NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
Haven't read the entire thread but have we all agreed it's the others sides fault yet?
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Why are our politicians still not helping our citizens? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter IC FBGCav
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uwillbsoon
Footballguy
This is a semi-related question: In order to get and not repay PPP funds, what does a business have to do?
I ask because the employer I worked for cut 20% of their staff the week before applying for PPP funds. On their PPP application, they indicated the post-cut employee count number.
I did some rudimentary investigation and it looked like they were taking employee counts from pre-pandemic (I forget specifically when) and then basically a certain time after receiving the PPP funds. If the after number is equal to or above the before number, they don't have to repay those funds. There's more to it, but anyone more in the know confirm that's roughly accurate?
I ask because if they don't, it seems like the impetus to cut staff (this was a subscription-based software company - there wasn't any great loss of revenue expected - the people buying our software were considered essential in most states) was to get that employee count number lower before they applied for funds - so they wouldn't have to repay them. But that won't work, right? Because the staff number will likely be lower than pre-pandemic, those PPP funds need to be repaid in some fashion, right?
I ask because the employer I worked for cut 20% of their staff the week before applying for PPP funds. On their PPP application, they indicated the post-cut employee count number.
I did some rudimentary investigation and it looked like they were taking employee counts from pre-pandemic (I forget specifically when) and then basically a certain time after receiving the PPP funds. If the after number is equal to or above the before number, they don't have to repay those funds. There's more to it, but anyone more in the know confirm that's roughly accurate?
I ask because if they don't, it seems like the impetus to cut staff (this was a subscription-based software company - there wasn't any great loss of revenue expected - the people buying our software were considered essential in most states) was to get that employee count number lower before they applied for funds - so they wouldn't have to repay them. But that won't work, right? Because the staff number will likely be lower than pre-pandemic, those PPP funds need to be repaid in some fashion, right?
I’m getting $1028 every other week since it switched from CERB($1000) back to ei.
edit to add that this is since March, back to ei in September(I think), and there was also a one time $1000 from the province, and another $500 from the province we can apply for starting the 18th.
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parasaurolophus
Footballguy
so the CERB benefit for you was actually less than standard unemployment?
In the US it was additional.
the moops
Footballguy
Yes. I am unsure how long it lasted, but it definitely was not a one time thing like the US 1200 dollar deal
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
My question was rhetorical in response to a rhetorical.
I had already pointed out that they were getting it and that the benefits the US provided were actually higher.
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They made it simple and easy to get. Wanted to get it out as soon as possible to everyone who needed it.
For some it was more. Ei is based on a few things, cerb was standard $1000 for everyone.
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urbanhack
Fight The Power!
Look no further than how this whole pandemic was treated. Scraps for the general public and small business; and a PPP program overrun with fraud and handouts to companies who didn't need it.
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/religion/article/Joel-Osteen-s-Lakewood-Church-got-4-4M-in-15800887.php
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/05/tom-bradys-company-tb12-received-more-than-960000-ppp-loan.html
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-organization-kushner-companies-3-million-ppp-loans-pandemic-report-2020-12
https://www.propublica.org/article/the-small-biz-double-dip-temp-companies-got-cheap-government-money-got-paid-by-clients-for-the-same-workers
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/religion/article/Joel-Osteen-s-Lakewood-Church-got-4-4M-in-15800887.php
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/05/tom-bradys-company-tb12-received-more-than-960000-ppp-loan.html
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-organization-kushner-companies-3-million-ppp-loans-pandemic-report-2020-12
https://www.propublica.org/article/the-small-biz-double-dip-temp-companies-got-cheap-government-money-got-paid-by-clients-for-the-same-workers
NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
Paywalled but not surprised at all that my favorite con man, Joel Osteen, found a way to capitalize on this.
GordonGekko
Footballguy
1) Certain personality types are drawn to being professional politicians. Sociopaths, psychopaths, narcissists, etc. You'll also get some Cluster B types, BPD and the like. That's part of the problem.
2) The average Joe only benefits if the situation is Win/Win where the 2nd Win is a coincidence. For example, a politician works a deal to bring a company into his city that creates lots of jobs. Well the politician gets cash kickbacks and making jobs helps his reelection and improves his tax base to support the city infrastructure. That's a win for him. The win for the Average Joe, getting more jobs, is just a coincidence, a byproduct of the politician serving themselves first. Part of the problem is the media is "supposed" to operate as a public watchdog. I.E. to report the fraud when the 2nd Win doesn't happen. But now the mass media is part of the establishment, and is just as complicit in the crimes against the commoners.
3) If you look at human history, real change only happens, at it roots, when you choke out someone's money or their children are under threat/their children are being killed. Pablo Escobar ( consider Mark Bowden's Killing Pablo) was a good test case. He was unstoppable, he was kidnapping and killing judges, cops, lawyers, politicians, until Los Pepes was formed ( cartel, military, law enforcement, US Special Forces) and they stopped his direct family from leaving the country and started kiling his cousins, his friends, his contacts, his partners until they flushed out Escobar.
In many social breakdowns, there is an "Let Them Eat Cake" moment. That's when people see their children starving and/or dying and then their sense of self preservation goes out the window. I think many people here have a very poor concept of armed uprisings and militias in terms of being a political means to an end. An uprising won't be 100 militia guys marching and going head to head with a formal military. It will be small controlled cells basically operating like the Beltway Sniper situation. That's the true nightmare scenario for everyone.
When you have a large wealth gap, you have a large missing frame of reference. So someone like Pelosi or Newsom, when was the last time they lived check to check or had to clean their own bathrooms? How often do they spend their day ONLY around other rich, wealthy and powerful people? It's easy to dismiss what you don't see every single day.
Congress spent 8-9 months and made like over 100K of their salary prorated to give all of you 600 dollars of your grandchildren's money. And they want you to get on your knees and worship them for it.
Here's the reality of the near future for America. We will go to war with China. It's inevitable. There will likely be a food shortage and food riots at some point. Lots of people are going to die when there is finally a "Let Them Eat Cake" moment , a point of no return. It's going to be a YouTube video where a hard working family was locked down forever and now are homeless and their little child is cold and starving on the street. That's when people will snap. It should make people pause that firearm sales have been through the roof in the last year.
As for professional politicians, it's like NFL QB1s, you get all of the glory when there is glory to be had, but you get all of the blame when the whole team loses. Just how it works. Don't be angry at them, don't be jealous or envious of them, just avoid them, because when it all pops off and spins out of contol, you don't want to be standing near them.
This is it guys, this is the start of the end of the world. Ancient old dogs like Wikkid and I, well it's not a huge loss for us. But lots of you younger guys, it really is quite tragic. Make the most of the time you have today, because the clock is ticking.
ShamrockPride
Footballguy
End of the world? No. End of the modern American Empire? If we're lucky.GordonGekko said:
CR69
Footballguy
@GordonGekko
I see you specifically named California Democrats but you realize this is almost every ####### politician, regardless of party, right? We have to get past this left vs right ####. That is a distraction. It is 100% rich vs poor. The haves vs the have nots. You see that, right?
I see you specifically named California Democrats but you realize this is almost every ####### politician, regardless of party, right? We have to get past this left vs right ####. That is a distraction. It is 100% rich vs poor. The haves vs the have nots. You see that, right?
Godsbrother
Footballguy
Merry Christmas, GG. Things will be OK.GordonGekko said:
GordonGekko
Footballguy
If you are asking me if I think every last single politician is a stone cold grifter, my answer is Yes. I may lean conservative but I've said as much in multiple threads. I've also said I believe every last single professional politician fits under a category where they either narcissists, sociopaths, psychopaths, BPD or any other cluster out there. I've said that in a bunch of places as well.
I'd be happy to criticize politicians on the right, I'm no tribalist. It's just no one ever asks about politicians on the right here, for the most part, without going on the pure attack i.e. Orange Man Bad. I'm more than happy to discuss the flaws of some of Trump's policies, but rarely does anyone here broach that kind of subject civilly. But I'm also open to discussing the flaws of the Clinton, Obama and W. Bush administrations. If I'm asked a fair question, I'll give a fair answer. If someone comes to troll and bull rush cancel culture me, I'll level up and knee cap them with quotes, facts, data, stats, links, video, transcripts and information.
If you are discussing wealth disparity, as this thread topic discusses disengagement between professional politicians and the average citizen, I do think there is an entire socio economic division that roots into this problem in a toxic way. Or, as is said often, dignity comes with dollars. But I've said that in the post above. If it makes people here feel better, Cocaine Mitch, Graham, Jim Jordan, Gaetz, Cruz and the rest would gladly cut my throat for a million more votes. But so would Lightfoot, Durkan, Wheeler, Walz, Breed, Garcetti, Klobuchar, Warren and all the rest.
I name West Coast because it impacts my taxes and the policies/conflicts under which I have to live. I'm sure Otis and Chase Stuart in NY would reference Cuomo/De Blasio no matter their partisan leanings. I've written several things regarding Plumpjack and Newsom on an economic level ( i.e. rich versus poor) but it was deleted. I can't control what is deleted.
If you'd like to start a new thread to discuss specific political topics you find interesting that engage pros and cons in a partisan neutral manner, I'd be happy to participate in it.
Insein
Footballguy
Exactly. This isn't left or right. This is right vs wrong. Tulsi Gabbard and Rand Paul both voted against this and they couldn't be more diametrically opposed on social issues. They're both looking out for the American people here. This Bill needs to be vetoed if not by the Senate, then Trump better have the balls to stop this in it's tracks. This does nothing for the American people literally.
Insein
Footballguy
sho nuff
Footballguy
I can only vote against the current reps and senators in TN when given a chance. And that for sure means voting against Blackburn...and even then she likely will still win because party seems to come first.
Insein
Footballguy
That's my point. But the worst ones are so entrenched despite their own constituents don't even like them but they keep winning.
sho nuff
Footballguy
BigJim®
Footballguy
I may not be following these short exchanges right, but don't you mean "due to what their constituents vote based upon" and not "despite their own constituents" not liking them? Clearly they have constituent support if they are elected to office.
Insein
Footballguy
I'm talking career politicians like Pelosi and McConnel. You look at their districts and how can anyone that lives there vote for them when they keep disregarding what's best for their own people?
BigJim®
Footballguy
Let's be honest, even people themselves often disregard what is best for them (see pandemic response). It really should not be a surprise they don't vote in their best interest, or prioritize their best interest below trivial topics/slogans. I really think it is as simple as blind brand loyalty and general ignorance. My guess is if you ask 100 people off the street why they voted for a particular politician, most would generically respond brand/party, or the fact their choice was not the other brand/party. If you asked for specifics, you'd get a blank stare or unintelligible response from 75-80%. Far more than enough to determine elections. No different really from what you'd get asking someone why they are Presbyterian and not Lutheran. People don't care to know why they are what they feel strongly they are.
Zegras11
Footballguy
Justin Amash@justinamash
·
2h
I’ve spent ten years warning about the erosion of representative democracy resulting from increasingly centralized power, but even I didn’t imagine a Congress that would be handed a 5,593-page bill at 1:46 p.m., vote on it at 7:35 p.m., and then brag about the good job they did.
it's time for TERM LIMITS. What's going on is insane.
·
2h
I’ve spent ten years warning about the erosion of representative democracy resulting from increasingly centralized power, but even I didn’t imagine a Congress that would be handed a 5,593-page bill at 1:46 p.m., vote on it at 7:35 p.m., and then brag about the good job they did.
it's time for TERM LIMITS. What's going on is insane.
Insein
Footballguy
Past time for term limits. Unfortunately who do you think has to vote to put them in?
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Zegras11
Footballguy
Insein
Footballguy
IC FBGCav
Footballguy
3rd party that gives a crap about the majority of Americans.
You will never get that candidate elected on either side.
Insein
Footballguy
It would have to be someone from their own party popular enough to defeat them in the primary (and overcome the built in machine that favors the incumbent in elections). Opposing party wouldn't stand a chance against Pelosi in SF or McConnell in Kentucky.
urbanhack
Fight The Power!
There are a lot of individual senators and congresspeople who are advocating for us and trying to do the right thing, but they are handcuffed at this ####ed up system.
JAA
Footballguy
I would make a case that this is an example of how our capitalism is supposed to work. Make money at any and all costs. That’s the game the big boys are playing.
TwinTurbo
Footballguy
Both of them are poster children for TERM LIMITS. Career politicians are not public servants. Nobody should be allowed to "serve" for decades on end in the house or senate. And nobody is better off having Pelosi or McConnell in Congress since the 80's.
The people in their district keep voting for them because there are no term limits and their party doesn't run or support any viable opposition candidates. In Pelosi's case, a Democrat has held that seat since 1949. She hasn't participated in an actual debate since 1987 and has been reelected 16 times in a row with no opposition. I think these congressional mini-monarchies are one of the biggest scams going in American politics.
JAA
Footballguy
The Narrator
Footballguy
IC FBGCav
Footballguy
Insein
Footballguy
JAA
Footballguy
I’ve been thinking about how to solve this am issue. I can’t come up with any direct solutions as this is how capitalism works. However, I do think something we can do is teach more Economics is schools. I means, we teach so much math and science, we should consider some strong and basic economics in schools.
fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
2Squirrels1Nut
Footballguy
JAA
Footballguy
Capitalism in its purest form is not regulated. If you asked capitalism it’s opinion on this, it would say this was a desirable result. Capitalism doesn’t care about yours or mine feelings.
