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Email from commish - advice received and commish exiled


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The commissioner of the dynasty league I'm in sent out the email below. How would you respond to something like this?  I've already responded, but I'm wondering whether I went too far with my response, if I should backtrack/apologize/etc.  

Sup,

It seems like we are still having a hard time with initial trade offers being "fair." Based on what I see and what people tell me, I would agree that there are a lot of bull#### initial offers. At this juncture, everyone has his own reputation as a fantasy owner, save Aaron and Scott. No one in this league is an idiot, but I agree that some owners seem to believe the trade recipient is a complete ####### moron. I have also heard from each side that the fact we don't know each other well is problematic. I don't know how to fix that. What I can do is lay out some guidelines that people won't like, but that I also don't think should be hard to achieve/follow.

1. Use this trade calculator as a baseline for initial offers . . . . http://www.dynastyfftools.com/tools/calculator

2. If your initial offer does not reach the 90% fairness, I will dock you $50 in blind-bid money

3. If your initial offer does not reach the 90% fairness a second time, I will dock you $100.

4. If your initial offer does not reach the 90% fairness a third time, you will be removed from the league. This will accumulate over time and does not reset at the end of each season.

5. Don't ask someone if they are willing to trade (insert player), and then expect them to make you an offer. If you are interested, use the calculator and present a fair offer.

6. Not all offers are made through MFL. If you receive a crappy offer via text or email, you have to let me know so I know how to respond. 

If you don't like this approach, I don't care. I really want this league to continue, but I don't want it to continue if we can't make fair offers. We obviously don't all agree on value but, if we work off the same calculator as a starting point, we can have a better discussion of value as trade discussions progress.

Peace,

Jeff

 

Edited by oldmanhawkins
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:bye:

 

ETA: then start your own league with the other owners except the commish. Heck, maybe invite him but he gets no say in how things are run. 

Edited by -OZ-
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This is hilarious!

"No one will give me trades I like, so you have to use my favorite rankings site and send me offers I like."

The only reasonable response is to mock this mercilessly on the league's message board or email list, then leave it isn't immediately laughed out of existence by the remaining 10 owners.

Edited by Arodin
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Here is my response. After hearing your responses, I guess I shouldn't feel so bad. 

Commish,

First of all let me say that I appreciate the time and effort you put in as commish of this league and HKL.  But I have to say this.

In response to your “if you don’t like this approach then I don’t care,” please answer this question for me (and be honest).

Is this your league or ours?

Obviously I think it is ours and I believe we should have a vote on any proposed rule change.  

While I have not been vehemently opposed to the rule changes you have passed (in waterboy and HKL), I am displeased that you didn’t give the league a say.  I don’t wish to be a part of a league that will change a rule on the fly without AT LEAST majority rule.  

TLDR; let us vote, step down as commish, or I’m out.

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Since he's saying that he can't see offers made in emails and texts, that tells me he's also not turned off the abilities for commissioners to view trade offers, waiver claims etc. made by other league owners -  which is also a huge problem.

The guys is a loon - I don't see how/why anyone would put up with that.

Edited by Dr. Octopus
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The rule is idiotic, flawed on so many levels. But for me, it's not even about the rule. I can't comprehend why he thinks it is ok to go around instituting rules without input (votes) from other owners. I've been in this league four years, and the keeper league that I referenced for longer.  He just started adding random rules last year.  The craziest part is that most of the other owners don't see a problem.  

Edited by oldmanhawkins
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47 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

Since he's saying that he can't see offers made in emails and texts, that tells me he's also not turned off the abilities for commissioners to view trade offers, waiver claims etc. made by other league owners -  which is also a huge problem.

The guys is a loon - I don't see how/why anyone would put up with that.

Thank you for pointing this out.  I didn't put 2 and 2 together when I that the first time. 

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20 minutes ago, fruity pebbles said:

Unfortunately I couldn’t send an offer of Tyreek Hill for Dez Bryant because it’s only 78% fair in favor of Dez.

Yep, and don't even THINK about offering 1.01 for Julio. Also 78% in Julio's favor.

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The obvious Malicious Compliance solution is to offer your commish a bunch of trades that are 90%+ fair according to the calculator but wildly lopsided in your favor. For example, you give Lamar Miller & Jordy Nelson, you get Jerick McKinnon, Davante Adams, and 2018 rookie pick 17.

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4 hours ago, ZWK said:

The obvious Malicious Compliance solution is to offer your commish a bunch of trades that are 90%+ fair according to the calculator but wildly lopsided in your favor. For example, you give Lamar Miller & Jordy Nelson, you get Jerick McKinnon, Davante Adams, and 2018 rookie pick 17.

:thumbup:

1 hour ago, Ashem said:

'99% fair'

You give: Eddie Lacy, Teddy Bridgewater.

You get: 2018 pick 18.

 

 

:thumbup: :thumbup:

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I think he has come to see your league as his own personal ant farm and needs to be replaced. He obviously thinks it's okay to monitor trade offers and views owner apathy as an endorsement to do whatever he wants. It definitely won't stop here...

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9 hours ago, oldmanhawkins said:

Thank you for pointing this out.  I didn't put 2 and 2 together when I that the first time. 

That may be even worse than the idiotic offer rule. He obviously knows he can see other owners offers (which means he can see your waiver claims as well) and it's not an oversight that he did not turn off that ability.

As far as the "fair offer" rule it's beyond dumb as pointed out with a few examples on how the tool values trades in the first place, but it also does not allow a free market to exist. Sure sometimes a terrible offer can be annoying, but honestly I don't see why that needs to be regulated - reject and move on. If a certain owner always sends horrible offers, make a public joke about it on the message board or something and as others join in, he'll get the message.

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UPDATE:

It occurred to me that this might be an April fools joke, but unfortunately that is not the case.

Commish stepped down after my email.  I was thinking I should apologize to him.  After all, he does put a lot of time in running the leagues.  Guy has three kids under 3 and I think he is starting to lose his ####.  But after re-reading his last few emails to the league he’s just an arrogant SOB and I’m happy he’s out.

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The obvious question would be what happens when some one sends an offer that's only 80% fair but it's accepted before the commissioner is able to (illegally) view it using his ability - does the owner sending the offer still get docked FAAB?

This whole situation is so dumb that I can not believe the league has not told the guy to back off. Being a league commissioner is not being the league's overlord, it should be a role that's mostly administerial in nature and a facilitator for the league to run smoothly.

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1 hour ago, oldmanhawkins said:

UPDATE:

It occurred to me that this might be an April fools joke, but unfortunately that is not the case.

Commish stepped down after my email.  I was thinking I should apologize to him.  After all, he does put a lot of time in running the leagues.  Guy has three kids under 3 and I think he is starting to lose his ####.  But after re-reading his last few emails to the league he’s just an arrogant SOB and I’m happy he’s out.

 

Wow.  Maybe it was a brilliant plan to let one of you other slacking ****s take over the thankless task of being a commish.  Not that the guys in my league are slacking ****s.  No, really

 

:walksawaysheepishly:

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1 hour ago, oldmanhawkins said:

UPDATE:

It occurred to me that this might be an April fools joke, but unfortunately that is not the case.

Commish stepped down after my email.  I was thinking I should apologize to him.  After all, he does put a lot of time in running the leagues.  Guy has three kids under 3 and I think he is starting to lose his ####.  But after re-reading his last few emails to the league he’s just an arrogant SOB and I’m happy he’s out.

It's scary that he's the father of 3 kids.

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I am still trying to figure out why it's a problem to send ####ty initial offers.  Why does that matter to anyone?  Initial offers don't need to be accepted or given the time of day.  Just decline and move on.  Everybody tries to get an offer that is in their favor and everyone evaluates things differently (as some of you have pointed out in your "fair" offers by that site). 

 

I just don't understand why initial offer quality is a concern of anyone.  I get crappy offers all the time.  You laugh them off.....post them for everyone to see how ridiculous they are.....and chastise the offender.  Everyone wins.  Why take this right of passage away? 

 

The part about the Commish just changing rules is also an issue.  There are certain things that make things flow better (lineup deadlines, waiver times, etc) that don't affect the structure of the league that are fine to address to make the Commish life easier but foundational rules should always be voted on by league members. 

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1 hour ago, Gally said:

I am still trying to figure out why it's a problem to send ####ty initial offers.  Why does that matter to anyone?

It gets old when that's the only thing a guy sends and they send a few a week. I played with one league with a guy named shady who would also taunt people and tell you off for rejecting them. Like I say it gets old after a few months.

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I'll take a different approach.  I'm guessing his solution (which is awful, by the way) is because many owners in the league complain to him about the ####ty trade offers.  And there are a ton of dynasty players that make ####ty offers over and over.  It sounds like you just pressured a good commish that does a lot of work for the league into quitting without trying to understand what his goal was here.  To me, it doesn't sound like you had a commissioner problem it sounds like you have an owner problem.

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16 minutes ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

I'll take a different approach.  I'm guessing his solution (which is awful, by the way) is because many owners in the league complain to him about the ####ty trade offers.  And there are a ton of dynasty players that make ####ty offers over and over.  It sounds like you just pressured a good commish that does a lot of work for the league into quitting without trying to understand what his goal was here.  To me, it doesn't sound like you had a commissioner problem it sounds like you have an owner problem.

I'm not saying your wrong   But I believe an initial offer can be more beneficial to (open) trade discussion thus allowing the buyer to state a player of interest (Or position) and vice versa which allows the seller to consider available options  One or the other could be more interested in moving a specific player too  Now if the initial trade offer results in numerous laughable exchanges?  I'd whole heartily agree there is an owner problem  (Maybe) The commish should have considered initial trade offers cost $5 to send?

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1 hour ago, voiceofunreason said:

It gets old when that's the only thing a guy sends and they send a few a week. I played with one league with a guy named shady who would also taunt people and tell you off for rejecting them. Like I say it gets old after a few months.

It happens all the time.  It is what it is.  I have a few "Shady" type owners.  We have even started a "####ty Shady Offer" message board thread on the league website where everyone posts the offers they have received.  Its not grounds for instituting a rule requiring a certain level of trade offer (that you may or may not agree with the evaluation criteria).  That was a terrible idea.

 

You know what owners send those offers and you hit decline and shame the owner if it is bad enough.  Everyone evaluates players differently - its why any trades can happen at all.  One man's ####ty trade offer is another man's instant accept.  It's fantasy football.  This is part of the journey.

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36 minutes ago, Gally said:

It happens all the time.  It is what it is.  I have a few "Shady" type owners.  We have even started a "####ty Shady Offer" message board thread on the league website where everyone posts the offers they have received.  Its not grounds for instituting a rule requiring a certain level of trade offer (that you may or may not agree with the evaluation criteria).  That was a terrible idea.

 

You know what owners send those offers and you hit decline and shame the owner if it is bad enough.  Everyone evaluates players differently - its why any trades can happen at all.  One man's ####ty trade offer is another man's instant accept.  It's fantasy football.  This is part of the journey.

Well you said you didn't see why people don't like them. I don't think anyone does. It's just part of things but it's not one of the pluses.

There was a big thread last year about saying things publicly and some owners are extremely against that. Doesn't bother me but it can start fights. I feel like if you are embarrassed about somebody posting your offer than don't make it but to each there own.

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2 hours ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

I'll take a different approach.  I'm guessing his solution (which is awful, by the way) is because many owners in the league complain to him about the ####ty trade offers.  And there are a ton of dynasty players that make ####ty offers over and over.  It sounds like you just pressured a good commish that does a lot of work for the league into quitting without trying to understand what his goal was here.  To me, it doesn't sound like you had a commissioner problem it sounds like you have an owner problem.

I don't think you are entirely wrong.  My issue is that he just keeps making up rules to appease the whiny owner(s).  I've repeatedly said that we should have a vote and he gets butt hurt and asks why I have an issue with such an obviously great rule.  Last year, he made up the "activity rules" without vote:

 

Activity Rules


Since dynasty leagues are for the serious owners, all owners are expected to be active year round.

Owners should check the site once a week during the off-season.

Owners should check in at least once a day during the regular season and during the rookie draft.

Owners should vote for each poll on the league homepage.

Owners should participate in league discussion through email and/or league message board.

Owners should respond to trade offers within three days.

All owners should select the option to receive an email notification and the option to have a message sent to their cell phone.

If you just have to get away, please post a message on the homepage letting everyone know how long you will be gone and when the league can expect you back in action.

The first time an owner is in violation of any of these rules, he will be docked 
$50 of blind bidding money.

The second time an owner is in violation of these rules, he will be docked 
$100 of blind bidding money.

The third infraction will result in removal from the league.

Infractions do not reset at the end of the season.

If an owner is removed from the league for any violation of league rules or by 
his own choice, the commissioner will take charge of that team until a 
replacement owner is found and approved.

The commissioner will not perform any transactions on behalf of the abandoned team and the lineup will be entered based on the 4for4.com cheat sheet for that week.

  

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19 minutes ago, oldmanhawkins said:

I don't think you are entirely wrong.  My issue is that he just keeps making up rules to appease the whiny owner(s).  I've repeatedly said that we should have a vote and he gets butt hurt and asks why I have an issue with such an obviously great rule.  Last year, he made up the "activity rules" without vote:

 

Activity Rules


Since dynasty leagues are for the serious owners, all owners are expected to be active year round.

Owners should check the site once a week during the off-season.

Owners should check in at least once a day during the regular season and during the rookie draft.

Owners should vote for each poll on the league homepage.

Owners should participate in league discussion through email and/or league message board.

Owners should respond to trade offers within three days.

All owners should select the option to receive an email notification and the option to have a message sent to their cell phone.

If you just have to get away, please post a message on the homepage letting everyone know how long you will be gone and when the league can expect you back in action.

The first time an owner is in violation of any of these rules, he will be docked 
$50 of blind bidding money.

The second time an owner is in violation of these rules, he will be docked 
$100 of blind bidding money.

The third infraction will result in removal from the league.

Infractions do not reset at the end of the season.

If an owner is removed from the league for any violation of league rules or by 
his own choice, the commissioner will take charge of that team until a 
replacement owner is found and approved.

The commissioner will not perform any transactions on behalf of the abandoned team and the lineup will be entered based on the 4for4.com cheat sheet for that week.

  

His problem is he wants to legislate things that can't really be legislated.

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4 hours ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

I'll take a different approach.  I'm guessing his solution (which is awful, by the way) is because many owners in the league complain to him about the ####ty trade offers.  And there are a ton of dynasty players that make ####ty offers over and over.  It sounds like you just pressured a good commish that does a lot of work for the league into quitting without trying to understand what his goal was here.  To me, it doesn't sound like you had a commissioner problem it sounds like you have an owner problem.

:bs:

If there is that much of an issue, then put it out as a proposed rule change to vote on. 

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4 hours ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

I'll take a different approach.  I'm guessing his solution (which is awful, by the way) is because many owners in the league complain to him about the ####ty trade offers.  And there are a ton of dynasty players that make ####ty offers over and over.  It sounds like you just pressured a good commish that does a lot of work for the league into quitting without trying to understand what his goal was here.  To me, it doesn't sound like you had a commissioner problem it sounds like you have an owner problem.

I was assuming the league was composed of adults. 

Hit the decline button.

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2 hours ago, oldmanhawkins said:
4 hours ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

I'll take a different approach.  I'm guessing his solution (which is awful, by the way) is because many owners in the league complain to him about the ####ty trade offers.  And there are a ton of dynasty players that make ####ty offers over and over.  It sounds like you just pressured a good commish that does a lot of work for the league into quitting without trying to understand what his goal was here.  To me, it doesn't sound like you had a commissioner problem it sounds like you have an owner problem.

I don't think you are entirely wrong. 

He's absolutely entirely wrong.  A commish doesn't arbitrarily drop in rules, ever.  If the owners don't think there's a problem then there's not a problem.  He also doesn't allow rules that have a total BS implementation like that - it took all of three posts to thoroughly debunk the "value" that the calculator was supposed to bring.  He also doesn't put his opinion in the middle of where it's not welcome.  Judging initial offer quality is absolute horse####.  First of all it's just a first offer, it doesn't mean anything, it can just be a way to ping a guy about your interest.  Second of all it's none of his business who trades for what unless cheating is involved.

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2 hours ago, oldmanhawkins said:

I don't think you are entirely wrong.  My issue is that he just keeps making up rules to appease the whiny owner(s).  I've repeatedly said that we should have a vote and he gets butt hurt and asks why I have an issue with such an obviously great rule.  Last year, he made up the "activity rules" without vote:

 

Activity Rules


Since dynasty leagues are for the serious owners, all owners are expected to be active year round.

Owners should check the site once a week during the off-season.

Owners should check in at least once a day during the regular season and during the rookie draft.

Owners should vote for each poll on the league homepage.

Owners should participate in league discussion through email and/or league message board.

Owners should respond to trade offers within three days.

All owners should select the option to receive an email notification and the option to have a message sent to their cell phone.

If you just have to get away, please post a message on the homepage letting everyone know how long you will be gone and when the league can expect you back in action.

The first time an owner is in violation of any of these rules, he will be docked 
$50 of blind bidding money.

The second time an owner is in violation of these rules, he will be docked 
$100 of blind bidding money.

The third infraction will result in removal from the league.

Infractions do not reset at the end of the season.

If an owner is removed from the league for any violation of league rules or by 
his own choice, the commissioner will take charge of that team until a 
replacement owner is found and approved.

The commissioner will not perform any transactions on behalf of the abandoned team and the lineup will be entered based on the 4for4.com cheat sheet for that week.

  

 

Maybe it's just me but those "Activity Rules" seem like the basic level of participation that a serious dynasty owner should be providing.  So he wants you to visit the site regularly, respond to trade offers in 3 days, and vote on league polls?  What a monster.

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3 hours ago, oldmanhawkins said:

I don't think you are entirely wrong.  My issue is that he just keeps making up rules to appease the whiny owner(s).  I've repeatedly said that we should have a vote and he gets butt hurt and asks why I have an issue with such an obviously great rule.  Last year, he made up the "activity rules" without vote:

 

Activity Rules


Since dynasty leagues are for the serious owners, all owners are expected to be active year round.

Owners should check the site once a week during the off-season.

Owners should check in at least once a day during the regular season and during the rookie draft.

Owners should vote for each poll on the league homepage.

Owners should participate in league discussion through email and/or league message board.

Owners should respond to trade offers within three days.

All owners should select the option to receive an email notification and the option to have a message sent to their cell phone.

If you just have to get away, please post a message on the homepage letting everyone know how long you will be gone and when the league can expect you back in action.

The first time an owner is in violation of any of these rules, he will be docked 
$50 of blind bidding money.

The second time an owner is in violation of these rules, he will be docked 
$100 of blind bidding money.

The third infraction will result in removal from the league.

Infractions do not reset at the end of the season.

If an owner is removed from the league for any violation of league rules or by 
his own choice, the commissioner will take charge of that team until a 
replacement owner is found and approved.

The commissioner will not perform any transactions on behalf of the abandoned team and the lineup will be entered based on the 4for4.com cheat sheet for that week.

  

This is starting to sound like a league I quit about 3 years ago. I literally joined and quit long before the season started. He was very against bad trades and started making activity rules as well. Some other stuff happened and when I quit I got some serious crazy/rage emails after.

Was this league named after an episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm?

Edited by voiceofunreason
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