There should be some worry. It could play out like the last time, but it is far less likely to do so. That is why the NFLPA filed prematurely in TX- they wanted to avoid the SDNY. It’s the same reason they are asking for en banc hearing, even though they know it is likely to get denied (& they risk incurring penalties for filing a request the 5th circuit could deem “frivolous.”). They are desperate to keep the case out of SDNY. If they are worried, it would make sense for Zekes FF owners to be, also.
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RB Ezekiel Elliott, NE (7 Viewers)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
No offense, but both of those offers are really bad. If those guys are bench players for you, why wouldn’t they be bench players for the Zeke owner?
Obviously, if you can get Zeke for one of (or both) those guys, that’s well worth the risk.
NeverEnough
Footballguy
Well, he rejected my counter as expected because it was a lofty counter. However, he sent another offer of Julio, Landry & D. Murray for Zeke, Morris & Marvin Jones.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Of course they aren't very good offers. I'm trading for a player who can't play this week or the following 6 weeks. At this point in the season if you have a losing record you may have to make some drastic changes. Holding onto a player who can't play isn't going to get you into the playoffs.
The one guy's RBs are Elliott, Miller, Gallman, Kelley and Char West. I offered him Gore, who he could start.
The other guy has DJ and Elliott so he's really hurting now. He's starting Ingram and Aaron Jones at RB and Cohen as his flex so I offered him Sneed who he could start at flex Yahoo's evaluation shows him gaining more points in the trade which can sway some people's decisions..
The General
Footballguy
The tricky part is if he gets this thing pushed back just a week or 2 then the suspension kicks in during the playoffs. I wouldn't give too much.
I own him and am not giving him up unless I get a great offer.
I get it, but said you thought Snead was good or fair (or something like that); it's not. MAYBE both for Elliott, but even then IMO, it isn't enough. Just my 2 cents
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I don't think it's terrible, especially with his depleted team. It all depends on what he thinks Snead could be since he hasn't played yet. It's possible he's a 15 ppg player the rest of the season. Right now Elliott is a 0 ppg player for the next 7 weeks.
It's worth a shot. I thought about canceling the offer and sending a different one. Though about DeMarco Murray and Snead for Elliott and Cohen. I'm not going to give up two players for one player that isn't even playing.
Not trying to be a Richard, but it is terrible. "It's possible he's (Snead) a 15 pig player?" He's gonna almost double his career peg average? C'mon man.
Would you do trade from the other side? I'm thinking the answer is no.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
With his roster I would would consider it. The thing is, Elliott does nothing for his team if he doesn't make the playoffs which is very possible. If he keeps Elliott he'll be using up two bench spots on players who can't play, the other is DJ.
It's a full point PPR which gives bonuses to long TDs so Snead has potential. He's projected to average about 13 ppg so I was too high saying 15.
The trade is meant to take advantage of his situation but it does make his team better right now and gives him a better chance at winning games now. Elliott give him a better chance at winning in the playoffs but he's going to struggle making it there with him on his roster.
What are you're thoughts on the Murray/Snead for Elliott/Cohen offer? It's still not great but Murray and Snead would both be starters on his team most weeks.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Wouldn't surprise or bother me at all. All it takes is a counter or to say I'm not interested in moving him. Never know unless you try. He's a friend of mine so I'm comfortable with it.
I don't know his team, or his trading habits, whether it's a keeper league, etc, but theMurray/Snead trade is more realistic, IMO. If it's me, I'd offer gore/Snead, with a willingness to go up to Murray/Snead. If you did Murray, who'd your starting rbs be, assuming Zeke serves the 6 this year?
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
The Gore trade offer was in a different league so I don't have him in this particular trade talk.
My starting RBs would be Hunt and one of Riddick, McGuire, Henry or McFadden. I picked up McFadden as soon as I heard the news. I had Dalvin Cook until the injury.
The Zeke owner in my league is 1-4 & his team isn't great with Zeke. I haven't offered but I doubt he'd let him go for less than a solid rb2 and wr2.
It would bother some people. I lost DJ week one & had CJ (no moves after draft, hitch was before final cuts) & not Kerwin. Another owner picked up kerwinn & offered him to me for gronk. I politely declined, but a more reasonable offer might have led to real talks.
IDK if I'd do Murray/Snead, then. Maybe see what McGuire does this weekend &'if he does well, try him/Snead? My concern would be if the suspension goes through & DMC is in a RBBC with Alf, or Alf is the starter, you're much weaker @ RB2
The General
Footballguy
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
That’s perfectly fine. I play for money and teams that make the playoffs get some money back. I’d rather make the playoffs.
A trade only makes sense if you feel it makes your team better. The trades I offered make their team’s better while Zeke is out. If you feel you can make the playoffs while hanging onto Zeke then of course you keep him.
I have Zeke in two other leagues. I have no desire to trade him in either but my teams are both pretty good overall.
The General
Footballguy
Doesn't hurt to make offers but can't see anyone accepting Gore or Snead which was what was being talked about - especially before these appeals aren't figured out. Say these appeals are done or Zeke / NFPLA drops the appeals so we know 100% he's out until week 13 it would take some multiple player deal for me to bite.
I would love to see what deals get made. That stuff is useful to see to get an idea of what people are willing to take/give for Zeke.
ourmanflint
Footballguy
They are/were not desperate to keep the case out of SDNY. They simply chose the best venue for them. Home field is better than traveling across the country no?
No. They do not want to have the case decided inSDNY. They took a risk and filed heir case prematurely in TX because they wanted so badly to stay out of SDNY. The NFLPA lawyers had to have known that this (the jurisdictional issue) was going to be yet another tool the NFL lawyers would have available, but they gave that weapon to the NFL, because staying out of SDNY was so important. You can try to pretend that it doesn’t matter, but it does, and there’s not a single “expert” who doesn’t acknowledge that the change in venue is worse for the NFLPA than having the case in TX.
NeverEnough
Footballguy
You must be high. I would never do that. I just traded Zeke & Morris away w/Marvin Jones for Julio, D. Murray & landry in PPR. I then moved Julio & Njoku (I have Gronk) for Ajayi & T. Hill. Now I'm shopping Murray & Lynch for another upgrade.
ourmanflint
Footballguy
Home cooking is better yes? Then we agree on something. The idea that he is sure to lose in New York though is a fallacy. His case is solid in any venue. Had Henderson not tried to be so heavy handed, Elliot would be serving the suspension right now. He gave Elliot and the NFLPA their case. I clearly outlined his case in a prior post.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
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I haven’t once said that he is sure to lose in NY. I’ve said his chances in NY are worse than they were in TX. I’ve clearly outlined that in prior posts as well, but I’ll sum it up here: the 2nd circuit (the appellate court for SDNY) has said that even if factual or legal mistakes are made, the CBA gives Goodell a lot of power. As long as the CBA is adhered to, the courts can’t over-rule him. If the SDNY rules for Zeke, there’s a good chance he 2nd will overturn them.
ourmanflint
Footballguy
CA2 said "fundamental fairness" did not apply to Brady's case. 2 judges have said it applies in Zeke's case already. The 2 that ruled against Zeke didn't rule on the merits of his case. They simply ruled on jurisdiction. Again, they are not afraid of SDNY, they are simply taking the path of least resistance. Brady won on "fundamental fairness". He was overturned because his case didn't meet the criteria. Zeke's does meet the criteria.
Read the decision. They didn't say it didn't apply, exactly, they said it didn't matter. I included the link & quote earlier.
Zeke WILL lose eventually, IMO. The fact that the case is in SDNY (which the NFLPA IS afraid of, no matter how much you deny it) makes it possible that he will lose this year & serve his 6 games this year; but he will lose, eventually.
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ProFootballTalkVerified account @ProFootballTalk 13m13 minutes ago
Per source Judge Mazzant has informed NFL, NFLPA that he will not lift injunction until 5th Circuit rules on Elliott petition for rehearing.
ProFootballTalkVerified account @ProFootballTalk
In English, Ezekiel Elliott remains eligible to play at least until petition for rehearing is filed and resolved.
Per source Judge Mazzant has informed NFL, NFLPA that he will not lift injunction until 5th Circuit rules on Elliott petition for rehearing.
ProFootballTalkVerified account @ProFootballTalk
In English, Ezekiel Elliott remains eligible to play at least until petition for rehearing is filed and resolved.
The General
Footballguy
Hadn't seen this before:
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/10/13/battle-lines-for-next-nfl-elliott-skirmish-are-drawn/
14 day window??
Maybe this is all put off for another week and Zeke plays week 7?
Dizzy...
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/10/13/battle-lines-for-next-nfl-elliott-skirmish-are-drawn/
14 day window??
Maybe this is all put off for another week and Zeke plays week 7?
Dizzy...
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2738724-ezekiel-elliott-suspension-reportedly-wont-start-until-petition-resolved
This news starting to spread like wildfire.
This news starting to spread like wildfire.
Brady's appeal for an en banc hearing in the 2nd circuit was denied after about 6 weeks; not sure if that is typical, or if the 5th circuit would work under the same timeline.
The General
Footballguy
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Doubledown1313
Footballguy
CBS is reporting a ruling could come as soon ad Monday.
Cowboysfan8
Footballguy
The General
Footballguy
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/10/14/ezekiel-elliott-remains-eligible-to-play-for-now/?sf122094763=1
Think people are thinking this is old news. Don't think so.
Think people are thinking this is old news. Don't think so.
theplayer11
Footballguy
it never ends
Profootballtalk reports Ezekiel Elliott isn't yet suspended.
This conflicts with a statement from the NFL this week. The District Court doesn't plan to lift Elliott's injunction until the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals rules on his rehearing. With Dallas on their bye, there should be more clarity on Elliott's standing before Week 7.
Profootballtalk reports Ezekiel Elliott isn't yet suspended.
This conflicts with a statement from the NFL this week. The District Court doesn't plan to lift Elliott's injunction until the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals rules on his rehearing. With Dallas on their bye, there should be more clarity on Elliott's standing before Week 7.
I've got D. Henry and I'm debating the same thing.
Also wondering if the odds are high that this just goes on and on and if it's worth even holding onto either DMC or Alf.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I admitted that they were not good offers right away. I said I offered some low ball offers to see if I could take advantage of their situation.
ourmanflint
Footballguy
Read the decision long time ago. They said it didn't apply because it wasn't satisfied since Pash was a "collateral" witness. Tiffany Thompson is the accuser and main witness in the whole investigation. The person who interviewed her was also not made available. This same person recommended no suspension. Big difference.
This Zeke owner would not. Davis is a bit of apples to oranges, maybe you are so deep at WR and thin at RB if you lost EE that keeping one of the Cowboy's RB's over him can have merit under right circumstance but to me not over Breida under any circumstance. Reason being we don't know which one of those Cowboy RB's would be the starter and it just might be a RBBC, l would even say likely a RBBC but point is we don't know. With Breida you already got a potential full season RBBC guy instead of 6 games and one that is a Hyde injury, or trade, from being the guy. Now if one of those Dallas RB's become clear cut guy that makes a difference or if you can find roster spot to keep both that changes things up a little but otherwise Breida.
The NFL stated, in the suspension letter that the suspension WAS NOT based on Thompson's allegations. Therefore, she is not the main witness. It's BS, but it's BS that negates the point you are making:
As the arbitrator, Goodall is given the power to decide who can/can't be called as a witness, as the 2nd circuit confirmed last year:
So, the 2nd has said Goodell has free reign to decide what testimony he wants to include and exclude. That would likely include the testimony of Thompson, and of the person who interviewed her, as Goodell placed more importance (& based the suspension on) the pictures, medical testimony, & other evidence. Just because the NFLPA says the suspension was based on Thompson's testimony doesn't change the fact that the NFL explicitly said it was not.
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