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Best scoring system to level out RB and WR? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter raven1911
- Start date
gman8343
What would Lemmy do?
I like this.Two of my leagues reward 1 ppr for WR/TE but no ppr for RBs, which evens the playing field big time. Teams without a stud RB can compete if they have great WRs. We also start 3/4 WRs and 2 RBs.
For the last few years, we've done 3WR, 1TE, 1TE/WR, 2RB. This increases the scarcity (and thus the value) of WR. While we haven't gone so far as to do PPR yet, I'm planning on proposing a change to 1 PPR for WR/TE and a swap to 3WR, 1TE, 2RB, 1RB/TE/WR, which I think ought to tune up the balance even a bit more.-=kwantam
Captain Spaulding
Footballguy
I like the scoring adjustments suggested early. 3 WRs in starting lineup also helps. I think if you have more points weighted towards incremental yardage and PPR that really helps with week to week coaching abilities and reduces the luck factor. By luck factor I mean TD heavy leagues usually are more lucky with draft choices and the unpredictability of scoring touchdowns.
raven1911
Footballguy
Well, a couple reasons. 1) I have encountered teams that essentially have one stud RB (aka AP)or two good RB that are able to win time and time again. I don't think this represents a good team but a good draft. I am just getting sick of RB being like Gold and everyone else is just crap. 2) I think it gives more power to the manager of the team. With more choices in positions, there is more strategy involved and it makes it more competitive and makes draft day really interesting. 3) I would like to even out the weekly scores as well so that we can exploit other good positional matchups in a given week besides the RB position. I think this would even out the scoring every week, as I am getting tired of scores like 148 to 68. Its just too much of a blowout this year and it didn't seem like there were very many close games.
tombonneau
Footballguy
You are right. It's more about lineup options than scoring system. This works better in larger leagues. 14-teamer I'm in I think has the best RB-WR scoring:Start:1 RB2 WR1 TE1 RB/WR/TEScoring:1/10 yds3 pt 100 yard bonus5 pt 200 yard bonus6 pt TD8 pt TD 40+ yds.5 ppr (all positions)We had it at 1ppr for one year but it was too crazy. We also had a bonus tier for # of receptions, but that got out of hand too.I really think this is best as it doesn't handicap you by forcing you to start some scrub RB2. Teams are always in the running with a 1RB 3WR lineup. I've been using a mix all year, mostly 3WR, and am #4 scoring.This year the top WRs and RBs are all pretty well clustered in the 20-25 ppg, which IMO is the point. Moss/Owens are worth as much as Westbrook/LT/ADP which I feel is proper.
valhallan
Footballguy
Definitely has a lot to do with line-up requirements. My 12-teamer is fairly balanced with the following system
1 QB
1 RB
3 WR
1 TE
2 Flex (can be any position, but both flexes can't be used at the same position)
Teams usually start 2QB, 2RB, 3WR, 1TE or 1QB, 2RB, 4WR, 1TE. Some guys roll with 2 TEs.
Scoring is 1pt per 10 rush/rec yards, 6 pt rush/rec TDs, 1 pt per 25 pass yards, 4 pt pass TDs, 1 pt per reception for all positions, and -1 pt for all turnovers.
Some teams have stud RBs, some have stud QBs, and some have stud WRs. All strategies have proven to have some merit.
1 QB
1 RB
3 WR
1 TE
2 Flex (can be any position, but both flexes can't be used at the same position)
Teams usually start 2QB, 2RB, 3WR, 1TE or 1QB, 2RB, 4WR, 1TE. Some guys roll with 2 TEs.
Scoring is 1pt per 10 rush/rec yards, 6 pt rush/rec TDs, 1 pt per 25 pass yards, 4 pt pass TDs, 1 pt per reception for all positions, and -1 pt for all turnovers.
Some teams have stud RBs, some have stud QBs, and some have stud WRs. All strategies have proven to have some merit.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Personally, I like a format of 16 teams, 0-2 RBs, 3-5 WRs, 1-3 TE (7 total). PPR, 1.5 for TE, 1 for WR, .5 for RBTEs will rarely be equal to RBs or WRs, but this is as close as I'd imagine possible.
NatronIsMean
Footballguy
I like it not being level. As rare as RBs are, I like rewarding the few of them getting good output.
Koya
Footballguy
a .5 pt more for WRs usually is a simple fair way. Also remember, two things are at play here imo in regard to RBs:
(1) With the over the top rules favoring the passing game, WRs and QBs are being used far more in the short passing game than they have in the past, for the most part. NE and GB even demonstrate this pass first mentality because DBs can barely touch the WRs anymore.
(2) I think the stud RB is sometimes overated because you have 1 or 2 GREAT RBs most years that do such a great job winning fantasy leagues everyone tries to draft that guy. Problem is, outside of LT2 last year, Edge and Marshall Faulk and other one or two RB's that were so far above the fray, I think the rest are not nearly the difference makers people think.
The latter coupled with perhaps a bit of the former has me really re-evaluating the usual emphasis on RBs.
(1) With the over the top rules favoring the passing game, WRs and QBs are being used far more in the short passing game than they have in the past, for the most part. NE and GB even demonstrate this pass first mentality because DBs can barely touch the WRs anymore.
(2) I think the stud RB is sometimes overated because you have 1 or 2 GREAT RBs most years that do such a great job winning fantasy leagues everyone tries to draft that guy. Problem is, outside of LT2 last year, Edge and Marshall Faulk and other one or two RB's that were so far above the fray, I think the rest are not nearly the difference makers people think.
The latter coupled with perhaps a bit of the former has me really re-evaluating the usual emphasis on RBs.
CalBear
Footballguy
QBs and Ks are both more rare than RBs. Why not reward them instead of RBs?
My favorite scoring system is your basic PPR. 1 point/10 yards rush/rec. 1 point/25 passing. 6 points/TD. 1 point/reception. Start 1 QB, 2 WR, 2 RB, 1 TE, 1 WR/RB, 1 K, 1 D. So far this year:
Out of the top 10 WR/RB, 7 are WR's, 3 are RB's.
Out of the top 20 WR/RB, 13 are WR's, 7 are RB's.
Out of the top 50 WR/RB, 31 are WR's, 19 are RB's.
Why does everyone want to make it harder for RB's to score points?? Seems like a pretty good balance (even skewed towards WR's) to me!
Out of the top 10 WR/RB, 7 are WR's, 3 are RB's.
Out of the top 20 WR/RB, 13 are WR's, 7 are RB's.
Out of the top 50 WR/RB, 31 are WR's, 19 are RB's.
Why does everyone want to make it harder for RB's to score points?? Seems like a pretty good balance (even skewed towards WR's) to me!
CalBear
Footballguy
Did 13 WRs go in the first 20 picks of your draft? If not, why not? When you understand the answer to that question, you'll understand why RB scoring needs to be controlled.
Pictus Cat
Footballguy
Draft style might help too.
3rd round reversal or flip.
3rd round reversal or flip.
GregR_2
Footballguy
We have a starting lineup of 1 QB, 2 RB, 1 flex QB/RB, 4 WR, 2 TE, 1 flex WR/TE. 90% of the time the flex are used with a 2nd QB and a 5th WR, so it amounts to 2 QB, 2 RB, 5 WR, 2 TE most of the time. PPR is .25 RB, .5 WR, 1.0 TE. Last year the VBD of the top few players at each position was: Peyton 220, Brees 160, Vick 156, Bulger 151, Palmer 147.LT 275, SJax 181, LJ 176, Gore 111, Westbrook 106.Harrison 161, Owens 152, Wayne 138, Holt 134, Driver 133, CJ 129, Evans 129Gates 146, Winslow 126, Gonzo 126, Heap 115, Crumpler 113So the top 11 players in order last year were LT, Peyton, SJax, LJ, Harrison, Brees, Vick, Bulger, Owens, Palmer, Gates. That's 3 RB, 5 QB, 2 WR, 1 TE. I like the parity, and that WR and TE aren't as much of after thoughts as in other setups. Not to mention that there aren't always a slew of guys on waivers that are as good as the guys on your roster. We get a ton of trades in this league (contract, salary cap), as you can't completely depend on the auction or on the rookie draft to fill your needs.
Islander
Footballguy
In addition to some things mentioned here (PPR for WRs but not for RBs), we also award progressively more points for long TDs (up to 8 pts depending on length) than TDs of less than 5 yds (6 pts). This puts a premium on QBs and WRs relative to RBs because on average they more frequently score TDs of 25+ yards.
Prof. Chaos
Footballguy
My local leauge uses the old Miller Lite system. 9 pts. for td.s 10-39yds, 12 for tds. over 40. Evens out qb and wr production.
NatronIsMean
Footballguy
I guess the "rareness" isn't the key - I just like fantasy for what it has been the last 10 years, and that is a world where RBs are RBs. WRs actually score INCREDIBLY well, and better than RBs, when they go off. But in the real world of the NFL, WRs ARE more hit or miss than RBs. As for QBs and Ks, since we only start 1 and that is the standard for fantasy, QBs and Ks are not as rare as RBs.Having LT2 on your actual football team is more important than having any WR, and that's something I don't mind the fantasy game reflecting.
Statler & Waldorf
Footballguy
I've read a proposal before (by some one on this board I believe) about changing rushing TD's to 4 and receiving TD's to 6. On top of that, you can change it to 1 point for every 10 yards receiving and then 1 point for every 20 yards rushing. I personally wouldn't want to change anything. I like the stud RB.
ChromeWeasel
Footballguy
Definitely start 1 RB and start 2 WR. Allow 1 flex RB/WR/TE. If that's not enough, go to start 3 WR. Messing with the scoring is unecessary. Any league that requires starting 2 RB is driving up RB values. If you allow a third RB through flex your league is RIDICULOUSLY driving up RB values. Changing the scoring system wont help much, unless youre hoping to take advantage of less advanced owners.
In normal systems Qb's on avg score more points per game then RB's. Its just that most QB's at the upper tiers play at similar levels. If you want Qb's to be the most important start 2 of them. The amount of points scored won't change much. Also the having the top two Rb's this year really didn't matter. They just weren't strong enough over the rest of the guys to carry teams to victory.
weasel3515
Footballguy
One of the leagues I am commissioner for has the following set up:
Starting lineup
1 QB (1 pt. for every 10 yds. passing, 4 pts. for each TD thrown, -2 for INTs, 6 pts. for rushing TDs)
2 RBs (2 pts. for every 10 yards rushing, 2 pts for every 10 yds. receiving, 6 pts. for TDs, 1 PPR)
2 WRs (same scoring as for RBs)
1 TE (same scoring as for RBs and WRs)
1 FLEX (can be a RB, WR or TE but not a second QB, PK or D/ST)
1 PK (1 pt. for PAT, 3 pts. for FGs up to 45 yds. with each extra yard being worth an additional pt.)
1 D/ST (2 pts for each sack, fumble recover, INT, 6 pts. for defensive/ST TDs, 4 pts. for safety, 15 points for shutout, less points for total points given up like 8 points for 7-13 points, etc.)
Obviously this produces some very high scores but what we've found is that the top tier of QBs, RBs and WRs are all roughly equal and even Gates can be worth the same as a top tier WR. A good score for a QB/RB/WR is 30+ points. Breakout weeks are 40 and above, with the record being around 77 points I think (that would be AP earlier this year). While in past years it seems that RBs were more likely to be the higher scorers, this year the top tier is comprised of 9 QBs, 5 RBs and 4 WRs.
Starting lineup
1 QB (1 pt. for every 10 yds. passing, 4 pts. for each TD thrown, -2 for INTs, 6 pts. for rushing TDs)
2 RBs (2 pts. for every 10 yards rushing, 2 pts for every 10 yds. receiving, 6 pts. for TDs, 1 PPR)
2 WRs (same scoring as for RBs)
1 TE (same scoring as for RBs and WRs)
1 FLEX (can be a RB, WR or TE but not a second QB, PK or D/ST)
1 PK (1 pt. for PAT, 3 pts. for FGs up to 45 yds. with each extra yard being worth an additional pt.)
1 D/ST (2 pts for each sack, fumble recover, INT, 6 pts. for defensive/ST TDs, 4 pts. for safety, 15 points for shutout, less points for total points given up like 8 points for 7-13 points, etc.)
Obviously this produces some very high scores but what we've found is that the top tier of QBs, RBs and WRs are all roughly equal and even Gates can be worth the same as a top tier WR. A good score for a QB/RB/WR is 30+ points. Breakout weeks are 40 and above, with the record being around 77 points I think (that would be AP earlier this year). While in past years it seems that RBs were more likely to be the higher scorers, this year the top tier is comprised of 9 QBs, 5 RBs and 4 WRs.
Pretty darn close to my league... and same results. Top tier QB/WR/RB are fairly even. We also play 2 QB's.
CalBear
Footballguy
It's OK that you like it the way it is, but surely you can see that people can be dissatisfied that 10 RBs are chosen in the first round (which isn't at all like the NFL) and that QB is the least important position (which is the opposite of the NFL). For that matter, NFL teams don't start two tailbacks.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
My league does 1 pt/15 yards receiving for WRs and 1 pt/20 yards rushing for RBs. RBs also get 1 pt/20 yards receiving, but it's done independent of rushing yards, rather than grouped together.
Dirk Digler
Footballguy
I play in alot of league with alot of formats. My favorite of all of them is...
QB- .05 per 1 Yd/6per TD
RB- .1 per 1 Yd/6per TD .5 PPR
WR- .1 per 1 Yd/6per TD 1 PPR
TE- .1 per 1 Yd/6per TD 1.5 PPR
K- decimile per FG (29 Yds = 2.9 pts, 51 Yds = 5.1 pts, etc...)
QB- .05 per 1 Yd/6per TD
RB- .1 per 1 Yd/6per TD .5 PPR
WR- .1 per 1 Yd/6per TD 1 PPR
TE- .1 per 1 Yd/6per TD 1.5 PPR
K- decimile per FG (29 Yds = 2.9 pts, 51 Yds = 5.1 pts, etc...)
Our league scoring is such that the QB typically scores 60% more than an RB or WR. However, you need to start more RBs and WRs. We start the following.1 QB2 RB2 WR2 Flex (RB/WR)1 TERB scarcity definitely drives up their value, but a top tier QB is very nice in this system. During the draft you have to make a decision if you want to snag a top QB early and lose RB depth, or stick with drafting RBs early and hope to find this year's breakout QB like Romo late in the draft. This year was a little strange with RBs not performing so well and some of the top WRs having great years. Loading up on RBs wasn't necessarily the bast draft strategy. This system works fine for us. I'm not saying it's perfect, but we have fun with it.
CalBear
Footballguy
What's the need for starting 2 RBs, other than "that's what we've always done?"
shakeybarn
Footballguy
RB TDs = 4pts
WR TDs = 6pts
changed it years ago, never looked back... but toned down the PPR to .2 per reception.
WR TDs = 6pts
changed it years ago, never looked back... but toned down the PPR to .2 per reception.
WiDDoW_MaKeR
Footballguy
My league gives bonus points for longer TD's. WR's are usually the one's scoring the longer TD's. 0-9 yards is 6 points, 10-39 points is 9 points, and 40+ are 12 point TD's.
This is exactly what I'm thinking. Why do you want to change the "tried and true"? I'm really surprised to see a thread like this in a down year for RB's. How many RB's are really dominating games week in and week out?My favorite scoring system is the same as above except start 3 WR, 2 RB, 0 Flex.
