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Attack on London bridge, reports people run down, stabbed and shots fired (1 Viewer)

Billy Bats said:
So I'm assuming they found the suspect that was on the run and killed him? Or Is there a fourth suspect? 

Eta: "Police say they believe all the attackers have been shot and killed but they are working to confirm it."

"Armed officers responded and shot three attackers dead within eight minutes of the first call."  :thumbup:  
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8 minutes. 

Seems like forever if you're a victim; nearly unbelievably quick as a first responder. Well done. 

 
- the bomb vests were fake, but they were stab-proof.

- the attackers were all dead within 10 minutes of the first emergency call (surprising if true).

- The staff of one pub barred the doors as the attackers tried to get in.

Per The Sun.

 
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flapgreen said:
It's scary, man. I guess if my job required me to go, I would. But that's it. 
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The local news just interviewed a couple at the airport who canceled their flight to London just before check-in due to the terrorist attack. It's an understandable reaction, but if you look at the data, it may not be logical. The chances of being killed in many popular cities in this country is still greater than in London, and there have been large increases in the murder rates from 2014 to 2016 in Las Vegas, Phoenix, San Antonio, Anchorage and of course Chicago, STL and Baltimore. But most people wouldn't think twice about going to Vegas. The battle against terrorism is not easy and it could affect tourism, as it did in Peru and Colombia, where there were tens of thousand of victims over a couple of decades. Hopefully, terrorism in the USA and Europe never approaches those levels. 

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
7 killed, 48 injured.

- Raids have been underway, 12 arrested, possibly 5 and 4 more in other raids.

- Shots fired at one of them, ambulance came.
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That's great and all, but maybe they should start doing these before innocent people get killed?? Just a thought. But that will probably offend more people than they kill. And we can't have that, amirite?

 
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Billy Bats said:
That's great and all, but maybe they should start doing these before innocent people get killed?? Just a thought. But that will probably offend more people than they kill. And we can't have that, amirite?
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This has come up in France & Belgium - the reality is it's a really long list. If 3 men net 21 arrests in one morning, do the math for the total of names on their watch list.

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
This has come up in France & Belgium - the reality is it's a really long list. If 3 men net 21 arrests in one morning, do the math for the total of names on their watch list.
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So? Isn't that the problem that there's so damn many of them? If they start doing daily raids and start rounding up these scumbags, maybe they start leaving on their own. Lock these ####ers up, detain then deport. The list will get smaller on its own with the thought that they are being hunted down. :shrug:  

 
Billy Bats said:
So? Isn't that the problem that there's so damn many of them? If they start doing daily raids and start rounding up these scumbags, maybe they start leaving on their own. Lock these ####ers up, detain then deport. The list will get smaller on its own with the thought that they are being hunted down. :shrug:  
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Arrest them for what?  Recall that some of these attackers have been from England.

 
Billy Bats said:
So? Isn't that the problem that there's so damn many of them? If they start doing daily raids and start rounding up these scumbags, maybe they start leaving on their own. Lock these ####ers up, detain then deport. The list will get smaller on its own with the thought that they are being hunted down. :shrug:  
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I believe it is a matter of (the French/Belgian/English etc version of) Probable Cause, Habeas Corpus etc

 
Billy Bats said:
So? Isn't that the problem that there's so damn many of them? If they start doing daily raids and start rounding up these scumbags, maybe they start leaving on their own. Lock these ####ers up, detain then deport. The list will get smaller on its own with the thought that they are being hunted down. :shrug:  
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I'm just saying it's way past the "PC" stage, it's a logistical problem now, too few police for too many suspects.  

 
rascal said:
Arrest them for what?  Recall that some of these attackers have been from England.
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Well they're on a list for a reason. And they tend to find bomb making materials in most of the follow up raids. I think that's enough to arrest someone. Even if they don't make arrests, let these animals know they're being hunted. Time to start taking the attack to them. 

 
SoBeDad said:
The local news just interviewed a couple at the airport who canceled their flight to London just before check-in due to the terrorist attack. It's an understandable reaction, but if you look at the data, it may not be logical. The chances of being killed in many popular cities in this country is still greater than in London, and there have been large increases in the murder rates from 2014 to 2016 in Las Vegas, Phoenix, San Antonio, Anchorage and of course Chicago, STL and Baltimore. But most people wouldn't think twice about going to Vegas. The battle against terrorism is not easy and it could affect tourism, as it did in Peru and Colombia, where there were tens of thousand of victims over a couple of decades. Hopefully, terrorism in the USA and Europe never approaches those levels. 
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I'd say one difference between those cities and Europe is that a decent portion of the violence in US cities are not in touristy parts.  I imagine most deaths in Vegas aren't on the Strip. Could be wrong but the terrorists are particularly targeting tourist places. Not to mention, there is a psychological aspect to it. 

 
sporthenry said:
I'd say one difference between those cities and Europe is that a decent portion of the violence in US cities are not in touristy parts.  I imagine most deaths in Vegas aren't on the Strip. Could be wrong but the terrorists are particularly targeting tourist places. Not to mention, there is a psychological aspect to it. 
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These were my thoughts as well. Murder rates may be higher in said cities but not in typical high traffic areas. 

I was reading elsewhere and this was someone's argument, that you are more likely to be killed by a toddler than a terrorist. I don't think these type of arguments are completely applicable or truly accurate, just my opinion.

 
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Billy Bats said:
So? Isn't that the problem that there's so damn many of them? If they start doing daily raids and start rounding up these scumbags, maybe they start leaving on their own. Lock these ####ers up, detain then deport. The list will get smaller on its own with the thought that they are being hunted down. :shrug:  
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You can't just raid and detain and deport without having evidence and a reason to do so.  

Sounds so easy...but obviously isn't.

 
sho nuff said:
You can't just raid and detain and deport without having evidence and a reason to do so.  

Sounds so easy...but obviously isn't.
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I understand. Considering the regularity of attacks these days in the U.K. And the legitimate threat they pose on a daily basis, maybe it's time to amend some laws. 

 
Billy Bats said:
Too many suspects, I wonder how that happened? 
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It's 2017 but 1917 was the same. It's failure to distinguish political anarchy beliefs from religious beliefs. Salafist jihadism - Islam : Bolshevism - Socialism. People who seek to create a global caliphate through any violent means possible aren't typical Muslims, and it's a waste of time and counterproductive to make that mistake. I'm still not entirely sure how it's done without a surveillance state, at which point... you have a surveillance state, which isn't democracy, which you're trying to defend. Good luck with that, IC & policemen aren't exactly shrinking violets.

eta - Also consider a specific goal of the jihadists is to provoke a massive state response disproportionate to the threat which will (they hope) radicalize a much larger portion of the Muslim population. I'd say don't play into their hands. Still the choices all stink.

 
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Billy Bats said:
I understand. Considering the regularity of attacks these days in the U.K. And the legitimate threat they pose on a daily basis, maybe it's time to amend some laws. 
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Well...they can if they want.  I'm glad we have a constitution here that will make it hard for our leaders to do such things.

 
Zow said:
Okay. Sounds easy enough. Specifically, what should the statute/law say?
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I don't know man, you're the lawyer you tell me. That's what the people we elect supposedly get paid to do, isn't it? I know people will get mad at me for infringing on their rights and freedoms, don't want to open up this can of worms. I'm just an average joe that is sick and tired of accepting terrorist acts as living the daily life. :shrug:  I'll move on, back to the gambling thread. 

 
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Nigel Farage spitting fire on fox this morning saying internment is an option for suspects on the terror watch list 

 
The Prime Minister said: "While we have made significant progress (in tackling terrorism) in recent years, there is - to be frank - far too much tolerance of extremism in our country.

"So we need to become far more robust in identifying it and stamping it out across the public sector and across society.

"That will require some difficult, and often embarrassing conversations."

She said there were four important ways that things needed to change to tackle the terrorism threat.

1) Deflecting the "evil ideology" of Islamist extremism - "British values are better".

2) Shut down internet safe spaces - May accused internet firms of giving extremists "safe places" online and called for international action

3) The UK must say "enough is enough" and can no longer tolerate extremism. She says it's time for "difficult and embarrassing conversations".

4) Having a robust counter terrorism strategy - there will be a review of wehther police have the powers they need.
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"In order to protect our freedoms, we must do away with our freedoms" seems to be the standard tactic deployed by just about every world-wide conservative government. Because, somehow, blocking pornography in the UK will help eliminate terrorist safe spaces. 

 
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