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Dynasty Kareem Hunt Cleveland Browns

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1 hour ago, wgoldsph said:

I thought about this as a while and honestly don't know.  As an owner I want to say yes.  He certainly has the upside to be top 5 if everything plays out right. But there's just too much uncertainty.

I'm holding in dynasty leagues.  If I can get him for a 3rd round pick I'm trading for him.  I'm not giving him up for anything less than a 1st though.  Don't know where that puts him value wise.

Hunt offered for Daniel Jones was declined in a 1 qb league I am in...

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3 hours ago, IROK said:

Hunt offered for Daniel Jones was declined in a 1 qb league I am in...

Awful move.  Any time you can pick up an rb with flex upside let alone top 20 upside for a backup in a 1 qb league you jump on it.

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10 hours ago, wgoldsph said:

Awful move.  Any time you can pick up an rb with flex upside let alone top 20 upside for a backup in a 1 qb league you jump on it.

I was offered Jamal Adams (DB) and a 4th round pick for him in my 10 team IDP league, half point PPR.  We start 2 DBs, 1 RB (and 2 flex).  Hunt isn't a stater for me (Chubb, Fournette, M Gordon, Ekeler, Freeman).  Adams, before his injury, was by far the top DB in the game - so the move would improve my starting lineup, at the cost of RB depth (and Chubb's immediate backup).  I couldn't bring myself to accept.  I can't see anything that would hurt Hunt's value (only help it) this offseason, but Adams is quite the opposite with a potential trade. 

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23 minutes ago, matttyl said:

I was offered Jamal Adams (DB) and a 4th round pick for him in my 10 team IDP league, half point PPR.  We start 2 DBs, 1 RB (and 2 flex).  Hunt isn't a stater for me (Chubb, Fournette, M Gordon, Ekeler, Freeman).  Adams, before his injury, was by far the top DB in the game - so the move would improve my starting lineup, at the cost of RB depth (and Chubb's immediate backup).  I couldn't bring myself to accept.  I can't see anything that would hurt Hunt's value (only help it) this offseason, but Adams is quite the opposite with a potential trade. 

That and DB's are a dime a dozen and you can always find top 10 guys on the waiver wire at that position.  It is worse than kicker when it comes to that because of the volatility.  Just look back the last few years where Collins was "by far the top DB in the game" and then it was Derwin James.  They both tumbled after their big seasons.  Adams is a stud but history shows he won't be the top DB next year.  Easy decline for me. 

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11 hours ago, wgoldsph said:

Awful move.  Any time you can pick up an rb with flex upside let alone top 20 upside for a backup in a 1 qb league you jump on it.

I agree, but I find it interesting that people are overlooking what Jones did so much.

Jones 16 game pace (and we're only extrapolating from 12 here, not like we're pushing out 3 games to 16) was 4000 yards and 35 TDs with 374 yards rushing....as a rookie.

Other than the turnovers this was like Baker's rookie year on steroids and no one seems to have noticed.

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27 minutes ago, FreeBaGeL said:

I agree, but I find it interesting that people are overlooking what Jones did so much.

Jones 16 game pace (and we're only extrapolating from 12 here, not like we're pushing out 3 games to 16) was 4000 yards and 35 TDs with 374 yards rushing....as a rookie.

Other than the turnovers this was like Baker's rookie year on steroids and no one seems to have noticed.

Some of those are fixable.  He only had 12 int's which isn't terrible for a rookie compared to his 24 Td's.  However, another 11 lost fumbles is the big problem.  He needs to get stronger with the ball in the pocket with traffic around.  If he can get that number under control he has top 5 fantasy potential moving forward. 

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2 hours ago, Gally said:

Some of those are fixable.  He only had 12 int's which isn't terrible for a rookie compared to his 24 Td's.  However, another 11 lost fumbles is the big problem.  He needs to get stronger with the ball in the pocket with traffic around.  If he can get that number under control he has top 5 fantasy potential moving forward. 

Not to derail the thread but, how long of a time frame is that?  I don't see that offense improving enough next year.  Or Jones becoming top fifteen let alone top five next year.  Maybe his third year he's a low end starter in 1qb leagues?

Meanwhile two years of a ppr flex rb (which is what hunt is behind Chubb) with top 5 upside (he was as a rookie) is much more valuable to me.

2 hours ago, Gally said:

That and DB's are a dime a dozen and you can always find top 10 guys on the waiver wire at that position.  It is worse than kicker when it comes to that because of the volatility.  Just look back the last few years where Collins was "by far the top DB in the game" and then it was Derwin James.  They both tumbled after their big seasons.  Adams is a stud but history shows he won't be the top DB next year.  Easy decline for me. 

James was on ir most of the season, and Adams did well his first two seasons.  DB is a crapshoot though, mostly because as a db gets better qbs throw to them less.

 

3 hours ago, matttyl said:

I was offered Jamal Adams (DB) and a 4th round pick for him in my 10 team IDP league, half point PPR.  We start 2 DBs, 1 RB (and 2 flex).  Hunt isn't a stater for me (Chubb, Fournette, M Gordon, Ekeler, Freeman).  Adams, before his injury, was by far the top DB in the game - so the move would improve my starting lineup, at the cost of RB depth (and Chubb's immediate backup).  I couldn't bring myself to accept.  I can't see anything that would hurt Hunt's value (only help it) this offseason, but Adams is quite the opposite with a potential trade. 

See if you can get rid of Freeman.  If he's still starting for alt next season and they don't draft a rb to chase him I'll eat my hat.

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Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, wgoldsph said:

Not to derail the thread but, how long of a time frame is that?  I don't see that offense improving enough next year.  Or Jones becoming top fifteen let alone top five next year.  Maybe his third year he's a low end starter in 1qb leagues?

Why does the offense have to improve next year?  Jones' 16 game pace this year was 327 fantasy points, which would have been QB6.  As a rookie.  And that's in a league that counts -2 for turnovers, which he'll almost certainly have fewer of next year.

Edited by FreeBaGeL
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1 hour ago, FreeBaGeL said:

Why does the offense have to improve next year?  Jones' 16 game pace this year was 327 fantasy points, which would have been QB6.  As a rookie.  And that's in a league that counts -2 for turnovers, which he'll almost certainly have fewer of next year.

If you're counting average per game played then you have to bump him down for guys who missed time like brees, Strafford, tannehill, darnold...

Just looking at his numbers four of his games (against tb, det, nyj, and was) made up the majority of his yards and tds.  When playing quality or even middling competition he was a better mitch Trubisky.

 

This belongs in the Jones thread though.  I'm not sold on him at all.

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Quote

Nate Ulrich of the Akron Beacon-Journal confirms Kareem Hunt was pulled over and cited for a traffic violation Tuesday in Rocky River, Ohio.

Police discovered three "small amounts" of marijuana in the vehicle, which Hunt claimed belonged to his brother. Hunt, who was driving a car registered under his mother's name, was cited for speeding (he was clocked at 77 mph when the posted speed limit was 60) but avoided marijuana charges. Hunt can't afford any more slip-ups after the off-field scandal that led to his departure from Kansas City in 2018, though it doesn't sound like anything will come of this particular incident. If he can walk the straight and narrow, the former rushing champ should land a starting job when he enters free agency this offseason.

SOURCE: Nate Ulrich on Twitter

Jan 24, 2020, 11:58 AM ET

 

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Hunt doesn't seem to make very good decisions. Terrible timing on this. 

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24 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Hunt doesn't seem to make very good decisions. Terrible timing on this. 

The fact that he avoided marijuana charges is HUGE, and to be honest, traveling 77 in a 60 isn’t that egregious. I hope new Browns management run scared and let another team sign him this off-season. For dynasty owners, this could be a blessing in disguise! 

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3 minutes ago, FGITLOTR said:

The fact that he avoided marijuana charges is HUGE, and to be honest, traveling 77 in a 60 isn’t that egregious. I hope new Browns management run scared and let another team sign him this off-season. For dynasty owners, this could be a blessing in disguise! 

Yeah, nothing I consider morally very wrong. I just mean that he's going to be given a lot less room for error than most other NFL players given the high profile incident. 

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1 hour ago, FGITLOTR said:

The fact that he avoided marijuana charges is HUGE, and to be honest, traveling 77 in a 60 isn’t that egregious. I hope new Browns management run scared and let another team sign him this off-season. For dynasty owners, this could be a blessing in disguise! 

My thoughts exactly and one thing I'd add since he was with a family member in this latest incident is that hopefully both Hunt and the Browns come to mutual conclusion that Kareem would be better off playing somewhere not so close to home.

My negative takeaway is that this might make it harder for another team to trust him and going to need some trust to make him an offer the Browns don't want to match and/or compensate the Browns in a trade while at the same time making Hunt a good enough offer for him to sign.

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10 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

IDIOT

Bet ya he gets suspended

 

Obviously not a very intelligent fella.  The guy was on tape roughing up a woman and got a second chance.  I understand that weed isn't the same as heroin and may be a very mild drug, but he's aware that it's against NFL rules. He can't resume his marijuana habit once he's dome playing? Guy was fortunate enough to be born with talent that can make him a multi-millionaire for playing a game 16 times a year. And he can't manage to live those years without getting high? 

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31 minutes ago, JuniorNB said:

Obviously not a very intelligent fella.  The guy was on tape roughing up a woman and got a second chance.  I understand that weed isn't the same as heroin and may be a very mild drug, but he's aware that it's against NFL rules. He can't resume his marijuana habit once he's dome playing? Guy was fortunate enough to be born with talent that can make him a multi-millionaire for playing a game 16 times a year. And he can't manage to live those years without getting high? 

Or just like not speed around town with it in your car. 

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36 minutes ago, JuniorNB said:

Obviously not a very intelligent fella.  The guy was on tape roughing up a woman and got a second chance.  I understand that weed isn't the same as heroin and may be a very mild drug, but he's aware that it's against NFL rules. He can't resume his marijuana habit once he's dome playing? Guy was fortunate enough to be born with talent that can make him a multi-millionaire for playing a game 16 times a year. And he can't manage to live those years without getting high? 

Or maybe he was just driving down a highway like a regular person (aka faster than the speed limit) and his brother had a nickle bag on him?

Jesus, dude didn't kill a guy.  He was literally in his mom's car with his brother.

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4 hours ago, FGITLOTR said:

The fact that he avoided marijuana charges is HUGE, and to be honest, traveling 77 in a 60 isn’t that egregious. I hope new Browns management run scared and let another team sign him this off-season. For dynasty owners, this could be a blessing in disguise! 

I'd be shocked if this incident even raised an eyebrow for the Browns. The Browns are blessed to have 2 of the top-10 RB's in the NFL in my opinion, and aren't paying much for either. I envision Hunt being tendered at a 1st(or 2nd) round level, so I doubt any other team pays that price. 

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13 hours ago, travdogg said:

I'd be shocked if this incident even raised an eyebrow for the Browns. The Browns are blessed to have 2 of the top-10 RB's in the NFL in my opinion, and aren't paying much for either. I envision Hunt being tendered at a 1st(or 2nd) round level, so I doubt any other team pays that price. 

Good point about the cost. The only thing that could be an issue IMO is what has he promised to Browns coaches and management. 

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Some team in a legalized weed state will trade for him.

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Having such a small amount of weed nowadays is about as bad as letting your dog poop on your neighbor's lawn.  In the end, all he got was a speeding ticket, right?  This incident changes absolutely nothing as to the career path of Hunt.

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44 minutes ago, TheWinz said:

Having such a small amount of weed nowadays is about as bad as letting your dog poop on your neighbor's lawn.  In the end, all he got was a speeding ticket, right?  This incident changes absolutely nothing as to the career path of Hunt.

Sure but it could mean the NFL targets him for more drug testing. He also could have been swearing up and down to Cleveland that was clean and there was nothing to worry about, etc. We can't know those behind the scenes things. 

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guess you guys don't remember how Goodell works...I could see a repeat offender suspension...remember charges are not necessary for being punished

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2 hours ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

guess you guys don't remember how Goodell works...I could see a repeat offender suspension...remember charges are not necessary for being punished

What’s the repeat offense?  I don’t remember him getting popped for drugs before.  Am I missing something?

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10 minutes ago, Bayhawks said:

What’s the repeat offense?  I don’t remember him getting popped for drugs before.  Am I missing something?

 

10 minutes ago, Bayhawks said:

What’s the repeat offense?  I don’t remember him getting popped for drugs before.  Am I missing something?

personal conduct policy.....my brothers weed....that's a good one

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57 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Sure but it could mean the NFL targets him for more drug testing. He also could have been swearing up and down to Cleveland that was clean and there was nothing to worry about, etc. We can't know those behind the scenes things. 

Is Kareem already in the NFL's substance abuse program?  I am seriously asking, because I don't know.  He wasn't cited for driving while under the influence of marijuana, nor was he tested for it - it was only a speeding ticket.  To my knowledge, he has never failed a drug test. 

 

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9 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

He will get frequent testing going forward, bank on it.

Why?  Because he beats up people and gets speeding tickets?  Those two things are the opposite of what a pothead does.

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Just now, TheWinz said:

Why?  Because he beats up people and gets speeding tickets?  Those two things are the opposite of what a pothead does.

You don't think he's a frequent user of weed?

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2 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

You don't think he's a frequent user of weed?

Of course I do, but the frequency is unknown.  Care to venture a guess as to how many of the 1696 NFL players smoke?  I'll throw out a number - 305

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Just now, TheWinz said:

Of course I do, but the frequency is unknown.  Care to venture a guess as to how many of the 1696 NFL players smoke?  I'll throw out a number - 305

I'm just saying they will pay more attention to Hunt after being cause with it.  Bringing attention to yourself isn't very smart, especially after his previous troubles.

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5 hours ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

 

personal conduct policy.....my brothers weed....that's a good one

Weeds not personal conduct; it’s substances of abuse.  Two different policies.

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1 hour ago, Bayhawks said:

Weeds not personal conduct; it’s substances of abuse.  Two different policies.

Old Roger can do whatever he wants

 

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2 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Old Roger can do whatever he wants

 

Not really.  The CBA has a specific set of consequences for substances of abuse.  If he just decide to “do whatever he wants,” the NFLPA would challenge that.  In this case, they’d likely won.

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3 minutes ago, Bayhawks said:

Not really.  The CBA has a specific set of consequences for substances of abuse.  If he just decide to “do whatever he wants,” the NFLPA would challenge that.  In this case, they’d likely won.

If he's using they will get him, because they are going to have him peeing in a cup often.

Edited by JohnnyU

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38 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

If he's using they will get him, because they are going to have him peeing in a cup often.

Possibly; but that isn’t really relevant to my original question as to whether this was actually a 2nd violation or not.

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I will ask again - does anyone know if he has ever had a positive urine test, or if he is currently in the substance abuse program?  Those 2 questions are very relevant to his case.

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17 minutes ago, TheWinz said:

I will ask again - does anyone know if he has ever had a positive urine test, or if he is currently in the substance abuse program?  Those 2 questions are very relevant to his case.

I don’t think we’d know. I believe the first failure is kept confidential until a second one.

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11 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

I don’t think we’d know. I believe the first failure is kept confidential until a second one.

Ah, I did not know that, thanx.  BTW, if anyone is interested, I found the NFL's Substance Abuse Policy...

https://nflpaweb.blob.core.windows.net/media/Default/Active Players/wellness/2019 Policy and Program on Substances of Abuse.pdf

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You guys are the biggest squares in the world.

Everyone I've known in my entire life who's over the age of 18 has ingested weed in some form at one point.  For an NFL player it's both a pain reliever and a stress reducer, and it's incredibly easy to mask that you use it when you're extremely active and drink a ton of water, as long as your use is sparing.  Only people with legitimate problems (Josh Gordon) or idiots (that guy who was moving pounds of it years ago, his name escapes me) get caught.

My point is, again, this is a huge nothing and is in no way connected to his earlier issues; which were actual issues.

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4 hours ago, wgoldsph said:

You guys are the biggest squares in the world.

Everyone I've known in my entire life who's over the age of 18 has ingested weed in some form at one point.  For an NFL player it's both a pain reliever and a stress reducer, and it's incredibly easy to mask that you use it when you're extremely active and drink a ton of water, as long as your use is sparing.  Only people with legitimate problems (Josh Gordon) or idiots (that guy who was moving pounds of it years ago, his name escapes me) get caught.

My point is, again, this is a huge nothing and is in no way connected to his earlier issues; which were actual issues.

The bolded part isn't true.  They can take a hair sample within 90 days.https://www.healthline.com/health/hair-follicle-drug-test

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14 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

The bolded part isn't true.  They can take a hair sample within 90 days.https://www.healthline.com/health/hair-follicle-drug-test

Is the hair sample test legal in the NFL?  The testing is typically spelled out in a company’s drug and alcohol policy and when unions are involved, the testing method is part of the CBA.   

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2 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

Is the hair sample test legal in the NFL?  The testing is typically spelled out in a company’s drug and alcohol policy and when unions are involved, the testing method is part of the CBA.   

I don't know why it wouldn't be legal.  It's the most accurate form of testing.  I can't imagine the NFL owners letting a less accurate (urine test) get passed over a more accurate test (hair).

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3 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

I don't know why it wouldn't be legal.  It's the most accurate form of testing.  I can't imagine the NFL owners letting a less accurate (urine test) get passed over a more accurate test (hair).

It’s typically the union members that try to prohibit hair follicle testing from the D and A policy in the CBA.  It would not be the owners.  

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25 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

It’s typically the union members that try to prohibit hair follicle testing from the D and A policy in the CBA.  It would not be the owners.  

The owners could have fought against that in the collective bargaining negotiations.  Do we know what the policy is on hair testing?   Perhaps someone can provide a link to where they can't use it.

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19 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

The owners could have fought against that in the collective bargaining negotiations.  Do we know what the policy is on hair testing?   Perhaps someone can provide a link to where they can't use it.

I posted a link to the testing program a few posts above.  I skimmed through real fast, and the only collection method referenced is urine.

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Why would an owner care if their players smoked weed anyway? Guess would be an image thing but that’s changing. 

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