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WR Davante Adams, LV (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I didn’t say he felt fine.
he said he was feeling better & didn’t require surgery. That was after the MRI when he thought it wasn’t that bad, which is what i said. You quoted me so why the confusion about my words?But hey keep doing you and lacking the ability to have a civil conversation without being antagonistic And mis-quoting people. It’s a good look.
He also said this:
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shadyridr
Footballguy
I wasn't the one saying use google and good luck so you started with the antagonistic condescending toneI didn’t say he felt fine.
He also said this:
I just continued it
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
No you were just sea lioning after I already told you the source.
have a nice day Mr Sea Lion. Good luck figuring out how google works.
flapgreen
Footballguy
He has big problems if he actually has a torn ligament or even a severely sprained one. Everything seems very fuzzy right now. Really no good way of knowing.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Any sprain is a tear.
Imma repeat that because it’s important: any spran is a tear.
thats why they grade sprains.
the worst of which require surgery. Adams toe does not require surgery & he said it’s improving.
it’s not fuzzy. He gave us a very clear update 6 days ago. he said he’s making progress. Julio Jones played well through his turf toe once it healed a bit through rest days & proper management.
step away from the ledge. He doesn’t need surgery & it’s improving. That’s the best possible report. Just because he’s not tweeting hourly progress doesn’t mean it’s gotten any worse.
everyone needs to take several deep breaths.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
flapgreen
Footballguy
I'm aware of that. I'm a physical therapist. It's why I'm participating in the discussion. I don't actually own Adams in any leagues.Any sprain is a tear.
Imma repeat that because it’s important: any strain is a tear.
thats why they grade sprains.
the worst of which require surgery. Adams toe does not require surgery & he said it’s improving.
it’s not fuzzy. He gave us a very clear update 6 days ago. he said he’s making progress. Julio Jones played well through his turf toe once it healed a bit through rest days & proper management.
step away from the ledge. He doesn’t need surgery & it’s improving. That’s the best possible report. Just because he’s not tweeting hourly progress doesn’t mean it’s gotten any worse.
everyone needs to take several deep breaths.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
The way you said “a torn ligament or a severe sprain” seemed like you didn’t since they’re basically the same thing. My apologies.
What seems important to me is that it’s not so severe that it requires surgery, and inside 2 weeks and a couple days he’s improving.
guess I’m a glass half-full kinda guy.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
flap knows his stuff. refreshing when another person is educated and understands how it all works
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
Imagine any health care provider trying to diagnose an injury they have not examined, palpitated, worked. One of which they have no pictures, no MRI. Imagine then that they don't talk to the patient but hear from his spokesman, talking through the press, saying not what is actually going on, but what will be best for his employer. That health care provider would be committing malpractice in trying to diagnose or treat the injury. They would decline the patient, tell him to rest it, keep it elevated and iced, and to slowly work back into matters only after it felt better, but to go slow at first.
We are trying to diagnose with no real information. Diagnosis probably should not involve reading the tea leaves. Still, that is what is left to us. Right now the tea leaves seem to be getting read exactly according to the hopes or propensities of those reading them. They are an image in which we see our own thoughts, not anything really to do with the injury itself.
I know under McCarthy the Packers were cautious and conservative on guys returning to the field. Under this new regime, who knows.
We are trying to diagnose with no real information. Diagnosis probably should not involve reading the tea leaves. Still, that is what is left to us. Right now the tea leaves seem to be getting read exactly according to the hopes or propensities of those reading them. They are an image in which we see our own thoughts, not anything really to do with the injury itself.
I know under McCarthy the Packers were cautious and conservative on guys returning to the field. Under this new regime, who knows.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
If I had a dollar for every time you’ve been wrong about an injury I’d be a wealthy man.
hey, remember earlier in the year when you called a time-lime given by experts on an injury “obnoxious” and wrote an extensive post about why it was so wrong? And then it turned out to be spot on?
Yeah. That.
With no disrespect to flapgreen, the fact is we just don’t know. And again: Many players have played through turf toe. Julio Jones is probably the best example.
unless you’re personally treating Adams, you don’t know his timeline.
and what started this whole panicked side-thread was the “DNP” from Monday’s practice. Yeah, about that:
so he was a DNP at a practice that wasn’t.
So again - maybe wait for an actual official player update. Then we’ll know if it’s weeks or months or if he needs his toe amputated or what.
That’s what an “educated” person would do.
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Interseptopus
Footballguy
I dont know why I click to unhide your posts sometimes, you're so condescending
The post you are referring to I later said that I did not catch it was a meniscus repair; I thought it was a meniscectomy (like Gallup had). The timeline was correct once I saw it was a repair. I guess you missed that post.
You're the only one here looking at this through rose colored glasses.
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What @Ditkaless Wonders said above is exactly right -- people are seeing whatever they want to see.Any sprain is a tear.
Imma repeat that because it’s important: any spran is a tear.
thats why they grade sprains.
the worst of which require surgery. Adams toe does not require surgery & he said it’s improving.
it’s not fuzzy. He gave us a very clear update 6 days ago. he said he’s making progress. Julio Jones played well through his turf toe once it healed a bit through rest days & proper management.
step away from the ledge. He doesn’t need surgery & it’s improving. That’s the best possible report. Just because he’s not tweeting hourly progress doesn’t mean it’s gotten any worse.
everyone needs to take several deep breaths.
I don't own Adams anywhere, but I'd have the exact opposite reaction as the bolded. "Making progress", "it's improving" etc. is about as fuzzy and unclear as can be.
About the only clear thing is that 2+ weeks out, he still can't get on the field, and nobody's offering anything in the way of a timeline for when he will.
If I was an Adams owner, I'd be very pessimistic about his outlook ROS.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
So you’re seeing what you want to see, which is a negative?
weird - Tyreek Hill’s injury was considered much more significant & people similarly were pessimistic. He was back in 4 weeks.
again: we don’t know anything except it’s improving, and doesn’t require surgery.
its irresponsible to project anything else for the better or the worse without an actual update.
shadyridr
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
because you want to learn things about FF, probably. Nice personal attack tho. Really helps your credibility.
Nice revisionist history.
it wasn’t that you “didn’t catch” it. It was the next day. You made your criticism of the timeline given by the team based & your subsequent prognosis based on what you ASSUMED his injury was.
and you guessed wrong. Way to not own it.
and it’s hardly the 1st time.
And you’re the one consistently wrong with medical prognosis for patients you’ve never actually met.
i’d rather be me; thanks. My glasses are “realism-colored”
im hardly a Pollyanna. I am howwever the only one here going by the actual updates, and pointing out that other players have actually played through turf toe.
so because I’m not doom & gloom rife with assumption I’m rose-colored glasses?
fascinating projection. Keep unhiding my posts for sensible, realistic takes though.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I’m not condescending at all. That’s projection.
probably why you never noticed it before.
but thanks for the insult.
There isn't anything I want to see. I've got no skin in the game at all. Just giving an outsider's take on it.
On Adams specifically, it doesn't look good.
On you and the other posters in this thread, @Ditkaless Wonders nailed it.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Ok, well your “outsiders perspective” happens to be pessimistic.
and that’s ok - it’s just not based on much besides a gut feel.
i feel like the best approach as a FF manager who does have him is to wait & see and lay attention to the updates. Assuming Adams prognosis for ROS seems irresponsible.
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Rhythmdoctor
Footballguy
Todem
Footballguy
Turf toe is never good. I do not own Adams. But you really should be actively finding way to overcome him not being around for a while. Toe injuries are really tough, especially for RB's, WR's, CB's who do so much cutting on the dime and planting.
Regardless of the fact I have no information or MRI reports to look at....the history of this injury suggests an extended absence, and comes to pain tolerance and will he take an injection to play.....which I hope he would never do. It destroyed OJ McDuffie's career.
After the week 11 bye is a good target for his return. If he rushed back and re-aggravates it? Done for the season most likely and it will really be a big risk. Maybe he get's back earlier. Maybe not. All you can do as a FF is monitor updates. That is all we really have. But the moment he went down with a toe injury...I would have been working the market hard. Knowing the history of big toe injuries does help.
Regardless of the fact I have no information or MRI reports to look at....the history of this injury suggests an extended absence, and comes to pain tolerance and will he take an injection to play.....which I hope he would never do. It destroyed OJ McDuffie's career.
After the week 11 bye is a good target for his return. If he rushed back and re-aggravates it? Done for the season most likely and it will really be a big risk. Maybe he get's back earlier. Maybe not. All you can do as a FF is monitor updates. That is all we really have. But the moment he went down with a toe injury...I would have been working the market hard. Knowing the history of big toe injuries does help.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
yes, that might well be the case.
and I agree, you never hope to have turf toe happen.
but we really can’t go by anything other than what Adam’s or the Packers tell us. That they brought in Cobb would indicate to me he won’t be back this week.
but it is only week seven… And in the past I have had players who played through turf toe. The example I gave above a couple of times was Julio Jones. I had him that year, and there was the exact same doom and gloom prognosis from everyone saying that we’d be lucky to have them back for the playoffs. Not only did he play through it, but he played really well.
so it is in the range of possibilities that it’s not another five weeks.
oddsbodkins
Footballguy
Assume nothing until he plays a full game and comes away OK. Might not be this year. I'm holding in the hopes he's back for the playoff push. GB is lost without him.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Well, until he returns to practice, at least.
then you take it one step at a time. Do you start him his first week back? That’s probably risky as you elude to above. It is an injury notorious for recurrence.
some people may not have the luxury though and will take the risk.
no doubt, it’s a mess.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
oddsbodkins
Footballguy
I'd be leery starting him first game back if I had any option that didn't turn my stomach!
Meanwhile, we all wait for yahoo to list him as out...
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I’m pretty sure he’s out. But I do appreciate that this topic has returned to sensible discussion.
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
Shifting some talk away from the banter, has anyone traded FOR or away ADAMS?
I just received an offer of Kamara, (possibly out till Week9), Michel, Landry
for Fournette and Adams
Thought it was interesting enough to share with two hurt guys involved.
I just received an offer of Kamara, (possibly out till Week9), Michel, Landry
for Fournette and Adams
Thought it was interesting enough to share with two hurt guys involved.
Both of you are super close to taking a long time off. Both of you stop cluttering the boards with the petty back and forth. It ruins the board.
When you type something, make it 100% about Football and not another poster. Full stop.
My perspective is based upon what we've seen before when other players have had this injury, coupled with the absence of any positive quotes/information/timeline out of GB, coupled with the lack of activity 2+ weeks post-injury.
I consider that a bit more information-based than just a "gut feel", but I suppose opinions may differ.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
As an Adams owner, I would probably consider that trade. A high ankle sprain, while equally serious, is a somewhat predictable return timeline.
well I am not as pessimistic about Adams as others, there’s definitely a nebulous nature to turf toe. Every player responds differently to it and timelines can vary greatly.
Plus, when Camara is healthy he is likely more capable of better things which is why he was a top three draft pick.
I like that trade for you.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Six days ago Adams was quoted as saying he was improving.
you can update your timeline a little bit with that.
Well, again, two people can read the same ambiguous quote and reach opposite conclusions. If the best he can say is a nothing quote like "it's improving", I don't take that as a positive. I understand you do see that as a positive, and that's your prerogative.
Regardless, it's not a timeline.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
It has to be a positive. Improvement is always positive. Come on.
if you said it was not improving or getting worse, that would be a negative, right?.m
as for not practicing, with any sort of foot injury knee injury calf injury strain tear pole or any other soft tissue injury, you would never expect to see a Play or practice. So to me that has no weight to the positive or negative because it’s wholly expected.
Will have to agree to disagree then. Because I see “improvement“ as a positive and apparently you do not.
ps - The timeline I referred to was the time between updates. You suggested there has been no update. I corrected that.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
If that were the case, why wouldn’t the Packers have put him on the IR? From the time of the injury that would’ve been 8 weeks to week 11.
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My take is, if there was something positive to say about his status/recovery/return to play, he would have said something other than "it's improving", which is essentially saying nothing.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
McBokonon
Footballguy
I don't know why they're doing what they're doing, I'm just saying when I heard "turf toe" I immediately prepared to be without him for a long time and acted that way. If he comes back sooner, great.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
I've never seen a player say "yeah I'm screwed" "it's not healing" "It hurts like hell"
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
That's what I'm thinking. Kamara at 100% week 10, or Adams at unknown. The tough part is Fournette has been playing like a RB1 pretty close to Kamara level without Brees.
Tough situation to sift through.
leave a whisper
Footballguy
is his toe going to "bother him" ROS ? ..... prob
but in the NFL after 6-7 weeks just about every player has an ankle, foot, toe, elbow, hammy, back, finger, knee issue --- these guys are tough & play football through issues that would cause you & i not to go walk around at the zoo with our family.
he is getting around the clock care from specialists - once he is cleared by DR's (joint is stable) he will be out there
but in the NFL after 6-7 weeks just about every player has an ankle, foot, toe, elbow, hammy, back, finger, knee issue --- these guys are tough & play football through issues that would cause you & i not to go walk around at the zoo with our family.
he is getting around the clock care from specialists - once he is cleared by DR's (joint is stable) he will be out there
VikingFrog
Footballguy
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Yes, we are actually.So we disagree on the meaning of “it’s improving”.
ok.
If a guy had nothing positive to say, I'd expect him to say something vague like "it's improving".
You're taking those words literally, and I'm reading between the lines.
Of course we've got some other quotes to add into the mix:
Those words don't paint the picture of a guy that's coming back any second now. But again, just one outsider's take.
