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Dynasty Value Discussion Thread (15 Viewers)
- Thread starter spider321
- Start date
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Snorkelson
Footballguy
-OZ-
Footballguy
Pretend he's available in the draft, I'd take him just ahead of Ridley but not ahead of Barkley, Guice, or Michel. I'd give my 1.04 for him, you could make an argument that he's worth 1.03.
So I think you're giving at least a 19 1st (probably a good bit more), if not a good young back. It seems like an overpay but something like juju and Henry would probably be considered by either side.
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-OZ-
Footballguy
I'm still bigger on Everett than most.
Shaheen
Everett
Kittle
Smith
Rico
RSJ
I have RSJ in two leagues, if offered any of the other 5 straight up it would be an automatic accept.
I can see pitting Rico above kittle due to a higher ceiling but more risk. But while we're all looking for that next big thing, the basketball player turned stud te, it actually works less often than we'd like to think. And he hasn't shown the most important aspect, an ability to stay healthy. But if you're a gambler, he's probably worth pursuing.
Andrew74
Footballguy
1.01>>>>>Juju
I have the 1.02 in one league (0.5PPR) and wouldn’t think twice rejecting Juju.
I’d put him mid-1st.
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thriftyrocker
Footballguy
TBH I would probably rank Rico first of all those for exactly those reasons. I don't believe in the upside of any of the other of those guys, and the state of the position makes solid but unspectacular production unappealing. They are all pretty even though, except RSJ.
This is exactly how I'd rank them, too. Everett seems so overlooked. The guy was the 12th pick of the 2nd round last year, only what like 15 picks behind Njoku. TEs usually take a year or two or three to develop.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
In the league I have the 1.03, I'd run to the podium with the Smith-Shuster card in my hand.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
I don't get the Rico love. He has Austin Collie level concussion issues, he's never suited up on game day, and RSJ flashed as much in season as Rico did in the preseason. Give me RSJ.
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Hankmoody
Footballguy
RSJ wasn't on the list
With Gathers it's a risk/reward function. Yeah, he's probably "least likely" to hit his potential, but man-oh-man if he does. So you're basically saying "hes's a 98 on Madden, but only a 25% chance to get there" vs. Shaheen who's probably a 70% chance to hit 85 or better. I like Shaheen a ton, but aside from that if I have to hold a TE for a year or two like most need, I'd rather it be the guy with the highest ceiling. Those guys tend to maintain the highest exit value too.
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Zyphros
Footballguy
I have an offer to take on Rico, but that would require me to cut RSJ and a RB that I don't want to cut which is why I posed the ranking question. They're all pretty close to me. I really like what I saw out of Shaheen so he'd be my #1, but after that is all up the in air it seems.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Ricky Seals-Jones was on the list.RSJ wasn't on the list
With Gathers it's a risk/reward function. Yeah, he's probably "least likely" to hit his potential, but man-oh-man if he does. So you're basically saying "hes's a 98 on Madden, but only a 25% chance to get there" vs. Shaheen who's probably a 70% chance to hit 85 or better. I like Shaheen a ton, but aside from that if I have to hold a TE for a year or two like most need, I'd rather it be the guy with the highest ceiling. Those guys tend to maintain the highest exit value too.
25% is far too generous. I put his odds as ever starting a game lower than that, never mind reaching Gates levels.
The guy was a late 6th round pick and couldn't make the 53 man roster. And he wasn't signed away by another team, meaning he couldn't make a single 53 man roster.
Not every Power Forward not good enough for the NBA is the next Graham/Gates. Especially those who didn't even play football in high school.
Roster spots are valuable. I don't have room on my rosters for practice squad darlings.
I thought he was placed on IR or a PUP list due to a concussion in preseason which is why he wasn't on the roster. It wasn't that he didn't make the 53 man roster it was that he was injured.
NeverEnough
Footballguy
Any signs Higbee is gone this year, though? That didn't help Everett. I own Everett, Gronk & J. Cook. I want to move Gronk to upgrade elsewhere, but do not feel comfortable with only those 2 left at TE...
Concept Coop
Footballguy
He didn't make the roster as a rookie and he wasn't a lock to make it last season either. He was 4th on the depth chart and the Cowboys only carry 3x TEs.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
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Hankmoody
Footballguy
He made the cut to 53 and was IR'd after that. Otherwise he wouldn't have been eligible to return. It's likely they did that out of fear of losing him to another team if they tried to IR him in preseason.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
I think you're right. If we want to say he was going to make the 53 man roster either way, I'm fine with that. I don't think it was a lock, however, as he doesn't offer anything on special teams and wasn't ready to play inline. I could certainly be wrong about that, however. Point stands that he's never suited up and spent his rookie year on the practice squad without being signed away.
No, Higbee will be a short term deterrent. I'm not in a rush to buy Everett (don't own him anywhere) for that reason but I do like his long term outlook. He was drafted by the current regime. Higbee was not. Although I do believe it is the same GM and I don't know how much influence McVay has on draft picks.
NeverEnough
Footballguy
Pick 13 out of how many? PPR?
Your roster looks like? I own Kupp in multiple leagues & would not move him unless it improves my team elsewhere that I need it without hurting me @ WR.
Pwingles
Footballguy
12 team, 5 or 6 round rookie/fa draft
must start
2qb, 2rb,2wr,2te, 3 rwt flex
2db,2dl,2lb,2 idp flex
alshon and g tate are my best wr, cupp 3rd best
whole roster is not great, need help about everywhere, highlights are
cam, alshon, kelce, freeman
building blocks for each position but not great at all.
Open to dealing cupp but feel like 13,38 is light. Originally asked for 13,14 and he countered.
Im picking from the 4 slot, prolly going best rb but due to league structure and needing depth everywhere i have no clue how people are going to value these qbs ao i may end up with a better than expected rb
must start
2qb, 2rb,2wr,2te, 3 rwt flex
2db,2dl,2lb,2 idp flex
alshon and g tate are my best wr, cupp 3rd best
whole roster is not great, need help about everywhere, highlights are
cam, alshon, kelce, freeman
building blocks for each position but not great at all.
Open to dealing cupp but feel like 13,38 is light. Originally asked for 13,14 and he countered.
Im picking from the 4 slot, prolly going best rb but due to league structure and needing depth everywhere i have no clue how people are going to value these qbs ao i may end up with a better than expected rb
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jeaton6
Footballguy
Wtih all the Barkley hype what does everyone think it takes to close the gap from 1.1 Rookie pick to 1.1 start-up pick OBJ? Assuming this is established league?
In picks: My gut says it should take at least an early 1st round rookie pick like 1.3 but perhaps I’m still not sold on Barkley as some.
In players: Someone like Juju or Corey Davis?
In picks: My gut says it should take at least an early 1st round rookie pick like 1.3 but perhaps I’m still not sold on Barkley as some.
In players: Someone like Juju or Corey Davis?
jeaton6
Footballguy
No I’m just describing OBJ as the average dynasty startup 1.1 pick.
My question is focused on established leagues.
Pwingles
Footballguy
In a vacuum id want 3 1sts for obj one being top 2-3 at minimum.
In this case where it would be barkley and additional pieces, i would seriously think about this years 1.01 and next years 1 from same team assuming they owned the 1.01 this year and their team is bad. But would likely try and squeeze the 2.01 this year out of it as well.
Player wise, idk for sure. I guess the equivelent of what i described above.
Maybe someone is panicking on cooper?
The ones you said, juju and davis could be in consideration as well
In this case where it would be barkley and additional pieces, i would seriously think about this years 1.01 and next years 1 from same team assuming they owned the 1.01 this year and their team is bad. But would likely try and squeeze the 2.01 this year out of it as well.
Player wise, idk for sure. I guess the equivelent of what i described above.
Maybe someone is panicking on cooper?
The ones you said, juju and davis could be in consideration as well
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kutta
Footballguy
Just found out Aaron Rodgers is on the market and I could use a QB (Winston is all I have right now). What’s the going rate for Rodgers? 12 team, start 1 QB PPR.
i have picks 1.01, 1.04, 1.11, 2.01, 2.04.
I’d love to get a deal done with a couple of those later picks. I’m thinking of offering 1.11 and 2.04, but I’m not sure if that’s an under pay or an over pay.
i have picks 1.01, 1.04, 1.11, 2.01, 2.04.
I’d love to get a deal done with a couple of those later picks. I’m thinking of offering 1.11 and 2.04, but I’m not sure if that’s an under pay or an over pay.
-OZ-
Footballguy
2 QB, almost definitely the picks. I like kupp, but with 5QBs that look promising, that's almost the equivalent of 1.08 in most leagues, either one of the top backs, Sutton, or Kirk should be there, or maybe one of the QBs or TE. Then you get a decent IDP with the 38th pick.
What's the full lineup? How many RB and wr?
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Pwingles
Footballguy
That would be the offer i would send, I would assume the owner will try and get one more thing though. So maybe start with 1.11+2.04 and see if he comes back and asks for that other 2 or not
I"d just offer the 1.11.
I did see Rodgers traded away in a FFPC league a few weeks ago but it was super cheap, criminally cheap. 2.1 for Rodgers and they had to throw in 3.2. That seems way to cheap, for sure no need to kick in the third, but I had someone tell me in another FFPC league they've been unable to get a first.
Not sure how familiar you are with FFPC but it's 12 team 1 QB but due to shorter roster sizes it does devalue QB so those may or may not be good examples.
It amazes me how rigid some owners are. Rodgers remains an elite talent who will likely have 3-5 years of top end, QB 1 play left. If you could obtain him for 1.11, that would be an absolute steal.
I think 1.04 is slightly too rich but a reasonable cost if you are in the proverbial "one player away" mode.
I'd love to own him but I'm not trying to acquire Rodgers because the price is too rich. The 1.11 + 2.01 would be an insta-reject in most leagues IMO. For comparison, Goff was traded for the 2.02 in one of my leagues a few months ago and he's worth considerably less than Rodgers IMO. It's probably too much considering this year's draft class, but you'd probably have to be willing to pony up the 1.04 for him in most leagues.
The time to acquire Rodgers was when he was on IR during the season, there won't be much of a discount now by any owner worth their salt.
The time to acquire Rodgers was when he was on IR during the season, there won't be much of a discount now by any owner worth their salt.
Hu-Tang Clan
Footballguy
I was just offered Rodgers and Demarco Murray for David Johnson yesterday.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
In FFPC there is always a discount on QBs with the short rosters because it's so easy to get someone decent in there. There is no market because everyone has a solid QB. For instance in one of my FFPC leagues last year kirk cousins was dropped mid way through the season and the team that picked him up only had to bid 13% of their BB bucks to win him if I recall correctly. I doubt there were more than a couple teams that even put on a bid.
I think elite QBs are criminally underrated in these leagues as the point difference between Rodgers and "solid" is larger than people realize, but the buying price remains pretty cheap.
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That's interesting, what are the QB scoring rules? Cousins was the #5 QB in my leagues (#9 in PPG), seems a bit crazy for someone to outright drop even a low-end QB1. I could see how the offseason cutdown's would result in reduced prices for a start 1QB league, but would agree that that should make the truly elite year in year out guys at that position close to untouchable. I would think it would be similar dynamics to like a 8 or 10 team league where the true perennial studs really increase in value.
Curious what those who play in Zealots leagues would say about Rodgers price, it was my understanding that QB's are hoarded in those leagues as opposed to FFPC.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
What are you buying/selling O.J. Howard and Njoku for?
Spike
Footballguy
barackdhouse
Footballguy
I just moved Stafford and Martavis and Marvin Jones for Rodgers and a 2019 2nd.
I had been advertising that I would give either of those two WRs for a current 2nd, preferably higher. So in a very rough fashion, you could say Bryant and the 2019 2nd cancel out. Leaves Stafford plus Jones for Rodgers. If Jones is worth roughly an early 2nd, and maybe Stafford a late 2nd or early 3rd, then I would say an offer of a late 1st and an early 2nd is about right. Doesn't mean they will accept it. And maybe I got him cheap. But you asked for going rate. I made this trade in FFPC style league yesterday.
Also agree with others that elite QBs seem to be undervalued in FFPC.
I had been advertising that I would give either of those two WRs for a current 2nd, preferably higher. So in a very rough fashion, you could say Bryant and the 2019 2nd cancel out. Leaves Stafford plus Jones for Rodgers. If Jones is worth roughly an early 2nd, and maybe Stafford a late 2nd or early 3rd, then I would say an offer of a late 1st and an early 2nd is about right. Doesn't mean they will accept it. And maybe I got him cheap. But you asked for going rate. I made this trade in FFPC style league yesterday.
Also agree with others that elite QBs seem to be undervalued in FFPC.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
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I would buy for a late first - roughly what I recall their ADP was last year, so you essentially used someone else's roster for a rookie year taxi squad.
If I had held them all year, I'd want at least a mid-1st for them.
Not sure I'd be too excited about either one for 2018. Njoku is still very young for a TE (2 years younger than Engram) and Howard will still (likely) be splitting targets with Brate. If I needed a young TE, I'd hold off for now and try to buy whichever one is cheapest during the season.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
I agree on Njoku but disagree on Howard. I have both Brate and Howard on a dynasty squad and by week 9 of last year it was pretty apparent the Bucs were flipping from Brate to Howard. Plus Brate is an RFA so he may not even be on the squad.
RFAs are almost always back - I think it is a safe assumption Brate will be there in 2018. Howard had 15 targets and 10 receptions in the 2nd half of the season (only 6 games). In the 6 games they played together, Brate had 21 targets and 11 receptions. I would not get too excited about Howard for 2018 if I was you. Njoku's version of Brate (48 rec) is Devalve (33 rec). I think what will work against Howard is that he's probably going to get stuck blocking while he and Brate are on the field. I think Njoku's path to receptions is clearer than Howard's, but his development will be key. Pretty rare for a 22 year old TE to be a fantasy factor. One final word of caution for Howard is that Godwin might earn more targets in year 2. Between Evans, DeSean, and Godwin, there won't be a ton of targets left for Brate and Howard.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
In weeks 9-14 Brate had one catch in every game but one...week 13 where he had two. He had an uptick again starting week 15 but that was after Howard went down with an ankle injury. Brate is no threat.
If Godwin gets touches it'll be at the expense of Jackson.
You're probably right that Brate will be back, though. They have nearly $70m in cap space! They can afford to pay him $7m if they want.
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Ehhhh, you can get hyped for him if you want to talk yourself into it. He's certainly got the talent and a glimmer of hope for 2018, but I won't be targeting him in any redrafts unless the Bucs actually let Brate walk. It is very rare for even semi-productive RFAs to leave. 10 receptions in Howard's last 6 games is not exciting enough to me. He shouldn't be in anyone's top 12 for redraft/2018. But he's obviously a great dynasty asset.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
I don't quite feel right offering a 1st for Howard or Njoku with Goedert and Gesicki currently projected to go mid-2nd in rookie drafts.
Rank these assets:
Howard
Njoku
Everett
Goedert
Gesicki
Andrews
Rank these assets:
Howard
Njoku
Everett
Goedert
Gesicki
Andrews
I believe they can put a first or second round tender on him half or less than that which all but locks him up.
Well, we were talking about him and Njoku's 2018 likely production (based on me saying they'll both probably be mid-season buy low candidates), that's why I bring up redraft - to make the point that he's unlikely to break out this year. So I know you own him and want to get hyped about him in 2018, so I'm throwing a bit of cold water on that, but wanted to throw you a bone by reminding you he's a great long term asset.Andy Dufresne said:Wait...what thread am I in?
