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2022 New York Football Giants (under new management of Schoen & Daboll) (1 Viewer)

I don't really mind the early mocks. As someone who follows CFB, but doesn't really get into the hardcore scouting of all the players, its an easy way to learn about prospects and follow the ups and downs of different players as the process plays out. Sure, you have to take a lot of them with a grain of salt, but seeing who the respected analysts are projecting at least gives some data points.

For most of the season I was hell bent on the Gmen going WR in RD1 given their glaring talent deficit, but I've come around to the fact that we really need huge talent upgrade at multiple positions and BPA at a position of need in RD1 is fine. Get yourself a stud WR, TE, LB, or CB and it should provide huge dividends. I'd really like them to address the interior of the OL in the middle of the draft and develop those guys....you SHOULD be able to find solid starting Gs and Cs mid draft (even though I know their track record sucks in that department).
 
I don't really mind the early mocks. As someone who follows CFB, but doesn't really get into the hardcore scouting of all the players, its an easy way to learn about prospects and follow the ups and downs of different players as the process plays out. Sure, you have to take a lot of them with a grain of salt, but seeing who the respected analysts are projecting at least gives some data points.

For most of the season I was hell bent on the Gmen going WR in RD1 given their glaring talent deficit, but I've come around to the fact that we really need huge talent upgrade at multiple positions and BPA at a position of need in RD1 is fine. Get yourself a stud WR, TE, LB, or CB and it should provide huge dividends. I'd really like them to address the interior of the OL in the middle of the draft and develop those guys....you SHOULD be able to find solid starting Gs and Cs mid draft (even though I know their track record sucks in that department).
If a dominant C or G is available in the 1st rd you have to consider that as well. Like you said the track record of Giants developing the Oline in general has been terrible ... and that hasnt even been a particularly strong point in Buffalo. I think they should even consider a T if a good one unexpectedly falls to them in the 1st. I'm extremely worried about Evan Neal ... He was really terrible and showed no improvement at all as the year went on. Maybe it was the injury but they need to be prepared in case they have to move him inside ... he was a huge liability on a really bad oline.
This is not the same as the Andrew Thomas situation .... where he was getting beat inside trying to cheat outside. Thomas showed significant improvement the 2nd half of his rookie season
 
I don't really mind the early mocks. As someone who follows CFB, but doesn't really get into the hardcore scouting of all the players, its an easy way to learn about prospects and follow the ups and downs of different players as the process plays out. Sure, you have to take a lot of them with a grain of salt, but seeing who the respected analysts are projecting at least gives some data points.

For most of the season I was hell bent on the Gmen going WR in RD1 given their glaring talent deficit, but I've come around to the fact that we really need huge talent upgrade at multiple positions and BPA at a position of need in RD1 is fine. Get yourself a stud WR, TE, LB, or CB and it should provide huge dividends. I'd really like them to address the interior of the OL in the middle of the draft and develop those guys....you SHOULD be able to find solid starting Gs and Cs mid draft (even though I know their track record sucks in that department).
If a dominant C or G is available in the 1st rd you have to consider that as well. Like you said the track record of Giants developing the Oline in general has been terrible ... and that hasnt even been a particularly strong point in Buffalo. I think they should even consider a T if a good one unexpectedly falls to them in the 1st. I'm extremely worried about Evan Neal ... He was really terrible and showed no improvement at all as the year went on. Maybe it was the injury but they need to be prepared in case they have to move him inside ... he was a huge liability on a really bad oline.
This is not the same as the Andrew Thomas situation .... where he was getting beat inside trying to cheat outside. Thomas showed significant improvement the 2nd half of his rookie season
I don't mind the early mocks either. I'd like to see a WR or CB in round 1.

Keep in mind we also have two injured guards from last year's draft, hopefully, coming back:

Josh Ezeudu (3rd round) - Neck Injury, played 10 games.
Marcus Mkethan (5th round) - Torn ACL in August

Be a breathe of fresh air if we could could get the Center position figured out.
 
I don't really mind the early mocks. As someone who follows CFB, but doesn't really get into the hardcore scouting of all the players, its an easy way to learn about prospects and follow the ups and downs of different players as the process plays out. Sure, you have to take a lot of them with a grain of salt, but seeing who the respected analysts are projecting at least gives some data points.

For most of the season I was hell bent on the Gmen going WR in RD1 given their glaring talent deficit, but I've come around to the fact that we really need huge talent upgrade at multiple positions and BPA at a position of need in RD1 is fine. Get yourself a stud WR, TE, LB, or CB and it should provide huge dividends. I'd really like them to address the interior of the OL in the middle of the draft and develop those guys....you SHOULD be able to find solid starting Gs and Cs mid draft (even though I know their track record sucks in that department).
If a dominant C or G is available in the 1st rd you have to consider that as well. Like you said the track record of Giants developing the Oline in general has been terrible ... and that hasnt even been a particularly strong point in Buffalo. I think they should even consider a T if a good one unexpectedly falls to them in the 1st. I'm extremely worried about Evan Neal ... He was really terrible and showed no improvement at all as the year went on. Maybe it was the injury but they need to be prepared in case they have to move him inside ... he was a huge liability on a really bad oline.
This is not the same as the Andrew Thomas situation .... where he was getting beat inside trying to cheat outside. Thomas showed significant improvement the 2nd half of his rookie season
I don't mind the early mocks either. I'd like to see a WR or CB in round 1.

Keep in mind we also have two injured guards from last year's draft, hopefully, coming back:

Josh Ezeudu (3rd round) - Neck Injury, played 10 games.
Marcus Mkethan (5th round) - Torn ACL in August

Be a breathe of fresh air if we could could get the Center position figured out.
I wouldn't expect much from McKethan in 2023 ... he was a project to begin with and was expected to be drafted in the 6-7th rd but the Giants reached for him at in the 5th for some reason. Tore his acl and missed a entire season of development

Ezeudu was also a bit of a reach in the 3rd (projected 4t) ... He played terribly before a season ending neck injury that was described as a long term (not career threatening injury) ...

I'm hoping that the Lemieux experiment has finally come to an end

Giants cant be counting on these guys for 2023

Also it doesn't sound like the Giants are going to be signing both Gates and Feliciano ...so one of them is likely gone
 

"#Giants QB coach Shea Tierney will interview with the #Buccaneers for their vacant OC position, sources say. Tierney has worked closely with HC Brian Daboll with Alabama, the #Bills and NYG, and the development of Daniel Jones this past season has been noticed around the league."

******


"Colts are scheduling Giants’ defensive coordinator Wink Martindale to come to Indianapolis this weekend for a second head coaching interview, per league sources."
 
OL under contract for next season

LT: Andrew Thomas & Matt Peart

LG: Ezeudu, Bredeson, Lemieux & Wyatt Davis (ERFA)

C: None

RG: Glowinski. McKethan & Jack Anderson (ERFA)

RT: Neal & Phillips
 
If the Giants are really serious about rebuilding they should be thinking about trying to trade Leonard Williams ($18m) and Adore Jackson ($11M) for huge cap savings if traded.
Even Golladay ... if they can work out some miracle and trade him for nothing and eat some salary ... it would be another 18m cap savings.

Also tag Saquan with the intention of trading him for a 4th rd pick

That's rebuilding !
 
If the Giants are really serious about rebuilding they should be thinking about trying to trade Leonard Williams ($18m) and Adore Jackson ($11M) for huge cap savings if traded.
Even Golladay ... if they can work out some miracle and trade him for nothing and eat some salary ... it would be another 18m cap savings.

Also tag Saquan with the intention of trading him for a 4th rd pick

That's rebuilding !

Honestly I'm not in favor of any of that. Would rather try and restructure Leo, who has stated he might be willing to take a pay cut. And Adore was our only reliable CB. If you were going to take a 4th for Saquon, why wouldn't you just let him walk and take the compensatory pick?

Front office and coaching have accomplished what they needed to in year 1...build a winning culture and get players on board with what they are trying to do. You risk undermining all that if you trade away your best players and essentially enter tank mode one year after making the playoffs. They have the cap room to keep these guys and Schoen has already said he would rather keep guys in house than try and deal with the unknown of free agency.
 
If the Giants are really serious about rebuilding they should be thinking about trying to trade Leonard Williams ($18m) and Adore Jackson ($11M) for huge cap savings if traded.
Even Golladay ... if they can work out some miracle and trade him for nothing and eat some salary ... it would be another 18m cap savings.

Also tag Saquan with the intention of trading him for a 4th rd pick

That's rebuilding !

Honestly I'm not in favor of any of that. Would rather try and restructure Leo, who has stated he might be willing to take a pay cut. And Adore was our only reliable CB. If you were going to take a 4th for Saquon, why wouldn't you just let him walk and take the compensatory pick?

Front office and coaching have accomplished what they needed to in year 1...build a winning culture and get players on board with what they are trying to do. You risk undermining all that if you trade away your best players and essentially enter tank mode one year after making the playoffs. They have the cap room to keep these guys and Schoen has already said he would rather keep guys in house than try and deal with the unknown of free agency.
Leo is not worth a 32m cap hit ... I'm sure they'll come up with something better but his not going to be cheap and he seems like he may be declining
Comp pick could be anywhere from 3-7th
Rather keep Adore but his cap hit is pretty big
 

"....When we started in OTAs all the years before, we didn't start off on the same page," McKinney said. "I think everyone was kind of coaching in different directions, and I think a big reason to that was because of the coaching staff that we had."

Under Judge, McKinney said players resented showing up early and were only interested in going to the facility if they had to.

"That was the good part when Dabes and the crew that's there now came in because we talk to them, they actually listen," said McKinney....

"The coaches we had before, a lot of people didn't like each other, and they actually showed it," he said.

The newly hired staff's transparency with the players was critical to getting the team to buy into the culture, and once the players trusted them, it was "smooth sailing," McKinney said.
While McKinney is grateful that Daboll is in charge, he admitted that he and his Giants teammates didn't care who Judge's successor would be. They were determined to change the team's narrative. "
 
It will be interesting to see what Saquon decides to do. He might be able to make more NFL money elsewhere but I’m guessing he would make less money off the field.
 
It will be interesting to see what Saquon decides to do. He might be able to make more NFL money elsewhere but I’m guessing he would make less money off the field.
I don’t really think the NY endorsement boost is that big these days. All of these superstars are national brands these days and get plenty of money from large endorsement deals. I’d think whatever local endorsement $$ boost he gets from NY gets largely offset by the bigger tax burden he needs to pay.
 
https://www.nj.com/giants/2023/02/l...aniel-jones-likely-free-agency-price-tag.html

The appropriate figure is believed to be somewhere between $35 and $37 million, two executives familiar with the quarterback market told SNY. Another, whose team is in need of a veteran quarterback and would “explore” Jones if he were available, said he’d have a “hard time” justifying a $40 million figure for him. In the $30 millions? “Sure,” the exec said, “but not above.”
 
Jets offensive and defensive rookies of the year

AP Offensive Rookie of the Year: Garrett Wilson, Jets wide receiver
AP Defensive Rookie of the Year: Sauce Gardner, Jets cornerback
 
Michael Silver
@MikeSilver

Giants DC Don Martindale has been told he's out of the running for the Colts head coaching job. He was one of the candidates who interviewed twice.


*******

ProFootballTalk

@ProFootballTalk

Reports: Mike Kafka, Brian Callahan informed they won't be hired as Colts coach.
 
Sounds like both Kafka and Wink will be back next year. Love that we finally get some stability in the coaching ranks, even if just for one offseason.
 
My bad,yes he started there. But his dad did hire him as offensive coach when he was in Washington. Nepotism.
 
My bad,yes he started there. But his dad did hire him as offensive coach when he was in Washington. Nepotism.
I'm sure it could be construed that way by the many qualified former players and collegiate coaches looking to get that kind of a break.
Also Mike Shannon was an established Head coach with back to back SB victories in Denver and almost 15 years as a head coach before hiring his son who had already established himself as well.

Daboll is a 1st year head coach and his son has zero NFL coaching experience that seems nepotistic to me
 
My bad,yes he started there. But his dad did hire him as offensive coach when he was in Washington. Nepotism.
I'm sure it could be construed that way by the many qualified former players and collegiate coaches looking to get that kind of a break.
Also Mike Shannon was an established Head coach with back to back SB victories in Denver and almost 15 years as a head coach before hiring his son who had already established himself as well.

Daboll is a 1st year head coach and his son has zero NFL coaching experience that seems nepotistic to me
He's Coach of the Year. I'll trust him and the process.
 
Daniel Jones changed agents and they want *must more money* than the $35M we have seen floated recently. Saquon might be closer to leaving than we initially thought...
 
I think there maybe only 1 QB in the nfl that I would be willing to give that kind of Money and he just won his 2nd of 3 Super Bowls.
Rogers, Brady and Russel Wilson in their primes ... Sure ! But that's it !!!
No other QB in the NFL right now has proven that they can win a SB on a sustainable roster ... why the hell would any of them make more than Mahomes !?!?!?!

If Jones wants more than $40M ... You flat out Franchise Tag him like the Article says. If there is a team that is on the cusp of a SB like the Rams, Eagles were or 49ers are, that is willing to give up 2 first round picks to sign Jones then great ... I'll take it.

The only problem with Franchising a player is that the entire salary goes against the cap as opposed to being able to play with void years, signing, workout and roster bonuses to kick the can down the line. But on the plus side ... If a player signs the franchise tender you are able to trade them down the line and Jones at this point is certainly worth a 1st round pick plus to a team built to win now.

So like the Article says
If you tag him for $32.416 million in 2023 (certainly worth that) - Jones would be in line for a 20-percent raise ($38.89 million) for 2024 (also fair). That’s $71.31 million over two years (or $35.5M per year and obviously a bargain if you are willing to franchise him a 2nd time.

It doesnt make sense to do anything but Franchise him unless he's be willing to take around $35-$40M on a long term deal (80-100M guaranteed) with outs in the later years. If they do that Jones cap hit is going to be much less the first couple of years of his contract.
 
... I'll just leave this here, hang up the phone and let you guys respond to this...


also will leave this here.

people are not being too kind to Mr. Jones in the comments. :p
Very good artcle ... followed by some really dumb comments

One guy thinks they should exclusive tag him meaning no other teams can negotiate or sign Jones.
Another guy thinks jones couldn't possibly put up the same numbers on another team! Really? Cause no other team has that kind of talent LOL!!!
 
I hope the Giants give Jones the non-exclusive franchise tag and hope someone is willing to give him the crazy amount of money he's looking for and the Giants 2 1st round picks to do it. They can then draft a QB with more upside and with Daboll they can coach him to that upside. If not, even though it's not good for the cap, I would prefer to make him play another prove it year under the franchise tag. I'm always wary of players who have their best year in a contract year, but in this case I'm even more wary because his best year wasn't anything special. He hasn't been a foundational part of the team, it's more like "we can't do better with the resources available right now". Either way, they keep Jones and make him prove he's worth $45 million or get 2 1st round picks which can be used to draft his replacement.

I wouldn't sign Barkley to a long term deal. It almost never works out for the team when they give RBs big contracts, especially when they have Barkley's injury history. Barkley refusing $12 million a year was a dodged bullet IMO. Having a big contract year doesn't really make up for the 2 previous years. I'd rather draft a rookie and sign someone like Foreman and use the extra money elsewhere, like WR, OL, CB and LB.

From what I've read, Love wants market setting money. If that's the case, I would let him walk too. Safety and RB are the most replaceable positions (aside from K and P) so I don't like giving market setting money, or anything close, to any of them. That said, at least Barkley and Love are top players at their positions, when healthy, and not simply above average at a position that lacks a lot of quality players at the moment.
 
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Dan Duggan breaks down cap situation in The Athletic:

Giants general manager Joe Schoen is armed with a lot more salary cap space than his first year on the job. But it could go fast with the Giants’ in-house free agents and the need to import upgrades.

Here’s an overview of the Giants’ salary cap situation three weeks before free agency begins on March 13:

• Cap space: $44.4 million. The Giants have the fifth-most cap space in the league, according to the NFLPA’s database.
• Carryover cap space: $1.5 million. The Giants carried over $1.5 million from 2022 after being tight against the cap last year.
• Dead money: $8 million. The dead money charges mostly come from Sterling Shepard’s void year ($4.2 million) and the Kadarius Toney trade ($3.7 million).
• Potential cap casualties: WR Kenny Golladay, DL Leonard Williams, CB Adoree’ Jackson. The Giants could create $27.3 million in cap savings while eating $45.4 million in dead money if they cut those three players.
• Roster snapshot: The Giants currently have 54 players under contract for 2023. Only the top 51 contracts on the 90-man roster count against the cap until the start of the regular season. The Giants are projected to have 11 draft picks, but most of those selections won’t factor into the top 51 accounting during the offseason.

Here’s a deeper dive into the Giants’ cap situation position-by-position:

Quarterback: $6.9M

Tyrod Taylor: $6.9M
• Free agent: Daniel Jones

The quarterback cap charge will obviously grow once Jones is retained. If he signs an extension, the Giants can manipulate the cap charges to minimize the hit in 2023. Consider that Cowboys quarterback Dak Prescott signed a four-year, $160 million extension in 2021 and his cap hit was just $17.2 million in the first year of the deal. It’s unclear how aggressive Schoen plans to be with backloading contracts, but Jones’ Year 1 cap hit will surely be lower than his average annual salary.

Negotiations began last week, and there has been no word on how close the initial figures were from each side. It’s imperative for the Giants to extend Jones because the franchise tag would count $32.4 million on the cap, which would limit Schoen’s ability to upgrade the rest of the roster. The important date to keep in mind is the March 7 franchise tag deadline. Expect increased urgency to get a deal done as that deadline approaches.
Running back: $1.7M

Gary Brightwell: $985K
Jashaun Corbin: $750K
• Free agents: Saquon Barkley, Matt Breida

Barkley’s fate will dictate the Giants’ spending at running back. If he signs an extension worth approximately $12 million per year, the 2023 cap hit will likely be in the $6 million range. Tagging Barkley would result in a $10.1 million cap charge.

If the Giants let Barkley walk, they could sign an inexpensive back from a deep crop of free agents, add another back with a mid-round pick, then have a cheap backfield that will allow money to be directed elsewhere.
Wide receiver: $28.6M

• Kenny Golladay: $21.4M
Wan’Dale Robinson: $1.9M
Collin Johnson: $1M
Jaydon Mickens: $940K
• David Sills: $940K
Isaiah Hodgins: $870K
Kalil Pimpleton: $750K
• Makai Polk: $750K
• Free agents: Richie James, Darius Slayton, Sterling Shepard, Marcus Johnson

Golladay will surely be a cap casualty. Cutting him will create $6.7 million in savings while leaving $14.7 million in dead money. There will be speculation the Giants could designate Golladay as a June 1 cut, which would create $13.5 million in cap savings with $7.9 million in dead money this year. The downside of that approach is it would push $6.8 million in dead money onto the 2024 cap.

The Giants are in a healthy enough cap position that there’s no reason to push dead money into the future. They should just tear off the Band-Aid from one of the remaining Dave Gettleman errors and move on.

A void year, which carries a $4.2 million dead money charge, was added to Shepard’s contract as part of his pay cut last offseason. James and Slayton (after a pay cut) were minimum salary players who produced last season. They’d be worth re-signing at the right price.
Tight end: $3.8M

Daniel Bellinger: $1.1M
Chris Myarick: $1M
Lawrence Cager: $940K
Dre Miller: $750K
• Free agents: Nick Vannett

The Giants have very little invested at tight end, and they pivoted to more three-wide receiver sets as the season progressed, so they could go cheap at this position and spend the savings at other spots.
Offensive line: $34.4M

Andrew Thomas: $10.3M
Mark Glowinski: $8.4M
Evan Neal: $5.6M
Matt Peart: $1.3M
• Josh Ezeudu: $1.2M
Shane Lemieux: $1.1M
Ben Bredeson: $1M
Tyre Phillips: $1M
Jack Anderson: $940K
Korey Cunningham: $940K
Solomon Kindley: $940K
Devery Hamilton: $870K
Marcus McKethan: $819K
• Free agents: Jon Feliciano, Nick Gates, Wyatt Davis (ERFA)

Thomas is eligible for a monster extension, but he’s under contractual control for the next two years. The Giants must weigh if it’s best to act early before others reset the market and he further cements his status as an elite left tackle.

Glowinski is locked in for this season, but his contract is structured so he can be dumped next year. The Giants have a surplus of cheap, young interior offensive linemen who can compete at left guard and center. Those positions need to be better than 2022, but the Giants just used the 67th pick on Ezeudu, so it’s reasonable to expect him to be a capable starting guard in his second season. The Giants could bring back Gates and/or Feliciano as a cheap center option.
 
Defense/Special Teams:
Defensive line: $47.5M

• Leonard Williams: $32.3M
Dexter Lawrence: $12.4M
• DJ Davidson: $959K
Vernon Butler: $940K
Ryder Anderson: $870K
• Free agents: Nick Williams, Justin Ellis, Henry Mondeaux (RFA)

The Giants’ options with Williams were covered extensively in Step 7 of my 10-step offseason plan. The bottom line is that it would be beneficial for the Giants to reduce Williams’ massive 2023 cap hit, but releasing him to create $12 million in cap savings with $20.2 million in dead money would be an extreme measure. William has no reason to accept a pay cut despite his postseason comments, so a short-term extension that lowers his 2023 cap hit is likely the best option for all parties.

An extension for Lawrence should be a top priority after settling this year’s free-agent class. The 2019 first-round pick is due to become a free agent next offseason, and the Giants need to stop their trend of letting homegrown players leave. Lawrence has earned a huge contract, but the Giants can still create some cap relief this year since his entire $12.4 million fifth-year option salary is currently counting on the cap.

The Giants need to add more reinforcements on the defensive line, but with so much committed to Williams and Lawrence, they’ll likely need to target cheap free agents and draft picks.
Outside linebacker: $10.9M

Kayvon Thibodeaux: $7.1M
Azeez Ojulari: $1.8M
Elerson Smith: $1.1M
Tomon Fox: $873K
• Free agents: Jihad Ward, Oshane Ximines

This is an inexpensive position due to having two top edge rushers on rookie contracts. It could be a huge benefit to be able to save at a premium position for the next few years, but the Giants need more depth after Ojulari’s injury-plagued second season. Still, they don’t figure to spend big money at outside linebacker this offseason.
Inside linebacker: $3.9M

Cam Brown: $1.1M
Carter Coughlin: $1M
Micah McFadden: $959K
Darrian Beavers: $802K
• Free agents: Jaylon Smith, Landon Collins, Jarrad Davis

If there’s one position on the roster that could use a legitimate free agent investment, it’s inside linebacker. The Giants have tried to get by with scrap-heap veterans and Day 3 draft picks … and they’ve gotten what they paid for. They don’t necessarily need to bid at the top of the market, but they need to spend enough to at least get a league-average linebacker on the roster.
Cornerback: $27.4M

• Adoree’ Jackson: $19.1M
Darnay Holmes: $2.9M
Aaron Robinson: $1.4M
Cor’Dale Flott: $1.2M
Rodarius Williams: $983K
Nick McCloud: $940K
Zyon Gilbert: $870K
• Free agent: Fabian Moreau

Jackson has an oversized cap hit due to a restructure last year, but it doesn’t make sense to cut him for $8.6 million in cap savings with $10.5 million in dead money. He’s a quality player, and cornerbacks are vital in defensive coordinator Wink Martindale’s system.

The rest of this depth chart is mostly young mid-round draft picks. Holmes could be in a situation similar to Slayton a year ago when a playing time-based raise makes him a candidate for a pay cut. The Giants could use a mid-level veteran free agent to raise the floor at cornerback, especially with Jackson’s injury history.
Safety: $6.5M

Xavier McKinney: $2.7M
Dane Belton: $1.1M
Terrell Burgess: $1M
Jason Pinnock: $940K
Trenton Thompson: $750K
• Free agents: Julian Love, Tony Jefferson

Love is third in the free agent pecking order behind Jones and Barkley. Love’s negotiation will be fascinating due to the wide range of potential salary comparisons at safety. Both sides are interested in an extension, but the Giants will likely set a hard maximum value on Love. They could let him test the market, which could be beneficial if he doesn’t find any takers that meet his asking price. The Giants have cheap replacement options with promise in Belton and Pinnock.

McKinney is eligible for an extension as he enters the final year of his rookie deal. He’s the type of player the Giants could lose if they let him reach free agency next offseason. The hand injury he suffered during a bye week ATV accident complicates the equation, but it could help the Giants by suppressing his value if they’re convinced they want to commit to him long-term.
Special teams: $5.5M

• K Graham Gano: $5.5M
• Free agents: Jamie Gillan, Casey Kreiter

Gano is one of the most expensive kickers in the league, and he’s worth every penny. The Giants may want to consider an extension as the 35-year-old enters the final year of his contract. Gillan and Kreiter are minimum salary players who can be retained to keep down the overall price of the specialists.
 

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