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Andre Brown returns ?, to what roll? (1 Viewer)

IVNACATES

Footballguy
On Sept. 3rd, drebrown35 tweeted "see y'all week 8". I have looked just about everywhere for an update on his status, and found nothing.

I am an MJD owner that could use RB help, and picked drebrown off waivers this week to hold as lottery ticket. Now, Benny C. looks like he'll get a chance in the horrid StL backfield, and thinking of going with him. Don't want your input or opinion, just stating my position.

If he does return sooner, rather than later, has Wilson done enough to even make it RBBC, or will drebrown be the spark they need? I have seen zero Giant's games, so I only have stats to look at. Add that to the lack of info on drebrown, and I'm kinda in the dark. Any insight into the questions posed in the title would be greatly appreciated.

BTW, I tried reading the David Wilson thread. I just couldn't garner any info from it thanks to the crazy quoters in that thread!

 
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tdhartis

Footballguy
This is purely opinion, but it all depends on Wilson's effectiveness which is probably obvious. If he continues to struggle and/or fumble, Brown will likely come back to the majority of the carries. Coughlin trusts him and he's decent and proven. If Wilson turns the season around and starts doing well, then I think Brown will come back to a 70/30 split or close in Wilson's favor, and possibly take goal line duties. If Wilson amps his performance up to average in the coming weeks, I think Brown comes back to a roughly even split, and how either performs down the road will determine it from there. No matter what, I think he comes back and is given a chance to prove himself as the lead back in some fashion. I know this is pure speculation, but that's all you can really get at this point. I'm stashing where I can starting week 6/7.

 

replacements

Footballguy
Hard topic to speculate on,although there are 80 plus pages of people trying. If wilson struggles with protecting the qb, or protecting the ball over the next 3 weeks, Brown could have a very prominant roll very quickly upon his return. When healthy, Brown is a good football player. If wilson becomes more proficient at pass protection, and is able to use his speed and tackle breaking ability to make big plays. Then, Browns roll in the offense could be around 25% or so. The big question I will have about Brown of course will be an ability to come back and take on any significant roll and remain healthy.

 

Tango

Footballguy
Out of sight, out of mind. That mantra rules too often in the fantasy football world.

1. When Brown comes back, Jacobs will probably be cut (they'd need to clear a spot for Brown). It amazed me how much someone paid for Jacobs (27%) in my league this week following the cut of Scott just b/c Coughlin said he'd be getting more GL work. Sure he will....up until he's cut in a few weeks.

2. At this point it is difficult to imagine any scenario where a healthy Brown doesnt get at least 1/3 of the work and max 3/4. At worst a healthy Brown will be a decent #3 since he's talented and he'd get the GL work; at best a low #2 in my 16 team league.

3. The Giants bye is in week 9. Given that fact, Brown should be available for 8 weeks of action. if you believe point #2 above, then he is worth a roster spot now.

 

IVNACATES

Footballguy
I think he returns to a challah roll with marmalade. Mmmmmmm
You, and those like you, are what's has gone so wrong with this board. If you're not bringing anything to conversation, don't clutter a topic with non-sense.

Now, to the point. If I'm not mistaken, designate to return is 6 weeks, correct me if I am wrong. He was place on IR on 9/4. That should allow a return after the week of 10/16, which is week 7. Maybe my math is wrong, or Dan Hanzus from FreeBaGel's link is incorrect, but that should make him available for week 8 against the Eagles. That's assuming they don't hold him out until after bye to get in shape.

Edit to add: I was hoping someone would have heard how his recovery was going. You know, on schedule, or had a set back.

 
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Bayhawks

Footballguy
I think he returns to a challah roll with marmalade. Mmmmmmm
You, and those like you, are what's has gone so wrong with this board. If you're not bringing anything to conversation, don't clutter a topic with non-sense.Now, to the point. If I'm not mistaken, designate to return is 6 weeks, correct me if I am wrong. He was place on IR on 9/4. That should allow a return after the week of 10/16, which is week 7. Maybe my math is wrong, or Dan Hanzus from FreeBaGel's link is incorrect, but that should make him available for week 8 against the Eagles. That's assuming they don't hold him out until after bye to get in shape.

Edit to add: I was hoping someone would have heard how his recovery was going. You know, on schedule, or had a set back.
A designated player is ELIGIBLE TO RETURN TO PRACTICE if he has been on the IR list for at least six weeks from the date he was placed on Reserve. He is ELIGIBLE TO RETURN TO THE ACTIVE LIST if has been on the IR list for at least eight weeks from the date he is placed on Reserve.Brown would be able to return to practice after week 6, but is not able to be placed on the active list (play in a game) until after week 8. Since they have a week 9 bye, his 1st possible game would, in fact, be week 10.

The most recent news I found about him was from 9/18. He was "jogging" on a "gravity-assisted treadmill;" whatever that is. The site for this news is below; I couldn't get the link button to work.

http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2013/09/giants_rb_andre_brown_jogging_a_little_three_weeks_into_rehab.html

 

fbelange

Footballguy
I dropped him. But there a couple of these guys on my radar.

Vereen, A Brown, Harvin, even Crabtree if the stars align.

Unless you are in a real savvy league with some teams hurting for a RB, I think its too early to pick him up. He'll be available in most leagues probably up until the week of his return.

 

koreansteve

Footballguy
Everything I'm seeing is that he won't be available until week 10 (after the week 9 bye).

http://www.newsday.com/sports/football/giants/andre-brown-can-t-return-to-giants-until-week-10-1.6005648

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Andre-Brown-headed-to-IRdesignated-to-return-Giants-work-out-backs.html

I can't find anything about how his recovery is going. Seems like a guy that could certainly help in the fantasy playoffs if healthy...especially considering the lack of WW RB options out there.

 

habsfan

Footballguy
At this point it is difficult to imagine any scenario where a healthy Brown doesnt get at least 1/3 of the work and max 3/4.
If you turn down the rhetoric and speculation to sane levels, this is about what you are left with. The max case is a rewind to last year when Brown was healthy. The 1/3 scenario is what many thought was supposed to happen this year.

What troubles me with this is that this team has scored 7 points in two games and has roughly 150 yards rushing doing it. The RB mess is a subset of a bigger mess that needs to be straightened out.

 

Khy

Footballguy
I think he returns to a challah roll with marmalade. Mmmmmmm
You, and those like you, are what's has gone so wrong with this board. If you're not bringing anything to conversation, don't clutter a topic with non-sense.Now, to the point. If I'm not mistaken, designate to return is 6 weeks, correct me if I am wrong. He was place on IR on 9/4. That should allow a return after the week of 10/16, which is week 7. Maybe my math is wrong, or Dan Hanzus from FreeBaGel's link is incorrect, but that should make him available for week 8 against the Eagles. That's assuming they don't hold him out until after bye to get in shape.

Edit to add: I was hoping someone would have heard how his recovery was going. You know, on schedule, or had a set back.
A designated player is ELIGIBLE TO RETURN TO PRACTICE if he has been on the IR list for at least six weeks from the date he was placed on Reserve. He is ELIGIBLE TO RETURN TO THE ACTIVE LIST if has been on the IR list for at least eight weeks from the date he is placed on Reserve.Brown would be able to return to practice after week 6, but is not able to be placed on the active list (play in a game) until after week 8. Since they have a week 9 bye, his 1st possible game would, in fact, be week 10.

The most recent news I found about him was from 9/18. He was "jogging" on a "gravity-assisted treadmill;" whatever that is. The site for this news is below; I couldn't get the link button to work.

http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2013/09/giants_rb_andre_brown_jogging_a_little_three_weeks_into_rehab.html
This is 100% correct. Which means Wilson will have 4 weeks of what 'should' be lead back carries to really determine if Brown is worth while. Unfortunately, we don't know what Wilson will be just yet as he's yet to be given a chance. What we do know about Wilson is this:

In the limited time he was given last season besides his fumble in Week 1 he was amazing. As a rookie he was the NFL's leading Kick Returner and probably got screwed out of a pro bowl vote for it simply because he was a rookie.

The 3 games he saw more than 10 touches last season amounted to 13.3 carries/game, 76.6 yards, 5.75 ypc and 0.66 TDs per game.

This season's stats haven't been as good but if you are actually watching the games he's doing the right things so far. If you can get past the 2 fumble game to start the season. Keep in mind a few things.

  1. The Giants offensive line is currently grading out as the 25th worst run blocking unit in the NFL. Also consider, they're ranked as the 31st worst pass blocking line. These stats are from PFF rankings.
  2. As his carries have increase, his YPC have increased. He went from 7 carries and around 2.5ypc in the first two games. To 11 carries at 3.55 ypc in Week 3, to 13 carries and 4.23ypc in Week 4.
  3. And all 3 of these games have been against some of the top rushing defenses in the NFL through 4 weeks. Dallas (#3), Denver (#1), Carolina (#7), Kansas City (#24). Bear in mind that KC's stats are a little skewed by Week 3 vs the Eagles as Vick added 100 rushing yards to their overall total. If you remove Vick from the equation they're actually allowing about 92.75ypg which would put them at about 7th overall and drop Carolina to 8th.
  4. We don't actually know who the short yardage and goaline back 'really' is right now. And we have no idea if he'll be effective in the chances he may see at it (WIlson that is). The Giants have had a total of (I forget the exact stat I put together the other day) somewhere around 4 short yardage attempts and Jacobs saw 2 at the goal line, Wilson saw 1 and Wilson saw another on a 2nd and 1 from mid field.
  5. He's actually looked better than Scott did in pass blocking situations since week 1. Probably part of the reason the Giants felt comfortable cutting Scott was they felt they could trust Wilson in more passing downs as he's shown vast improvements over the past weeks.
The best answer right now is that on limited work Wilson's prospects seem to be trending in the right direction which isn't good for Brown's prospects when he returns. But we have yet to see Wilson in a real 'lead back' style of role where he's seeing 70/30 split on snaps between him and the other backs on the roster. We should hopefully get our first glimpse of that this weekend vs Philly. If he starts to go off in the 4 coming weeks. Brown may get very limited work when he returns. If he fails miserably, Brown may become the starter when he returns.

The biggest concern I'd have right now for Wilson, Brown or just the team in general is whether or not this offensive line can start clicking. Last season they were a top five pass and run blocking unit. This season they have yet to start the same five guys in a consecutive game. They looked better in Week 4 against KC than they looked in Week 3 against CAR. Week 3, Snee and Baas were clearly hurt. So in Week 4 having some fresh guys in Cordle and Brewer starting was a big deal. This week we should see the same 5 guys starting again, and they'll have another full week of practice together under their belt as well. Plus they're going against a much, much worse defensive front than KC or CAR presented the past few weeks. All in all, everything for the offense is trending in the right direction. This week against Philly could be a breakout game for the entire offense.

 
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ShaHBucks

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.

 

Khy

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.

 

ShaHBucks

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.
I just wanted to see if you'd take the bait :lmao: Cox is the longterm Brown replacement IMO. He looked better that Wilson in the preseason and has interesting size/power/agility.

 

IVNACATES

Footballguy
Thanks for setting me straight Bayhawks.

Really good information Khy.

FWIW: Since he is two more weeks away than I thought, think I'll drop him and take flier on Cunningham. If he busts, hopefully Brown will be there in a couple weeks.

 

Khy

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.
I just wanted to see if you'd take the bait :lmao: Cox is the longterm Brown replacement IMO. He looked better that Wilson in the preseason and has interesting size/power/agility.
Yeah... you're right about the Cox and Brown part. And clearly Cox's line of 18 carries for 32 yards at 1.8 ypc is better than Wilson's 24 carries, 179 yards at 7.9ypc line from the preseason.

 

ShaHBucks

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.
I just wanted to see if you'd take the bait :lmao: Cox is the longterm Brown replacement IMO. He looked better that Wilson in the preseason and has interesting size/power/agility.
Yeah... you're right about the Cox and Brown part. And clearly Cox's line of 18 carries for 32 yards at 1.8 ypc is better than Wilson's 24 carries, 179 yards at 7.9ypc line from the preseason.
Deja Vu. I'm not going there with Wilson's ypc ever again. For starters Cox would need to be activated vs Phi. It could take a few weeks but the only thing in his way from starting is David Wilson. Then he's a Wilson fumble or missed block from relevancy. Has that ever happen before?

OP if you want aything from the Wilson thread check the offseason stuff 2 million pages ago. Not too many people here are taking the Wilson hype serious these days. A healthy Andre Brown is built for the main carry role better than Wilson. He will get work.and I'm not saying that as a knock on Wilson's ability. I just think Brown is better.

 
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Khy

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.
I just wanted to see if you'd take the bait :lmao: Cox is the longterm Brown replacement IMO. He looked better that Wilson in the preseason and has interesting size/power/agility.
Yeah... you're right about the Cox and Brown part. And clearly Cox's line of 18 carries for 32 yards at 1.8 ypc is better than Wilson's 24 carries, 179 yards at 7.9ypc line from the preseason.
Deja Vu. I'm not going there with Wilson's ypc ever again.For starters Cox would need to be activated vs Phi. It could take a few weeks but the only thing in his way from starting is David Wilson. Then he's a Wilson fumble or missed block from relevancy. Has that ever happen before?

OP if you want aything from the Wilson thread check the offseason stuff 2 million pages ago. Not too many people here are taking the Wilson hype serious these days. A healthy Andre Brown is built for the main carry role better than Wilson. He will get work.and I'm not saying that as a knock on Wilson's ability. I just think Brown is better.
A few things...

1. I'd just like for you to explain how it's possible for 1.8ypc from a 7th round rookie to look better than well... anyone? Honest question. I watched every preseason game, Cox looked rather lost out there to me. The Giants like his size and would rather try develop him than Scott. This was made obvious in the preseason when the reports were that Scott was supposed to get cut in favor of Cox. That was prior to Brown's injury. But Cox has a long way to go before he could be anything relevant... much more than a few games at that. He'll be 'active' as a KR this week would be my guess but I doubt he sees any actual on field time without an injury to Wilson or Jacobs.

2. Andre Brown is never healthy and never has been healthy. So I don't see how he will ever be built for a main carry role. The guy has had a serious season ending injury every season since college. He's a train wreck and runs with reckless abandon. Sure, it makes him seem like a good RB in the limited work he gets because of how hard he runs, but it gets him hurt ALWAYS. The Giants are aware of this and regardless of how good or bad he or Wilson are through this season and next. Brown will never be in more than a 50/50 split back because of that risk. He may not even be in a 50/50 split with Wilson if Wilson completely fails at every step. It's possible they bring someone else in during the offseason and put Brown and <someone> in a 50/50 split. But he doesn't have the capability to be a every down back in this league. He's to often injured and frail. Plus, he's really not all that good. There's that as well.

 
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I think he returns to a challah roll with marmalade. Mmmmmmm
You, and those like you, are what's has gone so wrong with this board. If you're not bringing anything to conversation, don't clutter a topic with non-sense.
Maybe your diction sucks.
I think the culinary expertise of the OP is the problem. No spread works better on Challah than schmear.

I think CC has this right -- Brown moves into a shared position where he splits the snaps, if not evenly than 70-30 / 60-40. Giants need to find answers in the running game and Brown could provide a spark, esp. catching the ball out of the backfield.

 

ShaHBucks

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.
I just wanted to see if you'd take the bait :lmao: Cox is the longterm Brown replacement IMO. He looked better that Wilson in the preseason and has interesting size/power/agility.
Yeah... you're right about the Cox and Brown part. And clearly Cox's line of 18 carries for 32 yards at 1.8 ypc is better than Wilson's 24 carries, 179 yards at 7.9ypc line from the preseason.
Deja Vu. I'm not going there with Wilson's ypc ever again.For starters Cox would need to be activated vs Phi. It could take a few weeks but the only thing in his way from starting is David Wilson. Then he's a Wilson fumble or missed block from relevancy. Has that ever happen before?

OP if you want aything from the Wilson thread check the offseason stuff 2 million pages ago. Not too many people here are taking the Wilson hype serious these days. A healthy Andre Brown is built for the main carry role better than Wilson. He will get work.and I'm not saying that as a knock on Wilson's ability. I just think Brown is better.
A few things...

1. I'd just like for you to explain how it's possible for 1.8ypc from a 7th round rookie to look better than well... anyone? Honest question. I watched every preseason game, Cox looked rather lost out there to me. The Giants like his size and would rather try develop him than Scott. This was made obvious in the preseason when the reports were that Scott was supposed to get cut in favor of Cox. That was prior to Brown's injury. But Cox has a long way to go before he could be anything relevant... much more than a few games at that. He'll be 'active' as a KR this week would be my guess but I doubt he sees any actual on field time without an injury to Wilson or Jacobs.

2. Andre Brown is never healthy and never has been healthy. So I don't see how he will ever be built for a main carry role. The guy has had a serious season ending injury every season since college. He's a train wreck and runs with reckless abandon. Sure, it makes him seem like a good RB in the limited work he gets because of how hard he runs, but it gets him hurt ALWAYS. The Giants are aware of this and regardless of how good or bad he or Wilson are through this season and next. Brown will never be in more than a 50/50 split back because of that risk. He may not even be in a 50/50 split with Wilson if Wilson completely fails at every step. It's possible they bring someone else in during the offseason and put Brown and <someone> in a 50/50 split. But he doesn't have the capability to be a every down back in this league. He's to often injured and frail. Plus, he's really not all that good. There's that as well.
I don't think you watched Cox in the preseason. Late in game 1 he went 9 for 33. I only knew him from numbers but my first eyeball take was "not bad." Small sample but nice burst and size.

Game 2 he had 2 car for yards, 4 rec for 48 yards. He looked better with each touch.

Game 3 I don't remember anything beside Wilson went untouched for a long TD. Big whop, he didn't earn any dignity in my book.

Game 4 he went 4 car for -2. Tourain and Scott got touches. Scott looked like the best of the bunch. Brown was hurt and Wilson begin being traded for twice his value.

Brown/Scott have the size/power to take on defenders unlike anything Wilson has every shown me since college. He has fake power. The big plays are there. It's like hitting a home-run with all strikeouts in between with Wilson. As for Brown, he is pretty unfortunate. What else can you do but ride him until he gets hurt again? I'm sure it will be more respectable that what you've got from Wilson thus far.

 
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MoveToSkypager

Footballguy
I think he returns to a challah roll with marmalade. Mmmmmmm
You, and those like you, are what's has gone so wrong with this board. If you're not bringing anything to conversation, don't clutter a topic with non-sense.
Maybe your diction sucks.
I think the culinary expertise of the OP is the problem. No spread works better on Challah than schmear.

I think CC has this right -- Brown moves into a shared position where he splits the snaps, if not evenly than 70-30 / 60-40. Giants need to find answers in the running game and Brown could provide a spark, esp. catching the ball out of the backfield.
Coughlin has stated that Jacobs/Wilson will form a 1-2 punch, where does that leave Brown? Will Brown take more of Wilson's snaps? Or Jacobs?

 

Khy

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.
I just wanted to see if you'd take the bait :lmao: Cox is the longterm Brown replacement IMO. He looked better that Wilson in the preseason and has interesting size/power/agility.
Yeah... you're right about the Cox and Brown part. And clearly Cox's line of 18 carries for 32 yards at 1.8 ypc is better than Wilson's 24 carries, 179 yards at 7.9ypc line from the preseason.
Deja Vu. I'm not going there with Wilson's ypc ever again.For starters Cox would need to be activated vs Phi. It could take a few weeks but the only thing in his way from starting is David Wilson. Then he's a Wilson fumble or missed block from relevancy. Has that ever happen before?

OP if you want aything from the Wilson thread check the offseason stuff 2 million pages ago. Not too many people here are taking the Wilson hype serious these days. A healthy Andre Brown is built for the main carry role better than Wilson. He will get work.and I'm not saying that as a knock on Wilson's ability. I just think Brown is better.
A few things...

1. I'd just like for you to explain how it's possible for 1.8ypc from a 7th round rookie to look better than well... anyone? Honest question. I watched every preseason game, Cox looked rather lost out there to me. The Giants like his size and would rather try develop him than Scott. This was made obvious in the preseason when the reports were that Scott was supposed to get cut in favor of Cox. That was prior to Brown's injury. But Cox has a long way to go before he could be anything relevant... much more than a few games at that. He'll be 'active' as a KR this week would be my guess but I doubt he sees any actual on field time without an injury to Wilson or Jacobs.

2. Andre Brown is never healthy and never has been healthy. So I don't see how he will ever be built for a main carry role. The guy has had a serious season ending injury every season since college. He's a train wreck and runs with reckless abandon. Sure, it makes him seem like a good RB in the limited work he gets because of how hard he runs, but it gets him hurt ALWAYS. The Giants are aware of this and regardless of how good or bad he or Wilson are through this season and next. Brown will never be in more than a 50/50 split back because of that risk. He may not even be in a 50/50 split with Wilson if Wilson completely fails at every step. It's possible they bring someone else in during the offseason and put Brown and <someone> in a 50/50 split. But he doesn't have the capability to be a every down back in this league. He's to often injured and frail. Plus, he's really not all that good. There's that as well.
I don't think you watched Cox in the preseason.Late in game 1 he went 9 for 33. I only knew him from numbers but my first eyeball take was "not bad." Small sample but nice burst and size.

Game 2 he had 2 car for yards, 4 rec for 48 yards. He looked better with each touch.

Game 3 I don't remember anything beside Wilson went untouched for a long TD. Big whop, he didn't earn any dignity in my book.

Game 4 he went 4 car for -2. Tourain and Scott got touches. Scott looked like the best of the bunch. Brown was hurt and Wilson begin being traded for twice his value.

Brown/Scott have the size/power to take on defenders unlike anything Wilson has every shown me since college. He has fake power. The big plays are there. It's like hitting a home-run with all strikeouts in between with Wilson. As for Brown, he is pretty unfortunate. What else can you do but ride him until he gets hurt again? I'm sure it will be more respectable that what you've got from Wilson thus far.
Yeah you're right, whenever Cox came onto the field I closed my eyes. He was relevant only in the first preseason game. And 9 for 33 isn't world breaking. You act like he was destroying people, in reality he looked 'half decent' against the third team defense of the now 0-4 Pittsburgh Steelers. He was nothing to right home about he was better than Scott but that also isn't saying much. In fact Coughlin was quoted this week on Cox by saying "Cox needs to learn everything". The guy isn't even remotely ready to make any form of real impact, it'd be next season at best if he were to see real playing time. Short of a big injury to Wilson or Jacobs.

As for Wilson's power, read any NFL analysts review of him. He's a much more powerful runner than you seem to think. I'm not really sure what "fake power" is supposed to mean exactly? I'd like to see a definition for it though.

And as for Brown, you can limit his touches and try to only use him in goal line situations to try and limit the amount of opportunities he has to get injured. So you use him in only short yardage situations and possibly pass blocking if Wilson stops improving on them. Essentially, use his biggest strength and try to get the most out of that strength.

We're also ignoring the fact that the Giants could opt to hold him out longer than Week 10 if the season continues to tank the way it has... if it's Week 10 and they're 5 games out of the playoff race they may not bother to bring him back until way later in the season around Week 14 or so just to make sure he's completely healthy and back in football shape. There'd be no point in rushing him back when they could let him have a lot longer to make sure he's back in shape and less of a liability for injury.

 
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Concept Coop

Footballguy
I think he returns to a challah roll with marmalade. Mmmmmmm
You, and those like you, are what's has gone so wrong with this board. If you're not bringing anything to conversation, don't clutter a topic with non-sense.
Maybe your diction sucks.
I think the culinary expertise of the OP is the problem. No spread works better on Challah than schmear.

I think CC has this right -- Brown moves into a shared position where he splits the snaps, if not evenly than 70-30 / 60-40. Giants need to find answers in the running game and Brown could provide a spark, esp. catching the ball out of the backfield.
Coughlin has stated that Jacobs/Wilson will form a 1-2 punch, where does that leave Brown? Will Brown take more of Wilson's snaps? Or Jacobs?
It will be Wilson/Brown, once Brown is healthy. Hell, it was Wilson/Scott (over Jacobs) for a couple weeks.

 
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Khy

Footballguy
I think he returns to a challah roll with marmalade. Mmmmmmm
You, and those like you, are what's has gone so wrong with this board. If you're not bringing anything to conversation, don't clutter a topic with non-sense.
Maybe your diction sucks.
I think the culinary expertise of the OP is the problem. No spread works better on Challah than schmear.

I think CC has this right -- Brown moves into a shared position where he splits the snaps, if not evenly than 70-30 / 60-40. Giants need to find answers in the running game and Brown could provide a spark, esp. catching the ball out of the backfield.
Coughlin has stated that Jacobs/Wilson will form a 1-2 punch, where does that leave Brown? Will Brown take more of Wilson's snaps? Or Jacobs?
It will be Wilson/Brown, once Brown is healthy. Hell, it was Wilson/Scott for a couple weeks.
Coughlin seems to say a lot of things about playing situations to the media and never live up to them. As I keep saying, the release of Scott made almost no sense. I think nobody really knows how the snap count distribution will look until we actually see this Eagles game this weekend. it could be a 50/50 snap count. It could be a 80/20 snap count. It could be a 70/30 snap count. We really don't know... I'm 'assuming' they cut Scott because Wilson was finally showing signs that he's ready to take on a 3rd down role as well. Wilson's looked better than Scott in pass protection the past two weeks, and last week Scott was benched at the end of the game after letting Eli get lit up then fumbling a easy hand off. It was Wilson that finished the game out in passing situations, not Jacobs. So I'd assume that would continue. But then again, most people were assuming that Scott wouldn't be cut this week. So what do we know? Nothing. It's wait and see, either way... Brown's impact on return rests 100% on Wilson's effectiveness in the next four weeks.

 
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ShaHBucks

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.
I just wanted to see if you'd take the bait :lmao: Cox is the longterm Brown replacement IMO. He looked better that Wilson in the preseason and has interesting size/power/agility.
Yeah... you're right about the Cox and Brown part. And clearly Cox's line of 18 carries for 32 yards at 1.8 ypc is better than Wilson's 24 carries, 179 yards at 7.9ypc line from the preseason.
Deja Vu. I'm not going there with Wilson's ypc ever again.For starters Cox would need to be activated vs Phi. It could take a few weeks but the only thing in his way from starting is David Wilson. Then he's a Wilson fumble or missed block from relevancy. Has that ever happen before?

OP if you want aything from the Wilson thread check the offseason stuff 2 million pages ago. Not too many people here are taking the Wilson hype serious these days. A healthy Andre Brown is built for the main carry role better than Wilson. He will get work.and I'm not saying that as a knock on Wilson's ability. I just think Brown is better.
A few things...

1. I'd just like for you to explain how it's possible for 1.8ypc from a 7th round rookie to look better than well... anyone? Honest question. I watched every preseason game, Cox looked rather lost out there to me. The Giants like his size and would rather try develop him than Scott. This was made obvious in the preseason when the reports were that Scott was supposed to get cut in favor of Cox. That was prior to Brown's injury. But Cox has a long way to go before he could be anything relevant... much more than a few games at that. He'll be 'active' as a KR this week would be my guess but I doubt he sees any actual on field time without an injury to Wilson or Jacobs.

2. Andre Brown is never healthy and never has been healthy. So I don't see how he will ever be built for a main carry role. The guy has had a serious season ending injury every season since college. He's a train wreck and runs with reckless abandon. Sure, it makes him seem like a good RB in the limited work he gets because of how hard he runs, but it gets him hurt ALWAYS. The Giants are aware of this and regardless of how good or bad he or Wilson are through this season and next. Brown will never be in more than a 50/50 split back because of that risk. He may not even be in a 50/50 split with Wilson if Wilson completely fails at every step. It's possible they bring someone else in during the offseason and put Brown and <someone> in a 50/50 split. But he doesn't have the capability to be a every down back in this league. He's to often injured and frail. Plus, he's really not all that good. There's that as well.
I don't think you watched Cox in the preseason.Late in game 1 he went 9 for 33. I only knew him from numbers but my first eyeball take was "not bad." Small sample but nice burst and size.

Game 2 he had 2 car for yards, 4 rec for 48 yards. He looked better with each touch.

Game 3 I don't remember anything beside Wilson went untouched for a long TD. Big whop, he didn't earn any dignity in my book.

Game 4 he went 4 car for -2. Tourain and Scott got touches. Scott looked like the best of the bunch. Brown was hurt and Wilson begin being traded for twice his value.

Brown/Scott have the size/power to take on defenders unlike anything Wilson has every shown me since college. He has fake power. The big plays are there. It's like hitting a home-run with all strikeouts in between with Wilson. As for Brown, he is pretty unfortunate. What else can you do but ride him until he gets hurt again? I'm sure it will be more respectable that what you've got from Wilson thus far.
Yeah you're right, whenever Cox came onto the field I closed my eyes. He was relevant only in the first preseason game. And 9 for 33 isn't world breaking. You act like he was destroying people, in reality he looked 'half decent' against the third team defense of the now 0-4 Pittsburgh Steelers. He was nothing to right home about he was better than Scott but that also isn't saying much. In fact Coughlin was quoted this week on Cox by saying "Cox needs to learn everything". The guy isn't even remotely ready to make any form of real impact, it'd be next season at best if he were to see real playing time. Short of a big injury to Wilson or Jacobs.

As for Wilson's power, read any NFL analysts review of him. He's a much more powerful runner than you seem to think. I'm not really sure what "fake power" is supposed to mean exactly? I'd like to see a definition for it though.

And as for Brown, you can limit his touches and try to only use him in goal line situations to try and limit the amount of opportunities he has to get injured. So you use him in only short yardage situations and possibly pass blocking if Wilson stops improving on them. Essentially, use his biggest strength and try to get the most out of that strength.

We're also ignoring the fact that the Giants could opt to hold him out longer than Week 10 if the season continues to tank the way it has... if it's Week 10 and they're 5 games out of the playoff race they may not bother to bring him back until way later in the season around Week 14 or so just to make sure he's completely healthy and back in football shape. There'd be no point in rushing him back when they could let him have a lot longer to make sure he's back in shape and less of a liability for injury.
This is something I don't do. If I did I would have over drafted Wilson and be sorry about it. I don't know why you hang your hat on that. I'd kick any analyst you are referring to ### in fantasy football, most of us would. I'm sure I have a better track record than whoever your referring to as well. He tries to be a power runner but he doesn't have the size or strength for it on this level. You don't ever see him consistently take on a defender and push him for a few extra yards. It's a red flag, ignore it at your own peril because you heard Mike Mayock say so. ##### luck with that bruhI said Cox was a long-term play. If they were both in a rookie draft today I'd take Cox. I know what the coach said. I know what all the analyst and coaches said about Moreno this offseason. Go see why I didn't buy it in the Broncos RB thread all offseason. I know what the consensus is/was on David Wilson as well. Take some time to consider what I said. If you don't haven't done any homework on Cox than there isn't much you can tell me that I don't know. I can name a handful of no names that earned touches because of Wilson's play. One fumble or a missed assignment from Wilson and it's game on with seeing if Cox can help the team. It can just be to simply compliment Wilson, not necessarily to unseat him. Wilson will have a role, so will a Power runner in this offense. It's necessary at this point to consistently pickup 1st downs. Jacobs is done. It will either be Cox or Brown. I'm not all-in with Cox. He just one to watch on a team with all it's running backs falling apart one way or another.

No one knows anything about Browns return. No one know when he will get hurt again either. If he is healthy than he's the guy I want on this team. In a committee he is the only one I can see being a top-15 play.

 

Khy

Footballguy
ShaHBucks said:
Khy said:
ShaHBucks said:
Khy said:
ShaHBucks said:
Khy said:
ShaHBucks said:
Khy said:
ShaHBucks said:
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.
I just wanted to see if you'd take the bait :lmao: Cox is the longterm Brown replacement IMO. He looked better that Wilson in the preseason and has interesting size/power/agility.
Yeah... you're right about the Cox and Brown part. And clearly Cox's line of 18 carries for 32 yards at 1.8 ypc is better than Wilson's 24 carries, 179 yards at 7.9ypc line from the preseason.
Deja Vu. I'm not going there with Wilson's ypc ever again.For starters Cox would need to be activated vs Phi. It could take a few weeks but the only thing in his way from starting is David Wilson. Then he's a Wilson fumble or missed block from relevancy. Has that ever happen before?

OP if you want aything from the Wilson thread check the offseason stuff 2 million pages ago. Not too many people here are taking the Wilson hype serious these days. A healthy Andre Brown is built for the main carry role better than Wilson. He will get work.and I'm not saying that as a knock on Wilson's ability. I just think Brown is better.
A few things...

1. I'd just like for you to explain how it's possible for 1.8ypc from a 7th round rookie to look better than well... anyone? Honest question. I watched every preseason game, Cox looked rather lost out there to me. The Giants like his size and would rather try develop him than Scott. This was made obvious in the preseason when the reports were that Scott was supposed to get cut in favor of Cox. That was prior to Brown's injury. But Cox has a long way to go before he could be anything relevant... much more than a few games at that. He'll be 'active' as a KR this week would be my guess but I doubt he sees any actual on field time without an injury to Wilson or Jacobs.

2. Andre Brown is never healthy and never has been healthy. So I don't see how he will ever be built for a main carry role. The guy has had a serious season ending injury every season since college. He's a train wreck and runs with reckless abandon. Sure, it makes him seem like a good RB in the limited work he gets because of how hard he runs, but it gets him hurt ALWAYS. The Giants are aware of this and regardless of how good or bad he or Wilson are through this season and next. Brown will never be in more than a 50/50 split back because of that risk. He may not even be in a 50/50 split with Wilson if Wilson completely fails at every step. It's possible they bring someone else in during the offseason and put Brown and <someone> in a 50/50 split. But he doesn't have the capability to be a every down back in this league. He's to often injured and frail. Plus, he's really not all that good. There's that as well.
I don't think you watched Cox in the preseason.Late in game 1 he went 9 for 33. I only knew him from numbers but my first eyeball take was "not bad." Small sample but nice burst and size.

Game 2 he had 2 car for yards, 4 rec for 48 yards. He looked better with each touch.

Game 3 I don't remember anything beside Wilson went untouched for a long TD. Big whop, he didn't earn any dignity in my book.

Game 4 he went 4 car for -2. Tourain and Scott got touches. Scott looked like the best of the bunch. Brown was hurt and Wilson begin being traded for twice his value.

Brown/Scott have the size/power to take on defenders unlike anything Wilson has every shown me since college. He has fake power. The big plays are there. It's like hitting a home-run with all strikeouts in between with Wilson. As for Brown, he is pretty unfortunate. What else can you do but ride him until he gets hurt again? I'm sure it will be more respectable that what you've got from Wilson thus far.
Yeah you're right, whenever Cox came onto the field I closed my eyes. He was relevant only in the first preseason game. And 9 for 33 isn't world breaking. You act like he was destroying people, in reality he looked 'half decent' against the third team defense of the now 0-4 Pittsburgh Steelers. He was nothing to right home about he was better than Scott but that also isn't saying much. In fact Coughlin was quoted this week on Cox by saying "Cox needs to learn everything". The guy isn't even remotely ready to make any form of real impact, it'd be next season at best if he were to see real playing time. Short of a big injury to Wilson or Jacobs.

As for Wilson's power, read any NFL analysts review of him. He's a much more powerful runner than you seem to think. I'm not really sure what "fake power" is supposed to mean exactly? I'd like to see a definition for it though.

And as for Brown, you can limit his touches and try to only use him in goal line situations to try and limit the amount of opportunities he has to get injured. So you use him in only short yardage situations and possibly pass blocking if Wilson stops improving on them. Essentially, use his biggest strength and try to get the most out of that strength.

We're also ignoring the fact that the Giants could opt to hold him out longer than Week 10 if the season continues to tank the way it has... if it's Week 10 and they're 5 games out of the playoff race they may not bother to bring him back until way later in the season around Week 14 or so just to make sure he's completely healthy and back in football shape. There'd be no point in rushing him back when they could let him have a lot longer to make sure he's back in shape and less of a liability for injury.
This is something I don't do. If I did I would have over drafted Wilson and be sorry about it. I don't know why you hang your hat on that. I'd kick any analyst you are referring to ### in fantasy football, most of us would. I'm sure I have a better track record than whoever your referring to as well. He tries to be a power runner but he doesn't have the size or strength for it on this level. You don't ever see him consistently take on a defender and push him for a few extra yards. It's a red flag, ignore it at your own peril because you heard Mike Mayock say so. #### luck with that bruhI said Cox was a long-term play. If they were both in a rookie draft today I'd take Cox. I know what the coach said. I know what all the analyst and coaches said about Moreno this offseason. Go see why I didn't buy it in the Broncos RB thread all offseason. I know what the consensus is/was on David Wilson as well. Take some time to consider what I said. If you don't haven't done any homework on Cox than there isn't much you can tell me that I don't know. I can name a handful of no names that earned touches because of Wilson's play. One fumble or a missed assignment from Wilson and it's game on with seeing if Cox can help the team. It can just be to simply compliment Wilson, not necessarily to unseat him. Wilson will have a role, so will a Power runner in this offense. It's necessary at this point to consistently pickup 1st downs. Jacobs is done. It will either be Cox or Brown. I'm not all-in with Cox. He just one to watch on a team with all it's running backs falling apart one way or another.

No one knows anything about Browns return. No one know when he will get hurt again either. If he is healthy than he's the guy I want on this team. In a committee he is the only one I can see being a top-15 play.
See, I mention professionals because most people will take their opinion as more meaningful than mine. I never just look at stats and pro analysts and make a judgment from that. I make my own judgments. So far this season a lot of them I've made rather correctly and most are documented on this forum.

I said Doug Martin didn't deserve to be picked in the Top 5 this season. He was too inconsistent last season and I didn't like the situation with his coach and offensive questions. I got bashed heavily for it. Called insane and ######ed. What's happening now? Well, Doug Martin leads the league in carries and isn't even a top 10 RB.

I said that Arian Foster wouldn't come remotely close to his past production. Was told I was stupid and that Fosters a stud. What's he done so far but be mediocre?

I really liked what I saw from Kenbrell Thompkins and said he'd end up being the #1 fantasy reliever for the Patriots because Gronk likely wouldn't be back for awhile and Amendola would be too injured. He had a rough start but seems to be really catching on right now.

I thought the CJ Spiller hype was slightly unwarranted. He has a new QB and was in a new offensive system. Nothing was going to be the same as last year.

I thought Rivers would have a resurgence into the top 10 this season. So far that's looking accurate.

I also thought that David Wilson would have a breakout season. Because I feel like he happens to have ideal combinations of balance, power and speed. That make elite RBs. I could have predicted the small stumble from his fumbles in the first week. What I not ANYONE could predict was the offense completely imploding. A lot of people saw that possibility with Tampa and Pittsburgh. Nobody saw it coming with the Giants. I still think Wilson is immensely talented and given a better situation I feel like he'll rise to the occasion. Andre Brown will have no more success than Wilson's had to this point. Hell, if Brown was the RB to this point he'd probably have less yards because he's not as shifty as Wilson. Wilson's had to turn a lot of blown up -5 yard plays into zero yard plays. It's something stats don't show to people who don't want the games. But also something that gives me the feeling that I'm not wrong on my evaluation of the kid.

I also didnt think Lamar Miller had a chance to be a good RB in this league. I've watched tons of tape on him and all I've ever seen is a guy who can sprint through an open hole. He has good patience but no lateral agility. And goes down easily on first contact. I'm still seeing the same thing. What I'm also seeing that's surprising to me after watching the Dolphins in preseason? Is that they're actually managing to open up lanes for him to sprint through. If they can keep that up he'll put up stats. But if that line starts looking like Preseason- Week 2 again. He'll go back to being irrelevant.

 

Khy

Footballguy
MoveToSkypager said:
Quick question:

Who was a better start/stop runner? David Wilson or Barry Sanders?
I get where you're going with this... But Barry Sanders is the best start stop runner of all time. I never said he wasn't.

 

SaintsInDome2006

Footballguy
I just thought I would bring this back after the Jacobs game vs CHI.

It certainly looked like there was running room for big ol' Brandon.

Maybe this is a better situation than first appeared under Wilson. Of course Wilson may be back too.

Any new conclusions on Brown's viability?

I feel like while everyone and their sister is picking up Jacobs on Tuesday I should be adding Brown, but then 4 weeks is a long time to wait for a guy with an injury to come back to a time share on a lousy team.

 
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DropKick

Footballguy
I just thought I would bring this back after the Jacobs game vs CHI.

It certainly looked like there was running room for big ol' Brandon.

Maybe this is a better situation than first appeared under Wilson. Of course Wilson may be back too.

Any new conclusions on Brown's viability?

I feel like while everyone and their sister is picking up Jacobs on Tuesday I should be adding Brown, but then 4 weeks is a long time to wait for a guy with an injury to come back to a time share on a lousy team.
They mentioned three key injuries to the Bears d-line during the broadcast that could explain the Giants success running the ball.

 

Short Corner

Footballguy
I just thought I would bring this back after the Jacobs game vs CHI.

It certainly looked like there was running room for big ol' Brandon.

Maybe this is a better situation than first appeared under Wilson. Of course Wilson may be back too.

Any new conclusions on Brown's viability?

I feel like while everyone and their sister is picking up Jacobs on Tuesday I should be adding Brown, but then 4 weeks is a long time to wait for a guy with an injury to come back to a time share on a lousy team.
They mentioned three key injuries to the Bears d-line during the broadcast that could explain the Giants success running the ball.
I'll go with the injury in the Giants backfield.

 

Bri

Footballguy
Cox and Brown are my play in deep enough leagues. At worse they form a committee with Mr. Wilson. They have the size and power people believe Wilson has is spades.
I think you mean at best? I fail to see how at worse they form a committee. Hell I'd even give you "There's a 50/50 shot they form a committee with Wilson". But I fail to see how at worst that's what happens. At worst, Wilson explodes in the next 4 weeks and Brown and Cox never see the field except to give Wilson a breather.
I just wanted to see if you'd take the bait :lmao: Cox is the longterm Brown replacement IMO. He looked better that Wilson in the preseason and has interesting size/power/agility.
No he's not. When he was up, they signed Brandon Jacobs and eventually brought back Da'rel.

I suppose long term meaning many years from now type hope, but nothing at all currently gives this hope.

Most folks I know have the Gmen replacing much of their backfield before 2014.

This year, is somewhat normal for them. They have an odd tendency to use a whole lot of backs either by committee or by injury. They've had terrific depth for at least 15 years and awesome personnel folks to find RB talent.

 

Bri

Footballguy
Brown will do what he can and get the most carries once he's settled.

Jacobs will not be cut to make room for Brown.

The Giants have had so many injuries it seems totally reasonable (if outlandish) to expect someone to be hurt the week before Brown needs to be activated, even though it's a bye.

 

SaintsInDome2006

Footballguy
Two straight weeks RBs have stepped into the starting Giants RB role and done very well.

Is there any reason to think Brown can't do the same, stay healthy, do much better than Jacobs and Hillis and be a difference maker end of year?

 
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rickyg

Footballguy
I think he returns to a challah roll with marmalade. Mmmmmmm
You, and those like you, are what's has gone so wrong with this board. If you're not bringing anything to conversation, don't clutter a topic with non-sense.Now, to the point. If I'm not mistaken, designate to return is 6 weeks, correct me if I am wrong. He was place on IR on 9/4. That should allow a return after the week of 10/16, which is week 7. Maybe my math is wrong, or Dan Hanzus from FreeBaGel's link is incorrect, but that should make him available for week 8 against the Eagles. That's assuming they don't hold him out until after bye to get in shape.

Edit to add: I was hoping someone would have heard how his recovery was going. You know, on schedule, or had a set back.
Oh I think that you can do a better job of singling out posters who make this board bad, invictus or whatever your name is lol.

Take it easy I was just making a funny about your misspelled word in the title of the thread. Meant no harm.

Its "role" not "roll". Lol

But if you want input about Andre brown I'll give it to you:

David wilson isn't coming back at least until week 10 or 11 (if at all). By then Andre Brown will be the main back for the Giants and Wilson will be the change if pace guy for the rest of the season.

Brown is going to be a guy that could propel teams to a championship down the stretch if he can stay healthy.

 

tdhartis

Footballguy
David wilson isn't coming back at least until week 10 or 11 (if at all). By then Andre Brown will be the main back for the Giants and Wilson will be the change if pace guy for the rest of the season.Brown is going to be a guy that could propel teams to a championship down the stretch if he can stay healthy.
FWIW the current speculation is Wilson could be back week 10, and that would also be the first game A. Brown can play in. It's hard to establish yourself as the main back if they're coming back the same week, but I agree with your overall sentiment that Brown has the most potential value of the bunch down the stretch if (big if) he can stay healthy.

 

OG_GF

Footballguy
I drafted him literally hours before he got hurt. I've been holding him all year. That tells you all you need to know about my opinion of his value in a PPR league.

 

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