Jump to content
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Recommended Posts

This story is worthy of a mention in this thread.

link

Insurer looks to part ways with NFL

A company that the NFL was hoping it could count on to help in its defense against concussion lawsuits is seeking to separate itself from the league.

Alterra America Insurance, which provided the NFL with an excess casualty insurance policy last season, has asked for a New York State Supreme Court judge to issue a declaratory judgment in its favor that would clear the firm from having to defend the league and pay for the damages associated with litigation that now involves more than 3,000 former players. Many of the player suits have been consolidated into a single case in a district court in Pennsylvania.

In a complaint filed on Monday, Alterra said the league had expressed it was expecting the company to be involved in both defending and covering the league should they lose in court.

Calls and emails made to Alterra, and a lawyer representing them, were not returned.

NFL spokesman Brian McCarthy said league officials couldn't specifically comment because its legal team has not been served with the papers related to the action.

McCarthy provided ESPN.com with a statement the league has been using for some time.

"The NFL has long made player safety a priority and continues to do so. Any allegation that the NFL intentionally sought to mislead players has no merit. It stands in contrast to the league's actions to better protect players and advance the science and medical understanding of the management and treatment of concussions."

Alterra, which only covered the league for one year, is one of many insurance companies with which the league has a policy. No other insurance company that has a relationship with the league has balked in defending and perhaps paying off future claims.

As the concussion lawsuits mount, a significant amount of pressure has been put on the insurance companies. In April, Riddell, the official helmet of the league which has been included in many of the player lawsuits, filed suit in California, after it said that three of the nine companies that it had insurance policies with -- ranging in time from 1959 to 1980 -- either failed to acknowledge the league had coverage with them or contested the insurance company wasn't liable for current claims against Riddell.

While ESPN is fawning over Tebow's Bday, important news continues to fly ubde the radar. This very significant story and the reports that the FBI found no evidence of Saints'spying are swept under the rug.
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 648
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

They need to get rid of automatic replay of all scoring plays and turnovers.  Now every exciting play is immediately followed by a hmm I wonder if it will stand.  We don't celebrate the play anymore,

Couple of thoughts: The popularity of the NFL increased with the rise in fantasy football.  I wonder if FFL reached its peak and is starting to tail off.  Maybe I'm way off, but it seems to me t

Perhaps.  But, there are a lot of other things that neuroscientists need to do. 1.  Establish an agreed upon pathology that differentiates CTE.  At present there are preliminary criteria, all of

I play a lot of soccer and am a fan/player of most sports and I can say with little doubt that the ONLY REASON SOCCER IS THE WORLDS SPORT IS BECAUSE IT IS THE CHEAPEST TO PLAY!

Case in point; Soccer, Hockey, Basketball, and water polo are essentially the same sport but 3/4 are costly to play and soccer is cheap. All you need is 1 ball and some dirt.

Also, the governing body of Soccer (FIFA) has the worst rulebook in all of major sports and refuses to change.

As long as we have upper end facilities in America, I think football is safe

Link to post
Share on other sites

The only thing that could kill football is if they soften the sport up to prevent head injuries. It's already beginning. It's a high risk sport. So long as players are made fully aware of the risks and are offered the best medical treatment possible, then I have no problem at all with it. If they choose to take on the risk, grown men should be allowed to compete in violent sports. If the sport gets too soft people will lose interest. That's a fact.

The other problem, of course, is the lawsuits piling up from past players. I personally see it as greed, though I know others would disagree with that. I believe they knew the risks just fine when they played. They made a lot of money, gained fame and bagged who knows how many women because of their status. They now see a way to cash in some more.

The possibility of the NFL dying is very real. Everything ends at some point for one reason or another. I hope it doesn't, and I don't think it will, but it could.

Edited by Hagger
Link to post
Share on other sites

The lawsuits will probably be a big deal, but it isn't going to kill football.

Already today's football player takes far less hits than they did in the 80's. Does anyone think Jahvid Best would be going on any sort of PUP list in the 80's? No way.

They barely hit in practice anymore.

Basically I think we are right now at the worst period in post-football damages, and it's only going to get better from here on out.

Especially as they continue to turn the sport into flag football.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

Excerpt from Peter King's MMQB:

Stat of the Week

I'm a week late on this, so let's call it the Stat of (Last) Week. But it's so interesting I wanted to make sure you didn't miss it in the absolute avalanche of good football data and stories as we approach the season.

Bill Barnwell, a writer for Grantland.com who I respect greatly, did a mortality study comparing retired baseball players with retired football players. He compared players in both sports who played at least five professional seasons between 1959 and 1988. There were 1,494 baseball players and 3,088 football players. Of the baseball players, 238 have died. Of the football players, 394 have died.

That means 15.9 percent of the major leaguers who played in the three decades of the study have died, which is more than the 12.8 percent of football players who died.

This comes on the heels of the March news from the National Institute of Occupational Health and Safety, which reported retired football players were living longer than people in the general population.

This is a nascent subject in society right now, but at the very least it appears a faulty premise that football players, who have thought for years that they were taking years off their lives by playing the sport professionally, actually die earlier than the average Joe who watches at home. The NIOSH study said former players lived longer than the general population, and Barnwell's valuable study suggested a cross-section of football players lived longer than their baseball counterparts--also a surprising piece of evidence. There are sure to be more studies, but Barnwell's unexpected findings contribute valuable data to an emotional subject.

Link to post
Share on other sites

This comes on the heels of the March news from the National Institute of Occupational Health and Safety, which reported retired football players were living longer than people in the general population.

Correlation shouldn't be confused with causation. Football players make a lot more money than the average person and thus have access to better health care. They are also among the best athletes on the planet, which would seem to bode well for their chances of living long and healthy lives. I don't think anyone would actually argue that playing the sport of football is healthy.It's more like football is a demanding sport and you have to be healthy to play it at a high level. And if you manage to reach that level, you reap economic rewards that will allow you a privileged existence.
Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not sure why death is the barometer used, other than that it's probably easy data to obtain.

Also, I don't really like the 5-year criteria. It's just not a good comparison point for the two sports. In one sport, a 5-year professional career is very short and probably above average in the other. It's possible that there are players who never made it to 5 years in football because of injuries (that possibly led to death?). And is he counting minor league ball as part of those five years? Just because a baseball player isn't appearing in MLB games, doesn't mean he's not playing baseball. A 5-year MLB career could be part of a 15-year professional baseball career.

I'd also guess that baseball players have a much different on-the-road life than football players. I wonder if that has any impacts?

Link to post
Share on other sites

This comes on the heels of the March news from the National Institute of Occupational Health and Safety, which reported retired football players were living longer than people in the general population.

Correlation shouldn't be confused with causation. Football players make a lot more money than the average person and thus have access to better health care. They are also among the best athletes on the planet, which would seem to bode well for their chances of living long and healthy lives. I don't think anyone would actually argue that playing the sport of football is healthy.It's more like football is a demanding sport and you have to be healthy to play it at a high level. And if you manage to reach that level, you reap economic rewards that will allow you a privileged existence.
Perhaps. That assumes former players are accessinghealth care services, leading healthy lifestyles, etc. in retirement. This group of retirees, by the way, aren't exactly gaziilionaires. Future NFLers, sure. But, it's really hard to point to concussions as a significant contributor to premature death when the theory, science, and epidemiological data all suck when used to support this hypothesis.
Link to post
Share on other sites

On a not really related note, but because I found it out due to this thread and I figure it doesn't deserve it's own thread...

That number that we've always heard about the average NFL career being about 3.5 seasons, is wrong. The average NFL career is 6 seasons.

Link to post
Share on other sites

This comes on the heels of the March news from the National Institute of Occupational Health and Safety, which reported retired football players were living longer than people in the general population.

Correlation shouldn't be confused with causation. Football players make a lot more money than the average person and thus have access to better health care. They are also among the best athletes on the planet, which would seem to bode well for their chances of living long and healthy lives. I don't think anyone would actually argue that playing the sport of football is healthy.It's more like football is a demanding sport and you have to be healthy to play it at a high level. And if you manage to reach that level, you reap economic rewards that will allow you a privileged existence.
Which is why he went on to compare them to baseball players. IMO, obesity and it's health effects are a bigger problem than concussions and the current media focus on concussions is obscuring that.
Link to post
Share on other sites

This comes on the heels of the March news from the National Institute of Occupational Health and Safety, which reported retired football players were living longer than people in the general population.

Correlation shouldn't be confused with causation. Football players make a lot more money than the average person and thus have access to better health care. They are also among the best athletes on the planet, which would seem to bode well for their chances of living long and healthy lives. I don't think anyone would actually argue that playing the sport of football is healthy.It's more like football is a demanding sport and you have to be healthy to play it at a high level. And if you manage to reach that level, you reap economic rewards that will allow you a privileged existence.
Which is why he went on to compare them to baseball players. IMO, obesity and it's health effects are a bigger problem than concussions and the current media focus on concussions is obscuring that.
Exactly. And the few neuropsychologists, neurosurgeons, and pathologists positing the cte hypothesis have a ton of $ at stake in scaring everybody into thinking brains are going to shrivel up as a result of concussions.
Link to post
Share on other sites

On a not really related note, but because I found it out due to this thread and I figure it doesn't deserve it's own thread...That number that we've always heard about the average NFL career being about 3.5 seasons, is wrong. The average NFL career is 6 seasons.

What's the median? People use "average" to indicate either "mean" or "median", and those are very different things when you're looking at an asymptotic curve (which is what career length is).
Link to post
Share on other sites

On a not really related note, but because I found it out due to this thread and I figure it doesn't deserve it's own thread...

That number that we've always heard about the average NFL career being about 3.5 seasons, is wrong. The average NFL career is 6 seasons.

What's the median? People use "average" to indicate either "mean" or "median", and those are very different things when you're looking at an asymptotic curve (which is what career length is).

Actually the issue is the NFLPA was touting 3.5 for career length when that was a totally different stat. 3.5 is the average experience of players currently in the league. So if you grab 100 active players (not retired players), and add up how many years they have already played, you get 3.5.

Apparently the NFL reported the correct number for career length (i.e. how many seasons before retiring) as 6.0 seasons during the lockout last season. A columnist got the raw numbers from the NFLPA and also from Pro Football Reference and confirmed the 6 year career average was the correct result. He said he got right around 6 from the NFLPA dataset, and about 6.3 from PFR's data set.

Edit to add: I still had the article open, here's the link: http://www.thebiglead.com/index.php/2011/04/22/nfl-career-length-and-average-age-versus-average-life-expectancy/

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...
  • 4 weeks later...

News of football's death has been greatly exaggerated.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/10/06/poll-finds-nfl-more-popular-than-ever/

Poll finds NFL more popular than ever

Posted by Michael David Smith on October 6, 2012

We have another data point indicating that the NFL is more popular than ever.

A Harris Poll of the American public, conducted September 25-27, found that 59 percent of Americans follow pro football, the highest level of interest in the NFL that Harris has ever found in its regular studies of the U.S. population.

Football remains popular and even shows a rise in interest since last year, the Harris Poll said in a release. In 2011, over half of Americans (55 percent) said they followed professional football a slight increase from 2010, when 53 percent said so. This year, that number rises further, with 59 percent of Americans saying they follow professional football; this is the highest percentage to indicate this since The Harris Poll first started asking the question in 1992.

Its been remarkable in recent years that nothing not an offseason lockout of players, not increasing emphasis in the media on the long-term health risks of concussions suffered while playing football, not the NFLs at times heavy-handed actions to try to curb concussions, not replacement refs, nothing can slow the growing popularity of the NFL. Its not just Americas most popular sport, it may be Americas most popular cultural institution of any kind. And theres no reason to think the NFL has stopped growing.

Edited by squistion
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

News of football's death has been greatly exaggerated.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/10/06/poll-finds-nfl-more-popular-than-ever/

Poll finds NFL more popular than ever

Posted by Michael David Smith on October 6, 2012

We have another data point indicating that the NFL is more popular than ever.

A Harris Poll of the American public, conducted September 25-27, found that 59 percent of Americans follow pro football, the highest level of interest in the NFL that Harris has ever found in its regular studies of the U.S. population.

“Football remains popular and even shows a rise in interest since last year,” the Harris Poll said in a release. “In 2011, over half of Americans (55 percent) said they followed professional football – a slight increase from 2010, when 53 percent said so. This year, that number rises further, with 59 percent of Americans saying they follow professional football; this is the highest percentage to indicate this since The Harris Poll first started asking the question in 1992.”

It’s been remarkable in recent years that nothing — not an offseason lockout of players, not increasing emphasis in the media on the long-term health risks of concussions suffered while playing football, not the NFL’s at times heavy-handed actions to try to curb concussions, not replacement refs, nothing — can slow the growing popularity of the NFL. It’s not just America’s most popular sport, it may be America’s most popular cultural institution of any kind. And there’s no reason to think the NFL has stopped growing.

The original article didn't dispute that Football is at the height of it's popularity (and still could climb even higher) but that mounting concerns over concussions and the quality of life that players have post-football could eventually result in a decline in enrollment in youth football which would eventually have an impact on the quality of the product on the field:

The timing is wrong for this story, but then again the timing would never be right. Because this story considers the idea that football's popularity -- even as millions of fans are tuning in this week to the scouting combine to watch something as unwatchable as potential draft picks running and lifting -- will fade over the coming years.

Maybe to extinction.

That's the hypothesis, and listen, it's not my hypothesis. Let me duck away from that one right now and put the blame for this story where it belongs, which is to say, with someone else. In January and then again earlier this month, an ESPN website ran stories suggesting the death of football. Hyperbolic -- that was my thought. In mid-February a Yahoo website ran a similar story, this one suggesting the death of youth football. More hyperbole. But I was starting to wonder.

Four days later, the NFL trotted out commissioner Roger Goodell, put him on one of the biggest sports-talk radio stations in the biggest city in America to say that we wouldn't see less football in the future; we would see more. Goodell told WEPN-AM 1050 in New York that he hears it "from the fans consistently -- people want more football." And then he said the NFL was open to increasing the regular-season schedule to 18 games in 2013 or '14.

Now that Goodell was doing damage control, I was really interested in the hypothesis -- not mine, mind you -- that football is entering its most dangerous era. And then five days after Goodell's comments, NFL analyst Troy Aikman went on HBO's Real Sports and said football in this country "is at a real crossroads.

"If I had a 10-year-old boy," Aikman said, "I don't know that I'd be real inclined to encourage him to go play football, in light of what we're learning from head injuries. And so what is the sport going to look like 20 years from now? I believe, and this is my opinion, that at some point football is not going to be the No. 1 sport."

Now I'm sold. This hypothesis is no longer their hypothesis -- it's mine. Now I'm starting to think, you know, there's something to this. At the very least, there's something to the possibility that football's popularity, if not its outright existence, could become endangered thanks to mounting head injuries.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Today Goodell fined the Cards' kicker for a late hit.Seriously.

Fines are given by a former player (Merton Hanks) and any appeal handled by 2 former coaches (Art Shell and Ted Cottrell). Goodell isn't involved in the process.Not sure what the position of a player making an illegal and unnecessary hit has to do with anything. Are you arguing they shouldn't apply discipline consistently?
Link to post
Share on other sites

How is this any different than anything else that is dangerous, like skydiving or coal mining?

Just have the guys sign a waiver and be done with it. I will concede that there might be some pain on the front end of these lawsuits because old players can say they didn't know it was so dangerous, but once that shakes out the new guys will just sign waivers.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Today Goodell fined the Cards' kicker for a late hit.Seriously.

I love how Saints fans are still so bitter, they will do leap any intellectual hurdles they can to lambast the NFL.Seriously, my man, chill. Goodell didn't fine anybody. Stop freaking out.ETA: As much as some of you guys hate the NFL and want it to thrown into extinction, but this league is gonna' proceed as usual in dominating all others. Not sure why you wish apocalyptic failure on the sport that I, and a lot of folks here, enjoy so much. Thankfully, you guys are just a touch on the delusional end of the spectrum. Edited by cobalt_27
Link to post
Share on other sites

Today Goodell fined the Cards' kicker for a late hit.Seriously.

I love how Saints fans are still so bitter, they will do leap any intellectual hurdles they can to lambast the NFL.Seriously, my man, chill. Goodell didn't fine anybody. Stop freaking out.ETA: As much as some of you guys hate the NFL and want it to thrown into extinction, but this league is gonna' proceed as usual in dominating all others. Not sure why you wish apocalyptic failure on the sport that I, and a lot of folks here, enjoy so much. Thankfully, you guys are just a touch on the delusional end of the spectrum.
Thanks for the response and exchange, I appreciate it even though you've got a few strawmen in there. But the point I raised has nothing to do with the Saints, Goodell is regulating the game into something less recognizable than what has been an amazing 90 year institution. Sorry I think this is a 'boiling the water a degree at a time' issue.http://www.arizonasports.com/?nid=40&sid=1580246http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/10/05/kicker-jay-feely-fined-for-unnecessary-roughness/http://www.revengeofthebirds.com/2012/10/3/3446770/jay-feely-discusses-personal-foul-penalty-game-winning-field-goal Edited by SaintsInDome2006
Link to post
Share on other sites

Today Goodell fined the Cards' kicker for a late hit.Seriously.

Fines are given by a former player (Merton Hanks) and any appealed handled by 2 former coaches (Art Shell and Ted Cottrell). Goodell isn't involved in the process.Not sure what the position of a player making an illegal and unnecessary hit has to do with anything. Are you arguing they shouldn't apply discipline consistently?
Maybe I should consider the hit, agreed, but on a kicker on a touchback, how bad could it be?Let them play the game.
Link to post
Share on other sites

ETA: As much as some of you guys hate the NFL and want it to thrown into extinction, but this league is gonna' proceed as usual in dominating all others. Not sure why you wish apocalyptic failure on the sport that I, and a lot of folks here, enjoy so much. Thankfully, you guys are just a touch on the delusional end of the spectrum.

We can have football without having to sign on to the NFL being the powerful entity that it is. I can understand the critics of the league much better than I can its defenders.
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 4 months later...

Report: Goodell 'terrified' a player could die during game

Brad Biggs

In an expansive and well-written profile, Don Van Natta Jr. reports that NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell has privately expressed fears that a player could die on the field if the game’s “hard-knocks culture doesn’t change.”

According to the report for ESPN, Goodell has told one Hall of Fame player he speaks to on a regular basis he is “terrified of it.” Goodell fears tragedy striking for all the reasons you can imagine.

"It wouldn't just be a tragedy,” the Hall of Famer told Van Natta. “It would be awfully bad for business.”

Business, of course, is booming under Goodell and that is one of the primary focuses of the piece. The NFL is expected to exceed $10 billion in revenue this year and Goodell has marked $25 billion as a goal by 2027, in less than 15 years.

Only once in NFL history has a player died during a contest. Detroit Lions wide receiver Chuck Hughes suffered a heart attack during a game in 1971. Hopefully, there isn’t another death anytime soon.

Link to post
Share on other sites
From the article:

Goodell said the league’s concussion research is important because it also will help the average person in the long term.

“Most concussions don’t even occur in competition sports,” he said. “Football concussions are a small percentage of total concussions.

A true statement, but not really that relevant to the issue of NFL players and concussions.
Link to post
Share on other sites

ETA: As much as some of you guys hate the NFL and want it to thrown into extinction, but this league is gonna' proceed as usual in dominating all others. Not sure why you wish apocalyptic failure on the sport that I, and a lot of folks here, enjoy so much. Thankfully, you guys are just a touch on the delusional end of the spectrum.

We can have football without having to sign on to the NFL being the powerful entity that it is. I can understand the critics of the league much better than I can its defenders.
I criticize or applaud decisions and policy, not letters or titles. Whether it's a corporate enterprise, government institution, private individual, or non-profit organization doesn't matter to me. I get the sense you're just an anti-establishment guy on principle, so of course you hate the NFL.
Link to post
Share on other sites

ETA: As much as some of you guys hate the NFL and want it to thrown into extinction, but this league is gonna' proceed as usual in dominating all others. Not sure why you wish apocalyptic failure on the sport that I, and a lot of folks here, enjoy so much. Thankfully, you guys are just a touch on the delusional end of the spectrum.

We can have football without having to sign on to the NFL being the powerful entity that it is. I can understand the critics of the league much better than I can its defenders.
I criticize or applaud decisions and policy, not letters or titles. Whether it's a corporate enterprise, government institution, private individual, or non-profit organization doesn't matter to me. I get the sense you're just an anti-establishment guy on principle, so of course you hate the NFL.
Goodness, I don't know if I can adequately resume a conversation after a five month break.I want the NFL to be better, not extinct. I think it abuses its power and treats its employees shamefully.
Link to post
Share on other sites

ETA: As much as some of you guys hate the NFL and want it to thrown into extinction, but this league is gonna' proceed as usual in dominating all others. Not sure why you wish apocalyptic failure on the sport that I, and a lot of folks here, enjoy so much. Thankfully, you guys are just a touch on the delusional end of the spectrum.

We can have football without having to sign on to the NFL being the powerful entity that it is. I can understand the critics of the league much better than I can its defenders.
I criticize or applaud decisions and policy, not letters or titles. Whether it's a corporate enterprise, government institution, private individual, or non-profit organization doesn't matter to me. I get the sense you're just an anti-establishment guy on principle, so of course you hate the NFL.
Goodness, I don't know if I can adequately resume a conversation after a five month break.I want the NFL to be better, not extinct. I think it abuses its power and treats its employees shamefully.
The poor players are victims of such maltreatment, indeed. Abuse of power through collective bargaining?My dad's still stuck in the 60s, too. Some people never grow out of it. I'm cool with you, bro. :thumbup:
Link to post
Share on other sites

ETA: As much as some of you guys hate the NFL and want it to thrown into extinction, but this league is gonna' proceed as usual in dominating all others. Not sure why you wish apocalyptic failure on the sport that I, and a lot of folks here, enjoy so much. Thankfully, you guys are just a touch on the delusional end of the spectrum.

We can have football without having to sign on to the NFL being the powerful entity that it is. I can understand the critics of the league much better than I can its defenders.
I criticize or applaud decisions and policy, not letters or titles. Whether it's a corporate enterprise, government institution, private individual, or non-profit organization doesn't matter to me. I get the sense you're just an anti-establishment guy on principle, so of course you hate the NFL.
Goodness, I don't know if I can adequately resume a conversation after a five month break.I want the NFL to be better, not extinct. I think it abuses its power and treats its employees shamefully.
And how do you feel about the player's actions?I don't know if you're anti-establishment as he suggested. But I'll just point out.... he's saying he supports or condemns the merits of individual decisions. Your response to him was just to list some negatives of the one side, the NFL. Didn't really do much to show his impression was wrong.I personally think both sides abuse their power and behave shamefully and there's plenty of room to be critical of both sides.
Link to post
Share on other sites

ETA: As much as some of you guys hate the NFL and want it to thrown into extinction, but this league is gonna' proceed as usual in dominating all others. Not sure why you wish apocalyptic failure on the sport that I, and a lot of folks here, enjoy so much. Thankfully, you guys are just a touch on the delusional end of the spectrum.

We can have football without having to sign on to the NFL being the powerful entity that it is. I can understand the critics of the league much better than I can its defenders.
I criticize or applaud decisions and policy, not letters or titles. Whether it's a corporate enterprise, government institution, private individual, or non-profit organization doesn't matter to me. I get the sense you're just an anti-establishment guy on principle, so of course you hate the NFL.
Goodness, I don't know if I can adequately resume a conversation after a five month break.I want the NFL to be better, not extinct. I think it abuses its power and treats its employees shamefully.
And how do you feel about the player's actions?I don't know if you're anti-establishment as he suggested. But I'll just point out.... he's saying he supports or condemns the merits of individual decisions. Your response to him was just to list some negatives of the one side, the NFL. Didn't really do much to show his impression was wrong.I personally think both sides abuse their power and behave shamefully and there's plenty of room to be critical of both sides.
The cards are heavily stacked in favor of the owners and labor relations nearly always go their way. Wishing for a little success by the other side feels pretty reasonable. I'm not really sure what "anti-establishment" means but, since the "establishment's" primary mission is its own preservation, being wary of its power doesn't seem like such a bad thing.Football has always had its authoritarian streak and its most fervent fans seem pretty comfortable with a strong, almost inviolable structure. That doesn't sit well with me and I'll usually side with labor in almost any situation, sometimes to extremes. But our friend Cobalt isn't nearly as even-handed as he likes to think, either; his first instinct is to get defensive because someone might be challenging the "game he loves."
Link to post
Share on other sites

I know they want to change the culture of football from the ground up, but this can be a slippery slope here. I'd say most helmet to helmet hits are accidental.

2013's new college football rules include automatic ejections for hits

The NCAA Playing Rules Oversight Panel approved a new rule on Thursday, in which players that target and hit defenseless players above the shoulders will be ejected as a result. The previous penalty for targeting was a 15-yard personal foul penalty, which will still be assessed on top of the ejection going forward. If a player is ejected in the first half of a game, he will miss the remainder of it, but if it occurs in the second half, he will also miss the first half of the following game.

The decision to eject the player will be reviewable, and can be overturned if the replay official can find conclusive evidence that the player did not deserve to be ejected. The conferences can also review the penalty after the game, and add or reduce sanctions or suspensions as needed.

I don't disagree with the change. Hitting players in the head is so unbelievably dangerous, especially when that contact comes from the other player's helmet. If there's any way to really get people's attention that these kinds of hits will not be tolerated, kicking the players out of the game is a good way to start.

That said, considering the general state of dissatisfaction with the state of college football officiating, I can all but guarantee there will be an extremely squirrelly call that overturns a targeting ejection this year. Football isn't alone in the bad officiating department, though, so you take the good with the bad, I suppose.

Edited by Amused to Death
Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not really sure what "anti-establishment" means

...and I'll usually side with labor in almost any situation, sometimes to extremes.

Well, there you go. There's your answer.By the way, "the establishment" is no different than individuals or labor groups in their pursuit of self-preservation. That's why it's important to evaluate the merits and reasonableness of the actions and activities of the individuals/groups in each specific case. But, given your admissions above, it seems pretty clear you really don't care about that.
Link to post
Share on other sites

A very important cautionary statement published this week by a panel of preeminent neurologists and neuropsychologists who took part in the most recent October/November 2012 Zurich Conference regarding concussions and sports-related head injuries:

At present, there are no published epidemiological, crosssectionalor prospective studies relating to modern CTE. Owingto the nature of the published studies, being case reports orpathological case series, it is not possible to determine the causalityor risk factors with any certainty. As such, the speculationthat repeated concussion or subconcussive impacts cause CTEremains unproven.The extent to which age-related changes, psychiatric ormental health illness, alcohol/drug use or coexisting dementingillnesses contribute to this process is largely unaccounted for inthe published literature. In addition, consideration for thepotential genetic risk in those athletes with a family history ofneurodegenerative disease and the extent to which this contributesto the clinical and pathological profiles also requirefurther investigation.SUMMARYAt present, the interpretation of causation in the modern CTEcase studies should proceed cautiously. The causal assumptionsrequire further prospective or longitudinal studies on the topic.Ultimately, scientific research might establish that participationin contact sports leads to a distinct neuropathological syndrome,and this neuropathology causes psychiatric, cognitive and physicalproblems, but this cause and effect relationship remains tobe shown scientifically.

McCrory P, et al. Br J Sports Med 2013;47:327–330. doi:10.1136/bjsports-2013-092248
Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe they should just shut down the whole league. Say it has disolved and come up with a new league where anyone participating has to sign a waiver that they can't sue for these brain injuries and brain disorders years later. The same guys that are playing right now would crawl over each other to sign the waiver. When your options are $ millions playing football vs $ thousands as a 9-5 ham and egger at best, you will sign.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe they should just shut down the whole league. Say it has disolved and come up with a new league where anyone participating has to sign a waiver that they can't sue for these brain injuries and brain disorders years later. The same guys that are playing right now would crawl over each other to sign the waiver. When your options are $ millions playing football vs $ thousands as a 9-5 ham and egger at best, you will sign.

Surprised this already isnt happeneing. Not that it would stand up in court, it would just cause more litigation
Link to post
Share on other sites

Brian Westbrook suffering already, he's 33:http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/3/16/4112080/brian-westbrook-concussion-memory-loss

The NFL is mandating knee and thigh pads, but they don't require the use of mouthpieces that can reduce concussions. Nor do they mandate the use of safer helmets even though they are available.But they'll continue to change the rules to make the game 'safer'. :loco:
Link to post
Share on other sites

It's already dead to me.

I predict a rival league starts up which going back to the rules pre 2000 and makes all players sign a waiver to play. There is so much money to be had it will eventually happen. I don't understand how the UFC can get away with letting guys destroy each other but football cant.

Link to post
Share on other sites

It's already dead to me. I predict a rival league starts up which going back to the rules pre 2000 and makes all players sign a waiver to play. There is so much money to be had it will eventually happen. I don't understand how the UFC can get away with letting guys destroy each other but football cant.

Re: it already being dead to youHave you stopped watching the NFL as much as you once did? Or have you stopped entirely?
Link to post
Share on other sites

What I don't get is that the two sports with a serious problem with concussions are football and soccer. Yet I don't see anyone going after soccer. I don't hear people saying they should stop playing both football and soccer. Its just football that is the problem apparently. I don't get it. Should they at least be forcing soccer players to wear helmets, and ban heading the soccer ball?

Link to post
Share on other sites

It's already dead to me. I predict a rival league starts up which going back to the rules pre 2000 and makes all players sign a waiver to play. There is so much money to be had it will eventually happen. I don't understand how the UFC can get away with letting guys destroy each other but football cant.

Re: it already being dead to youHave you stopped watching the NFL as much as you once did? Or have you stopped entirely?
I still watch some but nowhere near the way I used to. It isn't because I'm older or because of the kids as I'm still home on Sundays and Monday. i just choose to do other things. It's still entertaining, it just isn't the same game I watched for 30 years. Edited by STEADYMOBBIN 22
Link to post
Share on other sites

It's already dead to me. I predict a rival league starts up which going back to the rules pre 2000 and makes all players sign a waiver to play. There is so much money to be had it will eventually happen. I don't understand how the UFC can get away with letting guys destroy each other but football cant.

Re: it already being dead to youHave you stopped watching the NFL as much as you once did? Or have you stopped entirely?
I still watch some but no where near the way I used to. It isn't because I'm older or because of the kids as I'm still home on Sundays and Monday. i just choose to do other things. It's still entertaining, it just isn't the same game I watched for 30 years.
I still watch almost every game that is televised by me (had ST from 00-10 but cancelled the past two seasons to save money) but I do not like the sport as much as I once did. In fact, I totally passed on one Sunday last season. Went to Ikea instead.
Link to post
Share on other sites

Brian Westbrook suffering already, he's 33:http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/3/16/4112080/brian-westbrook-concussion-memory-loss

Sorry, but Westbrook's amnestic disorder is very unlikely to be the result of concussions. That said, I wish him well in his recovery. Edited by cobalt_27
Link to post
Share on other sites

I find it fascinating the Boston group, heels dug in on the CTE issue, have become so incensed by their peers in the scientific community for not adopting their degree of certainty of the proposed concussion-->CTE link that they're going so far as to diminish the scientific process that is the very foundation of the empirical nature of their work. Says Ann McKee (neuropathologist):

"This is a time that calls for immediate action to reduce the amount of head trauma experienced by athletes in all sports to prevent CTE...and it is now irresponsible to justify inaction by requesting a level of scientific proof that will take decades to acquire."

I've been to a half-dozen conferences / talks given by the BU group (McKee, Cantu, and/or Stern) over the last five years. Bright folks and obviously knowledgable as anyone about brain-behavior relationships. But, the concern I've had with with them is that they have morphed away from science and have become social advocates. Nothing wrong with having a loose agenda in science. Very much a driving part of human nature and the scientific process, itself. But, they have become so agenda-driven and incentivized monetarily and professionally by advancing the CTE issue that I really think they have lost all semblance of objectivity.I am glad to see the neurologists, neuropsychologists, and other neuroscientists take a more cautionary tone in their recent consensus statement. The Boston group has masterfully manipulated the media for far too long. And it is not to say that they aren't at least partially right in their hypotheses. But, as scientists, I wish they held the process in a little bit higher regard.
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.


×
×
  • Create New...