Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
Ran a 10k - Official Thread (10 Viewers)
- Thread starter Ned
- Start date
The Iguana
Footballguy
I'm getting a PR, dammit! It's going to happen. Don't care what the weather is like! Of course, that's not the highest bar to set or anything.
MAC_32
Footballguy
Just get your mind in the right place - my break through half marathon was amidst a windy sleet/hail/thunder snow storm, 8+ minute pr. You may not run as fast as you could in ideal conditions, but you can still run substantially faster than you ever have before. It's neck-up though. And you're starting in the right place with the above.
Last edited by a moderator:
JShare87
Footballguy
Last edited by a moderator:
JShare87
Footballguy
I’ll try and make my sarcasm more evident in the future. I’ve been looking forward to this race for a while. You are all going to kill it regardless of the weather.
gruecd
Footballguy
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
I wondered but thought better safe than sorry.I picked up on it. Juxt is just a little slow, that's all.
ChiefD
Footballguy
He saves his speed for his legs.I picked up on it. Juxt is just a little slow, that's all.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
I've been thinking about that other marathon I'd run. I could sleep in my own bed the night before. I know how to get there, where to park. Almost pancake flat with little "extra" mileage due to possible tangent issues. I've run the loop seven times already so I feel like I know every inch of the course...
gruecd
Footballguy
The Iguana
Footballguy
My current PR is the only HM that I have done, which was back in November. Time was 2:10:22. Barring there being a sever snowstorm or completely iced over streets, I better break that. My goal, weather permitting, is 1:45. I believe I can do that but it will not be easy. Breaking 2 hours better be easy, no matter the weather!
Also, I have a 2nd HM that I am doing on May 4th here in town. I originally signed up for Carmel when a friend at work talked me into it and the plan was for it to just be a "long run" as part of my training for the one on May 4th. But I've come a long way even faster than expected and now I have 2 chances at my goal. My goal for Saturday is to basically set my pace at 8 min/mile and see how it goes. Depending on how well that goes, I will set my goal for May 4th accordingly. If the weather cooperates and I meet the goal, then I will decide how much to push that in a month. If the weather is off and/or I miss the goal this week, then I will figure out what I have to do so that I have every chance to break 1:45 in a month.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
The Iguana
Footballguy
Oh yeah, I'm also about to sign up for a 5K on May 11th. It's the local high school that puts it on as a fundraiser for their XC program. I have run it a couple times years ago. Plan to sign up and see how fast I can do that a week after the other HM...
The Iguana
Footballguy
Did that race in 23:45 about 6 years ago... Plan to try to be at or under 22 minutes this year... it's a nice flat, fast 5k road course.Oh yeah, I'm also about to sign up for a 5K on May 11th. It's the local high school that puts it on as a fundraiser for their XC program. I have run it a couple times years ago. Plan to sign up and see how fast I can do that a week after the other HM...
Last edited by a moderator:
gianmarco
Footballguy
Didn't realize we have 2 more on the calendar racing HM's this weekend. @pbm107 and @bushdocda.
Both still a go?
Both still a go?
TripleThreat
Footballguy
bushdocda
Footballguy
I’m a go but will not be ballz out. Using as my Thursday tempo workout so I’m thinking progression to HM goal pace for the last 6-7. Mid May race will be da ballz out.
pbm107
Footballguy
I'm racing but I am not expecting anything great. Last Monday my allergies started acting up, had a work trip, and then followed that up with a drunken weekend with friends down in Nashville. Ended up missing 3 straight running days, it was fun but also a whole lot of stupid.
The reality is I am not where I'd like to be fitness wise yet, and even if you remove the past 7 days I wouldn't be swinging for a big PR. That will have to wait until November.
Hopefully the current weather forecast is incorrect for Carmel.
gianmarco
Footballguy
Ok, this new roadrunner cadence thing for me is legit.
I just ran my easy 3 miles using it the whole way from start to finish. You can see my cadence registered at 176. First of all, my HR was much more level and consistent. So, really no additional effort being used and I averaged under 150 which is normal for me. Plus, I went a new route and the last mile and a half is pretty hilly so the bump there was to be expected.
Not only that, but I also shaved about 30 sec/mile off my easy pace. I never once felt like I was moving quickly (except on the downhills) yet I was in the mid-low 8's at times and had to keep telling myself to take even shorter steps to keep it relaxed. Plus, I feel lighter on my feet because they're spending less time on the ground and less impact on my legs and body.
It's crazy how my cadence "only" went up about 10-12 but it is COMPLETELY different and feels silly at times. It'll be interesting to try it at higher speeds later this week.
Also, shout outs to @SFBayDuck. I kept noticing his weather info on his runs and thought it was some fancy watch thing. So I looked up the klimat.app and saw it's a website that you just link to your Strava and it's done. Automatically adds the weather info to runs. Now I don't have to bother adding it in on my own. I like it. And looks like it's only $5/year to unlock more options.
I just ran my easy 3 miles using it the whole way from start to finish. You can see my cadence registered at 176. First of all, my HR was much more level and consistent. So, really no additional effort being used and I averaged under 150 which is normal for me. Plus, I went a new route and the last mile and a half is pretty hilly so the bump there was to be expected.
Not only that, but I also shaved about 30 sec/mile off my easy pace. I never once felt like I was moving quickly (except on the downhills) yet I was in the mid-low 8's at times and had to keep telling myself to take even shorter steps to keep it relaxed. Plus, I feel lighter on my feet because they're spending less time on the ground and less impact on my legs and body.
It's crazy how my cadence "only" went up about 10-12 but it is COMPLETELY different and feels silly at times. It'll be interesting to try it at higher speeds later this week.
Also, shout outs to @SFBayDuck. I kept noticing his weather info on his runs and thought it was some fancy watch thing. So I looked up the klimat.app and saw it's a website that you just link to your Strava and it's done. Automatically adds the weather info to runs. Now I don't have to bother adding it in on my own. I like it. And looks like it's only $5/year to unlock more options.
Last edited by a moderator:
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
I added that a couple of months ago. I never mentioned it in here, but y'all spend so much time
I'm also just using the free version, don't really see any reason to upgrade. I just figured it'd be interesting to have weather info automatically added to every run in case I want to go back and leverage it as another data point. Of course I probably have less variability or influence due to weather than anyone here, so it's probably more valuable to many of you.
gianmarco
Footballguy
I didn't upgrade yet but would do so more just to support the guy than anything else. Although the premium version does have dew point, so....
When it starts getting hot, I'll see what the "feels like" info shows and if it's similar to our SI, then that's good enough.
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
Yeah, just a simple SI number would probably be the most valuable data point.
I didn't upgrade yet but would do so more just to support the guy than anything else. Although the premium version does have dew point, so....
When it starts getting hot, I'll see what the "feels like" info shows and if it's similar to our SI, then that's good enough.
SteelCurtain
Footballguy
I meant to reply to your first post about this but I've been swamped at work and home. Plus the end of marathon training is balancing everything in life.
What you are experiencing is exactly what I had happen. Once I made the change, I felt like I was gliding instead of slumbering along. I found my body was able to withstand many more miles without the wear and tear. In terms of energy, I felt like I was more efficient with less "bounce", therefore better utilizing my strength. Admittedly my cadence can be crazy, but it works for me. It takes time to make it a habit. It was a couple weeks of dedicated work on it and it was during a downtime in terms of training so pacing wasn't as regimented as it is now.
It works for me. May not work for everyone but I'm glad it appears to be helping @gianmarco
MAC_32
Footballguy
Can I get the cliff notes version of this cadence thing? I think I'm experiencing the benefits of a subtle change to my technique, but haven't the slightest clue if it's what you two are doing/have done, if it's something different, and if it's having any impact in the first place. Offseason and carrying extra weight, so isn't apples-to-apples right now.
SteelCurtain
Footballguy
Cliff notes is I was advised to try to get my cadence from 175 to something faster. The ultimate goal was to be more efficient and less bouncy. Every time you push yourself up and bounce is wasted energy. Its better to use as much energy as possible to propel yourself forward instead of up/down. That was why I started to try it.
I found that my body was less achy, most specifically my joints (hips, knees, ankles). I think this was because I wasn't taking the same amount of pounding from each step.
I'm not sure I've seen the significantly faster pace due to my cadence, but my injuries have gone down to nearly nothing. Its been good for me, but I recognize cadence/stride is a very personal thing so I don't push it too hard. Plus I like being the resident roadrunner around these parts.
gianmarco
Footballguy
I'm pretty sure you know what cadence is (number of steps per minute). We've had the discussion here before and there's been plenty of things written about having an "ideal" cadence. Some claim that number is 180, but after looking at it more, there's disagreement about that. Some successful runners have a lower cadence and it works for them. Most of the elite runners were typically in that range which is where it came from.
That said, if your cadence is too low, then it can keep you from improving. From what I remember, when I read on this, we're talking like < 160 which is pretty hard to do. Still, there's enough people that believe that you are more efficient with a higher cadence because it decreases the time you spend with your feet touching the ground and it decreases the stress to your body as a result.
IIRC, SteelCurtain has a ridiculous cadence of ~190. When I first started running, mine was in the 168-170 range. It's just where it naturally ended up. I've since actually dropped it where I'm usually in the 164-165 range. When I race, I've gotten it up to about 174-175.
As I pointed out above, I'm watching this guy have probably the fastest turnover I've ever seen. So I made an abrupt change to try it out. Think of sprinting and churning your legs fast except I was just taking baby steps instead. It was a completely different way of running. It feels ridiculous. But sure enough, it wasn't any harder.
The basics of running for speed comes down to 2 things: Cadence and stride length.
The only way you move faster is by increasing 1 or the other or both. Most of us do it by increasing our stride length with only a slight increase in cadence. But, if you can start with a higher cadence, then it theoretically can get you faster without changing much.
The mental picture I have with it that helps it make sense for me is going up stairs. We've all tried going up stairs different ways. You can try going up 2 at a time. You take less steps but each step is a lot more work to move yourself. It gets tiring. Or you can take normal steps. Or you can take double steps where you move each foot to each step. If you've ever tried that, it feels stupid but it requires much less energy. Same concept -- much smaller steps and take much more of them.
When I read about this a while ago, they recommended using a metronome to help increase cadence. And they recommended just aiming for 1-2 beats increase, little by little. You can train yourself to get it higher. I think @Brony did this. I didn't do that. I literally tried moving my feet almost as fast as I could and thinking "baby steps". My increase was a HUGE amount and probably not the way to do it. When I ran today, it felt as if I just started running in terms of having to concentrate on my form and what I was doing. I had to keep telling myself "churn churn churn". But it worked. And because it's such a drastic change, I think it'll be easier for me to adopt than doing small incremental changes.
ETA -- lol@Cliff's notes. Oops?
Last edited by a moderator:
SteelCurtain
Footballguy
One more data point on cadence....
Saturday run -- 22 miles at 7:37 pace -- average was 186 steps per minute.. Average stride length was 1.12 meters.
Sunday recovery run -- 8 miles at 9:21 pace -- average was 180 steps per minute. Avg. stride length was 0.96 meters.
Monday interval workout -- 10.6 miles at 8:07 pace -- 190 steps per minute. Avg. stride length was 1.05 meters.
The back story is my legs were fried on Sunday, so they were slower and taking shorter strides. My interval workouts have a shorter stride length because at the end of each interval I do a recovery which is very slow and very short strides.
All this is on my Garmin Connect so I'm able to track it regularly.
Saturday run -- 22 miles at 7:37 pace -- average was 186 steps per minute.. Average stride length was 1.12 meters.
Sunday recovery run -- 8 miles at 9:21 pace -- average was 180 steps per minute. Avg. stride length was 0.96 meters.
Monday interval workout -- 10.6 miles at 8:07 pace -- 190 steps per minute. Avg. stride length was 1.05 meters.
The back story is my legs were fried on Sunday, so they were slower and taking shorter strides. My interval workouts have a shorter stride length because at the end of each interval I do a recovery which is very slow and very short strides.
All this is on my Garmin Connect so I'm able to track it regularly.
Last edited by a moderator:
MAC_32
Footballguy
Cliff notes is I was advised to try to get my cadence from 175 to something faster. The ultimate goal was to be more efficient and less bouncy. Every time you push yourself up and bounce is wasted energy. Its better to use as much energy as possible to propel yourself forward instead of up/down. That was why I started to try it.
I found that my body was less achy, most specifically my joints (hips, knees, ankles). I think this was because I wasn't taking the same amount of pounding from each step.
I'm not sure I've seen the significantly faster pace due to my cadence, but my injuries have gone down to nearly nothing. Its been good for me, but I recognize cadence/stride is a very personal thing so I don't push it too hard. Plus I like being the resident roadrunner around these parts.
Preciated, shockingly I have absolutely no idea what my cadence was nor is because I don't track it...but it's definitely higher now than it was last year. It's comforting to read your success utilizing the technical version of what I've been trying to accomplish, which is just about exactly what @gianmarco described. I've noticed my pace has improved at relative efforts (in optimum conditions) and my recovery time is substantially less than with my old technique. I don't know if the former will hold once in training mode again, but I'm increasingly confident the latter will carry over. I've been picking spots to push things a little more for a few day period then see how quickly I recover. I keep waiting to go too far and enduring a 3-4 day rough patch, but it hasn't happened yet. So maybe if I utilize this more frequently I won't struggle as much with the more challenging portions of whatever plan I choose.
Not going to abandon the glute engagement workouts, but it probably makes sense to not do more than one of those per week.
gianmarco
Footballguy
Here is my run from yesterday: You can see where my cadence bumped up. I then went back to my normal cadence and then finished back up higher again. No change in my HR.
My last race in December: I was up to 171.
My tempo run from a couple days ago: I started off lower in the low 160's and it got a little higher as I got faster. But, still pretty minimal.
My run today is a huge difference and it's still not even at 180. I can't even imagine getting up to 190.
My last race in December: I was up to 171.
My tempo run from a couple days ago: I started off lower in the low 160's and it got a little higher as I got faster. But, still pretty minimal.
My run today is a huge difference and it's still not even at 180. I can't even imagine getting up to 190.
SteelCurtain
Footballguy
My cadence changes dramatically during my interval workouts. https://www.strava.com/activities/2239338512
gianmarco
Footballguy
HOLY COW!
That's nuts. And lol@200+. I think "resident roadrunner" title will remain yours indefinitely.
gianmarco
Footballguy
You use Strava on your phone, right? You can turn it on to measure it. Go under settings when you start a run and open up "sensors". You can have it pick up your cadence.
Preciated, shockingly I have absolutely no idea what my cadence was nor is because I don't track it...but it's definitely higher now than it was last year. It's comforting to read your success utilizing the technical version of what I've been trying to accomplish, which is just about exactly what @gianmarco described. I've noticed my pace has improved at relative efforts (in optimum conditions) and my recovery time is substantially less than with my old technique. I don't know if the former will hold once in training mode again, but I'm increasingly confident the latter will carry over. I've been picking spots to push things a little more for a few day period then see how quickly I recover. I keep waiting to go too far and enduring a 3-4 day rough patch, but it hasn't happened yet. So maybe if I utilize this more frequently I won't struggle as much with the more challenging portions of whatever plan I choose.
Not going to abandon the glute engagement workouts, but it probably makes sense to not do more than one of those per week.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
Forecast updated on weatherunderground. Now with more wind and more thunderstorms.
ChiefD
Footballguy
gianmarco
Footballguy
Sucks to see that and would rather see it be completely clear. But, the reality is the likelihood of that being accurate to the hour 5 days out is incredibly small. Small changes now in some systems can completely change where and when that storm hits.
I'd wager that it's off and you guys end up being fine.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
Yeah, I won't post about it again until mid-week and I'll make a decision one way or the other then. Even without the thunderstorms I have major concerns about a PR attempt in high wind conditions. I think I'm less invested in this particular race than the others and I have a decent backup.
gianmarco
Footballguy
Oh, you can post about it a lot more. That's what we're here for
I'm just trying to help calm the worries. Just drink your beet juice and trust.....
The Iguana
Footballguy
Gian, you should read my posts more/closer... I had this same aha moment with cadence weeks ago!
The Iguana
Footballguy
The app I have on my phone only shows a 30% chance of rain on Saturday. Everything else shows something worse but I'm just going to believe my phone for now.
gianmarco
Footballguy
I know and I've read it from others. But it took me actually seeing it yesterday to try it.Gian, you should read my posts more/closer... I had this same aha moment with cadence weeks ago!
The Iguana
Footballguy
MAC_32
Footballguy
MAC_32
Footballguy
gianmarco
Footballguy
I love this thread and how we all learn and start adopting stuff.
Pretty soon we are all going to be beet-drinking, Klimat using, chicken eating, high cadence, large shoe-wearing, neurostim practicing BMFs.
ETA -- I think I found our team name.
Pretty soon we are all going to be beet-drinking, Klimat using, chicken eating, high cadence, large shoe-wearing, neurostim practicing BMFs.
ETA -- I think I found our team name.
Last edited by a moderator:
gruecd
Footballguy
tri-man 47
Footballguy
As to the former: Yes. That's a great reminder with some long races looming for some of you guys. Late in the race, focus on both.
As to the latter, I picture you running down the street with a metronome in hand. I have one sitting on our piano. Shall I bring it for the relay? BTW, I would say the king of short step/quick step is @Juxtatarot. Dude gets some rotation in those legs of his.
Similar threads
