LHUCKS
Footballguy
I wanted to see the poll numbers...I realize I've expressed my opinion.:(IMHO, Reid is a moron for starting Kolb week 3.
I wanted to see the poll numbers...I realize I've expressed my opinion.:(IMHO, Reid is a moron for starting Kolb week 3.
You mean the same Lions team that SHOULD have won vs. the Bears in week 1 if not for a bad rule? A Bears team that are 2-0 after beating Dallas.vick lead them to an extremely narrow victory over the worst team of the past decade. how can you even consider the super bowl?Because you haven't given up on the SuperBowl yet and because Kolb has looked like doggy doo doo.Seriously, Vick is in MVP form right now...I don't understand how you can bench him for a guy that MIGHT lead you to the Superbowl in future years.Seem like a -EV play to me...big time.How incredibily demoralizing this must be for the players too.You made the decision that Kolb was your guy for the future in the off-season - why would you not start him after one back half?
The situation is a little more complicated due to the success of Vick in the last two games. However, the Eagles didn't make this decision after watching them both play two games on TV like all of you have...they have watched Kolb over a four year period. They have seen him perform in practice, preseason, the offseason, and games, and they obviously think he is the better player.Due to their track record, I think I would have to trust them over you.IMHO, Reid is a moron for starting Kolb week 3.
You're right. Its lucky the DB's dropped the 3 picks he threw this week and last. Otherwise we might not be having this conversation.I don't think "playing well" is how I'd characterize Vick's play the last two weeks.You start your starter and pat Vick on the back for playing well while Kolb was out
Why couldn't Vick be the Eagles QB for the next 5 years? Why does it have to be Kolb?Yeah, the other objective is to build a team that can win the Super Bowl. To do that, the Eagles need to get Kevin Kolb in the right frame of mind and playing at a high level. They aren't going to the Super Bowl this year. Banged-up OL. Defense isn't there yet. Yeah, maybe they make the playoffs with Vick and not with Kolb. Maybe. But it's about the future, not about this week or next - and Kevin Kolb is or maybe isn't the future. The only way to find out is to play him.Oh, I don't know...perhaps because the point is to win games and go to the playoffs.Or is there another objective I'm not aware of?.....why would you even think they would consider not starting Kolb?
Seems like you're the one with the short memory. Vick had the football world in the palm of his hands a few years ago before he went crazy. As good as he was in Atlanta, everyone will tell you he was completely unfocused.Now he is actually focused and he looks amazing.What short memories people have--Vick has never been a great QB and it's laughable to think he should start the rest of the way. Granted, he looked decent today, but Kolb could have torched the Lion D as well....The bottom line is Kolb is the future and he needs time to develop...
bc andy reid invested immensely in kolb and nfl coaches have absurd egos.Why couldn't Vick be the Eagles QB for the next 5 years? Why does it have to be Kolb?Yeah, the other objective is to build a team that can win the Super Bowl. To do that, the Eagles need to get Kevin Kolb in the right frame of mind and playing at a high level. They aren't going to the Super Bowl this year. Banged-up OL. Defense isn't there yet. Yeah, maybe they make the playoffs with Vick and not with Kolb. Maybe. But it's about the future, not about this week or next - and Kevin Kolb is or maybe isn't the future. The only way to find out is to play him.Oh, I don't know...perhaps because the point is to win games and go to the playoffs.Or is there another objective I'm not aware of?.....why would you even think they would consider not starting Kolb?
invested immensely? what exactly did he invest in kolb? it wasn't his money or his final decision to extend him. also, please tell us more about reid's ego since you and him are such close friends. thanks freud.reid cares about his job and winning. thats where his ego is firmly centered. yeah, he is gonna give kolb a shot but if he sucks as bad as he did week 1 for more than a few weeks, he is GONE (to the bench).bc andy reid invested immensely in kolb and nfl coaches have absurd egos.Why couldn't Vick be the Eagles QB for the next 5 years? Why does it have to be Kolb?Yeah, the other objective is to build a team that can win the Super Bowl. To do that, the Eagles need to get Kevin Kolb in the right frame of mind and playing at a high level. They aren't going to the Super Bowl this year. Banged-up OL. Defense isn't there yet. Yeah, maybe they make the playoffs with Vick and not with Kolb. Maybe. But it's about the future, not about this week or next - and Kevin Kolb is or maybe isn't the future. The only way to find out is to play him.Oh, I don't know...perhaps because the point is to win games and go to the playoffs.Or is there another objective I'm not aware of?.....why would you even think they would consider not starting Kolb?
So they are emulating the 49ers?Have fun with that Philly.Bingo! Which is further proof this year is NOT about winning or going to the playoffs. Its about developing their QB of the future. If they were so concerned about this year, they would have just kept McNabb.This thread is amazing. Eagles already let go of one QB who was better than Kolb last offseason. Are they planning to do this every year? Is there some reason the Eagles don't want to re-sign the QB who's playing like a MVP?
??confused?? 7 years, lol...in 7 years Vick will have his 3rd grandchild and will be living his last days with his sweetheart on the old ranch. In 2 years the guy is ready for pasture. Look, Vick is an amazing athlete. He has already slowed down at the age of 31, it's just that he was so much faster than anyone else, that this older/slower version of Vick is still probably in the top 1% of NFL players speed wise. But in a couple years the guy will have no athletisicm left, at least at the NFL level. He just won't.The Eagles CANNOT win a super bowl with vick. If the insane law enforcement wouldn't have destroyed this man's career, then perhaps he would have had a chance in his prime years from 27-30. Unfortunately, someone he knew killed some dogs and so he had to go to jail and forfiet his possibly legend career. But it's over now. At 31, he has no chance to build a super bowl team.Kolb on the other hand still has a chance. He can turn into a great QB. Or perhaps he falters and bags groceries for the rest of his life. But you'll never know which one unless you play the guy. Yes, more than a half, more than a minute, more than a second. A QB needs a year or MORE to get into his prime.over the course of the next 7 years, the eales have a better chance of making the super bowl with vick than kolb.Yeah, the other objective is to build a team that can win the Super Bowl. To do that, the Eagles need to get Kevin Kolb in the right frame of mind and playing at a high level. They aren't going to the Super Bowl this year. Banged-up OL. Defense isn't there yet. Yeah, maybe they make the playoffs with Vick and not with Kolb. Maybe. But it's about the future, not about this week or next - and Kevin Kolb is or maybe isn't the future. The only way to find out is to play him.Oh, I don't know...perhaps because the point is to win games and go to the playoffs.Or is there another objective I'm not aware of?.....why would you even think they would consider not starting Kolb?
I agree that they should start Kolb...but let's not get crazy here, lol...Kolb is no Aaron Rodgers. Rodgers is the premier QB in the league for the next 5-10 years. Kolb is a guy who has played 2 decent games in his career and a few crappy ones.funny you should mention aaron rodgers considering the packers cut favre after the team went 13-3 and settled for a 6-10 season the next year. and now because they suffered through that one lean year they will be a super bowl contender for the next 5 years. hopefully the eagles arent as shortsighted as the people here.The notion that the Eagles have no chance to go anywhere this year so play Kolb is laughable. Why can't the Eagles win the NFC East? None of those teams are better than the Eagles. There are only two teams that are "great" teams in the NFC (Saints and Packers). They can hang with anyone else. Put your best field on the team every week. It didn't hurt Aaron Rodgers to sit a few years, why can't Kolb sit this year? Vick gives this team the best chance to go deep into the playoffs. Let it ride...
funny you should mention aaron rodgers considering the packers cut favre after the team went 13-3 and settled for a 6-10 season the next year. and now because they suffered through that one lean year they will be a super bowl contender for the next 5 years. hopefully the eagles arent as shortsighted as the people here.The notion that the Eagles have no chance to go anywhere this year so play Kolb is laughable. Why can't the Eagles win the NFC East? None of those teams are better than the Eagles. There are only two teams that are "great" teams in the NFC (Saints and Packers). They can hang with anyone else. Put your best field on the team every week. It didn't hurt Aaron Rodgers to sit a few years, why can't Kolb sit this year? Vick gives this team the best chance to go deep into the playoffs. Let it ride...
While you're probably correct...the thinking is off. Rodgers showed no more then Kolb in his first three years (in fact, the opposite is true!) Kolb has earned a real chance to prove himself. Ten attempts under duress are NOT a real chance.I agree that they should start Kolb...but let's not get crazy here, lol...Kolb is no Aaron Rodgers. Rodgers is the premier QB in the league for the next 5-10 years. Kolb is a guy who has played 2 decent games in his career and a few crappy ones.funny you should mention aaron rodgers considering the packers cut favre after the team went 13-3 and settled for a 6-10 season the next year. and now because they suffered through that one lean year they will be a super bowl contender for the next 5 years. hopefully the eagles arent as shortsighted as the people here.The notion that the Eagles have no chance to go anywhere this year so play Kolb is laughable. Why can't the Eagles win the NFC East? None of those teams are better than the Eagles. There are only two teams that are "great" teams in the NFC (Saints and Packers). They can hang with anyone else. Put your best field on the team every week. It didn't hurt Aaron Rodgers to sit a few years, why can't Kolb sit this year? Vick gives this team the best chance to go deep into the playoffs.
Let it ride...
This is a good post with solid arguments. I mostly agree.Vick has played well, and deserves a starting gig in the NFL. Not even the most die-hard Kolb supporter will deny that fact. What the Vick supporters continue to ignore is the fact that Kevin Kolb has earned the right to a real chance to show his stuff. If Kolb struggles in Jacksonville and again at home vs. Washington...THEN would be the time to start Vick. Not now.I voted for Vick, although I fully understand that Stubborn Andy will start Kolb in Week 3.Some points for consideration:#1 I see it is assanine for any Eagles fan to take the view that the 2010 Eagles are not going to "win it all" so who cares about wins and losses, lets just "develop Kolb". This shows an extreme misunderstanding of the state of play in the NFL these days. Take a look at the NFC East, a division that may be vastly overrated as both NYG and Dallas look like teams with some major flaws and Washington at best is an 8 or 9 win team. So a division title is there to clearly compete for. But that's not good enough? I'd rather lose 10 games and "build for the future"? The future is now and teams that get into the playoffs can get "hot". Look at the 2009 NY Jets, made it to the AFC Championship game and were leading it at halftime.#2 Kolb does not have a Peyton Manning-like contract. There is no reason why Mike Vick couldn't be the Eagles QB for at least 3 more seasons (which is a lifetime in today's NFL) after 2010. Bad argument to point to the fact that Vick will be a FA at the end of the year. If Vick is playing well and the Eagles are winning what better opportunity to sign him to a 3 year extension than during this current season.#3 Those that point to Vick's past failings as a QB, need to acknowledge that he does have "special talent". He has had the ulitmate "change of scenary" and it is quite feasible that he is poised to have the best run at QB in his NFL career. BTW, if one looks back at his career, as flawed as it may have been, he still was good enough to be a playoff caliber QB.#4 The slashing weapons that the Eagles have in Jackson and Maclin should make more big plays in an offense led by Vick, who's ability to improvise in a broken down pocket (something that will happen frequently given the Eagles subpar offensive line) than they would with a more stationary Kolb. Did anyone see Deshaun "Diva" Jackson visibly pouting in Week 1 and fully embracing Vick in Week 2? Secondly, did anyone notice what Vick's presence on the defense did for the Eagles' running game yesterday? McCoy had much more room to run inside yesterday due to the defensive schemes needed to contain Vick#5 Those that say it was "Detroit" should really wake up. Detroit is an improved team that almost beat the Bears in Week 1. Moreover, I don't think Kolb, with his much inferior escapability, would have made several key plays that Vick made yesterday and I think that with Kolb the Eagles lose week 2.
LHUCKS said:the notion that the Eagles can't win the SuperBowl this year is laughable to me. Vick honestly looks like the NFL MVP right now...when you have that kind of weapon at QB you can play with anybody.bweiser said:Yeah, the other objective is to build a team that can win the Super Bowl.LHUCKS said:Oh, I don't know...perhaps because the point is to win games and go to the playoffs.Or is there another objective I'm not aware of?caglassc said:.....why would you even think they would consider not starting Kolb?
Vick is 30, looks as fast as ever and is in better shape than someone named Warner who played til 37.plyka said:??confused?? 7 years, lol...in 7 years Vick will have his 3rd grandchild and will be living his last days with his sweetheart on the old ranch. In 2 years the guy is ready for pasture. Look, Vick is an amazing athlete. He has already slowed down at the age of 31, it's just that he was so much faster than anyone else, that this older/slower version of Vick is still probably in the top 1% of NFL players speed wise. But in a couple years the guy will have no athletisicm left, at least at the NFL level. He just won't.The Eagles CANNOT win a super bowl with vick. If the insane law enforcement wouldn't have destroyed this man's career, then perhaps he would have had a chance in his prime years from 27-30. Unfortunately, someone he knew killed some dogs and so he had to go to jail and forfiet his possibly legend career. But it's over now. At 31, he has no chance to build a super bowl team.Kolb on the other hand still has a chance. He can turn into a great QB. Or perhaps he falters and bags groceries for the rest of his life. But you'll never know which one unless you play the guy. Yes, more than a half, more than a minute, more than a second. A QB needs a year or MORE to get into his prime.thehornet said:over the course of the next 7 years, the eales have a better chance of making the super bowl with vick than kolb.bweiser said:Yeah, the other objective is to build a team that can win the Super Bowl. To do that, the Eagles need to get Kevin Kolb in the right frame of mind and playing at a high level. They aren't going to the Super Bowl this year. Banged-up OL. Defense isn't there yet. Yeah, maybe they make the playoffs with Vick and not with Kolb. Maybe. But it's about the future, not about this week or next - and Kevin Kolb is or maybe isn't the future. The only way to find out is to play him.LHUCKS said:Oh, I don't know...perhaps because the point is to win games and go to the playoffs.Or is there another objective I'm not aware of?caglassc said:.....why would you even think they would consider not starting Kolb?
correctThe Eagles would have lost yesterday if Kolb was playing. Vick made plays that Kolb just can't make.
And all of the Eagles skill players are downgraded with Kolb at QB. McCoy doesn't get the running lanes and the receivers aren't the same.Vick should start week 3.The Eagles would have lost yesterday if Kolb was playing. Vick made plays that Kolb just can't make.Mike Kafka could be the Eagles future, not Kolb, unless Kolb gets his #### together and stops worrying or thinking about the guys coming to hit him and focus on completing passes.
Translation: "My opinion has no basis for argument under the asusmption that it can't withstand any opposing point of views."shader said:BTW, if you voted Kolb, you should just give up. Football analysis just isn't your thing...
Yea because we found that out. Rodgers got a shot to prove it on the field. There were just as many Rodgers detractors as Kolb detractors before he proved it on the field.plyka said:I agree that they should start Kolb...but let's not get crazy here, lol...Kolb is no Aaron Rodgers. Rodgers is the premier QB in the league for the next 5-10 years. Kolb is a guy who has played 2 decent games in his career and a few crappy ones.CaptainHook said:funny you should mention aaron rodgers considering the packers cut favre after the team went 13-3 and settled for a 6-10 season the next year. and now because they suffered through that one lean year they will be a super bowl contender for the next 5 years. hopefully the eagles arent as shortsighted as the people here.The notion that the Eagles have no chance to go anywhere this year so play Kolb is laughable. Why can't the Eagles win the NFC East? None of those teams are better than the Eagles. There are only two teams that are "great" teams in the NFC (Saints and Packers). They can hang with anyone else. Put your best field on the team every week. It didn't hurt Aaron Rodgers to sit a few years, why can't Kolb sit this year? Vick gives this team the best chance to go deep into the playoffs. Let it ride...
Thank You, someone said it. Felt like the only one that thought this might be the right move(maybe only Eagles fan). You could trade Kolb and get a nice draft pick. If Vick is indeed back to his old self(better with new work ethic?) then you basically get the pick back you made on Kolb selection and profit what you got in the McNabb trade without losing anything at the position. This is still a big assumption that Vick is good as he's looked but it is why you have to play Vick in Week 3, the situation actually works its self out. If Vick leads the team to wins, then you see that he is your quarterback next year and you put yourself in a situation to win the superbowl this year. If the Eagles don't win though, you still have plenty of games left to get Kolb experience this year. Vick is only 30 or 31 years old, the same age Steve Young was in his first year starting for the 49ers. Also if you had Vick you can draft a quarterback next year and groom him, assuming you get a 2nd round pick back for Kolb you didn't waste anything. It's not like Kolb is a can't miss prospect, there are promising young QBs in the draft every year. I realize the Eagles plan was going into this season but you have to adapt on the fly in the NFL to be successful. I can't think of a team this good ever benching a qb this good for basically a rookie in the 3rd week of the season with a record of 1-1. Now you could say they should start Kolb and then go to Vick if Kolb is playing bad but not only would they risk their playoff chances but throw away a chance at getting a week 1 bye in the playoffs. If Kolb looks bad at Jacksonville I still have a hard time believing Reid would bench him in week 4, home against the Redskins. That's risking going 1-3 when maybe they would have gone 3-1 with Vick. You can't throw seasons down the drain just as a trial run to see if a guy can play. You do this when you have a bad team or have fallen out of contention, not when your one of the better teams in your conference. Now if they give Kolb the whole year and he looks bad then they probably go back to him next year because of a lack of options. So now the 1 year grooming has turned into 2 year thing possibly with a bad qb, say he doesn't get it done in year 2, then they need to groom a new rookie.They're allowed to re-sign the better QB. At least starting Kolb will ensure a higher draft pick.Bingo! Which is further proof this year is NOT about winning or going to the playoffs. Its about developing their QB of the future. If they were so concerned about this year, they would have just kept McNabb.This thread is amazing. Eagles already let go of one QB who was better than Kolb last offseason. Are they planning to do this every year? Is there some reason the Eagles don't want to re-sign the QB who's playing like a MVP?
Why would I delete a post stating my opinion. I foolishly believed that the Eagles management had a plan for the future. Turns out I was a fool for believing them. If we wanted to try to win the Super Bowl this year, then why not Keep Mcnabb? He's the better of all 3 QB's. Total waste of time and the Eagles will be a joke next year when Vick walks and we still don't know if Kolb can play.Looks like many of you need to eat some crow...or at least delete your post to try and save face.![]()
I don't think the Eagles(and Reid?) thought that McNabb could win them a superbowl so that is why they traded him. I don't agree with this but I thought everyone's complaint about Reid was that he is stubborn and sticks to his plan no matter what, and now Vick has shown great ability and your unhappy that Reid has adapted to the situation? Also your worry about the Eagles being joke isn't fair because if they don't play vick and lose him and Kolb turns out to be no good then the Eagles are really in big trouble. The way it is now you give yourself a chance at 2 guys being your quarterback because you can still play Kolb later on the year or next season. They were saying on NFL network the Eagles could franchise tag Vick. If Vick proves himself this year, he will not want to leave nor will the Eagles want him to.Why would I delete a post stating my opinion. I foolishly believed that the Eagles management had a plan for the future. Turns out I was a fool for believing them. If we wanted to try to win the Super Bowl this year, then why not Keep Mcnabb? He's the better of all 3 QB's. Total waste of time and the Eagles will be a joke next year when Vick walks and we still don't know if Kolb can play.Looks like many of you need to eat some crow...or at least delete your post to try and save face. :(
If I was Kolb, I would ask for a trade. The team basically gave him a vote of no confidence after 1 half of play. Would you want to play for a team that basically dropped you for the latest hot thing? I mean its not just management here. Apparently the locker room are all on Vick's side as well. What would they do when Vick is gone? All of sudden expect Kolb, the guy who they didn't think could lead them better than Vick to lead them? Basically, we're stuck with Vick now good or bad. There's no going back to Kolb with any confidence after this. The slightest falter or bad pass and its over for him.I don't think the Eagles(and Reid?) thought that McNabb could win them a superbowl so that is why they traded him. I don't agree with this but I thought everyone's complaint about Reid was that he is stubborn and sticks to his plan no matter what, and now Vick has shown great ability and your unhappy that Reid has adapted to the situation? Also your worry about the Eagles being joke isn't fair because if they don't play vick and lose him and Kolb turns out to be no good then the Eagles are really in big trouble. The way it is now you give yourself a chance at 2 guys being your quarterback because you can still play Kolb later on the year or next season. They were saying on NFL network the Eagles could franchise tag Vick. If Vick proves himself this year, he will not want to leave nor will the Eagles want him to.Why would I delete a post stating my opinion. I foolishly believed that the Eagles management had a plan for the future. Turns out I was a fool for believing them. If we wanted to try to win the Super Bowl this year, then why not Keep Mcnabb? He's the better of all 3 QB's. Total waste of time and the Eagles will be a joke next year when Vick walks and we still don't know if Kolb can play.Looks like many of you need to eat some crow...or at least delete your post to try and save face.![]()
I feel I have no crow to eat. The Eagles still drafted Kolb with their first pick in the 2007 draft. They still traded McNabb to the Redskins so Kolb could take over. They still gave Kolb a $12 mil contract extention to be "the guy". They still have only given him 10 passes to prove himself. And after 2010, we still won't know how good he can be. Basically everything I've said on these boards. I've never proclaimed KK to be the next great QB. Just that I'd like to see what they've invested in. Looks like we may never know.Let's go Mike! Win a Super Bowl! Otherwise we may as well have kept McNabb.Looks like many of you need to eat some crow...or at least delete your post to try and save face.![]()
Good points. But I think the players do like Kolb and do have confidence in Kolb, perferring Vick over Kolb is not an insult in anyway with the way Vick has played the first two games. So Kolb shouldn't take any offense to that and he has to understand he hasn't accomplished anything in the NFL yet and he wasn't even highly regarded coming out of college as Rodgers was and he was a good soldier. If Vick is the starter in future, obviously Kolb deserves to be traded. I guess my scenerio was more Kolb gets some games at the end of the season and is the starter, I don't think Kolb will have any problem playing for this team again this year. If he was benched the whole year and they said again they wanted him to be the starter again, then its up to Kolb. I think it would be in his best interest to return, with a Kafka type or sucky veteran as his backup. This is unlikely scenerio though ibecause if Vick starts the whole year, I wouldn't say we are "stuck" with him as he probably played quite well. Right now with concussion and the O-line it might be better he wasn't out there right now anyway.If I was Kolb, I would ask for a trade. The team basically gave him a vote of no confidence after 1 half of play. Would you want to play for a team that basically dropped you for the latest hot thing? I mean its not just management here. Apparently the locker room are all on Vick's side as well. What would they do when Vick is gone? All of sudden expect Kolb, the guy who they didn't think could lead them better than Vick to lead them? Basically, we're stuck with Vick now good or bad. There's no going back to Kolb with any confidence after this. The slightest falter or bad pass and its over for him.I don't think the Eagles(and Reid?) thought that McNabb could win them a superbowl so that is why they traded him. I don't agree with this but I thought everyone's complaint about Reid was that he is stubborn and sticks to his plan no matter what, and now Vick has shown great ability and your unhappy that Reid has adapted to the situation? Also your worry about the Eagles being joke isn't fair because if they don't play vick and lose him and Kolb turns out to be no good then the Eagles are really in big trouble. The way it is now you give yourself a chance at 2 guys being your quarterback because you can still play Kolb later on the year or next season. They were saying on NFL network the Eagles could franchise tag Vick. If Vick proves himself this year, he will not want to leave nor will the Eagles want him to.Why would I delete a post stating my opinion. I foolishly believed that the Eagles management had a plan for the future. Turns out I was a fool for believing them. If we wanted to try to win the Super Bowl this year, then why not Keep Mcnabb? He's the better of all 3 QB's. Total waste of time and the Eagles will be a joke next year when Vick walks and we still don't know if Kolb can play.Looks like many of you need to eat some crow...or at least delete your post to try and save face.![]()