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NFL and Covid Issues - Keep it 100% NFL

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4 minutes ago, jabarony said:

I don't like this at all.  It's a shot to those who prepared accordingly with extra QBs/Ks/Defs.  Everyone knew the rules going in.  They don't bail people out for Saturday injuries, why the bail out for this?

I commission my league, and brought options to the table knowing this could happen. My league mates said “let’s just embrace the chaos” and voted to just keep our short 5 person bench and not add IR spots. 
 

So, here we are. No special rules are going to be created mid season. People knew this could happen. And it can happen again. Let chaos reign. Prepare for the worst.

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2 minutes ago, Doug B said:

Kelce owners: If for some reason Lions TE T.J. Hockenson is available (unrostered in 18% of CBS leagues and 13% of Yahoo leagues), pick him up and start with confidence. The Saints are horrendous against TEs, and have both starting CBs out tomorrow so a bunch of the DBs will be shifting into unfamiliar roles.

Also, 50+ yards in each game thus far with Jax, Atl, Min and Was coming up after the bye.

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4 minutes ago, jabarony said:

I don't like this at all.  It's a shot to those who prepared accordingly with extra QBs/Ks/Defs.  Everyone knew the rules going in.  They don't bail people out for Saturday injuries, why the bail out for this?

I'd have to disagree. One owner in our league would have 7 guys out this week between PIT TEN KC & NE. Saturday injuries happen to ONE player. Not a whole team. Obviously his opponent would benefit tremendously. Thats not only  unfair to that owner but its also unfair to the rest of the league when one owner is essentially granted a gift win

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, jabarony said:

 

 

Edited by KingPrawn
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4 minutes ago, jabarony said:

I don't like this at all.  It's a shot to those who prepared accordingly with extra QBs/Ks/Defs.  Everyone knew the rules going in.  They don't bail people out for Saturday injuries, why the bail out for this?

I'd have to disagree. One owner in our league would have 7 guys out this week between PIT TEN KC & NE. Saturday injuries happen to ONE player. Not a whole team. Obviously his opponent would benefit tremendously. Thats not only  unfair to that owner but its also unfair to the rest of the league when one owner is essentially granted a gift win

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Just now, SoBeDad said:
6 minutes ago, Doug B said:

Kelce owners: If for some reason Lions TE T.J. Hockenson is available (unrostered in 18% of CBS leagues and 13% of Yahoo leagues), pick him up and start with confidence. The Saints are horrendous against TEs, and have both starting CBs out tomorrow so a bunch of the DBs will be shifting into unfamiliar roles.

Also, 50+ yards in each game thus far with Jax, Atl, Min and Was coming up after the bye.

And for those really desperate: Saints rookie TE Adam Trautman is getting the start tomorrow for a hurt Jared Cook. Trautman won't turn into King Kong, but there's little film on Trautman and Sean Payton likes to take advantage of an opponent failing to account for someone. Trautman did receive a few targets in the Raiders game and showed a little promise (not apparent in the stats, of course).

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Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, Doug B said:

As someone who chose a lotto RB5 over a backup to Mahomes, I can agree to an extent from a general roster management standpoint. It was a gamble I took, and I had to be prepared to adjust my roster if something happened.

Where I disagree with you, though, is in starting-lineup management. That's because right now, the Chiefs-Patriots game is in an uncertain state and owners can't make concrete plans regarding KC and NE players. Forcing owners to make a call on those players before noon Sunday -- when the NFL itself won't have a final decision on whether the game will be played Week 4 --- leads to too many walkover games IMHO, especially where Mahomes is benched for a guy on the Daniel Jones tier (a league-dependent consideration, to be sure).

I get what you are saying, this last minute thing really pissed him off. Our league is very QB heavy with 6 pt TDs so it really matters for him. I can pose the option to the whole league if they want to best ball the QB in situations like this but I don't know where to draw the line here. Best ball the whole team if they are missing a flex player? How do I even do that? What if someone has a garbage Wr3 or backup RB that doesn't play. Do I also give them best ball for that spot? Do I have to keep a list of stud players and use that to decide what I'm going to best ball for them?

If it's just QB spot I guess you can make an exception just for that but people missing stud RB and WR also in same situation.

Edited by tigerz

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4 minutes ago, KingPrawn said:
13 minutes ago, jabarony said:

I don't like this at all.  It's a shot to those who prepared accordingly with extra QBs/Ks/Defs.  Everyone knew the rules going in.  They don't bail people out for Saturday injuries, why the bail out for this?

I'd have to disagree. One owner in our league would have 7 guys out this week between PIT TEN KC & NE. Saturday injuries happen to ONE player. Not a whole team. Obviously his opponent would benefit tremendously. That's not only unfair to that owner but its also unfair to the rest of the league when one owner is essentially granted a gift win

Agreed with KP ... this stuff is well outside the "injuries happen!" ethic. Plus, the point in red carries a ton of weight for me.

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We agreed at the start of the season to have 7 bench spots and agreed we would expand bench spots should we deem it necessary. 

Can't take this year too seriously. We were just glad we could do a league. 

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3 minutes ago, tigerz said:

I get what you are saying, this last minute thing really pissed him off. Our league is very QB heavy with 6 pt TDs so it really matters for him. I can pose the option to the whole league if they want to best ball the QB in situations like this but I don't know where to draw the line here. Best ball the whole team if they are missing a flex player? How do I even do that? What if someone has a garbage Wr3 or backup RB that doesn't play. Do I also give them best ball for that spot? Do I have to keep a list of stud players and use that to decide what I'm going to best ball for them?

If it's just QB spot I guess you can make an exception just for that but people missing stud RB and WR also in same situation.

In your league's situation ... I really do think the fairest action (not "100% fair", just "fairest") is to let teams with Patriots and Chiefs submit provisional lineups. One lineup for if KC-NE gets played in Week 4, and a back-up lineup for if KC-NE is scratched.

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4 minutes ago, Doug B said:

In your league's situation ... I really do think the fairest action (not "100% fair", just "fairest") is to let teams with Patriots and Chiefs submit provisional lineups. One lineup for if KC-NE gets played in Week 4, and a back-up lineup for if KC-NE is scratched.

As comish in one of my leagues, this is what I'm doing.

Everyone who has KC/NE players basically have to send me an "If/Then" player statement prior to kickoff tmrw. I will then adjust scores manually if need be.

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4 minutes ago, Doug B said:

In your league's situation ... I really do think the fairest action (not "100% fair", just "fairest") is to let teams with Patriots and Chiefs submit provisional lineups. One lineup for if KC-NE gets played in Week 4, and a back-up lineup for if KC-NE is scratched.

Yes this is how I am handling for my local leagues I run.  People will post on our message board something like Mahomes (Cousins).

If game is cancelled then they get Cousins.

Now Nationally what do you do ?  Risk a 0 ?  There will be no backup plan.

I think Sunday morning will tell us what we need to know.  If 0 positives then game has a shot to be played.

If any positive Sunday morning from Saturday testing and this game is not happening.

Really concerning that a KC Taxi quad QB also tested positive putting both teams in play that hurts the odds.

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Some overall thoughts, for whatever they are worth (likely not much):

1) No league management site (Yahoo, ESPN, NFL, etc.) is set up in any way to reliably handle what many saw to be a high likelihood of probability (key players getting COVID, general outbreaks, games postponed/cancelled, etc.). Even if you added IR spots, reduced/did not require fees, or are manually calculating things, there are still nightmares to figure out and not a great way (if any) to actually institute them within any management tool.

2) What we're seeing in the NFL is only likely the beginning stage of COVID's impact. This will likely continue, if not get worse, and even if the NFL suddenly got smart about approaches to handling it (spoiler: they won't), I predict we won't see the tail end of impact well into the last quarter of the season, if we see it at all.

TL;DR - FF sucks this year. And the way the NFL has handled the season IMO means it will just get worse.

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6 minutes ago, Doug B said:

In your league's situation ... I really do think the fairest action (not "100% fair", just "fairest") is to let teams with Patriots and Chiefs submit provisional lineups. One lineup for if KC-NE gets played in Week 4, and a back-up lineup for if KC-NE is scratched.

Okay, does anyone have rules in their constitution for something like this so I can properly convey this as an option for the league to vote on? I feel like there are certain issues with this that could pop up (i.e. people dropping players before kickoff / people changing their lineups in ESPN from their pre and post communications / people submitting late lineups) etc. And it's just one game this week. What about future weeks when we have 4 or 5 games in flux. Do they do several provisional lineups? 

I think if you institute a change mid-season you need to apply it fully towards all future scenarios or its not fair.

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Oof ... just wanted to commiserate with an iBuddy in an Footballguys Free-For-All -based league (Summerpalooza III, SuperFlex league commished by Northern Voice).

I am going against @facook , who has to deal with the following COVID-19 ramifications to his roster this week:

Roethlisberger - OUT
Tannehill - OUT
C. Claypool - OUT

T. Kelce - ?
H. Butker - ?

Instead of starting Roethlisberger at QB and Tannehill in the SuperFlex ... he's having to go with Nick Mullens and Laviska Shenault :X  Luckily for him, my team sucks so he's got a shot even without Kelce and Butker.

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2 minutes ago, tigerz said:

Okay, does anyone have rules in their constitution for something like this so I can properly convey this as an option for the league to vote on? 

Not that many leagues have firm constitutions. Instead, you try to communicate to as many owners as possible what's going on and ask for input/feedback/opinions.

Typically, in most leagues if a change is unanimous, it's kosher -- constitution or not. It gets trickier when you have holdouts. This year, I'd suggest to any holdouts "Look, we're going to have to be a lot more flexible and a little bit less fair to get through this season. In an upcoming week ... it's likely that YOUR team will be affected and that YOUR team will benefit from flexibility and lenience. Are you 100% positive you want to draw a line in the sand here?"

For a lot of leagues, all of this advice will only go so far. Unfortunately, there will be unreasonable holdouts who will sap a lot of fun out of 2020 fantasy football leagues by not accurately taking a read of the unprecedented stuff that's happening in the NFL right now and being willing to adjust. IMHO, this is not the time to be a PITA for your league's commish just because your opponent won't be forced to start dog meat for Patrick Mahomes or something like that.

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I think the NFL realizes how much of their audience is fantasy related and hope they’ll decide to postpone this game before kickoff tomorrow. I don’t see how they can realistically play Monday or Tuesday night. 

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13 minutes ago, Doug B said:

Oof ... just wanted to commiserate with an iBuddy in an Footballguys Free-For-All -based league (Summerpalooza III, SuperFlex league commished by Northern Voice).

I am going against @facook , who has to deal with the following COVID-19 ramifications to his roster this week:

Roethlisberger - OUT
Tannehill - OUT
C. Claypool - OUT

T. Kelce - ?
H. Butker - ?

Instead of starting Roethlisberger at QB and Tannehill in the SuperFlex ... he's having to go with Nick Mullens and Laviska Shenault :X  Luckily for him, my team sucks so he's got a shot even without Kelce and Butker.

Commish in one of mine:

Mahomes/Tannehill 

Kelce/Fant (already played)

Dionte/AJB

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What happens if 2 weeks from now a KC or Tenn player tests positive a day or two before the game? A second bye? Don't know how this can realistically work over time if this type of scenario occurs. 

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It's possible the game is played. The fact that it is the starting QB makes it more possible others were infected. 

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, foxco said:

What happens if 2 weeks from now a KC or Tenn player tests positive a day or two before the game? A second bye? Don't know how this can realistically work over time if this type of scenario occurs. 

If all these positive tests start to cascade and teams don't have time to get their rosters clear of COVID via quarantine ... the NFL is going to have to consider a moratorium.  All practices and games called off for 13 days (one game week), or two game weeks, or something.

Edited by Doug B
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Posted (edited)
43 minutes ago, KingPrawn said:

I'd have to disagree. One owner in our league would have 7 guys out this week between PIT TEN KC & NE. Saturday injuries happen to ONE player. Not a whole team. Obviously his opponent would benefit tremendously. Thats not only  unfair to that owner but its also unfair to the rest of the league when one owner is essentially granted a gift win

Agreed...we definitely planned for coved nonsense...we increased rosters and prior to this supplemental draft we allowed owners the opportunity to claim the backup QB for their QBs (we are Super-flex) in exchange for forfeiting a supplemental pick...we also were very open that this season had a chance to be crazy so things could change which is exactly what is happening by whole teams possibly not playing instead of just players (and possibly not knowing until after all the games are played)...due to that we are going with the contingency thing I listed above and everyone is totally onboard and good with it...it is always about the integrity of the league first.

Edited by Boston

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Posted (edited)

Maybe someone already mentioned this, but I wouldn't be surprised if the league institutes a two week pause on the season and pushes the schedule back two week so everyone can get their players and coaches back and at the same time re-evaluate their priorities in safe practices and mask wearing.

Edited by elshagon
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Posted (edited)
Just now, elshagon said:

Maybe someone already mentioned this, but I wouldn't be surprised if the league institutes a two week pause on the season and pushes then schedule back two week so everyone can get their players and coaches back and at the same time re-evaluate their priorities in safe practices and mask wearing.

I sure hope so but I would be surprised. That would make too much sense. 

Edited by barackdhouse

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9 minutes ago, Man In The Box said:

I think the NFL realizes how much of their audience is fantasy related and hope they’ll decide to postpone this game before kickoff tomorrow. I don’t see how they can realistically play Monday or Tuesday night. 

Given the incubation period of the virus it's very possible players could test positive a few days after the game is played even if they are getting negatives now. Atlanta was able to play last week with a positive but that was with a non QB. Maybe they got lucky to not have other positives. 

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10 minutes ago, elshagon said:

Maybe someone already mentioned this, but I wouldn't be surprised if the league institutes a two week pause on the season and pushes the schedule back two week so everyone can get their players and coaches back and at the same time re-evaluate their priorities in safe practices and mask wearing.

This is best for fantasy as well. We're all built around a 17 week regular season. What happens if the NFL has to go 18 or 19 because teams are stacking up multiple bye weeks? Our leagues can't just increase the length of the FF season on the fly.

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13 minutes ago, elshagon said:

Maybe someone already mentioned this, but I wouldn't be surprised if the league institutes a two week pause on the season and pushes the schedule back two week so everyone can get their players and coaches back and at the same time re-evaluate their priorities in safe practices and mask wearing.

But this isn’t really a solution, because players/coaches/staff are absolutely positively going to test positive down the road during this season.  So then what?  Push the schedule back again?  Just not seeing them go this route.

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56 minutes ago, KingPrawn said:

I'd have to disagree. One owner in our league would have 7 guys out this week between PIT TEN KC & NE. Saturday injuries happen to ONE player. Not a whole team. Obviously his opponent would benefit tremendously. Thats not only  unfair to that owner but its also unfair to the rest of the league when one owner is essentially granted a gift win

Meh....i've had 4 starters get injured the same week and its marked down as #### happens.   

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29 minutes ago, Doug B said:

Not that many leagues have firm constitutions. Instead, you try to communicate to as many owners as possible what's going on and ask for input/feedback/opinions.

Typically, in most leagues if a change is unanimous, it's kosher -- constitution or not. It gets trickier when you have holdouts. This year, I'd suggest to any holdouts "Look, we're going to have to be a lot more flexible and a little bit less fair to get through this season. In an upcoming week ... it's likely that YOUR team will be affected and that YOUR team will benefit from flexibility and lenience. Are you 100% positive you want to draw a line in the sand here?"

For a lot of leagues, all of this advice will only go so far. Unfortunately, there will be unreasonable holdouts who will sap a lot of fun out of 2020 fantasy football leagues by not accurately taking a read of the unprecedented stuff that's happening in the NFL right now and being willing to adjust. IMHO, this is not the time to be a PITA for your league's commish just because your opponent won't be forced to start dog meat for Patrick Mahomes or something like that.

Appreciate the input. It is a living breathing constitution but usually changes are made in off-season for next season as mid-season changes aren't fair because people didn't know them going into the season.

However, I'm not so rigid as I am unwilling to hear arguments and try to do what's right, even when I personally don't want to do more work. I posed the question to my league and asked that it be unanimous. People are typically unresponsive unless they want to complain about something and some don't even set their 1 lineup properly in ESPN so I'm sure this will just add more trouble to my list but it is what it is.

Thanks.

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, perbach said:

Meh....i've had 4 starters get injured the same week and its marked down as #### happens.   

But you’re talking about 4 healthy players. These are apples and oranges. 

4 players getting hurt is [poop] happens. It’s highly unlikely that those 4 players were healthy & all got hurt so badly they couldn’t play during a Saturday walk-through.

So assuming it’s 4 players hurt the week before you’d have time to pick up FAs, make waiver claims or even orchestrate a trade. 

A game getting cancelled with 24 hours notice where those healthy players may not play isn’t anywhere near synonymous. 

Not remotely similar. 

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1 minute ago, tigerz said:

However, I'm not so rigid as I am unwilling to hear arguments and try to do what's right, even when I personally don't want to do more work. I posed the question to my league and asked that it be unanimous. People are typically unresponsive unless they want to complain about something and some don't even set their 1 lineup properly in ESPN so I'm sure this will just add more trouble to my list but it is what it is.

The bolded is true of our live leagues, too, where everyone knows each other. I've already sent an email to our commissioner (a longtime family friend) to get the discussion ball rolling. Might need to text him, too -- time is of the essence.

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1 minute ago, Hot Sauce Guy said:

A game getting cancelled with 24 hours notice where those healthy players may not play isn’t anywhere near synonymous. 

Not remotely similar. 

And to riff off Hot Sauce's point -- another confounding issue is that the NFL itself is indefinite as to whether the real-life game will be played Week 4 or not. So that throws things more into chaos -- fantasy owners don't actually know yet whether or not those guys will be available to their fantasy teams' Week Four lineups.

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Posted (edited)

My Superflex team Is fortunate to roster 4 QB’s, but that means I am using Darnold and Haskins in this week’s lineup. I can still field a roster (barely), but my bench has never looked like this before:

Mahomes - postponed

Rothlisberger - bye

Steelers Def - bye

S. Watkins - postponed

M. Hardeman - postponed

S. Michel - postponed

Bell - IR

Edited by Gold Fox
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Almost 30 yrs being a Commish across multiple Leagues and formats: some situations  you can operate by democracy, some situations require you to act as a benevolent dictator. This is definitely the latter. This forum is loaded with enough acumen to formulate a working solution that takes care of the League, whether it pleases everyone or not. Spend some time here reading and formulating a plan, and then TELL your League how the situation is being handled, emphasizing that in a time of crisis, what helps THE LEAGUE AS A WHOLE the most, isnt necessarily going to work out the same way for everyone. Not a time for waffling. Choose a course of action and follow through, with conviction. It will save you a boatload of issues, and doesnt require nearly as much energy. I convinced my Dyn guys to punt this Season to 2021 back in August, because I knew there was no way this season would go off without a hitch, and encouraged everyone here who played Dyn to do the same. Redraft a totally different beast. 2020 is a one-off just like every other redraft season. Much easier to deal with. Good luck to all of you who are knee deep in it. Make a well thought out plan,communicate, implement and be firm.

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All three of my teams have been wrecked with injuries and now C19. I'm 0-3, 0-3, and 1-2. Ironically, with the existence of C19 I still have a chance to win it all. 

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28 minutes ago, perbach said:

Meh....i've had 4 starters get injured the same week and its marked down as #### happens.   

All injured on a Saturday/Sunday, huh? Man I hate to have your luck.

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2 hours ago, Anarchy99 said:

They don’t do any testing on Sunday. 

As was already pointed out Chiefs and NE will be getting tested tomorrow but also for sure players on Vikings and Texans will be getting the less accurate POC tests tomorrow morning.

The question I have, if anyone can answer, is that I know the league revised some protocols in last day or two. My specific question is will the POC tests be given just to Texans and Vikings due to increased risk of exposure or to the entire league?

It's something to try and plan for because the POC tests have a higher degree of false positives.

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My dynasty team.. no joke.. could be down 11 guys tomorrow if KC cancelled

Mahomes/Cam/Mullens

CMC/Henry/Conner/Mixon/Akers/Bernard

Hopkins/Godwin/Lockett/Sutton/Cobb

Kelce/Goedart/Andrews

 

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48 minutes ago, Doug B said:

And to riff off Hot Sauce's point -- another confounding issue is that the NFL itself is indefinite as to whether the real-life game will be played Week 4 or not. So that throws things more into chaos -- fantasy owners don't actually know yet whether or not those guys will be available to their fantasy teams' Week Four lineups.

Right - like an apples to oranges comparison to a BYE week. While these may be treated like BYEs (see: PIT/TEN) they’re not. A BYE is a planned event. Owners prepare for BYEs as far back as draft day.

this is entirely unplanned. That’s another key distinction.

:thumbup:

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Desperate times call for desperate measures. I'm thinking of shutting down the waiver wire and using the player pool as a community best ball bench. If teams get to a point they don't have enough players to field a team they would get the highest score from the waiver pool for the player at their position. And yes, the same player could score for multiple teams. In a 12 team league with 17 roster spots and 9 starters one of the teams is down 9 players if you count the 2 he didn't use on Thursday.

Thoughts, suggestions??

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34 minutes ago, BearsFan4Life said:

My dynasty team.. no joke.. could be down 11 guys tomorrow if KC cancelled

Mahomes/Cam/Mullens

CMC/Henry/Conner/Mixon/Akers/Bernard

Hopkins/Godwin/Lockett/Sutton/Cobb

Kelce/Goedart/Andrews

 

Ok. You win. Or lose in this case. 

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I proposed the "IF/Then" start but so far it's 2 in favor,, 4 against.  2 of 4 against are the ones who complain about everything and don't know the rules.

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6 minutes ago, Ardbeg4ever said:

I proposed the "IF/Then" start but so far it's 2 in favor,, 4 against.  2 of 4 against are the ones who complain about everything and don't know the rules.

Weird - I had unanimous support for a contingency sub. First vote in decades-long league history to pass 12-0. 

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Lasted about as long as I expected. How does TENN even play next week? They are still getting cases.

It was a nice run.

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30 minutes ago, Raging weasel said:

Desperate times call for desperate measures. I'm thinking of shutting down the waiver wire and using the player pool as a community best ball bench. If teams get to a point they don't have enough players to field a team they would get the highest score from the waiver pool for the player at their position. And yes, the same player could score for multiple teams. In a 12 team league with 17 roster spots and 9 starters one of the teams is down 9 players if you count the 2 he didn't use on Thursday.

Thoughts, suggestions??

I think your scheme is genius. And could be used all year long, by all teams.

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Overall thoughts?  BAD business.  Horrible.  play in the rules.  Absolute joke to change the rules. DONE.

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38 minutes ago, Raging weasel said:

Desperate times call for desperate measures. I'm thinking of shutting down the waiver wire and using the player pool as a community best ball bench. If teams get to a point they don't have enough players to field a team they would get the highest score from the waiver pool for the player at their position. And yes, the same player could score for multiple teams. In a 12 team league with 17 roster spots and 9 starters one of the teams is down 9 players if you count the 2 he didn't use on Thursday.

Thoughts, suggestions??

Check your weekly scoring histories; it’s possible that the waiver pool is the best play for several positions.   With 12 teams/17 total players I’d expect a lot of kickers, D/STs, and QBs on the WW, and probably a lot of mediocre starting TEs.   I’d take the best ball results from that group any day.

In short, your solution might be too generous.

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4 hours ago, Blackbear said:

Probably not. Maybe some teams they need change venues. A mid January game in Green Bay, for example, could be too cold. But hopefully they can schedule around it or play at an indoor stadium somewhere if they had too. 

Wait - why would it ever be too cold in Green Bay?  I could see that happening to MN fans.....but GB?

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