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Andy D's 2017 Mock Draft Thread - 4/17 One last "Oh, okay.What the heck..." mock (1 Viewer)

bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Jabril peppers is the most overrated player almost ever. Anyone taking him top 5 should have their hesx examined. Too small for lb. Not good enough for corner in the nfl. Whoever takes him should convert him to a running back
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YES!!!  Someone who actually agrees with me about Peppers.  I don't even think he's good enough to be a second round pick.  I honestly think he would be a better offensive and special teams player than safety.

 
shocked if DEN doesn't go O line hard and heavy in first few rounds...the entire state will hit the pipe if they go TE.....

 
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McShay has the Bears taking Peppers with the 4th overall pick and I think it's a terrible idea.  I'd rather they take a QB that's projected to go in the second round.  I'm really hoping that somehow Garrett or Allen fall to them but it doesn't seem likely.

 
Stinkin Ref said:
shocked if DEN doesn't go O line hard and heavy in first few rounds...the entire state will hit the pipe if they go TE.....
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The offensive line prospects are mostly awful this year. You don't want them taking third round talent in the first just because is their biggest need, do you?

 
Andy Dufresne said:
The offensive line prospects are mostly awful this year. You don't want them taking third round talent in the first just because is their biggest need, do you?
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I hate the broncos so I hope they do pull a muscle reaching.....they tried fixing the line through free agency this year and it was a disaster....unless they improve immediately after FA opens I could see them reaching or moving around a ton to load up on online hoping they hit something....running team in Kubiaks system that gave their QB money to Von and also paid DT and Sanders big bucks...Elway has swung and missed on every o line pick so far for the most part....Talib will be gone, they lost Malik last year, and some LB's....so if it ain't o line, it will be defense....just traded for TE Derby....so no way they go TE IMO.....

 
GERS
12: RB CHRISTIAN MCCAFFREY  - / GREEN BAY PACKERS
13: RB LEONARD FOURNETTE  - / INDIANAPOLIS COLTS
14: RB DALVIN COOK  - / NEW ORLEANS SAINTS
15: WR MIKE 

This should cost somebody their job.

 
Andy Dufresne said:
13. New Orleans - Derek Barnett, DE Tennessee

Saints need someone to get to the QB.




 
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With Rankins finally in the line-up, the Saints have been able to get consistent pressure. He's a really nice compliment to Fairley on the inside. Jordan's life is immeasurably easier with Rankins/Fairley. Kruger is under contract for another year at $7mm. I can see them grabbing a DE, for sure, but the story this year has been problems at CB. They rolled the dice with young, unproven players and been burned badly. Crawley, Breaux, Williams have been in and out of the line-up all year. Journeyman/Castoff Sterling Moore has given them stability but they're still pretty lousy. I have no idea what the FA market will be at that position but I suspect it's easier to find top shelf talent via the draft than buy one. 

 
The problem with Peppers is his defensive skills don’t transfer well to any NFL position. He doesn’t have the change of direction skills to play CB at the college level and was the reason he was originally moved to safety last year before moving to the hybrid safety/linebacker role this year. He struggles to open his hips making him an average coverage safety at the college level and that won’t translate well into being a NFL safety. He’s undersized for a NFL LB and will have trouble shedding blockers. He’s unfortunately a tweener on defense.

He absolutely has elite athleticism that could transfer well at the NFL level as a kick/punt returner and possibly as a change of pace or gadget RB.

The earlier comparison in this thread to Charles Woodson is way way off. Woodson was one of the best coverage CB’s to ever play college football. A skill highly desirable at the NFL level. Woodson also was a college playmaker with punt returns and occasional WR on offense. Those playmaker skills were nice but not what made Woodson an elite NFL prospect. Peppers also has the playmaker label for his kick/punt return and gadget RB abilities. The difference is he is far from the elite defensive player Woodson was.

The article below does a nice job showing Pepper’s stats this year despite the negative troll slander littered in it.

http://thegame730am.com/jabrill-peppers-is-living-proof-theres-no-conspiracy-against-michigan-its-quite-the-opposite-really/?trackback=fbshare_mobile

Below you’ll find Peppers’ individual statistics and how they rank among Big Ten players.

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Tackles: 72, 32nd in Big Ten

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Tackles for loss: 13, 7th in Big Ten

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Sacks: 4, tied for 27th in Big Ten

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Interceptions: 1, tied for 35th in Big Ten (Peppers got his first career pick at Ohio State when one of his teammates tipped a pass. Fun fact: He was a First Team All-Big Ten selection in the defensive secondary last year without a single interception!)

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Passes broken up: 1, outside of top 20 in Big Ten (None of the statistic sites list anyone with less than 7)

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Forced fumbles: 0, unranked in Big Ten

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Fumble recoveries: 0, unranked in Big Ten

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Defensive touchdowns: 0, unranked in Big Ten



 




Individual season stats for his team showing why he wasn’t his team’s best defensive player:

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Tackles: 72, 3rd on Michigan

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Tackles for loss: 13, 4th on Michigan

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Sacks: 4, 8th on Michigan

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Interceptions: 1, tied for 8th on Michigan

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Passes broken up: 1, tied for 8th on Michigan

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Forced fumbles: 0, unranked on Michigan

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Fumble recoveries: 0, unranked on Michigan

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]Defensive touchdowns: 0, unranked on Michigan

[SIZE=11pt]His performances in big games in Michigan’s tilts vs. Penn State, vs. Wisconsin, at Iowa and at Ohio State:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]20 total tackles

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]0 TFL

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]0 sacks

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]1 interception

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]0 passes broken up

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]0 forced fumbles

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]0 fumble recoveries

[SIZE=10pt]·         [/SIZE]0 defensive TDs

Also not listed in this article is opposing QB’s completed 21 of 26 passes thrown at Peppers this year. He may be a playmaker but he’s not a defensive playmaker.

 
I would be happy to see Cook go to the Packers.  they have plenty of need, a dynamic R.B among them.  If cook is Shady McCoy as someone suggested he would be well worth the pick.  If he were only Darren Sproles I would still say he is worth the pick.

 
Houston O'line has played much better since LT Duane Brown came back. PFF has them ranked in the top half of the league overall. Still O'line depth/upgrades is a definite need so I wouldn't rule out any particular position. I think you are likely to see Houston go BPA at one of their need positions (O'line, D'Line, Safety) like their last few drafts.

 
Andy Dufresne said:
Some interesting takes on Peppers. Maybe his good college game doesn't translate.
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What has he done on defense that is so impressive though?  I think people are too caught up in his overall athleticism and not actually thinking about how his game translates to the NFL.  I don't know too many Bears fans that would be excited to have him on the team.  He doesn't really fit well, at least not for a top 5 pick.  I'd love to have him in the late second or early third round.  He reminds of a more overall talented Devin Hester.  Offers more to special teams and offense than he does on defense.

 
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I think stats like interceptions and sacks are a bit overrated. They're not always indicative of a guy's disruptiveness.

I haven't watched a lot of Michigan football so I can't give an opinion either way, but sometimes a guy's stats aren't great because of what he's asked to do in the scheme or the level of his teammate's play.

Unique athletes need smart coaches. If he has a coach that fits him to the system it may not go well but if you make the system play to his strengths it's a different story completely.

 
Andy Dufresne said:
I think stats like interceptions and sacks are a bit overrated. They're not always indicative of a guy's disruptiveness.

I haven't watched a lot of Michigan football so I can't give an opinion either way, but sometimes a guy's stats aren't great because of what he's asked to do in the scheme or the level of his teammate's play.

Unique athletes need smart coaches. If he has a coach that fits him to the system it may not go well but if you make the system play to his strengths it's a different story completely.
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I agree that sacks and INTs do not make a player great.  I haven't really seen much from Peppers on defense that has shown me he's worth that high of a pick though.  I don't think anyone will doubt his overall ability but the doubt lies in him being worth that high of a pick.  No one knows what position he'll be in the NFL, he's a "tweener."

 
I think Peppers goes top 10. These hybrid positions are coming into vogue. He'll be a Su'a Cravens type safety/LB combo. 

 
Moonshine said:
But, to be fair, when the Raiders pick rolls around, if you select anyone except a replacement for Janikowski I'm going to consider your judgement questionable at best. Joey Julius out of Penn State feels like the obvious pick  :D
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Reggie is doing the draft work now.  Al Davis is gone.   :P

 
Ditkaless Wonders said:
I would be happy to see Cook go to the Packers.  they have plenty of need, a dynamic R.B among them.  If cook is Shady McCoy as someone suggested he would be well worth the pick.  If he were only Darren Sproles I would still say he is worth the pick.
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I don't know that Shady is a good comp in physical style.  Effectiveness, maybe.  I think Cook looks much stronger than McCoy did coming out of college.  More like a faster Ray Rice or less freakish Adrian Peterson.  Clinton Portis or Fred Taylor?

 
Looks like I have another stab at this done for two rounds. Should I do it now or wait until next weeK? Assuming I should do it at all...

 
Just a forewarning, I hate this year's QB's for mock draft purposes. So, I cheated. I assume there will be 1-3 guys taken in the first round but didn't include any for this mock. Assume Kizer and Trubisky go in the 1st, but who knows where?

In my fantasy land, here's how this year's musical chairs of QBs turn out:

Kirk Cousins - San Francisco. Shanahan can't help himself and gives up the two 1sts for his former protege.

Tony Romo - Washington. He's cut by the Cowboys (people aren't going to trade for him) and he returns to haunt them.

Jimmy Garappolo - Cleveland. No, he's not worth it. Cleveland does it anyway.

Tyrod Taylor - Chicago. Buffalo foolishly lets him go and John Fox isn't going to play a rookie QB.

Jay Cutler - Buffalo. Because they take a QB in round 1 who's not ready to play.

Mike Glennon - Houston. Because he's cheap and good enough to outplay Osweiler.

Colin Kaepernick - New York Jets. Because how funny would THIS be?

 
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I have to transcribe this from my work computer because "The Bank" doesn't like emailing to external sources. So it'll take a bit.

1. Cleveland - Myles Garrett DE Texas A&M

This is really the only answer (other than a trade - in which case Garrett still goes #1)

2. San Francisco/Washington - Reuben Foster LB Alabama

Whichever team picks here, Foster would be a building block for a decade for their defense. Shades of Patrick Willis/Redskins need help up the middle.

3. Chicago - Jonathan Allen DL Alabama

Their defense should have been better this past year. Allen would assure it for next.

4. Jacksonville - Jamal Adams S LSU

Jags are on the verge of having a great defense. Teamed with Ramsey, this would be lethal.

5. Tennessee (fom LAR) - Mike Williams WR Clemson

It's no secret the Titans need better targets for Mariota. 

6. NY Jets - Leonard Fournette RB LSU

After seeing what Elliott did for Dallas, this would be awfully tempting for the Jets.

7. LA Chargers - Malik Hooker S Ohio State

They look kind of smart for letting Weddle go (his talent has slipped) but they DO need to replace what he was.

8. Carolina - Solomon Thomas DE Stanford

Thomas is this year's fast riser winner. Panthers always seem to churn through good DE's.

9. Cincinnati - Derek Barnett DE Tennessee

Helping their surprisingly wobbly defense would do wonders to make this a more balanced team.

10. Buffalo - Tim Williams DE Alabama

Off field questions be darned (they were dismissed anyway), this would be an aggressive player for McDermott's scheme.

11. New Orleans - Takkarist McKinley DE UCLA

12. Cleveland/New England - Marshon Lattimore CB Ohio St

13. Arizona - Quincy Wilson CB Florida

14. Indianapolis - Jabrill Peppers

15. Philadelphia (from MIN) - Corey Davis WR Western Michigan 

16. Baltimore - Taco Charlton DE Michigan

17. Washington - Malik McDowell DL Michigan St

18. Tennessee - Sidney Jones CB Washington

19. Tampa Bay - John Ross WR Washington

20. Denver - Cam Robinson T Alabama

21. Detroit - Carl Lawson DE Auburn

22. Miami - Zach Cunningham LB Vanderbilt

23. NY Giants - OJ Howard TE Alabama

24. Oakland - Jarrad Davis LB Florida

25. Houston - David Njoku TE Miami

26. Seattle - Gareon Conley CB Ohio St

27. Kansas City - TJ Watt DE/OLB Wisconsin

28. Dallas - Budda Baker S Washington

29. Green Bay - Dalvin Cook RB FSU

30. Pittsburgh - Gerald Everett TE South Alabama

31. Atlanta - Adoree' Jackson CB USC

32. New England - Teez Tabor CB Florida

 
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Round 2 - Assuming that Kizer and Trubisky went SOMEWHERE in the 1st, they're off the board here. Let's cheat some more and assume that teams DIDN'T get their QB guy in FA/Trade...what then?

33. Cle - Patrick Mahomes QB Texas Tech

34. SF - Deshaun Watson QB Clemson

35. Jax - Garett Bolles T Utah

36. Chi - Davis Webb QB Cal

37. LAR - Tre'Davious White CB LSU

38. LAC - Ryan Ramczyk T Wisconsin

39. NYJ - Desmond King CB Iowa

40. Car - Christian McCaffrey RB Stanford

41. Cin - Raekwon McMillan LB Ohio St

42. NO - Justin Evans S Texas A&M

43. Phi - Jourdan Lewis CB Michigan

44. Buf - Marlon Humphrey - CB Alabama

45. AZ - Forrest Lamp G Western Kentucky

46. Ind - Alvin Kamara RB Tennesse

47. Balt - JuJu Smith Schuster WR USC

48. Min - Antonio Garcia T Troy

49. Wash - Dan Feeney G Indiana

50. TB - Ryan Anderson DE Alabama

51. Den - Ethan Ppocic C LSU

52. Cle (from Ten) - Curtis Samuel RB Ohio St

53. Det - Haason Reddick LB Temple

54. Mia - Charles Harris DE Missouri

55. NYG - DeMarcus Walker DE FSU

56. Oak - Cordrea Tankersley CB Clemson

57. Hou - Elijah Lee LB Kansas St

58. Sea - Dion Dawkins T Temple

59. KC - Anthony Walker Jr. LB Northwestern

60. Dal - Dawuane Smoot DE Illinois

61. GB - Caleb Brantley DL Florida

62. Pitt - Isaiah Ford WR Virginia Tech

63. Atl - Chris Wormley DL Michigan

64. NE - Evan Engram TE Ole Miss

 
The Antonio Garcia cat...yes he plays at Troy but Garcia has not allowed a sack in nearly 900 offensive snaps.

That's impressive.

 
The Bears may consider taking Webb but not that early.  Webb is a 3rd to 4th round pick.  I see Trubisky, Watson and Kizer all going in the first round.  Mahomes will most likely go in the early second.

 
Hawkeye21 said:
The Bears may consider taking Webb but not that early.  Webb is a 3rd to 4th round pick.  I see Trubisky, Watson and Kizer all going in the first round.  Mahomes will most likely go in the early second.
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You're probably right. Later 2nd with someone trading up to get him is a decent scenario. I really just wanted to highlight that, from what I've read, he appears to be a fast riser.

 
Romo will not go to Washington.

If Dallas can't trade him like you say, then they keep him. He only cost $5m extra to keep the best back up in the league. Why cut him? If it's because people say that Jerry's a nice guy and he would do that for Romo, I promise you that JJ will also say "Hey Tony, I'm gonna let you walk as a thank you for your service so you can sign with somebody, even though that's a bad business decision for me....But if I do, it is damn sure not going to be the Washington Redskins."

 
wOw - you certainly went away from QBS in your 2.0. Don't think GMs can help themselves, so bet 1.0 is closer. Also dont think GMs can hold off on OLs but a lot of mocks top 20s have been tackle-free.

 
G-King said:
Romo will not go to Washington.

If Dallas can't trade him like you say, then they keep him. He only cost $5m extra to keep the best back up in the league. Why cut him? If it's because people say that Jerry's a nice guy and he would do that for Romo, I promise you that JJ will also say "Hey Tony, I'm gonna let you walk as a thank you for your service so you can sign with somebody, even though that's a bad business decision for me....But if I do, it is damn sure not going to be the Washington Redskins."
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Why would Romo go to Washington if they can just franchise tag Cousins for practically the same money? I believe Romo counts 24 mil against the cap and that's what the franchise tag would be for Cousins. 

Romo may go to Denver if the asking price is low enough. I still see Romo going to Chicago but I know Romo wants to go somewhere he can immediately compete for a super bowl, so it's likely Chicago is out. Probably music to the ears of Bears fans. 

I agree with the above. If they can't trade Romo he stays. 

 

 
wikkidpissah said:
wOw - you certainly went away from QBS in your 2.0. Don't think GMs can help themselves, so bet 1.0 is closer. Also dont think GMs can hold off on OLs but a lot of mocks top 20s have been tackle-free.
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Yeah I don't think it's possible at all that no QB is taken round 1. Especially with 2-3 really talented ones that should go in the top10. If they slip then someone will undoubtedly trade up. Crazy things have happened though!! 

 
G-King said:
Romo will not go to Washington.

If Dallas can't trade him like you say, then they keep him. He only cost $5m extra to keep the best back up in the league. Why cut him? If it's because people say that Jerry's a nice guy and he would do that for Romo, I promise you that JJ will also say "Hey Tony, I'm gonna let you walk as a thank you for your service so you can sign with somebody, even though that's a bad business decision for me....But if I do, it is damn sure not going to be the Washington Redskins."
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I don't see any teams willing to make a trade offer to the Cowboys for Romo.  I also don't see them keeping Romo for how much it's costing them.  you don't pay a back up that much money.  I think it's most likely he gets cut and goes to another team.  Should go to Denver or Houston but apparently the Bears are the odds favorite to sign him.

 
Obviously, a lot rides on how things play out with Martavis Bryant (suspension), Sammie Coates (fingers), and Ladarius Green (concussions) over the offseason, but I'd be really surprised if the Steelers took pass catchers with their first two picks and ignored the defense.

 
Romo would cost $24m to the Cowboys if he stays. But his contract to the new team won't be anywhere near that.

What should the Cowboys do?

Anyway...you guys are missing then point. I only made up that scenario so we WOULDN'T have to talk about the QBs. But the possibility of Cousins to SF is not even a stretch of the imagination.

If you prefer Romo in Houston, knock yourself out.

 
Hawkeye21 said:
I don't see any teams willing to make a trade offer to the Cowboys for Romo.  I also don't see them keeping Romo for how much it's costing them.  you don't pay a back up that much money.  I think it's most likely he gets cut and goes to another team.  Should go to Denver or Houston but apparently the Bears are the odds favorite to sign him.
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It doesn't cost that much to keep him, that's why.

 
Dr. Brew said:
Yeah I don't think it's possible at all that no QB is taken round 1. Especially with 2-3 really talented ones that should go in the top10. If they slip then someone will undoubtedly trade up. Crazy things have happened though!! 
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See...I didn't say that. I specifically said that 1-3 WOULD go in the 1st but not where. I just removed the QB discussion from the mock draft entirely because a) it causes less discussion of the other, just as interesting topics and b) these QBs are more of a wild card than any in recent memory.

Please...GET OFF THE QBs.! :angry:

 
Andy Dufresne said:
See...I didn't say that. I specifically said that 1-3 WOULD go in the 1st but not where. I just removed the QB discussion from the mock draft entirely because a) it causes less discussion of the other, just as interesting topics and b) these QBs are more of a wild card than any in recent memory.

Please...GET OFF THE QBs.! :angry:
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I didn't see that. I just looked at your most recent updated 1st round just a few posts above. Saw no QBs were in the first. I even read it twice to see if there was a disclaimer statement that mentioned the QBs generating too much discussion or whatever the issue was. 

Removing the QBs though really makes it tough to even discuss the other players in your 2.0 mock. Because where the QBs go really dictate the rest of the draft. If the best QB falls to Chicago do you really think they take a DL? And if they take a QB then that DL goes to someone else round 1. I guess I don't really see the point of doing a round 1 mock if you're going to completely take out the QBs. 

Instead maybe you could list 2-3 players each team might consider taking and that would open discussion up for that. Not trying to be difficult or rude about this, just kind of confused I guess... I'll just play along!!! 

 
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Andy Dufresne said:
See...I didn't say that. I specifically said that 1-3 WOULD go in the 1st but not where. I just removed the QB discussion from the mock draft entirely because a) it causes less discussion of the other, just as interesting topics and b) these QBs are more of a wild card than any in recent memory.

Please...GET OFF THE QBs.! :angry:
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Epic fail ;)

Seems high for foster though I do like the guy, top 10 for sure, 2 just seems high here.  

Love the Titans picks, though I think I'd prefer Marlon Humphrey at 18.

 
Dr. Brew said:
I didn't see that. I just looked at your most recent updated 1st round just a few posts above. Saw no QBs were in the first. I even read it twice to see if there was a disclaimer statement that mentioned the QBs generating too much discussion or whatever the issue was. 

Removing the QBs though really makes it tough to even discuss the other players in your 2.0 mock. Because where the QBs go really dictate the rest of the draft. If the best QB falls to Chicago do you really think they take a DL? And if they take a QB then that DL goes to someone else round 1. I guess I don't really see the point of doing a round 1 mock if you're going to completely take out the QBs. 

Instead maybe you could list 2-3 players each team might consider taking and that would open discussion up for that. Not trying to be difficult or rude about this, just kind of confused I guess... 
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No it doesn't because each team that needs a QB could easily not take or not get one.

For example, of course Chicago could take Allen over Trubisky/Kiser/Watson. In which case that QB is available for, say, Buffalo. But if they did take him the. Buffalo takes someone else.

It has the same effect as having 2 players for each of the teams that need a QB and leaves the discussion open for all the other team/player combos.

Anyway, accuracy isn't important or even fun. It's still one player per team so that's easy enough to discuss. And further mocks are fun to discuss relative positioning of each player in relation to his peers.

 
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