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World's Greatest Draft (1 Viewer)

While we're waiting, I wanted to open up a discussion that we really haven't enjoyed yet- the three giants of rock bands were selected in this draft. I don't want at the moment to compare them to other selections, but I do want to compare them to each other:

The Beatles

The Rolling Stones

Led Zeppelin

Most rock fans would agree that these three are at the very pinnacle of this form of music. I have often wondered which I like best, and it changes from time to time. Currently:

1. Stones

2. Beatles

3. Led Zeppelin

Here's how I see it: the Beatles have the strongest quality of music throughout their short career, and they are also probably the most innovative of the three (though this is arguable.) The Stones have the most quantity (obviously), but at their peak (I would say 1968-73) there has never been a better rock band. Zeppelin has the most sublime moments of any of the three, and they are also arguably the best live performers.

Ranking them:

Songwriting:

1. Beatles

2. Stones

3. Led Zeppelin

Lead guitar

1. Zeppelin

2. Stones

3. Beatles

Singing:

1. Beatles

2. Zeppelin

3. Stones

Thoughts?

 
timschochet said:
While we're waiting, I wanted to open up a discussion that we really haven't enjoyed yet- the three giants of rock bands were selected in this draft. I don't want at the moment to compare them to other selections, but I do want to compare them to each other:

The Beatles

The Rolling Stones

Led Zeppelin

Most rock fans would agree that these three are at the very pinnacle of this form of music. I have often wondered which I like best, and it changes from time to time. Currently:

1. Stones

2. Beatles

3. Led Zeppelin

Here's how I see it: the Beatles have the strongest quality of music throughout their short career, and they are also probably the most innovative of the three (though this is arguable.) The Stones have the most quantity (obviously), but at their peak (I would say 1968-73) there has never been a better rock band. Zeppelin has the most sublime moments of any of the three, and they are also arguably the best live performers.

Ranking them:

Songwriting:

1. Beatles

2. Stones

3. Led Zeppelin

Lead guitar

1. Zeppelin

2. Stones

3. Beatles

Singing:

1. Beatles

2. Zeppelin

3. Stones

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
How can you rank the Beatles #1 in two of the three categories with the Stones no higher than #2 in any of them, then rank the Stones higher? Or, are the rankings not connected?
 
timschochet said:
While we're waiting, I wanted to open up a discussion that we really haven't enjoyed yet- the three giants of rock bands were selected in this draft. I don't want at the moment to compare them to other selections, but I do want to compare them to each other:

The Beatles

The Rolling Stones

Led Zeppelin

Most rock fans would agree that these three are at the very pinnacle of this form of music. I have often wondered which I like best, and it changes from time to time. Currently:

1. Stones

2. Beatles

3. Led Zeppelin

Here's how I see it: the Beatles have the strongest quality of music throughout their short career, and they are also probably the most innovative of the three (though this is arguable.) The Stones have the most quantity (obviously), but at their peak (I would say 1968-73) there has never been a better rock band. Zeppelin has the most sublime moments of any of the three, and they are also arguably the best live performers.

Ranking them:

Songwriting:

1. Beatles

2. Stones

3. Led Zeppelin

Lead guitar

1. Zeppelin

2. Stones

3. Beatles

Singing:

1. Beatles

2. Zeppelin

3. Stones

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
I think the Beatles are by far the most innovative and influential, though I would rather listen to either of the other two, with Zep getting an edge. People don't realize how tame pop music was before the Beatles.
 
rodg12 said:
How can you rank the Beatles #1 in two of the three categories with the Stones no higher than #2 in any of them, then rank the Stones higher? Or, are the rankings not connected?
Click to expand...
No, that first ranking is just who I personally like the best- at the moment.
 
timschochet said:
rodg12 said:
How can you rank the Beatles #1 in two of the three categories with the Stones no higher than #2 in any of them, then rank the Stones higher? Or, are the rankings not connected?
Click to expand...
No, that first ranking is just who I personally like the best- at the moment.
Click to expand...
Gotcha. Personally, I'd rank them1. The Beatles2. Led Zepplin3. The StonesFor the purposes of this draft and the rankings here, I'd go1. The Beatles2. The Stones3. Led Zepplin
 
rodg12 said:
timschochet said:
rodg12 said:
How can you rank the Beatles #1 in two of the three categories with the Stones no higher than #2 in any of them, then rank the Stones higher? Or, are the rankings not connected?
Click to expand...
No, that first ranking is just who I personally like the best- at the moment.
Click to expand...
Gotcha. Personally, I'd rank them1. The Beatles2. Led Zepplin3. The StonesFor the purposes of this draft and the rankings here, I'd go1. The Beatles2. The Stones3. Led Zepplin
Click to expand...
Why do you think the Stones should be ranked higher than Zeppelin for the draft? Just curious.
 
I think Michelangelo is clearly the #1 artist/non painter. When this draft is over, I'm going to post my #2, provided this person has still not been selected.

 
timschochet said:
I think Michelangelo is clearly the #1 artist/non painter. When this draft is over, I'm going to post my #2, provided this person has still not been selected.
Click to expand...
I think I will also post:My top 5 military guy.My top 5 poet.My top ten novelist.My top 3 humanitarian. In fact, maybe I'll just post a whole draft list, and see if people think I could have won...
 
18.14 Maurice Pate, founder of UNICEF, Humanitarian

Maurice Pate (October 14, 1894 – January 19, 1965) was an American humanitarian and businessman. With (redacted), Pate co-founded the United Nations Children's Fund (UNICEF) in 1947 and served as its first executive director from 1947 until his death in 1965.

Talking about the United Nations, (redacted) Secretary-General, said, "The work of UNICEF is at the heart of the matter - and at the heart of UNICEF is Maurice Pate."[1] (Redacted) called Pate "the most effective human angel I know" when introducing Pate at a UNICEF dinner.[2] Pate was recognized worldwide for his efforts on behalf of children and hungry people.

...

Upon the outbreak of World War II in 1939, Pate led the Commission for Polish Relief, and later joined the American Red Cross as director of relief supplies for POWs in Asia and Europe.[5] He conducted food surveys with (redacted) in 1946 and 1947 – 38 countries in 76 days – and the two men planned UNICEF.[2] Pate joined UNICEF at its inception in January 1947. He agreed to serve as the director upon the condition that UNICEF serve the children of "ex-enemy countries," regardless of race or politics.

Initially, UNICEF was charged with combating the threats posed to children in Europe from disease and famine after World War II. The growing concern about child welfare and survival rates in developing countries, either from disease or starvation, led to the establishment of UNICEF as a continuing agency in 1953. Under Pate's leadership, UNICEF implemented programs to improve maternal and child health using low cost, preventive health care measures. Considerable progress was made to eradicate malaria, tuberculosis, whooping cough, and diphtheria. Vaccinations, breast feeding for children and rehydration therapy for diarrhea were emphasized to improve public health.

...

He declined a nomination for the Nobel Peace Prize in 1960 because he felt the contributions of the entire UNICEF organization should be recognized instead of one individual’s contribution. Thorn's note: shortly after his death, UNICEF was nominated for, and won, a Nobel Peace Prize as an organization.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited by a moderator:
timschochet said:
rodg12 said:
timschochet said:
rodg12 said:
How can you rank the Beatles #1 in two of the three categories with the Stones no higher than #2 in any of them, then rank the Stones higher? Or, are the rankings not connected?
Click to expand...
No, that first ranking is just who I personally like the best- at the moment.
Click to expand...
Gotcha. Personally, I'd rank them1. The Beatles2. Led Zepplin3. The StonesFor the purposes of this draft and the rankings here, I'd go1. The Beatles2. The Stones3. Led Zepplin
Click to expand...
Why do you think the Stones should be ranked higher than Zeppelin for the draft? Just curious.
Click to expand...
Mainly because I think their musical impact was longer-lasting. But I'm really splitting hairs to rank one above the other, honestly. I think The Beatles are clearly #1 and then The Stones and Zepplin are more like 2a and 2b. The Stones get a slight nod because they are still churning out music today while Zepplin was tragically finished in 1980.
 
Speaking of athletes who absolutely dominated their sport...

18.10 Lance Armstrong, Athlete

He won the Tour de France, one of the world's greatest events, 7 consecutive times in dominating fashion from 1999-2005. The feat is more impressive considering he came back from being diagnosed from testicular cancer that spread to other parts of the body prior to his run.

 
Cmon Yankee

Anyone want to take a PM so I dont slow it down. I really need to go work out so I have enough time to shower

 
This is what I have, please correct me if I'm wrong:

Skipped/owed picks:

18.01 Abrantes

18.02 Mister CIA

18.07 Usual21 - requested skip

18.08 John Maddens Lunchbox - requested autoskip

18.10 Big Rocks - timed out

18.12 Doug B - autoskip

18.15 Yankee23fan - Is OTC until 1:09 Eastern

8.16 Acer FC - is on deck

18.17 FUBAR - requested autoskip

18.18 Arsenal of Doom - is in the hole

18.19 Larry Boy

18.20 Mario Kart

19.01 Mario Kart

19.02 Larry Boy

19.03 Arsenal of Doom

19.04 FUBAR

19.05 Acer FC

19.06 Yankee23fan

 
18.16 Mikhail Baryshnikov- Artist /Non Painter

Mikhail Nikolaevich Baryshnikov (Russian: Михаил Николаевич Барышников) (born January 27, 1948) is a Soviet-born Russian American dancer, choreographer, and actor, often cited alongside XXXX and XXXX as one of the greatest ballet dancers of the 20th century. After a promising start in the Kirov Ballet in Leningrad, he defected to Canada in 1974 for more opportunities in western dance. After freelancing with many companies, he joined the New York City Ballet as a principal dancer to learn XXXX style of movement. He then moved to dance and later became artistic director with the American Ballet Theatre, also in New York.

Baryshnikov has spearheaded many of his own artistic projects and has been associated in particular with promoting modern dance, premiering dozens of new works, including many of his own. His success as a dramatic actor on stage, cinema and television has helped him become probably the most widely recognized contemporary ballet dancer.
Click to expand...
 
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Big Rocks said:
Speaking of athletes who absolutely dominated their sport...

18.10 Lance Armstrong, Athlete

He won the Tour de France, one of the world's greatest events, 7 consecutive times in dominating fashion from 1999-2005. The feat is more impressive considering he came back from being diagnosed from testicular cancer that spread to other parts of the body prior to his run.
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I was quite surprised when Eddie Merckx went before Lance. Maybe it's because I'm American-centric but when somebody comes along and breaks your record so convincingly, shouldn't that person be drafted higher??
 
Updated...

Thorn said:
This is what I have, please correct me if I'm wrong:

Skipped/owed picks:

18.01 Abrantes

18.07 Usual21 - requested skip

18.08 John Maddens Lunchbox - requested autoskip

18.12 Doug B - autoskip

18.15 Yankee23fan- requested skip

18.17 FUBAR - requested skip

18.18 Arsenal of Doom - is OTC until 1:24 Eastern

18.19 Larry is on deck

18.20 Mario Kart is in the hole

19.01 Mario Kart

19.02 Larry Boy

19.03 Arsenal of Doom

19.04 FUBAR - autoskip

19.05 Acer FC

19.06 Yankee23fan
Click to expand...
 
I'm going Novelist/Short Story here. I know there will be those that say she shouldn't considered against the greats already drafted, but once again, you can't argue with results. And she basically created a genre - and though it says it below, it's worth repeating - the only written work known to have outsold her collected works is the Bible.

I select Agatha Christie

Agatha Mary Clarissa, Lady Mallowan, DBE (née Miller; 15 September 1890 – 12 January 1976), commonly known as Agatha Christie, was an English crime writer of novels, short stories and plays. She also wrote romances under the name Mary Westmacott, but is best remembered for her 80 detective novels and her successful West End theatre plays. Her works, particularly featuring detectives Hercule Poirot or Miss Jane Marple, have given her the title the 'Queen of Crime' and made her one of the most important and innovative writers in the development of the genre.

Christie has been called by the Guinness Book of World Records as the best-selling writer of books of all time and the best-selling writer of any kind, along with William Shakespeare. Only the Bible is known to have outsold her collected sales of roughly four billion copies of novels.[1] UNESCO states that she is currently the most translated individual author in the world with only the collective corporate works of Walt Disney Productions surpassing her.[2] Christie's books have been translated into (at least) 56 languages.

Her stage play The Mousetrap holds the record for the longest initial run in the world, opening at the Ambassadors Theatre in London on 25 November, 1952, and as of 2009 is still running after more than 23,000 performances. In 1955 Christie was the first recipient of the Mystery Writers of America's highest honour, the Grand Master Award, and in the same year, Witness for the Prosecution was given an Edgar Award by the MWA, for Best Play. Most of her books and short stories have been filmed, some many times over (Murder on the Orient Express, Death on the Nile and 4.50 From Paddington for instance), and many have been adapted for television, radio, video games and comics.

In 1968 Booker Books, a subsidiary of the agri-industrial conglomerate Booker-McConnell, bought a 51 percent stake in Agatha Christie Limited, the private company that Christie had set up for tax purposes. Booker later increased its stake to 64 percent. In 1998, Booker sold its shares to Chorion, a company whose portfolio also includes the literary estates of Enid Blyton and Dennis Wheatley.[3]

Novels

Year

published Title Detectives

1920 The Mysterious Affair at Styles Hercule Poirot

Arthur Hastings

Chief Inspector Japp

1922 The Secret Adversary Tommy and Tuppence

1923 The Murder on the Links Hercule Poirot

Arthur Hastings

1924 The Man in the Brown Suit Anne Beddingfeld

Colonel Race

1925 The Secret of Chimneys Superintendent Battle

1926 The Murder of Roger Ackroyd Hercule Poirot

1927 The Big Four Hercule Poirot

Arthur Hastings

Chief Inspector Japp

1928 The Mystery of the Blue Train Hercule Poirot

1929 The Seven Dials Mystery Bill Eversleigh

Superintendent Battle

1930 The Murder at the Vicarage Miss Marple

1931 The Sittaford Mystery

also Murder at Hazelmoor Inspector Narracott

1932 Peril at End House Hercule Poirot

Arthur Hastings

Chief Inspector Japp

1933 Lord Edgware Dies

also Thirteen at Dinner Hercule Poirot

Arthur Hastings

Chief Inspector Japp

1934 Murder on the Orient Express

also Murder in the Calais Coach Hercule Poirot

1934 Why Didn't They Ask Evans?

also The Boomerang Clue Bobby Jones

Frankie Derwent

1935 Three Act Tragedy

also Murder in Three Acts Hercule Poirot

1935 Death in the Clouds

also Death in the Air Hercule Poirot

Chief Inspector Japp

1936 The A.B.C. Murders

also The Alphabet Murders Hercule Poirot

Arthur Hastings

Chief Inspector Japp

1936 Murder in Mesopotamia Hercule Poirot

1936 Cards on the Table Hercule Poirot

Colonel Race

Superintendent Battle

Ariadne Oliver

1937 Dumb Witness

also Poirot Loses a Client Hercule Poirot

Arthur Hastings

1937 Death on the Nile Hercule Poirot

Colonel Race

1938 Appointment with Death Hercule Poirot

1938 Hercule Poirot's Christmas

also Murder for Christmas

also A Holiday for Murder Hercule Poirot

1939 Murder is Easy

also Easy to Kill Superintendent Battle

1939 And Then There Were None

also Ten Little Indians

also Ten Little ######s

1940 Sad Cypress Hercule Poirot

1940 One, Two, Buckle My Shoe

also An Overdose of Death

also The Patriotic Murders Hercule Poirot

Chief Inspector Japp

1941 Evil Under the Sun Hercule Poirot

1941 N or M? Tommy and Tuppence

1942 The Body in the Library Miss Marple

1942 Five Little Pigs

also Murder in Retrospect Hercule Poirot

1942 The Moving Finger

also The Case of the Moving Finger Miss Marple

1944 Towards Zero Superintendent Battle

Inspector James Leach

1944 Death Comes as the End

1945 Sparkling Cyanide

also Remembered Death Colonel Race

1946 The Hollow

also Murder After Hours Hercule Poirot

1948 Taken at the Flood

also There is a Tide... Hercule Poirot

1949 Crooked House Charles Hayward

1950 A Murder is Announced Miss Marple

1951 They Came to Baghdad Victoria Jones

1952 Mrs McGinty's Dead

also Blood Will Tell Hercule Poirot

Ariadne Oliver

1952 They Do It with Mirrors

also Murder with Mirrors Miss Marple

1953 After the Funeral

also Funerals are Fatal

also Murder at the Gallop Hercule Poirot

1953 A Pocket Full of Rye Miss Marple

1954 Destination Unknown

also So Many Steps to Death

1955 Hickory Dickory Dock

also Hickory Dickory Death Hercule Poirot

1956 Dead Man's Folly Hercule Poirot

Ariadne Oliver

1957 4.50 from Paddington

also What Mrs. McGillicuddy Saw!

also Murder She Said Miss Marple

1958 Ordeal by Innocence

1959 Cat Among the Pigeons Hercule Poirot

1961 The Pale Horse Inspector Lejeune

Ariadne Oliver

1962 The Mirror Crack'd from Side to Side

also The Mirror Crack'd Miss Marple

1963 The Clocks Hercule Poirot

1964 A Caribbean Mystery Miss Marple

1965 At Bertram's Hotel Miss Marple

1966 Third Girl Hercule Poirot

Ariadne Oliver

1967 Endless Night

1968 By the Pricking of My Thumbs Tommy and Tuppence

1969 Hallowe'en Party Hercule Poirot

Ariadne Oliver

1970 Passenger to Frankfurt

1971 Nemesis Miss Marple

1972 Elephants Can Remember Hercule Poirot

Ariadne Oliver

1973 Postern of Fate

final Tommy and Tuppence

last novel Christie wrote Tommy and Tuppence

1975 Curtain

Poirot's last case, written four decades earlier Hercule Poirot

Arthur Hastings

1976 Sleeping Murder

Miss Marple's last case, written four decades earlier Miss Marple

[edit] Collections of short stories

In addition to her novels Christie wrote and published 160 short stories in her career. Almost all of these were written for publication in fiction magazines with over half of them first appearing in the 1920s. They were then published in book form in various collections, some of which were identical in the UK and US (e.g., The Labours of Hercules) and others where publication took place in one market but not the other.

Twelve of the stories which were published in The Sketch magazine in 1924 under the sub-heading of The Man who was No. 4 were further joined into one continuous narrative in the novel The Big Four in 1927. Four further stories, The Submarine Plans (1923), Christmas Adventure (1923), The Mystery of the Baghdad Chest (1932) and The Second Gong (1932), were expanded into longer narratives by Christie (respectively The Incredible Theft, The Adventure of the Christmas Pudding, The Mystery of the Spanish Chest and Dead Man's Mirror although the shorter versions of all four have also been published in the UK).

Only one short story remains unpublished in the UK in book form: Three Blind Mice (1948) on which a Christie placed a moratorium whilst the stage play based on the story, The Mousetrap, was still running in the West End. Prior to this the story was published in four installments in the weekly magazine Woman's Own in the issues dated December 31, 1948 to January 21, 1949 with illustrations by K. J. Petts.

In the US, the story Christmas Adventure has not been published in book form.

The main collections in both markets are:

1924 Poirot Investigates (short stories: eleven in the UK, fourteen in the US)

1929 Partners in Crime (fifteen short stories; featuring Tommy and Tuppence)

1930 The Mysterious Mr. Quin (twelve short stories; introducing Mr. Harley Quin)

1932 The Thirteen Problems (thirteen short stories; featuring Miss Marple, also known as The Tuesday Club Murders in the US)

1933 The Hound of Death (twelve short stories – UK only)

1934 The Listerdale Mystery (twelve short stories – UK only)

1934 Parker Pyne Investigates (twelve short stories; introducing Parker Pyne and Ariadne Oliver, also known as Mr. Parker Pyne, Detective in the US)

1937 Murder in the Mews (four novella-length stories; featuring Hercule Poirot, also known as Dead Man's Mirror in the US)

1939 The Regatta Mystery and Other Stories (nine short stories – US only)

1947 The Labours of Hercules (twelve short stories; featuring Hercule Poirot)

1948 The Witness for the Prosecution and Other Stories (eleven short stories – US only)

1950 Three Blind Mice and Other Stories (nine short stories – US only)

1951 The Under Dog and Other Stories (nine short stories – US only)

1960 The Adventure of the Christmas Pudding (six short stories – UK only)

1961 Double Sin and Other Stories (eight short stories – US only)

1971 The Golden Ball and Other Stories (fifteen short stories – US only)

1974 Poirot's Early Cases (eighteen short stories, also known as Hercule Poirot's Early Cases in the US)

1979 Miss Marple's Final Cases and Two Other Stories (eight short stories – UK only)

1991 Problem at Pollensa Bay and Other Stories (eight short stories – UK only)

1997 The Harlequin Tea Set (nine short stories – US only)

1997 While the Light Lasts and Other Stories (nine short stories – UK only)

In addition, various collections have been published over the years which re-print short stories which have previously appeared in other collections e.g. Surprise, Surprise! (1965 in the US). On occasion, in among the reprinted material, these collections have sometimes contained the first book printing of an individual story e.g. The Market Basing Mystery in the UK version of Thirteen for Luck! (1966) which later appeared in the same market in Poirot's Early Cases.

[edit] Novels written as Mary Westmacott

1930 Giant's Bread

1934 Unfinished Portrait

1944 Absent in the Spring

1948 The Rose and the Yew Tree

1952 A Daughter's a Daughter

1956 The Burden

[edit] Plays

1930 Black Coffee

1943 And Then There Were None

1945 Appointment with Death

1946 Murder on the Nile/Hidden Horizon

1951 The Hollow

1952 The Mousetrap

1953 Witness for the Prosecution

1954 Spider's Web

1956 A Daughter's a Daughter (Written in the late 1930s. Performed professionally once. Unpublished but turned into the 1952 Mary Westmacott novel)

1958 Verdict

1958 The Unexpected Guest

1960 Go Back for Murder

1962 Rule of Three (Comprising Afternoon at the Seaside, The Rats and The Patient)

1972 Fiddler's Three (Originally written as Fiddler's Five. Unpublished.)

1973 Akhnaton (Written in 1937)

2003 Chimneys (Written in 1931, but unperformed for 72 years. Unpublished.)

[edit] Radio Plays

1937 The Yellow Iris (Based on the short story of the same name)

1947 Three Blind Mice (Christie's celebrated stage play The Mousetrap was based on this radio play)

1948 Butter In a Lordly Dish

1954 Personal Call

[edit] Television Plays

1937 Wasp's Nest (Based on the short story of the same name)

[edit] Nonfiction

1946 Come, Tell Me How You Live

1977 Agatha Christie: An Autobiography

[edit] Other published works

1925 The Road of Dreams (Poetry)

1965 Star Over Bethlehem and other stories (Christian stories and poems)

1973 Poems

[edit] Co-authored works

1930 Behind The Screen. A radio serial written together with Hugh Walpole, Dorothy L. Sayers, Anthony Berkeley, E. C. Bentley and Ronald Knox of the Detection Club. Published in book form in 1983 in The Scoop and Behind The Screen.

1931 The Scoop. A radio serial written together with Dorothy L. Sayers, E. C. Bentley, Anthony Berkeley, Freeman Wills Crofts and Clemence Dane of the Detection Club. Published in book form in 1983 in The Scoop and Behind The Screen.

1931 The Floating Admiral. A book written together with G. K. Chesterton, Dorothy L. Sayers and certain other members of the Detection Club.

1956 Towards Zero (A West End theatre dramatization of her 1944 novel co-written with Gerard Verner)

 
AcerFC said:
18.16 Mikhail Baryshnikov- Artis /Non Painter

Mikhail Nikolaevich Baryshnikov (Russian: Михаил Николаевич Барышников) (born January 27, 1948) is a Soviet-born Russian American dancer, choreographer, and actor, often cited alongside XXXX and XXXX as one of the greatest ballet dancers of the 20th century. After a promising start in the Kirov Ballet in Leningrad, he defected to Canada in 1974 for more opportunities in western dance. After freelancing with many companies, he joined the New York City Ballet as a principal dancer to learn XXXX style of movement. He then moved to dance and later became artistic director with the American Ballet Theatre, also in New York.

Baryshnikov has spearheaded many of his own artistic projects and has been associated in particular with promoting modern dance, premiering dozens of new works, including many of his own. His success as a dramatic actor on stage, cinema and television has helped him become probably the most widely recognized contemporary ballet dancer.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I'm ecstatic that a dancer was selected in this draft. But am not sure Barishnikov was the best dancer to select. I think to compete with the other selections in the category you needed someone who was not only well-known as a performer but was an innovative and influential choreographer who thus made a lasting impact on the art form. Barishnikov falls short in that area.
 
18.07 - Sergio Leone - Artist/Non-Painter

Sergio Leone (January 3, 1929 – April 30, 1989) was an Italian film director, producer and screenwriter most famous for his spaghetti westerns.

Biography

Born in Rome, Leone was the son of the cinema pioneer Vincenzo Leone (known as director Roberto Roberti or Leone Roberto Roberti) and the silent film actress Edvige Valcarenghi (Bice Waleran). Having spent time watching his father work on film sets, he started working in the film industry at the age of 18 after he dropped out of studying law in university.

Leone is well-known for his spaghetti western films and his style of juxtaposing [disambiguation needed] extreme close-up shots with lengthy long shots and original music soundtracks. His most well-known movies include the Man with No Name trilogy (a.k.a. the Dollars Trilogy) (which consists of A Fistful of Dollars, For a Few Dollars More and The Good, the Bad and the Ugly), Once Upon a Time in the West and Once Upon a Time in America.

Leone began writing screenplays in the 1950s, primarily for the so-called "sword and sandal" (a.k.a. "peplum") historical epics, which were popular at the time. He also worked as an assistant director on several large-scale and high-profile runaway productions filmed at Cinecittà Studios in Rome, notably Quo Vadis (1951) and Ben-Hur (1959).

When director Mario Bonnard fell ill during the production of the 1959 Italian epic, Gli ultimi giorni di Pompei (The Last Days of Pompeii), starring Steve Reeves, Leone was asked to step in and complete the film. As a result, when the time came to make his solo directorial debut with The Colossus of Rhodes (Il Colosso di Rodi, 1961), Leone was well-equipped to produce low-budget films which looked and felt like Hollywood spectaculars.

1960s

In the early 1960s, demand for historical epics collapsed, and Leone was fortunate enough to be at the forefront of the genre that replaced it in the public's affections: the Western. His film A Fistful of Dollars (Per un Pugno di Dollari, 1964) was an early trend-setter in a genre that came to be known as the "spaghetti western". Based upon Akira Kurosawa's Edo-era samurai adventure Yojimbo (1961), Leone's film elicited a legal challenge from the Japanese director. A Fistful of Dollars is also notable for its establishment of Clint Eastwood as a star, who until that time had been an American television actor with few roles to his name.

The look of A Fistful of Dollars was established partly by its budget and Spanish locations, which presented a gritty, violent and morally complex vision of the American Old West. The film paid tribute to traditional American western movies, but significantly departed from them in storyline, plot, characterization and mood. Leone deservedly gets credit for one great breakthrough in the western genre that is still followed today: in traditional western films, heroes and villains alike looked as if they had just stepped out of a fashion magazine, and the moral opposites were clearly drawn, even down to the hero wearing a white hat and the villain wearing a black hat. Leone's characters were, in contrast, more "realistic" and complex: usually "lone wolves" in their behaviour; they rarely shaved, looked dirty, sweated profusely, and there was a strong suggestion of body odour and a history of criminal behaviour. The characters were also morally ambiguous by appearing generously compassionate, or nakedly and brutally self-serving, as the situation demanded. This sense of realism continues to affect western movies today, and has also been influential outside of the western genre. Many critics have called it ironic that an Italian director who could not speak English, and had never even seen the American Old West, almost single-handedly redefined the typical vision of the American cowboy. According to Christopher Frayling's book Something to do with Death, Leone knew a great deal about the American Old West. It fascinated him as a child, which carried into his adulthood and his films.

Leone's next two films — For a Few Dollars More (1965) and The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (1966) — completed what has come to be known as the Man with No Name trilogy (a.k.a. the Dollars Trilogy), with each film being more financially successful and more technically proficient than its predecessor. All three films featured innovative music scores by the prolific composer Ennio Morricone who worked closely with Leone in coming up with the themes. After they met to plan the soundtrack, they realized that both of them had gone to school together and were classmates at one time. Leone had a personal way of shooting scenes with Morricone's music ongoing. Critics have often said that The Good, the Bad and the Ugly was the finest of the trilogy.[citation needed]

Based on the success of The Man with No Name trilogy, Leone was invited to the United States in 1967 to direct what he hoped would be his masterwork, Once Upon a Time in the West (C'Era una Volta il West) for Paramount Pictures. The film was shot mostly in Almería, Spain and Cinecittà in Rome. It was also briefly shot in Monument Valley, Utah. The film starred Charles Bronson, Henry Fonda, Jason Robards and Claudia Cardinale. Once Upon a Time in the West emerged as a long, violent, dreamlike meditation upon the mythology of the American Old West. The film was scripted by Leone's longtime friend and collaborator Sergio Donati. The story was written by Bernardo Bertolucci and Dario Argento, both of whom went on to have significant careers as directors. Before its release, however, it was ruthlessly edited by Paramount, which perhaps contributed to its low box-office results in the United States. Nevertheless, it was a huge hit in Europe, grossing nearly three times its $5 million budget among French audiences, and highly praised amongst North American film students. It has come to be regarded by many as Leone's best film.

1970s

After Once Upon a Time in the West, Leone directed A Fistful of Dynamite, a.k.a. Duck, You Sucker (Giù la Testa, 1971). Leone was originally just going to produce the film, but due to artistic differences from then-director Peter Bogdanovich, Leone was asked to direct the film instead. A Fistful of Dynamite is a Mexican Revolution action drama, starring James Coburn, as an Irish revolutionary, and Rod Steiger, as a Mexican bandit who is conned into becoming a revolutionary.

Leone continued to produce, and on occasion, step in to reshoot scenes in other films. One of these films was My Name is Nobody (1973) by Tonino Valerii (though true participation of Leone in shooting is disputed[citation needed]), a comedy western film that poked fun at the spaghetti western genre. It starred Henry Fonda as an old gunslinger who watched "his" old West fade away before his very eyes as he played his guitar. Terence Hill also starred in the film as the young stranger who helps Fonda leave the dying West with style.

Leone's other productions included A Genius, Two Partners and a Dupe (1975, another western comedy starring Terence Hill); The Cat (Il gatto; 1977, starring Alberto Sordi and The Toy (Il giocattolo; 1979, starring Nino Manfredi). Leone also produced three comedies by actor/director Carlo Verdone, which were Fun Is Beautiful (Un Sacco Bello, 1980), Bianco, Rosso e Verdone (White, Red and Verdone - Verdone means "strong green", a pun referring to the three colours of the Italian flag, the star and to director Verdone, 1981) and Troppo Forte (Great!, 1986). During this period, Leone also directed various award-winning TV commercials for European television.

1980s

Leone turned down the opportunity to direct The Godfather, in favor of working on another gangster story he had conceived before the offer of The Godfather. He devoted ten years on this project, based on the novel The Hoods by former mobster Harry Grey, which focused on a quartet of New York City Jewish gangsters of the 1920s and 1930s who had been friends since childhood. The finished film, Once Upon a Time in America (1984), starred Robert De Niro and James Woods. It was a meditation on another aspect of popular American mythology, the role of greed and violence and their uneasy coexistence with the meaning of ethnicity and friendship. Feeling the final cut was too long, Warner Bros. edited its four-hour running time drastically for the American market, losing much of the sense of the complex narrative. Lasting over just two hours, the recut version that was shown in North America flopped and received much criticism. The original version, projected in the rest of the world, received a warm box office reception and great appreciation by the public and critics. When the original version of the film was released on DVD in the USA, it finally gained major critical acclaim, with many critics hailing the film as a masterpiece.

According to biographer Sir Christopher Frayling, Leone was deeply hurt by the studio-imposed editing and poor commercial reception of Once Upon a Time in America in North America. It would be his last film.

Later years and death

Leone died on April 30, 1989 of a heart attack at the age of 60. Leone was infamous for his compulsive eating, which led him to become obese. Before his death in 1989, Leone was part way through planning yet another film — this time on the Siege of Leningrad during World War II.

In his later years, Leone had a falling out of sorts with Clint Eastwood, his most famous actor. When Leone directed Once Upon a Time in America, he commented that Robert De Niro was a real actor, unlike Eastwood. However, the two made amends and reconciled before Leone's death. In 1992, Eastwood directed Unforgiven, a revisionist western drama for which he won an Oscar for best director, as well as Best Picture. Leone was one of the two directors whom Eastwood dedicated his award to, the other one was Don Siegel.

FILMS:

The Last Days of Pompeii (Gli ultimi giorni di Pompei, 1959) (Mario Bonnard is the credited director; Leone served as assistant director and reportedly took over completion of the film when Bonnard became severely ill during production)

Il Colosso di Rodi (1961)

A Fistful of Dollars (Per un Pugno di Dollari, 1964)

For a Few Dollars More (Per Qualche Dollaro in Più, 1965)

The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (Il Buono, il Brutto, il Cattivo, 1966)

Once Upon a Time in the West (C'Era una Volta il West, 1968)

A Fistful of Dynamite (Giù la Testa, 1971)

My Name is Nobody (Il mio nome è Nessuno, 1973) (producer, uncredited co-director)

A Genius, Two Partners and a Dupe (Un genio, due compari, un pollo, 1975) (uncredited producer and co-director)

Once Upon a Time in America (C'Era una Volta in America, 1984)

 
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Usual21 said:
18.14 - Sergio Leone - Artist/Non-Painter

Sergio Leone (January 3, 1929 – April 30, 1989) was an Italian film director, producer and screenwriter most famous for his spaghetti westerns.

Biography

Born in Rome, Leone was the son of the cinema pioneer Vincenzo Leone (known as director Roberto Roberti or Leone Roberto Roberti) and the silent film actress Edvige Valcarenghi (Bice Waleran). Having spent time watching his father work on film sets, he started working in the film industry at the age of 18 after he dropped out of studying law in university.

Leone is well-known for his spaghetti western films and his style of juxtaposing [disambiguation needed] extreme close-up shots with lengthy long shots and original music soundtracks. His most well-known movies include the Man with No Name trilogy (a.k.a. the Dollars Trilogy) (which consists of A Fistful of Dollars, For a Few Dollars More and The Good, the Bad and the Ugly), Once Upon a Time in the West and Once Upon a Time in America.

Leone began writing screenplays in the 1950s, primarily for the so-called "sword and sandal" (a.k.a. "peplum") historical epics, which were popular at the time. He also worked as an assistant director on several large-scale and high-profile runaway productions filmed at Cinecittà Studios in Rome, notably Quo Vadis (1951) and Ben-Hur (1959).

When director Mario Bonnard fell ill during the production of the 1959 Italian epic, Gli ultimi giorni di Pompei (The Last Days of Pompeii), starring Steve Reeves, Leone was asked to step in and complete the film. As a result, when the time came to make his solo directorial debut with The Colossus of Rhodes (Il Colosso di Rodi, 1961), Leone was well-equipped to produce low-budget films which looked and felt like Hollywood spectaculars.

1960s

In the early 1960s, demand for historical epics collapsed, and Leone was fortunate enough to be at the forefront of the genre that replaced it in the public's affections: the Western. His film A Fistful of Dollars (Per un Pugno di Dollari, 1964) was an early trend-setter in a genre that came to be known as the "spaghetti western". Based upon Akira Kurosawa's Edo-era samurai adventure Yojimbo (1961), Leone's film elicited a legal challenge from the Japanese director. A Fistful of Dollars is also notable for its establishment of Clint Eastwood as a star, who until that time had been an American television actor with few roles to his name.

The look of A Fistful of Dollars was established partly by its budget and Spanish locations, which presented a gritty, violent and morally complex vision of the American Old West. The film paid tribute to traditional American western movies, but significantly departed from them in storyline, plot, characterization and mood. Leone deservedly gets credit for one great breakthrough in the western genre that is still followed today: in traditional western films, heroes and villains alike looked as if they had just stepped out of a fashion magazine, and the moral opposites were clearly drawn, even down to the hero wearing a white hat and the villain wearing a black hat. Leone's characters were, in contrast, more "realistic" and complex: usually "lone wolves" in their behaviour; they rarely shaved, looked dirty, sweated profusely, and there was a strong suggestion of body odour and a history of criminal behaviour. The characters were also morally ambiguous by appearing generously compassionate, or nakedly and brutally self-serving, as the situation demanded. This sense of realism continues to affect western movies today, and has also been influential outside of the western genre. Many critics have called it ironic that an Italian director who could not speak English, and had never even seen the American Old West, almost single-handedly redefined the typical vision of the American cowboy. According to Christopher Frayling's book Something to do with Death, Leone knew a great deal about the American Old West. It fascinated him as a child, which carried into his adulthood and his films.

Leone's next two films — For a Few Dollars More (1965) and The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (1966) — completed what has come to be known as the Man with No Name trilogy (a.k.a. the Dollars Trilogy), with each film being more financially successful and more technically proficient than its predecessor. All three films featured innovative music scores by the prolific composer Ennio Morricone who worked closely with Leone in coming up with the themes. After they met to plan the soundtrack, they realized that both of them had gone to school together and were classmates at one time. Leone had a personal way of shooting scenes with Morricone's music ongoing. Critics have often said that The Good, the Bad and the Ugly was the finest of the trilogy.[citation needed]

Based on the success of The Man with No Name trilogy, Leone was invited to the United States in 1967 to direct what he hoped would be his masterwork, Once Upon a Time in the West (C'Era una Volta il West) for Paramount Pictures. The film was shot mostly in Almería, Spain and Cinecittà in Rome. It was also briefly shot in Monument Valley, Utah. The film starred Charles Bronson, Henry Fonda, Jason Robards and Claudia Cardinale. Once Upon a Time in the West emerged as a long, violent, dreamlike meditation upon the mythology of the American Old West. The film was scripted by Leone's longtime friend and collaborator Sergio Donati. The story was written by Bernardo Bertolucci and Dario Argento, both of whom went on to have significant careers as directors. Before its release, however, it was ruthlessly edited by Paramount, which perhaps contributed to its low box-office results in the United States. Nevertheless, it was a huge hit in Europe, grossing nearly three times its $5 million budget among French audiences, and highly praised amongst North American film students. It has come to be regarded by many as Leone's best film.

1970s

After Once Upon a Time in the West, Leone directed A Fistful of Dynamite, a.k.a. Duck, You Sucker (Giù la Testa, 1971). Leone was originally just going to produce the film, but due to artistic differences from then-director Peter Bogdanovich, Leone was asked to direct the film instead. A Fistful of Dynamite is a Mexican Revolution action drama, starring James Coburn, as an Irish revolutionary, and Rod Steiger, as a Mexican bandit who is conned into becoming a revolutionary.

Leone continued to produce, and on occasion, step in to reshoot scenes in other films. One of these films was My Name is Nobody (1973) by Tonino Valerii (though true participation of Leone in shooting is disputed[citation needed]), a comedy western film that poked fun at the spaghetti western genre. It starred Henry Fonda as an old gunslinger who watched "his" old West fade away before his very eyes as he played his guitar. Terence Hill also starred in the film as the young stranger who helps Fonda leave the dying West with style.

Leone's other productions included A Genius, Two Partners and a Dupe (1975, another western comedy starring Terence Hill); The Cat (Il gatto; 1977, starring Alberto Sordi and The Toy (Il giocattolo; 1979, starring Nino Manfredi). Leone also produced three comedies by actor/director Carlo Verdone, which were Fun Is Beautiful (Un Sacco Bello, 1980), Bianco, Rosso e Verdone (White, Red and Verdone - Verdone means "strong green", a pun referring to the three colours of the Italian flag, the star and to director Verdone, 1981) and Troppo Forte (Great!, 1986). During this period, Leone also directed various award-winning TV commercials for European television.

1980s

Leone turned down the opportunity to direct The Godfather, in favor of working on another gangster story he had conceived before the offer of The Godfather. He devoted ten years on this project, based on the novel The Hoods by former mobster Harry Grey, which focused on a quartet of New York City Jewish gangsters of the 1920s and 1930s who had been friends since childhood. The finished film, Once Upon a Time in America (1984), starred Robert De Niro and James Woods. It was a meditation on another aspect of popular American mythology, the role of greed and violence and their uneasy coexistence with the meaning of ethnicity and friendship. Feeling the final cut was too long, Warner Bros. edited its four-hour running time drastically for the American market, losing much of the sense of the complex narrative. Lasting over just two hours, the recut version that was shown in North America flopped and received much criticism. The original version, projected in the rest of the world, received a warm box office reception and great appreciation by the public and critics. When the original version of the film was released on DVD in the USA, it finally gained major critical acclaim, with many critics hailing the film as a masterpiece.

According to biographer Sir Christopher Frayling, Leone was deeply hurt by the studio-imposed editing and poor commercial reception of Once Upon a Time in America in North America. It would be his last film.

Later years and death

Leone died on April 30, 1989 of a heart attack at the age of 60. Leone was infamous for his compulsive eating, which led him to become obese. Before his death in 1989, Leone was part way through planning yet another film — this time on the Siege of Leningrad during World War II.

In his later years, Leone had a falling out of sorts with Clint Eastwood, his most famous actor. When Leone directed Once Upon a Time in America, he commented that Robert De Niro was a real actor, unlike Eastwood. However, the two made amends and reconciled before Leone's death. In 1992, Eastwood directed Unforgiven, a revisionist western drama for which he won an Oscar for best director, as well as Best Picture. Leone was one of the two directors whom Eastwood dedicated his award to, the other one was Don Siegel.

FILMS:

The Last Days of Pompeii (Gli ultimi giorni di Pompei, 1959) (Mario Bonnard is the credited director; Leone served as assistant director and reportedly took over completion of the film when Bonnard became severely ill during production)

Il Colosso di Rodi (1961)

A Fistful of Dollars (Per un Pugno di Dollari, 1964)

For a Few Dollars More (Per Qualche Dollaro in Più, 1965)

The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (Il Buono, il Brutto, il Cattivo, 1966)

Once Upon a Time in the West (C'Era una Volta il West, 1968)

A Fistful of Dynamite (Giù la Testa, 1971)

My Name is Nobody (Il mio nome è Nessuno, 1973) (producer, uncredited co-director)

A Genius, Two Partners and a Dupe (Un genio, due compari, un pollo, 1975) (uncredited producer and co-director)

Once Upon a Time in America (C'Era una Volta in America, 1984)
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Tim panned your John Paul Jones pick. I can't wait to see his response to this one.
 
Making my catch up pick

I even named a cat after this err, cat, because it had a triangular face.

18:08 - Pythagoras - Wild Card

(born c. 580 BC, Samos, Ionia — died c. 500, Metapontum, Lucania) Greek philosopher and mathematician. He established a community of followers in Croton who adhered to a way of life he prescribed. His school of philosophy reduced all meaning to numerical relationships and proposed that all existing objects are fundamentally composed of form and not material substance. The principles of Pythagoreanism, including belief in the immortality and reincarnation of the soul and in the liberating power of abstinence and asceticism, influenced the thought of Plato and Aristotle and contributed to the development of mathematics and Western rational philosophy. The proportions of musical intervals and scales were first studied by Pythagoras, and he was the first influential Western practitioner of vegetarianism.

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He was the first man to call himself a philosopher, or lover of wisdom,[2] and Pythagorean ideas exercised a marked influence on Plato.

Pythagoras or in a broader sense, the Pythagoreans, allegedly exercised an important influence on the work of Plato. According to R. M. Hare, his influence consists of three points: a) the platonic Republic might be related to the idea of "a tightly organized community of like-minded thinkers", like the one established by Pythagoras in Croton. b) there is evidence that Plato possibly took from Pythagoras the idea that mathematics and, generally speaking, abstract thinking is a secure basis for philosophical thinking as well as "for substantial theses in science and morals". c) Plato and Pythagoras shared a "mystical approach to the soul and its place in the material world". It is probable that both have been influenced by Orphism.[12]

Plato's harmonics were clearly influenced by the work of Archytas, a genuine Pythagorean of the third generation, who made important contributions to geometry, reflected in Book VIII of Euclid's Elements.

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The Pythagoreans posited the dualism between Limited and Unlimited. It was probably Pythagoras himself who declared that number was the principle in the universe, limiting and giving shape to matter. His study of musical intervals, leading to the discovery that the chief intervals can be expressed in numerical ratios between the first four integers, also led to the theory that the number 10, the sum of the first four integers, embraced the whole nature of number.

So great was the Pythagoreans' veneration for the "Tetractys of the Decad" (the sum of 1 + 2 + 3 + 4) that they swore their oaths by it rather than by the gods, as was conventional. Pythagoras may have discovered the theorem which still bears his name (in right triangles, the square on the hypotenuse equals the sum of the squares on the other sides), although this proposition has been discovered on a tablet dating from the time of the Babylonian king Hammurabi. Regardless of their sources, the Pythagoreans did important work in systematizing and extending the body of mathematical knowledge.

As a more general scheme, the Pythagoreans posited the two contraries, Limited and Unlimited, as ultimate principles. Numerical oddness and evenness are equated with Limited and Unlimited, as are one and plurality, right and left, male and female, motionlessness and movement, straight and crooked, light and darkness, good and bad, and square and oblong. It is not clear whether an ultimate One, or Monad, was posited as the cause of the two categories.

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The Pythagoreans are best known for two teachings: the transmigration of souls and the theory that numbers constitute the true nature of things. The believers performed purification rites and followed moral, ascetic, and dietary rules to enable their souls to achieve a higher rank in their subsequent lives and thus eventually be liberated from the “wheel of birth.” This belief also led them to regard the sexes as equal, to treat slaves humanely, and to respect animals. The highest purification was “philosophy,” and tradition credits Pythagoras with the first use of the term. Beginning with the discovery that the relationship between musical notes could be expressed in numerical ratios (see Greek music), the Pythagoreans elaborated a theory of numbers, the exact meaning of which is still disputed by scholars. Briefly, they taught that all things were numbers, meaning that the essence of things was number, and that all relationships—even abstract ethical concepts like justice—could be expressed numerically. They held that numbers set a limit to the unlimited—thus foreshadowing the distinction between form and matter that plays a key role in all later philosophy. The Pythagoreans were influential mathematicians and geometricians, and the theorem that bears their name is witness to their influence on the initial part of Euclidian geometry. They made important contributions to medicine and astronomy and were among the first to teach that the earth was a spherical planet, revolving about a fixed point. At the end of the 5th cent. B.C. the Pythagoreans were forced to flee Magna Graecia when people grew enraged at their interference with traditional religious customs; many were killed. A short-lived Neo-Pythagoreanism developed at the beginning of the Christian era; it borrowed some elements from Jewish and Hellenistic thought and greatly emphasized the mystical element in Pythagorean ideas.
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timschochet said:
Arsenal of Doom has been sending me information about Phidias which is very impressive. My wife has also contributed that this man (whom, frankly, I have never heard of) is of extreme importance and influence to the world of sculpture. I still don't know what to do with the fact that we have none of his actual art to look at. But my opinion is rising.
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I think the best analogy for Phidias is Homer; although they represent variations on a similar problem for purposes of this draft. With Homer we have original works (although as previously pointed out, we known them in English though Latin translations of Ancient Greek sources), with questions about whether or not Homer actually existed or if the works are a collection of stories assembled from various authors and oral traditions. Phidias, on the other, we know without question existed and we know specifically what his major works were; however, we only have copies of the originals (or in some cases small representation that just give an idea of what the statue looked like, as in the case of the great statue of Zeus). We also have the originals of work made under his direction at the Parthenon (The Elgin Marbles), but there is no way to accurately determine what of those works were made by hand as opposed to his students.While the original works are not available, the Phidian style is well known from the various secondary sources that are available. The major reconstructions such as the Athena Lemnia and Athena Parthenos, offer an accurate representation of what the work of Phidias was like. While certainly not every detail or nuance would be present, just as some of the original poetry is always lost in translation, particularly in the case of the Athena Parthenos you get a sense of why the world was awestruck by his mastery over the centuries.

As you noted, like Homer for poetry, Phidias’ importance is considered towering in the World of Art. This is why Michelangelo became regarded as the equal of Phidias years after completing the statue of David, and why have quotes like the one I have posed from Rodin that Phidias will never be equaled as an Artist.

Anyway, I’ve been in meetings all morning. Pick forthcoming.

 
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Going back to the well here:

Helen Keller - Humanitarian

I don't have time for a full write-up at the moment, but here is a quick section form her bio that foucses on some of her international fame and activities that are numerous.

Keller went on to become a world-famous speaker and author. She is remembered as an advocate for people with disabilities amid numerous other causes. She was a suffragist, a pacifist, a xxxxxx opposer, a radical Socialist, and a birth control supporter. In 1915, Helen Keller and George Kessler founded the Helen Keller International (HKI) organization. This organization is devoted to research in vision, health and nutrition. In 1920, she helped to found the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU). Keller and Sullivan traveled to over 39 countries, making several trips to Japan and becoming a favorite of the Japanese people. Keller met every US President from Grover Cleveland to Lyndon B. Johnson and was friends with many famous figures, including Alexander Graham Bell, Charlie Chaplin, and Mark Twain.

Keller was a member of the Socialist Party and actively campaigned and wrote in support of the working classes from 1909 to 1921. She supported Socialist Party candidate Eugene V. Debs in each of his campaigns for the presidency.

Keller and her friend Mark Twain were both considered radicals in the socio-political context present in the United States at the beginning of the 20th century, and as a consequence, their political views have been forgotten or glossed over in popular perception.[8] Newspaper columnists who had praised her courage and intelligence before she expressed her socialist views now called attention to her disabilities. The editor of the Brooklyn Eagle wrote that her "mistakes sprung out of the manifest limitations of her development." Keller responded to that editor, referring to having met him before he knew of her political views:

“ At that time the compliments he paid me were so generous that I blush to remember them. But now that I have come out for socialism he reminds me and the public that I am blind and deaf and especially liable to error. I must have shrunk in intelligence during the years since I met him...Oh, ridiculous Brooklyn Eagle! Socially blind and deaf, it defends an intolerable system, a system that is the cause of much of the physical blindness and deafness which we are trying to prevent.[9] ”

Keller joined the Industrial Workers of the World (known as the IWW or the Wobblies) in 1912,[8] saying that parliamentary socialism was "sinking in the political bog." She wrote for the IWW between 1916 and 1918. In Why I Became an IWW,[10] Keller explained that her motivation for activism came in part from her concern about blindness and other disabilities:

“ I was appointed on a commission to investigate the conditions of the blind. For the first time I, who had thought blindness a misfortune beyond human control, found that too much of it was traceable to wrong industrial conditions, often caused by the selfishness and greed of employers. And the social evil contributed its share. I found that poverty drove women to a life of shame that ended in blindness. ”

The last sentence refers to prostitution and syphilis, the latter a leading cause of blindness.
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AcerFC said:
18.16 Mikhail Baryshnikov- Artis /Non Painter

Mikhail Nikolaevich Baryshnikov (Russian: Михаил Николаевич Барышников) (born January 27, 1948) is a Soviet-born Russian American dancer, choreographer, and actor, often cited alongside XXXX and XXXX as one of the greatest ballet dancers of the 20th century. After a promising start in the Kirov Ballet in Leningrad, he defected to Canada in 1974 for more opportunities in western dance. After freelancing with many companies, he joined the New York City Ballet as a principal dancer to learn XXXX style of movement. He then moved to dance and later became artistic director with the American Ballet Theatre, also in New York.

Baryshnikov has spearheaded many of his own artistic projects and has been associated in particular with promoting modern dance, premiering dozens of new works, including many of his own. His success as a dramatic actor on stage, cinema and television has helped him become probably the most widely recognized contemporary ballet dancer.
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I don't know enough about ballet to say whether he was the best or most important dancer, but I love this pick.
 
krista4 said:
AcerFC said:
18.16 Mikhail Baryshnikov- Artis /Non Painter

Mikhail Nikolaevich Baryshnikov (Russian: Михаил Николаевич Барышников) (born January 27, 1948) is a Soviet-born Russian American dancer, choreographer, and actor, often cited alongside XXXX and XXXX as one of the greatest ballet dancers of the 20th century. After a promising start in the Kirov Ballet in Leningrad, he defected to Canada in 1974 for more opportunities in western dance. After freelancing with many companies, he joined the New York City Ballet as a principal dancer to learn XXXX style of movement. He then moved to dance and later became artistic director with the American Ballet Theatre, also in New York.

Baryshnikov has spearheaded many of his own artistic projects and has been associated in particular with promoting modern dance, premiering dozens of new works, including many of his own. His success as a dramatic actor on stage, cinema and television has helped him become probably the most widely recognized contemporary ballet dancer.
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I don't know enough about ballet to say whether he was the best or most important dancer, but I love this pick.
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This (without the I love this pick part)
 
Mixlflick1 said:
Usual21 said:
18.14 - Sergio Leone - Artist/Non-Painter

Sergio Leone (January 3, 1929 – April 30, 1989) was an Italian film director, producer and screenwriter most famous for his spaghetti westerns.

Biography

Born in Rome, Leone was the son of the cinema pioneer Vincenzo Leone (known as director Roberto Roberti or Leone Roberto Roberti) and the silent film actress Edvige Valcarenghi (Bice Waleran). Having spent time watching his father work on film sets, he started working in the film industry at the age of 18 after he dropped out of studying law in university.

Leone is well-known for his spaghetti western films and his style of juxtaposing [disambiguation needed] extreme close-up shots with lengthy long shots and original music soundtracks. His most well-known movies include the Man with No Name trilogy (a.k.a. the Dollars Trilogy) (which consists of A Fistful of Dollars, For a Few Dollars More and The Good, the Bad and the Ugly), Once Upon a Time in the West and Once Upon a Time in America.

Leone began writing screenplays in the 1950s, primarily for the so-called "sword and sandal" (a.k.a. "peplum") historical epics, which were popular at the time. He also worked as an assistant director on several large-scale and high-profile runaway productions filmed at Cinecittà Studios in Rome, notably Quo Vadis (1951) and Ben-Hur (1959).

When director Mario Bonnard fell ill during the production of the 1959 Italian epic, Gli ultimi giorni di Pompei (The Last Days of Pompeii), starring Steve Reeves, Leone was asked to step in and complete the film. As a result, when the time came to make his solo directorial debut with The Colossus of Rhodes (Il Colosso di Rodi, 1961), Leone was well-equipped to produce low-budget films which looked and felt like Hollywood spectaculars.

1960s

In the early 1960s, demand for historical epics collapsed, and Leone was fortunate enough to be at the forefront of the genre that replaced it in the public's affections: the Western. His film A Fistful of Dollars (Per un Pugno di Dollari, 1964) was an early trend-setter in a genre that came to be known as the "spaghetti western". Based upon Akira Kurosawa's Edo-era samurai adventure Yojimbo (1961), Leone's film elicited a legal challenge from the Japanese director. A Fistful of Dollars is also notable for its establishment of Clint Eastwood as a star, who until that time had been an American television actor with few roles to his name.

The look of A Fistful of Dollars was established partly by its budget and Spanish locations, which presented a gritty, violent and morally complex vision of the American Old West. The film paid tribute to traditional American western movies, but significantly departed from them in storyline, plot, characterization and mood. Leone deservedly gets credit for one great breakthrough in the western genre that is still followed today: in traditional western films, heroes and villains alike looked as if they had just stepped out of a fashion magazine, and the moral opposites were clearly drawn, even down to the hero wearing a white hat and the villain wearing a black hat. Leone's characters were, in contrast, more "realistic" and complex: usually "lone wolves" in their behaviour; they rarely shaved, looked dirty, sweated profusely, and there was a strong suggestion of body odour and a history of criminal behaviour. The characters were also morally ambiguous by appearing generously compassionate, or nakedly and brutally self-serving, as the situation demanded. This sense of realism continues to affect western movies today, and has also been influential outside of the western genre. Many critics have called it ironic that an Italian director who could not speak English, and had never even seen the American Old West, almost single-handedly redefined the typical vision of the American cowboy. According to Christopher Frayling's book Something to do with Death, Leone knew a great deal about the American Old West. It fascinated him as a child, which carried into his adulthood and his films.

Leone's next two films — For a Few Dollars More (1965) and The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (1966) — completed what has come to be known as the Man with No Name trilogy (a.k.a. the Dollars Trilogy), with each film being more financially successful and more technically proficient than its predecessor. All three films featured innovative music scores by the prolific composer Ennio Morricone who worked closely with Leone in coming up with the themes. After they met to plan the soundtrack, they realized that both of them had gone to school together and were classmates at one time. Leone had a personal way of shooting scenes with Morricone's music ongoing. Critics have often said that The Good, the Bad and the Ugly was the finest of the trilogy.[citation needed]

Based on the success of The Man with No Name trilogy, Leone was invited to the United States in 1967 to direct what he hoped would be his masterwork, Once Upon a Time in the West (C'Era una Volta il West) for Paramount Pictures. The film was shot mostly in Almería, Spain and Cinecittà in Rome. It was also briefly shot in Monument Valley, Utah. The film starred Charles Bronson, Henry Fonda, Jason Robards and Claudia Cardinale. Once Upon a Time in the West emerged as a long, violent, dreamlike meditation upon the mythology of the American Old West. The film was scripted by Leone's longtime friend and collaborator Sergio Donati. The story was written by Bernardo Bertolucci and Dario Argento, both of whom went on to have significant careers as directors. Before its release, however, it was ruthlessly edited by Paramount, which perhaps contributed to its low box-office results in the United States. Nevertheless, it was a huge hit in Europe, grossing nearly three times its $5 million budget among French audiences, and highly praised amongst North American film students. It has come to be regarded by many as Leone's best film.

1970s

After Once Upon a Time in the West, Leone directed A Fistful of Dynamite, a.k.a. Duck, You Sucker (Giù la Testa, 1971). Leone was originally just going to produce the film, but due to artistic differences from then-director Peter Bogdanovich, Leone was asked to direct the film instead. A Fistful of Dynamite is a Mexican Revolution action drama, starring James Coburn, as an Irish revolutionary, and Rod Steiger, as a Mexican bandit who is conned into becoming a revolutionary.

Leone continued to produce, and on occasion, step in to reshoot scenes in other films. One of these films was My Name is Nobody (1973) by Tonino Valerii (though true participation of Leone in shooting is disputed[citation needed]), a comedy western film that poked fun at the spaghetti western genre. It starred Henry Fonda as an old gunslinger who watched "his" old West fade away before his very eyes as he played his guitar. Terence Hill also starred in the film as the young stranger who helps Fonda leave the dying West with style.

Leone's other productions included A Genius, Two Partners and a Dupe (1975, another western comedy starring Terence Hill); The Cat (Il gatto; 1977, starring Alberto Sordi and The Toy (Il giocattolo; 1979, starring Nino Manfredi). Leone also produced three comedies by actor/director Carlo Verdone, which were Fun Is Beautiful (Un Sacco Bello, 1980), Bianco, Rosso e Verdone (White, Red and Verdone - Verdone means "strong green", a pun referring to the three colours of the Italian flag, the star and to director Verdone, 1981) and Troppo Forte (Great!, 1986). During this period, Leone also directed various award-winning TV commercials for European television.

1980s

Leone turned down the opportunity to direct The Godfather, in favor of working on another gangster story he had conceived before the offer of The Godfather. He devoted ten years on this project, based on the novel The Hoods by former mobster Harry Grey, which focused on a quartet of New York City Jewish gangsters of the 1920s and 1930s who had been friends since childhood. The finished film, Once Upon a Time in America (1984), starred Robert De Niro and James Woods. It was a meditation on another aspect of popular American mythology, the role of greed and violence and their uneasy coexistence with the meaning of ethnicity and friendship. Feeling the final cut was too long, Warner Bros. edited its four-hour running time drastically for the American market, losing much of the sense of the complex narrative. Lasting over just two hours, the recut version that was shown in North America flopped and received much criticism. The original version, projected in the rest of the world, received a warm box office reception and great appreciation by the public and critics. When the original version of the film was released on DVD in the USA, it finally gained major critical acclaim, with many critics hailing the film as a masterpiece.

According to biographer Sir Christopher Frayling, Leone was deeply hurt by the studio-imposed editing and poor commercial reception of Once Upon a Time in America in North America. It would be his last film.

Later years and death

Leone died on April 30, 1989 of a heart attack at the age of 60. Leone was infamous for his compulsive eating, which led him to become obese. Before his death in 1989, Leone was part way through planning yet another film — this time on the Siege of Leningrad during World War II.

In his later years, Leone had a falling out of sorts with Clint Eastwood, his most famous actor. When Leone directed Once Upon a Time in America, he commented that Robert De Niro was a real actor, unlike Eastwood. However, the two made amends and reconciled before Leone's death. In 1992, Eastwood directed Unforgiven, a revisionist western drama for which he won an Oscar for best director, as well as Best Picture. Leone was one of the two directors whom Eastwood dedicated his award to, the other one was Don Siegel.

FILMS:

The Last Days of Pompeii (Gli ultimi giorni di Pompei, 1959) (Mario Bonnard is the credited director; Leone served as assistant director and reportedly took over completion of the film when Bonnard became severely ill during production)

Il Colosso di Rodi (1961)

A Fistful of Dollars (Per un Pugno di Dollari, 1964)

For a Few Dollars More (Per Qualche Dollaro in Più, 1965)

The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (Il Buono, il Brutto, il Cattivo, 1966)

Once Upon a Time in the West (C'Era una Volta il West, 1968)

A Fistful of Dynamite (Giù la Testa, 1971)

My Name is Nobody (Il mio nome è Nessuno, 1973) (producer, uncredited co-director)

A Genius, Two Partners and a Dupe (Un genio, due compari, un pollo, 1975) (uncredited producer and co-director)

Once Upon a Time in America (C'Era una Volta in America, 1984)
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Tim panned your John Paul Jones pick. I can't wait to see his response to this one.
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That's what I'm shooting for. The only way this pick could be better is if Leone made a Biopic about JPJ.
 
timschochet said:
thatguy said:
I'd also like to point out, Tim, that you gave rankings of 10 to Wild Cards such as Marylin Monroe and Davy Crockett in the GAD. These people did nothing, but they both had large legends. Sounds a lot like Nostradamus.Then, I had my boy Thurgood Marshall, who actually did quite a lot, and he got a measly 8. I think it's a bit unfair that you should change your criteria now. And please don't try to argue somehow that you aren't changing your criteria, that there's a reasonable explanation for those rankings, because we both know there isn't.
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I haven't changed my criteria, but what's important to America is different from what's important to the rest of the world. Look, if I was judging religious figures for this draft, Jesus of Nazareth would be in the top 3 for sure, possibly number one, because of his legend and how profoundly that affected people. I rated Marilyn and Crockett in that draft under the same basic principle; they were huge American legends. Being a "large legend" as you put it, is of some importance.Is Nostradamus a large legend? Not really. His legend, to the world, is nowhere near as impactful as Marilyn's and Crockett's respective legends are to the United States. I really don't see the comparison.
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Give me a break. This is BS. Monroe and Crockett are no more important to me as an American than Nostradmus. The difference is that Nostradamus's book is read on a global level and he is the same pop culture figure here as he is elsewhere in the western hemisphere. To call either Monroe or Crockett impactful in a way that is somehow more important than Nostradamus is to fool yourself. Oh, and also, Nostradamus lived over 400 years ago and is still as widely known and read as he was in his lifetime.
 
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I can only show up for a minute and will update later. Sergio Leone is an astonishingly terrible pick. About the only thing he innovated was how to rip off other great directors and how to mix in cheap Italian actors with American movie stars. It's not as bad as John Paul Jones, but one of the 20 greatest artists of all time? Come on now.

On the other hand Barishnikov is an interesting use of this category. I don't know how to judge this, but it is creative.

What I really wanted to talk about though was Agatha Christie. I'm so torn. She really doesn't belong in this draft, not a chance, but I LOVE Agatha Christie. Her top 5:

1. And Then There Were None (Quite simply, the finest mystery ever written.

2. Death On The Nile

3. The Murder of Roger Ackroyd (If you solve this mystery yourself before getting to the end, you should win some sort of award. The most shocking ending to a mystery ever written.

4. Murder on The Orient Express

5. Thirteen At Dinner

All highly recommended.

 
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