gruden.

And you are also predicting that not only will Andrew Luck remain the best QB prospect, but that Carolina will have a shot at him again?

If the NFL was that easy to figure out, people would make a lot more money gambling.

Cam is already very limited in knowledge and process as real NFL QB's go. On top of that he's likely going to miss all of the off season, pre-season with coaches and playbook. How do you think he's going to be able to start his first season?No team is going to tailor their entire playbook and season after the auburn playbook, especially since it can't be used long term or expanded upon for NFL use.

There was nothing professional about Sam Bradford's college offense either. And now Cam's likely to miss the offseason, and the preseason?

The difference in our thinking is, you are taking opinions, and assuming them to be facts. Based on what, 10 seconds with Jon Gruden on TV?

He didn't have a complicated offense at Auburn, 'tis true. That's not the same thing as not being bright enough to pick up an NFL offense. Which we have zero evidence of. If Cam Newton were to be the #1 overall pick, I would place the Over/Under at percentage of QB snaps taken at about.....40. It'd be more except for the uncertain labor situation. People are taking a TV soundbite, and the startling revelation that Cam played in a spread offense, and going way, way overboard.

I really cannot believe the massive assumptions people are making here, and then using them as facts to make an argument. Just so I am clear here: Panthers are 'most likely' to be in line for the top pick next year, Andrew Luck will be the #1 QB/prospect in the draft, and the lockout will extend thru the preseason, do I have that right? Can I bet against all three of those somewhere?

I truly don't mean to sound like a #### here, but anyone telling me how long the lockout is "likely" to last is insulting my intelligence, or, even more alarming, actually believes they have a clue.

When was the last time a team had back-to-back #1 overall picks? Has it ever happened?

And finally, when was the last time the presumptive #1 pick the following year actually was the #1 pick the following year? Heck, the last quarterback? Jake Locker, Brady Quinn, Brian Brohm, I remember quite a few guys getting talked up entering their last year. None were #1 picks, and some weren't even 1st rounders.

Cam ran more than he threw, has 1 year experience at QB, his one year experience was very limited in anything an NFL QB does or needs to know, he doesn't/hasn't called plays, he can't read def's, he can't audible, he's a 1 read QB, has trouble with timing on passes, his arm may be strong but fairly inaccurate....

But he's an amassing physical specimen... then again, so is every Olympic athlete..

The guy has too much to learn, and not enough time to learn it. It'll be at least a year before he's a confident starter, at least... It'll be at least 3 years before he's a competent starter.. And I doubt he'll ever be a winner

He's great for a gimmick/gadget type offense. Maybe someone could go full wildcat and he'd fit in... As a passer, which he'd need to be at some point, not looking good..

I think there's a real good chance you are right on all this. But I have to believe if someone takes him, they put him on the chalkboard, and feel he can retain, learn, and process. I do think if he goes #1, he's gonna play. Maybe it's just a set of plays to start. I dunno. But the pressure to play him will be so massive, especially if Clausen doesn't play reasonably well.

If I was a Panther fan, I sure wouldn't want him either. But I have been wrong about college QBs more often than not. I thought Bradford would need time, and I thought JaMarcus was a good pick, so going by my track record, Cam will turn into Randall Cunningham.