Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
Just a gut feeling but I'm guessing a Ben extension is imminent given the current restructures today.
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✦✦✦ Official 2015 Pittsburgh Steelers Thread 
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- Thread starter Evilgrin 72
- Start date
Idiot Boxer
Footballguy
Reggie Bush, anyone?
3C's
Footballguy
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Of the recent/imminent cuts, two guys I can see being brought in are Bush and Woodley. The former if he's willing to sign a deal like Blount did last year rather than a MoJo Drew deal (unlikely) and Woodley if he's willing to sign an incentive based "prove it" deal (possible.)
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Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
3C's
Footballguy
Kind of why I was asking, I had contemplated this, then Wexell wrote about it, and now: Daniel Jeremiah’s Latest Has Virginia OLB Eli Harold Going To Steelers. With rankings like on CBS that would be too early, reaching. Of course a lot of fans want CB. So wondering if the preference is to "reach" for someone like Harold (even though it might not be a reach), take what might be BPA (by some rankings) in Malcom Brown or go for CB (fan choice)?
DJ's latest mock (Brown going way earlier than 22, 2 OL before 22): http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/mock-drafts/daniel-jeremiah/230601
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3C's
Footballguy
Yeah, they're still on board with the young guy Harris and they likely could get a guy in the mid rounds like one of the Davids (they did talk to Cobb) so they don't need to break the bank on a rb.
Godsbrother
Footballguy
Ideally, they trade down is all those guys are gone. But again, that's not the question you are asking.
It might not be popular but I'd be ok with an offensive tackle. Seems there a few of them right in that range.
They also need depth along the d-line. After reading about the two nose tackle prospects (Jordan Phillips, Eddie Goldman) I like them, but I'm not a fan of drafting a NT in the first in general.
I'm not sure about the LB prospects. There are so many of first/second round guys it's hard to differentiate, but I'd rather have them take another position than reach.
As for CB, if we are assuming Jalen Collins is gone, then I'd rather not see them take PJ Williams.
So, if the guys we all prefer are gone, I'd take a lineman. As I research more in the coming weeks/months my guess is I'll have a better expectation of who I want them to take. Typically, I find a guy a like about this time of year that's projected to be available at their pick, but rises up the draft board as time goes on. I haven't done enough research to have that guy yet.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
The only real suspense here is who offers him the better deal - Arizona or Tennessee?
3C's
Footballguy
3C's
Footballguy
I'm definitely high on Owa and Eli and considering Worilds is 50/50 to be in Pitt next year they'd have a real need for OLB if they don't sign a free agent (looking at you Brandon Graham).
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
I don't think Harold at 22 is a reach.
Kikaha in round 2 wouldn't make me upset either.
Kikaha in round 2 wouldn't make me upset either.
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
Bush? Would be fine with that, if the price was right(although I doubt he'd have playing caddy to Bell as his first choice, fwiw). Woodley? Aw, HELL naw!
He was already a smacked a$$ the last season, or so, before he left Pittsburgh. He didn't get any less smacked last year in Oakland. Pass.
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Idiot Boxer
Footballguy
Reggie has to know he's on the back end of his career. Coming to a playoff team and being a contributor on 3rd downs (and for 2 full games) and a shot at a title might get him here.
Anthony Fasano is another intriguing name. Certainly better than any #2 TE we've had in awhile.
Agree that we pass on bringing Woodley back.
Anthony Fasano is another intriguing name. Certainly better than any #2 TE we've had in awhile.
Agree that we pass on bringing Woodley back.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
True, but he knows the system and isn't likely to draw any interest. If he was willing to sign a vet minimum deal with sack incentives, it might be a better fit for the short term than a FA from another team or a rookie. They are absolutely decimated at OLB if/when Worilds walks and Harrison signs elsewhere.
3C's
Footballguy
Sign Harrison then. A 1 year deal with him at 2M is better than anything Woodley has to offer.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Agreed, I'd MUCH rather have Harrison, but if he asks for a prohibitive salary or decides he only wants to play for LeBeau, that may not be an option.
Woodley may be a hump, but if he'll sign for 2 years at 1.5 million total and they build in escalators based on sack or TFL totals, that may be better than starting Howard Jones or paying a guy like Orakpo 5 million per. If they fail to significantly upgrade the secondary, I'm petrified of what might happen if they have zero pass rush. It was bad enough last year with Harrison and Worilds. Without either, they may allow 500 points.
The alternative is to build through the draft but starting 2 rookies along with Jones and Shazier, neither of whom is anything resembling a known commodity, makes me extremely nervous. Especially with a first time coordinator.
3C's
Footballguy
Harrison's not doing either IMO. He wants to stay in town and play for a decent salary. Steelers really are being the one that are hard headed in that regard. Don't really blame them as long as they get some longer term players in. My thinking is he'd prefer to play in Pittsburgh for one more year and he's not looking to break the bank, but if Pittsburgh doesn't want him he'll go to Tenn is they want him.
Woodley is not coming in at 1.5M for 2 years (pretty sure that's below league min). Of course the way the BS contracts work they could pretend to pay him X amount in year 1 to cover the min...
The inside should be fine with Shazier, Timmons, Spence and Williams. Outside there's Jones and Moats. The guy they signed (Lemon) is seriously intriguing but there's a big step up from CFL to NFL. Get another OLB in the draft and/or free agency and there's a little more breathing room, no need to fret over Worilds or Harrison. Regardless, really want Harrison back one more year. He has the ability and desire, he deserves it.
36th Chamber
Footballguy
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
I just looked it up, vet minimum for Woodley on a 2-year deal would be $1.755M (I think it was $865,000 and $890,000 or something), so not too far off. I'd take him at that salary with performance escalators. Nothing more. A one year deal would be just as good. Seems unrealistic, but who is going to pay him at this point with all the injuries he's had? He's made a bunch of money, so he may be willing to sign a "prove it" deal someplace with the hopes that he can rehab his image as lazy and/or injury prone and earn himself one more contract of significance before he retires. Where better to do that in a single season than somewhere he already knows the terrain, the players, many of the defensive principles, etc?3C said:
I want Harrison back for another year too, but it's not up to you or me, and possibly not the Steelers either. He already demanded his way out of town once, I get the feeling he's going to put a number out there that he wants and if the Steelers don't pay it, he retires again or goes to Tennessee. What his number is remains to be seen, but they may not have a choice.
In today's NFL, a pass rush is pretty much the only thing necessary to have defensive success. If you can get after the QB regularly, you don't even need a great secondary. Most NFL defensive backs can cover a guy for 2-3 seconds. Almost none can cover a guy for 8-10 seconds. You can have a porous run defense and a weak secondary and if you have a hellacious pass rush, you can end drives and force turnovers that made the 2-3 first downs that offense picked up on the current drive irrelevant. The Steelers' inability to get pressure last year was the primary driving force behind the fall of their overall defensive rating. We have an offense now that can outscore just about anyone, if we can just fix the pass rush, the secondary becomes far less of a concern. If I'm them, I'm bringing in anyone and everyone that could help get after opposing signal callers. Roethlisberger isn't getting any younger - the window to win another Super Bowl with this regime (Ben/Antonio/LeVeon) is narrowing by the day before the massive rebuild (reload) starts a few years from now.
Just one guy's opinion. I personally don't really care if Woodley comes back or not, I'm no honk for ol' 56. I am, however, scared s---less of a lack of pass rush. Whereas once, I was a near IB-level shill for rebuilding the o-line, I now feel the same way about the pass rush. If they can dial that in, the prospects for a dream season increase exponentially.
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Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Both. I want as many inexpensive bodies in camp as they can get, if that's the route they're going to go (i.e. not sign a high $$$ free agent at OLB.) Right now, how many OLBs do they even have under contract? Jarvis Jones, Howard Jones, Shawn Lemon, Roosevelt Nix, and is that it? A high draft pick who has really yet to flash and has 3 career sacks going into his third season, and three undrafted PS players, none of whom has ever seen an NFL field on Sunday. That's it. Worilds, Harrison, and Moats are all free agents and thus far, Moats is the only one I've heard say in the press that he definitely wants back in Pittsburgh.
In case I haven't mentioned it, the lack of pass rush is terrifying me.
I definitely want Moats back. And I agree they need all the live bodies they can get. It's going to be very interesting to see how it plays out. They're going to bring someone in on the cheap and they're going to draft one in the first two rounds. But that's still not enough in my opinion.
If somehow they can bring back Moats and Woodley, draft an OLB and CB in the first 2 rounds, I'll feel better about the defense. But I'll still have tempered my expectations as it's going to take a while to get the defense back on track.
I know very very little about Lemon. To get anything out of him would be a huge bonus. So I'm not counting him as a warm body yet. And I'm not much of fan of the others.
The secondary is bad, but I completely agree with you that it doesn't matter how bad your secondary is if you can't get to the qb.
If somehow they can bring back Moats and Woodley, draft an OLB and CB in the first 2 rounds, I'll feel better about the defense. But I'll still have tempered my expectations as it's going to take a while to get the defense back on track.
I know very very little about Lemon. To get anything out of him would be a huge bonus. So I'm not counting him as a warm body yet. And I'm not much of fan of the others.
The secondary is bad, but I completely agree with you that it doesn't matter how bad your secondary is if you can't get to the qb.
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
Woodley can't provide any pass rush from the hot tub. May as well light 1.7M on fire as give it to him. Guy is falling apart. That was my point.
They could get him for free and he's unlikely to provide much of anything.
They could get him for free and he's unlikely to provide much of anything.
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Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
I agree with the thought that the best way to solve the pass rush problem is to provide as much competition as possible. I doubt Worilds is back as he has been highly inconsistent for what he is about to be paid. Luckily there is a glut of pass rushers in the draft and the FA market seems to have some decent high risk, high reward options.
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Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
That's the most likely scenario, but anyone you're going to get for a bargain-basement price is going to come with the same or equally staggering risk. At least Woodley is something of a known commodity, has had success in Pittsburgh in the past, and is still only 30. I'm only suggesting he could be an option in place of signing a guy like Orakpo, who has a similar skill set, similarly unappealing injury history, and is only 2 years younger, yet is likely to command triple the $ (if not much more.) If Woodley was willing to sign a vet min deal with incentives, and ends up chilling in the tub again, he would receive so little as to possibly not even count against the cap under the rule of 51, or at the very least be easily cuttable if he doesn't play.
If his body's shot, a physical would surely bear that out and rule him out entirely, I'm suggesting this is a possibility only if he checks out with doctors.
AhrnCityPahnder
Yinz-o-riffic
This is probably a very dumb question, but I never really thought about it before.
We already have $8.5M in dead money for Woodley from his last contract. Assuming he'd sign for a vet min, his cap hit adds on to that, right? I assume we aren't able to get cute with a new contract and what is already dead money.
We already have $8.5M in dead money for Woodley from his last contract. Assuming he'd sign for a vet min, his cap hit adds on to that, right? I assume we aren't able to get cute with a new contract and what is already dead money.
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
Bouchette, and I acknowledge most around here consider him a blow hard, quoted on a veteran on the team saying he didn't believe Woodley ever worked out and was very out of shape after his extension with Pitt. I've always heard some minor rumblings he was a malcontent or at very least a bad influence. I was admittedly never a Woodley fan and took some heat for criticizing his bloated contract and him never living up to it. I would prefer Harrison still over Woodley and would be doubly thrilled if they spent the extra on Orakpo for a high risk option.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
If that's the case, he's not coming back no matter what. I always chalk that kind of stuff up to rumor, but if it's legit, then there's no way they bring him back at any price.
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
Well, Bouchette may be a curmudgeon(He is. I love him, FWIW), but he's dialed in to the team more than any other beat guy. If he says it, you can pretty much take it as fact.
I think just looking at Woodley after he signed that contract was enough to dispel any notion all that noise was merely "rumor." Dude got fat. Quickly. I didn't want them to keep Woodley last year and don't want them to bring him back now. He had his day, but it's long since passed.
That said, they may as well launch whatever money they'd have to give Brian Orakpo into the sun. He's at, what, 2 pectoral tears in 3 years? 3 in the last 4? Guy is juicing(or at least majorly HGHing, if nothing else). "Ripping muscles off the bone" or rupturing connective tissues is usually a dead giveaway. He's got a body type that should almost not be possible for a human to have. If he could definitively prove that he isn't using something, I would be floored.
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3C's
Footballguy
I'd guess that would be best for the Steelers. No potential PR nightmare of cutting him.
Godsbrother
Footballguy
I don't think I would call it a PR nightmare if they cut him. I think most Steelers fans realize that Troy has become a liability. It will be sad if he pulls a Franco and plays his final season with another team but if he does I wish him the best.
He will always be remembered as a Steeler no matter what happens.
3C's
Footballguy
Of course he will always be a Steeler and no matter what happens he'll be big there forever. PR nightmare though if the staff doesn't want him back (apparently they don't) but he wants to continue on (could be), then goes to play somewhere else while the Steelers struggle to replace him.
Nice story from Wexell on SCI. http://pit.scout.com/story/1523865-someday-has-come-for-troy-polamalu?s=68
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
We think Thomas and Allen are better than Troy? I don't think he's a dynamic game changer, but he's got juice left. With a new coordinator I'd like Troy to stay. I'd hate to see him in Arizona or Tennessee.
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
I think whatever juice he had is squeezed out, sadly. Did he make a single splash play last year?
Not saying they have the answer to replace him on the roster right now, but I don't see Troy getting any better in '15 than he was in '14.
Very likely a moot point. If they're openly stating "We really hope Troy will retire" then he's probably done in Pittsburgh. They're moving on if they're going public with stuff like that. If he doesn't retire, they're gonna cut him.
Not saying they have the answer to replace him on the roster right now, but I don't see Troy getting any better in '15 than he was in '14.
Very likely a moot point. If they're openly stating "We really hope Troy will retire" then he's probably done in Pittsburgh. They're moving on if they're going public with stuff like that. If he doesn't retire, they're gonna cut him.
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Idiot Boxer
Footballguy
Steeler's Depot announcing that Moats has been re-signed.
3C's
Footballguy
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
3 years at $7.5M total is a decent deal. I like the signing at that price.
Per theredzone.org -- Brandon Gramham re-signed with Philly. Four years 26M - 14M guaranteed.
"
The Eagles reached a four-year deal with Brandon Graham, keeping the former outside linebacker in Philadelphia, Zach Berman of the Philadelphia Inquirer reports. Graham agreed to a four-year deal worth $26 million, with $14 million guaranteed, according to a source. Graham is expected to take over Trent Cole’s role as starting right outside linebacker.
Birds 24/7 first reported the signing.
The deal continues a career turnaround for Graham, who dealt with injuries and scheme changes early after the Eagles traded up in the first round of the 2010 draft to acquire Graham. He shed the “bust” label and is now a foundation piece for the Eagles. Graham adjusted to the 3-4 defense, recording 5.5 sacks in a part-time role last year."
"
The Eagles reached a four-year deal with Brandon Graham, keeping the former outside linebacker in Philadelphia, Zach Berman of the Philadelphia Inquirer reports. Graham agreed to a four-year deal worth $26 million, with $14 million guaranteed, according to a source. Graham is expected to take over Trent Cole’s role as starting right outside linebacker.
Birds 24/7 first reported the signing.
The deal continues a career turnaround for Graham, who dealt with injuries and scheme changes early after the Eagles traded up in the first round of the 2010 draft to acquire Graham. He shed the “bust” label and is now a foundation piece for the Eagles. Graham adjusted to the 3-4 defense, recording 5.5 sacks in a part-time role last year."
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
THANK YOU BRETT! #99!
What an absolute wonderful player and representative of what it is to be a Steeler .
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
BigSteelThrill said:
I understand the need to infuse youth and speed but seeing guys like Keisel, Ike, and Troy get released is tough for me. I'm a very sentimental guy by nature.
Godsbrother
Footballguy
I am too but it is worse holding on to them too long. This is a lesson I think the Steelers learned the hard way in the early 80s.BigSteelThrill said:
I understand the need to infuse youth and speed but seeing guys like Keisel, Ike, and Troy get released is tough for me. I'm a very sentimental guy by nature.
Love ya 99. Thanks for all of the great years and good luck to whatever is next for you.
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