i have to disagree with the lions pick. i just dont see miller going that high. he is a very good pass catcher(hands/routes/technique) and definitely the best TE in the draft, but he is a good, not excellent blocker, and not a threat to break the big play. One out of Erasmus James and David Pollack will merit the #10 pick. If Miller was also a dominant blocker, or a Tony Gonzalez type unstoppable force on offense, i could see taking him over a top DE, but as you said, impact DEs are hard to come by, and i just cant see the lions passing on a possible elite DE for a very good TE.Note: not saying the pick wont happen, just trying to get some discussion going...
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2005 FBG/ NFL Mock Draft (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter ltaylor
- Start date
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Both Mel Kiper and nfldraftblitz has the exact same pick for the lions.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
cstu, Chargers are on deck, I could us some of your input. What do you like about:E. JamesD.PollockM.SpearsI can see either one of them being a quality pick at this point. Even though Spears is slipping in most mocks/ranking I see and could be there at 28.Also, I don't really know alot about Pac Man Jones (UWV) , Justin Miller (clemson) and Carlos Rogers (aubrun). i could see them going CB later as well. I see Pac man being rates and going around 6-11 on various mocks as well.
cstu
Footballguy
I want them to get Spears, but it's too early and James is too much talent to pass up. Pollack doesn't seem as talented but he doesn't have James' injury problems and he seems like a character guy. CB isn't a need pick, but think Thomas Davis at safety would fix a lot of problems.JamesPollackT. Davis
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bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
I live in Big Ten country (michigan) gotta say he (E.James) got talent but appears often injured and lacking in fire. If he had pollack's "motor" or heart but I hate the word heart, as they say, he would be a no brainer.
i can see miller going to the lions at #10 - i just think he shouldnt, and once everyone gets worked out, he won't. TEs just aren't as important as "infrastructure" positions like OT and D-Line, or skill positions such as WR or CB - the only time i think a TE should break the top 10 is when they are a once-every-10-years kind of talent like winslow last year. i dont see miller at that level, he's more of a jason witten. The fact that Lions are already set at WR and RB just underscores how a solid pass receiving TE would not improve their team significantly. i think TE is a need, but it is a 2nd or 3rd round need, not a first round need.again, this is not meant as any disrespect to bob henry's analysis, i think it is accurate. this is more to spark some discussion, since we are in the part of the draft where there's a lot more room for interpretation.edit to add: jason witten, now, who would be a first rounder, not jason witten coming out of college, when he didnt merit a 1st round grade.
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I 
Heath Miller and think the Lions would be thrilled to add him.But, they have other needs as well so I'm not sure if it's a smart pick for them or not.Personally, I think this kid could be as good as Shockey/Heap in the passing game though and that's an underrated weapon to have.Just look at the impact Antonio Gates had on the Chargers offense this season for proof.
Heath Miller and think the Lions would be thrilled to add him.But, they have other needs as well so I'm not sure if it's a smart pick for them or not.Personally, I think this kid could be as good as Shockey/Heap in the passing game though and that's an underrated weapon to have.Just look at the impact Antonio Gates had on the Chargers offense this season for proof.i think shockey is a good comparison, and he went 14th in 2002. Levi Jones, the 3rd OT on the board, went 10th in that draft, and Dwight Freeney, the 2nd DE on the board, went 11th. 3 DTs also went before shockey. it seems like teams were willing to take linemen with small question marks before the clear top TE on the board.I
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JAA
Footballguy
Packman will move up in the draft due to an incredable combine workout. He is very raw and not ready to be a cover corner in the league day 1. Expect him to excel at punt/kickoff returns and nickel coverage to start. I could see him having 3-4 Ints rookie season out of the Nickel, he has a nose for the ball.
beto
Footballguy
Getting this up for 1/19. I PM'd Culdeus for the Cowboy pick, I say we
wait until noon for him.
Taken so far:
1 San Francisco- Aaron Rodgers- QB from Cal
2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas
3 Cleveland Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami
4 Chicago Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan
5 Tampa Bay Mike Williams - WR formerly USC
6 Tennessee Alex Barron - OT Florida St.
7 Oakland Cedric Benson - RB Texas
8 Arizona Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn
9 Washington Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma
10 Detroit Heath Miller - TE Virginia
OTC - Dallas Cowboys
wait until noon for him.
Taken so far:
1 San Francisco- Aaron Rodgers- QB from Cal
2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas
3 Cleveland Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami
4 Chicago Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan
5 Tampa Bay Mike Williams - WR formerly USC
6 Tennessee Alex Barron - OT Florida St.
7 Oakland Cedric Benson - RB Texas
8 Arizona Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn
9 Washington Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma
10 Detroit Heath Miller - TE Virginia
OTC - Dallas Cowboys
ILoveMyLions
Footballguy
Although I think the Lions need a good TE for their offense, I think there are some quality players in the second and third rounds that could be very effective like Smith, who was mentioned, and Everett from Miami. With all of those DEs on the board, as well as Davis, that would be hard for the Lions to pass up. They need to upgrade their pass defense and any of those players would do that.I'm not saying that I argue with the pick, as it is a need, but to get a #1 DE would be awesome on that young DL.
Bob Henry
Footballguy
NO question about it.. and I agree with that completely. However, given the structure of this mock I liked Miller better with the 10th pick than slightly reaching for Pollack and Cody was gone. I just felt more comfortable taking MIller here than Erasmus or Thomas Davis. I'd have no problems moving down as many spots as possible and still getting one of those players for defense. Maybe that would allow the Lions to do something similar to last year where they could move up some in the 2nd or get an extra 2nd/3rd where they could possibly get someone like Alex Smith (TE) in the 2nd, Kevin Everett (2nd/3rd), Carlos Rogers, David Baas, Ernest Shazor or even get lucky and get a solid DE.. though I tend to agree that it's hard to fill the pass-rushing DE need. Too many 1st rounders end up being busts that are too one-dimensional as pass rushers only. If we grab a DE in the 1st it needs to be a player who can hold up against the run, too. We already got a bust in Kalimba Edwards who is even spotty as a pass rusher. All of the comments are pretty much on target, so don't be afraid to say what you think. I got thick skin and appreciate the differing opinions. You need to have that to make the best decisions in the War Room.
ILoveMyLions
Footballguy
From what you are saying there, it seems that if Cody was there, you would have drafted him. I tend to agree. I think he's the best DE in the group and should be a productive player in the NFL as he seems to have a lot to offer. I can understand passing on James as he's not as proven and has injury concerns. Pollack is very similar to Cody, but probably isn't as highly rated at this point. If the Lions could trade down a few spots and pick up an extra third as you mentioned, that would be ideal. Then they could select any number of players as the have need at DE, S, TE, OG, LB...and even QB in the mid rounds
culdeus
Footballguy
1.11 Shawne Merriman jr Maryland DL/LB
I think considering the way the draft was going the Cowboys would look to trade down in a hurry here letting some people up to get a look at the skill players on the board. Shawne has been hyped a bit on The Ticket by Norm much in the same way Kiper hypes him up. It isn't a secret that Parcells wants to alternate between the 4-3 and 3-4 and this could be the floating front 7 guy they need. In addition he has the size and quickness to match his versatility.
I think if they could have traded down and picked up a late 1st and late 2nd though here they would have done it in a second because of the lack of a 3rd round pick.
I think considering the way the draft was going the Cowboys would look to trade down in a hurry here letting some people up to get a look at the skill players on the board. Shawne has been hyped a bit on The Ticket by Norm much in the same way Kiper hypes him up. It isn't a secret that Parcells wants to alternate between the 4-3 and 3-4 and this could be the floating front 7 guy they need. In addition he has the size and quickness to match his versatility.
I think if they could have traded down and picked up a late 1st and late 2nd though here they would have done it in a second because of the lack of a 3rd round pick.
beto
Footballguy
One thing to note is that in the Millen era they have been notorious for picking up players with injury questions in the draft for serious value. Boss Bailey, Shaun Rogers, Chris Cash and I think one other fairly high choice fit this description. Now I don't thing Erasmus represents value at the 10 spot but it would be something to think about.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
1.12 - San Diego Super Chargers select - E.James - DE - Wisconsin. I was really torn on this pick, I love M. Spears and Pollack from UGA but James has more talent and who knows one of those guys could still be there at 28. Neither of the elite WR was available or Alex Barron. The biggest need area for the Chargers is WR/OL and then the best defensive player available. Jamal Williams is a true stud in the middle, Igor is on the other side I think E.James steps right in and starts for Cesair on the other end. SD's 3-4 was very good at stopping the run last year and hopefully with Jamal taking double team, E.James can help them generate a pass rush to help out the young DB's.COOL NERD on the Clock with the Houston Texans.P.S. - In Mel Kiper's mock he had Derrick Johnson sliding to SD with this pick and Mike Williams was also available.
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coolnerd
Footballguy
11. Lions- Shawne Merriman12. Chargers- Eramus James
BTW, that you Chargers for selecting timely as i am going to be away from the computer most of the day.
With the 13th pick, Houston Texans select ADAM "PACMAN" JONES
In the last two drafts the Texans have went BPA at the top of the draft getting two of the most dynamic young players, Andre Johnson and Dunta Robinson, in the NFL. The tradition continues as the team refuses to reach for more pressing needs as there is not an OL or DLman really worth the 13th spot in the draft. Marcus Spears, Shaun Cody, Travis Johnson are possibilities on the DL, but really I don't think any OLman is even close here. The BPA who would be the next selection is Cadillac Williams, but while he is effective running inside the Texans want a true change of pace to Dom Davis which means a big physical back.
As for Jones he is very similair to Robinsosn, a fast slightly undersized CB who is a willing tackler in space. By getting Jones, the Texans should be able to play a more aggressive style of defense with corner blitzes and more man coverage. This should help the team get more pressure on the QB which is the biggest weakness on the defensive side of the ball.
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ILoveMyLions
Footballguy
None of those were first round picks though. They were all second rounders and beyond...
guderian
Footballguy
1 San Francisco- Aaron Rodgers- QB from Cal 2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas3 Cleveland - Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami4 Chicago - Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan 5 Tampa Bay - Mike Williams - WR formerly USC6 Tennessee - Alex Barron - OT Florida St.7 Oakland - Cedric Benson - RB Texas8 Arizona - Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn9 Washington - Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma10 Detroit - Heath Miller - TE Virginia11 Dallas - Shawne Merriman - OLB-DE Maryland12 San Diego - Ersamus James - DE Wisconsin13 Houston - Pac Man Jones - CB West Virginia
Evilgrin72
Footballguy
Thank you. Guys, can everyone please cut and paste this into your pick posts? Just make the pick, then add the list at the bottom with your pick on it. Makes it much easier to see who's been chosen when you have to be away for a bit. Thanks.........
Evilgrin72
Footballguy
:rotflmao:
beto
Footballguy
I guess I'm up.
I think the Panthers have the fortune this year of having some of their needs probably being close to the best player available. From what I hear they were really hurt by losing FS Deon Grant to the Jags and Collin Branch (former 5th rounder) never really became a player in the backfield. For all I know they may address this in free agency but this pick seems to make sense, Mike Minter say hello to your new running mate:
14 Carolina Thomas Davis - FS Georgia
They may be tempted by Cadillac here to shore up the backfield and they have never been shy about trading picks so I could see them moving down here. Taking someone like Elton Brown or Travis Johnson would also be a possiblity.
1 San Francisco- Aaron Rodgers- QB from Cal
2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas
3 Cleveland Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami
4 Chicago Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan
5 Tampa Bay Mike Williams - WR formerly USC
6 Tennessee Alex Barron - OT Florida St.
7 Oakland Cedric Benson - RB Texas
8 Arizona Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn
9 Washington Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma
10 Detroit Heath Miller - TE Virginia
11 Dallas Shawn Merriman - DE/OLB Maryland
12 San Diego Erasmus James - DE Wisconsin
13 Houston Adam "Pac-Man" Jones - CB West Virginia
14 Carolina Thomas Davis - FS Georgia
I think the Panthers have the fortune this year of having some of their needs probably being close to the best player available. From what I hear they were really hurt by losing FS Deon Grant to the Jags and Collin Branch (former 5th rounder) never really became a player in the backfield. For all I know they may address this in free agency but this pick seems to make sense, Mike Minter say hello to your new running mate:
14 Carolina Thomas Davis - FS Georgia
They may be tempted by Cadillac here to shore up the backfield and they have never been shy about trading picks so I could see them moving down here. Taking someone like Elton Brown or Travis Johnson would also be a possiblity.
1 San Francisco- Aaron Rodgers- QB from Cal
2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas
3 Cleveland Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami
4 Chicago Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan
5 Tampa Bay Mike Williams - WR formerly USC
6 Tennessee Alex Barron - OT Florida St.
7 Oakland Cedric Benson - RB Texas
8 Arizona Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn
9 Washington Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma
10 Detroit Heath Miller - TE Virginia
11 Dallas Shawn Merriman - DE/OLB Maryland
12 San Diego Erasmus James - DE Wisconsin
13 Houston Adam "Pac-Man" Jones - CB West Virginia
14 Carolina Thomas Davis - FS Georgia
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Colin Dowling
Footballguy
I didn't read the first 6 pages entirely, but has anyone pointed out to whoever did the Dolphins pick that they don't have a 3rd rounder? The analysis on page 1 talks about the 3rd round pick, but they traded it for Lamar Gordon.Also, regarding Miller, he's good and should develop in to a quality TE. However, he has a long way to go on his blocking and while he made a lot of progress this past season at UVA, I think he's a lot more Ben Watson and Jeramy Stevens than Winslow/SHockey. In other words, I suspect he'll post ok numbers this year but I don't see him as a 60+ catch guy, particularly if Joey Harrington is responsible for getting him the ball.COlin
my computer died at work, im on a loaner without any of the programs i need to get stuff done, so im going to be talkative today, hope i dont annoy anyone too much...Davis is an excellent pick here and the panthers would be elated to have him fall to them - i think it would take all of the first minute of their 15 to make the pick if davis is there. Sure's he's not the best ballhawk and is pretty raw, but Carolina's awesome D-line does all the dirty work, clogging up the line of scrimmage and forcing the QB into bad throws. all Davis will have to do is run around like a maniac and make plays - much like polamalu with the steelers. Davis may not pay dividends in 2005, but once he gets used to the freedom he will have roaming around behind that defensive front 7, he will wreak havoc.
I would imagine that this pick would leave the chiefs heartbroken, as Davis is exactly the kind of playmaker on D that they need to build around with wesley and woods both in decline.
Another guy the Panthers would have to take a long look at is Jamaal Brown to restock the line. i think if they go offense, an OT makes more sense than an RB because goings showed this year that if the panthers are effective in playing their style of football, the RB doesnt have to be the best talent. not to mention the 2nd-4th round grade RBs this year are a very deep class, and solid guys will be there for them to build RB depth later. the dropoff at safety after davis and OT after brown is much steeper.
Colin Dowling
Footballguy
Noted. Thanks.
BingoThe Cheifs are heartbroken about the Panthers snagging Davis.
It's obvoius that the Cheifs need to fix the Defense. There is a huge need at every level of the D. The cheifs are going to select DT Travis Johnson FSU.
He gives us a quick athletic almost 300 lber that will bring pressure from the DT spot. The Cheifs expect him to bring what Cornelius Griffin brought to the Redskins this year. Most likely will replace Lional Dalton in the starting lineup and team him with Ryan Sims (who needs to improve). There were obvious other needs like LB (love to have Johnson fall here) S (none worth drafting at this spot besides Davis) and WR (but D comes first this year)
1 San Francisco- Aaron Rodgers- QB from Cal
2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas
3 Cleveland Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami
4 Chicago Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan
5 Tampa Bay Mike Williams - WR formerly USC
6 Tennessee Alex Barron - OT Florida St.
7 Oakland Cedric Benson - RB Texas
8 Arizona Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn
9 Washington Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma
10 Detroit Heath Miller - TE Virginia
11 Dallas Shawn Merriman - DE/OLB Maryland
12 San Diego Erasmus James - DE Wisconsin
13 Houston Adam "Pac-Man" Jones - CB West Virginia
14 Carolina Thomas Davis - FS Georgia
15 Kansas City Travis Johnson DT Florida State
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Football Jones
Footballguy
1 San Francisco- Aaron Rodgers - QB from Cal
2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas
3 Cleveland - Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami
4 Chicago - Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan
5 Tampa Bay - Mike Williams - WR formerly USC
6 Tennessee - Alex Barron - OT Florida St.
7 Oakland - Cedric Benson - RB Texas
8 Arizona - Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn
9 Washington - Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma
10 Detroit - Heath Miller - TE Virginia
11 Dallas - Shawn Merriman - DE/OLB Maryland
12 San Diego - Erasmus James - DE Wisconsin
13 Houston - Adam "Pac-Man" Jones - CB West Virginia
14 Carolina - Thomas Davis - FS Georgia
15 Kansas City - Travis Johnson - DT Florida State
16 New Orleans - Alex Smith - QB Utah
My general strategy for the Saints is to target OL, LB, DB, & look for value at QB & TE. Even though QB wasn't a target position, I couldn't pass up Smith at 16. I'm one of those people who feel Aaron Brooks will never lead New Orleans to the promised land. They should start grooming somebody ASAP, IMO. That said, Brooks does give them a capable "transition" QB if they decide not to start the rookie right away.
Smith is 6'4" 212, very accurate, & has the arm to make all the throws. He's also highly intelligent, a good leader, & has excellent mobility. I'd be willing to bet he'll go no later than the 3rd overall pick. I also considered OT Jammal Brown, OG Elton Brown, & several CBs.
2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas
3 Cleveland - Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami
4 Chicago - Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan
5 Tampa Bay - Mike Williams - WR formerly USC
6 Tennessee - Alex Barron - OT Florida St.
7 Oakland - Cedric Benson - RB Texas
8 Arizona - Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn
9 Washington - Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma
10 Detroit - Heath Miller - TE Virginia
11 Dallas - Shawn Merriman - DE/OLB Maryland
12 San Diego - Erasmus James - DE Wisconsin
13 Houston - Adam "Pac-Man" Jones - CB West Virginia
14 Carolina - Thomas Davis - FS Georgia
15 Kansas City - Travis Johnson - DT Florida State
16 New Orleans - Alex Smith - QB Utah
My general strategy for the Saints is to target OL, LB, DB, & look for value at QB & TE. Even though QB wasn't a target position, I couldn't pass up Smith at 16. I'm one of those people who feel Aaron Brooks will never lead New Orleans to the promised land. They should start grooming somebody ASAP, IMO. That said, Brooks does give them a capable "transition" QB if they decide not to start the rookie right away.
Smith is 6'4" 212, very accurate, & has the arm to make all the throws. He's also highly intelligent, a good leader, & has excellent mobility. I'd be willing to bet he'll go no later than the 3rd overall pick. I also considered OT Jammal Brown, OG Elton Brown, & several CBs.
Football Jones
Footballguy
Kirby (Cincinnati) has been PMd.
and gasps go through the crowd as channing crowder already had his saints hat halfway on his head.i think this is a fantastic pick, if only because it acknowledges that aaron brooks is not, and will never be, the answer at QB for the saints. however, as you pointed out, its doubtful that smith will slip this far. if teams like what they see when they work him out, he'll land in the top 7 at worst, because some team will trade up out of fear that arizona will take him.
Football Jones
Footballguy
I did take a look at him, but Courtney Watson looks like a player in the middle. It certainly would've made sense, though. They could've shuffled their backers around to get both of them on the field. Crowder does have lots of potential.
Kirby
Footballguy
I really think the Bengals trade out of this spot. Last year Lewis traded the 17th pick and ended up with Deltha O’Neil, Chris Perry, Stacy Andrews, and Robert Geathers. I believe the Bengals most pressing needs are DT, SS, C, DE, and hopefully RB. DT is definitely the biggest need. Cincinnati was 26th in stopping the run. The only reason they weren't 32nd is because they got to play the Dolphins and Philly's 8th string. CMart(196) JLewis(186) Staley(123) Green(115) Droughns(110) Brown(147) Bettis(129) CTaylor(139) Barber(109) Some big numbers.
Anttaj Hawthorne DT Wisconsin
Hawthorne finished his senior season with 42 tackles – 11.5 for a loss – 6 sacks. . He is one of the best at plugging up the line and often hits the ball carrier in the backfield. 6'3 312 lbs.. big, athletic and explosive... something the bengals need desperately.
1 San Francisco- Aaron Rodgers - QB from Cal
2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas
3 Cleveland - Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami
4 Chicago - Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan
5 Tampa Bay - Mike Williams - WR formerly USC
6 Tennessee - Alex Barron - OT Florida St.
7 Oakland - Cedric Benson - RB Texas
8 Arizona - Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn
9 Washington - Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma
10 Detroit - Heath Miller - TE Virginia
11 Dallas - Shawn Merriman - DE/OLB Maryland
12 San Diego - Erasmus James - DE Wisconsin
13 Houston - Adam "Pac-Man" Jones - CB West Virginia
14 Carolina - Thomas Davis - FS Georgia
15 Kansas City - Travis Johnson - DT Florida State
16 New Orleans - Alex Smith - QB Utah
17 Cincinnati Bengals - Anttaj Hawthorne - DT Wisconsin
Anttaj Hawthorne DT Wisconsin
Hawthorne finished his senior season with 42 tackles – 11.5 for a loss – 6 sacks. . He is one of the best at plugging up the line and often hits the ball carrier in the backfield. 6'3 312 lbs.. big, athletic and explosive... something the bengals need desperately.
1 San Francisco- Aaron Rodgers - QB from Cal
2 Miami - Derrick Johnson - LB from Texas
3 Cleveland - Antrel Rolle - CB from Miami
4 Chicago - Braylon Edwards - WR Michigan
5 Tampa Bay - Mike Williams - WR formerly USC
6 Tennessee - Alex Barron - OT Florida St.
7 Oakland - Cedric Benson - RB Texas
8 Arizona - Ronnie Brown - RB Auburn
9 Washington - Dan Cody - DE Okalahoma
10 Detroit - Heath Miller - TE Virginia
11 Dallas - Shawn Merriman - DE/OLB Maryland
12 San Diego - Erasmus James - DE Wisconsin
13 Houston - Adam "Pac-Man" Jones - CB West Virginia
14 Carolina - Thomas Davis - FS Georgia
15 Kansas City - Travis Johnson - DT Florida State
16 New Orleans - Alex Smith - QB Utah
17 Cincinnati Bengals - Anttaj Hawthorne - DT Wisconsin
