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Beannie in 2010 (1 Viewer)

I own both Wells and Hightower, as long as Wells keeps fumbling the damn ball and Hightower keeps producing..................we have a freaking problem gentlemen. I keep hearing how Hightower will be fazed out and Wells will take over. Hasn't happened and it won't until Wells get his #### together!

:twocents:

Tex
Apparently you forgot to actually look at stats before posting this widely held assumption. Last season Wells had 4 fumbles (lost 2), while Hightower had 5 fumbles (6 if you count the playoffs)(lost 4) - and Wells had 33 more carries than Hightower. Also, Wells only had 1 fumble from week 8 on, while Hightower fumbled twice in the last half of the season (again, 3 times if you count his fumble in the post season). I'd say for the most part, we're past that.
I didn't watch many games but when I did, Wells fumbled only to get pulled, in comes Hightower and produce. The truth is Hightower is a thorn in the side of all the Wells owners including myself. Hightower also had more fantasy points with less carries yet with 61 receptions vs Wells lonesome 12 recptions and this is the major deference. No, I didn't forget to look at the stats again, I own them both and Hightower WILL BE an issue to those that own Wells until he get his #### together.ETA: Now that I've gone back and taken a second look: in PPR Hightower was ranked #11 and Wells #35 (standard scoring) and you think Hightower will be a non-factor........you're setting yourself up for a let down. In Non-PPR leagues it's a little closer but I'm not going to write off Timmy yet.
Did you check the splits? Let's take a look at how the season finished up...Week 14

Beanie 15car 79yds

Hightower 2car 3yds

Week 15

Beanie 17-110

Hightower 6-4

Week 16

Beanie 17-68

Hightower 10-32

Week 17

Beanie 6-19

Hightower 6-24

Playoffs Week 1

Beanie 14-91

Hightower 7-19

Playoffs Week 2

Beanie 5-7

Hightower 6-87 (70 yard run)

So Hightower pretty much had one good run through the last two months of the season, and other than that it was all Beanie.

With Warner and Boldin gone, they'll be passing much less now as well, and protecting a brittle Warner was pretty much the only reason Hightower saw the field towards the end of the year.
Have you ignored the reception disparity between the two? Does the fact that Wells is a nearly non-factor in the passing game and Hightower is not concern you? Well, it does me and until he can show that he can catch the ball I'm not getting too excited. I know I'm in the minority in my thinking but ignoring it will only cause disappointment. IIRC Wells lack of catching in college was one of the knocks on him................:twocents:

Tex
Hightower averaged 17 receiving yards per game over that span, and Beanie 11 receiving yards per game. Hardly comes close to making up for the huge difference in rushing they had over that span.Bottom line, as the season went on Beanie got more and more work, and Hightower got less and less. As is expected when a talented rookie comes in and a less talented incumbent begins to get pushed aside. Hightower is a better receiver, but little dump offs to the running backs are not what this team needs. The ironic part is that when Beanie did get passes thrown his way he did much better with them than Hightower. I don't think he's a particularly bad receiver, he just hasn't been asked to do it much.

 
Beannie has the upside of a tier 1 RB when you look at him in isolation as a player. But when you consider the QB situation and the considerable role played by Hightower, he definitely gets knocked down quite a few slots behind lesser individual players. Grant, Pierre Thomas and arguably Mathews are ahead of Beannie because of this concept.Talent + Opportunity + Motivation = Success. But remember that all three factors should be considered with signficant focus on other players (esp QB) and coaches on the team, rather than just the particular player in question.
Look at the top running backs the last few years. If they have one thing in common it's actually that they have NOT been on a team with an elite passing game. Adrian Peterson was a stud with Tavaris Jackson and Gus Frerotte at the helm. Chris Johnson was stud of the century with Kerry Collins and Vince Young. MJD....stud....with David Garrard. DeAngelo Williams....stud....with 6-pick Delhomme. Jerome Harrison was borderline record breaking in the games he started alongside the worst passing game of the last few years. Jamaal Charles, Frank Gore, Steven Jackson, Michael Turner, Matt Forte (in his good year), all part of passing games that weren't very good.
 
I own both Wells and Hightower, as long as Wells keeps fumbling the damn ball and Hightower keeps producing..................we have a freaking problem gentlemen. I keep hearing how Hightower will be fazed out and Wells will take over. Hasn't happened and it won't until Wells get his #### together!

:twocents:

Tex
Apparently you forgot to actually look at stats before posting this widely held assumption. Last season Wells had 4 fumbles (lost 2), while Hightower had 5 fumbles (6 if you count the playoffs)(lost 4) - and Wells had 33 more carries than Hightower. Also, Wells only had 1 fumble from week 8 on, while Hightower fumbled twice in the last half of the season (again, 3 times if you count his fumble in the post season). I'd say for the most part, we're past that.
I didn't watch many games but when I did, Wells fumbled only to get pulled, in comes Hightower and produce. The truth is Hightower is a thorn in the side of all the Wells owners including myself. Hightower also had more fantasy points with less carries yet with 61 receptions vs Wells lonesome 12 recptions and this is the major deference. No, I didn't forget to look at the stats again, I own them both and Hightower WILL BE an issue to those that own Wells until he get his #### together.ETA: Now that I've gone back and taken a second look: in PPR Hightower was ranked #11 and Wells #35 (standard scoring) and you think Hightower will be a non-factor........you're setting yourself up for a let down. In Non-PPR leagues it's a little closer but I'm not going to write off Timmy yet.
Did you check the splits? Let's take a look at how the season finished up...Week 14

Beanie 15car 79yds

Hightower 2car 3yds

Week 15

Beanie 17-110

Hightower 6-4

Week 16

Beanie 17-68

Hightower 10-32

Week 17

Beanie 6-19

Hightower 6-24

Playoffs Week 1

Beanie 14-91

Hightower 7-19

Playoffs Week 2

Beanie 5-7

Hightower 6-87 (70 yard run)

So Hightower pretty much had one good run through the last two months of the season, and other than that it was all Beanie.

With Warner and Boldin gone, they'll be passing much less now as well, and protecting a brittle Warner was pretty much the only reason Hightower saw the field towards the end of the year.
Have you ignored the reception disparity between the two? Does the fact that Wells is a nearly non-factor in the passing game and Hightower is not concern you? Well, it does me and until he can show that he can catch the ball I'm not getting too excited. I know I'm in the minority in my thinking but ignoring it will only cause disappointment. IIRC Wells lack of catching in college was one of the knocks on him................:twocents:

Tex
I don't see a problem in non PPR.

 
Beannie has the upside of a tier 1 RB when you look at him in isolation as a player. But when you consider the QB situation and the considerable role played by Hightower, he definitely gets knocked down quite a few slots behind lesser individual players. Grant, Pierre Thomas and arguably Mathews are ahead of Beannie because of this concept.Talent + Opportunity + Motivation = Success. But remember that all three factors should be considered with signficant focus on other players (esp QB) and coaches on the team, rather than just the particular player in question.
Look at the top running backs the last few years. If they have one thing in common it's actually that they have NOT been on a team with an elite passing game. Adrian Peterson was a stud with Tavaris Jackson and Gus Frerotte at the helm. Chris Johnson was stud of the century with Kerry Collins and Vince Young. MJD....stud....with David Garrard. DeAngelo Williams....stud....with 6-pick Delhomme. Jerome Harrison was borderline record breaking in the games he started alongside the worst passing game of the last few years. Jamaal Charles, Frank Gore, Steven Jackson, Michael Turner, Matt Forte (in his good year), all part of passing games that weren't very good.
Only the best of the best can thrive with garbage passing games. I'm not ready to put Beannie there just yet, but he does have that kind of upside. I'll give you that. But so does Mathews and with not just a small, but a very significant upgrade in the passing game if Leinart and Anderson are the bums we've seen in the past.Grant and Pierre OTOH don't have that kind of upside. Maybe Pierre but not Grant.
 
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I own both Wells and Hightower, as long as Wells keeps fumbling the damn ball and Hightower keeps producing..................we have a freaking problem gentlemen. I keep hearing how Hightower will be fazed out and Wells will take over. Hasn't happened and it won't until Wells get his #### together!:twocents:Tex
Apparently you forgot to actually look at stats before posting this widely held assumption. Last season Wells had 4 fumbles (lost 2), while Hightower had 5 fumbles (6 if you count the playoffs)(lost 4) - and Wells had 33 more carries than Hightower. Also, Wells only had 1 fumble from week 8 on, while Hightower fumbled twice in the last half of the season (again, 3 times if you count his fumble in the post season). I'd say for the most part, we're past that.
I didn't watch many games but when I did, Wells fumbled only to get pulled, in comes Hightower and produce. The truth is Hightower is a thorn in the side of all the Wells owners including myself. Hightower also had more fantasy points with less carries yet with 61 receptions vs Wells lonesome 12 recptions and this is the major deference. No, I didn't forget to look at the stats again, I own them both and Hightower WILL BE an issue to those that own Wells until he get his #### together.ETA: Now that I've gone back and taken a second look: in PPR Hightower was ranked #11 and Wells #35 (standard scoring) and you think Hightower will be a non-factor........you're setting yourself up for a let down. In Non-PPR leagues it's a little closer but I'm not going to write off Timmy yet.
If that is your position and you own them in a dynasty league, you should have no trouble selling high with Beanie and keeping Hightower.
Like you said yourself its a DYNASTY!
Exactly. I'd say you are in a great position to sell Beanie and keep Hightower. If you are not a believer, then sell him high.
 
Ryan Mathews is the better pick this year. Less competition for touches and a MUCH better QB situation. Best part is Mathews can probably be had a round or three later. :ph34r:
Let's see let me name the best 5 rb's in the game right now

P. Manning

Brees

Brady

Rivers

Big Ben

Romo

Eli

Rodgers

Cutler

Schaub

Can you name more than 2 of theswe teams with GREAT QB SITUATIONS that also have a stud at the rb position?

<I didn't put in Favre cause who knows if he's playing or not>
I'm not sure whether you are agreeing or disagreeing with me, but I like your list:Manning - Addai/Brown - Addai is washed up; Brown didn't hold up last year when given opportunities

Brees - Pierre Thomas - probably will go right about where Beanie does. I'd take Pierre, esp in 0.5 or full PPR.

Brady - cluster fruit RBBC.

Rivers - Mathews/Sproles - DS will be a situational role player and will get opps, but I think Mathews will get the lion share.

Big Ben - Mendenhall - going way higher than Beannie in most drafts, so not relevant here.

Romo - Felix/MBIII/Choice - another cluster fruit RBBC.

Eli - Bradshaw/Jacobs - Bradshaw could be serious value. I don't like Jacobs. But both have too many durability concerns IMO.

Rodgers - Ryan Grant is the man. He will go right around the same time but I'd pick him ahead of Beannie.

Cutler - Matt Forte will go much later and could be good value but who knows if this team can handle Mike Martz and vice versa.

Schaub - Foster/Slaton/Tate = another cluster fruit RBBC.

Beannie has the upside of a tier 1 RB when you look at him in isolation as a player. But when you consider the QB situation and the considerable role played by Hightower, he definitely gets knocked down quite a few slots behind lesser individual players. Grant, Pierre Thomas and arguably Mathews are ahead of Beannie because of this concept.

Talent + Opportunity + Motivation = Success. But remember that all three factors should be considered with signficant focus on other players (esp QB) and coaches on the team, rather than just the particular player in question.
lol..not sure why you liked it... It completely destroys your theory.. Mark Sanchez- Thomas Jones

Matt Cassel- Jamal Charles

Jeke Dellhome- Dwill/Jstew

Alex Smith- Gore

Bulger- S.Jackson

Gerrard- MJJ

And dont tell me he's not in thier league because he avg. as good and in some cases better ypc than the guys above...Oh yeah and he was a rookie.

 
Ryan Mathews is the better pick this year. Less competition for touches and a MUCH better QB situation. Best part is Mathews can probably be had a round or three later. :goodposting:
Let's see let me name the best 5 rb's in the game right now

P. Manning

Brees

Brady

Rivers

Big Ben

Romo

Eli

Rodgers

Cutler

Schaub

Can you name more than 2 of theswe teams with GREAT QB SITUATIONS that also have a stud at the rb position?

<I didn't put in Favre cause who knows if he's playing or not>
I'm not sure whether you are agreeing or disagreeing with me, but I like your list:Manning - Addai/Brown - Addai is washed up; Brown didn't hold up last year when given opportunities

Brees - Pierre Thomas - probably will go right about where Beanie does. I'd take Pierre, esp in 0.5 or full PPR.

Brady - cluster fruit RBBC.

Rivers - Mathews/Sproles - DS will be a situational role player and will get opps, but I think Mathews will get the lion share.

Big Ben - Mendenhall - going way higher than Beannie in most drafts, so not relevant here.

Romo - Felix/MBIII/Choice - another cluster fruit RBBC.

Eli - Bradshaw/Jacobs - Bradshaw could be serious value. I don't like Jacobs. But both have too many durability concerns IMO.

Rodgers - Ryan Grant is the man. He will go right around the same time but I'd pick him ahead of Beannie.

Cutler - Matt Forte will go much later and could be good value but who knows if this team can handle Mike Martz and vice versa.

Schaub - Foster/Slaton/Tate = another cluster fruit RBBC.

Beannie has the upside of a tier 1 RB when you look at him in isolation as a player. But when you consider the QB situation and the considerable role played by Hightower, he definitely gets knocked down quite a few slots behind lesser individual players. Grant, Pierre Thomas and arguably Mathews are ahead of Beannie because of this concept.

Talent + Opportunity + Motivation = Success. But remember that all three factors should be considered with signficant focus on other players (esp QB) and coaches on the team, rather than just the particular player in question.
lol..not sure why you liked it... It completely destroys your theory.. Mark Sanchez- Thomas Jones

Matt Cassel- Jamal Charles

Jeke Dellhome- Dwill/Jstew

Alex Smith- Gore

Bulger- S.Jackson

Gerrard- MJJ

And dont tell me he's not in thier league because he avg. as good and in some cases better ypc than the guys above...Oh yeah and he was a rookie.
I'm not saying Beanie's a bum or not worth rostering. I'm just saying that for where you need to pick him, there are other guys with similar talent (Mathews, maybe PThomas if you include receptions) with potentially MUCH better QB situations.
 
Ryan Mathews is the better pick this year. Less competition for touches and a MUCH better QB situation. Best part is Mathews can probably be had a round or three later. :hifive:
Let's see let me name the best 5 rb's in the game right now

P. Manning

Brees

Brady

Rivers

Big Ben

Romo

Eli

Rodgers

Cutler

Schaub

Can you name more than 2 of theswe teams with GREAT QB SITUATIONS that also have a stud at the rb position?

<I didn't put in Favre cause who knows if he's playing or not>
I'm not sure whether you are agreeing or disagreeing with me, but I like your list:Manning - Addai/Brown - Addai is washed up; Brown didn't hold up last year when given opportunities

Brees - Pierre Thomas - probably will go right about where Beanie does. I'd take Pierre, esp in 0.5 or full PPR.

Brady - cluster fruit RBBC.

Rivers - Mathews/Sproles - DS will be a situational role player and will get opps, but I think Mathews will get the lion share.

Big Ben - Mendenhall - going way higher than Beannie in most drafts, so not relevant here.

Romo - Felix/MBIII/Choice - another cluster fruit RBBC.

Eli - Bradshaw/Jacobs - Bradshaw could be serious value. I don't like Jacobs. But both have too many durability concerns IMO.

Rodgers - Ryan Grant is the man. He will go right around the same time but I'd pick him ahead of Beannie.

Cutler - Matt Forte will go much later and could be good value but who knows if this team can handle Mike Martz and vice versa.

Schaub - Foster/Slaton/Tate = another cluster fruit RBBC.

Beannie has the upside of a tier 1 RB when you look at him in isolation as a player. But when you consider the QB situation and the considerable role played by Hightower, he definitely gets knocked down quite a few slots behind lesser individual players. Grant, Pierre Thomas and arguably Mathews are ahead of Beannie because of this concept.

Talent + Opportunity + Motivation = Success. But remember that all three factors should be considered with signficant focus on other players (esp QB) and coaches on the team, rather than just the particular player in question.
lol..not sure why you liked it... It completely destroys your theory.. Mark Sanchez- Thomas Jones

Matt Cassel- Jamal Charles

Jeke Dellhome- Dwill/Jstew

Alex Smith- Gore

Bulger- S.Jackson

Gerrard- MJJ

And dont tell me he's not in thier league because he avg. as good and in some cases better ypc than the guys above...Oh yeah and he was a rookie.
I'm not saying Beanie's a bum or not worth rostering. I'm just saying that for where you need to pick him, there are other guys with similar talent (Mathews, maybe PThomas if you include receptions) with potentially MUCH better QB situations.
And what we are saying is it doesn't help a runningback at all to have a good qb at the helm. If anything it hurts them.Look at all 32 teams, can you find more than 3 rb's and qb's that are both in the top 10?

I feel alittle more confident this year in Beannie because Leinart is at the helm.

I know they will be running inside the 5 yards line

I know they will concentrate on Oline instead of 2 allstar wr's.

I know their gameplans will consists of running instead of matchups in the secondary

 
Blackjacks said:
And what we are saying is it doesn't help a runningback at all to have a good qb at the helm. If anything it hurts them.Look at all 32 teams, can you find more than 3 rb's and qb's that are both in the top 10?I feel alittle more confident this year in Beannie because Leinart is at the helm.I know they will be running inside the 5 yards lineI know they will concentrate on Oline instead of 2 allstar wr's.I know their gameplans will consists of running instead of matchups in the secondary
Gotcha. Well I disagree with you. I almost always upgrade RBs for having a good QB, all other things equal.
 
2009 highlights...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=581omQencPs

i think beanie inexorably will take on a bigger and bigger role... barring injury, there is too much of a talent discrepancy to not happen...

he is a rare combination of size, strength, balance, speed, quickness, athleticism, vision, instincts and elusiveness... he punches through the DL in a blink, can run around LBs and is a rampaging rhino/unstoppable freight train in the secondary... tough for one DB to bring him down in the open field...

ohio state didn't throw to RBs, but he is a superior athlete with good hand/eye coordination, and can catch the ball (if not be split out like faulk, westbrook, bush, spiller, best)... agree HC was probably being conservative in bringing him along slowly, while he learned pass protection (even more importantly than leinart, was protecting warner last year)...

i really like his temperment (tough, physical, determined), and his overall game... he has the physical traits and talent to be a bell cow, a rarity in the contemporary NFL... he can pound it inside and in short yardage/goal line situations, but has the explosiveness and speed to break long runs if a defender misses a tackle (which he did at ohio state, didn't break one last year, but i would be shocked if he doesn't bust a few long runs of 40+ yards in 2010, especially if he does get an increasing workload)...

imo, future top 10 potential, with upside...

 
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Wells should have a fine season. I am just always leary of Cardinals RB's.

I rather have Matthews and Spiller (Spiller in a dynasty this year) though. Matthews is in an ideal situation and Spiller is just a major major game breaking talent and has all the tools to be a PPR beast. Just my hunch. But Wells looked really good at times last year and is clearly the lead dog. Hightower is a nice 3rd down back and is a must handcuff.

In Redraft no question Wells will go ahead of those 2.

 
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Blackjacks said:
And what we are saying is it doesn't help a runningback at all to have a good qb at the helm. If anything it hurts them.Look at all 32 teams, can you find more than 3 rb's and qb's that are both in the top 10?I feel alittle more confident this year in Beannie because Leinart is at the helm.I know they will be running inside the 5 yards lineI know they will concentrate on Oline instead of 2 allstar wr's.I know their gameplans will consists of running instead of matchups in the secondary
Gotcha. Well I disagree with you. I almost always upgrade RBs for having a good QB, all other things equal.
I think you're on the right track, just looking at the wrong thing. Overall decent-good teams give the RB a big uptick in production - mainly because they are ahead in games and nursing leads in the 4th quarter. That said, in the NFL, many good teams are such because of their good QBs - but I contest that that relationship (good QB = good RB) is not causal. I would sooner take an RB on a team that has a good defense and a poor QB, as they will lean on the RB to control the clock, keep the scoring down, etc. (Guys like Jamal Lewis on the Ravens, Forte before Cutler, Priest and LJ for the Cheifs, etc. are all good examples too) My point is that an overall decent team is more indicative of RB success than strictly looking at the QB position.
 
LawFitz said:
FreeBaGeL said:
LawFitz said:
Beannie has the upside of a tier 1 RB when you look at him in isolation as a player. But when you consider the QB situation and the considerable role played by Hightower, he definitely gets knocked down quite a few slots behind lesser individual players. Grant, Pierre Thomas and arguably Mathews are ahead of Beannie because of this concept.

Talent + Opportunity + Motivation = Success. But remember that all three factors should be considered with signficant focus on other players (esp QB) and coaches on the team, rather than just the particular player in question.
Look at the top running backs the last few years. If they have one thing in common it's actually that they have NOT been on a team with an elite passing game. Adrian Peterson was a stud with Tavaris Jackson and Gus Frerotte at the helm. Chris Johnson was stud of the century with Kerry Collins and Vince Young. MJD....stud....with David Garrard. DeAngelo Williams....stud....with 6-pick Delhomme. Jerome Harrison was borderline record breaking in the games he started alongside the worst passing game of the last few years. Jamaal Charles, Frank Gore, Steven Jackson, Michael Turner, Matt Forte (in his good year), all part of passing games that weren't very good.
Only the best of the best can thrive with garbage passing games. I'm not ready to put Beannie there just yet, but he does have that kind of upside. I'll give you that. But so does Mathews and with not just a small, but a very significant upgrade in the passing game if Leinart and Anderson are the bums we've seen in the past.

Grant and Pierre OTOH don't have that kind of upside. Maybe Pierre but not Grant.
Although Warner is gone and the passing game should be down graded, to label it a garbage passing game is a mistake. This is not good fantasy analysis.

 
LawFitz said:
FreeBaGeL said:
LawFitz said:
Beannie has the upside of a tier 1 RB when you look at him in isolation as a player. But when you consider the QB situation and the considerable role played by Hightower, he definitely gets knocked down quite a few slots behind lesser individual players. Grant, Pierre Thomas and arguably Mathews are ahead of Beannie because of this concept.

Talent + Opportunity + Motivation = Success. But remember that all three factors should be considered with signficant focus on other players (esp QB) and coaches on the team, rather than just the particular player in question.
Look at the top running backs the last few years. If they have one thing in common it's actually that they have NOT been on a team with an elite passing game. Adrian Peterson was a stud with Tavaris Jackson and Gus Frerotte at the helm. Chris Johnson was stud of the century with Kerry Collins and Vince Young. MJD....stud....with David Garrard. DeAngelo Williams....stud....with 6-pick Delhomme. Jerome Harrison was borderline record breaking in the games he started alongside the worst passing game of the last few years. Jamaal Charles, Frank Gore, Steven Jackson, Michael Turner, Matt Forte (in his good year), all part of passing games that weren't very good.
Only the best of the best can thrive with garbage passing games. I'm not ready to put Beannie there just yet, but he does have that kind of upside. I'll give you that. But so does Mathews and with not just a small, but a very significant upgrade in the passing game if Leinart and Anderson are the bums we've seen in the past.

Grant and Pierre OTOH don't have that kind of upside. Maybe Pierre but not Grant.
Although Warner is gone and the passing game should be down graded, to label it a garbage passing game is a mistake. This is not good fantasy analysis.
Not to mention several of the guys listed there (Forte, Turner, Charles, Harrison) are nowhere near "the best".
 
Was Beanie not injured frequently in college? He won't be averaging 5.0 ypc on the Cardinals. He's going to need a lot of carries to get it done. Does this not concern anyone?

Also, in reference to the Vegas talk about the Cards being favored over the 49ers, Vegas' job isn't to be right. It is to get fools to bet evenly. So let's not bash the guy predicting the 49ers to win the division with Vegas being the strongest argument against him. That's a really weak argument.
Might wanna check how many games he missed before making this statement.

He avg 4.5ypc last year as a rookie... Adrian Peterson avg 4.4....

 
Was Beanie not injured frequently in college? He won't be averaging 5.0 ypc on the Cardinals. He's going to need a lot of carries to get it done. Does this not concern anyone?

Also, in reference to the Vegas talk about the Cards being favored over the 49ers, Vegas' job isn't to be right. It is to get fools to bet evenly. So let's not bash the guy predicting the 49ers to win the division with Vegas being the strongest argument against him. That's a really weak argument.
Might wanna check how many games he missed before making this statement.

He avg 4.5ypc last year as a rookie... Adrian Peterson avg 4.4....
what does this have to do with anything?
 
a PPR top ten? i'd say that's doubtful with Hightower stealing all 3rd down duty and catching 45+. I'd rate beanie as a 3rd round value off the top of my head.
No one said PPR. I agree, in PPR his value takes a hit and knocks him out of the 2nd round in redraft (and certainly drops him out of the top 10 in dynasty). The question in regards to Wells vs. this years rookies - I'd keep Wells over everyone except MAYBE Mathews. Wells has proven he can do it at this level but Mathews may see enough work to get close to Wells' numbers this season (top 12-18 RB) if SD press clippings are to be beleived. Personally, I still like Wells better than all of this years incoming RBs - but a case could be made for Mathews.
I would draft Mathews over Beanie this year (even redraft). Dynasty would be a no-brainer for me.
 
Many people assume that Beanie Wells only succeeded because defenses were keyed on the passing game.

This is not the case if you watch the tape. There were many occasions where the box was stacked and Beanie blasted through it.

Hightower on the other hand...

 
Billy Ball Thorton said:
MrTwo94 said:
Was Beanie not injured frequently in college? He won't be averaging 5.0 ypc on the Cardinals. He's going to need a lot of carries to get it done. Does this not concern anyone?

Also, in reference to the Vegas talk about the Cards being favored over the 49ers, Vegas' job isn't to be right. It is to get fools to bet evenly. So let's not bash the guy predicting the 49ers to win the division with Vegas being the strongest argument against him. That's a really weak argument.
Might wanna check how many games he missed before making this statement.

He avg 4.5ypc last year as a rookie... Adrian Peterson avg 4.4....
Article citing various Beanie injuries
From the article

Beanie has had plenty of injuries, but none of his injuries have been terribly serious. He does not have any permanent damage and he has shown great toughness by playing through most of the injuries during his career.

Again how many games has he missed in 3 years???

 
Had Beanie last year and was very impressed with what I saw when given the opportunity. Great burst, leg drive, power. Good vision, receiving ability and lateral agility. Had nothing changed in Arizona, I would taken him in the 1st round this season with no hesitation.

BUT, the cardinals situation this year seems eerily similar to the 2004 49ers, and stars Beanie Wells (unfortunately) in the role of Kevan Barlow.

In 2003, the niners were a playoff-talent team with garcia and owens, and a 2 headed tandem of Hearst and Barlow at RB. At the end of the season Hearst was injured in week 12 (13?), thus giving all RB touches to Kevan Barlow for the remainder of the season. Barlow answered with repeated studly performances en route to probably the FF playoffs MVP that season.

After the season was over, the niners lost TO, and proceeded to dump Garcia as well, losing their primary passing threats on offense. Despite this, many people at the time were ranking Barlow as high as #8 overall in some mocks, and at the very least a mid 2nd rounder. Most people now remember that Barlow did not fare so well the next season. With nothing to fear in the passing game, teams loaded up to stop the run and Barlow ended up with a measly 3.3 YPC with the niners ending up with the worst record in football in 2004.

Now granted, Warner and Boldin may not be the same as Garcia and Owens, and the cards still have Fitzgerald on the outside... and of course I'm not suggesting that Wells will completely flop like Barlow. But it's definitely something to keep in mind. Too often I see people projecting performances based solely on talent and not on the situation. I highly doubt Kevan Barlow suddenly became less talented in 2004, or that Cedric Benson suddenly became more talented in 2009. Temper your expectations for Beanie in 2010.

 
Had Beanie last year and was very impressed with what I saw when given the opportunity. Great burst, leg drive, power. Good vision, receiving ability and lateral agility. Had nothing changed in Arizona, I would taken him in the 1st round this season with no hesitation. BUT, the cardinals situation this year seems eerily similar to the 2004 49ers, and stars Beanie Wells (unfortunately) in the role of Kevan Barlow.In 2003, the niners were a playoff-talent team with garcia and owens, and a 2 headed tandem of Hearst and Barlow at RB. At the end of the season Hearst was injured in week 12 (13?), thus giving all RB touches to Kevan Barlow for the remainder of the season. Barlow answered with repeated studly performances en route to probably the FF playoffs MVP that season. After the season was over, the niners lost TO, and proceeded to dump Garcia as well, losing their primary passing threats on offense. Despite this, many people at the time were ranking Barlow as high as #8 overall in some mocks, and at the very least a mid 2nd rounder. Most people now remember that Barlow did not fare so well the next season. With nothing to fear in the passing game, teams loaded up to stop the run and Barlow ended up with a measly 3.3 YPC with the niners ending up with the worst record in football in 2004.Now granted, Warner and Boldin may not be the same as Garcia and Owens, and the cards still have Fitzgerald on the outside... and of course I'm not suggesting that Wells will completely flop like Barlow. But it's definitely something to keep in mind. Too often I see people projecting performances based solely on talent and not on the situation. I highly doubt Kevan Barlow suddenly became less talented in 2004, or that Cedric Benson suddenly became more talented in 2009. Temper your expectations for Beanie in 2010.
Barlow was a 3rd round draft pick on an average team who was rather underwhelming for 2 1/2 years before his little lighting in a bottle mini-rush at the end of 2003 (which to his credit decided a lot of FF titles). He returned back to his disappointing norm in 2004, and his team got worse around him.By contrast, Beanie was a 1st round pick on a team a season removed from the Super Bowl, and showed a ton of promise on a playoff team in his rookie year.Barlow may not have become less talented in 2004 - he probably really wasn't all that talented to begin with.
 
Had Beanie last year and was very impressed with what I saw when given the opportunity. Great burst, leg drive, power. Good vision, receiving ability and lateral agility. Had nothing changed in Arizona, I would taken him in the 1st round this season with no hesitation.

BUT, the cardinals situation this year seems eerily similar to the 2004 49ers, and stars Beanie Wells (unfortunately) in the role of Kevan Barlow.

In 2003, the niners were a playoff-talent team with garcia and owens, and a 2 headed tandem of Hearst and Barlow at RB. At the end of the season Hearst was injured in week 12 (13?), thus giving all RB touches to Kevan Barlow for the remainder of the season. Barlow answered with repeated studly performances en route to probably the FF playoffs MVP that season.

After the season was over, the niners lost TO, and proceeded to dump Garcia as well, losing their primary passing threats on offense. Despite this, many people at the time were ranking Barlow as high as #8 overall in some mocks, and at the very least a mid 2nd rounder. Most people now remember that Barlow did not fare so well the next season. With nothing to fear in the passing game, teams loaded up to stop the run and Barlow ended up with a measly 3.3 YPC with the niners ending up with the worst record in football in 2004.

Now granted, Warner and Boldin may not be the same as Garcia and Owens, and the cards still have Fitzgerald on the outside... and of course I'm not suggesting that Wells will completely flop like Barlow. But it's definitely something to keep in mind. Too often I see people projecting performances based solely on talent and not on the situation. I highly doubt Kevan Barlow suddenly became less talented in 2004, or that Cedric Benson suddenly became more talented in 2009. Temper your expectations for Beanie in 2010.
Barlow was a 3rd round draft pick on an average team who was rather underwhelming for 2 1/2 years before his little lighting in a bottle mini-rush at the end of 2003 (which to his credit decided a lot of FF titles). He returned back to his disappointing norm in 2004, and his team got worse around him.By contrast, Beanie was a 1st round pick on a team a season removed from the Super Bowl, and showed a ton of promise on a playoff team in his rookie year.

Barlow may not have become less talented in 2004 - he probably really wasn't all that talented to begin with.
If by "underwhelming" you mean Barlow's 4.7 YPA and 10 YPR numbers pre-2004, then I suppose Beanie's 4.5 YPA and 11 YPR last year would put him in that category as well. Also the "average" 49ers team of 2000-2003 were pretty much a top 5 offense every year (including 2003). I guess that makes the 2009 cardinals offense (who ranked 14th on offense in 2009) mediocre by comparison.Determining talent by where a player was drafted is such a crapshoot (in different years nonetheless) that I kind of chuckle when people bring it up in discussions regarding FF performance... Jamaal Charles vs. Darren McFadden for example.

Don't turn a blind eye to obvious indicators of performance and become enamored by a player's flash and potential. As I said in teh beginning of my OP, Beanie's a great player, it's his situation that I'd be concerned about.

 
Faneca = great for BeanieFaneca = really bad for Leinhart
This is the part that I think people overlook. Sure Hightower will still get some carries. And Leinart's not as strong as Warner in the passing game, but I think the key is the offensive line. Look at the Steelers as an example. Before Big Ben, the Steelers used to consistently run the ball. Everyone knew they were going to run the ball, defenses stacked the box and the Steelers still ran the ball effectively. If the Cardinals can put together a good offensive line it won't matter what Leinart does back there, the running game should still succeed. And Wells has shown the ability to make something out of nothing at times as well. I can see Beanie as a top 15 RB and an effective RB#2 in non ppr scoring. And as far as ppr goes, I think Wells has the ability to catch passes too, but if they can start to impose their will in the running game on teams, why bother pissing around throwing the ball to the RB's?
 
Cardinals fan here... and I think all of you are underestimating the VALUE of Tim Hightower to this team.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSImE-cPgGQ&NR=1

Check out those highlights. Hightower reminds me of Steve Jackson-Lite. Not sure if many of you have seen any Tim Hightower highlights post his atrocious Rookie Season. Because since then this guy has been "Violence in Motion".

REASONS WHY HIGHTOWER WILL STILL SEE MUCH PLAYING TIME:

1.) We've final got our Stud RB; we also have an above average RB. No way we're going to run our stud to the ground. Expect Hightower to get many-many carries to keep Beanie fresh.

2.) Hightower is the more instinctive Goal-Line runner. This is the guy who managed to vulture 10 TDs in his Rookie Season, and 8 last year. Whiz has proven he likes to RUN the ball in the red-zone.

3.) Pass Protection. Something that has held back many, many, many RBs. This is still a team that can shoot-out. They've got Larry Fitzgerald and boatloads of young WR waiting to breakout. We will still be passing; and it's important to keep our amazing pass-blocker Hightower in there.

4.) The team simply loves Hightower. The guy was a 5th Round Pick last year, and has clearly outplayed that position. He's matured since then and is becoming a great player.

5.) The guy gets the job done in post-season play. Two years in the League and he already has quality post-season experience. He ripped off the longest run of his career in the Post-Season; and he scored the Game-Winning Touchdown against the Eagles to get us to the Super Bowl.

-

Now I'm a firm believer that Wells is the superior back, but for our offensive system... we are completely blessed to have two backs that can handle the load! I'd damper your expectations of Wells just a tad bit: and raise Hightowers through the roof.

The Cardinals had 46 Offensive Touchdowns last season. 27 were created by Warner. 15 were created by the Running Backs. (7 for Beanie. 8 for Hightower.) Do you think Leinart is good for 27 Touchdowns? I don't. There will be more opportunity for Rushing TDs this season.

Hightower and Wells will both be viable Fantasy Options.

 
2.) Hightower is the more instinctive Goal-Line runner. This is the guy who managed to vulture 10 TDs in his Rookie Season, and 8 last year. Whiz has proven he likes to RUN the ball in the red-zone.
We went over this ad nauseum last year. Hightower had a lot of goaline TDs, only because he had a lot of goaline opportunities. His actual efficiency numbers down there are below average. I'm surprised there are still people out there holding onto the notion that he's a good goaline runner.
 
Had Beanie last year and was very impressed with what I saw when given the opportunity. Great burst, leg drive, power. Good vision, receiving ability and lateral agility. Had nothing changed in Arizona, I would taken him in the 1st round this season with no hesitation.

BUT, the cardinals situation this year seems eerily similar to the 2004 49ers, and stars Beanie Wells (unfortunately) in the role of Kevan Barlow.

In 2003, the niners were a playoff-talent team with garcia and owens, and a 2 headed tandem of Hearst and Barlow at RB. At the end of the season Hearst was injured in week 12 (13?), thus giving all RB touches to Kevan Barlow for the remainder of the season. Barlow answered with repeated studly performances en route to probably the FF playoffs MVP that season.

After the season was over, the niners lost TO, and proceeded to dump Garcia as well, losing their primary passing threats on offense. Despite this, many people at the time were ranking Barlow as high as #8 overall in some mocks, and at the very least a mid 2nd rounder. Most people now remember that Barlow did not fare so well the next season. With nothing to fear in the passing game, teams loaded up to stop the run and Barlow ended up with a measly 3.3 YPC with the niners ending up with the worst record in football in 2004.

Now granted, Warner and Boldin may not be the same as Garcia and Owens, and the cards still have Fitzgerald on the outside... and of course I'm not suggesting that Wells will completely flop like Barlow. But it's definitely something to keep in mind. Too often I see people projecting performances based solely on talent and not on the situation. I highly doubt Kevan Barlow suddenly became less talented in 2004, or that Cedric Benson suddenly became more talented in 2009. Temper your expectations for Beanie in 2010.
Barlow was a 3rd round draft pick on an average team who was rather underwhelming for 2 1/2 years before his little lighting in a bottle mini-rush at the end of 2003 (which to his credit decided a lot of FF titles). He returned back to his disappointing norm in 2004, and his team got worse around him.By contrast, Beanie was a 1st round pick on a team a season removed from the Super Bowl, and showed a ton of promise on a playoff team in his rookie year.

Barlow may not have become less talented in 2004 - he probably really wasn't all that talented to begin with.
If by "underwhelming" you mean Barlow's 4.7 YPA and 10 YPR numbers pre-2004, then I suppose Beanie's 4.5 YPA and 11 YPR last year would put him in that category as well. Also the "average" 49ers team of 2000-2003 were pretty much a top 5 offense every year (including 2003). I guess that makes the 2009 cardinals offense (who ranked 14th on offense in 2009) mediocre by comparison.Determining talent by where a player was drafted is such a crapshoot (in different years nonetheless) that I kind of chuckle when people bring it up in discussions regarding FF performance... Jamaal Charles vs. Darren McFadden for example.

Don't turn a blind eye to obvious indicators of performance and become enamored by a player's flash and potential. As I said in teh beginning of my OP, Beanie's a great player, it's his situation that I'd be concerned about.
You're kind of doing the same thing. While chastizing others for basing talent on draft position, you're basing it on performance.Go back to the Kevan Barlow threads on this board. Absolutely no one was talking about how good of a player he looked like. Now go back to the Cardinal game threads throughout this season and look at how everyone is talking about Beanie. He clearly displayed immense talent this year, that surprised even his biggest advocates.

Beanie had "man among boys" syndrome last year. That is, when you watched him get the ball, he looked like a complete manimal. He looked special. That is the type of guy you don't sit here and bicker over situation about. That is the type of guy you get on your team immediately. Studs win championships in FF, and this guy has a better chance to be FFs next big stud moreso than anyone in the league other than perhaps Jonathan Stewart.

People were drafting Kevan Barlow purely based on his numbers. People are drafting Wells because of what they saw.

 
You're kind of doing the same thing. While chastizing others for basing talent on draft position, you're basing it on performance.Go back to the Kevan Barlow threads on this board. Absolutely no one was talking about how good of a player he looked like. Now go back to the Cardinal game threads throughout this season and look at how everyone is talking about Beanie. He clearly displayed immense talent this year, that surprised even his biggest advocates.Beanie had "man among boys" syndrome last year. That is, when you watched him get the ball, he looked like a complete manimal. He looked special. That is the type of guy you don't sit here and bicker over situation about. That is the type of guy you get on your team immediately. Studs win championships in FF, and this guy has a better chance to be FFs next big stud moreso than anyone in the league other than perhaps Jonathan Stewart.People were drafting Kevan Barlow purely based on his numbers. People are drafting Wells because of what they saw.
Again, I understand the infatuation and am impressed with the player that Wells showed last season. I also said I don't think he'll be a complete flop, simply warning that expectations need to be reined in a little due to the change in his situation. Randy Moss clearly had "man among boys" syndrome his first year in NE, yet just the year before he was almost worthless as a FF player in Oakland. Clearly just being a manimal isn't enough to overcome your surroundings, there's 10 other players on the field that determine the effectiveness.
 
Had Beanie last year and was very impressed with what I saw when given the opportunity. Great burst, leg drive, power. Good vision, receiving ability and lateral agility. Had nothing changed in Arizona, I would taken him in the 1st round this season with no hesitation. BUT, the cardinals situation this year seems eerily similar to the 2004 49ers, and stars Beanie Wells (unfortunately) in the role of Kevan Barlow.In 2003, the niners were a playoff-talent team with garcia and owens, and a 2 headed tandem of Hearst and Barlow at RB. At the end of the season Hearst was injured in week 12 (13?), thus giving all RB touches to Kevan Barlow for the remainder of the season. Barlow answered with repeated studly performances en route to probably the FF playoffs MVP that season. After the season was over, the niners lost TO, and proceeded to dump Garcia as well, losing their primary passing threats on offense. Despite this, many people at the time were ranking Barlow as high as #8 overall in some mocks, and at the very least a mid 2nd rounder. Most people now remember that Barlow did not fare so well the next season. With nothing to fear in the passing game, teams loaded up to stop the run and Barlow ended up with a measly 3.3 YPC with the niners ending up with the worst record in football in 2004.Now granted, Warner and Boldin may not be the same as Garcia and Owens, and the cards still have Fitzgerald on the outside... and of course I'm not suggesting that Wells will completely flop like Barlow. But it's definitely something to keep in mind. Too often I see people projecting performances based solely on talent and not on the situation. I highly doubt Kevan Barlow suddenly became less talented in 2004, or that Cedric Benson suddenly became more talented in 2009. Temper your expectations for Beanie in 2010.
I'm not sure the situations are all that similar. Garcia was replaced by Tim Rattay and Ken Dorsey, a pair of seventh rounders. Warner is being replaced by Matt Leinart, a Heisman winner, national champion, and early first rounder. He hasn't had much chance to prove himself in the NFL yet, because he's been stuck behind Warner, who probably played his way into the Hall of Fame while Leinart was on the bench.Losing Boldin should not be as hard on the Cardinals as losing Owens was on the Niners. Breaston and Doucet should be able to fill his shoes. Plus they still have Fitzgerald.Those Niners were coached by Denis Erickson, who in six seasons in the NFL never finished above 0.500. The Cardinals' Whisenhunt has taken them to the plays twice ,and the Super Bowl once, in his first three years as a head coach.Finally, Wells is just more talented than Barlow was, IMO.
 
2.) Hightower is the more instinctive Goal-Line runner. This is the guy who managed to vulture 10 TDs in his Rookie Season, and 8 last year. Whiz has proven he likes to RUN the ball in the red-zone.
We went over this ad nauseum last year. Hightower had a lot of goaline TDs, only because he had a lot of goaline opportunities. His actual efficiency numbers down there are below average. I'm surprised there are still people out there holding onto the notion that he's a good goaline runner.
:shrug: Not to mention that Beanie is actually bigger than Hightower (1" taller/ 6 lbs. heavier).
 
Had Beanie last year and was very impressed with what I saw when given the opportunity. Great burst, leg drive, power. Good vision, receiving ability and lateral agility. Had nothing changed in Arizona, I would taken him in the 1st round this season with no hesitation. BUT, the cardinals situation this year seems eerily similar to the 2004 49ers, and stars Beanie Wells (unfortunately) in the role of Kevan Barlow.In 2003, the niners were a playoff-talent team with garcia and owens, and a 2 headed tandem of Hearst and Barlow at RB. At the end of the season Hearst was injured in week 12 (13?), thus giving all RB touches to Kevan Barlow for the remainder of the season. Barlow answered with repeated studly performances en route to probably the FF playoffs MVP that season. After the season was over, the niners lost TO, and proceeded to dump Garcia as well, losing their primary passing threats on offense. Despite this, many people at the time were ranking Barlow as high as #8 overall in some mocks, and at the very least a mid 2nd rounder. Most people now remember that Barlow did not fare so well the next season. With nothing to fear in the passing game, teams loaded up to stop the run and Barlow ended up with a measly 3.3 YPC with the niners ending up with the worst record in football in 2004.Now granted, Warner and Boldin may not be the same as Garcia and Owens, and the cards still have Fitzgerald on the outside... and of course I'm not suggesting that Wells will completely flop like Barlow. But it's definitely something to keep in mind. Too often I see people projecting performances based solely on talent and not on the situation. I highly doubt Kevan Barlow suddenly became less talented in 2004, or that Cedric Benson suddenly became more talented in 2009. Temper your expectations for Beanie in 2010.
I'm not sure the situations are all that similar. Garcia was replaced by Tim Rattay and Ken Dorsey, a pair of seventh rounders. Warner is being replaced by Matt Leinart, a Heisman winner, national champion, and early first rounder. He hasn't had much chance to prove himself in the NFL yet, because he's been stuck behind Warner, who probably played his way into the Hall of Fame while Leinart was on the bench.Losing Boldin should not be as hard on the Cardinals as losing Owens was on the Niners. Breaston and Doucet should be able to fill his shoes. Plus they still have Fitzgerald.Those Niners were coached by Denis Erickson, who in six seasons in the NFL never finished above 0.500. The Cardinals' Whisenhunt has taken them to the plays twice ,and the Super Bowl once, in his first three years as a head coach.Finally, Wells is just more talented than Barlow was, IMO.
Again with the "where a guy was drafted"... who really cares? Rattay had a higher Y/A, higher completion percentage, 24 TDs to 18 INTs, and an 81 QB rating in this SF career. Better than the 2 no.1 overalls on SF's roster right now, and certainly better than Leinart, who thusfar is inferior in all those major QB categories. The only thing Leinart's proven so far is that he's a pretty mediocre NFL QB.Some of you seem to think I'm going around parading in a "THe end is nigh for Beanie" sign. Not at all. I agree that Boldin has more viable replacements in Breaston and Doucet, while Whisenhunt is clearly a superior coach to Erickson. Not to mention that FItz is still there. Those are all factors in Beanie's favor. However, his 4.5 YPC isn't worldbeating, manimal or not. And he had more than a couple of games where he didn't even break 3 YPC (one of which Leinart started) And to suggest he's going to do better than that this year will require Leinart to duplicate Warner's production with a lesser cast. Those who are expecting Leinart to pull an Aaron Rodgers are going to be sorely disappointed.
 
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writ...nals/index.html

Red run: Cardinals offense will undergo philosophy change in 2010

TEMPE, Ariz. -- Cardinals running back Beanie Wells has a different look this year. After a recent attempt to line his own hair turned out poorly, the former Ohio State star decided it was better to start from scratch. So he grabbed a razor, some shaving cream and went to work.

If Wells has his way, a smooth noggin won't be the only change fans notice in him. After a solid but unspectacular rookie season, the former first-round pick believes he is poised for a breakout season. The Cardinals relied on their passing game the past two seasons but are expected to lean on their running game this year following the January retirement of quarterback Kurt Warner. That should mean more opportunities for Wells and Tim Hightower, who split the workload last season.

"This is big for me," Wells said during a break in offseason team activities. "I feel like last year during the draft I wasn't selected where I expected to be or even where I was projected to go. I'm just out to show those 30 teams that passed on me that you passed on a great running back."

Wells, who was taken 31st overall in the 2009 draft, doesn't set personal statistical goals for a season, but he does admit that after running for 793 yards and seven touchdowns as a rookie he's expecting a "drastic jump from those numbers." Should that be taken to mean he could double each of those stats? "Oh, yeah," Wells says. "Definitely."

The Cardinals' reliance on the passing game the past two seasons was understandable; they had a Hall of Fame-caliber quarterback in Warner, whose 56 touchdown passes from 2008 to '09 ranked fifth in the NFL, and a stable of receivers that included Pro Bowlers Larry Fitzgerald and Anquan Boldin and 1,000-yard wideout Steve Breaston.

However Warner stepped down after passing for 32,344 yards and 208 touchdowns over his 12-year career with three teams, and Boldin was traded to Baltimore in March. Now everyone is waiting to see how the Cardinals will proceed. The expectation is they will seek to run the ball, control the clock and avoid putting too much responsibility on the shoulder's of former first-round pick Matt Leinart, who has yet to prove he's a legitimate starter. But coach Ken Whisenhunt says they will continue to play to their strengths, whatever that ultimately may be.

The players unquestionably are expecting more of a commitment to the run. Statistically, the Cardinals were not balanced in 2009, attempting 594 passes and 365 rushes. It's doubtful that will happen this year.

"There were times in the season where it was like, 'OK, everybody knows we're going to pass. There's no need for us to even get down in a stance,' " says left tackle Levi Brown. "In this game you want to feel like you're attacking. You can attack when you're passing but, for the most part, you're adjusting to your opponent. When you're run blocking, you can get up in this guy's chest, you can try to take advantage of your weight and strength. If we can balance that out and give people a little bit more to worry about, it changes up things. It makes you a little bit more dangerous."

The line became even more formidable -- particularly from a rushing standpoint -- with the signing of nine-time Pro Bowl guard Alan Faneca, whose forte is run-blocking. Other line changes include Brown moving from right tackle to left; Reggie Wells from left guard to right; and Brandon Keith getting the first shot at right tackle.

The group is big, talented and eager to throw its weight around. That brings a smile to the faces of Wells and Hightower, who led the team with eight rushing TDs last season and was second with 598 yards. Both agree Warner and the passing game were the strength of the offense in 2009, but they view this year as an opportunity to show they can hold their own.

"As a running back, that's what you prepare for all season," says Hightower. "That's what we've been grinding and getting in shape for, doing all the things in the weight room and on the field for -- the expectation of getting to carry the load a little bit more. Kurt was a great leader last year, but Kurt liked to throw the ball. He was good at that, and when that's the playmaker on your team you've got to do what you've got to do. But I think this year, hopefully, is going to allow us to mix it up and let a lot more guys step up. From my position and Beanie's position, that's a running back's dream, to be able to contribute."

Hightower started every game last season, but the workload was evenly split with Hightower getting 143 carries to Wells' 176. Wells averaged 4.5 yards a carry, Hightower 4.2. Despite the comparable stats, defensive coordinators see Wells as the bigger threat because he's bigger (6-foot-2, 229 pounds to 6-1, 222) and carries more power behind his pads. "Hightower is a good back, but Beanie has the stature and the ability to be a premier back," said an opposing defensive coordinator.

The Cardinals would appear to agree. Last December they began featuring the then-rookie, running him at least 13 times in four straight games; during that same time Hightower had more than six rushes just once. The two have a good friendship and are professional about their desire to be a featured back.

"We're both competitive," says Hightower. "We joke all the time about how we hate being taken off the field, I don't care if it's first down, goal line or third down, I hate being taken off the field. I want to be an every-down back. I grew up watching Walter Payton. I'm just competitive like that. Beanie is the same way. He loves making plays. We kind of feed off of that. At some point we both know we're going to be taken out of the game, but we're doing everything we can to make it hard on them to take us out."

If the Cardinals run the ball as well as they're anticipating, there should be plenty of carries to go around. And that's a look Cardinals fans haven't seen for some time.

 
That Beanie rookie highlight reel has me salivating. The guy is a flat out stud. He'll get 234 carries for 1,164 yards, 32 catches for 315 yards, 13 total TD's and be a top 10 RB no problem.

 
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I don't feel much differently about him now as I did last year, when he's healthy he can be dominant (by far the superior runner in the 2nd half) but I don't trust him to stay on the field for a full season. Like last season I'll keep an eye on him midseason if his owner gets impatient with him in redrafts, but I'm taking my risks elsewhere in dynasty's...at least at Beanie's price.

 
How about this comparison... Who would you rather take? Shonn Greene or Chris Wells?
Greene here, liked him more coming out of school and his situation has only improved since being drafted. He's a good bet for Rudi Johnson in his prime type production, but unless he's done a 180 on his passing game skills that's his ceiling.
 
You can't run the ball on teams who KNOW you're going to run the ball.Not even with Adrian Peterson, let alone Beanie Wells.
Remind me: what kind of defenses did AP face with Tavaris at the helm?
And the last 2 two times rb's went for 2,000 yards, who were their QB's?K. Collins and Vince Young to go along with Anthony Wright and E. Grbac I think (to lazy to look) I know they weren't anyone good
 
excerpt from a recent PFW article lending some credence to allusions to the cards running more in 2010...

"Grimm said the Cardinals' offense in ’10 will resemble those Steelers teams of the early-to-mid 2000s at times, which is a dramatic change from when Warner was under center."

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/06/0...ange-on-offense
Yeah, because that's the way it works in the NFL. Your passing game gets totally wrecked so you just start to run all over people instead. Easy. Better start drafting Browns running backs!
You do realize that the majority of top ten backs over the last several years weren't in pass-heavy offenses, right?
 
Im getting a bad vibe from Beanie this year. I see Arizona dropping off a lot both on offense and defense. No player lost this offseason was more important to their team than Kurt Warner, and I don't trust Leinart at all. He cratered when the job was handed to him 08, why should we trust him now? Tim Hightower is going to be the passing down back, and with the losses this team suffered on defense, I expect them to be in catch-up mode a lot when they're not playing Seattle or St. Louis. Im afraid we might see anywhere from 4-8 10 carries for 34 yards type games from Beanie. He could easily have 1300 yards this season, but only have 6-8 games that you want him in your lineup. I think Stewart, Mathews, Best, and Benson are all much better at the same or lower ADP than Wells.

 
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Im getting a bad vibe from Beanie this year. I see Arizona dropping off a lot both on offense and defense. No player lost this offseason was more important to their team than Kurt Warner, and I don't trust Leinart at all. He cratered when the job was handed to him 08, why should we trust him now? Tim Hightower is going to be the passing down back, and with the losses this team suffered on defense, I expect them to be in catch-up mode a lot when they're not playing Seattle or St. Louis. Im afraid we might see anywhere from 4-8 10 carries for 34 yards type games from Beanie. He could easily have 1300 yards this season, but only have 6-8 games that you want him in your lineup. I think Stewart, Mathews, Best, and Benson are all much better at the same or lower ADP than Wells.
the losses on defense could be overrated...dan williams should be an upgrade at NT... calais campbell broke out as a soph and still has upside...dansby hurts, but washington was a consensus top 3 LB & maybe most athletic LB in the draft... LB is a very instinctive position (like RB) often conducive to early success... they lose berry & okeafor on outside, but added porter, who had career high in sacks as recently as 2008... he is on the downside of his career, but could still have something left in the tank....i'd rather have rolle than rhodes, but that isn't necessarily a catastrophic dropoff...they still have pro bowlers dockett, wilson, DRC...
 
MrTwo94 said:
excerpt from a recent PFW article lending some credence to allusions to the cards running more in 2010...

"Grimm said the Cardinals' offense in ’10 will resemble those Steelers teams of the early-to-mid 2000s at times, which is a dramatic change from when Warner was under center."

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2010/06/0...ange-on-offense
Yeah, because that's the way it works in the NFL. Your passing game gets totally wrecked so you just start to run all over people instead. Easy. Better start drafting Browns running backs!
You do realize that the majority of top ten backs over the last several years weren't in pass-heavy offenses, right?
Um, yes. I think most people would find that safe to assume, but you are badly missing the point. Running the ball is a luxury in the NFL. A privilege one must earn. Not a last resort when it looks like your passing game is going to fall apart. Unless a team is stoutly built to run the ball (like the Jets or Panthers) then the rule seems to be that you run the ball when you can, but you pass the ball if you can't run the ball. You don't just magically run the ball effectively when your passing game falls apart as everyone here seems to assume.
in the top half of the league in rushing yards...2 - steven jackson

4 - MJD

7 - ryan grant

11 - jamaal charles (in what, half a season?)

15 - fred jackson

are the rams "stoutly built to run the ball"? :rolleyes:

JAX started two rookie OTs in 2009.

clifton and tauscher not exactly an elite OT combo.

KC had one of the worst OL in the NFL last year.

BUF - ditto.

your concerns don't seem to compute?

 
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Bob Magaw said:
Im getting a bad vibe from Beanie this year. I see Arizona dropping off a lot both on offense and defense. No player lost this offseason was more important to their team than Kurt Warner, and I don't trust Leinart at all. He cratered when the job was handed to him 08, why should we trust him now? Tim Hightower is going to be the passing down back, and with the losses this team suffered on defense, I expect them to be in catch-up mode a lot when they're not playing Seattle or St. Louis. Im afraid we might see anywhere from 4-8 10 carries for 34 yards type games from Beanie. He could easily have 1300 yards this season, but only have 6-8 games that you want him in your lineup. I think Stewart, Mathews, Best, and Benson are all much better at the same or lower ADP than Wells.
the losses on defense could be overrated...dan williams should be an upgrade at NT... calais campbell broke out as a soph and still has upside...dansby hurts, but washington was a consensus top 3 LB & maybe most athletic LB in the draft... LB is a very instinctive position (like RB) often conducive to early success... they lose berry & okeafor on outside, but added porter, who had career high in sacks as recently as 2008... he is on the downside of his career, but could still have something left in the tank....i'd rather have rolle than rhodes, but that isn't necessarily a catastrophic dropoff...they still have pro bowlers dockett, wilson, DRC...
I don't think this defense could afford to lose much when they won't have the "best defense is a good offense" factor going for them. Only Tennessee faced more pass attempts than Arizona's defense last year, and when teams don't feel pressured to go into shootout mode, the 25-to-37 run to pass ratio they faced will even out and their poor 4.5 ypc against will come into play even more.
 
I don't know why Bob limited his comparison to just those guys. Almost universally (pretty much outside of AD) the best rushers came from poor passing attacks last year. Tennessee, San Francisco, Baltimore, Miami, Carolina, New York Jets all in addition to the guys Bob listed.

Your reasons for "eliminating" comparisons are way too finalistic (I don't think that's a word) though. Beanie won't get that many carries, so this one doesn't count. Beanie won't average a high ypc, so that one doesn't count. Beanie will be in a RBBC, so this one doesn't count. Beanie isn't as talented as that guy, so that one doesn't count. Basically, you're only looking for situations where a bad running back in a RBBC on a bad team did well. Obviously there aren't many of those, but the whole point is that many don't believe that's the situation he's in.

Beanie is not a mediocre player destined for a time share at a mediocre ypc. Beanie has the talent to be every bit as good as Steven Jackson or MJD (did you watch the guy play last year, I'm not convinced that he's any worse than those guys at running the football right here and now). Beanie has the ability to have a high ypc. Beanie has the ability to have Hightower diapered to the bench all year while he carries the load. You could have made many of the same arguments last year against Chris Johnson, Frank Gore, Ray Rice, Ricky Williams, DeAngelo Williams, and Shonn Greene as you are right now against Beanie.

And while Arizona's passing game will certainly take a step backwards, there's no guarantee they will be anywhere near as bad as many of the teams listed here. They still have Fitzgerald and some solid WRs behind him. That's a LOT more than what you could say for teams like SF, StL, Miami, KC, Buffalo, Tennessee, or the NYJ headed into last year. Heck, several of those teams didn't even have a WR1 that was as good as Arizona's WR3.

 
I don't know why Bob limited his comparison to just those guys. Almost universally (pretty much outside of AD) the best rushers came from poor passing attacks last year. Tennessee, San Francisco, Baltimore, Miami, Carolina, New York Jets all in addition to the guys Bob listed.Your reasons for "eliminating" comparisons are way too finalistic (I don't think that's a word) though. Beanie won't get that many carries, so this one doesn't count. Beanie won't average a high ypc, so that one doesn't count. Beanie will be in a RBBC, so this one doesn't count. Beanie isn't as talented as that guy, so that one doesn't count. Basically, you're only looking for situations where a bad running back in a RBBC on a bad team did well. Obviously there aren't many of those, but the whole point is that many don't believe that's the situation he's in.Beanie is not a mediocre player destined for a time share at a mediocre ypc. Beanie has the talent to be every bit as good as Steven Jackson or MJD (did you watch the guy play last year, I'm not convinced that he's any worse than those guys at running the football right here and now). Beanie has the ability to have a high ypc. Beanie has the ability to have Hightower diapered to the bench all year while he carries the load. You could have made many of the same arguments last year against Chris Johnson, Frank Gore, Ray Rice, Ricky Williams, DeAngelo Williams, and Shonn Greene as you are right now against Beanie.And while Arizona's passing game will certainly take a step backwards, there's no guarantee they will be anywhere near as bad as many of the teams listed here. They still have Fitzgerald and some solid WRs behind him. That's a LOT more than what you could say for teams like SF, StL, Miami, KC, Buffalo, Tennessee, or the NYJ headed into last year. Heck, several of those teams didn't even have a WR1 that was as good as Arizona's WR3.
:lmao: :excited: :yucky:
 
Beanie is not a mediocre player destined for a time share at a mediocre ypc. Beanie has the talent to be every bit as good as Steven Jackson or MJD (did you watch the guy play last year, I'm not convinced that he's any worse than those guys at running the football right here and now). Beanie has the ability to have a high ypc. Beanie has the ability to have Hightower diapered to the bench all year while he carries the load. You could have made many of the same arguments last year against Chris Johnson, Frank Gore, Ray Rice, Ricky Williams, DeAngelo Williams, and Shonn Greene as you are right now against Beanie.
1) Cedric Benson, Ryan Grant, or Michael Turner yes, MJD/Sjax no. Wells will never be the pass catching back that MJD/Sjax is. Benson, Grant, and Turner are all in much, much better offenses than Wells right now.2) Hightower is clearly better than Wells on passing downs and he will continue to dominate touches in those situations. Hightower will also continue to cut into Wells short yardage opportunities. Hightower went 8 for 13 inside the 5 last year, Wells 4 for 7. I can't see them giving Wells exclusive goal line work after Hightower was so efficient in that role last year.3) The only backs from your list that are in similar situations to Wells are Ricky, DeAngelo, and Greene. Greene was almost worthless until Leon Washington went down. DeAngelo is on arguably the best running team in the league, and Ricky only had moderate value until Ronnie Brown went down. Yes, if Tim Hightower suffers a season-ending injury, Wells will be an awesome guy to own, but you can say the same about a lot of backs going a lot later than Wells.
 
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