Brady Quinn (1 Viewer)

[twitch]

The verification of Anderson and Frye sucking actually came from you, as referenced above. My arguement that Quinn is better than the other 2? It doesnt even seem nessecary really. But then, my last name is NOT Crennel, and Im not an offensive guru like Im sure he is, so I guess Im just not qualified (thats a sarcastic poke because we both Romeo doesnt know anymore about QBs than you or I). Ill tell you things Brady Quinn hasnt done which at the very least help him suck LESS than the other two. He didnt have anything to do with this team being 32nd or 30th in the NFL in scoring the past 2 years. He didnt have 24 turnovers or 17INTs last season. He didnt go 10 for 27 with no TDs and FOUR ints against a 4-12 team. Not much of a case is it??

Your argument then is that Frye/Anderson suck, and Quinn couldn't possibly suck MORE. So, the reason that Crennel isn't starting him is that he's an idiot.That's not a very good argument.

Who's to say that Quinn could do any better right now? He could easily go out there and throw 30 picks and no TDs. I'll take Crennel's opinion of whether Quinn would suck more than Anderson/Frye over yours. Have you considered that he might have more evidence than you?

You're just now.

No, Ive never been much for fishing. I even said as you can see that what I said wasnt really a solid take. Like I heard Pittsburgh's coach say earlier tonite in a pregame interview in that "the tape will tell the story", of course meaning we wont know until he gets a chance to play. Could he easily go out and throw 30 picks with NO TDs? Are you really saying that? And you think Im the one fishing? Cmon. Im not saying Quinn is going to step in and be an All Pro. And Im sure youll take your coach's opinion over mine. How can I debate that? But what exactly does he know about QB play? He's been a defensive coach his entire career. He's been a head coach of a horrible team for 2 years, and so for only 2 years has he been responsible for actually judging QB talent. And Im going out on a limb here and saying to this point he has not done a very good job at it. The minute he decides to make the move to start Quinn is the minute I start respecting his judgement of QB talent.

Kinda blows your "I'm here to support Romeo" argument.

No, its just part of being objective. Im anticipating his making this move and looking like a genius. Otherwise, my efforts will have all been for naught.

 

[chris1969]

so for only 2 years has he been responsible for actually judging QB talent. And Im going out on a limb here and saying to this point he has not done a very good job at it. The minute he decides to make the move to start Quinn is the minute I start respecting his judgement of QB talent.

Oh yeah, I believe you sincerity.

 

[twitch]

so for only 2 years has he been responsible for actually judging QB talent. And Im going out on a limb here and saying to this point he has not done a very good job at it. The minute he decides to make the move to start Quinn is the minute I start respecting his judgement of QB talent.

Oh yeah, I believe you sincerity.

are you telling me he's done a GOOD job with the QBs there? Seriously? like I said, Im just trying to be objective. dont confuse honesty for sincerity.

 

[Raider Nation]

Mike Holgrem, Tony Dungy, Andy Reed, BB, Jeff Fisher, Mike Shanahan.....

There may be a few more, but I actually had to think to come up with 6 guys.

STOP IT... YOU'RE KILLING ME!!!

 

[chris1969]

so for only 2 years has he been responsible for actually judging QB talent. And Im going out on a limb here and saying to this point he has not done a very good job at it. The minute he decides to make the move to start Quinn is the minute I start respecting his judgement of QB talent.

Oh yeah, I believe you sincerity.

are you telling me he's done a GOOD job with the QBs there? Seriously? like I said, Im just trying to be objective. dont confuse honesty for sincerity.

Are you telling me that there was another QB he should have started last year? He didn't draft em, he just chose which one would play. If your trying to be objective, then talk about offensive mistakes he's made in the past (he has a few to choose from) rather than say he was a defensive coordinator, so he can't make a good decision about QB. After all, your own coach who used to be a defensive coordinator made a pretty good QB decision a few years ago.This thread is edited to let the record state that Tom Brady didn't start week 1 and he did fine.

 

[chris1969]

Mike Holgrem, Tony Dungy, Andy Reed, BB, Jeff Fisher, Mike Shanahan.....

There may be a few more, but I actually had to think to come up with 6 guys.

STOP IT... YOU'RE KILLING ME!!!

OK RN start naming some coaches.You should probably start with Al Davis, he's been coaching and GM'ing the Raiders for years.

 

[twitch]

so for only 2 years has he been responsible for actually judging QB talent. And Im going out on a limb here and saying to this point he has not done a very good job at it. The minute he decides to make the move to start Quinn is the minute I start respecting his judgement of QB talent.

Oh yeah, I believe you sincerity.

are you telling me he's done a GOOD job with the QBs there? Seriously? like I said, Im just trying to be objective. dont confuse honesty for sincerity.

Are you telling me that there was another QB he should have started last year? He didn't draft em, he just chose which one would play. If your trying to be objective, then talk about offensive mistakes he's made in the past (he has a few to choose from) rather than say he was a defensive coordinator, so he can't make a good decision about QB. After all, your own coach who used to be a defensive coordinator made a pretty good QB decision a few years ago.This thread is edited to let the record state that Tom Brady didn't start week 1 and he did fine.

Im saying basically what Ive been more or less saying all along.....up until this point, he's not had the opportunity to name Brady Quinn his starting QB. Now that the opportunity is there, I just hope he makes the right choice....Belichick had some experience in making difficult QB decisions before the Tom Brady situation...in Cleveland as you know of all places. he was the one who put Bernie Kosar to rest, and I personally watched Cleveland beat New England in the playoffs one year with Testaverde at the helm. That hurt. But, no, it wasnt Bill's first rodeo when the Brady/Bledsoe situation arose.

 

[Raider Nation]

Mike Holgrem, Tony Dungy, Andy Reed, BB, Jeff Fisher, Mike Shanahan.....

There may be a few more, but I actually had to think to come up with 6 guys.

STOP IT... YOU'RE KILLING ME!!!

OK RN start naming some coaches.

It would take forever for me to name coaches I'd rather have than Crennel.So instead, here are the coaches I'd take Crennel over:

 

[chris1969]

so for only 2 years has he been responsible for actually judging QB talent. And Im going out on a limb here and saying to this point he has not done a very good job at it. The minute he decides to make the move to start Quinn is the minute I start respecting his judgement of QB talent.

Oh yeah, I believe you sincerity.

are you telling me he's done a GOOD job with the QBs there? Seriously? like I said, Im just trying to be objective. dont confuse honesty for sincerity.

Are you telling me that there was another QB he should have started last year? He didn't draft em, he just chose which one would play. If your trying to be objective, then talk about offensive mistakes he's made in the past (he has a few to choose from) rather than say he was a defensive coordinator, so he can't make a good decision about QB. After all, your own coach who used to be a defensive coordinator made a pretty good QB decision a few years ago.This thread is edited to let the record state that Tom Brady didn't start week 1 and he did fine.

Im saying basically what Ive been more or less saying all along.....up until this point, he's not had the opportunity to name Brady Quinn his starting QB. Now that the opportunity is there, I just hope he makes the right choice....Belichick had some experience in making difficult QB decisions before the Tom Brady situation...in Cleveland as you know of all places. he was the one who put Bernie Kosar to rest, and I personally watched Cleveland beat New England in the playoffs one year with Testaverde at the helm. That hurt. But, no, it wasnt Bill's first rodeo when the Brady/Bledsoe situation arose.

A Brown's fan will tell you that benching Bernie for Vinnie was a bad decision. Bernie got benched for more of a political reason. Bernie's last play as a Brown was a bomb for a TD that won the game. BB benched him because he called a play that Bernie knew wasn't gonna work and Bernie changed the play in the huddle. Bernie had changed plays in the huddle for about a week and a half before BB had enough and let him go for "diminishing skills" Everybody knew that Bernie's skills hadn't diminished. He had the same sidearm throw and poor legs as when he was drafted, but he did make pre-snap reads comparable to Peyton Manning, and enough knowledge on offense to be an OC before he was drafted. BB was trying to force Bernie to be the QB in his system rather than convert his system to Bernie. When Testaverde came in he just proved that he wasn't as good as Bernie. The fans ran BB out on a rail after that. It took the Browns a couple of years to recover on offense after BB left. Bernie never did recover as BB's label stuck with him. I still think that Bernie was the smartest QB of his time, if he had more physical ability he'd have been the greatest QB ever.

 

[chris1969]

Mike Holgrem, Tony Dungy, Andy Reed, BB, Jeff Fisher, Mike Shanahan.....

There may be a few more, but I actually had to think to come up with 6 guys.

STOP IT... YOU'RE KILLING ME!!!

OK RN start naming some coaches.

It would take forever for me to name coaches I'd rather have than Crennel.So instead, here are the coaches I'd take Crennel over:

Exactly what I expected, there are only 32 teams in the NFL and maybe a half dozen guys that could be serious candidates, rather than put yourself on record so you can get trashed like everyone else, it's easier to point fingers and duck. Let me know when you grow some gonads.

 

[mad sweeney]

I made my point, but I'll put it into simpler terms.

There is not a lot The Browns are gonna gain by playing Quinn in the first 5 weeks against some of the best defenses in the NFL, but there is a lot they can lose. A rookie QB thrown into the fray too early will develop bad habits that are often uncorrectable. If the Browns had enough around him to make a run deep into the playoffs, then I'd say yeah throw him into the fire week 1. They unfortunately are looking for at best a winning season. The plan is to give him 5 weeks to prep for what should be a cake game for him and then 2 weeks to prep for the next one. That way they can build his confidence and give him 10 games under his belt for next year when they can make a playoff run.

Of course Phil Savage should overlook all of that and start Quinn week 1 because you drafted him in your dynasty league. I don't know what he's thinking!

As I said, Im not a Browns fan. I said earlier Im a Pats fan. As such, but Im pulling for Romeo Crennel, and thus Im pulling for the Browns. For the record, Im not in any leagues this year. I have no interest in Brady Quinn's fantasy value this season. I said in my initial post that his fantasy value this season probably will be minimal. It just pains me to see him get held back because of a negative line of thinking like theyre "protecting" him from some strong defenses. Get him in there and see what he can do. Dont worry about rattling the kid's confidence simply because it didnt work out so well for Tim Couch. They need to forget about that experiment gone wrong. Couch is not even the NFL, and it wasnt meant to be for him. This kid is not losing his confidence in a few short weeks because I dont see that being part of his makeup. But the only way to find out is to get him on the field. For the record, the year the Browns drafted Tim Couch, they passed over guys like Torry Holt and Champ Bailey and Donovan McNabb and Edgerrin James and Chris McCallister and Jevon Kearse. All of these guys except Kearse went in the first 11 picks. This is a team that has had their head in the sand in many ways and drafting the wrong players has just been a part of it. Theyre finally drafting the right guys. I can see the talent improving a little with the additions of Joe Thomas and Quinn, and if they can actually keep Winslow and Edwards on the field. But they cant look back. They have to look forward. Maybe starting one of those other guys is the right call. But since when do all GMs know exactly what they are doing? These guys dont make mistakes. And who's making the calls there in Cleveland anyway? Since when does the GM determine who starts and who doesnt? If thats the case, then thats part of the problem. Savage needs to draft the players. The HC needs to actually make the decision on who plays. Savage should have nothing to do with that.

Romeo makes the call, but Phil can override Romeo's decision. So far both have said that Quinn isn't in the mix right now. If you support Romeo so much than you should support his decision.

If youre telling me his coaching decision can be overridden by a GM, then Im not sure supporting whatever decision is made is actually supporting Romeo Crennel. The mere thought of him making a choice and having it overruled is almost the definition of 'lame duck'.

Seems somewhat similar to the Vince Young scenario last year, and they gave "Lame Duck" Fisher a contract extension.

Fisher has been coaching that team dating back to Houston....something like 15 years. He's won division titles. He's been to a Superbowl. He's been a consistent winner and a consistently strong coach. He never should have been a 'lame duck' if he ever was. Romeo has coached 2 years and both years hsi teams have sucked. Lets alteast be fairly close in our comparisons.

I think I devalued the situation properly. Somewhat similar seems to imply that I do not consider the situations to be all that close. But consider:Remember the Dallas game with the cleat incident? There was a lot of talk around that time that Fisher would be gone next year and Dallas was an option. And there was also a lot of talk about the owner wanting Young in and could/would impose his will on Fisher, who didn't want to put him in until he had more experience. For a decent part of the season it was talked about and the extension didn't come around until Young not only came in but started winning. Regardless of your opinion, Fisher and lame duck came up in a lot of conversations. The difference in coaching experience is the only real difference between the two scenarios, and while that's a significant difference, the situations aren't as far apart as your snide reply implies.

 

[chris1969]

snide seems to be a good word for this guy.

 

[Raider Nation]

Mike Holgrem, Tony Dungy, Andy Reed, BB, Jeff Fisher, Mike Shanahan.....

There may be a few more, but I actually had to think to come up with 6 guys.

STOP IT... YOU'RE KILLING ME!!!

OK RN start naming some coaches.

It would take forever for me to name coaches I'd rather have than Crennel.So instead, here are the coaches I'd take Crennel over:

Exactly what I expected, there are only 32 teams in the NFL and maybe a half dozen guys that could be serious candidates, rather than put yourself on record so you can get trashed like everyone else, it's easier to point fingers and duck. Let me know when you grow some gonads.

Allow me to be more clear.

CRENNEL IS THE WORST HEAD COACH IN THE NFL.

Is that "on record" enough?

HTH

 

[twitch]

snide seems to be a good word for this guy.

Im going to try and not take this too personal from you fellas. I understand youve been thru some tough times with your team. I havent tried to be 'snide' here, but its felt almost a little nessecary at times. My fault. The pessimism has been almost overbearing. All Ive tried to do in this thread is pump up your boy Quinn a little. I havent been the one offering up the Romeo Crennel beatdown. I didtnt think much of the comparison to Fisher considering his tenure, but Ill go along with them both being on the 'hot seat'. The GM Floyd Reese ended up leaving...dont know if that factored in that situation one way or the other. But you made the point that Fisher only kept his job because Vince Young led them to something like 6 or 7 straight wins, so hopefully when Quinn eventually gets in there he can do the same. Probably not very likely, but you never know. If that's what its going to take for Crennel to keep his job, then Ill be pulling for it to happen. On Kosar, that's some intersting stuff. I didnt know the spefcifics about his benching. Here's what I do know. Belichick cut Kosar in '93. BB then took that team to the playoffs in '94 and they actually WON a playoff game with Testaverde. Playoff wins are hard to come by. Ask Denver or Dallas right now. Bill helped the Browns do that. In the meantime, Kosar went to Dallas after being cut and filled in for Aikman for a short period, helped them get to the playoffs and earned his only Superbowl ring. He gets a ring after getting cut...thats the sweetest kindof irony there is. Then he moves to (well, basically retires in ) Miami and backs up Dan Marino for the next 3 years. So, as much as Im sure he hated getting cut in Cleveland, Id say things sortof worked out for old Bernie. That team left and moved to Baltimore the year after that playoff win, so I guess the case can be made that Belichick himself may have been a 'lameduck'.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

This might help.

Savage had said the QB position was one that he would have input on but the final decision is Romeo's. From what I've seen Quinn has been sensational but with a limited playbook. His timing is a tad off. He doesn't know the entire playbook. Bottom line? He simply is not ready. Has nothing to do with his talent and for anyone who wants to argue that he should be shoved in before he's ready due to poor play by Charlie Frye, Brown's GM Phil Savage has made it unequivicably clear that poor play by Frye/Anderson will not force the Browns to start Brady before he's ready and RIGHT NOW, he's not ready to start.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/trainingcamp...tory?id=2991944

Despite Quinn's strong start, rookie likely not Browns QB in opener

Even though rookie quarterback Brady Quinn has had a solid preseason, Browns general manager Phil Savage said Saturday night that the Notre Dame product likely won't be leading the Cleveland offense in its opener on Sept. 9.

It's unrealistic for Brady to be in the mix for the opener," Savage told the News-Herald of northeast Ohio after the first quarter of Saturday night's preseason win over the Broncos...

Quinn has looked great, he's not ready. Savage has made his stance clear, he doesn't feel he's ready but he'll leave it up to Romeo to decide.Hint on how Romeo will handle it. Although Crennell has stated he won't name a starter till later for the first game, his ex-boss, Bill Parcells said he has known Romeo for 21 years and that he doesn't think Romeo would ever play a rookie QB.

The Browns season and Brady Quinn's eventual development won't be harmed if he sits out the first few games. Phil Savage has indicated that Quinn is not ready. Crennell has been tight lipped but he wants the Steelers to prepare for all three QBs but more than likely Quinn will sit until the coaches feel he's ready to start and from what I've seen the kid looks great but he's not quite there so I applaud the coaches decision.

 

[twitch]

This might help.

Savage had said the QB position was one that he would have input on but the final decision is Romeo's. From what I've seen Quinn has been sensational but with a limited playbook. His timing is a tad off. He doesn't know the entire playbook. Bottom line? He simply is not ready. Has nothing to do with his talent and for anyone who wants to argue that he should be shoved in before he's ready due to poor play by Charlie Frye, Brown's GM Phil Savage has made it unequivicably clear that poor play by Frye/Anderson will not force the Browns to start Brady before he's ready and RIGHT NOW, he's not ready to start.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/trainingcamp...tory?id=2991944

Despite Quinn's strong start, rookie likely not Browns QB in opener

Even though rookie quarterback Brady Quinn has had a solid preseason, Browns general manager Phil Savage said Saturday night that the Notre Dame product likely won't be leading the Cleveland offense in its opener on Sept. 9.

It's unrealistic for Brady to be in the mix for the opener," Savage told the News-Herald of northeast Ohio after the first quarter of Saturday night's preseason win over the Broncos...

Quinn has looked great, he's not ready. Savage has made his stance clear, he doesn't feel he's ready but he'll leave it up to Romeo to decide.Hint on how Romeo will handle it. Although Crennell has stated he won't name a starter till later for the first game, his ex-boss, Bill Parcells said he has known Romeo for 21 years and that he doesn't think Romeo would ever play a rookie QB.

The Browns season and Brady Quinn's eventual development won't be harmed if he sits out the first few games. Phil Savage has indicated that Quinn is not ready. Crennell has been tight lipped but he wants the Steelers to prepare for all three QBs but more than likely Quinn will sit until the coaches feel he's ready to start and from what I've seen the kid looks great but he's not quite there so I applaud the coaches decision.

I agree with most everything youve said here. The one disagreement I have is with what Parcells actually said. I heard him comment on this subject I believe last Monday on the ESPN pregame show, and he said something to the effect that he knows Romeo would not never start a QB who wasnt ready. I dont think he ever said Romeo wouldnt start a "rookie". Parcells himself did it with both Bledsoe and Curtis Martin and saw success, so he knows rookies are capable. Both had long careers and starting out of the gate didnt negatively affect either long term. But Romeo Crennel's his own man, and Im sure no matter how much respect of course he has for Parcells, ultimately he'll subscribe to his own good judgement. My stance here has been that while Quinn is a rookie, and as Ive said most if not all rookies are probably not fully ready for the NFL, he's still the best theyve got. Charlie Frye has led this team to 10pts in his preseason action....one FG and a Jamal Lewis TD. And his lost fumble recovered by the Chiefs actually was returned for a 56 yard TD. So, the guy has a positive net of 3 points. Three points in 3 preseason games flat sucks. A QB's job is to score points. He's completed 68% of his passes. Nice. 22 for 32. Solid. 232 yds. Not bad. One INT. One lost fumble. 3 positive points. From a starting QB? He did nothing against Detroit. 5/10 42yds and a pick. Zero points against the 2nd worst team in the league last year. I cant live with that from a starting QB. So, Quinn is not ready to be a starting QB in the NFL. I can accept that. But neither is Frye. But it wont take long for this situation to sort itself out. But Quinn has one last shot imo to earn the starting gig.....in the upcoming 4th preseason game. If he's lights out good, Romeo may just go with his gut and start him right away. He may just feel he's ready after all. Or he may just realize despite not being 'ready', he's still the best they've got. My gut tells me that's what's going to happen.

 

[Joe Bryant]

This might help.

Savage had said the QB position was one that he would have input on but the final decision is Romeo's. From what I've seen Quinn has been sensational but with a limited playbook. His timing is a tad off. He doesn't know the entire playbook. Bottom line? He simply is not ready. Has nothing to do with his talent and for anyone who wants to argue that he should be shoved in before he's ready due to poor play by Charlie Frye, Brown's GM Phil Savage has made it unequivicably clear that poor play by Frye/Anderson will not force the Browns to start Brady before he's ready and RIGHT NOW, he's not ready to start.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/trainingcamp...tory?id=2991944

Despite Quinn's strong start, rookie likely not Browns QB in opener

Even though rookie quarterback Brady Quinn has had a solid preseason, Browns general manager Phil Savage said Saturday night that the Notre Dame product likely won't be leading the Cleveland offense in its opener on Sept. 9.

It's unrealistic for Brady to be in the mix for the opener," Savage told the News-Herald of northeast Ohio after the first quarter of Saturday night's preseason win over the Broncos...

Quinn has looked great, he's not ready. Savage has made his stance clear, he doesn't feel he's ready but he'll leave it up to Romeo to decide.Hint on how Romeo will handle it. Although Crennell has stated he won't name a starter till later for the first game, his ex-boss, Bill Parcells said he has known Romeo for 21 years and that he doesn't think Romeo would ever play a rookie QB.

The Browns season and Brady Quinn's eventual development won't be harmed if he sits out the first few games. Phil Savage has indicated that Quinn is not ready. Crennell has been tight lipped but he wants the Steelers to prepare for all three QBs but more than likely Quinn will sit until the coaches feel he's ready to start and from what I've seen the kid looks great but he's not quite there so I applaud the coaches decision.

Given where they are now (not getting to see Quinn against the real defense and working with the real offense), I can see this. J