Adrian Peterson, retired (7 Viewers)

[tone1oc]

Can we talk about how he looks flat out awful on about 90% of his runs? It's amazing to me that he keeps on ripping off a long run almost every game which definitely masks the odor of most of his production.

I'm not trying to cherry pick stats here, but I read that he has the largest %age of runs of < 2yds (can't remember where I saw the stat the past week or so, I did some searching and couldn't find). I think his decline has already started, though its still masked by volume.

Sure. The offensive line has not been playing well until the most recent game against the Bears. Part of that is because they played against Denver (very good defense) and KC who effectively run blitzed and caused a lot of tackles for loss because the offensive line isn't good enough. The Vikings have had some success in the passing game and the Bears do not have the personnel on defense to apply pressure and run blitz the way that Denver and KC can. Against the Bears Peterson did not have many long runs but instead consistently got good yardage running in the middle.

Peterson has converted many 1st downs as well. Some of the low yardage runs have been when the Vikings only needed one or two yards to get the 1st down. The offensive line has not been good enough to create any push in goal line situations.

Peterson in interview that I linked above he says himself that he has been stopping his feet when he doesn't see a hole right away. That he didn't used to do that. Some times he said he was trying to make a big play, which when you are facing 8 defenders in the box is hard to do. He says he needs to keep his feet moving and keep his power ahead of him, something he can't do if he stops his feet.

Strangely Peterson being away from the game for almost a season has him kind of starting over on a lot of things he has developed over the years. He still suck in pass protection which is strange to me. I remember being critical of former Vikings coaches for not using him in the passing game more early in his career. But Chester Taylor was much better at this aspect of the game than Peterson and I am not sure the coaches really tried to develop Peterson as a receiver. That development is on him as well, and he has stated this was a goal of his, to become a better all around RB and football player like Walter Payton was, yet it still hasn't happened.

To the current coaches credit they gave Peterson the opportunity to be more involved in the passing game. But after Peterson failed multiple pass protections over the first few games they made a change and have had Matt Asiata on 3rd downs since.

The new boss is the same as the old boss. Obviously it would be an advantage to have Peterson in the game on 3rd downs if he were good enough at it. He isn't and the coaches adapt to what the players can do or not do. Even with players as good as Peterson.

This is the kind of discussion I was trying to steer. I haven't watched every game of his, I did catch a good amount of the Bears game and a few others and I could probably concede that the O-Line isn't that good. Even with that said, it seems he used to be able to overcome that. The Bears game did include many more smaller chunk runs, which is definitely a good sign for owners. I'm not so sure though that it didn't have more to do with the Bears being bad, than him and/or oline turning the corner.

Is there something to be said that maybe he just doesn't have the quick burst he use to, but still has the long speed and power to break through second defenders? He just doesn't look like the player I'm used to seeing, even on some of his longer runs. Perhaps I'm reading to much into it.

I did dig up a few interesting stats from Rich Hribar via his weekly Worksheet on rotoworld (a great weekly read)

• Adrian Peterson leads the league in rushing attempts inside of the 5-yard line with 11, but has converted just one for a touchdown.
• Peterson has carried 69 times for 192 yards (2.8 YPC) in the first half of games this season and 51 times for 338 yards (6.6 YPC) in the second half. His 3.8 YPC increase in the second half is the second highest in the league.
• Peterson ranks 42nd in points per touch (.68) on the season out of all backs with 50 or more touches.

Thanks again for a nice breakdown.

 

[tone1oc]

Can we talk about how he looks flat out awful on about 90% of his runs? It's amazing to me that he keeps on ripping off a long run almost every game which definitely masks the odor of most of his production.

I'm not trying to cherry pick stats here, but I read that he has the largest %age of runs of < 2yds (can't remember where I saw the stat the past week or so, I did some searching and couldn't find). I think his decline has already started, though its still masked by volume.

We can talk about it, but if you've been watching games he's been getting destroyed in the backfield and still making positive yards out of it. If you're going to post that stat, please post his yards after contact to compare.

I do not have access to the advanced stats, but I'd like to see where he stacks up in this department.

 

[Biabreakable]

Can we talk about how he looks flat out awful on about 90% of his runs? It's amazing to me that he keeps on ripping off a long run almost every game which definitely masks the odor of most of his production.

I'm not trying to cherry pick stats here, but I read that he has the largest %age of runs of < 2yds (can't remember where I saw the stat the past week or so, I did some searching and couldn't find). I think his decline has already started, though its still masked by volume.

Sure. The offensive line has not been playing well until the most recent game against the Bears. Part of that is because they played against Denver (very good defense) and KC who effectively run blitzed and caused a lot of tackles for loss because the offensive line isn't good enough. The Vikings have had some success in the passing game and the Bears do not have the personnel on defense to apply pressure and run blitz the way that Denver and KC can. Against the Bears Peterson did not have many long runs but instead consistently got good yardage running in the middle.

Peterson has converted many 1st downs as well. Some of the low yardage runs have been when the Vikings only needed one or two yards to get the 1st down. The offensive line has not been good enough to create any push in goal line situations.

Peterson in interview that I linked above he says himself that he has been stopping his feet when he doesn't see a hole right away. That he didn't used to do that. Some times he said he was trying to make a big play, which when you are facing 8 defenders in the box is hard to do. He says he needs to keep his feet moving and keep his power ahead of him, something he can't do if he stops his feet.

Strangely Peterson being away from the game for almost a season has him kind of starting over on a lot of things he has developed over the years. He still suck in pass protection which is strange to me. I remember being critical of former Vikings coaches for not using him in the passing game more early in his career. But Chester Taylor was much better at this aspect of the game than Peterson and I am not sure the coaches really tried to develop Peterson as a receiver. That development is on him as well, and he has stated this was a goal of his, to become a better all around RB and football player like Walter Payton was, yet it still hasn't happened.

To the current coaches credit they gave Peterson the opportunity to be more involved in the passing game. But after Peterson failed multiple pass protections over the first few games they made a change and have had Matt Asiata on 3rd downs since.

The new boss is the same as the old boss. Obviously it would be an advantage to have Peterson in the game on 3rd downs if he were good enough at it. He isn't and the coaches adapt to what the players can do or not do. Even with players as good as Peterson.

This is the kind of discussion I was trying to steer. I haven't watched every game of his, I did catch a good amount of the Bears game and a few others and I could probably concede that the O-Line isn't that good. Even with that said, it seems he used to be able to overcome that. The Bears game did include many more smaller chunk runs, which is definitely a good sign for owners. I'm not so sure though that it didn't have more to do with the Bears being bad, than him and/or oline turning the corner.

Is there something to be said that maybe he just doesn't have the quick burst he use to, but still has the long speed and power to break through second defenders? He just doesn't look like the player I'm used to seeing, even on some of his longer runs. Perhaps I'm reading to much into it.

I did dig up a few interesting stats from Rich Hribar via his weekly Worksheet on rotoworld (a great weekly read)

• Adrian Peterson leads the league in rushing attempts inside of the 5-yard line with 11, but has converted just one for a touchdown.
• Peterson has carried 69 times for 192 yards (2.8 YPC) in the first half of games this season and 51 times for 338 yards (6.6 YPC) in the second half. His 3.8 YPC increase in the second half is the second highest in the league.
• Peterson ranks 42nd in points per touch (.68) on the season out of all backs with 50 or more touches.

Thanks again for a nice breakdown.

The things that Rich brings up have been points of emphasis of Norv Turner and Teddy Bridgewater. They want to start faster than they have. The passing game establishing itself as a threat is part of it as well. Teddy and the receivers have the advantage of these 8 man fronts and single coverage, but have not made defenses pay enough with the passing game to cause them to stop doing it.

The Rams will likely lead to another game of blitzing more similar to the Denver and KC games. The Vikings have been making adjustments to improve their pass protection and I think the offensive line is getting a little better from experience. The Vikings are playing 4 different players as starters this season with the switch of Fusco to LG.

I don't even know the names of the Bears DT but they are nothing like what the Rams have in Donald and Brockers.

The Rams are playing 3 safeties a lot, so there could be opportunities for big runs if the Vikings can get to the outside with a TE or FB matched up on Barron.

 

[TheFanatic]

The Rams know that Bridgewater is really good when he has time and really terrible when being pressured. The Rams are going to blitz all D' day on Sunday...

 

[Biabreakable]

The Rams know that Bridgewater is really good when he has time and really terrible when being pressured. The Rams are going to blitz all D' day on Sunday...

It's Greg Williams. That is going to happen every game.

Will be a difficult match up no doubt. I think Teddy needs to win this game.

 

[Bugg]

Can we talk about how he looks flat out awful on about 90% of his runs? It's amazing to me that he keeps on ripping off a long run almost every game which definitely masks the odor of most of his production.

I'm not trying to cherry pick stats here, but I read that he has the largest %age of runs of < 2yds (can't remember where I saw the stat the past week or so, I did some searching and couldn't find). I think his decline has already started, though its still masked by volume.

We can talk about it, but if you've been watching games he's been getting destroyed in the backfield and still making positive yards out of it. If you're going to post that stat, please post his yards after contact to compare.

I do not have access to the advanced stats, but I'd like to see where he stacks up in this department.

Per Pro Football Focus:

Peterson has a current Yards After Contact per Attempt of 2.16. This ranks 41 out of 54 among RB's who have 25% or more of their team's carry attempts.

For reference, L. Miller is #1 at 3.66, and D. Woodhead is #54 at 1.67.

 

[ghostguy123]

Can we talk about how he looks flat out awful on about 90% of his runs? It's amazing to me that he keeps on ripping off a long run almost every game which definitely masks the odor of most of his production.

I'm not trying to cherry pick stats here, but I read that he has the largest %age of runs of < 2yds (can't remember where I saw the stat the past week or so, I did some searching and couldn't find). I think his decline has already started, though its still masked by volume.

We can talk about it, but if you've been watching games he's been getting destroyed in the backfield and still making positive yards out of it. If you're going to post that stat, please post his yards after contact to compare.

I do not have access to the advanced stats, but I'd like to see where he stacks up in this department.

Per Pro Football Focus:

Peterson has a current Yards After Contact per Attempt of 2.16. This ranks 41 out of 54 among RB's who have 25% or more of their team's carry attempts.

For reference, L. Miller is #1 at 3.66, and D. Woodhead is #54 at 1.67.

I have a feeling that stat can be looked at 100 different ways and doesnt mean much unless everything is taken into account.

I would think being hit in the backfield would make it considerably harder to get yards after contact than when you get touched while moving forward with good momentum going.

Also, what are the yards after contact by 1 defender, by 2, by 3.................I imagine it's easier to get YAC when there is one defender there rather than 2-3.

 

[Bugg]

The Rams know that Bridgewater is really good when he has time and really terrible when being pressured. The Rams are going to blitz all D' day on Sunday...

Per Pro Football Focus (Under Pressure stats):

When under pressure, Teddy B. is tied with A. Rodgers for #18 out of 35 in completion percentage (50%) among QB's who have taken 25% or more of their team's dropbacks.

If we use PFF's accuracy percentage, which includes dropped passes data, then Teddy moves up to #13 (and two spots ahead of Rodgers) out of 35 (67.7%).

The big kicker though, is that Teddy ranks #3 out of 35 in pressure percentage (45.4%). The only 2 qbs that top him are Manziel (50.5%) and Wilson (45.6).

Also, Teddy does have a 17.4% sack rate when under pressure, which is the 14th highest out of the 35. (For reference, Rodgers is #18 at 15.9%)

On the whole, I would put him in the middle of the pack among QBs when under pressure this year.

Last year, however, he ranked #3 in completion percentage (57.9%) when under pressure, #1 overall in accuracy percentage ,(75.2%) and #13 in sack percentage (20.6%). However, his pressure percentage was only 39.9% last year, which ranked #9. Thus, this year, he is getting pressured more, while regressing some in his completion and accuracy percentages and improving in his sack rate percentage.

I don't really know what all of this means, but on the whole, I would not call it terrible.

 

[Bugg]

Can we talk about how he looks flat out awful on about 90% of his runs? It's amazing to me that he keeps on ripping off a long run almost every game which definitely masks the odor of most of his production.

I'm not trying to cherry pick stats here, but I read that he has the largest %age of runs of < 2yds (can't remember where I saw the stat the past week or so, I did some searching and couldn't find). I think his decline has already started, though its still masked by volume.

We can talk about it, but if you've been watching games he's been getting destroyed in the backfield and still making positive yards out of it. If you're going to post that stat, please post his yards after contact to compare.

I do not have access to the advanced stats, but I'd like to see where he stacks up in this department.

Per Pro Football Focus:

Peterson has a current Yards After Contact per Attempt of 2.16. This ranks 41 out of 54 among RB's who have 25% or more of their team's carry attempts.

For reference, L. Miller is #1 at 3.66, and D. Woodhead is #54 at 1.67.

I have a feeling that stat can be looked at 100 different ways and doesnt mean much unless everything is taken into account.

I would think being hit in the backfield would make it considerably harder to get yards after contact than when you get touched while moving forward with good momentum going.

Also, what are the yards after contact by 1 defender, by 2, by 3.................I imagine it's easier to get YAC when there is one defender there rather than 2-3.

I agree. I just wanted to post the only numbers available to me, since others asked about them. Also, if you look at the pressure percentage for Bridgewater this year (in my previous post above) and note that it is #3, it makes a strong case that AD is probably getting somewhat similar pressure behind the line on his rush attempts as well.

 

[Bugg]

Also, I want to note that I am fully aware that the numbers I posted above need to be filtered through actual game analysis, like ghostguy123 pointed out. I just wanted to add them to the conversation.

 

[KellysHeroes]

Not reading this thread, but ADP has been disappointing

 

[BobbyLayne]

3rd in the NFL in yards rush per game behind Gurley & Bell. 4th in 20+ runs, 2nd in 40+ runs.

I don't manage by box score but his production seems fine.

When I watch the condensed games he is still a very special runner. Not Gurley special but still pretty good.

 

[cstu]

Outside of the Chiefs game he's averaging 5 YPC

 

[kOOk]

The Rams know that Bridgewater is really good when he has time and really terrible when being pressured. The Rams are going to blitz all D' day on Sunday...

Per Pro Football Focus (Under Pressure stats):

When under pressure, Teddy B. is tied with A. Rodgers for #18 out of 35 in completion percentage (50%) among QB's who have taken 25% or more of their team's dropbacks.

If we use PFF's accuracy percentage, which includes dropped passes data, then Teddy moves up to #13 (and two spots ahead of Rodgers) out of 35 (67.7%).

The big kicker though, is that Teddy ranks #3 out of 35 in pressure percentage (45.4%). The only 2 qbs that top him are Manziel (50.5%) and Wilson (45.6).

Also, Teddy does have a 17.4% sack rate when under pressure, which is the 14th highest out of the 35. (For reference, Rodgers is #18 at 15.9%)

On the whole, I would put him in the middle of the pack among QBs when under pressure this year.

Last year, however, he ranked #3 in completion percentage (57.9%) when under pressure, #1 overall in accuracy percentage ,(75.2%) and #13 in sack percentage (20.6%). However, his pressure percentage was only 39.9% last year, which ranked #9. Thus, this year, he is getting pressured more, while regressing some in his completion and accuracy percentages and improving in his sack rate percentage.

I don't really know what all of this means, but on the whole, I would not call it terrible.

 

[Biabreakable]

I listened to Jeff Fisher and Greg Williams press conferences. Both had very positive things to say about Bridgewater and Norv Turner. Williams in particular talked about how Norv has done a good job with developing QB over his career and he sees some of those things in how Bridgewater plays. He also mentions that there are some things that Bridgewater does well that Turner has adapted to, showing his flexibility in featuring what the players do best.

I get the feeling from this that the Rams may play the Vikings more balanced than Denver or KC did and while Peterson is always the priority, perhaps they do not blitz quite as much as usual. We will see soon enough.

 

[kutta]

For reference, I just traded away AP in my 12-team, PPR dynasty league. I received Hyde and a 2016 mid-first.

 

[Faust]

Next Gen Stats: Bills skill-position players come alive

Excerpt:

3. Thanks in large part to poor blocking, Adrian Peterson's yards-after-contact average is down from previous seasons. If you're seeking evidence that he still has extraordinary short-area bust, though, Peterson reached 19.62 mph on a six-yard touchdown run versus the Rams. Of the eight other rushing touchdowns from that distance this season, no player has topped 17.00 mph.

 

[TheFanatic]

The Rams know that Bridgewater is really good when he has time and really terrible when being pressured. The Rams are going to blitz all D' day on Sunday...

Per Pro Football Focus (Under Pressure stats):

When under pressure, Teddy B. is tied with A. Rodgers for #18 out of 35 in completion percentage (50%) among QB's who have taken 25% or more of their team's dropbacks.

If we use PFF's accuracy percentage, which includes dropped passes data, then Teddy moves up to #13 (and two spots ahead of Rodgers) out of 35 (67.7%).

The big kicker though, is that Teddy ranks #3 out of 35 in pressure percentage (45.4%). The only 2 qbs that top him are Manziel (50.5%) and Wilson (45.6).

Also, Teddy does have a 17.4% sack rate when under pressure, which is the 14th highest out of the 35. (For reference, Rodgers is #18 at 15.9%)

On the whole, I would put him in the middle of the pack among QBs when under pressure this year.

Last year, however, he ranked #3 in completion percentage (57.9%) when under pressure, #1 overall in accuracy percentage ,(75.2%) and #13 in sack percentage (20.6%). However, his pressure percentage was only 39.9% last year, which ranked #9. Thus, this year, he is getting pressured more, while regressing some in his completion and accuracy percentages and improving in his sack rate percentage.

I don't really know what all of this means, but on the whole, I would not call it terrible.

That's funny, because according to Bernie Miklatz of 101.1 ESPN in St. Louis and former columnist for the paper, Bridgewater has a 60 passer rating when he's pressured, which is only 2 points above Nick Foles who is maybe the worst starting QB in the league. He also states that the Vikings are one of the top teams in terms of plays that net negative yards. So he might be completing passes, but a lot of them are for negative yards.

 

[TheFanatic]

Not reading this thread, but ADP has been disappointing

3rd in standard scoring league and 5th in PPR. Yeah, he sucks.

 

[tone1oc]

Not reading this thread, but ADP has been disappointing

3rd in standard scoring league and 5th in PPR. Yeah, he sucks.

He said he was disappointing, not that he sucks. With the amount of injuries/suspensions/poor play at RB, 3rd sounds a lot better than it is. He's RB8 in standard on a per game basis, that's backend RB1 and not what many owners were expecting this year.

The RB landscape is a mess and he is producing, so not that disappointing in the larger picture.

 

[Biabreakable]

What is disappointing is Petersons pass protection. I was optimistic that Peterson could be involved in the passing game more than he has. He did get the opportunity to play 3rd down over the first few games but they have been using Asiata there since. Peterson still gets targets on early downs occasionally but they do not really run screens with him. So that potential has gone away.

 

[Bugg]

The Rams know that Bridgewater is really good when he has time and really terrible when being pressured. The Rams are going to blitz all D' day on Sunday...

Per Pro Football Focus (Under Pressure stats):

When under pressure, Teddy B. is tied with A. Rodgers for #18 out of 35 in completion percentage (50%) among QB's who have taken 25% or more of their team's dropbacks.

If we use PFF's accuracy percentage, which includes dropped passes data, then Teddy moves up to #13 (and two spots ahead of Rodgers) out of 35 (67.7%).

The big kicker though, is that Teddy ranks #3 out of 35 in pressure percentage (45.4%). The only 2 qbs that top him are Manziel (50.5%) and Wilson (45.6).

Also, Teddy does have a 17.4% sack rate when under pressure, which is the 14th highest out of the 35. (For reference, Rodgers is #18 at 15.9%)

On the whole, I would put him in the middle of the pack among QBs when under pressure this year.

Last year, however, he ranked #3 in completion percentage (57.9%) when under pressure, #1 overall in accuracy percentage ,(75.2%) and #13 in sack percentage (20.6%). However, his pressure percentage was only 39.9% last year, which ranked #9. Thus, this year, he is getting pressured more, while regressing some in his completion and accuracy percentages and improving in his sack rate percentage.

I don't really know what all of this means, but on the whole, I would not call it terrible.

That's funny, because according to Bernie Miklatz of 101.1 ESPN in St. Louis and former columnist for the paper, Bridgewater has a 60 passer rating when he's pressured, which is only 2 points above Nick Foles who is maybe the worst starting QB in the league. He also states that the Vikings are one of the top teams in terms of plays that net negative yards. So he might be completing passes, but a lot of them are for negative yards.

Funny? Just stats, not sure what is funny about them?

Anyways, you say Teddy B. has a 60 passer rating when under pressure. Is that QBR, PFF QB Rating or classic NFL Passer Rating? Where does it rank across the entire NFL?

This may be a very valid piece of evidence, but as it stands, it needs more depth in my opinion. I did some searching to find an answer to my questions, but I could not find anything helpful.

Also, in regards to the negative yardage plays, what percent are run? What % are pass? What % are pass when the QB is under pressure? Like the above, without more depth, these statements are not very definitive in regards to what we are specifically discussing (Teddy's performance under pressure).

I am not trying to claim your points are not valid, rather, I am trying to put them into context. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[Biabreakable]

According to PFR here are the top 32 QB sorted by QBR

1 Tom Brady 113.5
2 Andy Dalton 111
3 Carson Palmer 110.2
4 Tyrod Taylor 108.9
5 Aaron Rodgers 108.2
6 Derek Carr 104.3
7 Drew Brees 102.8
8 Marcus Mariota 101
9 Philip Rivers 100.7
10 Brian Hoyer 97.1
11 Eli Manning 96.9
12 Josh McCown 95.2
13 Russell Wilson 95
14 Matt Ryan 92.4
15 Ben Roethlisberger 92.2
16 Alex Smith 92.1
17 Jay Cutler 89.6
18 Ryan Fitzpatrick 89.3
19 Ryan Tannehill 88.7
20 Matthew Stafford 84.1
21 Jameis Winston 84
22 Teddy Bridgewater 83.4
23 Blake Bortles 83.2
24 Kirk Cousins 82.9
25 Joe Flacco 82.8
26 Cam Newton 81.4
27 Nick Foles 79.7
28 Sam Bradford 79.5
29 Colin Kaepernick 78.5
30 Peyton Manning 75.6
31 Andrew Luck 74.9
32 Ryan Mallett 63.6

Here they are sorted by ESPN total QB rating

3 Carson Palmer 84.76
2 Andy Dalton 77.65
18 Ryan Fitzpatrick 76.71
5 Aaron Rodgers 74.3
1 Tom Brady 73.9
4 Tyrod Taylor 72.61
7 Drew Brees 71.17
11 Eli Manning 70.06
10 Brian Hoyer 69.39
15 Ben Roethlisberger 68.37
6 Derek Carr 66.62
17 Jay Cutler 65.9
14 Matt Ryan 65.13
9 Philip Rivers 64.15
13 Russell Wilson 63.46
22 Teddy Bridgewater 62.28
21 Jameis Winston 59.71
23 Blake Bortles 59.44
8 Marcus Mariota 58.46
24 Kirk Cousins 56.23
30 Peyton Manning 54.17
12 Josh McCown 52.78
32 Ryan Mallett 51.5
26 Cam Newton 50.67
20 Matthew Stafford 50.1
16 Alex Smith 49.49
31 Andrew Luck 47.57
29 Colin Kaepernick 47.14
25 Joe Flacco 44.48
27 Nick Foles 37.89
28 Sam Bradford 35.27
19 Ryan Tannehill 33.59

 

[TheFanatic]

The Rams know that Bridgewater is really good when he has time and really terrible when being pressured. The Rams are going to blitz all D' day on Sunday...

Per Pro Football Focus (Under Pressure stats):

When under pressure, Teddy B. is tied with A. Rodgers for #18 out of 35 in completion percentage (50%) among QB's who have taken 25% or more of their team's dropbacks.

If we use PFF's accuracy percentage, which includes dropped passes data, then Teddy moves up to #13 (and two spots ahead of Rodgers) out of 35 (67.7%).

The big kicker though, is that Teddy ranks #3 out of 35 in pressure percentage (45.4%). The only 2 qbs that top him are Manziel (50.5%) and Wilson (45.6).

Also, Teddy does have a 17.4% sack rate when under pressure, which is the 14th highest out of the 35. (For reference, Rodgers is #18 at 15.9%)

On the whole, I would put him in the middle of the pack among QBs when under pressure this year.

Last year, however, he ranked #3 in completion percentage (57.9%) when under pressure, #1 overall in accuracy percentage ,(75.2%) and #13 in sack percentage (20.6%). However, his pressure percentage was only 39.9% last year, which ranked #9. Thus, this year, he is getting pressured more, while regressing some in his completion and accuracy percentages and improving in his sack rate percentage.

I don't really know what all of this means, but on the whole, I would not call it terrible.

That's funny, because according to Bernie Miklatz of 101.1 ESPN in St. Louis and former columnist for the paper, Bridgewater has a 60 passer rating when he's pressured, which is only 2 points above Nick Foles who is maybe the worst starting QB in the league. He also states that the Vikings are one of the top teams in terms of plays that net negative yards. So he might be completing passes, but a lot of them are for negative yards.

Funny? Just stats, not sure what is funny about them?

Anyways, you say Teddy B. has a 60 passer rating when under pressure. Is that QBR, PFF QB Rating or classic NFL Passer Rating? Where does it rank across the entire NFL?

This may be a very valid piece of evidence, but as it stands, it needs more depth in my opinion. I did some searching to find an answer to my questions, but I could not find anything helpful.

Also, in regards to the negative yardage plays, what percent are run? What % are pass? What % are pass when the QB is under pressure? Like the above, without more depth, these statements are not very definitive in regards to what we are specifically discussing (Teddy's performance under pressure).

I am not trying to claim your points are not valid, rather, I am trying to put them into context. Any help would be appreciated.

All I know is that Miklatz on his radio show said that Bridgewater had a 60 something passer rating when pressured and over 100 when not. Whether he's middle of the road, high, or low at 60, it would be of benefit to pressure the guy in order to win the game.

Completion % is a nice stat, but it doesn't tell the whole story. A guy like Nick Foles that throws really short passes can complete them, but pretty much can't do that on 3rd and anything longer than about 3 yards.

 

[TheFanatic]

According to PFR here are the top 32 QB sorted by QBR

1 Tom Brady 113.5
2 Andy Dalton 111
3 Carson Palmer 110.2
4 Tyrod Taylor 108.9
5 Aaron Rodgers 108.2
6 Derek Carr 104.3
7 Drew Brees 102.8
8 Marcus Mariota 101
9 Philip Rivers 100.7
10 Brian Hoyer 97.1
11 Eli Manning 96.9
12 Josh McCown 95.2
13 Russell Wilson 95
14 Matt Ryan 92.4
15 Ben Roethlisberger 92.2
16 Alex Smith 92.1
17 Jay Cutler 89.6
18 Ryan Fitzpatrick 89.3
19 Ryan Tannehill 88.7
20 Matthew Stafford 84.1
21 Jameis Winston 84
22 Teddy Bridgewater 83.4
23 Blake Bortles 83.2
24 Kirk Cousins 82.9
25 Joe Flacco 82.8
26 Cam Newton 81.4
27 Nick Foles 79.7
28 Sam Bradford 79.5
29 Colin Kaepernick 78.5
30 Peyton Manning 75.6
31 Andrew Luck 74.9
32 Ryan Mallett 63.6

Here they are sorted by ESPN total QB rating

3 Carson Palmer 84.76
2 Andy Dalton 77.65
18 Ryan Fitzpatrick 76.71
5 Aaron Rodgers 74.3
1 Tom Brady 73.9
4 Tyrod Taylor 72.61
7 Drew Brees 71.17
11 Eli Manning 70.06
10 Brian Hoyer 69.39
15 Ben Roethlisberger 68.37
6 Derek Carr 66.62
17 Jay Cutler 65.9
14 Matt Ryan 65.13
9 Philip Rivers 64.15
13 Russell Wilson 63.46
22 Teddy Bridgewater 62.28
21 Jameis Winston 59.71
23 Blake Bortles 59.44
8 Marcus Mariota 58.46
24 Kirk Cousins 56.23
30 Peyton Manning 54.17
12 Josh McCown 52.78
32 Ryan Mallett 51.5
26 Cam Newton 50.67
20 Matthew Stafford 50.1
16 Alex Smith 49.49
31 Andrew Luck 47.57
29 Colin Kaepernick 47.14
25 Joe Flacco 44.48
27 Nick Foles 37.89
28 Sam Bradford 35.27
19 Ryan Tannehill 33.59

And the splits of when pressured and when not?

 

[Biabreakable]

According to PFR here are the top 32 QB sorted by QBR

1 Tom Brady 113.5
2 Andy Dalton 111
3 Carson Palmer 110.2
4 Tyrod Taylor 108.9
5 Aaron Rodgers 108.2
6 Derek Carr 104.3
7 Drew Brees 102.8
8 Marcus Mariota 101
9 Philip Rivers 100.7
10 Brian Hoyer 97.1
11 Eli Manning 96.9
12 Josh McCown 95.2
13 Russell Wilson 95
14 Matt Ryan 92.4
15 Ben Roethlisberger 92.2
16 Alex Smith 92.1
17 Jay Cutler 89.6
18 Ryan Fitzpatrick 89.3
19 Ryan Tannehill 88.7
20 Matthew Stafford 84.1
21 Jameis Winston 84
22 Teddy Bridgewater 83.4
23 Blake Bortles 83.2
24 Kirk Cousins 82.9
25 Joe Flacco 82.8
26 Cam Newton 81.4
27 Nick Foles 79.7
28 Sam Bradford 79.5
29 Colin Kaepernick 78.5
30 Peyton Manning 75.6
31 Andrew Luck 74.9
32 Ryan Mallett 63.6

Here they are sorted by ESPN total QB rating

3 Carson Palmer 84.76
2 Andy Dalton 77.65
18 Ryan Fitzpatrick 76.71
5 Aaron Rodgers 74.3
1 Tom Brady 73.9
4 Tyrod Taylor 72.61
7 Drew Brees 71.17
11 Eli Manning 70.06
10 Brian Hoyer 69.39
15 Ben Roethlisberger 68.37
6 Derek Carr 66.62
17 Jay Cutler 65.9
14 Matt Ryan 65.13
9 Philip Rivers 64.15
13 Russell Wilson 63.46
22 Teddy Bridgewater 62.28
21 Jameis Winston 59.71
23 Blake Bortles 59.44
8 Marcus Mariota 58.46
24 Kirk Cousins 56.23
30 Peyton Manning 54.17
12 Josh McCown 52.78
32 Ryan Mallett 51.5
26 Cam Newton 50.67
20 Matthew Stafford 50.1
16 Alex Smith 49.49
31 Andrew Luck 47.57
29 Colin Kaepernick 47.14
25 Joe Flacco 44.48
27 Nick Foles 37.89
28 Sam Bradford 35.27
19 Ryan Tannehill 33.59

And the splits of when pressured and when not?

I don't have that data.

Bridgewater has been pressured on a high percentage of his throws. Above 40% the last time I saw a stat specifically about him being under pressure.

ETA - Listening to Norse Code.

According to PFF

Teddy under pressure 45.1%
Carr under pressure 26.1%

Most QB lose about 30 points of QB Rating when under pressure.

 

[Ladsud]

Yeah

 

[tjnc09]

I thought he looked like crap. It looked to me like he was struggling in pass protection as well... like the speed of the game caught him off guard all over again.

As far as "showing flashes"... guys do that just as often on their way OUT as UP, so I wouldn't get too warm over that.

I think we came away with very different impressions of Peterson.

To me he looked explosive with power, speed and effort in his very limited opportunities with very few holes.

Dude's faced stacked fronts his whole career, but I can think of thirty (30) reasons why it's more of a problem now than it was in Fall 2013.

one of the worst posts ever in the shark pool....and that's saying a lot.

 

[snellman]

He has almost identical yds after 9 games this year (961) as he had the year he went over 2000 (960). He has been looking better week by week just like he did that year as well. Will he go for over 2000 this year? Probably not, but I wouldn't bet against him.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Status Update 11/15/15: Adrian Peterson is *still the best running the football and maybe the best since Jim Brown, Gale Sayers and Barry Sanders.

 

[skol asylum]

He has almost identical yds after 9 games this year (961) as he had the year he went over 2000 (960). He has been looking better week by week just like he did that year as well. Will he go for over 2000 this year? Probably not, but I wouldn't bet against him.

Amazing he has this many yards with this line.

 

[Shutout]

Really looks to be much more in the groove these past few weeks. Vikings are flying under the radar, as a whole.

Pete could have something to really play for in the ff playoffs

 

[az_prof]

Status Update 11/15/15: Adrian Peterson is *still the best running the football and maybe the best since Jim Brown, Gale Sayers and Barry Sanders.

I was there in Oakland today and AP is a HOF back. I think he will keep performing until he has another serious injury.

 

[kOOk]

Can we talk about how he looks flat out awful on about 90% of his runs? It's amazing to me that he keeps on ripping off a long run almost every game which definitely masks the odor of most of his production.

I'm not trying to cherry pick stats here, but I read that he has the largest %age of runs of < 2yds (can't remember where I saw the stat the past week or so, I did some searching and couldn't find). I think his decline has already started, though its still masked by volume.

 

[KellysHeroes]

Not reading this thread, but ADP has been disappointing

3rd in standard scoring league and 5th in PPR. Yeah, he sucks.

He said he was disappointing, not that he sucks. With the amount of injuries/suspensions/poor play at RB, 3rd sounds a lot better than it is. He's RB8 in standard on a per game basis, that's backend RB1 and not what many owners were expecting this year.

The RB landscape is a mess and he is producing, so not that disappointing in the larger picture.

This, in a yr where so many top RBs are hurt and disappointing; a healthy ADP should be blowing them away. Now he has stepped it up the last 2 weeks which is great since I got him on 4 playoff contenders so maybe he just needed a half dozen games to get going.

 

[Biabreakable]

I do think Peterson has been a bit rusty in some areas from having a full season off. Things like fumbling is something he has needed to focus on improving again, thankfully the Vikings have recovered most of his fumbles.

As he mentions, he has been stopping his feet when a clear hole doesn't open right away, that he will focus on keeping his feet moving because that is how he keeps his power and momentum in front of him.

He has never been good in pass protection. Something he has said he wants to get better at and become a good all around RB. Well he may have been working on it, but he hasn't gotten better. The Vikings gave him the opportunity to prove he can be trusted there over the first four games. He failed a lot and the Vikings have pulled him from 3rd down situations now.

Peterson leads the league in rushing yards at 961. The next closest player in this category is Chris Johnson at 734. So Peterson has a 227 yards lead on the rest of the league.

Peterson is 3rd overall in total yards from scrimmage at 1099. Only Antonio Brown and Devonta Freeman are ahead of him. Freeman is ahead of him by 42 yards due to having 29 more receptions.

In standard leagues Peterson is RB 2 behind Freeman with 139.9 points. RB 10 and below do not have 100 points yet.

In PPR leagues Peterson is RB 4 behind Freeman, Ingram, Miller with 156.9 points.

Only two players are averaging over 100 yards rushing per game. Peterson at 106.8 yards/game and Gurley at 101.3 yards/game.

 

[Sabertooth]

He whipped the Raiders in their nuts yesterday. Great guy.

 

[TheFanatic]

I do think Peterson has been a bit rusty in some areas from having a full season off. Things like fumbling is something he has needed to focus on improving again, thankfully the Vikings have recovered most of his fumbles.

As he mentions, he has been stopping his feet when a clear hole doesn't open right away, that he will focus on keeping his feet moving because that is how he keeps his power and momentum in front of him.

He has never been good in pass protection. Something he has said he wants to get better at and become a good all around RB. Well he may have been working on it, but he hasn't gotten better. The Vikings gave him the opportunity to prove he can be trusted there over the first four games. He failed a lot and the Vikings have pulled him from 3rd down situations now.

Peterson leads the league in rushing yards at 961. The next closest player in this category is Chris Johnson at 734. So Peterson has a 227 yards lead on the rest of the league.

Peterson is 3rd overall in total yards from scrimmage at 1099. Only Antonio Brown and Devonta Freeman are ahead of him. Freeman is ahead of him by 42 yards due to having 29 more receptions.

In standard leagues Peterson is RB 2 behind Freeman with 139.9 points. RB 10 and below do not have 100 points yet.

In PPR leagues Peterson is RB 4 behind Freeman, Ingram, Miller with 156.9 points.

Only two players are averaging over 100 yards rushing per game. Peterson at 106.8 yards/game and Gurley at 101.3 yards/game.

Yeah that guy is really disappointing... The guy is going to break 1,000 yards in his 11th game of the season behind that O-line. Why did I waste a roster spot on this guy? Why doesn't he have 1500 yards by now? So disappointed...

 

[Donkey Derp]

Peterson leads the league in rushing yards at 961. The next closest player in this category is Chris Johnson at 734. So Peterson has a 227 yards lead on the rest of the league.

The top two rushing yard leaders are 30 years old. It seemed like age was the only thing people cared about in here for a while.

 

[VikingFrog]

But if you take away his 80 yard touchdown run, he only has 123 yards rushing.

 

[FGITLOTR]

But if you take away his 80 yard touchdown run, he only has 123 yards rushing.

"Only"?? 123 rushing yards is excellent game and it's ridiculous to take away that long run...the dude is an anomaly

 

[TheFanatic]

Peterson leads the league in rushing yards at 961. The next closest player in this category is Chris Johnson at 734. So Peterson has a 227 yards lead on the rest of the league.

The top two rushing yard leaders are 30 years old. It seemed like age was the only thing people cared about in here for a while.

That was before Adrian Peterson found the fountain of youth (or whatever other pharmaceutical help) to get 2000 yards less than a year after blowing out an ACL. Whatever is happening here, I firmly believe is because the chemists paid by the players are ahead of the ones paid by the league. You can chalk it up to him missing the year, but last I checked, aging had nothing to do with miles. If it were about miles (and it's not), Priest Holmes would literally still be playing.

 

[Biabreakable]

I do think Peterson has been a bit rusty in some areas from having a full season off. Things like fumbling is something he has needed to focus on improving again, thankfully the Vikings have recovered most of his fumbles.

As he mentions, he has been stopping his feet when a clear hole doesn't open right away, that he will focus on keeping his feet moving because that is how he keeps his power and momentum in front of him.

He has never been good in pass protection. Something he has said he wants to get better at and become a good all around RB. Well he may have been working on it, but he hasn't gotten better. The Vikings gave him the opportunity to prove he can be trusted there over the first four games. He failed a lot and the Vikings have pulled him from 3rd down situations now.

Peterson leads the league in rushing yards at 961. The next closest player in this category is Chris Johnson at 734. So Peterson has a 227 yards lead on the rest of the league.

Peterson is 3rd overall in total yards from scrimmage at 1099. Only Antonio Brown and Devonta Freeman are ahead of him. Freeman is ahead of him by 42 yards due to having 29 more receptions.

In standard leagues Peterson is RB 2 behind Freeman with 139.9 points. RB 10 and below do not have 100 points yet.

In PPR leagues Peterson is RB 4 behind Freeman, Ingram, Miller with 156.9 points.

Only two players are averaging over 100 yards rushing per game. Peterson at 106.8 yards/game and Gurley at 101.3 yards/game.

Yeah that guy is really disappointing... The guy is going to break 1,000 yards in his 11th game of the season behind that O-line. Why did I waste a roster spot on this guy? Why doesn't he have 1500 yards by now? So disappointed...

Hey Peterson could have doubled his receptions by now if he could be relied upon on 3rd downs. Those receptions to Asiata could have been to Peterson if he were a complete RB who knew how to pass block proficiently enough to be used on all 3 downs. So that is a real disappointment for me.

To be disappointed about any thing else would be pretty silly. Peterson has carried this team at key times throughout the season. He is currently on pace to rush for 1712 yards which will be amazing if he keeps this pace for the rest of the season.

 

[VikingFrog]

But if you take away his 80 yard touchdown run, he only has 123 yards rushing.

"Only"?? 123 rushing yards is excellent game and it's ridiculous to take away that long run...the dude is an anomaly

My comment was meant with complete and utter sarcasm.

 

[Biabreakable]

Peterson leads the league in rushing yards at 961. The next closest player in this category is Chris Johnson at 734. So Peterson has a 227 yards lead on the rest of the league.

The top two rushing yard leaders are 30 years old. It seemed like age was the only thing people cared about in here for a while.

You make an interesting point that currently the two rushing leaders are 30 years old. Chris Johnson also has a 2k rushing season before like Peterson.

 

[Boondocksaints]

I offered Peterson and James Jones for Leveon Bell a few weeks ago. Rejected - woo- dodged a bullet.

 

[TDorBust]

Peterson leads the league in rushing yards at 961. The next closest player in this category is Chris Johnson at 734. So Peterson has a 227 yards lead on the rest of the league.

The top two rushing yard leaders are 30 years old. It seemed like age was the only thing people cared about in here for a while.

You make an interesting point that currently the two rushing leaders are 30 years old. Chris Johnson also has a 2k rushing season before like Peterson.

Traded for Peterson recently in Salary League and I will say if we started the year over I would be down on AP again. No man can escape age but the thing you will notice is both 30 years olds had a very easy 2014. So again it's more about carries but usually carries equal age for the top backs.

I will worry about AP again going in to next year with a full year of carries instead of a year off. Also you might even get 17-18 games this year for AP instead of the normal 16 adding even more carries.

 

[FGITLOTR]

But if you take away his 80 yard touchdown run, he only has 123 yards rushing.

"Only"?? 123 rushing yards is excellent game and it's ridiculous to take away that long run...the dude is an anomaly

My comment was meant with complete and utter sarcasm.[/quote

Lol sorry, I missed that

 

[Biabreakable]

Peterson leads the league in rushing yards at 961. The next closest player in this category is Chris Johnson at 734. So Peterson has a 227 yards lead on the rest of the league.

The top two rushing yard leaders are 30 years old. It seemed like age was the only thing people cared about in here for a while.

You make an interesting point that currently the two rushing leaders are 30 years old. Chris Johnson also has a 2k rushing season before like Peterson.

Traded for Peterson recently in Salary League and I will say if we started the year over I would be down on AP again. No man can escape age but the thing you will notice is both 30 years olds had a very easy 2014. So again it's more about carries but usually carries equal age for the top backs.

I will worry about AP again going in to next year with a full year of carries instead of a year off. Also you might even get 17-18 games this year for AP instead of the normal 16 adding even more carries.

You make a good point that Peterson does not have many extra playoff games in his history. That might change this year leading to a total workload that might be larger than he has had in a season before.

In 2008 the Vikings had one playoff game and Peterson had an additional 20 carries 83 yards and 2 TD. Total 404 touches.

In 2009 the Vikings had two playoff games and Peterson had an additional 51 carries 185 yards 3 TD 3 receptions for 33 yards Total 411 touches.

In 2008 the Vikings had one playoff game and Peterson had an additional 22 carries 99 yards 1 reception 8 yards.Total 411 touches.

Currently Peterson is averaging 21.6 rushing attempts per game 2.1 receptions per game. Over 16 games this would be 380 touches. Add another 23.7 touches per game to that for one playoff game and he is over 400 touches again. If he has 2 or more additional games then he would touch the ball perhaps over 450 times.

I do recall looking at some evidence of RB having decline after a 400 touch season. I have also seen instances such as Ricky Williams accumulating over 400 touches in the regular season two seasons in a row and it is not certain if he would have declined the following year as he skipped a suspension and didn't play much that season.

I don't have time right now but I will revisit this topic about RB age and historical evidence of decline. I will also look for decline based on the volume of touches, which can just happen because of a reduction of volume. 400 is a lot of touches to have in a season.

 

[TheFanatic]

I do think Peterson has been a bit rusty in some areas from having a full season off. Things like fumbling is something he has needed to focus on improving again, thankfully the Vikings have recovered most of his fumbles.

As he mentions, he has been stopping his feet when a clear hole doesn't open right away, that he will focus on keeping his feet moving because that is how he keeps his power and momentum in front of him.

He has never been good in pass protection. Something he has said he wants to get better at and become a good all around RB. Well he may have been working on it, but he hasn't gotten better. The Vikings gave him the opportunity to prove he can be trusted there over the first four games. He failed a lot and the Vikings have pulled him from 3rd down situations now.

Peterson leads the league in rushing yards at 961. The next closest player in this category is Chris Johnson at 734. So Peterson has a 227 yards lead on the rest of the league.

Peterson is 3rd overall in total yards from scrimmage at 1099. Only Antonio Brown and Devonta Freeman are ahead of him. Freeman is ahead of him by 42 yards due to having 29 more receptions.

In standard leagues Peterson is RB 2 behind Freeman with 139.9 points. RB 10 and below do not have 100 points yet.

In PPR leagues Peterson is RB 4 behind Freeman, Ingram, Miller with 156.9 points.

Only two players are averaging over 100 yards rushing per game. Peterson at 106.8 yards/game and Gurley at 101.3 yards/game.

Yeah that guy is really disappointing... The guy is going to break 1,000 yards in his 11th game of the season behind that O-line. Why did I waste a roster spot on this guy? Why doesn't he have 1500 yards by now? So disappointed...

Hey Peterson could have doubled his receptions by now if he could be relied upon on 3rd downs. Those receptions to Asiata could have been to Peterson if he were a complete RB who knew how to pass block proficiently enough to be used on all 3 downs. So that is a real disappointment for me.

To be disappointed about any thing else would be pretty silly. Peterson has carried this team at key times throughout the season. He is currently on pace to rush for 1712 yards which will be amazing if he keeps this pace for the rest of the season.

Peterson has never been much of a pass catcher so why is this disappointing to you now? 95% of his fantasy output is on first and second down his entire career. You shouldn't be disappointed in that, you should have more realistic expectations of what Peterson does.

Outside of last year (and this year of course), Peterson has 206 receptions over the first 7 years of his career. That comes out to about 29 catches per year. This year he's on pace for 33. So he's actually doing better than his yearly average while averaging 4.9 yards per carry, leading the league in rushing behind a suspect offensive line and with a mediocre QB. Again, how is this disappointing? I wish he had a few more TD's but that's a wish, not a disappointment..

ETA Matt Asiata has a grand total of 12 catches on the season for 70 yards. Three games this season he hasn't had a catch and he's never had more than 3 in a game.