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Alcohol use disorder (1 Viewer)

I hope you are able to work things out for the both of you. Training camp is around the corner. Still lots of Yankees giving many people in South Florida lots of business, hopefully you too. I'm a lightweight, so never had a problem, my oldest daughter can drink with the best of them, I worry about her liver.
-True Story, I had an event in St Pete at the Iberian Rooster downtown the night the Lightning won Game 7 ECF, DJ, EDM, all of it. So I am going thru my usual "Night Of" stuff which means I am ON POINT and my 21 year old son just sorta pops up or into my night and I never explained to him what I used to do in the night club world in the 90s and so on. There were a lot of folks wanting to talk to me and start plotting out future events...I just stopped what i was doing, turned the keys over to my wife sorta speak and i took my son and went around all over downtown celebrating the Lightning going to the Stanley Cup and forgot about all these other peeps wanting a piece of me that night. 

It was way more fun hanging out with my son, we don't typically get drunk together. 

 
I work out almost every day. Eat healthy 90% of the time.   Go days and weeks without drinking.  When I do drink I only drink lite beer but will have between 3-4 at a social setting, 4-8 at a party setting when everyone is partying.     Never 1 or 2.   If I am going to have 1-2 I would rather not drink at all. And many times I don`t have any.  I often wonder why.  I think it because 1-2 lite beers really do nothing, but 3-4 and I am feeling loose.  Not sure where I fall.

 
Was listening to this podcast with Jordan Peterson today

He said something that I found very interesting and maybe it will be useful to somebody in here.

He said (paraphrased) that alcohol is a good "drug" to cope with anxiety - especially in social settings.  He went on to say that it does two things to:

  • Makes you more extroverted and enthusiastic while you are on the ascending limb of the blood alcohol curve  (which is why some keep drinking because they want to stay that way)
  • Reduces anxiety
He went on to say to say that drinking/being drunk doesn't make you "stupid" - many people say you do stupid risky things when drunk.  He claims that you still know it's risky, you aren't dumb in that sense.  You just no longer care or assess the risk the same as you would sober.

I found the whole podcast fascinating - have no clue who the pod-caster is (Theo Von??) and I also have no clue how scientifically accurate his information is but it at least made sense to me and I enjoyed listening to it.  Also, it made me think that if this stuff is true that it probably contributes to why I'm not an alcoholic.  I'm already somewhat extroverted and enthusiastic without having to drink and I'm also not anxious in social settings and outside some work and family items I'm not anxious really at all.

It's a 15 minute video but worth it if you are interested in the topic. 

 
after my heart attack i quit drinking because i needed to get straightened out with my diet and one of my best buddies had just gone through a 12 stepper and was sober so i figured what the hell i will give this a shot with him and anyhow after a month or two of really fighting it and i mean really fighting it because going out with friends and having too much to drink is what we did i realized that i never have just one if i have one the question is not should i have two the question is how many are left because that is how many i am going to have and then i feel like crap the next day and have to worry about what i did or said and deal with a ton of guilt so it clicked to me that i just cant drink like 99 percent of the world can i have a problem and it means i cant so now i dont but i will tell  you this it took me those two or three months of not having had a beer to realize the difference and to realize that i really like waking up in the morning and not having any stomach acid either physically or mentally and hey the weight loss is pretty damn nice too and basically you will lose some friends in the process and i have but now i also see that the friendships i have now are based on actually talking and listening to people and getting to know them instead of just being around them while we are all smashed basically there is a saying that if you want to find out who your friends are stop drinking and i believe it so i dont know brohans this is just me talking about me and maybe it applies to you or maybe it doesnt but stay strong and keeep on keepin on take that to the bank bromigos 

 
I had the luxury of moving away from friends before I confronted my own alcohol use, so that was serendipitous. But then I realized that I was moving because of alcohol and leaving friends that I had made through alcohol because of alcohol, if that makes any sense.

Came down to it that I wouldn't have this situation if not for alcohol and drugs. So I do what I can daily with both. Today is exactly two years and five months since a drink. Oct. will be two and a half years if I can make it that long.

Alcohol was a cruel mistress. I remember a woman back when I was twenty-seven or so saying, "Oh my God. You're really good." She was referring to baseball. One of my friends answered, "Yeah, he's awesome at baseball. Alcohol is just his mistress." It was telling then, and took me eighteen or so more years to finally figure it out. My friends knew back then. 

I'd urge anyone with doubts to really assess their lives and be honest with themselves. I didn't at twenty-seven, and deep down knew I needed to walk into the nearest AA meeting. There are hard, hard answers lurking. I know that. But maybe once done, you can be free of the nightly and morning routine. And that's what it is. A routine gone bad.

Anyway, best to all those reading and if you need an ear, I'm here.

 
I had the luxury of moving away from friends before I confronted my own alcohol use, so that was serendipitous. But then I realized that I was moving because of alcohol and leaving friends that I had made through alcohol because of alcohol, if that makes any sense.

Came down to it that I wouldn't have this situation if not for alcohol and drugs. So I do what I can daily with both. Today is exactly two years and five months since a drink. Oct. will be two and a half years if I can make it that long.

Alcohol was a cruel mistress. I remember a woman back when I was twenty-seven or so saying, "Oh my God. You're really good." She was referring to baseball. One of my friends answered, "Yeah, he's awesome at baseball. Alcohol is just his mistress." It was telling then, and took me eighteen or so more years to finally figure it out. My friends knew back then. 

I'd urge anyone with doubts to really assess their lives and be honest with themselves. I didn't at twenty-seven, and deep down knew I needed to walk into the nearest AA meeting. There are hard, hard answers lurking. I know that. But maybe once done, you can be free of the nightly and morning routine. And that's what it is. A routine gone bad.

Anyway, best to all those reading and if you need an ear, I'm here.


Man, that's awesome Roc.  Keep it up!

 
Man, that's awesome Roc.  Keep it up!
Thanks, GM. It all started with you guys in Sober February, which @St. Louis Bob originated. I remember going through it with you that month, though you were more taking the month off than addressing anything deeper (I say that so as not to implicate you. What was a light-hearted thing for you guys got really serious for me really quickly when I realized I was physically withdrawing from drinking).

Anyway, Bob should know that he directly impacted my life in a seriously good way. Bob, praying for you and your family, man. Keep strong. Keep it up. Much love.

 
Thanks, GM. It all started with you guys in Sober February, which @St. Louis Bob originated. I remember going through it with you that month, though you were more taking the month off than addressing anything deeper (I say that so as not to implicate you. What was a light-hearted thing for you guys got really serious for me really quickly when I realized I was physically withdrawing from drinking).

Anyway, Bob should know that he directly impacted my life in a seriously good way. Bob, praying for you and your family, man. Keep strong. Keep it up. Much love.
Oh, I'm going to reach the conclusion sooner or later that alcohol is just not something I should be consuming.  48 now and want to watch my kids all grow up without physical damage, mental damage or emotional damage caused by booze.  I mean, I've got 6 year old sons and if I want to live to see them into adulthood, I'm going to have to make some modifications.  A daughter who is 9 and I'd like to walk her down an aisle one day without her worrying dad might be drunk and embarrass her.  Or even if he can do it all because he's not there.  I've got a much better shot at that if I cut the drinking out for good.  I don't know if by this age I'll suddenly discover a governor pedal so it's gonna have to be one or the other.  

But I do like my IPAs.  Well, and my Rose.  :bag:

 
AAABatteries said:
Was listening to this podcast with Jordan Peterson today

He said something that I found very interesting and maybe it will be useful to somebody in here.

He said (paraphrased) that alcohol is a good "drug" to cope with anxiety - especially in social settings.  He went on to say that it does two things to:

  • Makes you more extroverted and enthusiastic while you are on the ascending limb of the blood alcohol curve  (which is why some keep drinking because they want to stay that way)
  • Reduces anxiety
He went on to say to say that drinking/being drunk doesn't make you "stupid" - many people say you do stupid risky things when drunk.  He claims that you still know it's risky, you aren't dumb in that sense.  You just no longer care or assess the risk the same as you would sober.

I found the whole podcast fascinating - have no clue who the pod-caster is (Theo Von??) and I also have no clue how scientifically accurate his information is but it at least made sense to me and I enjoyed listening to it.  Also, it made me think that if this stuff is true that it probably contributes to why I'm not an alcoholic.  I'm already somewhat extroverted and enthusiastic without having to drink and I'm also not anxious in social settings and outside some work and family items I'm not anxious really at all.

It's a 15 minute video but worth it if you are interested in the topic. 
As a recovering alcoholic, I find this to be disappointing. Entertaining for sure, but disappointing. 

after my heart attack i quit drinking because i needed to get straightened out with my diet and one of my best buddies had just gone through a 12 stepper and was sober so i figured what the hell i will give this a shot with him and anyhow after a month or two of really fighting it and i mean really fighting it because going out with friends and having too much to drink is what we did i realized that i never have just one if i have one the question is not should i have two the question is how many are left because that is how many i am going to have and then i feel like crap the next day and have to worry about what i did or said and deal with a ton of guilt so it clicked to me that i just cant drink like 99 percent of the world can i have a problem and it means i cant so now i dont but i will tell  you this it took me those two or three months of not having had a beer to realize the difference and to realize that i really like waking up in the morning and not having any stomach acid either physically or mentally and hey the weight loss is pretty damn nice too and basically you will lose some friends in the process and i have but now i also see that the friendships i have now are based on actually talking and listening to people and getting to know them instead of just being around them while we are all smashed basically there is a saying that if you want to find out who your friends are stop drinking and i believe it so i dont know brohans this is just me talking about me and maybe it applies to you or maybe it doesnt but stay strong and keeep on keepin on take that to the bank bromigos 
This is much more real.

Oh, I'm going to reach the conclusion sooner or later that alcohol is just not something I should be consuming.  48 now and want to watch my kids all grow up without physical damage, mental damage or emotional damage caused by booze.  I mean, I've got 6 year old sons and if I want to live to see them into adulthood, I'm going to have to make some modifications.  A daughter who is 9 and I'd like to walk her down an aisle one day without her worrying dad might be drunk and embarrass her.  Or even if he can do it all because he's not there.  I've got a much better shot at that if I cut the drinking out for good.  I don't know if by this age I'll suddenly discover a governor pedal so it's gonna have to be one or the other.  

But I do like my IPAs.  Well, and my Rose.  :bag:
90% of this was in my "Goodbye alcohol" letter that I wrote in treatment. You have the right ideas. 

 
Oh, I'm going to reach the conclusion sooner or later that alcohol is just not something I should be consuming.  48 now and want to watch my kids all grow up without physical damage, mental damage or emotional damage caused by booze.  I mean, I've got 6 year old sons and if I want to live to see them into adulthood, I'm going to have to make some modifications.  A daughter who is 9 and I'd like to walk her down an aisle one day without her worrying dad might be drunk and embarrass her.  Or even if he can do it all because he's not there.  I've got a much better shot at that if I cut the drinking out for good.  I don't know if by this age I'll suddenly discover a governor pedal so it's gonna have to be one or the other.  

But I do like my IPAs.  Well, and my Rose.  :bag:


GM, I don't know what to say. I hope you find peace with what you ultimately decide you need to do. Because only you can only do what you think is right for you when you decide you want to do it. If you still enjoy your IPAs and Rose, then by all means partake. If you're unhappy with where you're at with that, reach out, man. There are so many people willing to help. It all comes down to what you want to do and when you want to do it. I fall off with other things than alcohol, so know this doesn't come from a place of judgment, but of just having been through the initial process.

I support you in whatever you decide to do, regardless. Whatever you want to find, hope you find it. Peace, brother. You guys meant a lot that month and continue to do so.

 
22 hours ago, AAABatteries said:
Was listening to this podcast with Jordan Peterson today

He said something that I found very interesting and maybe it will be useful to somebody in here.

He said (paraphrased) that alcohol is a good "drug" to cope with anxiety - especially in social settings.  He went on to say that it does two things to:

  • Makes you more extroverted and enthusiastic while you are on the ascending limb of the blood alcohol curve  (which is why some keep drinking because they want to stay that way)
  • Reduces anxiety
He went on to say to say that drinking/being drunk doesn't make you "stupid" - many people say you do stupid risky things when drunk.  He claims that you still know it's risky, you aren't dumb in that sense.  You just no longer care or assess the risk the same as you would sober.

I found the whole podcast fascinating - have no clue who the pod-caster is (Theo Von??) and I also have no clue how scientifically accurate his information is but it at least made sense to me and I enjoyed listening to it.  Also, it made me think that if this stuff is true that it probably contributes to why I'm not an alcoholic.  I'm already somewhat extroverted and enthusiastic without having to drink and I'm also not anxious in social settings and outside some work and family items I'm not anxious really at all.

It's a 15 minute video but worth it if you are interested in the topic. 
Expand  
As a recovering alcoholic, I find this to be disappointing. Entertaining for sure, but disappointing. 
To be clear,

I think it's disappointing that was the takeaway. I like you AAA, so this is not a dig on you. And as you explained you don't have an alcohol problem. But the first 9:30 is much more poignant than the "Alcohol is good for anxiety" comments.

It "helps" with anxiety and depression and other feelings we don't want to have. But those feelings don't go away. They just get buried and then continue to snowball until we're pulling a Costanza under our desk at 2:30pm at work after a liter of vodka and Gatorades because "no one can smell that"

The video you linked does have value, so thank you. I just thing the message was misinterpreted.

 
Oh, I'm going to reach the conclusion sooner or later that alcohol is just not something I should be consuming.  48 now and want to watch my kids all grow up without physical damage, mental damage or emotional damage caused by booze.  I mean, I've got 6 year old sons and if I want to live to see them into adulthood, I'm going to have to make some modifications.  A daughter who is 9 and I'd like to walk her down an aisle one day without her worrying dad might be drunk and embarrass her.  Or even if he can do it all because he's not there.  I've got a much better shot at that if I cut the drinking out for good.  I don't know if by this age I'll suddenly discover a governor pedal so it's gonna have to be one or the other.  

But I do like my IPAs.  Well, and my Rose.  :bag:
Just realized I’ve probably been drinking for 30 years.  Not a lot or not heavily for all of them but definitely that long.  And I’m 41 FWIW

ive probably only been an (mostly) every day drinker for 10 years though (no coincidental I have kids that are 12 10 an 8  ).  16-30 ish was much more weekend binge drinking style

 
Just realized I’ve probably been drinking for 30 years.  Not a lot or not heavily for all of them but definitely that long.  And I’m 41 FWIW

ive probably only been an (mostly) every day drinker for 10 years though (no coincidental I have kids that are 12 10 an 8  ).  16-30 ish was much more weekend binge drinking style


Similar situation here. 45, usually just did weekend drinking in my 20s but somehow the past 10 years evolved to every night drinking. I mentioned in another thread (maybe about a year ago?) that I was considering quitting altogether. I'm fine not drinking to excess and only having 2-3 beers in an evening, but the problem is my body isn't. The last few years it's really jacked up my sleeping pattern and also caused acid reflex, which can make the sleeping issue even worse.

These last few months I've cut way way down and am usually around 4-8 beers a week (depending on ABV), the bulk of which are on Saturday. I have many days during the week I don't drink at all. But the thing is, even just 3 beers can mess up my sleep and make me totally unmotivated to do anything the next day. I guess I'm just getting old and can't handle alcohol anymore?

 
so i dont know why i keep writing in here but i guess it is sort of cathartic i drank a lot because i felt like i was behind and always chasing life trying to make money trying to get out of debt trying to make sure i was with the right people and trying to make sure that i was on top and i would cover that up with booze and truthfully booze does a great job of making you forget about stresses for a while but i stress for a while because the piper you pay is an absolutely ##### and for me it was the next morning and knowing i had been out of control and said things that i would have to apologize for and stressing out about that and eventually having a heart attack driven by alcohol consumption and weight gain and bad blood numbers and eating like a moron because i was drunk and out of control so now that i have set it down and gotten on this here wagon and i am going to struggle to find the right words for this but it is intoxicating to get up walk or bike then eat rightt then get to work and actually get stuff done instead of just faking it because i was hung over and i feel like i am getting out ahead of life i really feel like i am running my life now instead of running to catch up with life and if i am being honest that isnt all because i quit drinking i mean i made significant life changes due to my heart attack but taking booze out of the equation was a really big part of that so hey just some swc writing on the internet flavor for your ear take that to the bank bromigos 

 
So I've just had an interesting run of things with alcohol this year and I'm curious to know if I do have some kind of psychological issue with it.

Over the past couple years I had developed a covert system of drinking. Fireball in coffee in the morning, beers at lunch, keeping beer in the garage in a cooler so I can drink out there when I'm doing yardwork, etc.  I definitely used alcohol to self medicate from depression for a couple of years and some of those habits have hung around, but the depression is no more (thank you, Jesus).

I do this because my wife has an issue with alcohol of any sort at any time because her mom was a puritan (not literally, but a Baptist) and she got hit by a drunk driver about 12 years ago and she has a friend whose husband is an alcoholic.  She basically has an internal conniption fit every time she sees me with a beer or smells it on my breath. We've talked about it, even looked at the Bible, but she is an illogical and emotional creature and can't psychologically get over it.  She's never been drunk once in her life and hasn't had a sip of alcohol in 20 years.  As a result I'm not comfortable drinking at home (plus the puritan mom lives with us).  When I'm alone for the evening or on a trip with some guys for college football (I referee) I also have a tendency to binge drink at those times because "FREEDOM!!1".

I think this has caused me to have more of an issue with alcohol than I would if things were more "normal".  All of the hiding it has made it more of a secretive, clandestine and forbidden habit.  My wife knows I drink on occasion, but she is fairly ignorant to the when and frequency.

So back in mid June my wife talks me into doing a program called 75 Hard.  Among the stipulations (including workouts, eating, etc.) is NO alcohol at all.  I've gone long periods without before, so this isn't a problem.  Basically I went from June 12th through September 13th without a drop of alcohol of any kind.  I lost weight, got in the best shape of my post-20's life and didn't really "miss" alcohol too often (outside of a couple of nights out with the guys...those were tough).

So now here I am, back off the wagon so to speak and I'm basically going overboard right out the gate.  Drank a 6-pack of tall boys in 3 days and am currently sipping on a coffee with Fireball for my morning in the office with a 6-pack in a cooler in my trunk chilling for after my game tonight.  It feels like now that I can, I'm going all in on drinking again and I'm a bit concerned I have some kind of odd problem. Also, I tried to have a beer during my nighttime routine last night and my wife had to tell me "it scared her" despite the fact I hadn't had a drop in over 3 months.  It pissed me off and I poured the rest of my beer down the sink while crushing the can in anger and stormed out of the room.  I'm quite sick of the judgement there.  However, if she really knew how much I had been drinking, she would be justifiably worried...so I'm really not too mad at her and things were fine between us this morning.

I don't know.  I don't feel some need to completely quit, but day drinking and hiding it from my wife feels like I have a problem.  The fact that I could go 3 months without anything makes me think it isn't out of control and I'm never reckless or driving drunk, never blacked out and haven't puked in years with very few hangovers over that time.  I really just like 2-3 beers in the evening, but don't really have that option on a regular basis apparently unless I want to fight with my wife.

I don't know what the point of all of this is other than to just share my thoughts/feelings in here. 

TIA, will answer yours. gl peas

 
So I've just had an interesting run of things with alcohol this year and I'm curious to know if I do have some kind of psychological issue with it.

Over the past couple years I had developed a covert system of drinking. Fireball in coffee in the morning, beers at lunch, keeping beer in the garage in a cooler so I can drink out there when I'm doing yardwork, etc.  I definitely used alcohol to self medicate from depression for a couple of years and some of those habits have hung around, but the depression is no more (thank you, Jesus).

I do this because my wife has an issue with alcohol of any sort at any time because her mom was a puritan (not literally, but a Baptist) and she got hit by a drunk driver about 12 years ago and she has a friend whose husband is an alcoholic.  She basically has an internal conniption fit every time she sees me with a beer or smells it on my breath. We've talked about it, even looked at the Bible, but she is an illogical and emotional creature and can't psychologically get over it.  She's never been drunk once in her life and hasn't had a sip of alcohol in 20 years.  As a result I'm not comfortable drinking at home (plus the puritan mom lives with us).  When I'm alone for the evening or on a trip with some guys for college football (I referee) I also have a tendency to binge drink at those times because "FREEDOM!!1".

I think this has caused me to have more of an issue with alcohol than I would if things were more "normal".  All of the hiding it has made it more of a secretive, clandestine and forbidden habit.  My wife knows I drink on occasion, but she is fairly ignorant to the when and frequency.

So back in mid June my wife talks me into doing a program called 75 Hard.  Among the stipulations (including workouts, eating, etc.) is NO alcohol at all.  I've gone long periods without before, so this isn't a problem.  Basically I went from June 12th through September 13th without a drop of alcohol of any kind.  I lost weight, got in the best shape of my post-20's life and didn't really "miss" alcohol too often (outside of a couple of nights out with the guys...those were tough).

So now here I am, back off the wagon so to speak and I'm basically going overboard right out the gate.  Drank a 6-pack of tall boys in 3 days and am currently sipping on a coffee with Fireball for my morning in the office with a 6-pack in a cooler in my trunk chilling for after my game tonight.  It feels like now that I can, I'm going all in on drinking again and I'm a bit concerned I have some kind of odd problem. Also, I tried to have a beer during my nighttime routine last night and my wife had to tell me "it scared her" despite the fact I hadn't had a drop in over 3 months.  It pissed me off and I poured the rest of my beer down the sink while crushing the can in anger and stormed out of the room.  I'm quite sick of the judgement there.  However, if she really knew how much I had been drinking, she would be justifiably worried...so I'm really not too mad at her and things were fine between us this morning.

I don't know.  I don't feel some need to completely quit, but day drinking and hiding it from my wife feels like I have a problem.  The fact that I could go 3 months without anything makes me think it isn't out of control and I'm never reckless or driving drunk, never blacked out and haven't puked in years with very few hangovers over that time.  I really just like 2-3 beers in the evening, but don't really have that option on a regular basis apparently unless I want to fight with my wife.

I don't know what the point of all of this is other than to just share my thoughts/feelings in here. 

TIA, will answer yours. gl peas
First the drinking.  The "Fireball in my coffee" things makes me very nervous, but the rest of what you describe doesn't sound like anything to worry about.  Like, at all.  Knocking back a six pack on a Friday evening while hanging out with the guys is pretty normal drinking behavior -- that's a lot of empty calories, but it's not actually all that much alcohol.  A couple of beers in the evening, or a beer or two while you're screwing around in the garage, is totally normal.  Normally I would say that even if it doesn't seem like a big deal to me, if you think it's problematic then it's probably problematic, but of course there's another huge confounding issue here, namely your spouse.

The main issue here is that your wife has a very negative relationship with alcohol and it's affecting you.  I'm not going to say that she's wrong or irrational, but she's definitely out there on the tail end of the distribution.  FWIW, my paternal grandmother was like this -- fundamentalist Baptist, no alcohol whatsoever any time no exceptions.  My grandpa used to sneak off to minor league ball games just to have a few beers from time to time.  It certainly sounds like this is a huge source of tension in your marriage.  Even if you think that your drinking is perfectly fine, I can see where your mind would trick you into thinking that your drinking is disordered somehow just because of the sneaking around.  

Is there any way that you can talk your wife into some sort of "out of sight, out mind" agreement?  Like, you're free to drink in the garage or on the deck or whatever where she doesn't have to see it, and you agree to keep it out of the living room?  Maybe you've tried that already.  I don't have any other brilliant advice to offer other than to hang in there.  

 
Thanks, GM. It all started with you guys in Sober February, which @St. Louis Bob originated. I remember going through it with you that month, though you were more taking the month off than addressing anything deeper (I say that so as not to implicate you. What was a light-hearted thing for you guys got really serious for me really quickly when I realized I was physically withdrawing from drinking).

Anyway, Bob should know that he directly impacted my life in a seriously good way. Bob, praying for you and your family, man. Keep strong. Keep it up. Much love.
Wow man, I had no idea.  Of course I'm happy to hear that things are moving in the right direction for you.  Much love to you my brother!

 
Wow man, I had no idea.  Of course I'm happy to hear that things are moving in the right direction for you.  Much love to you my brother!
I wrote that so you would know how much you impacted me throughout what you might have thought was a trivial time-killer. I started that February and am still going strong without alcohol. It's not easy, and I've fallen off with other non-prescription drugs at times, but I'm two and half years alcohol-free and over three months fully sober, so I have some things going for me. I won't soon forget it, if ever. I remember you, krista, and GM all having a reaction when I said I had the shakes on the floor from withdrawal. I wasn't kidding, and I knew then that it was now or never. I'd been to rehab before, but things just got worse. 

So thanks, Bob. I hope things are going well with your treatments. I see you on the boards today, so I'll check for an update in case you feel up for giving one. Much love to you too, man!

 
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