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2021 Buffalo Bills - Same as it ever was*** (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter GroveDiesel
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GroveDiesel
Footballguy
flysack
Footballguy
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
flysack
Footballguy
True enough. That team got hit by a plague this year, and if it exposed something about Cam, it's that he just isn't a leader who can gut it out (like Rodgers), he tends to fall with the team.
I can see why the Bills would be interested in Dorsey though. His experience would do a lot to help a guy like Tyrod (if Tyrod stays). Hell, Tyrod is basically a less accurate half size Cam Newton.
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Tommy Collins
Footballguy
The connection is that they worked together for 4 years there. But, if he were sold on Dorsey this entire time, why has he taken so long to hire him? Other than concerns about his ability to be OC, the only thing I can think of is that they're looking to assemble a very experienced staff and Dorsey hasn't been coaching that long.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Probably my least favorite hire so far. He's directly linked to Kubiak for pretty much his entire career, hasn't had much playcalling duties it seems, and the offenses have never been all that impressive. I would much rather have seen a guy like Dorsey be given the reins.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
Sounds like a guy who is suited to coordinating a run-heavy offense with a good but not great QB. *ahem*
Super King
Footballguy
He had the 8th, 10th, and 9th OFF rankings '10-'12 with the Texans. Better than Greg Olsen...
Buffaloes
Footballguy
Bronco fan, but I root for the Bills pretty much whenever they don't play Denver. that said, Rico might be a nice guy and all that, but I don't understad this hire. it's the general understanding that even though he was OC he didn't call plays. he was largely seen as a guy Kubes brought with him because they were buds. I don't know what your O will look like, but I have a feeling it will be reminiscent to the 1990s Broncos offenses, which were very good at the time, but without much innovation since then. I hope I'm wrong, but the memories of 5 to 7 step drops out of empty back sets with no help from TE or RB behind the worst OL in the league is still fesh in my mind.
as far as the offensive ranks, it has widely been assumed that it was Kubiak's show. Like I said, I think Dennison is probably a really good guy. he''s incredibly smart (engineering degree) and he's a loyal guy. he's a former LB turned ST coordinator, OL coach, QB coach, and OC--I think he was probably miscast as the latter 2.
I hope I'm wrong here, but Bronco fans pretty much across the board are shocked he's an OC for another team.
as far as the offensive ranks, it has widely been assumed that it was Kubiak's show. Like I said, I think Dennison is probably a really good guy. he''s incredibly smart (engineering degree) and he's a loyal guy. he's a former LB turned ST coordinator, OL coach, QB coach, and OC--I think he was probably miscast as the latter 2.
I hope I'm wrong here, but Bronco fans pretty much across the board are shocked he's an OC for another team.
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Tommy Collins
Footballguy
It's tough to look at 2015 & 2016 as an indicator of what this offense could look like. In 2015 Kubiak was the HC and the offense didn't mesh well with Peyton's skillset. Peyton also dramatically declined in that last year. Then in 2016 they ended up with Trevor Siemian and Paxton Lynch. So both of those situations weren't great. They're also recent enough that nobody needs a reminder as to what happened on those offenses.GroveDiesel said:
Here are his prior stints as OC:
Denver Broncos
2006:
Jake Plummer: 55.2%, 1,994 Yards, 11 TDs, 13 INT (Started 11 games)
Jay Cutler: 59.1%, 1,001 Yards, 9 TDs, 5 INT (Started 5 games)
Tatum Bell: 1,025 Yards, 4.4 YPC, 2 TDs, 24 Receptions, 115 Yards, 0 TDs (Started 13 games)
Mike Bell: 666 Yards, 4.3 YPC, 8 TDs, 20 Receptions, 158 Yards, 0 TDs (Started 3 games)
Javon Walker: 69 Receptions, 1,084 Yards, 8 TDs
Rod Smith: 52 Receptions, 512 Yards, 3 TDs
*Ranked 17th in points scored
2007:
Jay Cutler: 63.6%, 3,497 Yards, 20 TDs, 14 INT
Selvin Young: 729 Yards, 5.2 YPC, 1 TD, 35 Receptions, 231 Yards, 0 TDs (Started 8 games)
Travis Henry: 691 Yards, 4.1 YPC, 4 TDs, 7 Receptions, 65 Yards, 0 TDs (Started 7 games)
Brandon Marshall: 102 Receptions, 1,325 Yards, 7 TDs
Tony Scheffler: 49 Receptions, 549 Yards, 5 TDs (Started 7 games)
Brandon Stokley: 40 Receptions, 635 Yards, 5 TDs (Started 9 games)
*Ranked 21st in points scored
2008:
Jay Cutler: 62.3%, 4,526 Yards, 25 TDs, 18 INTs
Peyton Hillis: 343 Yards, 5.0 YPC, 5 TDs, 14 Receptions, 179 Yards, 1 TD (Started 6 games)
Michael Pittman: 320 Yards, 4.2 YPC, 4 TDs, 10 Receptions, 112 Yards, 0 TDs (Started 3 games)
Selvin Young: 303 Yards, 5.0 YPC, 1 TDs, 3 Receptions, 16 Yards, 0 TDs (Started 5 games)
Tatum Bell: 249 Yards, 5.7 YPC, 2 TDs, 10 Receptions, 57 Yards, 0 TDs (Started 3 games)
Brandon Marshall: 104 Receptions, 1,265 Yards, 6 TDs
Eddie Royal: 91 Receptions, 980 Yards, 5 TDs
Brandon Stokley: 49 Receptions, 528 Yards, 3 TDs
Tony Scheffler: 40 Receptions, 645 Yards, 3 TDs
*Ranked 16th in points scored
2009:
Mike McCoy took over as OC and the offense was ranked 20th in points scored, followed by 19th and 25th in the proceeding years, respectively.
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These seasons were during the Jake Plummer to rookie Jay Cutler transition. After the 2008 season, Jay Cutler ended up going to Chicago where he is the same QB he is today. 2008 was probably the best year of his career. The teams had a thrown together squad of RBs and the only true receiving threat was Brandon Marshall who emerged in 2007.
Houston Texans
2010:
Matt Schaub: 63.6%, 4,370 Yards, 24 TDs, 12 INT
Arian Foster: 1,616 Yards, 4.9 YPC, 16 TDs, 66 Receptions, 604 Yards, 2 TDs (Started 13 games)
Andre Johnson: 86 Receptions, 1,216 Yards, 8 TDs (Started 13 games)
Kevin Walter: 51 Receptions, 621 Yards, 5 TDs
Owen Daniels: 38 Receptions, 471 Yards, 2 TDs (Started 10 Games)
*Ranked 9th in points scored
2011:
Matt Schaub: 61%, 2,479 Yards, 15 TDs, 6 INTs (Started 10 games)
TJ Yates: 61.2%, 949 Yards, 3 TDs, 3 INTs (Started 5 games)
Arian Foster: 1,224 Yards, 4.4 YPC, 10 TDs, 53 Receptions, 617 Yards, 2 TDs (Started 13 games)
Ben Tate: 942 Yards, 5.4 YPC, 4 TDs, 13 Receptions, 98 Yards, 0 TDs
Andre Johnson: 33 Receptions, 492 Yards, 2 TDs (Started 7 games)
Owen Daniels: 54 Receptions, 677 Yards, 3 TDs
*Ranked 10th in points scored despite injuries to Schaub, Foster and Johnson.
2012:
Matt Schaub: 64.3%, 4,008 Yards, 22 TDs, 12 INTs
Arian Foster: 1,424 Yards, 4.1 YPC, 15 TDs, 40 Receptions, 217 Yards, 2 TDs
Andre Johnson: 112 Receptions, 1,598 Yards, 4 TDs
Owen Daniels: 62 Receptions, 716 Yards, 6 TDs
*Ranked 8th in points scored
2013:
Matt Schaub: 61.2%, 2,310 Yards, 10 TDs, 14 INTs (Started 8 games)
Case Keenum: 54.2%, 1,760 Yards, 9 TDs, 6 INTs (Started 8 games)
Ben Tate: 771 Yards, 4.3 YPC, 4 TDs, 34 Receptions, 140 Yards, 0 TDs (Started 7 games)
Arian Foster: 542 Yards, 4.5 YPC, 1 TD, 22 Receptions, 183 Yards, 1 TD (Started 8 games)
Andre Johnson: 109 Receptions, 1,407 Yards, 5 TDs
DeAndre Hopkins: 52 Receptions, 802 Yards, 2 TDs
Garrett Graham: 49 Receptions, 545 Yards, 5 TDs (Started 11 games)
Owen Daniels: 24 Receptions, 252 Yards, 3 TDs (Started 5 games)
*Ranked 31st in points scored
2014:
Bill O'Brien took over as HC and did not have an OC in 2014 it appears (much like will be the case in 2017). His offenses ranked 14, 21, and 28th in points scored from 2014 to 2016, respectively.
-------------
Obviously Schaub was successful during this stint in Houston but is no longer considered a starting QB. He had started for 3 years prior to Dennison taking over as OC there and his stats were in line with what he did from 2010-2013 in this offense. Kubiak was the HC during those previous seasons as well but the OC was Mike Sherman in 2007 and Kyle Shanahan in 2008 & 2009. A lot may have changed from 2008/2009 to today, but Kyle Shanahan is one of the hottest coaching candidates out there and Dennison had similar results that Shanahan did when the torch was passed.
Overall Thoughts
There will be varying thoughts on who deserves credit for the success and failures of these teams. Is it Kubiak's offense and Dennison just had a small role? That will be the narrative for a while. But what can be seen from these offenses is that they generally got very good production out of lesser RBs and took advantage of the one stud RB they did have (Arian Foster). They also relied heavily on the #1 WR in these offenses (Brandon Marshall and then Andre Johnson) as they had some great seasons in these offenses. The TEs were involved as well and Foster was used heavily in the passing game, too.
BlueDredSo
Footballguy
The Rick Dennison Offense
Good article. SBNation /Buffalo Rumblings has had some solid info & articles this past year. They're quickly becoming my #1 source for NFL & Bills info, even if I don't always agree with their opinions.
Good article. SBNation /Buffalo Rumblings has had some solid info & articles this past year. They're quickly becoming my #1 source for NFL & Bills info, even if I don't always agree with their opinions.
Tommy Collins
Footballguy
I used to go to BR but stopped after Brian Galliford stepped down. Not a fan of Trespasso or whatever his name is.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Was there my doubt that Chris Hogan would become a key piece of the NE offense?
Mr. Peterson
Footballguy
What are the odds that the Bills could actually trade Tyrod and get something for him? There's a number of teams that are interested in him.
And if we were to trade him, would we have to do it before the 11th so his money doesn't effect the cap?
And if we were to trade him, would we have to do it before the 11th so his money doesn't effect the cap?
BlueDredSo
Footballguy
I'd say the most likely scenario involving a trade would have the Bills retaining him and then trading him before or during the draft. I'm sure they're looking into it, but the odds don't seem good of that happening. I think most teams will just wait for the Bills to make a decision, and if they do retain him I don't really see any teams trading for him after that. Maybe the Browns still would, but if they draft a QB is Tyrod really going to do them any favors until the young gun is ready? The rest of their team isn't good enough for Tyrod to make them respectable.
I'm still really torn about Tyrod. Part of me wants them to retain him as I think he's clearly their best option for the immediate future. However, what if Cardale is awesome? Or...what if he's terrible and the Bills end up with a really high draft pick in 2018 to grab one of those QBs? I'm mostly interested to see what a new coaching regime and possibly a better OL & WR group can do for Tyrod. I think the defense can and will turn it around this coming year. Maybe not top 10, but much improved.
Buffalo Bills[SIZE=.9em]Verified account[/SIZE] @buffalobills 15m15 minutes ago
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We've agreed to terms with QB Tyrod Taylor on a restructured contract. Welcome back,@TyrodTaylor!
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We've agreed to terms with QB Tyrod Taylor on a restructured contract. Welcome back,
ScottNorwood
Footballcutie
I think keeping Tyrod was the right move. I don't see any better options available.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
Agreed. He's not Aaron Rodgers, but he's the best guy we've had here since Flutie. Not the highest bar in the world, obviously, but all other options were clearly worse by a significant margin.
Mr. Peterson
Footballguy
If we have another 7-9 or 8-8 season I'm gonna be so pissed. I'm tired of missing the playoffs and then missing out on the top talent.
I don't know if Tyrod is good enough to get us over the hump, but he's too decent to prevent us from drafting in the top 3.
I don't know if Tyrod is good enough to get us over the hump, but he's too decent to prevent us from drafting in the top 3.
flysack
Footballguy
Agree that it's better than drafting EJ Manuel three rounds too high and starting him Day 1.
flysack
Footballguy
Mr. Peterson
Footballguy
Don't we have one of the most difficult schedules in the league next year?
I would've been fine with a complete rebuild this year. Go get Darnold, Rosen or another QB to build the team with.
I would've been fine with a complete rebuild this year. Go get Darnold, Rosen or another QB to build the team with.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
No idea what the full deal looks like. But they're reporting $7M signing bonus, $10M cap hit this year, and it becomes a year to year deal after the 2nd year.humpback said:
Borden
Footballguy
Yeah, it's all about the total guaranteed $. I'd be perfectly fine with the same deal that he had, just without the big balloon payment. Those numbers seem low for year 1, hopefully year 2 isn't huge.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
He'll need to actually be on the field to do that. But he has the skills IMO.
flysack
Footballguy
When I think of Watkins, I think Buffalo Luck is wasting away the cheapest years of a guy who is going to be a top 5 WR for a long time.
He'll just do it somewhere else. He'll demand Top 5 dollars from a Bills team that never saw him play a full season. So feeling bitter, Buffalo will cut him lose and he'll be a dominant force for some other team.
I pray Brady retires before it happens.
He'll just do it somewhere else. He'll demand Top 5 dollars from a Bills team that never saw him play a full season. So feeling bitter, Buffalo will cut him lose and he'll be a dominant force for some other team.
I pray Brady retires before it happens.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
And of course Gilmore signs with New England. Because of course he does.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
flysack
Footballguy
A small, angry part of me was looking forward to watching him rob another team of its money. Now he'll probably outperform a bloated contract, become a real shutdown CB, and make the Bills look like idiots for not resigning him.
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flysack
Footballguy
Well, one good thing about Tyrod is he doesn't throw picks. His bad throws (which are numerous) are usually too off target for receivers or CBs to catch.
NE will just keep him under 150 yards passing in each game.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
True.
It will be interesting seeing him against Sammy. If Sammy can manage to stay healthy it'll be kind of fun to see him school Gilmore. (Not that I have ever really had anything against Gilmore)
flysack
Footballguy
See, now this I believe. Sammy can school Gilmore. The sad part will be all the replays that show Sammy making Gilmore his b!tch 20 yards across the middle, while Tyrod throws a five yard dump pass to his RB.
(damn, I'm really feeling the Bills Bitterness lately)
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
If it's towards Gilmore's side, that's probably OK too. Gilmore is great at sticking to guys (except when he plays off the line and gets torched), but he is dreadful in run support.
Of course we all know that Gilmore will look amazing in New England though. BB will do what he always does and design a defense that highlights a player's strength while minimizing their weaknesses.
Jason La Canfora[SIZE=.9em]Verified account[/SIZE] @JasonLaCanfora
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Tyrod Taylor's re-done deal with the Bills is for 2yrs, $30.5M (rest of it voids), $15.5M guar. Makes $14.5 this year, would make $16M in 18
10:14 AM - 9 Mar 2017
If this is accurate, sounds like a 1 yr. deal with a 2nd yr. option with only a $1M buyout- if so, sounds great.
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Tyrod Taylor's re-done deal with the Bills is for 2yrs, $30.5M (rest of it voids), $15.5M guar. Makes $14.5 this year, would make $16M in 18
10:14 AM - 9 Mar 2017
If this is accurate, sounds like a 1 yr. deal with a 2nd yr. option with only a $1M buyout- if so, sounds great.
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GroveDiesel
Footballguy
They'll probably grab a couple of guys in free agency and draft a couple more. Because, yeah, their WRs are a freaking nightmare. They have a stud #1 that can't stay on the field and a #2 that spent his first year on IR and....that's it.
Thank goodness WRs are somewhat deep in the draft.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Oof.
Check out @RapSheet's Tweet: https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/839953619868864512?s=09
That is a whole lot of money for a guy that didn't play all that well last year for the Pack.
Check out @RapSheet's Tweet: https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/839953619868864512?s=09
That is a whole lot of money for a guy that didn't play all that well last year for the Pack.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
One thing I can say I definitely like about Tyrod Taylor is that he has been a classy guy the whole way through and says all the right things. He certainly seems like a leader that works his tail off to win and does what he can to get others on board. That doesn't make him a great QB, but it's nice to see anyway. I'd rather have a guy of Taylor's talent and intangibles than Rivers or Cutler and theirs.
msommer
Footballguy
If you ask Packers guys whether they would want to keep Hyde I think they wold say yes. Maybe not at that price.
And don't forget, their corners flat out sucked last year so Hyde was filling in/helping out out of position
msommer
Footballguy
I hope Tyrod hires a great investment consultant. 'Cause this is money he need to live off for the rest of his life (barring back up duties elsewhere and miraculous improvements in performance under a new regime)
CanadianNFLJunkie
Footballguy
I'll gladly take Rivers over like 75% of the other starting QBs in the league.Similar threads
