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2021 Buffalo Bills - Same as it ever was*** (4 Viewers)

Gilmore being out sucks, but the upside is that Philly's WRs may be the worst in the league. My biggest fear is that Buffalo has had a hard time getting defensive playcalls in on time all year and they're up against the fastest playing team in the NFL.

 
Gilmore being out sucks, but the upside is that Philly's WRs may be the worst in the league. My biggest fear is that Buffalo has had a hard time getting defensive playcalls in on time all year and they're up against the fastest playing team in the NFL.
I'm not even concerned about this game. I asked myself "What would be the Billsiest way to end this season?" and the obvious answer is winning the next three games only to lose a win-and-you're-in game at home against the Jets, with Fitzpatrick putting up 300/3+. So the Philly, Washington and Dallas games are all locks at this point.

 
Aaron Williams back at practice today. That's awesome news. If he can get back and the Bills still have a shot at the playoffs, that would be huge.
One of my favorite players. When he keeps his emotions in check, he's the vocal leader of that secondary and the kind of voice the entire defense needs.

Say what you will about Mario, he's a great guy, good player, well liked, but you never see him leading on the field. It's not his skill set. They need someone to do that. A tough MLB would be preferred, but Aaron works as well.
Unfortunately the follow-up on the reports that he was practicing are kind of scary. Sounds like he may never be healed up. He's giving it a try, but it's a very real possibility that he may just decide to retire :(
Damn. That sucks.

 
Gilmore being out sucks, but the upside is that Philly's WRs may be the worst in the league. My biggest fear is that Buffalo has had a hard time getting defensive playcalls in on time all year and they're up against the fastest playing team in the NFL.
I'm not even concerned about this game. I asked myself "What would be the Billsiest way to end this season?" and the obvious answer is winning the next three games only to lose a win-and-you're-in game at home against the Jets, with Fitzpatrick putting up 300/3+. So the Philly, Washington and Dallas games are all locks at this point.
:goodposting:

All of you breaking down the X's and O's are totally off base.

 
I am not ready to writeoff Tyrod. He has looked shaky at times but he's only started 9 games as a pro. 5-4 as a starter, 66% completion, 1,960 yards, 14 TD, 4 INT, 290 rushing and 2 TDs. Yes he's a one-read QB right now and only using half of the field.

Maybe he's not the future, but any Bills fan would be foolish to write him off at this point, I think. Draft a QB and let them battle it out, but I'm not gonna say he's a scrub based on what we've seen thus far. I think if you would've asked any Bills fan if they'd be happy with those numbers from the QB at the beginning of the season, every one of them would be ecstatic. He's just been inconsistent at times and the defense hasn't been what we'd hoped.
:goodposting:

Taylor has exceeded the wildest dreams that any of us had for the QB position during the offseason. By all means, draft a QB, and keep drafting them until we stumble into a legitimate franchise QB. But I would be perfectly happy with Taylor as our presumed starter heading into next season.
How confident are you Bills fans with Taylor this week v. PHI...the way they played against NE? Blowout by BUF...PHI played their Super Bowl last week and will be flat?

 
What does Bills nation have on the condition of this Defense. The week 15&16 matchups look sweet, but is this D going to be healthy enough to take advantage?

 
The Bills get the Eagles at their stadium just as they are starting to get healthy and coming off their biggest win of the year. What could go wrong here?

:doh:

The one upside to laying an egg tomorrow is that the Bills will be out of it 2 weeks before Christmas, which means I can already be over the disappointment in time for the holiday!!!

 
Bad_Mo said:
I am not ready to writeoff Tyrod. He has looked shaky at times but he's only started 9 games as a pro. 5-4 as a starter, 66% completion, 1,960 yards, 14 TD, 4 INT, 290 rushing and 2 TDs. Yes he's a one-read QB right now and only using half of the field.

Maybe he's not the future, but any Bills fan would be foolish to write him off at this point, I think. Draft a QB and let them battle it out, but I'm not gonna say he's a scrub based on what we've seen thus far. I think if you would've asked any Bills fan if they'd be happy with those numbers from the QB at the beginning of the season, every one of them would be ecstatic. He's just been inconsistent at times and the defense hasn't been what we'd hoped.
:goodposting:

Taylor has exceeded the wildest dreams that any of us had for the QB position during the offseason. By all means, draft a QB, and keep drafting them until we stumble into a legitimate franchise QB. But I would be perfectly happy with Taylor as our presumed starter heading into next season.
How confident are you Bills fans with Taylor this week v. PHI...the way they played against NE? Blowout by BUF...PHI played their Super Bowl last week and will be flat?
They're still technically alive for the playoffs, and McCoy will be amped like hell to stick it to the Eagles.

I doubt they'll come out flat.

 
Bad_Mo said:
I am not ready to writeoff Tyrod. He has looked shaky at times but he's only started 9 games as a pro. 5-4 as a starter, 66% completion, 1,960 yards, 14 TD, 4 INT, 290 rushing and 2 TDs. Yes he's a one-read QB right now and only using half of the field.

Maybe he's not the future, but any Bills fan would be foolish to write him off at this point, I think. Draft a QB and let them battle it out, but I'm not gonna say he's a scrub based on what we've seen thus far. I think if you would've asked any Bills fan if they'd be happy with those numbers from the QB at the beginning of the season, every one of them would be ecstatic. He's just been inconsistent at times and the defense hasn't been what we'd hoped.
:goodposting:

Taylor has exceeded the wildest dreams that any of us had for the QB position during the offseason. By all means, draft a QB, and keep drafting them until we stumble into a legitimate franchise QB. But I would be perfectly happy with Taylor as our presumed starter heading into next season.
How confident are you Bills fans with Taylor this week v. PHI...the way they played against NE? Blowout by BUF...PHI played their Super Bowl last week and will be flat?
They're still technically alive for the playoffs, and McCoy will be amped like hell to stick it to the Eagles.

I doubt they'll come out flat.
He was talking about the Eagles coming out flat.

That said, I have a gut feeling we're going to see the D come out and start hot, despite the injuries, leading to an early big lead for the Bills and I don't think they'll look back. I'm actually looking forward to this one, a bit. With all the injuries over the past few weeks, I've been wanting to write them off, so I can look forward to just watching some good/playoff football.

 
See you all next year. I think I'm done doing anything but having the next three games on in the background while I do something productive with my Sunday afternoons.

 
So frustrating.

Injuries have been a huge factor, but this team hasn't been able to string together any consistency at all, at any point in the season. And the defense never did click. Unlike pretty much everyone else, I'm still fine with Rex, but the defense needs to be seriously fixed this off-season. Hoping Taylor takes a step forward as well, but I think our QB situation is resolved for the time being.

Edit: Another point in Rex's defense is that we would not have Taylor if it weren't for Rex. Even if you're bearish on Taylor and think he isn't our long-term answer, you have to admit that he's leaps and bounds better than EJ or Cassel or whoever. In the offseason, we were considered to have the worst QB situation in league and it wasn't even close. Nobody thinks that now.

 
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So frustrating.

Injuries have been a huge factor, but this team hasn't been able to string together any consistency at all, at any point in the season. And the defense never did click. Unlike pretty much everyone else, I'm still fine with Rex, but the defense needs to be seriously fixed this off-season. Hoping Taylor takes a step forward as well, but I think our QB situation is resolved for the time being.

Edit: Another point in Rex's defense is that we would not have Taylor if it weren't for Rex. Even if you're bearish on Taylor and think he isn't our long-term answer, you have to admit that he's leaps and bounds better than EJ or Cassel or whoever. In the offseason, we were considered to have the worst QB situation in league and it wasn't even close. Nobody thinks that now.
Here's the obvious counterpoint: Rex is supposed to be the defensive genius. He gets rid of the previous defensive staff that had great success. Rex's defense then goes out and regresses in almost every way (Gilmore and Darby being the noticeable exceptions).

On top of that, his track record in New York was that his teams consistently played hard, but were undisciplined and too conservative offensively. The Bills are again following this mold. So why should we think something will change for the positive next year?

 
OC Zed said:
IvanKaramazov said:
So frustrating.

Injuries have been a huge factor, but this team hasn't been able to string together any consistency at all, at any point in the season. And the defense never did click. Unlike pretty much everyone else, I'm still fine with Rex, but the defense needs to be seriously fixed this off-season. Hoping Taylor takes a step forward as well, but I think our QB situation is resolved for the time being.

Edit: Another point in Rex's defense is that we would not have Taylor if it weren't for Rex. Even if you're bearish on Taylor and think he isn't our long-term answer, you have to admit that he's leaps and bounds better than EJ or Cassel or whoever. In the offseason, we were considered to have the worst QB situation in league and it wasn't even close. Nobody thinks that now.
Here's the obvious counterpoint: Rex is supposed to be the defensive genius. He gets rid of the previous defensive staff that had great success. Rex's defense then goes out and regresses in almost every way (Gilmore and Darby being the noticeable exceptions).

On top of that, his track record in New York was that his teams consistently played hard, but were undisciplined and too conservative offensively. The Bills are again following this mold. So why should we think something will change for the positive next year?
I get all that. I'm extremely disappointed in the play of the defense. No question on that one. You can't even blame it on injuries -- they were never any good even when everyone was healthy. Totally fair point. If things don't turn around next year, I'll likely change my mind. Much of what befuddles me is why we keep running three- and four-man rushes when our blitzing plays seem so much more successful on average. (Today is a bad example, as we did get burned on one of our very few blitzes). This isn't the defensive scheme I was expecting.

I will also give you the undisciplined part. That's irritating as hell, and players should be getting fined.

I don't get your complaint about the offense being too conservative. This offense stretches the field more than anything we've seen since Bledsoe and Losman. If we had been offered this level of offense in the preseason, every single one of us would have taken it and assumed that we would finish 12-4 or something like that. (Ignoring the games when everybody was injured at the same time). The problem is the defense and ST, not the offense.

 
The whole situation is messed up, and a large part could be that Whaley has not been allowed to hire the coach.

Bringing in Rex was really the start of a rebuild. The regression in D should not have been surprising in hindsight, as strength of the D, the line, doesnt seem to match how he wants to play. So a turnover in personnelle and a year to learn the scheme should have been expected.

On offense, you have conservative play calling and a committment to the run.

But then you have the GM operating in win now mode. Bringing in Clay, Harvin and trading up for Watkins. They are gearing up for a passing attack that the coaches do not seem committed to.

I dont see how things will change in the near future. I forsee a failed first attempt by the Pegulas, followed by a committment to building right from the start, get your GM (I am fine with Whaley) let him hire the coach and hold him accountable.

I would be fine with firing Rex and letting Whaley pick his guy, but no way that happens. Just hope the Bills dont follow the Jets and let Whaley go while bringing on a GM who has no say in the head coach.

 
Also, while I like Taylor and am happy with him as QB, we should absolutely continue drafting players at this position and looking for developmental guys in FA. I don't mean first rounders, but keep addressing the position.

 
OC Zed said:
IvanKaramazov said:
So frustrating.

Injuries have been a huge factor, but this team hasn't been able to string together any consistency at all, at any point in the season. And the defense never did click. Unlike pretty much everyone else, I'm still fine with Rex, but the defense needs to be seriously fixed this off-season. Hoping Taylor takes a step forward as well, but I think our QB situation is resolved for the time being.

Edit: Another point in Rex's defense is that we would not have Taylor if it weren't for Rex. Even if you're bearish on Taylor and think he isn't our long-term answer, you have to admit that he's leaps and bounds better than EJ or Cassel or whoever. In the offseason, we were considered to have the worst QB situation in league and it wasn't even close. Nobody thinks that now.
Here's the obvious counterpoint: Rex is supposed to be the defensive genius. He gets rid of the previous defensive staff that had great success. Rex's defense then goes out and regresses in almost every way (Gilmore and Darby being the noticeable exceptions).

On top of that, his track record in New York was that his teams consistently played hard, but were undisciplined and too conservative offensively. The Bills are again following this mold. So why should we think something will change for the positive next year?
I get all that. I'm extremely disappointed in the play of the defense. No question on that one. You can't even blame it on injuries -- they were never any good even when everyone was healthy. Totally fair point. If things don't turn around next year, I'll likely change my mind. Much of what befuddles me is why we keep running three- and four-man rushes when our blitzing plays seem so much more successful on average. (Today is a bad example, as we did get burned on one of our very few blitzes). This isn't the defensive scheme I was expecting.

I will also give you the undisciplined part. That's irritating as hell, and players should be getting fined.

I don't get your complaint about the offense being too conservative. This offense stretches the field more than anything we've seen since Bledsoe and Losman. If we had been offered this level of offense in the preseason, every single one of us would have taken it and assumed that we would finish 12-4 or something like that. (Ignoring the games when everybody was injured at the same time). The problem is the defense and ST, not the offense.
I have to disagree with this, the game today is won with consistency on 5-15 yard passes and in this area the Bills are awful. I was very concerned to see Tyrod have three passes batted down at the line today. It appeared they have recognized that they need to explore the middle of the field (crossing routes and slants) but he was unable to do it.

If this is why they stayed away from these plays in the past and he is unable to adapt he will not be the answer at QB.

 
OC Zed said:
IvanKaramazov said:
So frustrating.

Injuries have been a huge factor, but this team hasn't been able to string together any consistency at all, at any point in the season. And the defense never did click. Unlike pretty much everyone else, I'm still fine with Rex, but the defense needs to be seriously fixed this off-season. Hoping Taylor takes a step forward as well, but I think our QB situation is resolved for the time being.

Edit: Another point in Rex's defense is that we would not have Taylor if it weren't for Rex. Even if you're bearish on Taylor and think he isn't our long-term answer, you have to admit that he's leaps and bounds better than EJ or Cassel or whoever. In the offseason, we were considered to have the worst QB situation in league and it wasn't even close. Nobody thinks that now.
Here's the obvious counterpoint: Rex is supposed to be the defensive genius. He gets rid of the previous defensive staff that had great success. Rex's defense then goes out and regresses in almost every way (Gilmore and Darby being the noticeable exceptions).

On top of that, his track record in New York was that his teams consistently played hard, but were undisciplined and too conservative offensively. The Bills are again following this mold. So why should we think something will change for the positive next year?
I mean it's not really fair to say "he screwed up the defense and had a reputation for X in NY" [particularly when said rep can't be substantiated by 09-14 Jets penalty stats]. You either throw out the rep & give him a fresh start or not.

 
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But then you have the GM operating in win now mode. Bringing in Clay, Harvin and trading up for Watkins. They are gearing up for a passing attack that the coaches do not seem committed to.
We need to upgrade the right side of the line. I think you're correct that our staff's vision would be better implemented with less star-power at the skill positions and more on the front five.

 
I have to disagree with this, the game today is won with consistency on 5-15 yard passes and in this area the Bills are awful. I was very concerned to see Tyrod have three passes batted down at the line today. It appeared they have recognized that they need to explore the middle of the field (crossing routes and slants) but he was unable to do it.

If this is why they stayed away from these plays in the past and he is unable to adapt he will not be the answer at QB.
This area does need work, and you would think that Clay would be a bigger security blanket for part of the field.

With regard to passes being batted down, Taylor is basically Doug Flutie. He's athletic and creative, but he can't avoid being short and he's going to have the occasional batted pass. Not that it's not a legitimate gripe, but I think that's going to be a permanent thing for him.

 
There's just no excuse for the lack of discipline. Lack of discipline almost certainly cost them at least 2 games this year. The game was over the minute that they went from 1st and 10 from their 20 to 1st and 20 from their 10 due to a hold.

Climbing out of a 1st and 20 on your own 10 when you have to drive the field at the end of the game is basically checkmate. That's when game ending INTs happen and that's exactly what happens.

 
I don't get your complaint about the offense being too conservative. This offense stretches the field more than anything we've seen since Bledsoe and Losman. If we had been offered this level of offense in the preseason, every single one of us would have taken it and assumed that we would finish 12-4 or something like that. (Ignoring the games when everybody was injured at the same time). The problem is the defense and ST, not the offense.
Yes, Tyrod does throw it deep 3 or 4 times a game. The problem is there isn't a heck of a lot to the passing game beyond that. And there seems to be no willingness to ever use the the passing game to open up the running game. It's a run-dominant team, which works well when you can jump out to big, early leads and have a defense that can shut other teams down. We haven't been able to do either of those things this year on a consistent basis.

 
I don't get your complaint about the offense being too conservative. This offense stretches the field more than anything we've seen since Bledsoe and Losman. If we had been offered this level of offense in the preseason, every single one of us would have taken it and assumed that we would finish 12-4 or something like that. (Ignoring the games when everybody was injured at the same time). The problem is the defense and ST, not the offense.
Yes, Tyrod does throw it deep 3 or 4 times a game. The problem is there isn't a heck of a lot to the passing game beyond that. And there seems to be no willingness to ever use the the passing game to open up the running game. It's a run-dominant team, which works well when you can jump out to big, early leads and have a defense that can shut other teams down. We haven't been able to do either of those things this year on a consistent basis.
There is no team in the NFL besides possibly NE that jumps out to early leads and shuts other teams down on a consistent basis. Your criticism is basically that this team isn't the 1990 Bills.

I get what you're saying about us not throwing the ball a lot -- clearly this team is designed as an old-school run-first team. That's not the same thing as being conservative though. Trent Edwards threw the ball a lot more than Taylor does, but they were all check-downs. Is that what you want?

 
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I don't get your complaint about the offense being too conservative. This offense stretches the field more than anything we've seen since Bledsoe and Losman. If we had been offered this level of offense in the preseason, every single one of us would have taken it and assumed that we would finish 12-4 or something like that. (Ignoring the games when everybody was injured at the same time). The problem is the defense and ST, not the offense.
Yes, Tyrod does throw it deep 3 or 4 times a game. The problem is there isn't a heck of a lot to the passing game beyond that. And there seems to be no willingness to ever use the the passing game to open up the running game. It's a run-dominant team, which works well when you can jump out to big, early leads and have a defense that can shut other teams down. We haven't been able to do either of those things this year on a consistent basis.
There is no team in the NFL besides possibly NE that jumps out to early leads and shuts other teams down on a consistent basis. Your criticism is basically that this team isn't the 1990 Bills.

I get what you're saying about us not throwing the ball a lot -- clearly this team is designed as an old-school run-first team. That's not the same thing as being conservative though. Trent Edwards threw the ball a lot more than Taylor does, but they were all check-downs. Is that what you want?
I want the offense to be more balanced. The offensive talent and Tyrod's development this year indicates that we can - and should do this. I get leery of the old-school run-first team approach when the defense is as inconsistent as it is.

 
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3-0

Pitt loses to Denver

Jets lose to NE

Bills beat the Jets

and Johnny Football Shocks the world and beats Pittsburgh in Cleveland Week 17

PLAYOFFS!!!

Make it happen Santa.

 
Last year's defense with this year's offense would have had them in the playoffs.

Schwartz and Roman are what we needed.

 
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Gottabesweet said:
3-0

Pitt loses to Denver

Jets lose to NE

Bills beat the Jets

and Johnny Football Shocks the world and beats Pittsburgh in Cleveland Week 17

PLAYOFFS!!!

Make it happen Santa.
Is it possible, if the Chiefs manage to lose 2 games, that the Steelers would have nothing to play for? I think in that case the Steelers would be in, as well as the winner of Bills/Jets, right?

 
Is there anyone that still believes that the Bills would have been better off with Cassell over Taylor?

If so, you should stop taking drugs.

 
I hold no real particular ill will towards the Jets, though they are a division opponent, but man it makes me sad to see how abysmal they were last year and see them sitting at 9-5 right now. The Bills haven't been 9-5 since 1999.

Why isn't this team ever good?

 
I hold no real particular ill will towards the Jets, though they are a division opponent, but man it makes me sad to see how abysmal they were last year and see them sitting at 9-5 right now. The Bills haven't been 9-5 since 1999.

Why isn't this team ever good?
The common denominator is Rex.

 
I hold no real particular ill will towards the Jets, though they are a division opponent, but man it makes me sad to see how abysmal they were last year and see them sitting at 9-5 right now. The Bills haven't been 9-5 since 1999.

Why isn't this team ever good?
The common denominator is Rex.
I hate to say it, but I'm pretty sure the Jets hired the better HC.

Bowles looks legit.
And the better OC

 
I fear we are headed down the path to the dark side with all the rumblings the last day.

You need a proper chain of command in an organization.

Owner hires GM and holds him accountable.

GM hires the coach and holds him accountable.

Whaley is a pseudo GM with no power to fire Rex (my opinion) and this structure just does not work.

I can see a scenario where Whaley knows this and forces the issue, and Pegula brings another GM into this mess with the same upside down structure.

 
I hold no real particular ill will towards the Jets, though they are a division opponent, but man it makes me sad to see how abysmal they were last year and see them sitting at 9-5 right now. The Bills haven't been 9-5 since 1999.

Why isn't this team ever good?
The common denominator is Rex.
I hate to say it, but I'm pretty sure the Jets hired the better HC.

Bowles looks legit.
And the better OC
I wouldn't say that. Roman has been solid. They've had injuries too.

My only compliant with Roman is not getting Sammy involved enough, but he seems to have corrected that the past couple weeks.

 
The Duff Man said:
I fear we are headed down the path to the dark side with all the rumblings the last day.

You need a proper chain of command in an organization.

Owner hires GM and holds him accountable.

GM hires the coach and holds him accountable.

Whaley is a pseudo GM with no power to fire Rex (my opinion) and this structure just does not work.

I can see a scenario where Whaley knows this and forces the issue, and Pegula brings another GM into this mess with the same upside down structure.
This is all so logical and yet it's beyond the grasp of our owners.

This is going to be a bad situation for many, many years to come.

 
The options for next year are horrendous.

1. Keep Gm and coach -seeming less likely, I read Whaleys contract is up?

2. Lose GM, keep coach - ugh....Jets

3. Keep GM, fire coach - one and done and huge payout

4. Lose both - see above, big payout

Pegulas made a big mistake. They needed an interim coach until they sorted things out once Marrone quit. Instead they jumped into the deep end with what seems like an anchor. My question is how long will they stay underwater....cutting the rope will be expensive and embarassing..

 
One and done for Rex?
No. The popular thing to do right now is to criticize Rex and the rest of the staff, but this team dearly needs some continuity. This has been a really weird season. The defense has been a massive, almost unspeakable disappointment, but the offense has been much better than anyone expected. I honestly don't know what to expect next year, but if the offense just stays where it is and the defense gets back to average-plus, this is a ten-win team.

Who among us thought that anybody would be writing "If the defense can hold up its end of the bargain" sentences this season?

 
I have watched more Bills games this year than I would have liked seeing how I really like Watkins. Every week I find myself shaking my head at how misused Watkins is. 74 targets!? The worst part is I am watching Taylor's reads and they don't even look Watkins ways for large parts of the game. I mean not even to see if he is open. I don't know how that is possible. Taylor is too conservative and he needs to trust Watkins, I am guessing this is a coaching thing though. Taylor actually has made some good throws and looked good but really crazy how that happens.

The D is a mess, coaching is not good.

Rex is proving to be someone who should be a coordinator and not a head coach.

 

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