I kind of regretted getting the booster when I did. I felt cruddy for 3 days and my lymph nodes in my underarm still hurt. I'm guessing my antibodies were very high and I didn't need it yet. That being said I know you have had health issues to think it's a great idea for you. Good luck!
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Will you get a Covid vaccine when available? (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter gianmarco
- Start date
gianmarco
Footballguy
That reaction doesn't mean that at all. I felt awful after my first dose. Some people have more reaction to their first dose than second and vice versa.
There are a myriad of factors that go into how the body responses immunologically. Using your reaction to it as a way to figure out if you needed the booster or not is faulty. No reason to have any regret to getting it at all. What you experienced is very common to many vaccinations.
Yet I had zero reaction to either of the first two shots and never had a reaction to the flu shot.
gianmarco
Footballguy
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
gianmarco
Footballguy
Of course I don't know. If you're just guessing about your antibodies (even though there's no basis to it), then fine. But you've expressed doubt and regret about the booster based on your reaction and that is faulty.
Another possibility is that your body is slow to generate an immune response. It's possible you didn't have much of a reaction the first two doses because you didn't build a robust immune response. You may have had equivocal antibody production and coverage. The booster may have been what allowed your body to produce a strong and adequate response to protect you much better than you had been previously.
In that case, you should be thrilled you got it.
I haven't worn a mask since March and have not been cautious at all. I'm fairly certain my antibody levels were adequate.
His point was dumb. I was making an educated guess by how I reacted to the booster compared to how my body reacted to the other two shots and every other vaccine I've ever taken. My educated guess could be wrong or could be right. I'll never know. But I'm allowed to speculate.
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
His point wasn’t dumb. He has knowledge on this topic - you clearly don’t. I’m not sure why you would prefer to lack knowledge.
From my anecdotal observations of when people have strong immune response side effects (flu-like symptoms, etc):
-Any 1st dose after fairly recent infection (consistent reaction)
-2nd dose Moderna (highly consistent)
-3rd dose for highly immunocompromised (almost everyone I talked to had a reaction after nothing with first 2)
Hit or miss immune response side effects:
-2nd dose Pfizer (much more mild than Moderna and inconsistent.
-3rd dose Pfizer
-1st dose J&J with no prior infection
-Very recent infection, like less than 3 months (many had no reaction)
1st doses of Moderna and Pfizer rarely gave bad side effects unless there was a previous infection. Moderna reliably produced one bad reaction. Pfizer is about 50-50 on people having any reaction with either dose. It was very rare to have some one have a bad reaction with both doses. A bad first dose usually meant an easy second dose.
My best guess is that a ‘bad reaction’ results when you’ve got some antibodies already and the immune system is working hard to give you high potency protection. I think after that reaction the body reaches a saturation point where it doesn’t need to overreact to future doses this why some don’t have reactions on 2nd or 3rd doses or very recent infections.
-Any 1st dose after fairly recent infection (consistent reaction)
-2nd dose Moderna (highly consistent)
-3rd dose for highly immunocompromised (almost everyone I talked to had a reaction after nothing with first 2)
Hit or miss immune response side effects:
-2nd dose Pfizer (much more mild than Moderna and inconsistent.
-3rd dose Pfizer
-1st dose J&J with no prior infection
-Very recent infection, like less than 3 months (many had no reaction)
1st doses of Moderna and Pfizer rarely gave bad side effects unless there was a previous infection. Moderna reliably produced one bad reaction. Pfizer is about 50-50 on people having any reaction with either dose. It was very rare to have some one have a bad reaction with both doses. A bad first dose usually meant an easy second dose.
My best guess is that a ‘bad reaction’ results when you’ve got some antibodies already and the immune system is working hard to give you high potency protection. I think after that reaction the body reaches a saturation point where it doesn’t need to overreact to future doses this why some don’t have reactions on 2nd or 3rd doses or very recent infections.
dhockster
Footballguy
It sounds like you were making a guess, not an educated guess. An educated guess usually has some sound logic behind it even if it may not be correct.
Doug B
Footballguy
I thought you were in NYC proper? If so ... how are you getting by without masking? Ever got thrown out or denied entrance somewhere? Or is there no private enforcement (e.g. no cashier anywhere makes an issue of it)?
Masks havent been required here since May. I wore masks in stores until then. Its in other settings I stopped using masks once fully vaxxed.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Pfizer booster tomorrow
nirad3
Footballguy
I got my 2nd Pfizer in May. I'm not immunocompromised, but I'm borderline diabetic and fat asf. When should I plan on getting my booster? I travel like once a month for work and do spend time indoors without a mask on (bars, restaurants, etc.).
I know I could probably just Google but this thread has been fantastic for vax info.
I know I could probably just Google but this thread has been fantastic for vax info.
cheeseypoof
Footballguy
Pfizer Shot #3 in the arm.
cheeseypoof
Footballguy
I just got my booster and they asked for my card. They entered the 3rd shot info on it.
Tony Jabroni
Footballguy
The Commish
Footballguy
Agreed.
In my view, the WORST messaging of this whole thing has been around the antibodies. The more I think about it, the more angry I get at how it was handled.
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cheeseypoof
Footballguy
Gawain
Footballguy
5-12 still on tap for Halloween timeframe?
NY Post ran a story on the 4th kid to die in his school district.
Would be awesome to get at least 1 of my 3 protected (wife got her 3rd today, I'm scheduled for tomorrow). Other two are 3 and 2, so likely a while for them.
NY Post ran a story on the 4th kid to die in his school district.
Would be awesome to get at least 1 of my 3 protected (wife got her 3rd today, I'm scheduled for tomorrow). Other two are 3 and 2, so likely a while for them.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
How are we going to have the kids vaxxed by Halloween? FDA doesn't meet on that until the week prior, and then you need CDC approval. Is Pfizer already shipping the reduced kids doses to pharmacies, doctor's offices, and mass vax sites?
Gawain
Footballguy
I don't know, which is why I listen to the people that do. If it's just a reduced dose, can only half (or some other percentage) of an adult dose be drawn and given?
Don Quixote
Footballguy
I've read that it will be separately packaged doses for kids, but they will be ready for when the green light is given. I'm expecting approval around first week of November.
ETA: Story here where I read that - https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/10/08/children-vaccines-distribution/
“Some large pediatric practices, for instance, had planned to pull child-sized doses from existing Pfizer-BioNTech vials for vaccination clinics and were surprised to learn this week that Pfizer is discouraging that. Pfizer spokesman Kit Longley said the company will be shipping separate pediatric vials, with unique labels and different color caps to distinguish those from the vials used for those 12 and older.“
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Nah best case is first dose before Halloween, fully vaxxed by Thanksgiving. More realistic is fully vaxxed by Christmas. Not sure if they’ve made the lower dosed vials but they haven’t shipped them yet.Leeroy Jenkins said:
The logics of getting them done will be a problem. Pharmacies are not the best places to get those kids vaccinated, so either pediatrician offices or doing vaccination events at schools are going to be the best bet. None of the options will be very efficient.
Zegras11
Footballguy
https://www.ktvb.com/article/news/local/208/idaho-nurse-covid-poem/277-0b194a58-27c3-4e4a-8d5b-b222fc559bfa?fbclid=IwAR0wGdduoB3_lDuwmpEsEIbafM4WOIsqMFk9EQLhPYv0RYdZsphlYSyl46Q
Poem by a cardiac nurse for St. Luke's Health System, Sara McDonald has seen the worst of the worst over the last year and a half.
By Sara McDonald
I am a COVID veteran
This is a different kind of war
A war some don’t believe in
A war some mock, a “hoax”
The trauma is real
The dying is real
Running down the halls one room after another
“put your mask back on”
“stop pulling on lines”
Mitts
“You have to keep your mask on”
“Your daughter is coming in the morning, don’t you want to see her?”
The goal is to keep that one alive
“long enough”
For his daughter to be here when they turn the oxygen off.
“Let’s just get him to morning.”
There's that name I will never forget
the first in a growing line,
they declined for a time the use of their O2 device
I had to take it
I gave it to another, “more likely to survive”
This one lives
That one dies
They all suffer
The look in their eyes
As they learn the rules of an unfamiliar game
From room air to nasal cannula
NC to oxymask
Non-rebreather
Highflo
Bipap
Max it out
“I can’t breathe!”
I know you can’t breathe
I know
“I know it’s uncomfortable,”
“I know it’s blasting air in your face.”
“I’ll gladly take it off, just do me a favor,
change your code status first.”
“I have a line of people waiting for that machine, if you aren’t going to keep it on”
“I need you to change your code status first”
“What else can be done?”
“Intubation is next”
That look on their face
“That’s where we are”
The look on their face
“That’s where you’re at now”
The look on their face
“This machine doesn’t go any higher”
“Intubation is next”
You don’t like that option
You didn’t realize
None of them realize
They would be so acutely aware
cognizant
oriented
at the moment facing that decision
I stand anxious,
waiting
I need them to make it faster
I realize what a cruel thing my impatience in this moment is, but
I need them to make it
faster
I have another one crumping three doors down
I am still not able to be more places than one, at any given time,
Much as I try
As if I want to share my time between two atrocious scenes
So?
“I want this off my face. It’s blasting me!”
“I can’t breathe!”
ok
“I need you to understand what will happen if I take that off.”
No sugar coating,
no lies,
no time for gentle deliveries
First you’ll panic, gasping for air
You’ll be agitated.
You’ll start pulling at lines, and thrashing about like a fish out of water
In this case, a fish suffocating at the bottom of an ocean of air,
Surrounded by it, yet out of reach
“WATER WATER EVERYWHERE, BUT NOT A DROP TO DRINK.”
The panic
We’ll hold onto you,
Mitts if we must
keep you from hurting yourself on equipment
manage self-damage
You’ll struggle
You’ll ask for the equipment back, but it’s already been cleaned,
passed onto the next
You’ll grow tired
You’ll thrash less
You’ll stop talking
You’ll shift to a soft blue hue
You’ll fall asleep,
so tired,
just a rest
The blue will deepen
You’re not done, but you’re holding still,
Onto the next
Someone else is crashing
Thrashing
Pulling on lines
“Take slow deep breaths”
“Keep them slow”
“Try not to panic” (are you telling them, or yourself?)
“Try not to panic. Take some slow deep breaths.”
Stable
Back to the previous room
Agonal breathing, sporadic, gasp
A deeper blue
They’re still alive
On to the next…
On to the next…
On to the next…
On to the next, until morning
We just have to make it ‘til morning
We just have to make it, while mourning
We just have to make it, still mourning
We just have to make it
Onto the next
Poem by a cardiac nurse for St. Luke's Health System, Sara McDonald has seen the worst of the worst over the last year and a half.
By Sara McDonald
I am a COVID veteran
This is a different kind of war
A war some don’t believe in
A war some mock, a “hoax”
The trauma is real
The dying is real
Running down the halls one room after another
“put your mask back on”
“stop pulling on lines”
Mitts
“You have to keep your mask on”
“Your daughter is coming in the morning, don’t you want to see her?”
The goal is to keep that one alive
“long enough”
For his daughter to be here when they turn the oxygen off.
“Let’s just get him to morning.”
There's that name I will never forget
the first in a growing line,
they declined for a time the use of their O2 device
I had to take it
I gave it to another, “more likely to survive”
This one lives
That one dies
They all suffer
The look in their eyes
As they learn the rules of an unfamiliar game
From room air to nasal cannula
NC to oxymask
Non-rebreather
Highflo
Bipap
Max it out
“I can’t breathe!”
I know you can’t breathe
I know
“I know it’s uncomfortable,”
“I know it’s blasting air in your face.”
“I’ll gladly take it off, just do me a favor,
change your code status first.”
“I have a line of people waiting for that machine, if you aren’t going to keep it on”
“I need you to change your code status first”
“What else can be done?”
“Intubation is next”
That look on their face
“That’s where we are”
The look on their face
“That’s where you’re at now”
The look on their face
“This machine doesn’t go any higher”
“Intubation is next”
You don’t like that option
You didn’t realize
None of them realize
They would be so acutely aware
cognizant
oriented
at the moment facing that decision
I stand anxious,
waiting
I need them to make it faster
I realize what a cruel thing my impatience in this moment is, but
I need them to make it
faster
I have another one crumping three doors down
I am still not able to be more places than one, at any given time,
Much as I try
As if I want to share my time between two atrocious scenes
So?
“I want this off my face. It’s blasting me!”
“I can’t breathe!”
ok
“I need you to understand what will happen if I take that off.”
No sugar coating,
no lies,
no time for gentle deliveries
First you’ll panic, gasping for air
You’ll be agitated.
You’ll start pulling at lines, and thrashing about like a fish out of water
In this case, a fish suffocating at the bottom of an ocean of air,
Surrounded by it, yet out of reach
“WATER WATER EVERYWHERE, BUT NOT A DROP TO DRINK.”
The panic
We’ll hold onto you,
Mitts if we must
keep you from hurting yourself on equipment
manage self-damage
You’ll struggle
You’ll ask for the equipment back, but it’s already been cleaned,
passed onto the next
You’ll grow tired
You’ll thrash less
You’ll stop talking
You’ll shift to a soft blue hue
You’ll fall asleep,
so tired,
just a rest
The blue will deepen
You’re not done, but you’re holding still,
Onto the next
Someone else is crashing
Thrashing
Pulling on lines
“Take slow deep breaths”
“Keep them slow”
“Try not to panic” (are you telling them, or yourself?)
“Try not to panic. Take some slow deep breaths.”
Stable
Back to the previous room
Agonal breathing, sporadic, gasp
A deeper blue
They’re still alive
On to the next…
On to the next…
On to the next…
On to the next, until morning
We just have to make it ‘til morning
We just have to make it, while mourning
We just have to make it, still mourning
We just have to make it
Onto the next
Terminalxylem
Footballguy
Nice summary of recent studies assessing the durability of vaccine-induced immunity:
Agree with the author. I got boosted ~8 months after completing my initial Pfizer series, and think preventing infection/transmission is a worthwhile goal in its own right, though it needs to be balanced with worldwide vaccine distribution. I'm also much more concerned with long-term covid adverse effects than those from the vaccine.
beer 30
Footballguy
Rogan had Sanjay Gupta on yesterday to discuss everything discussed in this thread, only about 45 min into a 3 hour podcast but it's been interesting so far.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/6rAgS1KiUvLRNP4HfUePpA?si=AZnzUSSySRy4utX4N0NZcQ&dl_branch=1
https://open.spotify.com/episode/6rAgS1KiUvLRNP4HfUePpA?si=AZnzUSSySRy4utX4N0NZcQ&dl_branch=1
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Why do people listen to Joe Rogan? He hosted freakin Fear Factor and was not a good standup comedian. But now has some crazy following.
beer 30
Footballguy
In the past he's had some quality guests on and had some really good discussions with them. He's gone off the rails with the COVID/vaccine stuff but prior to, he was an entertaining listen.
yak651
Footballguy
He reaffirms peoples beliefs and they can point to him as someone that is "well known" so believable
gianmarco
Footballguy
Got my Covid booster along with the flu vaccine 2 nights ago. After working that night, got home yesterday morning and started to feel a little under the weather. Some ibuprofen, felt great until 6 hours later when it came back. Redose the ibuprofen, once again better although not perfect. By last night about 24 hours after the shots I felt miserable. Chills, aches, had to just get in bed and lie down. Was watching the soccer game and as soon as it was done was in bed with a heavy blanket. Then, at like 10pm, a switch flipped and I felt suddenly much better. Slept "ok", woke up this morning a little achy. Some more ibuprofen, then had about an hour period of just sweating, couldn't get comfortable. And now, completely back to normal. Minimal arm soreness but really mild.
Despite all this, never had a fever even though it felt like it with the chills and then the sweating.
So, in the end, glad I got it done and I'm even getting cell service in elevators now.
Despite all this, never had a fever even though it felt like it with the chills and then the sweating.
So, in the end, glad I got it done and I'm even getting cell service in elevators now.
cheeseypoof
Footballguy
Had my booster on Monday and flu shot today. Hoping the 3 days in between mitigates any such reaction. Just arm soreness from the booster, so looking good so far. Never recall an adverse reaction to the flu vaccine in previous years.
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
So Moderna booster "approved" via 19-0 vote. FDA and CDC still have to formally adopt the vote and recommendations though.
Two things I saw that I don't understand. The 50 microgram booster apparently narrowly fails an "FDA requirement" of a 4-fold increased immune response, HOWEVER, it causes a 42-fold increase in antibodies against Delta. What means this?
As an obese (just make it over the BMI!) 43yr old -- should I get this? I am leaning strongly yes.
Two things I saw that I don't understand. The 50 microgram booster apparently narrowly fails an "FDA requirement" of a 4-fold increased immune response, HOWEVER, it causes a 42-fold increase in antibodies against Delta. What means this?
As an obese (just make it over the BMI!) 43yr old -- should I get this? I am leaning strongly yes.
ignatiusjreilly
Footballguy
Got my Pfizer booster yesterday (second shot was in late March). Made an appointment online at Walgreen's. Told a white lie on the form about working in a high-risk environment (I'm still WFH).
No major reaction. Arm is the tiniest bit sore. I feel tired, but that's mostly because I stayed up too late last night (see the Bedtime Procrastination thread I started elsewhere in the FFA).
Definitely feel a lot better about the Dolphins game I'm going to next weekend.
No major reaction. Arm is the tiniest bit sore. I feel tired, but that's mostly because I stayed up too late last night (see the Bedtime Procrastination thread I started elsewhere in the FFA).
Definitely feel a lot better about the Dolphins game I'm going to next weekend.
Can’t really answer your question but from some of the discussion I’ve read, the data wasn’t very compelling. Moderna produces lasting protection without a booster but they’re going to approve the booster anyway because Pfizer was already approved. It’s dumb.
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
beer 30
Footballguy
And this is part of the problem. Just tell people they don't need it if they don't need it. Don't approve it just because the kid down the street got approved.
I know it's not that simple but there is just a comedy of errors how the folks in charge are presenting solutions to this thing to the public.
![[icon]](/data/avatars/m/5/5167.jpg?1660313464){kind=avatar}
[icon]
Insoxicated
[icon]
Insoxicated
It's a massive boost in antibodies and while it's not really NEEDED for protection vs hospitalization/death.... it likely DOES bump the protection vs infection numbers back into the mid-high 90% range... which is a nice perk.
I got the full 100mcg Moderna boost over a month ago, so I'm guessing I've got antibodies coming out of my ####### ears at this point
[icon]
Insoxicated
https://www.news-medical.net/news/20211006/Moderna-COVID-vaccine-booster-dose-results-in-immune-memory.aspx
Excellent Breakdown of the actual Moderna Booster data, for those who want to see it.
Excellent Breakdown of the actual Moderna Booster data, for those who want to see it.
I’m fine with it, I just think how they are doing it is ridiculous. If this is the way you decide approval, why go through the dog and pony show. Now we get to deal with another week of confusing messaging where news stories are saying it’s approved but it will be another 7-10 days before we can actually give them in the pharmacy. If this is how they are going to do it, just have all the groups meet at once and approve boosters on everything including mix and match.It's a massive boost in antibodies and while it's not really NEEDED for protection vs hospitalization/death.... it likely DOES bump the protection vs infection numbers back into the mid-high 90% range... which is a nice perk.
I got the full 100mcg Moderna boost over a month ago, so I'm guessing I've got antibodies coming out of my ####### ears at this point
Mix and match is another thing. The data appears clear that they are beneficial and might be better than a J&J booster but probably won’t get approved because Moderna/Pfizer haven’t applied for approval.
[icon]
Insoxicated
Understood and agree.
Regarding Mix and Match... IMO if I had gotten J&J before, I would 100% boost with Moderna (or Pfizer)
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Got my Pfizer booster today. Kind of hoping I feel worse this time than last two times so I know my body is fighting it. I've never had the greatest immune system so was really curious what my antibody levels are/were.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
This approach still seems like an absolute no-brainer to me. We know that the vaccines are safe, including boosters. So if an adult wants to get a booster, just let them get one. The FDA and whoever else should feel free to wade in with a recommendation, but there's no good justification for having the FDA be a gatekeeper when there are no serious consumer safety issues at play.Biff84 said:
