Sabertooth
Footballguy
I'll give you that Adrian was a better athlete. But his key fumbles in big games are a huge weakness.
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Adrian Peterson Status Updates (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter TheFanatic
- Start date
Peterson wasn't perfect, I'd probably have him outside the top-10 of all-time, but that is some pretty huge nitpicking. I can really only think of 2 major fumbles in Peterson's career, and neither of those swung the the game. they still beat Seattle in 2016(in the coldest game in NFL history) if Walsh makes a gimme FG, and they still beat NO in 2010(a game Peterson had 120 yards and 3 TD's in), if Favre doesn't throw that horrible across the field INT. So really, I'm not sure any of Peterson's fumbles were that huge of a deal.
Walter Payton was annually among the fumble leaders, and he's universally considered a top-3 RB of all time. Much rather have guys who took over games and occasionally made mistakes, than good players who didn't make mistakes.
Mr. Irrelevant
IBL Representative
That near-1,400-yard stat line of his looks appealing, but it needs to be pointed out that in that 2009 season, "former 1st-round pick" Ronnie Brown got the clear majority of the workload from jump. Williams only became the lead back by default (putting up 2/3 of his rush yards) after Week 9, when Brown went down for the season.
I could see a very similar situation playing out for the Saints this year, with the caveat that they'll likely run the ball about 100 fewer times than the '09 Dolphins did - further reducing AP's fantasy value in the absence of an Ingram injury.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Not really. Fumbles are huge. Three in one game is laughably bad. That they came in the NFCC game is just historically bad. They were much better than the Saints that year. Peterson dropped the ball.
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But they didn't was the point, those games should have been won despite those 2 fumbles, and even then that is 2 games in a 10 year career.
Fumbles are completely acceptable if they are complimented by a ton of big plays. For every fumble Peterson had, he had about 350 yards and 2-3 TDs. That is 100% acceptable.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
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Because a RB can only carry mediocre teams with bad coaching so far. I mean, Barry Sanders had only one career playoff win too.
ETA: Dickerson only had 2 playoff wins, OJ Simpson had 0.
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Sabertooth
Footballguy
Adrian isn't as good as Barry either. And that's the thing. Adrian didn't carry the Vikings into the playoffs. Brett did. Adrian lost the game for them.
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Agree, Peterson isn't as good as Sanders.
Favre, while I agree was more important during the season, was more responsible for that loss than Peterson was. He had 2 INT's, 1 being a throw that had a near 0% chance of success. Also that was one season with good QB play in Peterson's entire career. Teddy Bridgewater is the 2nd best QB Peterson has ever played with. Playing with Brees might be a FAR bigger deal than anyone thinks.
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Sabertooth
Footballguy
We can have different opinions. Have a great weekend.
TheFanatic
Footballguy
ADP played in 5 playoff games.
His first, against the Eagles in 2008 he put up 20/83 and 2 TD's His QB? Tarvaris Jackson who went 15/35 for 164, 0 TD's and a pick. And the WR's on that team were :X
His second game was 2009. He puts up 63 rushing yards and 19 receiving yards and they win
His third game was the same year. He goes for 122 yards on 25 carries and 3 TD's. He also has the 2 fumbles
His fourth game wasn't until 2012 where he has 99 yards on 22 carries. Joe Webb went 11/30 and 180 yards, a TD and a pic
His last game was 2015 where he went for a measly 45 yards on 23 carries and a fumble. The QB, Bridgewater went 17/24 for 146 and 0 TD's and picks.
1st loss, QB was terrible. Second loss, he puts up 122 and 3. Third loss, QB was horrendous. Fourth loss, QB was awful
I don't think we can saddle the RB for those losses.
His first, against the Eagles in 2008 he put up 20/83 and 2 TD's His QB? Tarvaris Jackson who went 15/35 for 164, 0 TD's and a pick. And the WR's on that team were :X
His second game was 2009. He puts up 63 rushing yards and 19 receiving yards and they win
His third game was the same year. He goes for 122 yards on 25 carries and 3 TD's. He also has the 2 fumbles
His fourth game wasn't until 2012 where he has 99 yards on 22 carries. Joe Webb went 11/30 and 180 yards, a TD and a pic
His last game was 2015 where he went for a measly 45 yards on 23 carries and a fumble. The QB, Bridgewater went 17/24 for 146 and 0 TD's and picks.
1st loss, QB was terrible. Second loss, he puts up 122 and 3. Third loss, QB was horrendous. Fourth loss, QB was awful
I don't think we can saddle the RB for those losses.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Really, I think this could be very effective. And I believe AP's receiving will be improved, just a hunch but when Brees works with receivers he works with them.
AP didn't lose that Saints game.....and Favre's interception late was a desperation late heave that didn't cost them the game either. What cost them the game was Childress' inept coaching ability and allowing 12 men in the huddle coming out of a timeout when the Vikes were barely in FG range. That is what cost them the game late. If they just have a normal play and do something safe the Vikes kick a FG and win in regulation. Childress was terrible.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Three fumbles right?Gally said:
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
I've been following this conversation (and really I'm pretty positive about AP's fit with NO0, but I think the bigger takeaway here (Saber I think does have a point, AP scored 3 TDs in that game but he also had those key fumbles) is that AP has played 10 seasons and maybe has had 1-2 with excellent QB play.
He's played with one top 10 offense in his career, that 2009 season. The Saints are top 10 every year under Payton and frequently top 2. I have no idea if it's too late for him health/age wise, we will find out. We know he has the determination, and how. But if he is healthy, this is his best opportunity since that 2009 season.
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AP had two fumbles (lost 1). Favre accounted for more turnovers on the day, however the single biggest reason the Vikes lost that day was due to the ineptitude of Brad Childress. He was a terrible head coach. How can you allow a 12 men in the huddle penalty coming out of a timeout when you are in FG range to win the game to go to the Super Bowl. Terrible.
DLR
Footballguy
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Dude (as in AP), STHU. Yes, you have the requisite equipment for ball catching - a pair of hands. It's not bad coaching or QB that stunted your involvement in the passing game.
Just wait until Sean Payton starts jacking with the RB depth chart and load distribution. AP is going to complain like a teenager asked to clean his room.
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Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
TheFanatic
Footballguy
Will Payton bust out the switch if he does?Andy Dufresne said:
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
That doesn't go over well with the Saints. He'll sit. However I have a feeling Payton will love Peterson if he has his wheels.Andy Dufresne said:
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
That should read "Peterson is full of himself, as usual."
Interseptopus
Footballguy
I never understand why some players don't set realistic goals...
Maybe they do and this is all for show, just to get people talking about them
Maybe they do and this is all for show, just to get people talking about them
Ilov80s
Footballguy
It's better than him saying, "I'm not good at catching the ball so I will settle for whatever I can get."
Ilov80s
Footballguy
--Teams generally don't part with franchise/HOF players until they're done - usually a year too late, if anything, so they don't alienate the fan base. MINN didn't cut him through the child abuse stuff because he could still play. Declining his option indicates they think he's done.
--He ended up signing a contract worth RB25 money which indicates every other team thought he's done, too. And even that money is HEAVILY tied to incentives for games played, rushing totals, and touchdowns scored. The team most high on him and willing to give him a contract think there's a good chance he could be done as well, having only $2.5M signing bonus tied up in him for sure...which is very little for the NFL.
--NO runs 3-4 different backs through touches. Last year, in a game where Ingram was dominating, they gave 3 rushing TDs inside the 1 yard line, in one game, to John Kuhn. Even if AP does magically get his groove back, that backfield is a land mine for fantasy value.
--He can talk all he wants about catching balls but that was never a big part of his game and it's not going to start at age 32.
Wasted pick any earlier than the 6th round in PPR, imo. I won't consider him until the 7th. In non-PPR I would consider him in the 5th.
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Been plenty of practice reports.
Word early was he looked great but those were non-contact drills.
Last week they held joint practices with the Chargers and he made several nice runs that had Saints beat writers saying how impressive he looked, I believe he was even described as looking like the best player on the Saints offense on a day they otherwise got destroyed by the Chargers defense.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Without getting into whether or not Peterson is done, or if the Vikes think he is, wasn't the option for close to $15MM. It's not surprising they did not pick that up.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Yeah his ADP on FF Calc is late 4th/early 5th. That's too expensive. However in mocks, I often see him at the 6/7 turn and think it's a decent pick.
matttyl
Footballguy
Ilov80s
Footballguy
matttyl
Footballguy
I can't see how, without an injury to either, either of them is going to be much of a value, though. What WRs are going in that range?
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
One of them likely will return value - but it's too risky trying to pick which one imo. If I had to take one, Ingram would be the easy decision between those two, but frankly with Kamara also likely being involved, no thanks.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Diggs, Garcon and Desean were the WRs taken after him in the last one. You think they just cancel each other completely? Saints are always among the highest scoring backfields. It makes sense to me to get a piece.
