Commissioner Collusion - what say you? - Update - I’m playing the sketchy commish in the semi’s and Thomas is out (1 Viewer)

[I Am the Stig]

Amazing to watch you guys make this stuff up.

ETA: I guess the good news is we've concluded its not collusion now that one owner is being forced to do things against his will.  Seems like the vitriol has been against the wrong owner after all.

No, he wasn’t forced to do anything he wasn’t willing to do. He is the one who wanted MT. MT was not forced upon him. 
 

This was more a situation of “would you rather” and he would rather have MT for 3 out of 4 weeks or not at all. 

 

[Sudoku_in_the_Bathtub]

Nope.

Nothing.

 

[dhockster]

The answer is blatantly obvious.

No, I don't think it is. If the condition of the trade is restricting another owner's ability to play his roster the way he wants, why does it matter what player you are restricting?

 

[acarey50]

He was forced.  How is "don't play him against me" a currency in fantasy?  Back to the other examples, could you not say "he willingly agreed to the action as a condition of the trade" if the condition of the trade was to start the Jets D every time he played against him for 5 years?  Honestly, would you be okay with this condition?

He could have said no to the deal

 

[habsfan]

This guy gets it

The issue of forced or not forced is completly irrelevant. You are arguing inside the "bubble" of collusion, as if the bubble itself isn't against any reasonable rules. It is. Influence was traded as a "sweetener" in addition to players and influence shouldn't be an accepted "currency" in any league.

 

[I Am the Stig]

Yes, he willingly agreed to the secrecy and thereby collusion that occurred. 

No disclosure was required therefor nothing was kept secret. 
 

He willingly agreed to the terms to sit MT. He easily could have passed on the trade, nothing was forced upon him. 

 

[I Am the Stig]

The issue of forced or not forced is completly irrelevant. You are arguing inside the "bubble" of collusion, as if the bubble itself isn't against any reasonable rules. It is. Influence was traded as a "sweetener" in addition to players and influence shouldn't be an accepted "currency" in any league.

While in your league such “currency” may not be allowed in this league it was not expressly forbidden. 
 

You can’t look at this as what is right or wrong in your league. What only matters is how the affected league rules are and how they will address this moving forward. 

 

[Gally]

While in your league such “currency” may not be allowed in this league it was not expressly forbidden. 
 

You can’t look at this as what is right or wrong in your league. What only matters is how the affected league rules are and how they will address this moving forward. 

There things such as intent of rules.  That matters and obviously the intent of this leagues rules were broken or there wouldn't have been the uproar and issues.  The guy lied about the condition of the trade.  That is guilt for doing something he knew was against the intent of the rules.

Not everything has to be explicitly included to be against the rules.   For example, loaning another team your players.  It has never been "expressly" written in any rule set I have ever seen but everyone knows you cannot do it.  This is the exact same issue. 

 

[ghostguy123]

There things such as intent of rules.  That matters and obviously the intent of this leagues rules were broken or there wouldn't have been the uproar and issues.  The guy lied about the condition of the trade.  That is guilt for doing something he knew was against the intent of the rules.

Not everything has to be explicitly included to be against the rules.   For example, loaning another team your players.  It has never been "expressly" written in any rule set I have ever seen but everyone knows you cannot do it.  This is the exact same issue. 

Sounds about right.

I dont think the NFL has a specific rule against pulling your pants down and urinating on the top of the pile after the play is over, but pretty sure they will throw a flag for unsportsmanlike conduct.

 

[I Am the Stig]

There things such as intent of rules.  That matters and obviously the intent of this leagues rules were broken or there wouldn't have been the uproar and issues.  The guy lied about the condition of the trade.  That is guilt for doing something he knew was against the intent of the rules.

Not everything has to be explicitly included to be against the rules.   For example, loaning another team your players.  It has never been "expressly" written in any rule set I have ever seen but everyone knows you cannot do it.  This is the exact same issue. 

Lots of things can be written to address the spirit of the unwritten rules to cover unforeseen scenarios. 
 

In fact several rules and procedures could have been put in place to prevent this type of trade from being processed. 
 

The reality this league was woefully short on rules and this is what happens. 

 

[TheWinz]

The reality this league was woefully short on rules and this is what happens. 

Owners determine how "thick" the by-laws are.  The shadier the owners, the thicker the by-laws.  And when the commish is one of the shady ones, the by-laws need to be as thick as War & Peace.

 

[TheWinz]

Sounds about right.

I dont think the NFL has a specific rule against pulling your pants down and urinating on the top of the pile after the play is over, but pretty sure they will throw a flag for unsportsmanlike conduct.

Pretty sure this is called the "Romanowski Rule".

 

[I Am the Stig]

Owners determine how "thick" the by-laws are.  The shadier the owners, the thicker the by-laws.  And when the commish is one of the shady ones, the by-laws need to be as thick as War & Peace.

How thick does a bylaw have to be to say: "All conditions of a trade beyond player currency, must be made available for league review." ?

 

[I Am the Stig]

Sounds about right.

I dont think the NFL has a specific rule against pulling your pants down and urinating on the top of the pile after the play is over, but pretty sure they will throw a flag for unsportsmanlike conduct.

And yet there are laws against exposing oneself as well as public urination. 

 

[ghostguy123]

And yet there are laws against exposing oneself as well as public urination. 

And yet in some places there are no such laws.

There are also laws against many of the things that happen on a football field.

 

[Judge Smails]

And I wasn't trying to be funny. 

There are people here that obviously know football. The board would be tons better off if people dropped this and talked about what they think players will do on the field this weekend. 

Or playoff strategies. 

Or roster management strategies. 

Or pretty much anything that can help people win at Fantasy Football.

Thanks.

I’m good with shutting it down. Have the vote and input from many people was great. It’s a 

now and doesn’t feel right to have more pages here than the chili thread 

 

[TheWinz]

How thick does a bylaw have to be to say: "All conditions of a trade beyond player currency, must be made available for league review." ?

You missed my point completely.  Show me the by-laws from any league, and I can find 10 ways to cheat that aren't listed.

 

[I Am the Stig]

You missed my point completely.  Show me the by-laws from any league, and I can find 10 ways to cheat that aren't listed.

All well. 

 

[Gally]

How thick does a bylaw have to be to say: "All conditions of a trade beyond player currency, must be made available for league review." ?

This isn't necessary and is the intent of allowing trades.  If you allow trades it is understood that all conditions of the trade must be disclosed.  That did not happen here and then was lied about.  That is why this is an issue.

 

[I Am the Stig]

This isn't necessary and is the intent of allowing trades.  If you allow trades it is understood that all conditions of the trade must be disclosed.  That did not happen here and then was lied about.  That is why this is an issue.

There was no requirement to disclose the conditions as there is no league vote on trades. 
 

Stop projecting your league rules and standards onto this league. 
 

It was a bad oversight but legal within the framework of the league. The trade would be collusion in your league. Both things can be true. 

 

[Gally]

There was no requirement to disclose the conditions as there is no league vote on trades. 
 

Stop projecting your league rules and standards onto this league. 
 

It was a bad oversight but legal within the framework of the league. The trade would be collusion in your league. Both things can be true. 

You don't need league voting to understand that all conditions of a trade must be disclosed.  

None of my leagues have trade committee but all trades must have all the conditions of a trade disclosed.  Its not expressly written in the rules but is understood by everyone that it must be done.

Two owners had a secret agreement to require one team to play a perceived inferior lineup.  That is collusion.  It is the textbook definition of collusion (regardless of their being atrade committee or not).

 

[BoerumHill]

I’m offering to Venmo the Kendall Hinton owner (#3 seed) to Flex him over Cole Beasley and Nelson Agholar. 

Am I guilty of collusion? Yes, but it’ll probably backfire. It’d still be a hilarious way to lock up 5 playoff spots for all of us with a winning record. His #6 seed opponent will likely drop into a 4-way tie at 5-7 for the last spot.   

We’re fraternity brothers from 30+ years ago, anything goes. We play to have fun. #carryon

 

[I Am the Stig]

You don't need league voting to understand that all conditions of a trade must be disclosed.  

None of my leagues have trade committee but all trades must have all the conditions of a trade disclosed.  Its not expressly written in the rules but is understood by everyone that it must be done.

Two owners had a secret agreement to require one team to play a perceived inferior lineup.  That is collusion.  It is the textbook definition of collusion (regardless of their being atrade committee or not).

I say you do and you say you don’t. That’s the beauty of different leagues with different opinions and rules. 
 

This league will decide for itself how to handle this. 

 

[TheWinz]

I say you do and you say you don’t. That’s the beauty of different leagues with different opinions and rules. 
 

This league will decide for itself how to handle this. 

Is murder illegal if you don't get caught?

 

[DropKick]

Is murder illegal if you don't get caught?

It's Sunday morning.  Shouldn't you be busy monitoring line-ups in your league?

 

[BoerumHill]

It's Sunday morning.  Shouldn't you be busy monitoring line-ups in your league?

Thank you. Gonna email my buddy I’m whupping today rn to remind him to swap out Taylor (Covid) for Fournette. Poor ******* left Duke on the bench Thursday, I’d like it to be less lopsided. He’s DFL and probably not even thinking about football today.

 

[I Am the Stig]

It's Sunday morning.  Shouldn't you be busy monitoring line-ups in your league?

We have laws against murder. We also have laws that allow killing under specific circumstances. 

There was no rule either requiring disclosure of or forbidding extra conditions on trades. 
 

 

[Gally]

I say you do and you say you don’t. That’s the beauty of different leagues with different opinions and rules. 
 

This league will decide for itself how to handle this. 

The league did decide how to handle it.  The commish stepped down and everyone has up in arms because of the secret agreement to not disclose all the trade conditions.

The requirement to disclose all aspects of a trade is not league dependent.  It is a universal understanding for all trades.  It is kind of the point of a trade - to disclose what is actually being traded.  This idea really isn't debatable.

 

[I Am the Stig]

The league did decide how to handle it.  The commish stepped down and everyone has up in arms because of the secret agreement to not disclose all the trade conditions.

The requirement to disclose all aspects of a trade is not league dependent.  It is a universal understanding for all trades.  It is kind of the point of a trade - to disclose what is actually being traded.  This idea really isn't debatable.

And The league ruled what they wanted to do. Another league may have done nothing. I’m not trying to convince you of anything and you aren’t going to change my mind. 
 

It is ok that we see this differently. 

 

[BassNBrew]

Show me the by-laws from any league, and I can find 10 ways to cheat that aren't listed.

Remind me to invite you into some of my leagues next year. 

 

[Judge Smails]

Playing the colluding commish in the semi’s and Thomas is ruled out. Karma!!!

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

Playing the colluding commish in the semi’s and Thomas is ruled out. Karma!!!

Sounds like the trade might have helped the owner make the playoffs. It seems to have worked out for them. Is that also karma? 

 

[Judge Smails]

Sounds like the trade might have helped the owner make the playoffs. It seems to have worked out for them. Is that also karma? 

Owner had division locked up and a 2 game lead for the bye before the trade. So no 

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

Owner had division locked up and a 2 game lead for the bye before the trade. So no 

OK. Hope you win.