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Where is the “but her emails!!!!” crowd in regards to Trump destroying records? (2 Viewers)

Sabertooth

Footballguy
Remember When Hillary was villainized over emails?  How is that just an absolute non starter, but nary a peep from the right about Trump destroying records with impunity? 
 

Trump Never Stopped Ripping Up Documents

how can any American be in favor of this?  These are crimes against all of us.  

 
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I believe several members of the Trump admin we’re doing the same thing with regard to having private servers. The Trump apologists who were all over HRC for it didn’t seem to care. 

 
I am unsure of your political affiliation, however it would be hypocritical for the left to make a big deal out of this when it should not have been a big deal that Hillary was doing it.

Likewise, it is hypocritical for the right to completely ignore this.

In this case both sides are wrong, which is often case the in politics.

 
I am unsure of your political affiliation, however it would be hypocritical for the left to make a big deal out of this when it should not have been a big deal that Hillary was doing it.

Likewise, it is hypocritical for the right to completely ignore this.

In this case both sides are wrong, which is often case the in politics.
Except that the left DID make a big deal out of Hillary doing it. 
In this forum for example, those of us who attempted to defend Hillary (myself included) were a very small minority. Most of those here on the left and right thought it was a huge thing. 
 

I didn’t think it was a big deal then and honestly I don’t think this is a big deal either. Trump had some insane ideas, he put them down in writing, and then he tore them up. So what? The point is he never did them. If he had done some of this crazy #### then that would be a big deal. But otherwise I don’t care how many crazy ideas he had going on in his head. He’s a crazy guy and has no business being anywhere near the White House ever again (or the first time.) 

 
I am unsure of your political affiliation, however it would be hypocritical for the left to make a big deal out of this when it should not have been a big deal that Hillary was doing it.

Likewise, it is hypocritical for the right to completely ignore this.

In this case both sides are wrong, which is often case the in politics.
Hillary was wrong because there was a reason for a clear separation of work product and personal items.  She was wrong because she placed the burden on others (those she sent e-mails to) to "formally" maintain her archives.  She was wrong because she didn't make the efforts to turn this over when she left.  She was wrong in a few other ways I forget.  This is ignoring the security issues which generated most of the conversation but isn't the topic here.

Hillary's search through her private e-mails failed to find some that should have been treated as government business and turned over.  These were found when the government went through the manually maintained archives of other government employees.   Given that these manually maintained archives lived on fragile (compared to server) desktop hard drives (see IRS scandal) it can be assumed that there were others lost in the process.  So functionally Hillary most likely ripped up some government records.   Many also assume that Hillary literally deleted on purpose some official e-mails to hide wrong doing, or simply out of embarrassment.  There is no real evidence of this to my knowledge and it would be unlikely on any large scale simply because there is another copy of any successfully sent e-mail. 

Trump on the other hand was purposely tearing up documents.  Was this just one of many copies?  Was it to hide something embarrassing or worst?  Was it just in frustration which would kind of make it on par with Hillary being lazy (her private server really was done for convenience you know).  For now I assume that what they did was roughly on par.   That things were lost because of their actions but that it was reasonable to believe that there were other copies somewhere safe.   I think it is safe to believe this for Hillary after this much time.   It remains to be seen I guess for Trump.

 
Except that the left DID make a big deal out of Hillary doing it. 
In this forum for example, those of us who attempted to defend Hillary (myself included) were a very small minority. Most of those here on the left and right thought it was a huge thing. 
Yep. Got a lot of "likes" arguing with you on that from people that were completely silent when Trump did similar. Amazing.

 
Yep. Got a lot of "likes" arguing with you on that from people that were completely silent when Trump did similar. Amazing.
It’s not amazing.  It’s not even surprising.  Many on the right don’t deal in good faith on these issues.  Or any issues actually.  

 
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Except that the left DID make a big deal out of Hillary doing it. 
In this forum for example, those of us who attempted to defend Hillary (myself included) were a very small minority. Most of those here on the left and right thought it was a huge thing. 
Yep. Got a lot of "likes" arguing with you on that from people that were completely silent when Trump did similar. Amazing.
If by "amazing" you mean predictable and sad, then I'd agree.  I too had a ton of likes out of those who now vilify me as the evil hippie leftist.  :lol:  

At least Tim is consistent in his wrongness.  @timschochet how you don't see this sort of behavior as problematic is beyond me.  I quoted in that Hillary thread dozens and dozens of officials, democrat and republican alike, giving specific reasons why it's problematic for our leaders to act this way.  

This is just as bad as what Hillary did.

 
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Remember When Hillary was villainized over emails?  How is that just an absolute non starter, but nary a peep from the right about Trump destroying records with impunity? 
 

Trump Never Stopped Ripping Up Documents

how can any American be in favor of this?  These are crimes against all of us.  
I don't know how you guys presume these things.  This is wrong.  He shouldn't do/have done it.

BTW, I have never heard of a DJT staffer having an email server in the basement shuttling TS data around.  If so they should be arrested and prosecuted as HRC should have been.

 
I don't know how you guys presume these things.  This is wrong.  He shouldn't do/have done it.

BTW, I have never heard of a DJT staffer having an email server in the basement shuttling TS data around.  If so they should be arrested and prosecuted as HRC should have been.
If you haven’t heard about the private email servers, burner phones, and other methods of escaping oversight, you simply weren’t listening.  

 
the left didn't care much about Hillary's emails/servers ...... they shouldn't about Trump destroying similar documents

however, people like me who DID think it was a big deal? I think if Trump did similar its also a big deal, I'll not be hypocritical on it

 
Maybe when someone explains what the scandal is there will be outrage.  Who the hell keeps paper records these days?  Everything should be digitally stored on computers.  They should be destroying paper records as they are untraceable and could contain sensitive information.  Everything these days is created on computers and that is where the official records should be maintained.  If Trump destroyed those that would be an issue.  

 
the left didn't care much about Hillary's emails/servers ...... they shouldn't about Trump destroying similar documents

however, people like me who DID think it was a big deal? I think if Trump did similar its also a big deal, I'll not be hypocritical on it


Yeah, I don't think you'll find anyone who disagrees with that.  I think the problem is that it doesn't meet the sufficient level of outrage set by @Sabertooth.   Simply not being okay with it like we were with Hillary's server is not okay.  You need to be at 11 like he is - or greater.

Hence, that's why we got this bad faith thread started in the first place.  :shrug:

 
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I thought Hillary's unwillingness to follow basic public records requirements was a significant story in 2016.  

I think Trump's unwillingness to follow basic public records requirements doesn't rise to the Top 100 reasons why I won't support Trump in 2022, but if it's a difference-maker for some other voter, great I guess.  

 
I thought Hillary's unwillingness to follow basic public records requirements was a significant story in 2016.  
Really, it was HRC's handling and dissemination of TS information through her basement server that was the biggest issue.  This is such a huge, obvious no no that it seems unbelievable to me that there weren't arrests.  Anyone else would have been treated much, much differently.

 
Maybe when someone explains what the scandal is there will be outrage.  Who the hell keeps paper records these days?  Everything should be digitally stored on computers.  They should be destroying paper records as they are untraceable and could contain sensitive information.  Everything these days is created on computers and that is where the official records should be maintained.  If Trump destroyed those that would be an issue.  
Old school mob bosses  :coffee:

 
Maybe when someone explains what the scandal is there will be outrage.  Who the hell keeps paper records these days?  Everything should be digitally stored on computers.  They should be destroying paper records as they are untraceable and could contain sensitive information.  Everything these days is created on computers and that is where the official records should be maintained.  If Trump destroyed those that would be an issue.  
I tend to agree with this. What are they worried about here? They'll lose Trump's sharpie doodles? Should be getting rid of the paper copies altogether... We don't live in the 90s anymore. As an aside, I'm generally annoyed if I go to a meeting and someone hands me a paper copy of some document.

 
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Really, it was HRC's handling and dissemination of TS information through her basement server that was the biggest issue.  This is such a huge, obvious no no that it seems unbelievable to me that there weren't arrests.  Anyone else would have been treated much, much differently.
How many of the thousand or so participants in the fifty or so e-mail chains that actually contained a nugget of classified information that was forwarded to Hillary were fired?  Yet alone arrested?  Or disciplined in any way?

 
How many of the thousand or so participants in the fifty or so e-mail chains that actually contained a nugget of classified information that was forwarded to Hillary were fired?  Yet alone arrested?  Or disciplined in any way?
No idea, but if they knowingly did so outside of secure email system they should have also been prosecuted.  This stuff is no joke.

That's why I said arrests, plural.  

 
Yep. Got a lot of "likes" arguing with you on that from people that were completely silent when Trump did similar. Amazing.


It’s not amazing.  It’s not even surprising.  Many on the right don’t deal in good faith on these issues.  Or any issues actually.  
Where are all the guys that lived in PSF when Trump was in office?

Biden seems to screw up everything he touches but ….crickets because he’s a dem

It works both ways, always has always will 

 
No idea, but if they knowingly did so outside of secure email system they should have also been prosecuted.  This stuff is no joke.

That's why I said arrests, plural.  
The .gov email system that these government employees resided on (where Hillary should have resided on) was just as inappropriate of a location for these 50 or so email chains as was Hillary's server.    Hillary's server as a repository of top secret information (8 e-mails) was one of the many nonsensical ideas discussed by  "dozens and dozens of officials, democrat and republican alike".   Others included what 2000 emails meant (they were "up-classified" for the FISA request), how someone had to be copying documents directly out of the secure locations, etc., etc.  We had a lot of expert opinions on stuff that never happened. 

But yes, these things that didn't happen as portrayed were the biggest issue.  Few cared about record's management.

 
...  I quoted in that Hillary thread dozens and dozens of officials, democrat and republican alike, giving specific reasons why it's problematic for our leaders to act this way.  ....
To be fair these officials were consistently wrong only because the direct questions they were answering were unrelated to anything really happening.  I mean in a different context these quotes would not have been nonsense.

 
I love the fascination with proving someone a hypocrite on this board.

I criticized Hillary for her e-mails.  I think what Trump is doing is deplorable.  But I think just about everything he's doing is deplorable, so it's just another drop in the bucket.

 
I love the fascination with proving someone a hypocrite on this board.

I criticized Hillary for her e-mails.  I think what Trump is doing is deplorable.  But I think just about everything he's doing is deplorable, so it's just another drop in the bucket.
That’s my viewpoint also.  Every time I hear his name in the news, it’s What Did He Do Now?  

 
Maybe when someone explains what the scandal is there will be outrage.  Who the hell keeps paper records these days?  Everything should be digitally stored on computers.  They should be destroying paper records as they are untraceable and could contain sensitive information.  Everything these days is created on computers and that is where the official records should be maintained.  If Trump destroyed those that would be an issue.  


Yes I am sure that's definitely what Trump did. He kept paper at Mar-a-Lago and destroyed other paper records simply because he had it all digital. 

That definitely sounds like Trump.

 
To be fair these officials were consistently wrong only because the direct questions they were answering were unrelated to anything really happening.  I mean in a different context these quotes would not have been nonsense.
Not sure what you're talking about...they were pretty spot on.  This really isn't a difficult discussion to have.  We may be talking about two different things though.  I'm speaking of that which is "wrong" not necessarily "illegal".  

 
Yes I am sure that's definitely what Trump did. He kept paper at Mar-a-Lago and destroyed other paper records simply because he had it all digital. 

That definitely sounds like Trump.


Seriously, explain why these paper copies are important.  There is no requirement to keep paper records.  Did Trump's staff create these agendas, schedules, whatever and not have them saved on the computer.  Government agencies shred millions upon millions of paper documents daily.  Records are almost exclusively keep digitally.  

So far all this has been is a bunch of lefties throwing out the snark and having zero clue what they are talking about.  There is no meat here.  

 
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Where are all the guys that lived in PSF when Trump was in office?

Biden seems to screw up everything he touches but ….crickets because he’s a dem

It works both ways, always has always will 
I can think of plenty that just don't post on FBG much at all for whatever reason. Lot of good traffic in the 1/6 threads, maybe you will find some of the people you are looking for in there. 

Agree to disagree strongly on the bolded. Part of the reason there is less traffic is that Biden has been a much better president than Trump.

 
I can think of plenty that just don't post on FBG much at all for whatever reason. Lot of good traffic in the 1/6 threads, maybe you will find some of the people you are looking for in there. 

Agree to disagree strongly on the bolded. Part of the reason there is less traffic is that Biden has been a much better president than Trump.
The 1/6 thread lol

Yeah, I noticed they still post in the Trump threads some

 
The 1/6 thread lol

Yeah, I noticed they still post in the Trump threads some
Yeah. For whatever reason, people think it is a big issue that the former president tried to overturn an election and goaded his supporters into overrunning the capital.  Probably would be less important if he wasn't still in completely control of the GOP. Weird.

 
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The fact that this thread starts with whataboutism is disappointing.   The issue should not be that "hey, the right was outraged about this and they're being hypocritical."    That's just more of the same tribal nonsense that we get in every single thread,

The issue is that Trump was using burn bags and other means to destroy documents (but yeah, I'm sure they kept duplicate electronic records of everything while they were intentionally destroying these records).    And they're destroying records while making a concerted and wide-ranging effort to overturn the results of a legal election.

What's the big deal?   We have a law prohibiting this, because of NIxon.   The Presidential Records Acts makes these documents public records so that we don't have this shady stuff going on.   Trump didn't care about that or any other law.   

That should matter to anyone who isn't burying their head in the sand.

 
The fact that this thread starts with whataboutism is disappointing.   The issue should not be that "hey, the right was outraged about this and they're being hypocritical."    That's just more of the same tribal nonsense that we get in every single thread,

The issue is that Trump was using burn bags and other means to destroy documents (but yeah, I'm sure they kept duplicate electronic records of everything while they were intentionally destroying these records).    And they're destroying records while making a concerted and wide-ranging effort to overturn the results of a legal election.

What's the big deal?   We have a law prohibiting this, because of NIxon.   The Presidential Records Acts makes these documents public records so that we don't have this shady stuff going on.   Trump didn't care about that or any other law.   

That should matter to anyone who isn't burying their head in the sand.
He has slid thru all his life.  I guess it doesn’t matter to people who can actually do something about it.  It’s beyond tiring.  

 
The fact that this thread starts with whataboutism is disappointing.   The issue should not be that "hey, the right was outraged about this and they're being hypocritical."    That's just more of the same tribal nonsense that we get in every single thread,

The issue is that Trump was using burn bags and other means to destroy documents (but yeah, I'm sure they kept duplicate electronic records of everything while they were intentionally destroying these records).    And they're destroying records while making a concerted and wide-ranging effort to overturn the results of a legal election.

What's the big deal?   We have a law prohibiting this, because of NIxon.   The Presidential Records Acts makes these documents public records so that we don't have this shady stuff going on.   Trump didn't care about that or any other law.   

That should matter to anyone who isn't burying their head in the sand.
I agree 100%.  I love pointing out hypocrisy.  It's a vice.  Sorry.  But yeah the real story here is Trump and his attempts to hide so much.  

 
Really, it was HRC's handling and dissemination of TS information through her basement server that was the biggest issue.  This is such a huge, obvious no no that it seems unbelievable to me that there weren't arrests.  Anyone else would have been treated much, much differently.
What is TS information? Top Secret?  

 
I love the fascination with proving someone a hypocrite on this board.

I criticized Hillary for her e-mails.  I think what Trump is doing is deplorable.  But I think just about everything he's doing is deplorable, so it's just another drop in the bucket.
In fairness jm, you’re one of the more centered non hyper partisan posters here (which is why I enjoy your postings).  It’s not surprising you feel this way.  I don’t think a thread like this is pointed at you.  

 
What is TS information? Top Secret?  


Yes, she had a lot of classified material including some at the secret and top secret level.   A normal federal employee would be criminally charged and possibly face serious jail time for handling classified in such a manner.  Record keeping not so much.  

 
Yeah. For whatever reason, people think it is a big issue that the former president tried to overturn an election and goaded his supporters into overrunning the capital.  Probably would be less important if he wasn't still in completely control of the GOP. Weird.
You’re missing the point (pretending to obviously). 
How do you explain complaining about the president on a message board every single day for 4 years then completely disappearing and giving the next president a complete pass on everything?

 

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