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Yes and Plexiglass has hands of a god. Once againRoll your eyes all you want, but there were several occasions last year where it looked like Eli was throwing passes at a life-size cardboard cutout of Shockey.Living in NY and watching plenty of the Giants, I've seen what good "receivers" Toomer and Dropsey are.
His parents are married?
How about a guy who has ALWAYS been the WR1 for the Steelers, taking on the double teams and opposing defense's #1 corner? He's allowed Ward to run against 2nd corners and single coverage.How about a WR who will have the respect of every defensive coordinator he faces?
Again, his per game averages equate to a 62-1050-5 season in Pittsburgh, and they are the farthest thing from a passing team in the NFL.His 8 1/4 games with Roethlisberger from 2004 extrapolated over an entire season would've given him 1270-9. And the Steelers ran the ball more than everyone but Atlanta with virtually NO passing in the 2nd halves of a few games.
You're right in that it MIGHT not equate to a top 20 fantasy season, but the odds are against you. In conventional fantasy leagues, 1000 + 6 = 136 fantasy points. That would've ranked as follows:
I don't project 1,000-6If anything, I see that as his floor for 2005 if nothing goes right for him.
I understand that Toomer has been pretty good. I never knocked him. And I only look a those game last year because Burress missed almost 5 weeks with a hamstring injury and played the first couple weeks with Maddox under center. I'll compare Manning's talent level to Roethlisberger's much more than I would Maddox's. So, when I look at only 8 1/4 games from 2004, there's a reason for it. It shows what he's capable of doing, especially if Manning improves in the least bit.
Unless you play in an 8-10 man league, even Plaxico's downside puts him in the as a #2 FF WR.
If you land WR12 and WR24, you are going to be hard pressed to win many leagues.My goal is 2 in the top 24 (12 team , start 3 WR). Im not confident Plax will finish in the top 24. I think he looks to finish ~30. This is mostly due to Plax situation and NOT ability.
Fair enough.My opinions are based primarily on past production, and now he's moving into a better situation for him.
Having held onto him before, past production goes as such: ####ty for the first two weeks...bench him, goes off for 120 and 1.... start him for another miserable to average 3 weeks where he solely costs me at least one game... bench him... goes off again and so on. You can have him.
This is the best argument i have heard against Burress, he screwed Bojang by not producing in the games he started him.
I have to laugh at this one.He played a little more than half of a season with a strong-armed QB for the first time and averaged about 20 yards per catch. You think he just started to figure out how to get open? I don't. He was always able to get open, but Maddox couldn't hit him consistently down the field. He just didn't have the arm strength to fit the ball in and relied on Ward.
Actually if Burress shows any life, I think Tiki comes out a loser, not a winner. Teams are getting away from throwing the ball to a RB, even a versatile guy like Tiki. Coughlin may want to go downfield more and that hurts Tiki and helps Plax and Shockey.
Laugh all you want, but you know there is some truth to what I am saying. But if you want to keep pumping up a guy who hasn't even averaged 1000 yards a season in his NFL career, then have it. And the reason Hines Ward always was thrown the ball more is because he is a much better wide receiver than Burress.
If you don't include his rookie season, then those are NOT career averages, merely you eliminating his worst season to try and make your argument look better.
Fine, then call the averages whatever you want. His rookie season didn't really matter much. I wonder how including Javon Walker's rookie season would impact his career average as of today.His rookie season has no bearing on how he might produce in the future. As a rookie, he wasn't a starter for most of the year and he had ligament damage in either his wrist or finger (can't remember which).
Get your facts straight.He played in 10 1/4 games. He missed 3 quarters of the game against Cincy, but it technically is a game played. He had about 50 yards in a quarter that day.
Burress started 9 games his rookie season and still only 22 catches and 273 yards. Not to mention that lovely play where he caught a ball in the middle of the field and then got up and spiked the ball when he hadn't been touched. Did he not realize he was playing tackle football?
And his career averages still aren't that good, even if you take away his rookie season. And this constant talk about him playing on a run-first team doesn't mean a lot. The Steelers were a pass-first team in 2002 AND 2003. Only when they failed to have success throwing the ball in 2003 did they revert back to being a run-first team in 2004.
Burress started 9 games his rookie season and still only 22 catches and 273 yards. Not to mention that lovely play where he caught a ball in the middle of the field and then got up and spiked the ball when he hadn't been touched. Did he not realize he was playing tackle football?
Put whatever stock you want into his rookie season. Doesn't matter to me. If you don't think the Steelers' offensive philosophy had anything to do with his production, you haven't been paying attention.
Ok, 10 1/4 games. That bumps his projection over a 16 game season to 1090, still not impressive or worth making a big deal over. That would have been 19th in the NFL.And while Maddox may not have played well weeks 1 and 2, Hines Ward seemed to still do pretty well, catching 13 balls for 250 yards and a touchdown in those two games. That is almost 20 yards per catch. Not exactly underneath stuff that Ward seems to always catch because of the presence of Burress, eh?
What you fail to understand about Ward and Burress is that Ward was in a position to always do well as Maddox's safety net. In week 1, Ward had a 39 yard catch. In week 2, he had a 58 yard catch and most of his production and the TD came after Roethlisberger came into the game (including the 58 yard catch and a 25 yard one, too)
Burress definitely wasn't the reason Ward broke out. Ward's a great player on his own. I'd have to guess that facing single coverage and the 2nd corner every week had to help a little though.Great observations Dancing Bear!! The whole Coughlin coaching point was brought up quickly and dismissed. This coach mentally broke down the Giants last year, and if you haven't noticed, Plax has the maturity of a 7 year old. He couldn't handle the Steelers not respecting his Mother's Day situation, how in the world does he handle Tom and the New York media? he chokes under pressure. Plax wasn't the reason why Ward broke out. Hines played QB in college and figured out how to find a spot in the defense. How is Plax going to a better passing offense? because the Giants running attack is not as efficient as Pitts? Plax's big year was also effected by his big 250+ yardage game against the tie with Atlanta, that is hardly where he proved his stuff. Steeler4life, I have worn the Steelers tatoo on my arm since 1988 and I love them, but Plax was not the answer. He never was a goal line threat. Plax just stretches the field and he MAY make the other guys better.
I've found two reasons to completely disregard this post.Great observations Dancing Bear!! The whole Coughlin coaching point was brought up quickly and dismissed. This coach mentally broke down the Giants last year, and if you haven't noticed, Plax has the maturity of a 7 year old. He couldn't handle the Steelers not respecting his Mother's Day situation, how in the world does he handle Tom and the New York media? he chokes under pressure. Plax wasn't the reason why Ward broke out. Hines played QB in college and figured out how to find a spot in the defense. How is Plax going to a better passing offense? because the Giants running attack is not as efficient as Pitts? Plax's big year was also effected by his big 250+ yardage game against the tie with Atlanta, that is hardly where he proved his stuff. Steeler4life, I have worn the Steelers tatoo on my arm since 1988 and I love them, but Plax was not the answer. He never was a goal line threat. Plax just stretches the field and he MAY make the other guys better.
Mine would be youI've found two reasons to completely disregard this post.Great observations Dancing Bear!! The whole Coughlin coaching point was brought up quickly and dismissed. This coach mentally broke down the Giants last year, and if you haven't noticed, Plax has the maturity of a 7 year old. He couldn't handle the Steelers not respecting his Mother's Day situation, how in the world does he handle Tom and the New York media? he chokes under pressure. Plax wasn't the reason why Ward broke out. Hines played QB in college and figured out how to find a spot in the defense. How is Plax going to a better passing offense? because the Giants running attack is not as efficient as Pitts? Plax's big year was also effected by his big 250+ yardage game against the tie with Atlanta, that is hardly where he proved his stuff. Steeler4life, I have worn the Steelers tatoo on my arm since 1988 and I love them, but Plax was not the answer. He never was a goal line threat. Plax just stretches the field and he MAY make the other guys better.
T.O. Thank you though 
He said YARDS PER COMPLETION, not attempt.
Ever think that maybe the drop in Burress' play had something to do with it. If all Burress can do is get open deep, what good is he to a team that doesn't have a great offensive line?
Right, and Ward can actually get open on short routes, which is not always as easy as it seems. Burress seemingly cannot do it consistently. And Ward is always better at making things happened after the catch.
There most certainly have been teams that used this approach when playing Pitt over the past few years! Balt inparticular would single up McAlister on Burress and use the rest of the D to stop the run game as Fanica and Co. have had very good success at getting to Ray Lewis in blockiing schemes. Burress has had a few VERY big games vs. Balt over the years due to this reason specifically.
Yards pet attempt is a lot more important than yards per completion. When Maddox was completing fewer passes, it didn't matter that his yards per completion was similar. He was a far less efficient QB.Burress didn't just forget how to play in 2003 compared to 2002. It's not that Burress can't run shorter routes, but Ward is clearly better at it and they had him and Randle El to handle that. Burress' role was to clear out the safety help and occasionally make big plays in the passing game, but the OL rarely gave those plays a chance to develop in 2003. On the few occasions it did, Maddox was so uncomfortable in the pocket that he got "happy feet" and got rid of the ball on shorter routes.
