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WR Courtland Sutton, DEN (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
3 hour lunch
Footballguy
He and Juedy ranked pretty closely- who would you take in redraft and why?
foxco
Footballguy
Jeudy for me with nothing substantial to back this decision up. Literally just a hunch he'll be more consistent. Still like Sutton though, a bit iffy early in the season because of his injury recovery but signs seem to be good he'll be back.
Sutton, he already has a 1200 yard season on his resume, and looked like one of the league's best young players before his ACL tear. I don't dislike Jeudy at all, and fully think there is room for both of them to be productive, but I see Sutton with a higher ceiling.
mcintyre1
Footballguy
I've got Jeudy higher in re-draft, but I'm not super confident on that. I'm dissuaded from Sutton some by the language the team uses around his recovery. Makes it sound like he isn't performing up to snuff and they're hoping he'll get back to where he was in time for the season. Might be reading too much into that, though.
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
Yeah, I'm not liking the sounds of any of this for re-draft. He might bring something to the table as a buy low in week 5. I have him in dynasty and didn't give any thought to keeping OBJ ahead of Sutton on a Lamb package trade. I'm starting to wonder if I should have given some consideration to keeping the older Beckham. Really just hoping that Sutton can stay healthy and serve as a depth WR for my team. Hopefully he starts looking like his old self by season's end.
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Sutton is 6’4” 216, profiles as a true alpha. There have been some good moments in camp - beat Kyle Fuller on a 60+ bomb fm Lock in the team scrimmage 10 days ago - but, echoing what Fangio said, he’s still wearing a hinged brace as a precaution during positional drills. I don’t think he’s really trusting his body rn. I’m sue that will come with time but it’s a mental hurdle when coming back from a major injury. Should see his first game snaps Saturday.
Jeudy is a great route runner, having an explosive camp, and looked good in the first PS game. Lock & TB both played well but the Vikings were a below average D last year and just got boat raced. It’s hard to learn much from a game when one team doesn’t even come to play.
Would be insane if Lock mad a big jump bc they have some great weapons to spread the ball around to.
Jeudy is a great route runner, having an explosive camp, and looked good in the first PS game. Lock & TB both played well but the Vikings were a below average D last year and just got boat raced. It’s hard to learn much from a game when one team doesn’t even come to play.
Would be insane if Lock mad a big jump bc they have some great weapons to spread the ball around to.
DocHolliday
Footballguy
Prefer Jeudy since I don’t think Sutton is fully healthy. No reason to roll that dice.
greenmountaingoat
Footballguy
Working on updating my rankings. Anyone have current info on how Sutton is looking?
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Playing this Saturday. Has not had any setbacks and getting a few snaps is another box checked. Should be good to go IMO. I like his mentality about his rehab. When he was still recovering and not yet running or jumping yet he reached out to Demyrius Thomas, Von Miller, and Bradley Chubb. All had season ending injuries and came back to be a pro bowler again. Love his mindset. Serious young man, very professional, I like his chances to bounce back to what he was two years ago.
greenmountaingoat
Footballguy
Follow up question: if we could guarantee fully healthy knee Courtland Sutton with Birdgwater:
Courtland Sutton WR 18?
Jerry Jeudy WR 25-30?
Bump up for Bridgewater and the overall offense , bump down for Fant, Hamler and Patrick?
Struggling Sutton, Jeudy might be bumped a few spots into the WR 20 range?
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
I like Judy a little better bc I’m not totally sure Sutton is fully back. I have both in the WR3 range. At 18 you’re putting him above Aiyuk, Julio & Thielen?
foxco
Footballguy
I think Teddy's game gives an advantage to Jeudy; Sutton may not get as many deep balls.
I'd have Sutton in the low/mid 20's I think.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Teddy seems good for Jerry, but do you still see Sutton as more of a red zone threat?
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
I see Sutton as a big bodied X WR who is also a deep threat
ETA: phenomenal at contested catches as well
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
agreed they're both really good, just different skill sets
Jeudy had a lot of empty air yards last year but he's.a very precise route runner
Fant is a tremendous athlete, I don't know why they put him in the slot or outside so little
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Hey let me ask you something.
Has he been running the show from training camp? Is he a guy who observes practice a lot? I don’t know I’m just asking.
I’ve been monitoring this pretty close and while the HC had those kind of comments a month ago, it seems like things been trending pretty positive. that tentative narrative may not be applicable anymore.
basing that on Sutton’s comments and others observations. I’ve seen clips of him making spectacular grabs where he has to high point the ball. it seems like he’s trusting his body a little more.
just asking, you know this situation better than I do.
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moleculo
Footballguy
I can't tell you how often he watches, other than more than me
. This could be a case of he had that impression early on and never came off of it, or not. I think it's telling he hasn't played in pre-season. Orlando also mentioned that Tim Patrick can do similar things, so no real reason to rush him...especially because the schedule doesn't get tough until game 4. Why not keep Sutton on a play count until then?
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
I can't tell you how often he watches, other than more than me
Orlando also mentioned that Tim Patrick can do similar things, so no real reason to rush him...especially because the schedule doesn't get tough until game 4. Why not keep
Sutton on a play count until then?
Sutton will play a few series this weekend against the Rams.
Broncos have great depth. Patrick was a revelation last year, Hamler is a burner, the backup TE (I may never learn how to spell Albert O's name) is a terrific prospect. Everyone would like the big 3 to be target hogs but they can spread it around if they choose to.
moleculo
Footballguy
they can and they will. I think Sutton is more of a buy-low candidate, and low will be after a couple of games where he doesn't really do much to start. Especially with Bridgewater starting, I think Jeudy is the guy to draft.
I think Sutton's involvement, especially early, will be go-routes and red-zone work. Open up the underneath for Jeudy to work. He will run routes that don't involve a lot of cutting, at least until he can regain confidence. He will have stat lines of 2-50 or so for the first couple of games, with some TD's sprinkled in there.
moleculo
Footballguy
@BobbyLayne
Fwiw, Sutton had a really nice 18 yard catch and then a TD. On the 18yard catch, he made a real nice cut to square off his route. They didn't show the replay of his TD.
Lots of hugs, high 5s, etc on the sideline. I think he looks ready to go.
Fwiw, Sutton had a really nice 18 yard catch and then a TD. On the 18yard catch, he made a real nice cut to square off his route. They didn't show the replay of his TD.
Lots of hugs, high 5s, etc on the sideline. I think he looks ready to go.
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
Not buying 100%. No injury setbacks in the first 5 weeks, a competent Broncos offense, and looking like vintage Sutton by the end of October is what I'm hoping for.
Will target in re-draft if he starts as slow as I'm bracing for.
Will target in re-draft if he starts as slow as I'm bracing for.
VikingFrog
Footballguy
I have never owned much of Sutton so I’ve never watched much of him. How do you feel this plays out with Jeudy going down.
I was just offered a trade offer for Sutton and with my WR1 being Aiyuk… I may have to accept it. But I honestly have rarely owned any Broncos so I don’t know much about them.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Good size, great body control, wins a lot of contested catches but also has deep ball skills. Profiles as an alpha X WR, terrific breakout player in Y2 (Pro Bowl) but missed almost all of last year. Early in camp Fangio said he was still tentative and not really trusting his body yet. Last week he said the last 14 days have been bight n day, really coming on, but would be on a pitch count Week 1. Has a good rapport with Teddy and caught a TD 3rd preseason G.
I’m high on him but couple things to be cautious about. 1) Bridgewater is suboptimal for high value targets >15 yards, and 2) with a very good defense and strong running attack, may not be much more than a WR3 in FF. If Fant is healthy he’s probably option 1. But I like Sutton a lot, he should be solid once his snap count gets up.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Addendum
could not find snap counts but random analyst said he got 80% snaps and 80% of routes
I’m dubious that’s a ballpark estimate and not data, but PFF had an article which included routes run: Sutton 33, Patrick 27, Fant 27, Jeudy 24
Anyway, seems like he was not on a pitch count, that was pregame coachspeak. Only 3 targets. Should be a reasonable expectation that will change, but wanted you to know he was not limited in his snaps yesterday.
Take the trade is my advice. You’re getting good value and probably have low capital invested in Ty’son, + you’re getting the better player IMO.
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
To Sutton's credit, pretty incredible that he beat OBJ back to the field in week 1. Pretty big upset based on the August training camp reports and video clips.
No problem trading for him now if you're getting a discount. If you're asked to pay a premium because of Jeudy or anything near what his value would have been at full health, I would pass. I like Patrick and to a lesser extent Hamler if they're on the waiver wire during Jeudy's absence.
No problem trading for him now if you're getting a discount. If you're asked to pay a premium because of Jeudy or anything near what his value would have been at full health, I would pass. I like Patrick and to a lesser extent Hamler if they're on the waiver wire during Jeudy's absence.
VikingFrog
Footballguy
Thanks. Yeah. I ended up accepting that trade. I drafted my first WR in the fifth round after going RB, RB, TE, QB… and that first WR didn’t even get a target on Sunday. So as you can imagine, my WR room is a little desperate.
Appreciate both responses on Sutton and the analytical response. I look forward to watching him play and learning a bit more about him myself.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Career day
9-159 on 12 targets, all career highs
in his breakout 2919 season he was very consistent, only two 100 yard games but still averaged 69.5 yards per G (w/ a high of 130)
he’s back to being the alpha he was two years ago IMO
9-159 on 12 targets, all career highs
in his breakout 2919 season he was very consistent, only two 100 yard games but still averaged 69.5 yards per G (w/ a high of 130)
he’s back to being the alpha he was two years ago IMO
VikingFrog
Footballguy
Still a few players to go. But he may have saved my bacon today and was fun to watch. Plays faster than I’d think he would just looking at him.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
He only ran a 4.54 when he was a prospect. Plays faster than that IMO. Both g guy with good body control. Jeudy is a different kind of WR,very much precise route runner. Both should be good for awhile if they stay healthy.
(think Sutton is up this year, no 5th year option, but hopefully a Broncos homer cam chime in to clarify.)
TampaMike19
Footballguy
Didn’t see this coming at all- sat him everywhere
he won’t leave my lineup ROS
he won’t leave my lineup ROS
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
Great to see. Wasn't expecting anything early. Now, just stay healthy!
So happy for Teddy Two Gloves. Funny how him beating out Lock was supposed to be a bad thing for Sutton's stock, but I know that was also pre-Jeudy injury.
So happy for Teddy Two Gloves. Funny how him beating out Lock was supposed to be a bad thing for Sutton's stock, but I know that was also pre-Jeudy injury.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
I started just based on the logic he should lead the team in targets with Jeudy on the shelf.
Been monitoring his progress and he was rounding into form at the end of TC. While the targets were low Week 1 (only 3), it wasn’t bc he was on a snap count. He led the teams receiving corps in snaps and routes run, and he had been building a good rapport with Teddy in practice.
No way I expected a career game but this has been building for awhile. Guy was a stud X WR in 2019.
I hate being that guy, but the Jaguars might have a historically bad pass defense. I like Sutton a lot(always have) but this is the best matchup he'll have all season. Sutton has locked himself into being a top-24 WR in my opinion. That isn't going anywhere. But I'd be very cautious about assuming he's going to be a top option going forward.
TampaMike19
Footballguy
Well, THAT AIN'T good. I seriously hope I'm not playing against Kyler next week then...
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
in redraft he was taken as a WR3 so kind of a non sequitur, no? nobody expects their 7th rounder to be their top dog.
but getting a top 24 season from that ADP is league winning stuff
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Helaire-ious
Footballguy
I have been on this train since the off season. It has now left the station! May have to start him in flex over CEH
The Frankman
Footballguy
Johnny Utah #9
Footballguy
They didn’t need him yesterday but disappointing game. Came very close to a 2 TD day, with a DPI that put the ball like at the 1, and got tackled on a reception in the 4th at the 1 yard line.
