American held hostage by al Qaeda appeals to Obama... (1 Viewer)

[GroveDiesel]

First he defected, supposedly. Now suddenly dudes an active member of the Taliban? Seriously?

Is that what I said?

We traded 5 terrorists for one of their own. What did you mean by that remark?

Don't you dare take that out of full context. That's low and pathetic even for you.

What does it mean, in full context?

It means IF he went looking to join up with the Taliban, then we traded for one of their own. I'm not sure why that's difficult for you to process.

I think I made it clear that that was the worst case scenario. Do you deny that that scenario is even the slightest bit possible?

 

[GroveDiesel]

First he defected, supposedly. Now suddenly dudes an active member of the Taliban? Seriously?

Is that what I said?

We traded 5 terrorists for one of their own. What did you mean by that remark?

Don't you dare take that out of full context. That's low and pathetic even for you.

What does it mean, in full context?

It means, he is too scared to speak plainly.

He said what he meant to say and tried to pre-deflect any criticism of his hatred by making those pre-qualifiers.

Don't put words into my mouth. I can speak plainly for myself just fine. Keep your small little thoghts to yourself.

 

[timschochet]

First he defected, supposedly. Now suddenly dudes an active member of the Taliban? Seriously?

Is that what I said?

We traded 5 terrorists for one of their own. What did you mean by that remark?

Don't you dare take that out of full context. That's low and pathetic even for you.

What does it mean, in full context?

It means IF he went looking to join up with the Taliban, then we traded for one of their own. I'm not sure why that's difficult for you to process.I think I made it clear that that was the worst case scenario. Do you deny that that scenario is even the slightest bit possible?

First off you're still wrong; for you to be right, not only would he have gone off seeking to join the Taliban, the Taliban would have to welcome him with open arms, and then this guy would have had to spend the last 5 years pretending to be a prisoner when actually he was a member of the Taliban. THAT'S what it means to be "one of theirs". Is what I just wrote possible? Of course. Is it likely? IMO not even slightly. And for you to bring it up as a probability further indicates to me what I've stated all along- this whole story is another excuse to hate on Obama. It's pathetic.

 

[GroveDiesel]

First he defected, supposedly. Now suddenly dudes an active member of the Taliban? Seriously?

Is that what I said?

We traded 5 terrorists for one of their own. What did you mean by that remark?

Don't you dare take that out of full context. That's low and pathetic even for you.

What does it mean, in full context?

It means IF he went looking to join up with the Taliban, then we traded for one of their own. I'm not sure why that's difficult for you to process.I think I made it clear that that was the worst case scenario. Do you deny that that scenario is even the slightest bit possible?

First off you're still wrong; for you to be right, not only would he have gone off seeking to join the Taliban, the Taliban would have to welcome him with open arms, and then this guy would have had to spend the last 5 years pretending to be a prisoner when actually he was a member of the Taliban. THAT'S what it means to be "one of theirs". Is what I just wrote possible? Of course. Is it likely? IMO not even slightly. And for you to bring it up as a probability further indicates to me what I've stated all along- this whole story is another excuse to hate on Obama. It's pathetic.

So the reports of him from 4 years ago helping teach the Taliban how to make IEDs, teach them ambush tactics and actually leading a small camp of insurgents are false and you know they're false?

 

[timschochet]

First he defected, supposedly. Now suddenly dudes an active member of the Taliban? Seriously?

Is that what I said?

We traded 5 terrorists for one of their own. What did you mean by that remark?

Don't you dare take that out of full context. That's low and pathetic even for you.

What does it mean, in full context?

It means IF he went looking to join up with the Taliban, then we traded for one of their own. I'm not sure why that's difficult for you to process.I think I made it clear that that was the worst case scenario. Do you deny that that scenario is even the slightest bit possible?

First off you're still wrong; for you to be right, not only would he have gone off seeking to join the Taliban, the Taliban would have to welcome him with open arms, and then this guy would have had to spend the last 5 years pretending to be a prisoner when actually he was a member of the Taliban. THAT'S what it means to be "one of theirs". Is what I just wrote possible? Of course. Is it likely? IMO not even slightly. And for you to bring it up as a probability further indicates to me what I've stated all along- this whole story is another excuse to hate on Obama. It's pathetic.

So the reports of him from 4 years ago helping teach the Taliban how to make IEDs, teach them ambush tactics and actually leading a small camp of insurgents are false and you know they're false?

What reports?

 

[BigSteelThrill]

They're irrelevant to the mission of returning a soldier.

Had the U.S. military already excommunicated him or applied charges to him, then you would have something to work from.

But they hadnt. So he was a soldier they were working to return. And did return.

Now you want to play the IF game of how bad of a soldier he was. That's a different matter. But I imagine they are working on that also.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

Now the guy is Bin Laden.

 

[timschochet]

I haven't seen these reports, but I have a little trouble believing that some Anerican private captured in 2009 is teaching the Taliban how to make IEDs and ambush tactics. As if the Taliban was unaware of those things before this guy showed up.

 

[GroveDiesel]

First he defected, supposedly. Now suddenly dudes an active member of the Taliban? Seriously?

Is that what I said?

We traded 5 terrorists for one of their own. What did you mean by that remark?

Don't you dare take that out of full context. That's low and pathetic even for you.

What does it mean, in full context?

It means IF he went looking to join up with the Taliban, then we traded for one of their own. I'm not sure why that's difficult for you to process.I think I made it clear that that was the worst case scenario. Do you deny that that scenario is even the slightest bit possible?

First off you're still wrong; for you to be right, not only would he have gone off seeking to join the Taliban, the Taliban would have to welcome him with open arms, and then this guy would have had to spend the last 5 years pretending to be a prisoner when actually he was a member of the Taliban. THAT'S what it means to be "one of theirs". Is what I just wrote possible? Of course. Is it likely? IMO not even slightly. And for you to bring it up as a probability further indicates to me what I've stated all along- this whole story is another excuse to hate on Obama. It's pathetic.

So the reports of him from 4 years ago helping teach the Taliban how to make IEDs, teach them ambush tactics and actually leading a small camp of insurgents are false and you know they're false?

What reports?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1305184/Bowe-Bergdahl-Taliban-claim-captured-U-S-solider-teaching-fighters-bomb-making-skills.html

 

[timschochet]

Now the guy is Bin Laden.

Don't you dare take Grove Diesel out of full context! Even by your standards, that is the lowest of the low!

 

[BigSteelThrill]

A Taliban report.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

I haven't seen these reports, but I have a little trouble believing that some Anerican private captured in 2009 is teaching the Taliban how to make IEDs and ambush tactics. As if the Taliban was unaware of those things before this guy showed up.

'Most of the skills he taught us we already knew,' he said. 'Some of my comrades think he's pretending to be a Muslim to save himself so they wouldn't behead him.'

 

[timschochet]

I haven't seen these reports, but I have a little trouble believing that some Anerican private captured in 2009 is teaching the Taliban how to make IEDs and ambush tactics. As if the Taliban was unaware of those things before this guy showed up.

'Most of the skills he taught us we already knew,' he said. 'Some of my comrades think he's pretending to be a Muslim to save himself so they wouldn't behead him.'

I'm sorry but this whole thing is starting to sound like a Monty Python skit. LOL

 

[Jim11]

I haven't seen these reports, but I have a little trouble believing that some Anerican private captured in 2009 is teaching the Taliban how to make IEDs and ambush tactics. As if the Taliban was unaware of those things before this guy showed up.

'Most of the skills he taught us we already knew,' he said. 'Some of my comrades think he's pretending to be a Muslim to save himself so they wouldn't behead him.'

I'm sorry but this whole thing is starting to sound like a Monty Python skit. LOL

Yeah, it's just hilarious how those guys got killed looking for him.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

If the part about them intercepting a call in which there was information about him trying to contact the Taliban after deserting is true, this will go down as one of the most epic blunders in modern Presidential history.

If this guy went looking to go talk with the Taliban, then we didn't trade 5 terrorists for a US soldier, we traded 5 terrorists for one of their own.

If his former squad leader is lying, he should be severely punished. If it's true...

My guess is this guy gets buried though and a fake investigation takes place. No way will this be allowed to go south for the White House.

He was still a US soldier. Hate 'em all you want.

This.

But the rose garden thing was a turd.

Yep

 

[BigSteelThrill]

I haven't seen these reports, but I have a little trouble believing that some Anerican private captured in 2009 is teaching the Taliban how to make IEDs and ambush tactics. As if the Taliban was unaware of those things before this guy showed up.

'Most of the skills he taught us we already knew,' he said. 'Some of my comrades think he's pretending to be a Muslim to save himself so they wouldn't behead him.'

I'm sorry but this whole thing is starting to sound like a Monty Python skit. LOL

 

[timschochet]

I haven't seen these reports, but I have a little trouble believing that some Anerican private captured in 2009 is teaching the Taliban how to make IEDs and ambush tactics. As if the Taliban was unaware of those things before this guy showed up.

'Most of the skills he taught us we already knew,' he said. 'Some of my comrades think he's pretending to be a Muslim to save himself so they wouldn't behead him.'

I'm sorry but this whole thing is starting to sound like a Monty Python skit. LOL

You're right, it is. The attempts you and BST will go to in order to smear anyone that disagrees with you is disgusting. You should be ashamed of yourself. But you aren't because you have proven incapable of shame here. You constantly demonize those who you disagree with no matter how rationally they frame their argument or what evidence they come to the table with. It's why you've turned youself into the joke that everyone views you as here. You can't have a simple discussion without ridiculing those that hold a different view than yours or trying to dehumanize them with slurs and strawmen you've created. It's sad and pathetic that every thread you enter becomes all about you and turns into you on your high horse trying to belittle those you disagree with.

Having a few laughs at your expense is not demonizing you and it's not dehumanizing you. Certainly there are plenty of people here who have laughs at my expense.

If we were having a debate about political philosophy, or any other REAL issue, I would never treat it so lightly, and I would treat your comments with the respect that they deserve. Honestly I believe you to be a very intelligent poster and you have offered some comments from time to time that I have found quite insightful. But I don't regard the question of whether or not this dude was a member of the Taliban to be a real issue. It's a joke IMO, so I treat it as such. But I did not smear you nor attempt to belittle you in any way.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

You're right, it is. The attempts you and BST will go to in order to smear anyone that disagrees with you is disgusting. You should be ashamed of yourself. But you aren't because you have proven incapable of shame here. You constantly demonize those who you disagree with no matter how rationally they frame their argument or what evidence they come to the table with. It's why you've turned youself into the joke that everyone views you as here. You can't have a simple discussion without ridiculing those that hold a different view than yours or trying to dehumanize them with slurs and strawmen you've created. It's sad and pathetic that every thread you enter becomes all about you and turns into you on your high horse trying to belittle those you disagree with.

 

[John Bender]

Still going great in here. Keep it up.

 

[GroveDiesel]

Ugh. Been an awful week, awful month and awful year for me. Not the best frame of mind to talk politics at all. My apologies to everyone in this thread for being a moron. I'll go ahead and check out now.

 

[HellToupee]

Still going great in here. Keep it up.

 

[timschochet]

Ugh. Been an awful week, awful month and awful year for me. Not the best frame of mind to talk politics at all. My apologies to everyone in this thread for being a moron. I'll go ahead and check out now.

I thought some of your comments were over the top, but I didn't think you were a moron. Anyhow, I hope that whatever is going wrong in your personal life gets fixed quickly.

 

[Soonerman]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

Really. Just dead soldiers? You are a Taliban sympathizer just like Tim. Both of you just don't like America

You didnt answer my question, KooK.

I just want to get you on record that you're a Taliban sympathizer. Let's affirm that right here, right now. Just say it.

I would have sent 10 million US soldiers to Afghanistan and not stopped til there were no living Taliban/Al Qaeda fighters over the age of 16.

Man, you are the most badass internet tough guy ever.

Do you have any idea how many soldiers the US even has? What a freaking joke.

You dummy, I would have implemented a draft and sent everyone to kill our enemies. I dont understand why you pacifists dont understand what war is really about.

Yep, to put 10 million soldiers in Afghanistan would have required a WW2 like military. I'm sure Congress would have approved that. Of course anything is possible for an internet tough guy such as yourself.

 

[timschochet]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

Really. Just dead soldiers? You are a Taliban sympathizer just like Tim. Both of you just don't like America

You didnt answer my question, KooK.

I just want to get you on record that you're a Taliban sympathizer. Let's affirm that right here, right now. Just say it.

I would have sent 10 million US soldiers to Afghanistan and not stopped til there were no living Taliban/Al Qaeda fighters over the age of 16.

Man, you are the most badass internet tough guy ever.

Do you have any idea how many soldiers the US even has? What a freaking joke.

You dummy, I would have implemented a draft and sent everyone to kill our enemies. I dont understand why you pacifists dont understand what war is really about.

Yep, to put 10 million soldiers in Afghanistan would have required a WW2 like military. I'm sure Congress would have approved that. Of course anything is possible for an internet tough guy such as yourself.

Actually, while I'm not convinced it would have been the best solution, Congress WOULD have approved it- at any time during the first 30 days after September 11, 2001. If President Bush had wanted to have a draft at that time and sent a million men to Afghanistan, we could have.

But part of the reason we didn't is because we feared, reasonably, that such a large presence of American forces would have destabilized Pakistan. And from the beginning, that has been the key issue at play.

 

[Soonerman]

Actually, while I'm not convinced it would have been the best solution, Congress WOULD have approved it- at any time during the first 30 days after September 11, 2001. If President Bush had wanted to have a draft at that time and sent a million men to Afghanistan, we could have.


But part of the reason we didn't is because we feared, reasonably, that such a large presence of American forces would have destabilized Pakistan. And from the beginning, that has been the key issue at play.

You left a zero off the Todd proposal I was mocking.

 

[Aerial Assault]

Wait, Obama did a prisoner exchange and received Bin Laden??? IMPEACH!! BENGHAZEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!111ONE

 

[BeaverCleaver]

at all the condescending comments that the lefties fall back on like usual.

 

[cstu]

First he defected, supposedly. Now suddenly dudes an active member of the Taliban? Seriously?

Is that what I said?

We traded 5 terrorists for one of their own. What did you mean by that remark?

Don't you dare take that out of full context. That's low and pathetic even for you.

What does it mean, in full context?

It means IF he went looking to join up with the Taliban, then we traded for one of their own. I'm not sure why that's difficult for you to process.I think I made it clear that that was the worst case scenario. Do you deny that that scenario is even the slightest bit possible?

First off you're still wrong; for you to be right, not only would he have gone off seeking to join the Taliban, the Taliban would have to welcome him with open arms, and then this guy would have had to spend the last 5 years pretending to be a prisoner when actually he was a member of the Taliban. THAT'S what it means to be "one of theirs".Is what I just wrote possible? Of course. Is it likely? IMO not even slightly. And for you to bring it up as a probability further indicates to me what I've stated all along- this whole story is another excuse to hate on Obama. It's pathetic.

Next you're going to tell me Homeland isn't real either.

 

[tommyboy]

Trading one awol dude for 5 taliban commanders is so stupid, the only reason it was done was to take the VA story off the headlines.

 

[BroncoFreak_2K3]

at all the condescending comments that the lefties fall back on like usual.

 

[Otis]

First he defected, supposedly. Now suddenly dudes an active member of the Taliban? Seriously?

Is that what I said?

We traded 5 terrorists for one of their own. What did you mean by that remark?

Don't you dare take that out of full context. That's low and pathetic even for you.

What does it mean, in full context?

It means, he is too scared to speak plainly.

He said what he meant to say and tried to pre-deflect any criticism of his hatred by making those pre-qualifiers.

Don't put words into my mouth. I can speak plainly for myself just fine. Keep your small little thoghts to yourself.

Would be a good album name imo

 

[Henry Ford]

Obviously none of us knows what Bergdahl did or didn't do over the last five years, but I do have a serious issue with protesting the return of the last living American POW.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

Actually, while I'm not convinced it would have been the best solution, Congress WOULD have approved it- at any time during the first 30 days after September 11, 2001. If President Bush had wanted to have a draft at that time and sent a million men to Afghanistan, we could have.


But part of the reason we didn't is because we feared, reasonably, that such a large presence of American forces would have destabilized Pakistan. And from the beginning, that has been the key issue at play.

You left a zero off the Todd proposal I was mocking.

And Todd wasn't?

 

[TPW]

Obviously none of us knows what Bergdahl did or didn't do over the last five years, but I do have a serious issue with protesting the return of the last living American POW.

I and many others have issues with anyone referring to someone who by all accounts walked away from his post of his own accord as a "POW."

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

"All" seems to be yet another word that is too difficult to understand.

 

[TPW]

Do you have information contradicting his supposed desertion of his post? If so, please do share. I've heard nothing to the contrary.

 

[shader]

First he defected, supposedly. Now suddenly dudes an active member of the Taliban? Seriously?

Is that what I said?

We traded 5 terrorists for one of their own. What did you mean by that remark?

Don't you dare take that out of full context. That's low and pathetic even for you.

What does it mean, in full context?

It means IF he went looking to join up with the Taliban, then we traded for one of their own. I'm not sure why that's difficult for you to process.I think I made it clear that that was the worst case scenario. Do you deny that that scenario is even the slightest bit possible?

First off you're still wrong; for you to be right, not only would he have gone off seeking to join the Taliban, the Taliban would have to welcome him with open arms, and then this guy would have had to spend the last 5 years pretending to be a prisoner when actually he was a member of the Taliban. THAT'S what it means to be "one of theirs".Is what I just wrote possible? Of course. Is it likely? IMO not even slightly. And for you to bring it up as a probability further indicates to me what I've stated all along- this whole story is another excuse to hate on Obama. It's pathetic.

So the reports of him from 4 years ago helping teach the Taliban how to make IEDs, teach them ambush tactics and actually leading a small camp of insurgents are false and you know they're false?

What reports?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1305184/Bowe-Bergdahl-Taliban-claim-captured-U-S-solider-teaching-fighters-bomb-making-skills.html

Gotta be from CNN or MSNBC or it ain't legit

 

[greenroom]

Do you have information contradicting his supposed desertion of his post? If so, please do share. I've heard nothing to the contrary.

Do you proof that he is not a POW? Since you think he just walked up to the Taliban and said can you keep me captive? He "may" have went AWOL, but to say he is not a POW is ignorant!

 

[TPW]

Do you have information contradicting his supposed desertion of his post? If so, please do share. I've heard nothing to the contrary.

Do you proof that he is not a POW? Since you think he just walked up to the Taliban and said can you keep me captive? He "may" have went AWOL, but to say he is not a POW is ignorant!

In our culture the term "Prisoner of War" generally implies that a person was captured in the course of action against enemy forces, particularly a solider. It may be splitting hairs but as a former member of the armed forces myself and with an uncle who died in an overseas conflict, to hear Sgt. Bergdahl referred to as such offends me deeply.

"POW?" No. Prisoner in a war zone is more accurate. Deserter is best.

 

[Billy Bats]

He was a Prisoner Of Walking.

Video released of the Taliban handing over Bergdahl.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/06/04/taliban-video-handover/9946647/

 

[GroveDiesel]

How many people are protesting the fact that he was brought back at all versus how many think the cost was too high? Nobody is going to argue that no cost is too high, are they?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Obviously none of us knows what Bergdahl did or didn't do over the last five years, but I do have a serious issue with protesting the return of the last living American POW.

"All" seems to be yet another word that is too difficult to understand.

The Taliban do not actually have "Prisoners of War."

We know this because they execute anyone and everyone they catch in combat.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

How many people are protesting the fact that he was brought back at all versus how many think the cost was too high? Nobody is going to argue that no cost is too high, are they?

Correct. Everyone wants every soldier home. Soldiers and people who love them also understand that this does not come at "any price."

The President is getting criticism from Democrats like Dianne Feinstein, from Hillary Clinton who is already separating herself, from Chris Matthews, from Anderson Cooper, WaPo, NYT, from the soldiers themselves.

The criticism is about who was released and the manner in which it was done.

 

[Henry Ford]

You don't have to be captured in combat to be a prisoner of war.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

Obviously none of us knows what Bergdahl did or didn't do over the last five years, but I do have a serious issue with protesting the return of the last living American POW.

"All" seems to be yet another word that is too difficult to understand.

The Taliban does not actually have "Prisoners of War."

We know this because they execute anyone and everyone they catch in combat.

There is "no" account of this guys actions that does not state that he deserted? Maybe he did desert, but I'm pretty certain that the official account at least as of today does not make that assertion, or at least doesn't come to that as a final conclusion.

And yes I see that post was edited since my reply but I'd doubt "walked away by his own accord" is in "all accounts" either. We shall see if it is in his account!

In any case don't our soldiers deserve the benefit of doubt on unsettled issues such as this until such time we decide to make such a charge and go through the appropriate due process to attempt to prove it?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

You don't have to be captured in combat to be a prisoner of war.

I think we all know the military will adjudicate this according to the code. I did it put it in quotes, I suppose because to me there is a difference between being caught "during war" and being "at war." My main point was that the Taliban kills everyone they catch who they think is "at war" with them, including people who aren't even in the military.

 

[glock]

How many people are protesting the fact that he was brought back at all versus how many think the cost was too high? Nobody is going to argue that no cost is too high, are they?

And remember- we don't know the true cost.

 

[GroveDiesel]

You don't have to be captured in combat to be a prisoner of war.

The US doesn't use the POW designation anymore. He was Missing/Captured.

 

[glock]

You don't have to be captured in combat to be a prisoner of war.

I think we all know the military will adjudicate this according to the code. I did it put it in quotes, I suppose because to me there is a difference between being caught "during war" and being "at war." My main point was that the Taliban kills everyone they catch who they think is "at war" with them, including people who aren't even in the military.

Unless they think they could be of some use.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Obviously none of us knows what Bergdahl did or didn't do over the last five years, but I do have a serious issue with protesting the return of the last living American POW.

"All" seems to be yet another word that is too difficult to understand.

The Taliban does not actually have "Prisoners of War."

We know this because they execute anyone and everyone they catch in combat.

There is "no" account of this guys actions that does not state that he deserted? Maybe he did desert, but I'm pretty certain that the official account at least as of today does not make that assertion, or at least doesn't come to that as a final conclusion.

And yes I see that post was edited since my reply but I'd doubt "walked away by his own accord" is in "all accounts" either. We shall see if it is in his account!

In any case don't our soldiers deserve the benefit of doubt on unsettled issues such as this until such time we decide to make such a charge and go through the appropriate due process to attempt to prove it?

I completely agree on the due process part. I just know, we all, supporters, critics, whomever (we all want him home), have not seen a single account that he was captured in combat, or accidentally, or that he was lost looking for base. So then I just wonder what underlay the decision by the Taliban to not execute this one, single "POW" captured by them in the whole war.