2016-17 NBA Thread: Finals are over, please go away (2 Viewers)

[Charlie Harper]

I think it's interesting that before the game Kerr took some criticism from Nate Duncan (among others) for sticking with his regular-season rotation and not playing his best players enough. Namely sticking with Pachulia and Ian Clark and only playing the death lineup for a total of something like 17 minutes over the first four games. Kerr responded that the death lineup was an "in case of emergency break glass" kind of adjustment and he was again criticized for waiting until the team was behind to make changes. Coach Brown was lauded for being more aggresive.

This game David West played more than Zaza and they played without a center for the majority of the game. McCaw took Clark's minutes (the second most off the bench, even more than Livingston) and Iguodala played 38 huge minutes.

I don't know if Nate Duncan's criticism specifically had anything to do with it but I'll applaud Kerr once again for being willing to listen and make those changes proactively. I think if the Warriors stuck with their earlier strategy they may have lost the game and with that maybe the series. These teams were closer than 4-1 makes it look.

I believe Kerr is smart enough to know who his weak links are, but I think drifting from the regular season rotation goes against Kerr's philosophy of how basketball should be played so he only does it as last resort. He wants every player on that team to feel committed and a part of the unit. I don't think we would see the Warriors as we know them (a team that plays unselfishly and with great joy), if he just rode the death lineup to victories. 

By sticking with the regular season rotation until necessary Kerr shows his confidence in his team and what they accomplished through out the season. That way when he asks them to take a step back like he did with Clark and McGee they accept it. It's the same reason why he doesn't spam the Curry/Durant PnR.....it's because Kerr truly believes it is best for the team to share the rock as much as possible.

So while it's easy to say Kerr should shorten his rotation, run the Death Lineup 40+ minutes, and go mismatch hunting....people have to realize Kerr isn't just controlling NBA players like a video game. Kerr is dealing with grown men with egos and he uses the rotation and play calling as tools necessary to form the cohesive and beautiful basketball team that we see.

 

[bananafish]

I believe Kerr is smart enough to know who his weak links are, but I think drifting from the regular season rotation goes against Kerr's philosophy of how basketball should be played so he only does it as last resort. He wants every player on that team to feel committed and a part of the unit. I don't think we would see the Warriors as we know them (a team that plays unselfishly and with great joy), if he just rode the death lineup to victories. 

By sticking with the regular season rotation until necessary Kerr shows his confidence in his team and what they accomplished through out the season. That way when he asks them to take a step back like he did with Clark and McGee they accept it. It's the same reason why he doesn't spam the Curry/Durant PnR.....it's because Kerr truly believes it is best for the team to share the rock as much as possible.

So while it's easy to say Kerr should shorten his rotation, run the Death Lineup 40+ minutes, and go mismatch hunting....people have to realize Kerr isn't just controlling NBA players like a video game. Kerr is dealing with grown men with egos and he uses the rotation and play calling as tools necessary to form the cohesive and beautiful basketball team that we see.

I don't disagree with this but he played Maurice Speights and freakin' Anderson Varejao significant minutes in Game 7 last year, a game which they lost by 4 points. An adjustment was necessary and he made it this time.

 

[Gr00vus]

GOAT

The impressive thing to me was he played 47 minutes tonight, and he was pretty much the only thing they had going for the last 6 minutes of the 4th besides some J.R. 3s.

This Warriors team is far beyond anything since maybe the Celtic dynasty of the 50's/60's in terms of how much talent is concentrated on one team. They just beat an excellent Cavs team, mercilessly exploiting every weakness the Cavs had. There was nowhere for guys like Korver and Williams to hide. It's really phenomenal, but the league is going to be pretty non-competitive while this squad is together. Maybe if James made it over to the Clippers (if they could stay healthy and get rid of Doc Rivers) or Spurs things would be interesting again.

 

[wilked]

I don't believe I've played for a superteam. I don't believe in that.

glad to see that the team at The Onion never sleeps, great work from them as always 

 

[Insein]

Lebron to the Wolves would make a lot of sense for both sides. 

This is what I come to this thread for in June.

 

[Weebs210]

 ANOTHER finals loss for your boy lol.

ANOTHER non fmvp for your boy lol.

 

[MarvinTScamper]

So ESPN fires a bunch of their top reporters, then parent #abc sends a washed up school teacher to ask post game questions. #NBAFinals2017

that was the worst floor/postgame/celebration interviewing I have seen in 5-6 years.

 

[thecatch]

Lebron to the Wolves would make a lot of sense for both sides. 

An old guy like that taking up all of our cap space? No thanks. 

 

[Frostillicus]

This is what I come to this thread for in June.

An old guy like that taking up all of our cap space? No thanks. 

Already starting to feel like home in here again.

 

[MarvinTScamper]

An old guy like that taking up all of our cap space? No thanks. 

Joe Smith down?

 

[Capella]

/sweeps the floor. Gets out the mop for all the vomit and hot takes. 

 

[MarvinTScamper]

I think if Lebron, Curry and KD got together, they'd be pretty good

I'm really proud of our Warriors, @joet

 

[MattFancy]

So we'll see these same 2 teams next year, right?

 

[Insein]

So we'll see these same 2 teams next year, right?

Doubt Cleveland will be the same except for Lebron and Kyrie.

 

[Jayrok]

/sweeps the floor. Gets out the mop for all the vomit and hot takes. 

The clock struck midnight for Kyrie Irving during the 4th quarter when his last bit of energy spilled out onto the floor along with his bag of magic handles.  Too tired to give chase, he could only stand there and watch as the ball, along with his hope and dreams of a repeat, slowly roll off his leg and out of bounds... just out of his reach.  

 

[msudaisy26]

Doubt Cleveland will be the same except for Lebron and Kyrie.

What teams are out there that actually want Love and what would they give up to get him? I think the Rockets would want him, but not sure they have what the Cavs want. 

 

[bananafish]

So we'll see these same 2 teams next year, right?

I'm obviously biased, but I don't see anything wrong with that.

This was some of the best basketball I've seen in my lifetime, at least since the Jordan years. I think the Cavs/Warriors years could be just as enjoyable as those were if not more so.

The Celtics could also make it interesting in the East, they will have a very, very interesting off-season. If the Rockets could figure out a way to get Gordon Heyward that would make them contenders as well.

 

[BroncoFreak_2K3]

I'm obviously biased, but I don't see anything wrong with that.

This was some of the best basketball I've seen in my lifetime, at least since the Jordan years. I think the Cavs/Warriors years could be just as enjoyable as those were if not more so.

totally agree

 

[Short Corner]

Doubt Cleveland will be the same except for Lebron and Kyrie.

I would try and deal Kyrie.  Highest trade value and really seems to lack some basketball sense that should be inate, ie blowing thru that 2 for 1 in game 3 and letting guys run by him as last man back in transition.

Other than that, they don't have many assets to give when the rest of the league seems to be in wait out the Warriors mode.

 

[TobiasFunke]

I'm obviously biased, but I don't see anything wrong with that.

This was some of the best basketball I've seen in my lifetime, at least since the Jordan years. I think the Cavs/Warriors years could be just as enjoyable as those were if not more so.

The Celtics could also make it interesting in the East, they will have a very, very interesting off-season. If the Rockets could figure out a way to get Gordon Heyward that would make them contenders as well.

If there is something wrong with the current and likely future situation, it's not what it produced over the last two weeks.  It's what it meant/will mean for the seven months that precede it. 

Unrelated- the Finals were kinda dull IMO.The Warriors are remarkable and so is LeBron, and it's close to being an interesting matchup, but it was never really in doubt and it's going to get worse with LeBron at 32 and none of the Warriors' stars older than 29.

 

[Jayrok]

Unbelievable team they have there in SF.  Good series but would have been better had Cleveland won game 3.  

Happy for Durant.  Best offensive player in the world.  It doesn't always work when a superstar joins a team of stars.  His addition was seamless, a tribute to their unselfish play.  

Cavs need to step up and sign one or two to match that talent before their (and Lebron's) window slams shut.  

 

[Jayrod]

The clock struck midnight for Kyrie Irving during the 4th quarter when his last bit of energy spilled out onto the floor along with his bag of magic handles.  Too tired to give chase, he could only stand there and watch as the ball, along with his hope and dreams of a repeat, slowly roll off his leg and out of bounds... just out of his reach.  

Straight-lava-fire

 

[Jayrod]

I was so angry after the game last night that I just turned it off with a minute to go.  Still pretty annoyed.

I'm mad at Tristan Thompson for waiting until game 4 to show up.  I'm mad at Kevin Love for playing poorly for half the series.  I'm mad at the NBA for having ####### rules in place that allowed KD to go to the GSW.  And I'm still mad at Zaza for injuring Leonard in the Spurs series.

For some reason I found myself yelling at the TV almost the whole series.  Yelling at the Cavs players, yelling at Zaza and Draymond for being jackasses, yelling at the refs for letting players set illegal screens and letting everyone just grab and hold.  I'm glad its finally over and I can stop letting this sham of a game effect my mood every 3rd day.

 

[MattFancy]

I'm obviously biased, but I don't see anything wrong with that.

This was some of the best basketball I've seen in my lifetime, at least since the Jordan years. I think the Cavs/Warriors years could be just as enjoyable as those were if not more so.

The Celtics could also make it interesting in the East, they will have a very, very interesting off-season. If the Rockets could figure out a way to get Gordon Heyward that would make them contenders as well.

I don't think so either. I just don't really see any other teams being able to take down these 2. I'm not sure anyone in the West can take down Golden State. San Antonio probably has the best shot, but I wouldn't bet on it.

As for the East, Boston is really the only threat to Cleveland. As long as Cleveland has LeBron, they're going to run the East.

 

[bananafish]

Looks like exactly zero Warriors will be visiting Trump in the White House. @TobiasFunke has to like that at least.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/06/13/warriors-will-skip-white-house-visit/

 

[MarvinTScamper]

I was so angry after the game last night that I just turned it off with a minute to go.  Still pretty annoyed.

I'm mad at Tristan Thompson for waiting until game 4 to show up.  I'm mad at Kevin Love for playing poorly for half the series.  I'm mad at the NBA for having ####### rules in place that allowed KD to go to the GSW.  And I'm still mad at Zaza for injuring Leonard in the Spurs series.

For some reason I found myself yelling at the TV almost the whole series.  Yelling at the Cavs players, yelling at Zaza and Draymond for being jackasses, yelling at the refs for letting players set illegal screens and letting everyone just grab and hold.  I'm glad its finally over and I can stop letting this sham of a game effect my mood every 3rd day.

lol

 

[Capella]

I was so angry after the game last night that I just turned it off with a minute to go.  Still pretty annoyed.

I'm mad at Tristan Thompson for waiting until game 4 to show up.  I'm mad at Kevin Love for playing poorly for half the series.  I'm mad at the NBA for having ####### rules in place that allowed KD to go to the GSW.  And I'm still mad at Zaza for injuring Leonard in the Spurs series.

For some reason I found myself yelling at the TV almost the whole series.  Yelling at the Cavs players, yelling at Zaza and Draymond for being jackasses, yelling at the refs for letting players set illegal screens and letting everyone just grab and hold.  I'm glad its finally over and I can stop letting this sham of a game effect my mood every 3rd day.

why be so mad over this 

 

[BroncoFreak_2K3]

I was so angry after the game last night that I just turned it off with a minute to go.  Still pretty annoyed.

I'm mad at Tristan Thompson for waiting until game 4 to show up.  I'm mad at Kevin Love for playing poorly for half the series.  I'm mad at the NBA for having ####### rules in place that allowed KD to go to the GSW.  And I'm still mad at Zaza for injuring Leonard in the Spurs series.

For some reason I found myself yelling at the TV almost the whole series.  Yelling at the Cavs players, yelling at Zaza and Draymond for being jackasses, yelling at the refs for letting players set illegal screens and letting everyone just grab and hold.  I'm glad its finally over and I can stop letting this sham of a game effect my mood every 3rd day.

yeesh 

 

[Jayrod]

why be so mad over this 

I don't know.  I think it is just something I used to thoroughly enjoy that I feel has been taken from me.

I've got a counselling appointment scheduled today to help me through it.  Don't worry, guys, I'll be fine.

 

[Dentist]

Well, the best team won, which is what makes the NBA great.. no other league consistently gets their best team to win a title like the NBA.

Having said that,  I'm not even sure how I feel about a sport whereby the winner is all but certain before the season even starts.   I'm impressed that Cleveland got a game off of them and made another one fairly close.   I'm not entirely sure how this Warriors team lost as many games as it did during the season.. feels like they should've been 80-2.

Even men's tennis seems to have more variance than today's NBA whereby superstars can somehow align together and form these superteams.

I mean I realize he got a ring, but is Durant really that jazzed about said ring?  I mean instead of truly winning it, it felt more like "well, at least I didn't screw it up"

On the other side of the coin it felt like LeBron was playing well enough that sans-Durant he might have knocked that GS team out again.

 

[MarvinTScamper]

I don't know.  I think it is just something I used to thoroughly enjoy that I feel has been taken from me.

I've got a counselling appointment scheduled today to help me through it.  Don't worry, guys, I'll be fine.

WHEW!

This is how I read your post, from a hockey watching perspective.

"I'm mad at the players needing skates.  I hate that there is ice on the floor.  I hate that there are guys in front of the net trying to stop the puck.  I don't like them carrying sticks.  WHO ARE THESE GUYS IN THE BLACK/WHITE STRIPES GETTING IN THE WAY!  I can't believe I watch this.  WHY IS THIS ONLY DURING WINTER!?!?!"

Everything you said is exactly what I fully expect when I watch the NBA.

 

[Capella]

I don't know.  I think it is just something I used to thoroughly enjoy that I feel has been taken from me.

I've got a counselling appointment scheduled today to help me through it.  Don't worry, guys, I'll be fine.

Games 3-5 were some of the best basketball I've ever seen. Not sure how a hoops fan couldn't enjoy that.

 

[Scoresman]

Well, the best team won, which is what makes the NBA great.. no other league consistently gets their best team to win a title like the NBA.

Having said that,  I'm not even sure how I feel about a sport whereby the winner is all but certain before the season even starts.   I'm impressed that Cleveland got a game off of them and made another one fairly close.   I'm not entirely sure how this Warriors team lost as many games as it did during the season.. feels like they should've been 80-2.

Even men's tennis seems to have more variance than today's NBA whereby superstars can somehow align together and form these superteams.

I mean I realize he got a ring, but is Durant really that jazzed about said ring?  I mean instead of truly winning it, it felt more like "well, at least I didn't screw it up"

On the other side of the coin it felt like LeBron was playing well enough that sans-Durant he might have knocked that GS team out again.

So what's the maximum talent level on a team for you to say a player has "truly won it?"  How are we defining this?

 

[wikkidpissah]

I was so angry after the game last night that I just turned it off with a minute to go.  Still pretty annoyed.

I'm mad at Tristan Thompson for waiting until game 4 to show up.  I'm mad at Kevin Love for playing poorly for half the series.  I'm mad at the NBA for having ####### rules in place that allowed KD to go to the GSW.  And I'm still mad at Zaza for injuring Leonard in the Spurs series.

For some reason I found myself yelling at the TV almost the whole series.  Yelling at the Cavs players, yelling at Zaza and Draymond for being jackasses, yelling at the refs for letting players set illegal screens and letting everyone just grab and hold.  I'm glad its finally over and I can stop letting this sham of a game effect my mood every 3rd day.

A magnanimous King would have made sure Love got both a corner trey and a faketrey drive early in each game for all his gruntwork low and Tris got an alleyoop or dramatic putback and JR & Kyle got dey rhythm pops right off but, when there's doubt, nobody in The Land actually matters but the King. Mightn't have made a difference but it is the difference.

 

[Jayrod]

Games 3-5 were some of the best basketball I've ever seen. Not sure how a hoops fan couldn't enjoy that.

I guess I just felt like the whole thing was unfair.  Like it was the Western Conference All-stars vs the Cleveland Cavaliers.  It was also magnified by the injury to Kawhi Leonard, which stole away a series I had really looked forward to.

The basketball was pretty good for the most part, though.  Just frustrating to think there was nothing that the Cavs could do to even stand a chance of winning even 2 of the 5 games.

 

[Capella]

A magnanimous King would have made sure Love got both a corner trey and a faketrey drive early in each game for all his gruntwork low and Tris got an alleyoop or dramatic putback and JR & Kyle got dey rhythm pops right off but, when there's doubt, nobody in The Land actually matters but the King. Mightn't have made a difference but it is the difference.

 ? ??????????????????????????????

 

[wikkidpissah]

 ? ??????????????????????????????

Mom! Capella put lil rabbit poops all over my post. MOOOOooommmm!!

 

[MarvinTScamper]

the whole "my poor Cavs" angle is odd.   It's just the last "Superteam"   They don't deserve any sympathy, and they'd do the EXACT same thing, if given the chance.

 

[Capella]

Mom! Capella put lil rabbit poops all over my post. MOOOOooommmm!!

I'm not surprised you don't have emojis. 

 

[culdeus]

Kobe has had a few years off. Would he take the minimum to join the Cavs. 

 

[Nigel]

Games 3-5 were some of the best basketball I've ever seen. Not sure how a hoops fan couldn't enjoy that.

This is true but for me the two week payoff wasn't worth slogging through a meaningless regular season/three playoff rounds. Seedlings don't matter, these two teams will rest their stars even more next year, and we'll do it again next June. Not sure how to fix it but it's a problem for the league. 

 

[RokNRole]

So what's the maximum talent level on a team for you to say a player has "truly won it?"  How are we defining this?

If you don't win the team that drafted you then it doesn't really count.

 

[Jayrod]

the whole "my poor Cavs" angle is odd.   It's just the last "Superteam"   They don't deserve any sympathy, and they'd do the EXACT same thing, if given the chance.

The sad part is, is that I'm not a Cavs fan.  I rooted against them in the Celtics series and I'd have rooted against them vs. the Spurs.  For some reason, starting last year, I've come to absolutely hate the Warriors.  Maybe because of all of the crap they talked about beating the Cavs 2 years ago and then there run to 73 wins...I don't know, I just don't like the Warriors and find myself way too emotionally invested in the whole thing.

 

[RokNRole]

I guess I just felt like the whole thing was unfair.  Like it was the Western Conference All-stars vs the Cleveland Cavaliers.  It was also magnified by the injury to Kawhi Leonard, which stole away a series I had really looked forward to.

The basketball was pretty good for the most part, though.  Just frustrating to think there was nothing that the Cavs could do to even stand a chance of winning even 2 of the 5 games.

You should play NBA 2k bro. You can manage all 30 teams moves in franchise. You can sim the games and if things aren't going the way you want you can jump in and take control of the players so no funny business happens.

 

[Jayrod]

You should play NBA 2k bro. You can manage all 30 teams moves in franchise. You can sim the games and if things aren't going the way you want you can jump in and take control of the players so no funny business happens.

Good point.  Maybe this is why I'm not really a fan of any teams except for the St. Louis Cards and I don't even watch baseball anymore.  I hate the lack of control over something I care about...so I just don't care.  For some reason the NBA sucked me in over the last few years and I started actually rooting for teams.

I've now decided to push them all away.  I can't be hurt again if I never let them in.

 

[RokNRole]

Good point.  Maybe this is why I'm not really a fan of any teams except for the St. Louis Cards and I don't even watch baseball anymore.  I hate the lack of control over something I care about...so I just don't care.  For some reason the NBA sucked me in over the last few years and I started actually rooting for teams.

I've now decided to push them all away.  I can't be hurt again if I never let them in.

When your kid starts playing sports are you going to be THAT dad?

 

[Bobcat10]

the whole "my poor Cavs" angle is odd.   It's just the last "Superteam"   They don't deserve any sympathy, and they'd do the EXACT same thing, if given the chance.

Right, the 73 win Warriors needed to go get Durant to beat the Cavs.  If that wasn't glaring during the series I'm not sure what people were watching.  The Cavs will now do whatever they can this offseason to beat the Warriors next year.  Or maybe nothing and give it another run with what they have, it's not like this series was as lopsided as many think.  We'd very likely be staring at an epic game 7 if game 3 didn't turn in the last couple minutes.  Props to the Warriors for gritting that game out, turned out to be huge.  It could have even been totally different last night if Durant was called for his 3rd foul when he drilled Lebron in the head early in the 2nd quarter.  Sometimes you just need a few big breaks like that to prevail.

 

[Bobcat10]

The sad part is, is that I'm not a Cavs fan.  I rooted against them in the Celtics series and I'd have rooted against them vs. the Spurs.  For some reason, starting last year, I've come to absolutely hate the Warriors.  Maybe because of all of the crap they talked about beating the Cavs 2 years ago and then there run to 73 wins...I don't know, I just don't like the Warriors and find myself way too emotionally invested in the whole thing.

They are a very unlikable group if you aren't from the Bay or a bandwagon jumper.  Your therapist should be done with you in about 5 minutes today.

 

[need2know]

I just want to thank the NBA and espn/abc for putting up one of the most boring playoff seasons in any sport I have ever seen.  

There were only a handful of games, really just a handful of moments, that were interesting or went against what was predicted.

Can't really blame anybody it's a group effort.  Really sad.  I hope some young teams mature and get good fast.

 

[Bull Dozier]

the whole "my poor Cavs" angle is odd.   It's just the last "Superteam"   They don't deserve any sympathy, and they'd do the EXACT same thing, if given the chance.

I have to go back and keep score, but are all the same people hating on Durant for joining a "super team" that just lost the finals, the same people speculating and indicating no issue at all with the Cavs adding Paul George, or whoever?  Or is Cleveland adding a superstar OK because they didn't do as good of a job managing their cap so they actually have to give up a piece of some value to fit their new star on their roster?

?