Anouncing a proposed trade to the league? (1 Viewer)

[Hank Mardukas]

I'm in a 12 team PPR league and my team is really stacked. I'm 6-1 with Rivers, Rice, Fred Jackson, Mathews, Maclin, Nicks, Jennings, Hernandez, and some good depth. (combination of draft and a couple trades). I offered a team (3-4) Nicks and Battle for Brady. He has Cam Newton and trades are somewhat rare in this league. He's already offered Brady to several people and gotten no response. He doesn't think he's getting full value out of Brady with my offer, but Brady would otherwise rot on his bench. So he posted a message on the league board saying that this is the last chance to get Brady, that he has a good offer on the table and will accept it if he doesn't get a better offer. He also posted that the team offering him for Brady is already dominant and would become virtually unbeatable with Brady. Immediately after this he received two trade offers - neither of which is as good as mine. He's now considering taking one of those offers. FYI, trades can only be vetoed by the commish.

This seems shady to me. Deciding whether or not to help an already stacked team should be a consideration for you and you alone. I'm curious what people's opinion on this type of thing is.

 

[Captain Hook]

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[JoeSteeler]

So he posted a message on the league board saying that this is the last chance to get Brady, that he has a good offer on the table and will accept it if he doesn't get a better offer.

smart move IMO

 

[shnikies]

One way to avoid this type of situation is to refuse to negotiate outside of the website. So, if he wants to offer you a trade he should send it through the site. Though it's not "right" what he's doing, it's not illegal. If he posted the exact trade that would be a different story.

 

[SwampDawg]

Nothing wrong with trying to drive up the price, Yankees and Red Sox do it to each other all the time. I would personally take the best deal regardless of records and worry about your team in the playoffs but if he can make a deal close to it with a 1-6 team and helps prevent you who he might face later from getting stronger I can see that side.

 

[kardplayer]

Here's my take on "pre-announcing" trades.

I think its smart to go out and say "I'm giving up Brady and getting a Top 10 WR and a 11-20 RB, who wants to beat it". Even if I think I'm getting fair value, if I think someone will give me more, I'm broadcasting it.

Smarter (and more time consuming) would be to do it on a team by team basis, with the actual players you want back to beat the offer.

As an owner, why you would take less to avoid stacking a team is beyond me.

 

[habsfan]

For anyone suggesting this is shady or wrong, I'm curious how you would propose to prevent it.

 

[FantasyTrader]

He's doing the smart thing. Creating a sense of urgency for the rest of the league and creating a seller's market for Brady. Truth be told, I think he's made up his mind that there's no way in he** he's trading you Brady anyway. The key is, everything he's doing he's doing to help HIS team. No shady.

And this doesn't belong in the AC. It's a strategy post.

 

[spodog]

I've seen this happen before. It happens in the NFL as well, just not on a mesasage board. Part of the game.

The guy in your situtation never likes it, but not much you can do about it.

 

[RUSF18]

I would consider everything beyond "I have an offer for Brady that I'm ready to accept, come back with any other offers" to be poor form, but obviously not illegal or anything. For all anyone else knows, he could be BSing about having an offer to make someone else dominant in order to solicit more offers.

Just don't trade with him again if it bothers you.

 

[sspunisher]

Haha it's smart. If you don't want to give up more, I'd tell him to notify you before he trades Brady away to see what deal he has in place. He''ll agree to see if you can beat it because his goal is to keep driving Brady's price up.

If you decide you don't want to beat whatever deal he tells you he has in place, announce to everyone what your previous deal was and how you are now officially withdrawing it. If he can drive the price up on you, no reason why you can't try to drive the price back down.

 

[Birdie048]

He is just trying to get more value for his player. He could be pushing you to up your offer. It might be within the rules but it does create a bad taste for the owner being exploited.

So, up your offer or make the same offer to the new Brady owner. Just because he trades him to somebody else does not mean you can not still get him. Be creative! He did in his exploitation!

 

[rizzler]

Would Brady really "rot" on his bench?

In my league Brady has a better ppg score than Newton (and has finished his bye week)

I guess this is neither here nor there, but Brady would be starting 10 times out of 10 for me.

 

[moondog]

I'm in a 12 team PPR league and my team is really stacked. I'm 6-1 with Rivers, Rice, Fred Jackson, Mathews, Maclin, Nicks, Jennings, Hernandez, and some good depth. (combination of draft and a couple trades). I offered a team (3-4) Nicks and Battle for Brady. He has Cam Newton and trades are somewhat rare in this league. He's already offered Brady to several people and gotten no response. He doesn't think he's getting full value out of Brady with my offer, but Brady would otherwise rot on his bench. So he posted a message on the league board saying that this is the last chance to get Brady, that he has a good offer on the table and will accept it if he doesn't get a better offer. He also posted that the team offering him for Brady is already dominant and would become virtually unbeatable with Brady. Immediately after this he received two trade offers - neither of which is as good as mine. He's now considering taking one of those offers. FYI, trades can only be vetoed by the commish. This seems shady to me. Deciding whether or not to help an already stacked team should be a consideration for you and you alone. I'm curious what people's opinion on this type of thing is.

So what are the two other trades offers you say are not as good as your offer ?

 

[Hank Mardukas]

Would Brady really "rot" on his bench?In my league Brady has a better ppg score than Newton (and has finished his bye week)I guess this is neither here nor there, but Brady would be starting 10 times out of 10 for me.

He's basically decided that he's going to roll with Newton. He doesn't want to play matchups because he hates having to stress about it. I would take Newwton, but Brady's playoff schedule is superior.

 

[rizzler]

He's basically decided that he's going to roll with Newton. He doesn't want to play matchups because he hates having to stress about it. I would take Newwton, but Brady's playoff schedule is superior.

Brady is matchup proof. Proven. A stud. Hall of Famer, still in his prime.Yes you take brady.Nicks and Battle, if you get away with that, thumbs up dude.

 

[Hank Mardukas]

I'm in a 12 team PPR league and my team is really stacked. I'm 6-1 with Rivers, Rice, Fred Jackson, Mathews, Maclin, Nicks, Jennings, Hernandez, and some good depth. (combination of draft and a couple trades). I offered a team (3-4) Nicks and Battle for Brady. He has Cam Newton and trades are somewhat rare in this league. He's already offered Brady to several people and gotten no response. He doesn't think he's getting full value out of Brady with my offer, but Brady would otherwise rot on his bench. So he posted a message on the league board saying that this is the last chance to get Brady, that he has a good offer on the table and will accept it if he doesn't get a better offer. He also posted that the team offering him for Brady is already dominant and would become virtually unbeatable with Brady. Immediately after this he received two trade offers - neither of which is as good as mine. He's now considering taking one of those offers. FYI, trades can only be vetoed by the commish. This seems shady to me. Deciding whether or not to help an already stacked team should be a consideration for you and you alone. I'm curious what people's opinion on this type of thing is.

So what are the two other trades offers you say are not as good as your offer ?

One is Beanie Wells and Jordy Nelson and the other was something not even worthy of consideration. Can't remember what it was.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

IMPORTANT NOTE ABOUT THE SHARK POOL

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This is a legitimate topic on the ethics of announcing pending trades in order to solicit better offers.

It's a fair strategy, even if it burns you. Plus, deciding you'd rather not strengthen a team you are in competition and will eventually have to beat if you want to win is fair game too. I personally think it's short sighted, as he'd rather strengthen the big dog so that he can continue thumping all the 'middle of the pack' teams you are really in competition with for that final playoff spot. But unless there is a league rule against this, I see nothing wrong with it. You also could up your offer if you feel that he might go another direction.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

Haha it's smart. If you don't want to give up more, I'd tell him to notify you before he trades Brady away to see what deal he has in place. He''ll agree to see if you can beat it because his goal is to keep driving Brady's price up. If you decide you don't want to beat whatever deal he tells you he has in place, announce to everyone what your previous deal was and how you are now officially withdrawing it. If he can drive the price up on you, no reason why you can't try to drive the price back down.

nice... though it sounds like the offers are pretty weak to begin with...

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

He's basically decided that he's going to roll with Newton. He doesn't want to play matchups because he hates having to stress about it. I would take Newwton, but Brady's playoff schedule is superior.

Brady is matchup proof. Proven. A stud. Hall of Famer, still in his prime.Yes you take brady.Nicks and Battle, if you get away with that, thumbs up dude.

fwiw I think it seems like a pretty decent offer (unless it's a qb 6 pt td league in which case it would be a nice little coup)

 

[Hank Mardukas]

I don't have an issue with his declaring that he wants a better offer. I have a problem with his telling the league that it will make my team so much better and essentially inviting them to try to block the trade.

 

[Hank Mardukas]

I'm in a 12 team PPR league and my team is really stacked. I'm 6-1 with Rivers, Rice, Fred Jackson, Mathews, Maclin, Nicks, Jennings, Hernandez, and some good depth. (combination of draft and a couple trades). I offered a team (3-4) Nicks and Battle for Brady. He has Cam Newton and trades are somewhat rare in this league. He's already offered Brady to several people and gotten no response. He doesn't think he's getting full value out of Brady with my offer, but Brady would otherwise rot on his bench. So he posted a message on the league board saying that this is the last chance to get Brady, that he has a good offer on the table and will accept it if he doesn't get a better offer. He also posted that the team offering him for Brady is already dominant and would become virtually unbeatable with Brady. Immediately after this he received two trade offers - neither of which is as good as mine. He's now considering taking one of those offers. FYI, trades can only be vetoed by the commish. This seems shady to me. Deciding whether or not to help an already stacked team should be a consideration for you and you alone. I'm curious what people's opinion on this type of thing is.

So what are the two other trades offers you say are not as good as your offer ?

One is Beanie Wells and Jordy Nelson and the other was something not even worthy of consideration. Can't remember what it was.

The other offer was Mendenhall and Stevie Johnson. not quite as bad as I had thought.

 

[Instinctive]

It is and it is not ok:

Acceptable, and something I would say he was dumb if he didn't do: I have a strong offer for Brady, talk to me if you want to beat it - top 10 WR, top 20 RB

The crap about making another team stronger is something I kind of assume - all trades should make both teams stronger, no ####.

But the idea of taking a lesser offer to keep a team from getting stacked...that seems incredibly moronic to me. You take what you can to make YOUR team better, and don't worry about the other teams.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I'm in a 12 team PPR league and my team is really stacked. I'm 6-1 with Rivers, Rice, Fred Jackson, Mathews, Maclin, Nicks, Jennings, Hernandez, and some good depth. (combination of draft and a couple trades). I offered a team (3-4) Nicks and Battle for Brady. He has Cam Newton and trades are somewhat rare in this league. He's already offered Brady to several people and gotten no response. He doesn't think he's getting full value out of Brady with my offer, but Brady would otherwise rot on his bench. So he posted a message on the league board saying that this is the last chance to get Brady, that he has a good offer on the table and will accept it if he doesn't get a better offer. He also posted that the team offering him for Brady is already dominant and would become virtually unbeatable with Brady. Immediately after this he received two trade offers - neither of which is as good as mine. He's now considering taking one of those offers. FYI, trades can only be vetoed by the commish.

This seems shady to me. Deciding whether or not to help an already stacked team should be a consideration for you and you alone. I'm curious what people's opinion on this type of thing is.

Not really.What does a veto have anything to do with it?

 

[Flying Elvis]

He did the right thing the wrong way.

He absolutely should try to get the best value and play up the "last chance to get Brady" angle. It's also fine that he's making it known that his current best offer is from an already dominant team.

Of course, using the public board to do so displays a level of tact that would make the Incredible Hulk seem sophisticated. Individual emails to the teams that may need Brady would be the way to go.

I have no issue with taking slightly lessser value if it means keeping the last piece of the puzzle out of the hands of a serious contender.

 

[GregR]

There is nothing unethical about it, but it shows a lack of understanding of how to interact effectively with people. You're upset about how he went about it, and I think a lot of people would be in your shoes.

Nothing wrong with trying to get the best deal you can. But he could have accomplished the same thing without getting you upset. At the very least he could have sent out individual mails to the other owners and you'd probably never have known. He could have also limited the mails to teams who actually are in a position they might trade for Brady.

Someone mentioned using the website for negotiations in the future. I don't think it would be a bad thing the next time this guy approaches you for a trade to ask him to submit whatever he wants to talk about on the website, so an offer he makes you is binding if you accept it. That's the price he pays for what he did.

However I recommend to people that they not make an offer themselves on the website unless an agreement has been reached. There are just too many other things that can happen that can screw you once an offer is out there. Most frequent one is if one of his players gets injured and so he accepts your offer now it is further in his favor.

 

[kardplayer]

I think it's ok to say to the league - "You don't really want the best team to get even better do you? Outbid him". That's negotiating 101 - positioning.

It's not ok to take less than the top bid.

 

[doeseatplace]

Would Brady really "rot" on his bench?In my league Brady has a better ppg score than Newton (and has finished his bye week)I guess this is neither here nor there, but Brady would be starting 10 times out of 10 for me.

Heh. This is the real story of this thread.

 

[dancer]

One league I am in, this sort of thing is actually required. For years we've had a "trade approval" process that has to make sure trades are "fair". Put aside all the arguments for or against that concept in general for now...but it sure started a lot of "discussions" about fair. This year we added a new rule - every trade is posted and is effective 2 days after announced, but in those 2 days anyone can make a better offer to either team. Then the teams involved in the trade can choose to accept the new trade or continue with the original (if accept new, then that gets 2 days, etc.).

There was a lot of doubt as to whether this would work. Some said this would be horrible, as some would do all the work researching and negotiating to get a trade done, then someone else would swoop in and get the benefit. But the truth is, it worked (surprisingly) absolutely perfectly. Every trade made went through as proposed, not a single one was outbid, and every trade was (by default) viewed by the league as being very fair. For the first time ever.

 

[MIMN]

I have no issue with him announcing that this is the last chance to get Brady. I often play in leagues with less serious owners and I regularly recommend to them that if they are trading a top 5-10 player in their position that they do this. It gives them the chance to get the best value.

The most shady thing I saw was him telling you the details of the other trades.

 

[Patroclus]

I would immediately pull the offer and post it to the board. Brady's value falls. Reverse burn

 

[Mario Kart]

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[glumpy]

I'm in a 12 team PPR league and my team is really stacked. I'm 6-1 with Rivers, Rice, Fred Jackson, Mathews, Maclin, Nicks, Jennings, Hernandez, and some good depth. (combination of draft and a couple trades). I offered a team (3-4) Nicks and Battle for Brady. He has Cam Newton and trades are somewhat rare in this league. He's already offered Brady to several people and gotten no response. He doesn't think he's getting full value out of Brady with my offer, but Brady would otherwise rot on his bench. So he posted a message on the league board saying that this is the last chance to get Brady, that he has a good offer on the table and will accept it if he doesn't get a better offer. He also posted that the team offering him for Brady is already dominant and would become virtually unbeatable with Brady. Immediately after this he received two trade offers - neither of which is as good as mine. He's now considering taking one of those offers. FYI, trades can only be vetoed by the commish. This seems shady to me. Deciding whether or not to help an already stacked team should be a consideration for you and you alone. I'm curious what people's opinion on this type of thing is.

Glanced through the responses without really catching them all, and will give my initial rxn's... The offer you gave is lowball imo. OK but not equal. Awfully tough to make an 'equal' offer for Brady so no criticism intended there. His opening it up to the league could have been better done, to where it did not list you as the competition. Not a bad idea to get competition but not well done.What are his needs? If he's an also ran with both Newton and Brady then he ought to be real specific about addressing his shortfalls. And--that's what you should be offering.

 

[jesseasi]

I have never seen any other league duplicate the rules we have - but I think it is the best rule out there when it comes to trading.

In our league (Dynasty league - so lopsided trades are normal). We have no veto power over trades. No voting system. No commish that will step in. No 3rd party adviser that will approve trades (I saw some league paid someone to do that - crazy!)

There is no "#####ing and moaning" about unfair trades.

We have a "Put up or Shut Up" rule.

When a trade is announced to the league - we have a 24 hour grace period. If other teams feel the trade is lopsided or unfair - they can step in and make a trump offer to either owner. Trump offer only needs to include what would be deemed the "main" players or parts of a trade.

We started this rule in 2003 when during our rookie draft - the worst team in the league traded their best player - Culpepper for the 15th pick in the draft to select Carson Palmer. Our league went crazy at the time about how bad of a trade that was. The team that got Culpepper went on to win 2 championships in a row with Culpepper. Teams pointed to that trade so much that he finally said he did not want Culpeppper any more and traded him for Vick and went on to win another.

The owner that made that deal washed out of the league a few years later - but that one trade created our "Trump Rule".

We have lots of trades in our league - probably 100 trades a year if not more. I have never counted. 12 teams with all kinds of parts with 23 man rosters and future picks.

Our trump rule has come up many times - at least 2-3 times a year. It is so much fun when it happens. Stinks when you get trumped - but adds lots of excitement - especially when you just made a nice haul and you wait to see if anyone tries to trump you.

I see no problem announcing to the league what your offers are and if anyone else wants to step up. It is marketing for a player. It is trying to maximize your value. It is SMART.

Heck teams even bluff what their best offers are when negotiating. We do whatever we can to trade and get maximum value.

 

[T J]

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You telling people what to do agaain? Get over yourself.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

There is nothing unethical about it, but it shows a lack of understanding of how to interact effectively with people. You're upset about how he went about it, and I think a lot of people would be in your shoes.

Nothing wrong with trying to get the best deal you can. But he could have accomplished the same thing without getting you upset. At the very least he could have sent out individual mails to the other owners and you'd probably never have known. He could have also limited the mails to teams who actually are in a position they might trade for Brady.

This. He didn't do anything wrong - hell, this happens by e-mail all the time in most of my leagues. But he was a little heavy-handed in the way he did it. He probably wasn't trying to piss you off, but I understand you feeling ungood about his method. That being said, there's nothing "shady" about it that I can see.