Don't drag us into your gutter.I honestly don't believe you. You know that feeling after you win vs after you lose. You're taking the loss because of some higher moral obligation? Just ridiculous. That's bad fandom, take the win and get out of there.BigSteelThrill said:
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Would you rather that your team win on a terrible call (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter GregR_2
- Start date
Hello? It's football, the fate of the free world doesn't ride on it. This has nothing to do with the downfall of American society. This has to do with bad fans wanting their team to lose.Wow. Thats what went wrong with our political system.Its all about "my team". Has nothing to do with the sport itself.My team won, I'll take it. It's a feeling of relief. A good feeling.It's not about being a good sport, I'm not rubbing it in anyone's face or bragging about anything, I'm just choosing that my team wins. I feel bad for the other team that got screwed, but hey my guys won. What kind of sick fan would choose to be on the other side?You know that feeling when you go home with a loss because of a horrible call? The fans on the other side shouldn't have to feel that either. Bad fandom? I'll take being a good sport over a good fan any day of the week and twice on Sunday.I honestly don't believe you. You know that feeling after you win vs after you lose. You're taking the loss because of some higher moral obligation? Just ridiculous. That's bad fandom, take the win and get out of there.BigSteelThrill said:
Me, me, me.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
You must be high. Nice jump in logic.
The Redbeard
Footballguy
I totally disagree. Barry Bonds, Marion Jones, Tour d' France, High schoolers doing steroids. It is EXACTLY about the downfall of fair play, accountability and many things that make us proud to be American. Just my $.2, but if you would really have a win that everyone for ever would remember as a win you only got because of a terrible call... well, enjoy.Hello? It's football, the fate of the free world doesn't ride on it. This has nothing to do with the downfall of American society. This has to do with bad fans wanting their team to lose.Wow. Thats what went wrong with our political system.Its all about "my team". Has nothing to do with the sport itself.My team won, I'll take it. It's a feeling of relief. A good feeling.It's not about being a good sport, I'm not rubbing it in anyone's face or bragging about anything, I'm just choosing that my team wins. I feel bad for the other team that got screwed, but hey my guys won. What kind of sick fan would choose to be on the other side?You know that feeling when you go home with a loss because of a horrible call? The fans on the other side shouldn't have to feel that either. Bad fandom? I'll take being a good sport over a good fan any day of the week and twice on Sunday.I honestly don't believe you. You know that feeling after you win vs after you lose. You're taking the loss because of some higher moral obligation? Just ridiculous. That's bad fandom, take the win and get out of there.BigSteelThrill said:
Me, me, me.
southeastjerome
Footballguy
I understand that. At the same time, its a football game, so to say someone lacks integrity because they'd rather their team win b/c of a mistake is going a little bit overboard. Not to mention there are good and bad calls in almost every game against each team. To say one does not have integrity because of being happy with a win in a football game is insane. I'm over it though, I am totally comfortable with my integrity and I don't need to tell anyone what I do to uphold that. A fooball game, man, where are your priorities?
suchislife
Footballguy
A win is a win. There is no asterisk next to wins due a blown call. Sucks if you're on the losing end, but I'll take the win every time.
Integrity is not something that you pick and choose when to apply.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
suchislife
Footballguy
Fight the good fight guys. I hope you can change the direction of our decaying society. In the meantime I'll take a win by my team any way they come. And that was the OP's question.
Iwannabeacowboybaby!
Footballguy
I'm naive and a wishful thinker, but I'd want my team to win the right way. I wouldn't get as much satisfaction knowing and everyone else knowing that they really weren't the best team.
When I say The Dallas Cowboys were the best, I don't want from now until eternity someone saying "But if the ref didn't make the horrible call" they would never had won.
When I say The Dallas Cowboys were the best, I don't want from now until eternity someone saying "But if the ref didn't make the horrible call" they would never had won.
GregR_2
Footballguy
Joss Whedon once said, "If nothing we do matters, then all that matters is what we do." It sort of stuck with me.If our actions do matter in some concrete way, than our choices may be made just for the results that matter. If you're good because you believe good acts get you into heaven and you want to go to heaven, that's a case where your actions are guided strongly because you perceive they matter.
But what about if/when nothing that we do matters? In the absence of some greater meaning or effect, then the only things that matter are our choices and why we make them. If there is absolutely no gain for me, no benefit or consequences, then my choices to be good or bad, ethical or unethical, kind or mean, is one of the truest reflections on my character.
So I read the bolded statement above, that since my preference doesn't control things -- i.e. it doesn't matter -- that it removes any moral or ethical responsibility from me. I don't buy that. I believe such a moment is the truer test of a person's character. I'd prefer my team win the game, but as it was meant to be played and called, on each team's merits and with as little decided by the refs bad judgement as possible. My desire to see my team win does not outweigh that I don't think an undeserving fan base should be subjected to what comes with losing on a bad call.
Sure I'm ok with bad calls cancelling out in that game. But that isn't even close to the case here since it's an otherwise perfectly officiated game. And there may be some teams or fans who at times I may think are deserving of things going against them for things they've chose to do in the past.
But overall, I think my preference does matter. I thought the "just win" choice in the poll would have more people vote for it, but I'm surprised it was as big of a landslide as it was.
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roadkill1292
Footballguy
Well, I still don't know how to answer the question but I'm very OK with the call made on Dawson's double doinker FG in the Browns-Ravens game today. But I don't think I'm a very good "fan." More of an "interested observer."
roadkill1292
Footballguy
In an online poll at the Baltimore Sun, only 20% of respondents are voting that the Ravens got jobbed by yesterday's FG call, for whatever that's worth.
Road Warriors
Footballguy
So 20% of their readership is blind? Or they just don't get cable?
roadkill1292
Footballguy
If you'll read Joe Bryant's comments in the Browns-Ravens game thread you'll see him raising some issues that make the situation not so cut and dried. 20% is probably lower than some cities, higher than in others.
suchislife
Footballguy
In last night's Buf/NE game, Lee Evans trapped a ball that was initially ruled a catch on the field. Buffalo tried to hurry to the line to get the next play off before NE could challenge the call. The play was ultimately over turned. What if they did get play off? And further assume that Buffalo wasn't getting blown out, but that the play in question was a game winning TD catch and replay was inconclusive yet your team's players knew it wasn't a catch. Would you want your players to man-up and say to the ref "hey, I didn't really catch that ball...you should reverse your call". I don't think there's a reader in this forum that would be in work the next day saying to their co-workers "can you believe Lee Evans didn't admit he didn't really catch that ball? What an immoral piece of crap he is."
Was Buffalo wrong for hurrying to the line? Or should they have slowed down so NE could get a good look at the play? I want my team to hurry to the line. If that earns me a place in Hell, so be it.
Was Buffalo wrong for hurrying to the line? Or should they have slowed down so NE could get a good look at the play? I want my team to hurry to the line. If that earns me a place in Hell, so be it.
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southeastjerome
Footballguy
I don't disagree, not sure how that applies to what I said. To say someone lacks integrity because they want their team to win due to a circumstance of human error (which is a part of the game whether you like it or not) is crazy. So do you not root for a baseball team because they try to steal signs? You can say I lack integrity, and that is fine, but if I told you what I do in life you'd take back that statement in a heartbeat. Not sure where your priorities are, but I think you need to get off your high horse a little bit. Face the facts that there are errors in every single game, physical and mental and it is just part of the game (or any game for that matter). The best team surely does not always win and some times that is in your favorite team's favor and some time it is not. Morally, I don't think there is anything wrong with being happy your team won. Of course you are entitled to your own opinion. To each his own my friend.
Liquid Tension
Footballguy
I see this as two different things. If I was calling it, I would call it correctly. But knowing that bad calls go against my teams all the time, I would take the bad call win rather than a good call loss. The other reason is that EVERY play holding can be called and sometimes it is and sometimes it is not and it can have a HUGE impact on the game. What about that 40 yard PI call that was lame and only called because of a horribly short pass by the QB? The refs impact the game all the time and just because the bad call that went your way was the last one of the game doesn't make it the one that caused you to win.BTW, I was a huge supporter if instant replay because I wanted the calls to be correct, but I think instant replay has hurt the game... bad. First, the calls I talk about above and others like a chuck at 6 yards can have a huge impact on the game and they can't be reviewed. Instead we get many calls reviewed that are many time less meaningful than a holding call or pass interference. The game has also been slowed dramatically because of IR and we now have less plays in a game because of IR and that to me gives the better team less of an opportunity to win a game. Finally, you see teams run to the LOS to get a play off so the other team can't review a play in time and decide if they want to throw a challenge or not. It just has taken a lot out of the game IMO.
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Mungo Burrows
Footballguy
Having just had to go running back into a stadium from the parking lot. I can very safely say that I was much happier the first time I walked out of the stadium, and could have lived quite easily with myself getting the win, knowing that mistakes are made all the time, and sometimes they work out in your favor and sometimes they don't. For those touting "integrity", if I know a bad call was made and there's something I could do about it yet don't, then you can call my integrity into question. If you think I need to feel bad about an outcome that I was not a part of, and was in some part due to some third party making an honest mistake to have integrity, then I don't know if I want to have it. You can't feel bad every time breaks go against someone. They're part of life.roadkill1292 said:
GregR_2
Footballguy
Had to think about this for awhile as this is a great question on the topic, that made me had to think deeper about my beliefs to be able to express them clearly. Let me address the latter part first, about Lee Evans not admitting he didn't catch the ball.Under the conditions the NFL plays in, I completely agree that no one would think that of him. It isn't expected of him. Under other circumstances though I might be disappointed in someone. Guys who play pickup basketball and call fouls when they know there wasn't one, just because it's call your own and you can get away with it. I have a real life experience of a horrible volleyball tournament my college club team played in where the refs didn't even know the rules and most of the teams entered didn't know what they were doing. There was only one other decent team, and we were looking forward to playing with them and commented to them before the game we were looking forward to getting to play a game by the rules and such. During the championship match we're calling our own violations and such, even to the point of having to say to the ref, "No, really, I was in the net... blatantly in the net. It's their ball." They didn't reciprocate at all, and yes I thought a lot less of that team afterwards that they wouldn't reciprocate to have a good game when the refs were incompetent.Ok, back to the first part, about hurrying to the line. I want the refs to get the call right even if it hurts my team... but at the same time I don't expect teams to not hurry to the line. Kind of hard to explain even to myself why that is. I guess that I don't put a burden of responsibility on the team of allowing the refs time to correct a call if need be. The system should be set up so it isn't an issue. But the way the game is structured, yes, it isn't expected of teams to set about helping to correct a bad call.But that doesn't even remotely mean I should be off the hook for having the integrity for wanting to see the call made correctly in the first place. When the Texans are having a play reviewed and it's clear the call should go the other team's way, I am not cheering for the ref to make the wrong call just because it favors my team.I guess I'm saying, I can't fully express why I don't think poorly of the team for hurrying to the line. But that I don't doesn't change the fact that I think a person of integrity would rather see the correct call be made regardless of which team it benefits.
