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***2013 Denver Broncos*** (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter moleculo
- Start date
I think this is a dangerous assumption. Of course Welker will steal receptions from them, and they stole receptions from each other, but I don't think that makes them useless. If I recall, Peyton gets the ball to the open man. The numbers will probably go down, but if Peyton's throwing three or four touchdowns a game this year, it's very possible they might get one of them. 5 touchdowns from Tamme seems highly possible in my option.
moleculo
Footballguy
so one thing I saw in camp last week, and again in the first game tonight, was a lot of 12 personnel. That is, 1 RB, 2 TE, 2 WR. That means that Welker was on the sideline. The 2 TE's were Green and Julius Thomas (Tamme and Ddrreesseenn were both injured) in both practice and in the game. I think that when the Broncos want to run the ball (i.e maintaining a 2nd half lead), Welker will not be on the field. Having two TE's on the field gives a ton of versatility, as the Patriots showed last year. The problem for Welker is that he isn't nearly as big as Demaryius or Decker, so his contributions to the running game are minimal. My projections for Welker would be a few ticks better than what Stokley did last year.
I will not be drafting Welker at his current ADP of 4.09. I'm also very bullish on Julius Thomas - he's the real deal.
I will not be drafting Welker at his current ADP of 4.09. I'm also very bullish on Julius Thomas - he's the real deal.
moleculo
Footballguy
season finally kicks off tomorrow! I'm pretty nervous about the Ravens game. If Broncos struggle in this game, people will be jumping off the bandwagon en masse. This is a hype game more than anything else - it's about how a team finishes the season more than about how they start.
Here's your opening day depth chart:
WR Demaryius Thomas Andre CaldwellLT Ryan Clady Chris ClarkLG Zane Beadles Chris KuperC Manny Ramirez Steve VallosRG Louis Vasquez John MoffittRT Orlando Franklin Chris ClarkTE Julius Thomas Joel Dreessen Jacob Tamme Virgil GreenWR Eric Decker Trindon HollidayWR Wes Welker Eric DeckerQB Peyton Manning Brock Osweiler Zac DysertRB Ronnie Hillman Montee Ball Knowshon Moreno C.J. AndersonLDE Derek Wolfe Malik JacksonDT Kevin Vickerson Mitch UnreinNT Terrance Knighton Sylvester WilliamsRDE Robert Ayers Shaun PhillipsSLB Nate Irving Shaun PhillipsMLB Wesley Woodyard Paris LenonWLB Danny Trevathan Steven Johnson Adrian RobinsonLCB Champ Bailey Chris Harris Quentin JammerRCB Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie Tony Carter Kayvon WebsterSS Duke Ihenacho Mike AdamsFS Rahim Moore David Bruton Omar Boldencouple things to note:
Here's your opening day depth chart:
WR Demaryius Thomas Andre CaldwellLT Ryan Clady Chris ClarkLG Zane Beadles Chris KuperC Manny Ramirez Steve VallosRG Louis Vasquez John MoffittRT Orlando Franklin Chris ClarkTE Julius Thomas Joel Dreessen Jacob Tamme Virgil GreenWR Eric Decker Trindon HollidayWR Wes Welker Eric DeckerQB Peyton Manning Brock Osweiler Zac DysertRB Ronnie Hillman Montee Ball Knowshon Moreno C.J. AndersonLDE Derek Wolfe Malik JacksonDT Kevin Vickerson Mitch UnreinNT Terrance Knighton Sylvester WilliamsRDE Robert Ayers Shaun PhillipsSLB Nate Irving Shaun PhillipsMLB Wesley Woodyard Paris LenonWLB Danny Trevathan Steven Johnson Adrian RobinsonLCB Champ Bailey Chris Harris Quentin JammerRCB Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie Tony Carter Kayvon WebsterSS Duke Ihenacho Mike AdamsFS Rahim Moore David Bruton Omar Boldencouple things to note:
- 11 DB's, and only 7 DL. 4.5 WR's, 4 RB's. Sounds to me like a team gearing up to have 2nd half leads. Gotta be able to run the ball and defend the pass.
- WW playing at mike - did he get any game time there all pre-season? I think it's great that they are getting WW and Danny T on the field at the same time, I just hope they come in ready to go.
- Last year, Broncos played nickel 65% of the time. I'm assuming this roster reflects that? I'm curious how the nickel stacks up - assuming Irving leaves the field for Harris.
- No fullback - when they want to do that, I assume Virgil Green lines up as a FB?
- carrying 3 QB's.
Woodyard played MLB and Trevathan played WLB in game 3 of the preseason. Trevathan was the guy who had trouble keeping up with Jared Cook, who was pretty much the one bright spot for St. Louis's offense. I'm hoping that was just early jitters and that he gets over it, because he looked really lost, and the last thing we need is to struggle against TEs again this year.
I think Woodyard at the MLB is only going to last until Bradley is healthy enough to go again, at which point Wood will be back at the Will again.
Edit: Nevermind, forgot Bradley got IR'd. Looks like Woodyard might be there at least until Von returns and Irving isn't needed so much at SLB. Hopefully Irving plays well enough that the coaches will trust him as the starting MLB, because I'd rather have Von/Irving/Woodyard on the field than Von/Woodyard/Trevathan.
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moleculo
Footballguy
So today the sun shined a litter brighter, flowers smelled a little nicer, food tasted a little better.
The D is better than I was afraid it might be. I seriously was concerned about this game w/o Champ and Von, that seems silly now. It seems that Phillips is an adequate replacement for Doom - maybe even better because he seems more competent in the run game. Chris Harris continues to impress. Nacho was all over the field. WW and Danny T looked, for the most part, very good. DL did their job, keeping Rice/Pierce in check. DRC made his receiver invisible. I can't wait to see what this D can do with Von Miller and a healthy Champ Bailey.
Offensively - what needs to be said. I think it's now obvious that Manning has the best set of receivers in the league (Atlanta is debatable), and the best receivers of his career. Give Manning weapons like that, give him a little time, and records will fall. The up-tempo O made a huge difference too - I swear the Ravens looked beat in the 3rd quarter - tired, frustrated. Make them run around like that for 3 quarters and it's gonna be tough to compete in the 4th, especially at altitude.
Looking forward to seeing how well the show travels next week in NY.
The D is better than I was afraid it might be. I seriously was concerned about this game w/o Champ and Von, that seems silly now. It seems that Phillips is an adequate replacement for Doom - maybe even better because he seems more competent in the run game. Chris Harris continues to impress. Nacho was all over the field. WW and Danny T looked, for the most part, very good. DL did their job, keeping Rice/Pierce in check. DRC made his receiver invisible. I can't wait to see what this D can do with Von Miller and a healthy Champ Bailey.
Offensively - what needs to be said. I think it's now obvious that Manning has the best set of receivers in the league (Atlanta is debatable), and the best receivers of his career. Give Manning weapons like that, give him a little time, and records will fall. The up-tempo O made a huge difference too - I swear the Ravens looked beat in the 3rd quarter - tired, frustrated. Make them run around like that for 3 quarters and it's gonna be tough to compete in the 4th, especially at altitude.
Looking forward to seeing how well the show travels next week in NY.
Hoss Style
Footballguy
I'm most happy that our interior DLine looked stout. We need that.
BroncoFreak_2K3
sucker for Orange
They won't lose a home game if they continue the Up-tempo O, and I doubt they lose but one or 2 on the road as well. But at home, no team will be able to keep up with that pace. Very nice to have 2 quality over the middle threats now with Welker and JT. Hope it continues with JT. Kid is a beast.
BAL D was gassed that entire 2nd half. I think that trend will continue at all DEN home games.
I predicted at the beginning of the season Peyton would throw at least 60 TDs. This was a darn good start.
I too was pleasantly surprised with our D. I was a little worried when Woodyard went out with the injury, but glad to see it wasn't serious.
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moleculo
Footballguy
wow. Not much more needs to be said. Offense appears to be absolutely unstoppable. Defense looks more than adequate - top 5 in the league, especially once Von and Champ are in the line-up. Special teams is fantastic as well.
folks, this is shaping up to be a historic team. Enjoy every minute of it.
folks, this is shaping up to be a historic team. Enjoy every minute of it.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Things to take away about this team after last night's game:
-Ronnie Hillman sucks and should not see the field any time in the foreseeable future. I don't care how quick you look, if you fumble this much, especially in critical situations, you are a liability.
-The Broncos offensive line is definitely not the same without the starting center and left tackle. They can do enough most weeks to make do, but against teams that can get pressure with their front four, it is a problem. Both games against KC will be interesting since the Chiefs are great at getting to the quarterback.
-The lack of discipline the team showed last night was glaring. Have they gotten a little cocky because of the hot start? Maybe, but discipline is all on coaching, and John Fox has a lot of work to do in that regard.
-The defense stinks right now. They have allowed 87 points in their last two road games. I don't care how awesome an offense is, if you can't stop the other team from scoring, you aren't gonna win anything in the postseason. Jack Del Rio has a lot of work to do.
-Ronnie Hillman sucks and should not see the field any time in the foreseeable future. I don't care how quick you look, if you fumble this much, especially in critical situations, you are a liability.
-The Broncos offensive line is definitely not the same without the starting center and left tackle. They can do enough most weeks to make do, but against teams that can get pressure with their front four, it is a problem. Both games against KC will be interesting since the Chiefs are great at getting to the quarterback.
-The lack of discipline the team showed last night was glaring. Have they gotten a little cocky because of the hot start? Maybe, but discipline is all on coaching, and John Fox has a lot of work to do in that regard.
-The defense stinks right now. They have allowed 87 points in their last two road games. I don't care how awesome an offense is, if you can't stop the other team from scoring, you aren't gonna win anything in the postseason. Jack Del Rio has a lot of work to do.
You forgot the Right Tackle. I know Chris Clark got whupped on the safety, but I think the loss of Franklin might have been a bigger factor. When JT allowed the INT, he was on the right side helping out Vasquez. Also, I don't know what happened to Kuper, but he hasn't looked good in well over a year now. A lot of those failed runs up the middle boiled down to Kuper being unable to generate any push.
The defense wasn't good, by any means, but I also don't think they did too badly. They gave up an 11 yard touchdown "drive" after Holliday's fumble. They gave up two more touchdowns on drives that started on their own side of the field. After Peyton's INT, they held Indy to -3 yards on 3 plays before "giving up" the field goal. Plus, two of the points were via safety. That's 26 of Indy's 39 points right there. They held Indy to 5.3 yards per pass and 3.9 yards per rush (a number dramatically inflated by Luck's scrambles- 3.1 ypc on RB carries). They got a pair of sacks and a takeaway. They held Indy to 334 total yards. Again, I'm not saying they were great- notably, they had a couple of stupid penalties and the timing of their screw-ups was really poor, and Von Miller's impact on the pass rush was... underwhelming- but all-in-all it was a decent enough showing for a unit that's still without Woodyard and Champ Bailey.
I think the lion's share of the blame for yesterday falls on the pass protection, turnovers, and stupid penalties. Hell, take away either the Hillman fumble or the Manning INT, and I think Denver still manages to pull out a road victory against a top AFC squad. I really believed up until the moment of the INT that Denver was still going to pull it out.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
A lot of that is probably true, but my confidence in this team is definitely not what it was a month ago. I think the porous defensive effort against Dallas combined with the shakiness of the o-line is probably why. I don't care how awesome your passing game is, bad o-line play and bad defense is not on the menu for winning in the postseason.
moleculo
Footballguy
I was very pleased to see the defense return to form yesterday. That was championship quality D. They gave up one drive, which accounted for 95 of Washington's 266 total yards. I'm not sure who is having a bigger impact on the D right now - Von Miller of Wesley Woodyard.
There were some mistakes offensively, but the D kept Washington in check and even got the ball back after Manning's picks.
With Von back, this team is allowing 5.3 passing y/a, 53% completion rate, and a QB rating of 62.4. These metrics would be best in the league if sustained over the whole season. A pretty dramatic improvement.
Lots of guys got dinged up yesterday - Nacho, JT, Harris, plus some other key guys nursing some injuries in Manning, Franklin, Woodyard, and Champ. The bye week couldn't come at a better time. We have a tough 4 game stretch coming up, need everyone at full health.
The next 5 weeks will determine who gets to play at home in the playoffs.
There were some mistakes offensively, but the D kept Washington in check and even got the ball back after Manning's picks.
With Von back, this team is allowing 5.3 passing y/a, 53% completion rate, and a QB rating of 62.4. These metrics would be best in the league if sustained over the whole season. A pretty dramatic improvement.
Lots of guys got dinged up yesterday - Nacho, JT, Harris, plus some other key guys nursing some injuries in Manning, Franklin, Woodyard, and Champ. The bye week couldn't come at a better time. We have a tough 4 game stretch coming up, need everyone at full health.
The next 5 weeks will determine who gets to play at home in the playoffs.
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Mile High
Footballguy
The Denver Broncos game scheduled for Nov. 17 against the 8-0 and division rival Kansas City Chiefs has been moved from 2:05 p.m. to a 6:30 p.m. primetime game on NBC, the NFL announced on Friday.
Joan Niesen previously reported that CBS has protected this game and the other one in Kansas City on Dec. 1 from being rescheduled to NBC’s Sunday night game. The Dec. 1 game is — as of now — still set for 11 a.m. It’s not immediately clear what changed.
The Broncos will play in primetime the following weekend, too, on Sunday against the New England Patriots at 6:30 p.m. on the road, also on NBC.
“We were informed by the league that this change was made to ensure the largest possible television audience would see the Broncos’ game against the Chiefs,” Broncos spokesman Patrick Smyth said. “Teams can play a maximum of six primetime games, which is what the Broncos are now set to play. This won’t have any impact on our Sunday Night Football game scheduled at New England the following week.”
Joan Niesen previously reported that CBS has protected this game and the other one in Kansas City on Dec. 1 from being rescheduled to NBC’s Sunday night game. The Dec. 1 game is — as of now — still set for 11 a.m. It’s not immediately clear what changed.
The Broncos will play in primetime the following weekend, too, on Sunday against the New England Patriots at 6:30 p.m. on the road, also on NBC.
“We were informed by the league that this change was made to ensure the largest possible television audience would see the Broncos’ game against the Chiefs,” Broncos spokesman Patrick Smyth said. “Teams can play a maximum of six primetime games, which is what the Broncos are now set to play. This won’t have any impact on our Sunday Night Football game scheduled at New England the following week.”
Hearing the second Den/KC game is also likely to be moved to the 4:25 EST time slot to maximize the audience.
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Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Following last night's win over the Chiefs, here is how I see things now:
-The Broncos should win their last four games.
-Beating KC in two weeks is far more important than beating the Patriots next week. A win over KC in two weeks would likely guarantee a division title, unless the Chiefs win out, the Broncos lose to the Patriots, and the Broncos get upset by someone in December.
-If the Broncos win at KC in two weeks, and then win their last four, they are guaranteed a bye, and would get home field unless the Patriots win out and also go 14-2, which would give NE home field by virtue of the win next week.
-But winning the division is the first goal, hence them winning at KC being more important than beating at NE. Granted, I'd love to win both, but if they can only win one, let it be the KC game.
-If the Broncos lose both, they are likely looking at a wild card, the 5 seed.
-The Broncos should win their last four games.
-Beating KC in two weeks is far more important than beating the Patriots next week. A win over KC in two weeks would likely guarantee a division title, unless the Chiefs win out, the Broncos lose to the Patriots, and the Broncos get upset by someone in December.
-If the Broncos win at KC in two weeks, and then win their last four, they are guaranteed a bye, and would get home field unless the Patriots win out and also go 14-2, which would give NE home field by virtue of the win next week.
-But winning the division is the first goal, hence them winning at KC being more important than beating at NE. Granted, I'd love to win both, but if they can only win one, let it be the KC game.
-If the Broncos lose both, they are likely looking at a wild card, the 5 seed.
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Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Another thing: I am gonna run myself headfirst into a wall if the coaching staff doesn't instill some discipline into the defense. The stupid penalties, like the one that led to KC's first TD last night, have got to stop.
For the most part, penalties don't bug me. Most of the time, penalties are just indicators of aggressive play. For every time a lineman gets called for holding, there might be two more where he held and got away with it. In the end, the negative of the penalty is offset by the benefit of the borderline play the rest of the time. Same thing with offsides penalties. What is an offsides this time might well be a perfectly timed jump next time, resulting in a strip-sack. On the whole, the risk is worth the reward. Plus, in the case of PI and offensive holding, a lot of times the penalty is a lot better than the outcome of the play would be if the penalty was never committed.
There are, however, a few penalties that are the exception. Most dead-ball penalties, any procedural penalties on offense (illegal formation, illegal shift, etc), delay of game, and the like. These are penalties that don't really have an upside, that don't serve as a marker for productively aggressive play, and that don't ever provide more value than the counterfactual where the penalty had not been committed. These penalties are truly inexcusable, and need to be cleaned up. Nacho's taunting penalty most definitely falls into this category. Inexcusable. Clean it up.
Hoss Style
Footballguy
Hoss Style
Footballguy
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Mile High
Footballguy
Not sure he is out for the year yet. They said it could have caused loss of a limb or even death.
Buffaloes
Footballguy
big ones looming the next 2 weeks. I agree that the score of next week's game isn't as important given NE's loss tonight, but they are the best team on the schedule and a good barometer for where the Broncos stand. An angry NE team, hostile environment, possibly in the cold and under the lights. I think NE is a much better team than KC and this week's game will be a very good test.
The KC game in 2 weeks looms large. If Denver can take care of business against KC, I agree they should be able to take care of their final 4 games and could have a favorable position heading into the playoffs. Hopefully Rahim is going to be ok. That's scary.
I was very impressed with last night's gameplan coupled with the OL's play and Manning's ability to slide out of trouble. It was nice getting through a game without Manning getting hit hard.
The KC game in 2 weeks looms large. If Denver can take care of business against KC, I agree they should be able to take care of their final 4 games and could have a favorable position heading into the playoffs. Hopefully Rahim is going to be ok. That's scary.
I was very impressed with last night's gameplan coupled with the OL's play and Manning's ability to slide out of trouble. It was nice getting through a game without Manning getting hit hard.
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Ghost Rider
Footballguy
The game against KC is far more important, especially in light of tonight's loss by the Patriots. I don't expect the Broncos to win both, and the Patriots rarely lose two in a row, so I expect the Broncos to lose in New England next week, but bounce back and sneak out a win in KC.
Buffaloes
Footballguy
I could see that. A December win in Arrowhead is never easy, but if they can put together a solid effort similar to last night they can pull off the sweep.
I would anticipate anywhere between a 60% and a 66% chance of winning either of the next two games, which would translate into somewhere between a 36% and 44% chance of winning both. So, rightfully favored in each of the next two games, but an underdog to win them both.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
The Broncos are 1-point favorites in New England next week as of now. That line shocks me, given the Broncos struggles there in recent years. I know that this year's team is the best Broncos team since 1998, and the Patriots haven't quite been themselves, but winning at NE is still a tall order for any team.
BRONG
FOR A LIMITED TIME ONLY
ffldrew
Footballguy
I had a buddy who was our keeper in soccer and got kicked in the back of the thigh/hamstring and had this - it went down his leg and up his back. He couldn't play for 2 years.
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Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Some amazing numbers about the Broncos since the start of the 2012 season:
-22-5 overall record
-Their only five losses are to teams that last year won 14, 13, 13 and 14 games, and this year to a team that is currently 7-3. These Broncos do not lose to bad teams or even average teams.
-Not only do they not lose to bad or average teams, they kick the #### out of them most of the time. 16 of those 22 wins are against teams that were under .500 last year or are currently under .500 this year, and the average margin of victory in those 16 wins is 17.6, with 12 of those wins being by double digits, and only one of them being by 7 points or less (the 30-23 win against San Diego last year, a game where the Chargers score a TD in the waning seconds to make the score look closer than the game was).
-Their six wins against teams .500 or better are 31-19 vs. 8-8 Pittsburgh, 31-23 at 10-6 Cincinnati, 34-17 at 10-6 Baltimore, 52-20 vs. 6-5 Philadelphia, 51-48 at 5-5 Dallas, and 27-17 vs. 9-1 Kansas City.
-22-5 overall record
-Their only five losses are to teams that last year won 14, 13, 13 and 14 games, and this year to a team that is currently 7-3. These Broncos do not lose to bad teams or even average teams.
-Not only do they not lose to bad or average teams, they kick the #### out of them most of the time. 16 of those 22 wins are against teams that were under .500 last year or are currently under .500 this year, and the average margin of victory in those 16 wins is 17.6, with 12 of those wins being by double digits, and only one of them being by 7 points or less (the 30-23 win against San Diego last year, a game where the Chargers score a TD in the waning seconds to make the score look closer than the game was).
-Their six wins against teams .500 or better are 31-19 vs. 8-8 Pittsburgh, 31-23 at 10-6 Cincinnati, 34-17 at 10-6 Baltimore, 52-20 vs. 6-5 Philadelphia, 51-48 at 5-5 Dallas, and 27-17 vs. 9-1 Kansas City.
moleculo
Footballguy
LuckyOne
Footballguy
I'm not excited about Huff at all. He has consistently been below average and leveraged being selected high in the 1st to raise his stock. Hopefully, he'll be depth they never need.
Mile High
Footballguy
moleculo
Footballguy
Thats Good Broncos review of Chiefs game
Note: contains some salty language and touches on some adult themes.
Note: contains some salty language and touches on some adult themes.
Anyone know what Manning's record is when facing a team 2+ times in the same season? Basically thinking about divisional opponents. I would think his record would be very good after seeing what a team does once then getting a 2nd chance to prepare for them.
moleculo
Footballguy
Denver Post:
look for Broncos to swing more conservative, starting this week. So long scoring record!
need2know
Footballguy
I'll believe it when I see it. If they want to continue winning, it aint going to be because of the running game
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
It is simple: until the coaching staff cleans these fumbles up, this team, as great as it is, won't win the Super Bowl. You can't win the Super Bowl when you are giving away crucial fumbles against good teams.
Mile High
Footballguy
Keith Lewis
Footballguy
Manning chokes when the pressure is high.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
It's not just the running backs. The returner Holliday has had some costly fumbles this season, as well, including tonight's which led to the DRC injury (although DRC is a complete idiot for diving for that ball when there was no need to intercept the pass since the half was ending anyway).
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Sad truth: the Broncos defense, despite getting better for a short bit in the middle of the season, stinks, and good luck winning it all with a defense this porous.
Basically, the offense is gonna have to play lights out in every playoff game for them to win it, and considering smart coaches can find ways to at least slow the Broncos offense down at times, if the defense doesn't drastically turn things around, this Broncos team will be watching the Super Bowl on television.
Basically, the offense is gonna have to play lights out in every playoff game for them to win it, and considering smart coaches can find ways to at least slow the Broncos offense down at times, if the defense doesn't drastically turn things around, this Broncos team will be watching the Super Bowl on television.
moleculo
Footballguy
This article pretty much captures where I am right now:
If Peyton Manning isn’t great, the 2013 Denver Broncos won’t be either
If Peyton Manning isn’t great, the 2013 Denver Broncos won’t be either
