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John Cena Apologizes In Mandarin?


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8 minutes ago, Sea Duck said:

I think it's safe to say that any longtime star of the WWE, who starred as the lead character in a movie called "The Marine" and followed with a string of movies where he plays almost-stereotypical conservative roles (cops, firefighters, soldiers, weightlifters, etc.), who has publicly endorsed Republican political candidates.....is going to be considered an icon to a significant portion of the conservative demographic.

That's why Cena's apology is generating so much attention. If this was Sean Penn or Lebron James, the reaction from the right would be standard fare mockery and political zingers for a few days, then it's right back to enjoying their iPhones. But Cena's apology hits a little too close to home. It's a cold dose of reality, shining a spotlight on America's increasing acquiescence to China.

There's a whole lot of stereotyping in there and honestly I didn't think see the reactions different on Cena vs Lebron (thought both were being derided).  I hadn't assumed from the reactions I was seeing here that he was liberal or conservative.  Did a quick search and it doesn't seem he is very political and was critical of Trump...certainly not icon status.  But if you say so, I mean he does have muscles.

Edited by djmich
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2 minutes ago, djmich said:

There's a whole lot of stereotyping in there and honestly I didn't think see the reactions different on Cena vs Lebron (thought both were being derided).  I hadn't assumed from the reactions I was seeing here that he was liberal or conservative.  Did a quick search and it doesn't seem he is very political and was critical of Trump...certainly not icon status.  But if you say so, I mean he does have muscles.

:confused:

I didn't assume that Cena was liberal or conservative, either.

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55 minutes ago, Sea Duck said:

Right. Liberals have been groveling to China for years -- Disney, the NBA, etc.; but Cena's apology is a sign that conservative icons are not immune to China's influence, either. He's the proverbial canary in a coal mine. He's a wake-up call.

At its core liberals and conservatives are no different.  They are run by the almighty dollar just the same.  

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8 minutes ago, Sea Duck said:

:confused:

I didn't assume that Cena was liberal or conservative, either.

I read your posts thinking you thought Cena was a conservative.   makes an ### out of you and me.   

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51 minutes ago, djmich said:

There's a whole lot of stereotyping in there and honestly I didn't think see the reactions different on Cena vs Lebron (thought both were being derided).  I hadn't assumed from the reactions I was seeing here that he was liberal or conservative.  Did a quick search and it doesn't seem he is very political and was critical of Trump...certainly not icon status.  But if you say so, I mean he does have muscles.

Come on.  He's an ex-wrestler.  Are you trying to tell me that you and the rest of the Republicans can't name all the matches and wrestlers in WrestleMania 4?

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2 hours ago, Joe Bryant said:

Because Cena's groveling just happened.

But why are people now seemingly more worried about conditions in China?  Did it take Cena for that to be something? Or the NBA backing down?

China is and has been a mess for a long long tome when it comes to humanitarian issues.

I mean its good people want to pay attention...if it ever leads  to change....Im all for it.  Will it though?  Will it anywhere?   Do we have better chances to effect change in parts of Africa and South America than we do China?

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1 hour ago, djmich said:

Are you asking why people weren't upset about Cena's groveling in Mandarin prior to him groveling in Mandarin?

 

Is Cena active in conservative politics?  I didn't know that

No...why people only care about China when a Cena or NBA or whoever backs down and gives in for the money?  And why China but nit other places?

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14 minutes ago, Max Power said:

Seeing as how the medical community backed down to China while people died, it might be time for some accountability. 

What Cena did is more enabling BS....

Accountability how?

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11 minutes ago, sho nuff said:

Accountability how?

We can start with their lack of transparency during covid. China will continue to throw its global weight around until someone forces accountability. 

Slow Joe isn't going to. Hollywood and the NBA's groveling just emboldens China. 

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Just now, Max Power said:

We can start with their lack of transparency during covid. China will continue to throw its global weight around until someone forces accountability. 

Slow Joe isn't going to. Hollywood and the NBA's groveling just emboldens China. 

Don was certain they were hiding this lab escape and they walked all over him.

A nation with billions of customers is a hard problem to overcome. 

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8 minutes ago, Max Power said:

We can start with their lack of transparency during covid. China will continue to throw its global weight around until someone forces accountability. 

Slow Joe isn't going to. Hollywood and the NBA's groveling just emboldens China. 

But what would make them be accountable.  No POTUS is going to take them on.  We rely on them too much.

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3 hours ago, Joe Bryant said:

Because Cena's groveling just happened.

When I see loaded terms like these - its not surprising, its what I expect from someone simply looking to stir the pot instead of having a legitimate conversation.

 

I do find it a little ironic that you started a thread complaining about Nate Silver being unable to apologize for getting the 2016 election "wrong".  And, yet now, you get someone who apologizes for getting something "wrong" and you find it interesting.

 

Your words (when describing how you would respond to getting a projection wrong):

"That's the rub.

My business is 100% about customer reaction and satisfaction. "

And:

"This actually is a fascinating topic for me. Lots of different layers to it. And the idea that most people find it so seemingly incredibly difficult to admit they were wrong is especially fascinating."

 

 

So, apparently you find it fascinating when people can't admit they were wrong, AND when people do admit they were wrong.  :shrug:

 

John Cena's business is 100% about customer reaction and satisfaction.  He did what was expected of him to satisfy a large chunk of customers.  Its a non-story - unless you think he is somehow different than other businesses or governments who address the same issues.

 

If YOU had a large segment of Chinese customers, and said something that offended them - I suspect you would be "groveling" too.

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1 hour ago, Sinn Fein said:

When I see loaded terms like these - its not surprising, its what I expect from someone simply looking to stir the pot instead of having a legitimate conversation.

 

I do find it a little ironic that you started a thread complaining about Nate Silver being unable to apologize for getting the 2016 election "wrong".  And, yet now, you get someone who apologizes for getting something "wrong" and you find it interesting.

 

Your words (when describing how you would respond to getting a projection wrong):

"That's the rub.

My business is 100% about customer reaction and satisfaction. "

And:

"This actually is a fascinating topic for me. Lots of different layers to it. And the idea that most people find it so seemingly incredibly difficult to admit they were wrong is especially fascinating."

 

 

So, apparently you find it fascinating when people can't admit they were wrong, AND when people do admit they were wrong.  :shrug:

 

John Cena's business is 100% about customer reaction and satisfaction.  He did what was expected of him to satisfy a large chunk of customers.  Its a non-story - unless you think he is somehow different than other businesses or governments who address the same issues.

 

If YOU had a large segment of Chinese customers, and said something that offended them - I suspect you would be "groveling" too.

Sorry to hear you think that I'm simply looking to stir the pot instead of having legitimate conversation. We'll just have to disagree there. 

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6 hours ago, Sinn Fein said:

When I see loaded terms like these - its not surprising, its what I expect from someone simply looking to stir the pot instead of having a legitimate conversation.

"I must say right now, it's very, very, very, very, very, very important.  I love and respect China and Chinese people. I'm very, very sorry for my mistake." 

Sinn, the word used to describe this statement was dead on.  Maybe add a pinch of desperation.

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6 minutes ago, Sand said:

"I must say right now, it's very, very, very, very, very, very important.  I love and respect China and Chinese people. I'm very, very sorry for my mistake." 

Sinn, the word used to describe this statement was dead on.  Maybe add a pinch of desperation.

Yeah, I reacted negatively to the “groveling” and “bootlicking” words, which I thought were pretty harsh, but then I watched the whole video with the translation and it’s sort of hard to argue that those words weren’t fair. 

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On 5/28/2021 at 10:46 AM, Joe Bryant said:

I don't think buying an item where you are unsure of how it's made is the same as going on twitter and making a video apologizing to China for calling Taiwan a country and proclaiming how much you love China.

Do you?

I do. It's all about the money. China is the third largest market in the world and coming up on us fast. 

It's terrible.  I support the bootlicking comment but the only difference is he is the product.  Nike is smart enough to not print shirts that say 'china is crap, i support taiwan'.  If they did, you would see the exact reaction.  

Again, it's only odd because he is the product so he has to respond.  Our companies have been bootlicking china to exploit labor for 30 years.  

And again, zero support for China here.  I thought we were making a mistake 30 years ago and I think we have made a huge mistake now

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On 5/25/2021 at 5:04 PM, Joe Bryant said:

Can you elaborate? Big how? And to who? I think I understand but wondering what you thought.

For China and their government, Taiwan is a thorn in their side. A giant middle finger to their grand aspirations. They believe Taiwan is part of China. They desire re-unification and a time where Taiwan is part of China once again. 

Actually, we should backtrack. 

China believes the 21st century is their century. They greatly dislike the US led world order that has developed since 1945. China feels they haven't received the respect that they feel they deserve and that other countries have taken advantage of China when they were weak in the past (dating back centuries). China teaches their history and concludes it with "Never again." They view their history as a time of great disrespect and they never want it to happen again.

To achieve global domination, a country must achieve regional dominance first. Can't dominate on the global stage if you aren't the only sheriff in town in your backyard. For China, this means rendering the US power in Asia to zero. This means rendering Western power to nothing in the region. This may help some view the South China Sea issue differently. 

Taiwan being a Western-esque country/society in China's backyard is a huge middle finger to China. Where did Chiang Kai-shek retreat to? Taiwan. 

The US, since 1979, has maintained a policy of "strategic ambiguity" with regards to Taiwan. CFR ranks Taiwan as a Tier 1 issue to watch in 2021. 

Harvard Professor Graham Allison wrote a good book on China and the US that I would advise anyone interested in the topic to check out: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01IAS9FZY/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_hsch_vapi_tkin_p1_i0

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21 hours ago, Don't Toews Me said:

For China and their government, Taiwan is a thorn in their side. A giant middle finger to their grand aspirations. They believe Taiwan is part of China. They desire re-unification and a time where Taiwan is part of China once again. 

Actually, we should backtrack. 

China believes the 21st century is their century. They greatly dislike the US led world order that has developed since 1945. China feels they haven't received the respect that they feel they deserve and that other countries have taken advantage of China when they were weak in the past (dating back centuries). China teaches their history and concludes it with "Never again." They view their history as a time of great disrespect and they never want it to happen again.

To achieve global domination, a country must achieve regional dominance first. Can't dominate on the global stage if you aren't the only sheriff in town in your backyard. For China, this means rendering the US power in Asia to zero. This means rendering Western power to nothing in the region. This may help some view the South China Sea issue differently. 

Taiwan being a Western-esque country/society in China's backyard is a huge middle finger to China. Where did Chiang Kai-shek retreat to? Taiwan. 

The US, since 1979, has maintained a policy of "strategic ambiguity" with regards to Taiwan. CFR ranks Taiwan as a Tier 1 issue to watch in 2021. 

Harvard Professor Graham Allison wrote a good book on China and the US that I would advise anyone interested in the topic to check out: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01IAS9FZY/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_hsch_vapi_tkin_p1_i0

Thank you. Very helpful for discussion.

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The Taiwan Temptation | Foreign Affairs

They will not allow another repeat of 1996. US sent some aircraft carriers in the region and that was the end of that. Why? China could not compete at the time. And they knew it. Talk about a hit to the ego.

China (and others) were shocked by how quick the US and allies obliterated Iraq in Desert Storm. "American Magic" they call it. Referring to the coordination between the various branches of the military as well as the technological advantage. China's military modernization the last couple decades has focused on these components. 

 

 

 

 

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On 6/4/2021 at 1:13 PM, Joe Bryant said:

Thank you. Very helpful for discussion.

I should have clarified. When I said "China," I was mainly referring to the party in power. I do not know the intricacies when it comes to the diverse opinions of over a billion people within a country. Do all Chinese people feel the past represented a period of disrespect? I cannot answer that. I can speculate, but I cannot answer definitively. So for the sake of accuracy and proper discussion purposes, we should refer to the government of China. I do not wish to spread false information.

On a separate but related note, the following video will be an interesting space to watch over the next 10-15 years. Adds another importance to Taiwan and TSMC: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUfjtKtkS2U

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  • 3 weeks later...

I'm sure this is fine. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-57578926?

From Morning Brew:

Quote

 

Today, Hong Kong’s largest pro-democracy tabloid, Apple Daily, printed its last issue. But it wasn't a case of a newspaper failing in its pivot to digital: Chinese authorities raided its offices last Thursday, froze its assets, and arrested five executives, including the editor-in-chief. 

Founder Jimmy Lai has been in jail since last year for participating in a political protest, among other charges.

The publication covered everything from celebrity gossip to politics and was known for being anti-government, irreverent, and a strong supporter of pro-democracy protests.

Free speech is getting more costly in Hong Kong

The region has historically been a media hub because of its press freedoms, but the government’s crackdown on pro-democracy activism has spread to journalism. 

Radio Television Hong Kong (RTHK) was forced to swap its station head with a career politician with no journalism experience.

Following difficulties obtaining necessary work permits, the New York Times moved part of its Hong Kong office to Seoul.

Looking ahead...the former chair of the Hong Kong Journalists Association said, “Police did not rule out the possibility of more arrests, and the next [target] could be other media.”

 

 

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