World Leader draft (1 Viewer)

[John Maddens Lunchbox]

Where are Golda Meir, Daw Aung San Suu Kyi , Mother Theresa, Margaret Thatcher, Marie Curie, Benazir Bhutto, Eleanor Rooselvelt, Cory Aquino, Imelda Marcos even?Here's a whole bunch of them

There's a striking interplay between women's spiritual and political leadership, especially in many indigenous societies. I'm thinking of of the Evenki shaman Olga who was both chieftain and religious leader of her Siberian village about a century ago, and the machis of Chile, shamanic priestesses who are deeply involved in the Mapuche sovereignty effort. But this overlap occurs even in imperial contexts, as when the aged mikogami Pimiko was chosen as ruler to save Japan from a chaotic struggle for power in its early history. Another example would be the important role the Candomblé maes de santo have played in the African-Brazilian community since early modern times. Priestesses or diviners have often led liberation movements: Nehanda Nyakasikana in the Shona revolt against the English colonization, for example, and María Candelaria in the Maya uprising against the Spanish, and Toypurina in the Gabrieleño revolt in southern California. The old priestess Cécile Fatiman inaugurated the Haitian revolution against slavery in a Vodun ceremony in the Bois Caiman in 1791. Even earlier, the seeress Veleda was the guiding force behind the Batavian insurrection of tribal Europeans against Rome, and Dahia al-Kahina ("the priestess") led the Berber resistence to Arab conquest in 7th century North Africa. And Gudit Isat (Judith the Fire) who overthrew the Axumite empire in 10th century Ethiopia was remembered as a religious leader as well (usually Jewish, but some traditions cast her as a pagan).

Dude. The draft's not over yet.

You'll pick Ann Coulter.

 

[DCThunder]

QB-The Buddha Good

Established a religion with currently over 300 million followers.

QB-Pope Alexander VI Bad

Bought papacy, had numerous mistresses and children while "celebate" father of Lucriecia Borgia.

RB-Admiral Lord Horatio Nelson, RN Good

Greatest fighting admiral of the days of fighting sail. Victor at the Nile, Copehagen and Trafalgar

RB-Marshall Grigori Zhukov Bad

Field Marshall of the Red Army defeated the Wermacht at Stalingrad, Kursk, releived the Siege of Leningrad and pushed the Germas back into Berlin, capturing the city and ending WWII.

RB-Lt. Col. George Armstrong Custer

Lost Battle of Little Big Horn (aka Custers Last Stand) leading to the loss of all his men to Sitting Bull and Crazy Horse. Last words are supposed to have been: Where did all these ####### Indians come from?????

WR-Emperor Caesar Augustus Good

First Emperor of Rome and undisputed ruler of the known world.

WR-President Ronald Reagan Good

40th President of the US, won the Cold War by defeating the Soviet Union, Established moral force for good.

WR Maximillien Robespierre Bad

Led the Committee of Public Saftey during the French Revolution sending many to the guillotine until he himself was executed.

WR Moctezuma II Bad

Leader of the Aztecs until defeated by Cortes and other Spanish invaders.

K- Queen Victoria Good

Queen of the United Kingdom and ruler of the British Empire at its height of military, scientific and economic power.

 

[scoobygang]

2.07 Catherine the GreatIf you like your monarchs to indulge in bestiality then she's your woman. Spent more time getting screwed than doing anything, which is how both of the aforementioned led to her demise.A death truly befitting an idiot monarch

You realize the whole horse thing never happened, right?Kind of hard to take your commentary seriously when you repeat the oldest urban legend in history. And criticize Elizabeth for not providing an heir and then complain that it's all that Victoria did.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

So, it's PatsFan's turn, right?

 

[MelvinTScupper]

Colonel and Andy, go ahead and post your picks

 

[MelvinTScupper]

2.07 Catherine the GreatIf you like your monarchs to indulge in bestiality then she's your woman. Spent more time getting screwed than doing anything, which is how both of the aforementioned led to her demise.A death truly befitting an idiot monarch

You realize the whole horse thing never happened, right?Kind of hard to take your commentary seriously when you repeat the oldest urban legend in history. And criticize Elizabeth for not providing an heir and then complain that it's all that Victoria did.

so, she just walked nude? :rotflmao:

 

[tri-man 47]

2.07 Catherine the Great

If you like your monarchs to indulge in bestiality then she's your woman. Spent more time getting screwed than doing anything, which is how both of the aforementioned led to her demise.

A death truly befitting an idiot monarch

You realize the whole horse thing never happened, right?Kind of hard to take your commentary seriously when you repeat the oldest urban legend in history. And criticize Elizabeth for not providing an heir and then complain that it's all that Victoria did.

Thank you, scooby. And as I said in the original Catherine post - she's tappable.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

10.11 "Bloody" Mary I (1516-1558)

K - Female - Awful

Queen Mary was the first woman to be crowned Queen of England in her own right. Her reign was brief and troubled. Her marriage to Prince Philip of Spain provoked Parliamentary dissent and armed rebellion; the Spanish alliance later drew England into a disastrous war with France, ending with the loss of Calais - England's last French territory.

Her religious intolerance is legendary. In 37 years Henry VIII had killed 90 heretics, Catholic and Protestant, burned at the stake; in four years Mary burned nearly 300 Protestants. Victims included blind men, pregnant women and Thomas Cranmer, Henry's Archbishop of Canterbury, who recanted his Protestantism seven times but reaffirmed it before his execution. The repression created a Protestant resistance which grew more resolute as the burnings continued. Protestants increasingly looked forward to the accession of Princess Elizabeth.

She dealt equally harshly with the Irish. She confiscated lands belonging to the O'Moores and the O'Connors in counties Laois and Offaly, renaming them Queen's County and King's County in honour of herself and her husband. The dispossessed chieftains waged a guerrilla war against the English settlements. Under the pretext of holding a peace conference with them, the English invited the O'Moores and the O'Connors to Mullaghmast where they had them and their families treacherously murdered.

Several of England's leading Protestant bishops were tortured and burned at the stake as heretics, including John Hooper, Nicholas Ridley, and Hugh Latimer. Even Thomas Cranmer, who had been Archbishop of Canterbury under Henry and Edward, was burned at the stake as a heretic. Over three hundred Protestants died in the Marian persecutions, and eight hundred more fled to Germany and Switzerland.

Mary died, childless, in 1558; she was 42. She had caused civil war. She had long lost the popular support which monarchs now needed. Granted a longer reign and an heir, she might have succeeded in integrating England into the Catholic Church and a Catholic empire; more probably, she would have made the country ungovernable. One of, if not the, worst monarchs ever.

 

[scoobygang]

Thank you, scooby.

And as I said in the original Catherine post - she's tappable.

For those that care:

The simple answer to your question is no, the rumor is not true. However, that won't stop us from repeating the rumor, to wit: that Catherine the Great, empress of Russia in the latter part of the 18th century, was crushed to death when attendants lost their grip on ropes supporting a horse that was being lowered on her for, ah, sexual purposes. This is without doubt the most outrageous story I heard during my entire college career, which is when you usually come across these historical tidbits.

The boring truth is this: Catherine the Great died of a stroke while sitting on the commode in the palace at St. Petersburg. Another less commonly circulated rumor has it that Catherine was so grossly fat (true in itself) that she broke the commode and died of blood loss from resultant injuries, but this is regarded as a fabrication also.

The story about Catherine's alleged yen for horses probably has its roots in the fact that she had an active and unusually public sex life. She had numerous lovers throughout her long reign, one of whom, Grigori Potemkin, procured young men for her after their own relationship cooled. The lucky stud would be "tested" by one of Catherine's ladies-in-waiting, and if he showed promise he would be appointed adjutant general, or something along those lines, and spend a couple soft years performing as required.

Catherine developed a colorful reputation among the courts of Europe on account of this system. She had lots of enemies, any of whom might have embellished on the already randy truth and come up with the horse story. There is some thought that Polish emigres might have invented it after her death to discredit her and the Russians in general, Poland having fared badly at the hands of Russian armies during her reign.

--CECIL ADAMS

 

[Yankee23Fan]

So, the Polish get beaten militarily, and all they come back with is "Your leader bangs horses?"No wonder they are the butt of international jokes.

 

[tri-man 47]

So, the Polish get beaten militarily, and all they come back with is "Your leader bangs horses?"No wonder they are the butt of international jokes.

But there was that Hollywood madame who wrote a book thirty years ago, and I recall reading her stories of mutually getting off with a dog ...

 

[John Maddens Lunchbox]

2.07 Catherine the GreatIf you like your monarchs to indulge in bestiality then she's your woman. Spent more time getting screwed than doing anything, which is how both of the aforementioned led to her demise.A death truly befitting an idiot monarch

You realize the whole horse thing never happened, right?Kind of hard to take your commentary seriously when you repeat the oldest urban legend in history. And criticize Elizabeth for not providing an heir and then complain that it's all that Victoria did.

I've read a few historical source that indicates this did happen and many that it didn't. Of course a lot have to be PG, so it's not going to be mentioned in most school history books. If it is false, it's a long held rumor that shouldn't have lasted for over 200 years. I am not ruling out the possibility that it didn't happen, more so I remain unconvinced it didn't 1 or 2 heirs is nice, but 9 of the little ####ers. The current royal family descend from BOTH sides (ie Queen Elizabeth AND Prince Philip) of Queen Victorias offspring, but then so does half of Europe including Krazy Kaiser Wilhelms gangProviding heirs is one thing, but to spend most of your LONG reign secluded away (Mourning, Copulating or birthing) is not exactly a hands on monarch.

 

[John Maddens Lunchbox]

See, everyone focuses on the salacious.Don't worry about the rest.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

QB - Lao Tzu - Religious - Good

Author of the Tao Te Ching (also known as the Dao) and founder of Taoism, which currently has about 200 million followers. Taoism, along with Buddhism and Confucianism, became one of the three great religions of China.

QB - Zoroaster - Religious - Good

Ancient Persian prophet who founded Zoroastrianism, the dominant world religion during the Persian empires and thus the most powerful world religion at the time of Jesus. Without his impact, Judaism would be unrecognizable, and Christianity would probably have never existed.

RB - Francisco Pizarro – Military - Evil

Spanish explorer and conqueror who defeated the Inca Empire with less than two hundred men, claimng most of South America for Spain. Conquered the largest amount of territory of any military leader and delivered the most riches to his country with the smallest expenditure of men and resources.

RB - Cyrus the Great - Military - Good

Founder of the Persian Empire, overthrew three great empires (Medes, Lydians, and Babylonians), and united the ancient Middle East into a single state stretching from India to the Mediterranean Sea. Cyrus' military victories eventually put him in possession of the largest empire in the world at that time.

RB - Heinrich Himmler - Military - Most Evil

Founder of the Gestapo, SS, and Waffen SS. The Waffen SS followed the German Army into the Soviet Union where they had the responsibility of murdering Jews, gypsies, communists and partisans. Himmler also presided over the concentration camps, exterminating 11 million people.

WR - Joseph Stalin - Political - Evil

Worst killer in the history of the world. Estimated 51 million un-natural deaths attributable to Stalin.

WR - George Washington - Political - Good

The cornerstone upon which the United States of America, the most powerful nation in the history of the world, was built.

WR - Constantine the Great - Political - Good

The most important emperor of Late Antiquity. Reunited the empire under one emperor and laid the foundations of post-classical European civilization. Legalization of Christianity and foundation of a 'New Rome' at Byzantium rank among the most momentous decisions ever made by a European ruler. Could have claimed the title of "the Great" on his military achievements alone.

WR - Ayatullah Ruhollah Khomeini – Political – Evil

Khomeini overthrew the Shah of Iran's regime and established an Islamo-fascist religious government. Consolidating his rule, had thousands killed while stamping out a rebellion of the secular left. His provocations of Iraq in 1980 helped start a war that lasted eight years, at the cost of a million lives.

K - "Bloody" Mary I - Female - Awful

Queen Mary was the first woman to be crowned Queen of England in her own right. Religiously intolerant, burning 300 Protestants at the stake. Caused civil war in England.

 

[DCThunder]

How can Himmler be Most Evil and Stalin be merely Evil? Seems a bit inconsistent or backward to me. Should they both be Most Evil?

 

[Gator Shawn]

9:06 Elisabeth BathoryKilled just over 600 women big deal.

Yes, by her own hand and then bathed in their blood. Don't find something sinister about that?We should have stuck with Evil or Worst..but not both. Is Erzebeth Bathory MORE evil than Catherine was an EFFECTIVE ruler? That's really tough to discern.

 

[tri-man 47]

In my mind, we'll judge on their effect on world history, their notoriety, and the creativeness of the pick. I was going to look over the picks this weekend and make some assessments.

 

[Patsfan2722]

10.9 - Political - Evil - Louis XIV

I had another pick ready but upon reading further, this guy did some pretty f-d up stuff!



LOUIS XIV, King of France, born at St. Germain-en-Laye, September 16th 1638, succeeded his father Louis XIII, in 1643. His mother, Anne of Austria, became regent, and Mazarin her minister. During the King's minority, the discontented nobles, encouraged by Spain, sought to shake off the authority of the Crown, and the civil wars of the Fronde arose. Peace was concluded in 1659, and in the following year Louis married the Infanta Marie Theresa, a princess possessing neither beauty nor other attractive qualities. Little was expected from the young King; his education had been neglected and his conduct was dissolute; but on Mazarin's death in 1661, he suddenly assumed the reins of government, and from that time forth carried into effect a political theory of pure despotism. His famous saying, "L'etat c'est moi," (I am the state), expressed the principle to which everything was accommodated. He had a cool and clear head, with much dignity and amenity of manners, great activity and perseverance. The distress caused by the religious wars had created throughout France a longing for repose, which was favorable to his assumption of absolute power. He was ably supported by his ministers. The wonderful talents of Colbert restored prosperity to the ruined finances of the country, and provided the means of war; while Louvois applied these means in raising and sending to the field armies more thoroughly equipped than any others of that age.

On the death of Philip IV of Spain, Louis, as his son-in-law, set up a claim to part of the Spanish Netherlands; and in 1667, accompanied by Turenne, he crossed the frontier with a powerful army, and took many places, and made himself master of that part of Flanders since known as French Flanders, and of the whole of Franche Comte. The triple alliance between England, the States-general and Sweden-arrested his career of conquest. The treaty of Aix-la-Chapelle (1668), forced him to surrender Franche Comte. He vowed revenge against the States-general, strengthened himself by German alliances, and purchased with money the friendship of Charles II of England. He seized Lorraine in 1670; and in 1672, again entered the Netherlands with Conde and Turenne, conquered half the country in-six weeks and left the Duke of Luxembourg to lay it waste. The States-general formed an alliance with Spain and the Emperor, but Louis made himself master of ten cities of the Empire in Alsace; and in the spring of 1674, took the field with three great armies, of which he commanded one in person, Conde another, and Turenne a third. Victory attended his arms; and notwithstanding the death of Turenne, and the retirement of the Prince of Conde from active service, he continued in subsequent years, along with the Duke of Orleans, to extend his conquests in the Netherlands, where by his orders the country was fearfully desolated. The peace of Nimeguen, in 1678, left him in possession of many of his conquests.

Louis had now reached the zenith of his career. All Europe feared him; his own nation had been brought by tyranny, skillfully managed, to regard him with humility, admiring and obeying; all remnants of political independence had been swept away; no assemblies of the States or the notables were held; the nobles had lost both the desire and the ability to assert political power. The court was the very heart of the political and national life of France, and there the utmost splendor was maintained, and a system of etiquette was established, which was a sort of perpetual worship of the King.

It was a serious thing for France and the world, when Louis fell under the control of his mistress, the Marquise de Maintenon, whom he married in a half private manner in 1685, and who was herself governed by the Jesuits. One of the first effects of this change was the adoption of severe measures against the Protestants. When it was reported to Louis that his troops had converted all the heretics, he revoked the Edict of Nantes, in 1685, and then ensued a bloody persecution; whilst more than half a million of the best and most industrious inhabitants of France fled, carrying their skill and industry to other lands.

The Elector of the Palatinate having died in 1685, and left his sister, the Duchess of Orleans, heiress of all his movable property, Louis claimed for her also all the allodial lands; and from this and other causes arose a new European war. A French army invaded the Palatinate, Baden, Wurtemburg and Treves in 1688. The war waged for years on a great scale and with various success; and after the French had gained, under Luxembourg, in 1693, the battle of Neerwinden, it was found the means of waging war were very much exhausted, and Louis concluded the peace of Ryswick, on the 20th of September 1697.

When the death of Charles II of Spain took place November 1st 1700, it was found that Louis had obtained his signature to a will, by which he left all his dominions to one of the grandsons of his sister, who had been Louis' queen. Louis supported to the utmost the claims of his grandson (Philip V), whilst the Emperor Leopold supported that of his son, afterwards the Emperor Charles IV. But the power of France was now weakened, and the war had to be maintained both on the side of the Netherlands and of Italy. One bloody defeat followed another; Marlborough was victorious in the Low Couutries, and Prince Eugene in Italy. On the 11th of April 1713, peace was concluded at Utrecht, the French prince obtaining the Spanish throne but France sacrificing valuable colonies. A terrible fermentation now prevailed in France, and the country was almost completely ruined; but the monarch mantained to the last an unbending despotism. He died after a short illness, September 1st 1717. The reign of Louis XIV is regarded as the Augustan age of French literature and art, and it can hardly be doubted that France has never since produced poets like Corneille and Racine in tragedy, or Moliere in comedy; satirists like Boileau, or divines like Bossuet, Fenelon, Bourdaloue and Massillon.

 

[The_Colonel]

10.10 WR - Political - Evil - Xerxes (Khashayar Shah) 520-465 BCEWhile he may represent a political hero in the Persian tradition of Iran, his leadership of his father's, Darius the Great, Persian empire led to the sacking of Athens and burning of the Acropolis following the combined land and sea invasion of Greece. His invasion of Greece followed the harsh suppression of revolt in Egypt and Babylon. Finally defeated by the Greeks in 479, Xerxes withdrew into his capital, sinking into deeper and deeper exercises in self-enjoyment, draining away the empire's resources and reputation. He was assassinated in 465, but succeeded by his son Artaxerxes. Unfortunately, the instability that began during Xerxes reign continued into Artaxerxes reign and created the foundation of later weakness in the Persian emperor at-large.

 

[tri-man 47]

And we're complete! Let the trash talking/boasting begin. MTS will designate more formal voting.

 

[Yankee23Fan]

 

[bucs4life_99]

Sweet draft everyone, this has to be one of the best threads in the FFA. I'm pretty surprised Simon Bolivar didn't go though...

 

[tri-man 47]

That's one point - we should step back and see who remains on the board unselected. I'd throw out Fidel Castro and Mussolini off the top of my head.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

That's one point - we should step back and see who remains on the board unselected. I'd throw out Fidel Castro and Mussolini off the top of my head.

Che GuavaraFidel CastroEvery remaining US PresidentSimon BolivarKruschevColonel KlinkGeneral Burchhalter

 

[tri-man 47]

I've analyzed the draft, and have picked a winner (and it's not me). Are we ready to start picking who's best, or are we going to do it in a more formal, poll-like way? One option would be to have us pick our top four (or top ten?) and put them in a formal poll for the FFA board.But I'd be happy to post my pick, FWIW.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

How can Himmler be Most Evil and Stalin be merely Evil? Seems a bit inconsistent or backward to me. Should they both be Most Evil?

Good point. I'd call them 2 of the 3 most evil men that ever lived (Hitler the other).Himmler was more "hands on" though. Hiter's original plan was to simply deport the Jews. Himmler, with others, convinced him to exterminate them instead. He was in charge of carrying out what Hitler outlined.

Both very, very evil and are sure to be in the line of succession in hell.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

Jan 1 - your kidding, right?

you're

 

[Yankee23Fan]

you're

I do that a lot.

 

[Orange Crush]

That's one point - we should step back and see who remains on the board unselected. I'd throw out Fidel Castro and Mussolini off the top of my head.

I still want to put together an Undrafted Free Agent squad, but it isn't going to be anywhere near as good as I had originally thought. Halfway through the draft I was convinced people like Vlad Dracula, Bloody Mary, Erzsebeth Bathony, Robespierre, Rashid al-Din Sinan (aka Hassan bin Saba), Horatio Lord Nelson, Duke of Wellington, etc., etc., were all going to be there for me. While there are a ton of excellent military leaders, and a few good (but not great) political leaders left, there is a serious void in QBs and Ks.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

actually, rather than have some gay poll, I think we should make some commentary, and just let it die.I think I would put Dufresne's team vs Yankee's team in the finals, with Dufresne's team winning (honestly, it came down to the Kicker, and Yankee, your's sucked. The spoiler might have been Gator Shawn.....his squad was solid, front to back. Dufresne had a couple soft spots, but his monster picks were fantastic, imho.Scooby brought more thought and ingenuity to the draft than anyone else.Kovax would lose in the first round, but went with his gut, and I admire that.The rest of us drafted well, but either draft position or poor evil/good mgmt (both for me) screwed us from having a shot at the title. Since we're basing this all on history, we didn't have to worry about Jesus having a good season.....draft position was much more significant here.

 

[Gator Shawn]

I still want to put together an Undrafted Free Agent squad, but it isn't going to be anywhere near as good as I had originally thought. Halfway through the draft I was convinced people like Vlad Dracula, Bloody Mary, Erzsebeth Bathony, Robespierre, Rashid al-Din Sinan (aka Hassan bin Saba), Horatio Lord Nelson, Duke of Wellington, etc., etc., were all going to be there for me. While there are a ton of excellent military leaders, and a few good (but not great) political leaders left, there is a serious void in QBs and Ks.

There are loads of name GOOD people out there, but the problem now is finding significant EVIL people to draft.Mohammed Farah Aidid might be notorious enough. I nearly took him to play up the Blackhawk Down angle.

 

[scoobygang]

I still want to put together an Undrafted Free Agent squad, but it isn't going to be anywhere near as good as I had originally thought. Halfway through the draft I was convinced people like Vlad Dracula, Bloody Mary, Erzsebeth Bathony, Robespierre, Rashid al-Din Sinan (aka Hassan bin Saba), Horatio Lord Nelson, Duke of Wellington, etc., etc., were all going to be there for me. While there are a ton of excellent military leaders, and a few good (but not great) political leaders left, there is a serious void in QBs and Ks.

There are loads of name GOOD people out there, but the problem now is finding significant EVIL people to draft.Mohammed Farah Aidid might be notorious enough. I nearly took him to play up the Blackhawk Down angle.

I think you only have that problem if you convince yourself that "BAD" means "EVIL" and that evil is going to be judged by a body count.I had a couple of other BAD candidates left. I wanted to do a post on Edward II because he actually had a particlularly gruesome death that's NOT an urban legend. And I thought it would be interesting to talk about the response to homosexuality in leaders. And it would have let me rag on the historical inaccuracies in Braveheart some more.Shining Path turned me onto to Gaeseric, who was the Vandal who probably dealt the most damage to Rome. There's no evidence that he was particularly evil, but he never saw fit to build after he conquered, so he coud have been an interesting "BAD" choice.

 

[tri-man 47]

I put Yankee at #1. I rated each position from best (11 points) to worst (1 point) for each of us. Then I added a multiplier for the number of slots at each - so coming out on top of the religious group would be 22 points (11 x 2). This adds some distortion, in that it puts a priority on WR, then RB, then QB and finally puts little value on the K slot (which I drafted early). But this also rewards depth. It ended up with a lot of judgment calls, in part because not all the teams did a summary list yet and I wasn't going to go back and re-read the thread.As I said, Yankee came out first. His strong one-two punch at RB was reinforced with a solid late pick (Sherman). His evil x 2 selection at QB created in interesting duo, and strategically put him in an excellent position later in the draft. But I'd say he won it with a great run in rounds 5-8 with WR's Madison, Churchill, Ramses II, and Lenin. Andy's squad has been mentioned. I'll also acknowledge NC Commish: It's hard to beat ol' Adolph, and I like the QB duo (tho' MTS and I gave him MLK Jr!).I hurt myself by playing defensively with female picks: A second round pick of Catherine the Great to take her off the charts, with a similar move in round four with Cleopatra (should have taken theocratic Ramses II). But otherwise I was pleased with good depth throughout.What fun! I really enjoyed this, and actually learned a great deal.

 

[Gold Dragon]

That's one point - we should step back and see who remains on the board unselected. I'd throw out Fidel Castro and Mussolini off the top of my head.

A few guys that I thought would have been good picks were:Qin Shi Huangdi (259-210 BC) - Political Evil

In 246 BC Qin Ying Zheng, unified the Warring States of China through military conquest and declared himself the First Emperor of China (Shi Huangdi). His rule included such notable feats as unifying China under a single currency, written language and standardized units of measurement in addition to the construction of the Great Wall, his Terra Cotta Mausoleum and a network of canals and roads.

However, all his exploits came at the brutal and cruel expense of his people. Millions of convicts, peasants and "unpopular groups" died in the construction of the Great Wall and other projects. He maintained his rule with his philosphy of legalism that opposed the popular Confucian philosophy and he burned books along with live scholars to keep dissenters in line. Confucian writing and philosophy was nearly wiped out of existence during his rule.

His unpopularity by nobility and peasants alike lead to numerous assassination attempts which he successfully evaded. He was obsessed with immortality and sent hundreds of young men and women to search for the proverbial "fountain of youth". This obsession led to a lack of preparation for a successor and the eventual downfall of the Qin dynasty. However, the legacy he left behind would not easily be forgotten. The office of emperor would remain for two centuries until 1911 when the Kuomintang and the Communists entered the scene. And the Qin dynasty is still remembered to this day by the name China.

St. Paul of Tarsus (5-67 AD) - Religious Good

Aside from Jesus, Paul is the most influential person in Christian history. Raised as a devout Jewish Pharisee, Paul's youth was dedicated to the elimination of the growing sect of Chritianity. However, his miraculous conversion on the Road to Damascus turned Paul's life upside down and he began a ministry that aimed to spread Christianity throughout the Roman empire.

His missionary journeys resulted in the planting of churches throughout Asia Minor, Greece, Italy and the Mediterranian islands. He mentored key Christian leaders such as Timothy, Titus and the good doctor Luke. When conflict arose in the early church between Jewish Christians wanting to maintain traditional Jewish customs and gentile Christians with traditionallypagan customs, Paul was the spokesperson for the Gentile Christians and mediator to bring the two sides together.

His letters to various early churches, many written while under Roman arrest, became pivotal to Christian doctrine and 13 letters (half of the NT) attributed to Paul became accepted as biblical canon by 400 AD. Today, Paul's applications of Jewish law and Jesus's teachings to church function and Christian living are definitional to Christians and churches all over the world that make up the largest religion on the planet.

Osama bin Laden - Military Evil

 

[Stoneys]

This has been one fantastic draft. Although, I wouldn't mind seeing the abridged version with just the picks and their write-ups. Overall, Great job guys.

 

[Yankee23Fan]

Bored at work bump

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Andy Dufresne

QB-G Lao Tzu 4.11

QB-G Zoroaster 7.01

RB-E Francisco Pizarro 5.01

RB-G Cyrus the Great 6.11

RB-E Heinrich Himmler 9.01

WR-E Joseph Stalin 1.01

WR-G Gen George Washington 2.11

WR-G Constantine the Great 3.01

WR-E Ayatollah Khomeni 8.11

K -W Queen Mary I 10.11

DC Thunder

QB-G Buddha 2.05

QB-E Pope Alexander VI 9.07

RB-E Georgi Zhukov 8.05

RB-E General Gge. Custer 10.05

RM-G Lord Horatio Nelson 7.07

WR-G Ronald Reagan 1.07

WR-G Emperor Caesar Augustus 4.05

WR-B Maximilien Marie Isidore de Robespierre 5.07

WR-E King MOCTEZUMA II 6.05

K -G Queen Victoria 3.07

Gator Shawn

QB-G Confucius 3.06

QB-E Rasputin 7.06

RB-G Sun Tzu 4.06

RB-G William the Conqueror 5.06

RB-G Gen. Robert E. Lee 8.06

WR-G Ghandi 1.06

WR-E Emperor Hirohito 2.06

WR-E Vlad the Impaler Tepes 6.06

WR-E Emperor Nero Germanicus 10.06

K -E Elisabeth Bathory 9.06

Kovax

QB-G Moses 3.1

QB-E Anton Levay 6.02

RB-E Pol Pot 1.1

RB-E Heinz Guderian 8.02

RB-G Dwight Eisenhower 9.1

WR-G George W Bush 2.02

WR-G Slick Willy 5.1

WR-E Slobodan Milosovic 7.1

WR-G Mikhail Gorbachev 10.02

K -F Oprah Winfrey 4.02

MTS

QB-G Abraham 4.01

QB-E Reverend Jim Jones 7.11

RB-G Atilla the Hun 1.11

RB-G Gustavus Adolphus 5.11

RB-G George S. Patton, Jr. 6.01

WR-E Mao Tse Tung 2.01

WR-E Idi Amin 8.01

WR-E Tojo Hideki 9.11

WR-E Mohmmar Qadaffi 10.01

K -G Joan of Arc 3.11

NCCommish

QB-G Martin Luther 2.08

QB-G Martin Luther King, Jr. 8.08

RB-G Charlemagne 3.04

RB-E Tamerlane 4.08

RB-E Shaka Zulu 6.08

WR-E Hitler 1.04

WR-G FDR 7.04

WR-E King Léopold II of Belgium 9.04

WR-E Mohamed Suharto 10.08

K -G Evita Peron 5.04

PatsFan

QB-G Jesus Christ 1.03

QB-G Omar/Umar Caliphate 4.09

RB-E Ivan the Terrible 2.09

RB-E Vo Nguyen Giap 7.03

RB-E Pompey the Great 8.09

WR-G Dali Llama I 3.03

WR-G Hannibal 5.03

WR-G Thomas Jefferson 9.03

WR-E Louis XIV 10.09

K -E Hilary Clinton 6.09

The Colonel

QB-G The Prophet Muhammed 1.02

QB-E Aleister Crowley 3.02

RB-G Publiu Cornelius Scipio 4.1

RB-E Hernando Cortez 5.02

RB-G Col. William Donovan 9.02

WR-G King Oliver Cromwell 6.1

WR-E Robert Mugabe 7.02

WR-E Neville Chamberlain 8.1

WR-E Xerxes 10.1

K -G Madame Chiang Kai Shek 2.1

TriMan

QB-E Cleopatra 4.07

QB-G John Calvin 7.05

RB-G Alexander the Great 1.05

RB-G Suleyman 3.05

RB-E Geronimo 10.07

WR-E Saddam Hussein 5.05

WR-G the Duke of Wellington 6.07

WR-E Kim Il Sung 8.07

WR-E Yassir Arafat 9.05

K -G Catherine the Great 2.07

Yankee23fan

QB-E Tomás de Torquemada 3.08

QB-E Cardinal Armand Jean du Plessis de Richelieu 4.04

RB-G Julius Ceasar 1.08

RB-E Genghis Khan 2.04

RB-E General Wm. Sherman 10.04

WR-G James Madison 5.08

WR-G Winston Churchill 6.04

WR-G Pharaoh Ramesses II 7.08

WR-E Vladimir Lenin 8.04

K -G Iceni Queen Boudicca 9.08

Scoobygang

QB-E Pope Urban II 4.03

QB-E Rashid al Din Sinan 6.03

RB-G Saladin 3.09

RB-G Themistocles 5.09

RB-E William Walker 9.09

WR-G Napoleon 1.09

WR-G Teddy Roosevelt 7.09

WR-E Winnie Mandela 8.03

WR-E Indira Ghandi 10.03

K -G Queen Elizabeth I 2.03

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Everyone did very well in this draft. There is not much separation between the top and bottom teams. Here's my rankings.1. Andy Dufresne - Two FOUNDERS, not just adherents/promoters of religions. Three military leaders that subdued/destroyed Continents. Four political leaders with global, historical impact. The worst female monarch ever. Tough roster to beat.2. Yankee23fan - Yes, the religious guys were evil, but of questionable impact in the context of world history. Iceni who?3. Gator Shawn - Too bad the kicker didn't have more name recognition.4. MTS - Solid top to bottom, except for the imaginary guy and the quasi-diet-coke-of-evil-lite religious leader.5. TriMan - Tough to call Geronimo evil. Arafat is of limited impact in world history.6. DC Thunder - The guy's my personal hero, but you can't take Reagan in the first. Custer and Moctezuma are "blah" picks.7. NCCommish - Peron and King Jr. aren't enough to bump up this otherwise solid roster.8. Scoobygang - Hurt by the Mandela/Ghandi/Walker picks.9. PatsFan - The Hilary selection cancels out the Christ pick. So-so with the rest.10. The Colonel - Crowley? Mugabe? Muhammed before Christ?11. Kovax - Killed by the Bush/Clinton/Winfrey/Levay picks.

 

[John Maddens Lunchbox]

You want rankings, I'll give you rankingsBest QBs PatsfanWorst QBs Tri Man, Cleopatra is out of position and useless in any positionBest RBsYankee23Fans, got Jamal Lewis and Ahman Green whilst some of the others were grabbing Ron Dayne and Damien AndersonWorst RBs (tie) DC Thunder. Horatio Nelson is your starter Andy Dufresne. Nothing special hereBest WRsAndy Dufresne - Stalin and Washington, sensational starters and strong benchWorst WRsKovax - GWB, Clinton, Milosevic are all farce picks. His best pick is his 4th one, Gorbachev.Best K - The Colonel. I have a feeling some of the best remained undrafted.Worst K - NCCommish. Inspired a musical, big freakin deal.Overall1 - Yankee23Fan. Strong across the board. Not a runaway winner, but is the favorite2 - NCCommish - A few weak spots, but solid line up that will be hard to beat3 - Gator Shawn - Bloody good line up. Research & knowledge goes a long way. The Danger to the top 24 - Andy Dufresne - Depending on his WRs to pull him out of the ####, they should do it more often than not.5 - Patsfan - Hillary Clinton pick cost him a spot or 2. Otherwise strong in the main categories6 - Melvin T Scupper - A nice unit who should win more than they lose, but lack the killer punch7 - The Colonel - Played it safe instead of going for the home run8 - Scoobygang - If a team is to emerge from the bottom it will be this one. 3 women is going to hurt however.9 - Tri Man - Too many weak spots to put up a concerted effort. Has a few keepers however.10 - DC Thunder - 2 of the first 3 picks are sleepers at best. Has depth, but no studs.11 - Kovax. Oprah Winfrey, W and Clinton on roster. Nuff said.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Best RBsYankee23Fans, got Jamal Lewis and Ahman Green whilst some of the others were grabbing Ron Dayne and Damien AndersonWorst RBs (tie) DC Thunder. Horatio Nelson is your starter Andy Dufresne. Nothing special here

You gotta be kidding me. Did you read the writeups?Cyrus created the Persian empire after overthrowing THREE great empires (Medes, Lydians, and Babylonians). Cyrus' military victories eventually put him in possession of the largest empire in the world at that time. Pizzaro conquered an entire continent with less people than Reg has alias'.Himmler. Ever read what the Waffen SS did in the USSR? Or what happened in the concentration camps?What's not special about them?

 

[DCThunder]

Don't worry, Andy. Anybody who would give a to Lord Nelson, the prototypical fighting sailor and the man who revolutionized naval warfare isn't worth listening to.That said, I don't think the Pizzaro pick is anything special, especially since he came up to the Big Show and couldn't hit the curveball.

 

[John Maddens Lunchbox]

You guys are precious aren't you.Sure most of the 'leaders' drafted have had impacts, but it's all about value.Some people didn't use VBD or just picked names out their ####.I could make a case for Carrot Top being include as a religious leader, but that doesn't mean a) he should be drafted and b) drafted in an appropriate slot. What you need is more opinion. Are you disappointed in your draft?Were there better picks that you let sail by through lack of knowledge or failing to take chances?Would you draft differently if given the chance to start again?The lack of a scoring criteria makes this a difficult draft to evaluate properly.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

You guys are precious aren't you.Sure most of the 'leaders' drafted have had impacts, but it's all about value.Some people didn't use VBD or just picked names out their ####.

You mean like Iceni Queen Boudicca?

I could make a case for Carrot Top being include as a religious leader, but that doesn't mean a) he should be drafted and b) drafted in an appropriate slot.

No you couldn't.

What you need is more opinion. Are you disappointed in your draft?Were there better picks that you let sail by through lack of knowledge or failing to take chances?Would you draft differently if given the chance to start again?

No. No. And No.

The lack of a scoring criteria makes this a difficult draft to evaluate properly.

Aye. There's the rub. You're right about that at least.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

The lack of a scoring criteria makes this a difficult draft to evaluate properly.

this is my favorite part.GDB bitter Australians who don't know what a leader is (except for MacArthur).

 

[John Maddens Lunchbox]

For some reason I can't quote your other post.AT least Boadicea (There are about 6 acceptable spelling variations) Took on and defeated the mightiest empire the world has ever seen.Name another woman drafted who can come even close to that?

 

[Andy Dufresne]

AT least Boadicea (There are about 6 acceptable spelling variations) Took on and defeated the mightiest empire the world has ever seen.

Defeated? She and her "forces" (read: mob) were massacred and the Iceni were persecuted mercilessly for many years after by the Romans.Great leader.

 

[scoobygang]

For some reason I can't quote your other post.AT least Boadicea (There are about 6 acceptable spelling variations) Took on and defeated the mightiest empire the world has ever seen.Name another woman drafted who can come even close to that?

No, she didn't.She had one very temporary victory over a garrison at the ###-end of the Roman Empire. She didn't liberate Britain from the Romans, and had no real lasting impact on the history of Britannia save as a cultural figure. Worthy of drafting? Sure. But she didn't do what you said she did, and coming on the heels of other statements you've made that just aren't historically accurate, you can see why some of us don't find your analysis to have a lot of value.

 

[John Maddens Lunchbox]

this is my favorite part.GDB bitter Australians who don't know what a leader is (except for MacArthur).

You attack the critic and not what other people drafted?You're my hero I didn't even pick on your lineupI know what a leader is better than you any day of the week.Most of the people dratfed in this are ####### leaders, it's just the degree in how successful they are that matters.If you want to get all precious about any criticism, then don't participate in a public draft

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Most of the people dratfed in this are ####### leaders, it's just the degree in how successful they are that matters.

Then why are my RB picks "nothing special"?

 

[John Maddens Lunchbox]

For some reason I can't quote your other post.AT least Boadicea (There are about 6 acceptable spelling variations) Took on and defeated the mightiest empire the world has ever seen.Name another woman drafted who can come even close to that?

No, she didn't.She had one very temporary victory over a garrison at the ###-end of the Roman Empire. She didn't liberate Britain from the Romans, and had no real lasting impact on the history of Britannia save as a cultural figure. Worthy of drafting? Sure. But she didn't do what you said she did, and coming on the heels of other statements you've made that just aren't historically accurate, you can see why some of us don't find your analysis to have a lot of value.

Since when is London the ### end of the Roman Empire?

Infuriated, Queen Boadicea -- described by one Roman historian as a tall, terrifying-looking woman with fierce eyes, a harsh voice, and very long red hair -- became the leader of a violent uprising against Roman rule. The rebels destroyed London, Colchester, and other cities, slaughtering some 70,000 people.

Another precious drafter crying because I didn't praise his line up and agree with everything he says.Sure you can debate Catherine the Great, I'm fine with that.Please point out another inaccuracy I have uttered. I'm all ears