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2025 Detroit Lions: 0-0 Draft, FAs, trades? (6 Viewers)

msudaisy26 said:
Moonlight said:
Jameson Williams stating he didn’t know that he was violating NFL gambling restrictions is troubling.
I suppose it means that he either didn’t take the time to read the rules or he may not be truthful.
Or in the alternative the Lions organization did not adequately take steps to educate him about the rules. The fact that so many players were found to be in violation with apparently another player under investigation suggests that this more likely is the case.
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I work for a corporation that doesn't make even a 1000th of what the NFL makes and we have handbooks, meetings and an HR department that handles this and makes sure everyone has access to the rules. You will never convince me that the NFL didn't tell their employees about these rules in some attempt to trap a handful of employees and make examples out of them or they just forgot.

Every employee of the NFL has been given these rules in some form of meeting, handbook, or something and I would bet a lot of money (pun intended) it has been more than once.

Anyone that violated these rules that says they didn't know are lying or didn't pay attention at the correct time.

With that said part of the rule is stupid, but it still a rule.
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As a teacher with a wife in HR, I can assure you something like 50% of the people aren't paying any attention.
 
Ilov80s said:
msudaisy26 said:
Moonlight said:
Jameson Williams stating he didn’t know that he was violating NFL gambling restrictions is troubling.
I suppose it means that he either didn’t take the time to read the rules or he may not be truthful.
Or in the alternative the Lions organization did not adequately take steps to educate him about the rules. The fact that so many players were found to be in violation with apparently another player under investigation suggests that this more likely is the case.
Click to expand...

I work for a corporation that doesn't make even a 1000th of what the NFL makes and we have handbooks, meetings and an HR department that handles this and makes sure everyone has access to the rules. You will never convince me that the NFL didn't tell their employees about these rules in some attempt to trap a handful of employees and make examples out of them or they just forgot.

Every employee of the NFL has been given these rules in some form of meeting, handbook, or something and I would bet a lot of money (pun intended) it has been more than once.

Anyone that violated these rules that says they didn't know are lying or didn't pay attention at the correct time.

With that said part of the rule is stupid, but it still a rule.
Click to expand...
As a teacher with a wife in HR, I can assure you something like 50% of the people aren't paying any attention.
Click to expand...

Then that is their fault and not the organization.
 
Snotbubbles said:
Ilov80s said:
msudaisy26 said:
Moonlight said:
Jameson Williams stating he didn’t know that he was violating NFL gambling restrictions is troubling.
I suppose it means that he either didn’t take the time to read the rules or he may not be truthful.
Or in the alternative the Lions organization did not adequately take steps to educate him about the rules. The fact that so many players were found to be in violation with apparently another player under investigation suggests that this more likely is the case.
Click to expand...

I work for a corporation that doesn't make even a 1000th of what the NFL makes and we have handbooks, meetings and an HR department that handles this and makes sure everyone has access to the rules. You will never convince me that the NFL didn't tell their employees about these rules in some attempt to trap a handful of employees and make examples out of them or they just forgot.

Every employee of the NFL has been given these rules in some form of meeting, handbook, or something and I would bet a lot of money (pun intended) it has been more than once.

Anyone that violated these rules that says they didn't know are lying or didn't pay attention at the correct time.

With that said part of the rule is stupid, but it still a rule.
Click to expand...
As a teacher with a wife in HR, I can assure you something like 50% of the people aren't paying any attention.
Click to expand...

Then that is their fault and not the organization.
Click to expand...
Of course. I always laugh when I hear adults complaining about some basic historical thing they just learned about via news/social media and be like "why didn't they teach us about that in school!". Bro, they did teach you about it. Your *** just wasn't listening, you were too busy complaining that "history is boring" and "when will I ever need to know this".
 
Brad Holmes has been the king of finding hidden gems deep in the draft and even UDFA. I think he will hit two this year. Who are going to be this year's big hits?

Late 3rd rounder, DT Brodric Martin.

5th Rounder, OL Colby Sorsdal.

7th Round, WR Antoine Green

UDFA running back Mohamed Ibrahim.

I think Martin and Sorsdal are both projects, which incredible physical attributes. Definitely practice squad with a shot at being a depth piece. If either becomes a starter in a couple of years, that would be an amazing pick.

I believe both Green and Ibrahim have a real shot at the 53-man roster as WR5 and RB3/RB4. More as special teamers, but also getting an occasional touch.

I am not seeing an ARSB or James Houston yet, but I think all four of these guys have potential to surprise on the up side and be a far bigger impact that anyone suspects. That said, my pick is going to be Sosdal as being the biggest surprise by eventually becoming a starter.
 
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jon_mx said:
Brad Holmes has been the king of finding hidden gems deep in the draft and even UDFA. I think he will hit two this year. Who are going to be this year's big hits?

Late 3rd rounder, DT Brodric Martin.

5th Rounder, OL Colby Sorsdal.

7th Round, WR Antoine Green

UDFA running back Mohamed Ibrahim.

I think Martin and Sorsdal are both projects, which incredible physical attributes. Definitely practice squad with a shot at being a depth piece. If either becomes a starter in a couple of years, that would be an amazing pick.

I believe both Green and Ibrahim have a real shot at the 53-man roster as WR5 and RB3/RB4. More as special teamers, but also getting an occasional touch.

I am not seeing an ARSB or James Houston yet, but I think all four of these guys have potential to surprise on the up side and be a far bigger impact that anyone suspects. That said, my pick is going to be Sosdal as being the biggest surprise by eventually becoming a starter.
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Nice article today on Sorsdal on the Pride of Detroit site.
 
Moonlight said:
jon_mx said:
Brad Holmes has been the king of finding hidden gems deep in the draft and even UDFA. I think he will hit two this year. Who are going to be this year's big hits?

Late 3rd rounder, DT Brodric Martin.

5th Rounder, OL Colby Sorsdal.

7th Round, WR Antoine Green

UDFA running back Mohamed Ibrahim.

I think Martin and Sorsdal are both projects, which incredible physical attributes. Definitely practice squad with a shot at being a depth piece. If either becomes a starter in a couple of years, that would be an amazing pick.

I believe both Green and Ibrahim have a real shot at the 53-man roster as WR5 and RB3/RB4. More as special teamers, but also getting an occasional touch.

I am not seeing an ARSB or James Houston yet, but I think all four of these guys have potential to surprise on the up side and be a far bigger impact that anyone suspects. That said, my pick is going to be Sosdal as being the biggest surprise by eventually becoming a starter.
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Nice article today on Sorsdal on the Pride of Detroit site.
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article is based on this YT podcast:

Why Lions 5th-round pick Colby Sorsdal is a FUTURE STARTER w/Duke Manyweather

I got nothing against Manyweather, he's very effective at marketing himself. He's found a niche segment (preparing elite OL for the NfL Draft) and he gets how important it is to have multiple streams (social media, reality show, et al.) That's fine, good on him, the modern "entrepreneur." But he's a trainer. Not an independent evaluator. He's literally a paid hype man. Now he's been a trainer to some elite OL and his opinion carries....some weight....but he works for the player, it's in his best interest to see them succeed and to get favorable treatment in the media.
 
BobbyLayne said:
Moonlight said:
jon_mx said:
Brad Holmes has been the king of finding hidden gems deep in the draft and even UDFA. I think he will hit two this year. Who are going to be this year's big hits?

Late 3rd rounder, DT Brodric Martin.

5th Rounder, OL Colby Sorsdal.

7th Round, WR Antoine Green

UDFA running back Mohamed Ibrahim.

I think Martin and Sorsdal are both projects, which incredible physical attributes. Definitely practice squad with a shot at being a depth piece. If either becomes a starter in a couple of years, that would be an amazing pick.

I believe both Green and Ibrahim have a real shot at the 53-man roster as WR5 and RB3/RB4. More as special teamers, but also getting an occasional touch.

I am not seeing an ARSB or James Houston yet, but I think all four of these guys have potential to surprise on the up side and be a far bigger impact that anyone suspects. That said, my pick is going to be Sosdal as being the biggest surprise by eventually becoming a starter.
Click to expand...
Nice article today on Sorsdal on the Pride of Detroit site.
Click to expand...

article is based on this YT podcast:

Why Lions 5th-round pick Colby Sorsdal is a FUTURE STARTER w/Duke Manyweather

I got nothing against Manyweather, he's very effective at marketing himself. He's found a niche segment (preparing elite OL for the NfL Draft) and he gets how important it is to have multiple streams (social media, reality show, et al.) That's fine, good on him, the modern "entrepreneur." But he's a trainer. Not an independent evaluator. He's literally a paid hype man. Now he's been a trainer to some elite OL and his opinion carries....some weight....but he works for the player, it's in his best interest to see them succeed and to get favorable treatment in the media.
Click to expand...

The fact that Sorsdal is putting in that kind of work in itself seems promising. These are the kind of guys the Lions target, people that put in maximum effort to be the best player they can possibly be. Sorsdal is only going to help promote Merryweather's company if he can become a starter and get that second contract. Right now he is only a potential Cinderella story which has not been written.
 
Anyone concerned? Apparently Jared forgot how to play football in the last 4-1/2 months.

Lions QB Jared Goff Turns Heads After Struggling at OTAs

6 Studs from Lions OTAs, 1 Dud

***************

100 days until kickoff....

Somebody was complaining the other day the offseason is so long. Man, I feel like I just hosted a SNF watch party a few weeks ago and the opener is right around the corner.

20 weeks, 2 days since we beat the Pack....14 weeks, 2 days until we unveil 2023.

***************

Shannon Sharpe Says Detroit Lions Is Best Fit For Free Agent WR Deandre Hopkins

Why is the 2023 Detroit Lions team different?
 
Obscure, low sub YT channel I strangely enjoy - Roar of the Lions UK - did a full eval of the Lions 90-man. For a bunch of Brits who don't know jack about American football (j/k @TartanLion) they did OK I think. A few debatable placements.

Thoughts?
  • 5 Roster Cornerstone - Amon-Ra St Brown, Frank Ragnow, Penei Sewell, Aidan Hutchinson, Jack Fox
  • 8 Quality Starter - Jared Goff, David Montgomery, Taylor Decker, Jonah Jackson, Alim McNeil, C.J. Gardner-Johnson, Cam Sutton, Kerby Joseph
  • 11 Average Starter - Kalif Raymond, Hal Vaitai, Graham Glasgow, Romeo Okwara, John Cominsky, Isaiah Buggs, Alex Anzalone, Emmanuel Moseley, Tracey Walker III, Michael Badgley, Riley Patterson
  • 9 Quality Backup - Brock Wright, Josh Reynolds, Marvin Jones Jr, Germain Ifedi, Charles Harris, James Reeves-Maybin, Malcolm Rodriguez, Will Harris, Jerry Jacobs
  • 9 Replacement Level - Jason Cabinda, Matt Nelson, Kayode Awosika, Benito Jones, Christian Covington, Derrick Barnes, Brady Breeze, Scott Daly, Jake McQuade
  • 12 Incomplete Eval - Craig Reynolds, Jermar Jefferson, Greg Bell, James Mitchell, Jameson Williams, Josh Paschal, Levi Onwuzurike, James Houston IV, Jarren Williams, Chase Lucas, Ifeatu Melifonwu, Saivion Smith
  • 23 Rookie - Hendon Hooker, Adrian Marinez, Jahmyr Gibbs, Mohammed Ibrahim, Sam LaPorta, Dylan Drummond, Antoine Green, Chase Cota, Connor Galvin, Brad Cecil, Colby Sorsdal, Ryan Swoboda, Brodric Martin, Chris Smith, Cory Durden, Zach Morton, Jack Campbell, Trevor Nowaske, Brian Branch, Starling Thomas V, Brandon Joseph, Steven Gilmore, John Parker Romo
  • 10 PS Level - Nate Sudfeld, Shane Zylstra, Maurice Alexander, Trinity Benson, Tom Kennedy, Max Pircher, Ross Pierschbacher, Logan Stenberg, julian Okwara, Anthony Pittman
  • 3 Not Roster Worthy - Derrick Deese Jr, Darrin Paulo, Khalil Dorsey
edit - looks like they missed T Obinna Eze (Incomplete / PS Level)
 
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BobbyLayne said:
Anyone concerned? Apparently Jared forgot how to play football in the last 4-1/2 months.

Lions QB Jared Goff Turns Heads After Struggling at OTAs

6 Studs from Lions OTAs, 1 Dud

***************

100 days until kickoff....

Somebody was complaining the other day the offseason is so long. Man, I feel like I just hosted a SNF watch party a few weeks ago and the opener is right around the corner.

20 weeks, 2 days since we beat the Pack....14 weeks, 2 days until we unveil 2023.

***************

Shannon Sharpe Says Detroit Lions Is Best Fit For Free Agent WR Deandre Hopkins

Why is the 2023 Detroit Lions team different?
Click to expand...

Something about Goff throwing to new targets, he always stinks. I think they have to romance him a bit, before Goff warms up to them and gets them the ball.
 
We really have a 91 man roster going into camp bc OL Max Pircher doesn't count against the limit (International Pathway player.) He also won't count against the PS if they keep him around for development.

The way-too-early 53 Man Projection 2.0
  • QB (3) - Goff, Sudfeld, Hooker (Hendon probably starts the year on NFI?)
  • RB (4) - Montgomery, Gibbs, Reynolds, Ibrahim
  • FB (0) - I don't think Cabinda makes it but they do like him; just don't see the point of a guy who plays so few snaps. OFF - 98, ST - 91
  • WR (5) - ARSB, MJJ, Reynolds, Raymond, Green; Jamo on suspension first 6
  • TE (3) - LaPorta, Mitchell, Wright (seems light - think they prefer 4)
  • OL (9) - Decker-Jackson-Ragnow-Vatai-Sewell starters; Awosika, Glasgow, Ifedi, Sorsdal backups
    Offense - 24
  • 1-tech (2) - Buggs, Martin
  • 3-tech (2) - McNeil, Covington
  • 4-I/5-tech (3) - Cominsky, R. Okwara, Paschal
  • Edge (2) - Hutchinson, Harris
  • DPR/Jack (2) - Houston IV, Barnes
  • Mike (2) - Campbell, Rodriguez
  • Off LB (2) - Anzalone, Nowaske (over JRM? IDK about that)
  • LCB (2) - Sutton, Harris
  • NB (3) - CJGJ, Branch, Thomas V
  • SS (2) - Walker III, Melifonwu
  • FS (2) - Joseph, S. Smith (may start year on PUP)
  • RCB (2) - Moseley (may start year on PUP), Jacobs
    Defense - 26
  • K (1) - Patterson
  • P (1) - Fox
  • LS (1) - McQuade
    specialists - 3
 
Everything zen Lions fans are easier to take than SOLers

OTA workouts: May 31-June 2, June 12-15
Mandatory Minicamp: June 6-8

There may be news. You should ignore it (probably.)
 
I am on the edge of my seat waiting for that imminent signing of DeAndre Hopkins by Detroit. The overwhelming consensus on the interwebs is this must be done.

I think we need to work on what we have and get some of our young studs extended.
 
jon_mx said:
I am on the edge of my seat waiting for that imminent signing of DeAndre Hopkins by Detroit. The overwhelming consensus on the interwebs is this must be done.

I think we need to work on what we have and get some of our young studs extended.
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I don’t think they will want to sign him for the money and length of contract he will ask. Hopkins is said to be a 50/50 ball type of player and he is getting old. Too much like MarvinJones. Though I’d like to have him over MJ.
As you suggest money may need to spent locking up their core.
 
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@Justin_Rogers

Dan Campbell said he was out in Grand Rapids for one of his daughter's volleyball tournaments. Said he interacted with a lot of fans and got a "Don't forget about us" impression. Said he's had some thoughts about taking a portion of training camp on the road to the west side.

Question: Who is sitting out today?
Campbell: I don't know, 15 to 20 guys, maybe 30.

***************

MCDC 1st Day of Mini Camp presser

Said both the Giants and Jaguars joint practices will be for 2 sessions.
Asked about defensive players talking trash, said they have a chip on their shoulder. "We want to be a top-tier defense."
"Jared Goff is a better QB now than he was with the Rams. We ask him to do a lot more, in my opinion, than what they were actually doing out there. He's light years ahead of where he was two years ago."
 
LaPorta and Gibbs seem to be getting the most raves early on. More people are doubful that Levi will ever suit up again.
 
Head Coach Dan Campbell speaks to the media June 7
  • opened answering questions about Charles Harris & Romeo Okwara, how each looks coming off injury (2nd yr back fm Achilles for R.O.)
  • Alim McNeil’s role + leadership by example (transformed his body - 13% lower body fat but still at 325)
  • stopping the run a point of emphasis this year
  • "Nobody is counting (Derrick) Barnes out."

    Says the third-year LB is having a good spring.
  • on C.J. Gardner-Johnson: "He's got contagious energy"
  • all the veteran DBs are **** talkers & very vocal
 
Pride of Detroit mini camp report:

CB Starling Thomas V​

The man who was matched up against Williams for much of the day had some good battles with him. He tallied at least two pass breakups while in coverage—although he likely would’ve been called for at least two penalties on the day, as well. Still, for an undrafted rookie to be involved in some serious battles with a first-round talent is impressive.

Thomas also closed out practice with an interception. The Lions were a little more shorthanded on defense than usual—Jerry Jacobs sat out most of the second part of practice—so Thomas got a little run with the first-team defense. During 7-on-7s with the first-team offense—but against the third-team offense—Thomas jumped in front of an Adrian Martinez pass for a clean interception where he read the quarterback’s eyes perfectly.

Due to his elite athleticism and special teams capabilities, Thomas has already been identified as a rookie UDFA who could make a crack at the 53-man roster. If he strings together practices like this, it will help his case.

********************

Called on Day 3 of the draft after we signed him as a UDFA - he is making the team. Also doing good work as gunner on punt returns (he'll likely be mostly a STer this year. Kid has the traits to develop into a starting CB.
 
Going to be following the Lions this year. Thought last years team was the best team the Eagles faced in the regular season. The pressure your front created really had Hurts on the run.
 
Can the Lions have the number one offense in NFL?

My expectation is #2 behind KC. If Jamo was around for the full year, I think they could challenge KC. I still see about 6800 yards, 4600 passing, 2200 rushing. It may be hard to match last season's consistently (fewest drives ending in a punt or turnover), but the Lions will have more explosive weapons at RB, WR, and TE. Barring some disaster, I do not see the Lions finishing below 3rd.
ETA: I think every year we need to put a blank paper in front of Ben Johnson and ask him what it will take for him to stay another season. And then pay it.
 
No more Dalvin Cook, no more Aaron Rodgers. What is happening to the NFC North?

Regarding Cook I’m happy that the Eagles have hitched themselves for the time being to Swift. They could still take a look at Cook but less likely. I could end up with egg on my face but trading Swift to the Eagles may end up being an act of sabotage.
 
Moonlight said:
No more Dalvin Cook, no more Aaron Rodgers. What is happening to the NFC North?

Regarding Cook I’m happy that the Eagles have hitched themselves for the time being to Swift. They could still take a look at Cook but less likely. I could end up with egg on my face but trading Swift to the Eagles may end up being an act of sabotage.
Click to expand...

Rodgers wasn't Rodgers last year. Vintage Rodgers beat the Lions both times last year and at his age I doubt that guy is coming back. The same can be said for Cook he hasn't been that good for a couple of years now. The Vikings were good last year because of Cousins, Jefferson and some crazy good fortune.
 
Moonlight said:
No more Dalvin Cook, no more Aaron Rodgers. What is happening to the NFC North?

Regarding Cook I’m happy that the Eagles have hitched themselves for the time being to Swift. They could still take a look at Cook but less likely. I could end up with egg on my face but trading Swift to the Eagles may end up being an act of sabotage.
Click to expand...

I would not go as far as calling it sabotage, but it is kind of like Hock. Both are very good and talented players who can contribute and make big plays in the NFL. But neither were all-in on football, willing to put in that knee-cap biting effort. Both of them go down too easily and don't have that fire in them.

It is probably too much to call them a cancer, but they are not champions. Maybe it was sabotage. It is funny that good teams seem willing to feed on Lions table scraps that the Lions don't want. I would say that has never happened, but then it kind of did under Patricia. But he gave away to good teams the few pieces we had worth keeping. I never shed a tear getting rid of Hock or Swift, but getting rid of Slay sickened me to the point I checked out on Patricia. Hock and Swift were disappointing with respect to their potential. I am happy the Vikings and Philly have them. Both of them can draw an occasional cut, but neither of them are going to kill you.
 
My initial thoughts on the 2021 draft was that it was top 3 in Lions history. After two season, not sure it is quite top 3, but still one of the best draft classes the Lions have ever had. Current status:
The best young offensive linemen in the league and getting better. Easy A+

Lions underestimated his injuries, and his back issues have largely made him a bust to this point. Very talented, but still a long-shot to be healthy enough to play at a high level: D

Decent player who is working hard and making strides. Will be interesting how his new leaner and meaning body will elevate his game. B- (with upside).
A bit disappointing due to injuries and not finding the right niche that fits his abilities. Is making progress, but may find himself cut in a position group which is vastly improved. C-

May have been the biggest steal in the draft. Finding a reciever with elite level production in the 4th round is rare. A+
Did not make the immediate impact on defense that was hoped, and mostly been a role player. Seems to be balling out in camp this year, enough to stay on the squad, but just as a depth piece. C
As a 7th Round pick, still being around is good. RB room is very good, and Jermar is on the bubble. Shows flashes, but may need to find a role on special teams. C+

SUMMARY: Just by getting two absolute studs makes this draft a top 10 draft in Lions history. The development of Alim into a better player would elevate the class even higher. There is still some hope one of the others could become productive starters. B+

It was a very nice start to the Brad Holmes era. A couple of UFDAs had some impact too.
 
 
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Moonlight said:
BobbyLayne said:

The Lions Hype Train is Unhinged (and correct)​

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Hour and a fifteen minutes! A little too much for me at the moment.
Bobby please if you listened to this can you give a summary?
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It is very worthwhile. Really deep dive into the how often they use different schemes they run and how effective they were. Dives into things like how the Lions blitzed more than any other team on 3rd and long, despite it not really working for them. Only about 1/3rd of the way through.
 
[Lutz] 5 highest-paid offensive line units ahead of training camp 2023:

1 - Detroit Lions ($64 million)
2 - Houston Texans ($62.9 million)
3 - Atlanta Falcons ($62.6 million)
4 - Cincinnati Bengals ($58.2 million)
5 - Cleveland Browns ($56.3 million)

******************

I like that they have their contracts structured so that they’re each expiring a different year.
 
BobbyLayne said:
[Lutz] 5 highest-paid offensive line units ahead of training camp 2023:

1 - Detroit Lions ($64 million)
2 - Houston Texans ($62.9 million)
3 - Atlanta Falcons ($62.6 million)
4 - Cincinnati Bengals ($58.2 million)
5 - Cleveland Browns ($56.3 million)

******************

I like that they have their contracts structured so that they’re each expiring a different year.
Click to expand...
Good place to have a lot of money invested.
 
Do we have any weak positional group this year? I really don't see one.

Our weakest is probably LB, but that is an improving unit.
 
jon_mx said:
Do we have any weak positional group this year? I really don't see one.

Our weakest is probably LB, but that is an improving unit.
Click to expand...
Receiver is thin for the first 6 weeks. If amon-ra tweaks an ankle during that time, it could be an issue.

Defensive tackle, maybe.
 
QB ⬆️ Quality starter and developing backups
WR ⬆️ Jamo > Chark; as good as ARSB was a year ago, I think he's going to be even better this year
RB ➡️ debatable - we'd like to think Monty>Jamaal + Gibbs>Swift but for now I'll say it's a wash
TE ⬆️ LaPorta could be pretty special Y2 onward, not sure about this year, but the other guys were productive in limited utilization
T ➡️ No changes if Nelson is still the swing tackle, & we hope Sewell continues to refine his craft, he's already a top RT
G ⬆️ Big V seems to be tracking to playing again, potentially good depth with Graham + Sorsdal
C ⬇️ Ragnow is tough as nails but he'll be in pain all year (inoperable foot injury); Pierschbacher is a downgrade from Evan Brown
K ⬇️ below average and they don't have a solution

Overall, they should continue to be a very good gap run scheme team. The exceptional (Top 5) OL and Goff-to-ARSB is a stellar baselane. Explosives could come from Jamo, Gibbs, and LaPorta - but those are not proven commodities. Ben Johnson is an elite OC and his play calling gives Detroit a schematic advantage most weeks. Should easily be Top Ten offensively with potential to be Top 5 (their passing attack was 4th in EPA last year.) There are no weaknesses here, except for QB and St Brown they could absorb an injury and not lose much with the next man up. With stars - but no true superstars - the sum is greater than the )(very) talented parts. Fundamentally sound team that doesn't beat itself, takes care of the ball and doesn't make too many penalties. Details are everything for this team.

DT ⬆️ McNeil has transformed his body (lost 13% of body fat but still 325), Buggs was a good resign, Martin is a project but good physical traits
ED ⬆️ Hutch should make a leap from good to great, R Okwara and Harris are healthy again, Cominsky can slide between 5-tech, 4I, 3-tech - good rotation
iLB ⬆️ As Coach Shep noted this week, they're not handing the role to Jack Campbell, but ultimately that pick should be a huge upgrade.
OLB ⬆️ Will be interesting to see the roles for Rodrigo, Barnes and James Houston IV - very different skills. Houston was not very disciplined in his responsibilities but was an elite pass rusher.
CB ⬆️ Massive upgrades with the Moseley and Sutton signings, and Jerry Jacobs will fight for a starting spot.
NB ⬆️ CJGJ, Brian Branch & a little Will Harris - raised the floorhere considerably.
S ⬆️ Will Kerby make a leap in Y2? I think so. Remarkably, Tracy Walker will be fully cleared for TC. CJGJ or Branch might end up here as needed.
P ⬆️ Coming off something of a down year by his own lofty standards, Jack Fox is a weapon. Decent passer as well lol.

The offense was great last year; the defense was awful, especially in the first third. After the Miami game they were forced to fundamentally change their defense after 7 g bc they simply did not have the right dudes to play the coverage they wanted. They played a ton of cover zero while going 1-6 - more than anyone in the NFL through week 8 - and rarely thereafter. But I promise you the approach has not changed. They are going right back to what they want to be, bc now they think they have the dudes who can run it. Overall, their pass EPA still ended up 28th. But first half they were historically awful (worst EPA since 2000) and were run of the mill bad the last ten games. They still ended up 15th in calling cover zero - almost all of them the first 7 games - and 2nd in Cover 1. They left their corners on an island a lot. The ended up 8th most in Cover 2, mostly reflecting how they played Weeks 9-18. They rarely play Cover 3 except early downs, hardly ever play quarters or quarter-half (that Fangio b.s. the Vikings butchered so badly last year.) Campbell and AG want an aggressive man coverage D with heavy blitzes on 3rd and long. This team will never at its core be a "let's keep everything in front of us" bend but don't break defense. They don't run many stunts bc they are almost always bringing 5 or 6 rushers. They are going to play a defense that reflects the character of their team - line up, man on man, bring pressure, let's see if you can beat us bc we don't think you can.

There are no holes on this defense IMO. This team will be so much better with the upgrades they made to the secondary. There's a lot of moving parts and a lot of things are in flux - will Pachal stay healthy, can Onwuzurike ever get on the field, will the young stars keep developing - but I'm really excited about what they will be doing on the defensive side this year. We are not thin at any position group, if (when injuries hit I think they have good depth.

jon_mx said:
Do we have any weak positional group this year? I really don't see one.

Our weakest is probably LB, but that is an improving unit.
Click to expand...

IMO, no - but as always, it depends partly on keeping guys healthy. Injuries are always a factor, we probably could not afford to lose any key defenders LT. But 2-3 game injuries that require a next man up, we should be fine. They're going to bring pressure, they're going to be a vocal, loud and obnoxious defense, and it's going to be really fun to watch when they get on a roll. And bc they will be playing very aggressively and it's impossible to always win those matchups, they'll have some spectacular failures. But I think more than we ever saw in Y1/Y2, the defense will become a huge part of their identity.

IMO they probably have to win 12 games to secure a home playoff game. That's a huge ask, especially for a franchise which has exactly six double digit win seasons since 1962. But they have all the right pieces, the leadership, the talent - it's a matter of execution.
 
BobbyLayne said:
IMO they probably have to win 12 games to secure a home playoff game. That's a huge ask, especially for a franchise which has exactly six double digit win seasons since 1962. But they have all the right pieces, the leadership, the talent - it's a matter of execution.
Click to expand...
11-6 might be enough to win this division, but 12 wins should seal it good.
 
Leroy Hoard said:
BobbyLayne said:
IMO they probably have to win 12 games to secure a home playoff game. That's a huge ask, especially for a franchise which has exactly six double digit win seasons since 1962. But they have all the right pieces, the leadership, the talent - it's a matter of execution.
Click to expand...
11-6 might be enough to win this division, but 12 wins should seal it good.
Click to expand...

Before I started my summer-lomg project of doing a deep dive into all 32 teams I was thinking 10-11 wins puts at the 3 seed.

The NFC South will once again be the weak sister division. Though I suppose in the NFL it's always possible a team has a horseshoe-up-their-butt year like the 2022 Vikings. Atlanta had a really interesting (in a quietly impressive way) offseason but they are weak af at QB. Carolina is in full rebuild, no offensive identity rn, Goff Junior will be starting, WR corps is undefined, Sanders might have a nice year but they're going to struggle overall. The Bucs and Saints are in a race to the bottom, I will be shocked if Bowles and Allen survive - they're not bankrupt but like a few teams they're doing a build the plane as we land it retool.

Which leaves Detroit, theoretically, battling SF for the 2/3 seeds, presuming stability at QB for them. The incumbent WCs - SEA, DAL and NYG - probably are the favorites to repeat, again though we know statistically 50% of the playoff teams likely won't get back to the postseason. I'm not a believer in the rosters for the LAR or WAS, and ARI is a hot mess. Unless something crazy happens PHI is the team to beat in the NFC.

In the NFC North, the Bears had a lot of roster turnover. They'll still be running a lot of wide zone RPO, the DJ Moore trade was huge, still have a solid RB room, but they're mid-stream right now. They're going to be better but until Fields makes a massive leap as a passer they're unlikely to win more than 6-7 games IMO. They have some promising players on defense but Ryan Poles has stubbed his toe a few times in roster construction. Surely the defense won't be as pathetic as a year go. Still not convinced they're building anything significant yet.

We expect the Pack to have a losing season bc Jordan Love is probably not the guy - they sort of agree when you look at that half-measures sort-of-an-extension they handed him. They were very mid last year, could have easily been a 6 win team a year ago. Considering where they came from over the second half, almost overachieved getting to 8-8 before Detroit smacked them in the mouth. As excited as we all were that Ben Johnson returned as the Lions OC, I was almost as thrilled when the Packers retained Joe Berry as the DC. LVN might eventually help out, maybe Quay has a bounce back Y2 and makes a leap, but rn it's looking like they really don't have the dudes to rush 4 and succeed. Good back end but lousy scheme (IMO.)

The Vikings still have a very potent offense, Addison is an upgrade at WR (no disrespect to Thielen but he's been declining), Mattison is very capable, Hock should ball out, Captain Kirk is fine. Defensively they are ****ed nine ways to Sunday if they don't work it out with Danielle Hunter. But I expect their pass defense to be vastly improved bc replacing Donatell with Brian Flores will transform their coverage scheme. They were horribly mismatched last year running that stupid Fangio quarters/quarter-half garbage that half the league is infected with rn. They have the right guys to run a much more aggressive (& way less predictive) defense. You're still going to have to keep up to beat them bc JJ is the best player in the division by a good margin. MInnesota might win a couple less games but the team will be better than last year's incredibly lucky 13-4 squad (11-0 in one-score games, negative points differential on the season.)

Anyway, who knows in mid-June, right? What we learn every year is we're never sure about the middle 75%. We have a pretty good idea which teams are elite, it's usually obvious who will be tanking for a top 4 pick, and almost anything can happen amongst the other 3/4 of the NFL. It's why we love the sport so much - it's never obvious who is really good, average or really bad. With the hard cap and annual personnel overturn, what happened last year means little. Every team has to learn how to win again.

I like our chances to win the NFC North, but man it's not easy winning 11, 12, or more games. Lot of different factors could screw it up, but from a roster construction view and leadership standpoint, we can compete with anyone.
 
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