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Phenoms Class Action: Need name/email ASAP (1 Viewer)

T

TheWalk84

Footballguy
Hey all!

I received this email from a couple of owners, and feel our strongest move here will be to organize one list of everyone who has been involved with Phenoms FF over the years:

Let's get this process started, moving swiftly and in one motion is our best chance to get this resolved quickly!

Do not stand for Phenomsff refusing to pay fantasy prizes.
Hi everyone - as I'm sure you are all well aware by now, Phenomsff Commissioner Michael Zangrilli recently sent out an email saying he will not honor his commitment to Phenoms fantasy football league and prizes will be paid at only 20-40 percent (more likely that he plans on paying nothing at all). All league money was promised to always be safe in Escrow. Michael Zangrilli cannot legally take our entry fees and run. We need to act fast and organize. Let's try to formulate an email chain by Monday. We can then find some assistance to prevent Comissioner Zangrilli from running away with our money. Andrew Walker is a league member & is a licensed California Attorney. He plans to seek out an Attorney from Utah to see what actions may be taken on our behalf against Mike & his company. If you do not want to simply sit by & allow someone to steal our time & money please contact Andrew Walker at awalker3441@gmail.com

Since this email was sent early this morning, Michael Zangrilli has informed Andrew he officially has an attorney.

For this initial step, Andrew has asked all to simply reply with your name and email address.



Thanks


 
*sigh*

Not involved but this kind of thing is going to ruin the hobby and invite legal scrutiny and possible outlawing as "gambling"

 
Rather than having people post their names and emails here, why don't you have them email that information to him directly.

There's nothing to be gained in this situation by people revealing their names and emails on this forum.

 
Greg Russell said:
Rather than having people post their names and emails here, why don't you have them email that information to him directly.

There's nothing to be gained in this situation by people revealing their names and emails on this forum.
Click to expand...
I did both. I don't give $@!& at this point.

 
Guys, putting your email address in a public forum just guarantees you 100x more spam than you are already getting.

 
Greg Russell said:
Rather than having people post their names and emails here, why don't you have them email that information to him directly.

There's nothing to be gained in this situation by people revealing their names and emails on this forum.
Click to expand...
Good point

I think it would have just been easier to collect everything in one place, but I want this to be painless, so just email him directly with your information!

Thanks!

 
Wow, I recall people on this site recommending these as fun, reputable leagues over the years.

What is his alleged reason for not offering full payouts this year?

 
ILUVBEER99 said:
this will just make sure nobody gets any money except the lawyers.
Click to expand...
Totally open to any other ideas, if you think there is a better way...

Hoping if there are enough people on board, he will be forced to not fight it and just pay out.. otherwise he will just keep the money, not be held accountable, and most likely pull off his next con with unsuspecting victims..

Seriously, if you think there is a better way to help get our money back I am totally down

 
purestrength said:
Wow, I recall people on this site recommending these as fun, reputable leagues over the years.

What is his alleged reason for not offering full payouts this year?
Click to expand...
He told this insane story of website "developers" who quoted him 200K originally and then he has now paid them 630k+ and it still is not finished.. He used all the money he had supposedly kept in escrow to pay this "company" and now can only pay about 20-40% MAX of the prize pool...

So many holes to this story though..

The facts are he has somewhere around 1.2 million dollars and he is saying he won't/can't pay the winners more than 20-40%..

It is insane...

 
renesauz said:
*sigh*

Not involved but this kind of thing is going to ruin the hobby and invite legal scrutiny and possible outlawing as "gambling"
Click to expand...
Why do people always say this when wronged players simply want justice for what has happened? We've had what, 5 or 6 companies (WCOFF, AFFL, Fantasy Jungle, Antsports, Phenoms) fail over time, and nothing EVER gets legislated.

What should be legislated is a company like Phenoms which publicly states that the entry fees are in a safe account (or the like) and they obviously are not. Mike flat out lied about the safety of the entry fees for payouts, misrepresenting to the public that the $ was safe. [SIZE=14.4444446563721px]THAT is fraudulent, and should be criminalized.[/SIZE]

 
So this is where 100 people get together and try to figure out how to divide the $20 left over after all the lawyers get theirs?

 
TheWalk84 said:
Hey all!

I received this email from a couple of owners, and feel our strongest move here will be to organize one list of everyone who has been involved with Phenoms FF over the years:

Let's get this process started, moving swiftly and in one motion is our best chance to get this resolved quickly!

Do not stand for Phenomsff refusing to pay fantasy prizes.

Hi everyone - as I'm sure you are all well aware by now, Phenomsff Commissioner Michael Zangrilli recently sent out an email saying he will not honor his commitment to Phenoms fantasy football league and prizes will be paid at only 20-40 percent (more likely that he plans on paying nothing at all). All league money was promised to always be safe in Escrow. Michael Zangrilli cannot legally take our entry fees and run. We need to act fast and organize. Let's try to formulate an email chain by Monday. We can then find some assistance to prevent Comissioner Zangrilli from running away with our money. Andrew Walker is a league member & is a licensed California Attorney. He plans to seek out an Attorney from Utah to see what actions may be taken on our behalf against Mike & his company. If you do not want to simply sit by & allow someone to steal our time & money please contact Andrew Walker at awalker3441@gmail.com

Since this email was sent early this morning, Michael Zangrilli has informed Andrew he officially has an attorney.

For this initial step, Andrew has asked all to simply reply with your name and email address.

Thanks
Click to expand...
It's not just football. There are active basketball and hockey leagues where Mike said he was going to refund our league entry fees but I would have to think he is sitting on that money too.

 
Quez said:
:ptts: should of used leaguesafe.com
Click to expand...
Commish left a dynasty league I was in. New commish stepped up, but said he would not use leaguesafe like the previous commish. I left the league and everyone said I was some sort of an ### for trying to force the new commish to use the service. It is human nature to trust people. I expect a huge league like Phenoms to fold every few years and new ones will pop up in its place. The only question is who will be the sheeple losing their money? If you are mad right now, you need to take a breath and get a little introspective. You paid money over the internet to a single dude to hold instead of requesting an escrow.

You have not lost all faith in humanity to ask for a service to hold the pool of funds. Point at the shirt.

 
use the same subject so the lawyer doesn't hate you all in the morning for filling up his inbox. I'm sure he has other matters to tend to also

 
No lawyer worth his salt is going to touch this. The bankruptcy court is going to handle out how the money gets distributed. Besides there are it enough assets to go after. This idea is beyond silly.

 
Wow, apparently I got out in time. I played in 2-3 Phenoms leagues each year for several years including one contract league long term. I bailed after last year, not because of anything Mike did, but solely because I was playing in too many leagues to enjoy it. Kind of felt like something wasn't the same about his leagues, too, but couldn't quite pinpoint it.

That said, I got everything he owed me.

 
As was already pointed out you guys are kicking a dead horse. Mike will file for bankruptcy protection and whatever assets he has (if any) will be frozen. His secured creditors such as banks and Uncle Sam will be paid first with any money that is recouped. Whatever is left will be divi'ed up between the thousands of creditors who are out of money. Guaranteed this guy doesn't have two nickels to rub together. If anyone wants to confirm my suspicion of that just look at his credit ratings.

It sucks but this happens all the time. The guy won't go to jail and most likely will start up another business in his wife/mother/?' s name. Rinse, wash, repeat. Most of these guys are just out of control and have too many vices . They just bs their way thru and think they can live like millionaires. Most do not have any remorse or conscious like the average person does. Don't for once think they are wired like you are.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
ROCKET said:
As was already pointed out you guys are kicking a dead horse. Mike will file for bankruptcy protection and whatever assets he has (if any) will be frozen. His secured creditors such as banks and Uncle Sam will be paid first with any money that is recouped. Whatever is left will be divi'ed up between the thousands of creditors who are out of money. Guaranteed this guy doesn't have two nickels to rub together. If anyone wants to confirm my suspicion of that just look at his credit ratings.

It sucks but this happens all the time. The guy won't go to jail and most likely will start up another business in his wife/mother/?' s name. Rinse, wash, repeat. Most of these guys are just out of control and have too many vices . They just bs their way thru and think they can live like millionaires. Most do not have any remorse or conscious like the average person does. Don't for once think they are wired like you are.
Click to expand...
:goodposting:

Especially the bolded. Mike was for years a hands on commish and would chat with some of the regulars who had multiple leagues. It seemed like everybody liked him in draft chat, and he came across like one of the guys. Just a regular joe. But none of us regular joes in our wildest dreams would think of defrauding so many on such a massive scale. This guy has icewater in his veins, and the vice that is fantasy football to us is just the tip of the iceberg of the laundry list of vices he probably has.

 
ROCKET said:
As was already pointed out you guys are kicking a dead horse. Mike will file for bankruptcy protection and whatever assets he has (if any) will be frozen. His secured creditors such as banks and Uncle Sam will be paid first with any money that is recouped. Whatever is left will be divi'ed up between the thousands of creditors who are out of money. Guaranteed this guy doesn't have two nickels to rub together. If anyone wants to confirm my suspicion of that just look at his credit ratings.

It sucks but this happens all the time. The guy won't go to jail and most likely will start up another business in his wife/mother/?' s name. Rinse, wash, repeat. Most of these guys are just out of control and have too many vices . They just bs their way thru and think they can live like millionaires. Most do not have any remorse or conscious like the average person does. Don't for once think they are wired like you are.
Click to expand...
I know i am clearly naive but I would think there is some point to at least attempting to hold someone legally accountable for fraud. Maybe through legal action, however futile, you make others watching from the sidelines think twice about trying this...

 
habsfan said:
ROCKET said:
As was already pointed out you guys are kicking a dead horse. Mike will file for bankruptcy protection and whatever assets he has (if any) will be frozen. His secured creditors such as banks and Uncle Sam will be paid first with any money that is recouped. Whatever is left will be divi'ed up between the thousands of creditors who are out of money. Guaranteed this guy doesn't have two nickels to rub together. If anyone wants to confirm my suspicion of that just look at his credit ratings.

It sucks but this happens all the time. The guy won't go to jail and most likely will start up another business in his wife/mother/?' s name. Rinse, wash, repeat. Most of these guys are just out of control and have too many vices . They just bs their way thru and think they can live like millionaires. Most do not have any remorse or conscious like the average person does. Don't for once think they are wired like you are.
Click to expand...
I know i am clearly naive but I would think there is some point to at least attempting to hold someone legally accountable for fraud. Maybe through legal action, however futile, you make others watching from the sidelines think twice about trying this...
Click to expand...
The problem is legally the guy will skate and never serve a day in jail. I agree it's fraud and should be criminal. The problem is the system doesn't hold these crooks accountable for their actions and they know it. The simplest way to put it is that they can basically steal tens/hundreds of thousands of dollars from hard working people and never be prosecuted for it.

They will claim the business failed and they had no ill intent. For every Bernie Madoff that is prosecuted there are thousands of pos that walk. Anyone who knows how business works knows it's an unfortunate part of it.

 
ROCKET said:
As was already pointed out you guys are kicking a dead horse. Mike will file for bankruptcy protection and whatever assets he has (if any) will be frozen. His secured creditors such as banks and Uncle Sam will be paid first with any money that is recouped. Whatever is left will be divi'ed up between the thousands of creditors who are out of money. Guaranteed this guy doesn't have two nickels to rub together. If anyone wants to confirm my suspicion of that just look at his credit ratings.

It sucks but this happens all the time. The guy won't go to jail and most likely will start up another business in his wife/mother/?' s name. Rinse, wash, repeat. Most of these guys are just out of control and have too many vices . They just bs their way thru and think they can live like millionaires. Most do not have any remorse or conscious like the average person does. Don't for once think they are wired like you are.
Click to expand...
Not that you'll get your money back but there's at least a chance he ends up like this guy... Don Lapree ...eventually.

Fantasy Football is a huge business so there are a lot of these guys wanting to scam people.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
All of us who lost money in Mike's long con ponzi scheme deserve what we got for not making sure we had some sort of protection in place. We had the word of a commissioner who had always paid quickly and with no problems. And a smorgasbord of league formats that made for interesting lineups and strategies compared to the CBS or Yahoo standard leagues. It was a lot of fun and everything seemed on the up and up. We didn't want to believe there was any risk to investing in small money leagues. I helped build Mike's business referring friends that signed up for his baseball leagues as well. I feel guilty for the referral now. Like I vouched for him. My conscience is not clean. I'm sure my friends won't blame me, but I do.

These types of failures are going to have a hit on this industry. The decision to spend discretionary income on harmless hobbies like fantasy football are based on trust. People want the the service of a paid commish who takes a small rake for the convenience of not having to deal with the headaches of being a commissioner. There's an instant gratification you get when you sign up for a league and it's all set up for you, money all collected, draft order set. You are good to go. It's a convenience based industry that Mike was doing with his Phenoms website. Now a lot of people who would otherwise not worry about dropping $50 for a league will just stay away. It may not seem like much, but the number of people who back away will be significant. And the budgets of those who continue will begin to dwindle. Fantasy football cannibalizing itself.

 
Just got this response from Utah Attorney general office:

[SIZE=9.5pt]Thank you for writing to the Utah Attorney General's Office. Maybe we should all call the other phone# listed.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9.5pt]We did find that Phenom Enterprises, LLC, is licensed with the Utah Division of Corporations and Commercial Code. With Phenom Enterprises, LLC being licensed, the Utah Division of Consumer Protection[/SIZE] will take your report and look into them further.

[SIZE=9.5pt]We recommend contacting the Division of Consumer Protection at (801) 530-6601[/SIZE], Monday - Friday 8 a.m to 5 p.m. If others have filed a complaint, an investigation could be possible.

[SIZE=9.5pt]We trust this information will be helpful to you.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9.5pt]Sincerely,[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9.5pt]Utah State Attorney General's Office[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9.5pt]Constituent Services[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9.5pt]Salt Lake City, Utah 84111[/SIZE]

[SIZE=9.5pt](801) 366-0260[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]-- [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Constituent Services
Utah Attorney General's Office [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium](801) 366-0260[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]u[/SIZE][SIZE=medium]ag@utah.gov[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]This email transmission from the Office of the Utah State Attorney General, contains information which may be confidential and/or legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named on this transmission. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited and that the email should be deleted immediately. If you have received this email in error, please notify us at uag@utah.govmailto:uag@utah.gov [/SIZE]The unauthorized disclosure, use or publication of confidential or privileged information inadvertently transmitted to you may result in criminal and/or civil liability.*

 
jon_mx said:
No lawyer worth his salt is going to touch this. The bankruptcy court is going to handle out how the money gets distributed. Besides there are it enough assets to go after. This idea is beyond silly.
Click to expand...
You are wrong on so many levels..

Embezzlement is the act of dishonestly withholding assets for the purpose ofconversion (theft) of such assets by one or more individuals to whom such assets have been entrusted, to be held and/or used for other purposes

Wire Fraud is any fraudulent scheme to intentionally deprive another of property or honest services via mail or wire communication

What Mike did is the very definition of embezzlement and wire fraud, which are felonies in the state of Utah, punishable by up 20 years in prison and full restitution of funds..

To put this further in perspective a Utah woman was just indicted by a grand jury on Embezzlement and wire fraud charges in June of this year. She "used" 1.3 million dollars of client "protected" funds. So there is recent precedence.. If investigations yield he spent ANY of that money gambling or to purchase any sort of personal item, that is felony wire fraud, every time is one count.

At the very least the class action will help the criminal case against mike… In the end, justice might be the only thing we get, and for most of us, that is O.K.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Dapitbull said:
Just got this response from Utah Attorney general office:

*snip*

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICEThis email transmission from the Office of the Utah State Attorney General, contains information which may be confidential and/or legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named on this transmission. If you are not the intended recipient,you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited and that the email should be deleted immediately. If you have received this email in error, please notify us at uag@utah.gov The unauthorized disclosure, use or publication of confidential or privileged information inadvertently transmitted to you may result in criminal and/or civil liability.*
Click to expand...
:slow clap:

 
LittlePhatty said:
Dapitbull said:
Just got this response from Utah Attorney general office:

*snip*

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICEThis email transmission from the Office of the Utah State Attorney General, contains information which may be confidential and/or legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named on this transmission. If you are not the intended recipient,you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited and that the email should be deleted immediately. If you have received this email in error, please notify us at uag@utah.gov The unauthorized disclosure, use or publication of confidential or privileged information inadvertently transmitted to you may result in criminal and/or civil liability.*
Click to expand...
:slow clap:
Click to expand...
It wasn't inadvertently sent to him.

 
TheWalk84 said:
purestrength said:
Wow, I recall people on this site recommending these as fun, reputable leagues over the years.

What is his alleged reason for not offering full payouts this year?
Click to expand...
He told this insane story of website "developers" who quoted him 200K originally and then he has now paid them 630k+ and it still is not finished.. He used all the money he had supposedly kept in escrow to pay this "company" and now can only pay about 20-40% MAX of the prize pool...

So many holes to this story though..

The facts are he has somewhere around 1.2 million dollars and he is saying he won't/can't pay the winners more than 20-40%..

It is insane...
Click to expand...
damn, the obamacare website software developers strike again!

 
Raiderfan32904 said:
All of us who lost money in Mike's long con ponzi scheme deserve what we got for not making sure we had some sort of protection in place. We had the word of a commissioner who had always paid quickly and with no problems. And a smorgasbord of league formats that made for interesting lineups and strategies compared to the CBS or Yahoo standard leagues. It was a lot of fun and everything seemed on the up and up. We didn't want to believe there was any risk to investing in small money leagues. I helped build Mike's business referring friends that signed up for his baseball leagues as well. I feel guilty for the referral now. Like I vouched for him. My conscience is not clean. I'm sure my friends won't blame me, but I do.

These types of failures are going to have a hit on this industry. The decision to spend discretionary income on harmless hobbies like fantasy football are based on trust. People want the the service of a paid commish who takes a small rake for the convenience of not having to deal with the headaches of being a commissioner. There's an instant gratification you get when you sign up for a league and it's all set up for you, money all collected, draft order set. You are good to go. It's a convenience based industry that Mike was doing with his Phenoms website. Now a lot of people who would otherwise not worry about dropping $50 for a league will just stay away. It may not seem like much, but the number of people who back away will be significant. And the budgets of those who continue will begin to dwindle. Fantasy football cannibalizing itself.
Click to expand...
Well said brother, well said.

Everyone scrambling for their money like ants on a hill. Hoping paypal or a credit card company will bail them out. When really they should look in the mirror.

 
ROCKET said:
As was already pointed out you guys are kicking a dead horse. Mike will file for bankruptcy protection and whatever assets he has (if any) will be frozen. His secured creditors such as banks and Uncle Sam will be paid first with any money that is recouped. Whatever is left will be divi'ed up between the thousands of creditors who are out of money. Guaranteed this guy doesn't have two nickels to rub together. If anyone wants to confirm my suspicion of that just look at his credit ratings.

It sucks but this happens all the time. The guy won't go to jail and most likely will start up another business in his wife/mother/?' s name. Rinse, wash, repeat. Most of these guys are just out of control and have too many vices . They just bs their way thru and think they can live like millionaires. Most do not have any remorse or conscious like the average person does. Don't for once think they are wired like you are.
Click to expand...
The funny part is when he starts his next scam there will be a lot from this site that will jump on board. Because their vice is gambling on fantasy football, or whatever else comes along.

 
TheWalk84 said:
jon_mx said:
No lawyer worth his salt is going to touch this. The bankruptcy court is going to handle out how the money gets distributed. Besides there are it enough assets to go after. This idea is beyond silly.
Click to expand...
You are wrong on so many levels..

Embezzlement is the act of dishonestly withholding assets for the purpose ofconversion (theft) of such assets by one or more individuals to whom such assets have been entrusted, to be held and/or used for other purposes

Wire Fraud is any fraudulent scheme to intentionally deprive another of property or honest services via mail or wire communication

What Mike did is the very definition of embezzlement and wire fraud, which are felonies in the state of Utah, punishable by up 20 years in prison and full restitution of funds..

To put this further in perspective a Utah woman was just indicted by a grand jury on Embezzlement and wire fraud charges in June of this year. She "used" 1.3 million dollars of client "protected" funds. So there is recent precedence.. If investigations yield he spent ANY of that money gambling or to purchase any sort of personal item, that is felony wire fraud, every time is one count.

At the very least the class action will help the criminal case against mike… In the end, justice might be the only thing we get, and for most of us, that is O.K.
Click to expand...
:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: Good luck with your case.

 
So this is where the Zangrilli defenders get together to insult people who lost money?

Looking up, yep, here they are.

 
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