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Conspiracy Theories (2 Viewers)

My personal opinion is that many of these are made up by the powers that be to camouflage the actual few that are true.

 
I see the newest ones surround McCain:

1. He didn’t die from cancer but committed suicide because he was headed to Guantanamo on a war crime comviction. 

2. He never had cancer and his death is faked so he can go underground to fight Trump as McCain is a key deep state figure. 

 
Ilov80s said:
I see the newest ones surround McCain:

1. He didn’t die from cancer but committed suicide because he was headed to Guantanamo on a war crime comviction. 

2. He never had cancer and his death is faked so he can go underground to fight Trump as McCain is a key deep state figure. 
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#1 is a Q thing right? Apparently it was known, down to the minute, when McCain would end his life by Q a month prior.  

 
jiffy said:
Kind of like it used to be called Global Warming, but since this didn't take off with the falsifying of data, the MSM changes it to climate changes.  I live in a climate that has four seasons, of course it is changing.
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Which banned alias are you? Pathetic

 
HellToupee said:
RFK’s assassination is a pretty fascinating one. I don’t believe it but it’s interesting 
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Have you been listening to the RFK Tapes podcast? I think the last episode drops this week, but I'm thoroughly unconvinced. Thing that really tripped my alarm bells was when they started expanding the conspiracy to explain how it was connected to JFK's murder. Isn't that always the way with conspiracy theories?  :rolleyes:

My college buddy made a really good observation once about conspiracy theories: they generally only require a single leap of logic. Once you've made that leap, everything else is perfectly logical.

 
Small-bore conspiracy theory that I (mostly) do believe in: Gillette, with its chokehold on the razor market, is not actually interested in selling you the most effective razor blades. They want you to be dissatisfied so that, when they introduce the newer, more expensive version, you'll snap it up.

Oh, one more that is definitely true: Tax prep is needlessly complicated because the big corporations like Intuit and H&R Block want to keep it that way. Think about it: You take information that the government provides you (W-2s and 1099s), enter it into a form, and then send it back to the same government. The IRS could easily fill it out for you, send you a form to accept or reject, and save the vast majority of taxpayers a lot of time, hassle and money. Except that that money all goes to an oligopoly that doesn't want the gravy train to end.

 
zftcg said:
Oh, one more that is definitely true: Tax prep is needlessly complicated because the big corporations like Intuit and H&R Block want to keep it that way. Think about it: You take information that the government provides you (W-2s and 1099s), enter it into a form, and then send it back to the same government. The IRS could easily fill it out for you, send you a form to accept or reject, and save the vast majority of taxpayers a lot of time, hassle and money. Except that that money all goes to an oligopoly that doesn't want the gravy train to end.
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I should add that the tax-prep companies' interests dovetail nicely with the agenda of the Republican party, which in addition to always bending over backwards to keep Big Business happy, prefers that Tax Day represent a hassle for the public. If all people had to do was review a sheet and sign it, it might be harder to gin up outrage.

 
zftcg said:
Small-bore conspiracy theory that I (mostly) do believe in: Gillette, with its chokehold on the razor market, is not actually interested in selling you the most effective razor blades. They want you to be dissatisfied so that, when they introduce the newer, more expensive version, you'll snap it up.

Oh, one more that is definitely true: Tax prep is needlessly complicated because the big corporations like Intuit and H&R Block want to keep it that way. Think about it: You take information that the government provides you (W-2s and 1099s), enter it into a form, and then send it back to the same government. The IRS could easily fill it out for you, send you a form to accept or reject, and save the vast majority of taxpayers a lot of time, hassle and money. Except that that money all goes to an oligopoly that doesn't want the gravy train to end.
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That's not a conspiracy theory.  They lobby for that.  It's well documented.

 
So, does not believing the "official" JFK assignation story (3 bullets, 1 shooter) mean that I believe in a conspiracy theory?

 
-fish- said:
That's not a conspiracy theory.  They lobby for that.  It's well documented.
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Conspiracy fact? I think of it as a CT in the sense that it sounds paranoid to say that a shadowy cabal of billionaires deliberately make your life more difficult so they can make more money. If we didn't have documented proof that it's true it would sound like a wacky conspiracy.

 
zftcg said:
Conspiracy fact? I think of it as a CT in the sense that it sounds paranoid to say that a shadowy cabal of billionaires deliberately make your life more difficult so they can make more money. If we didn't have documented proof that it's true it would sound like a wacky conspiracy.
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How does that sound paranoid?   Any time there's a cabal of billionaires, I assume they're trying to make my life more difficult so they can take my money.  I think it would be more crazy not to believe that.

 
matttyl said:
So, does not believing the "official" JFK assignation story (3 bullets, 1 shooter) mean that I believe in a conspiracy theory?
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Good question. 

I think you have to have an affirmative belief- in other words you have to accept one of the alternative theories. Simply being a skeptic of the facts as presented doesn’t make you a conspiracy guy, IMO. 

 
matttyl said:
So, does not believing the "official" JFK assignation story (3 bullets, 1 shooter) mean that I believe in a conspiracy theory?
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Yes.  You're in good company, though.   The poll I posted earlier shows that about 50% of Americans don't believe the official JFK assassination story.

 
timschochet said:
There is another category as well- you might call it the “false conspiracy theory.” For instance, climate change is real, yet millions of people appear to be convinced that it’s a conspiracy theory. 
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I think you are over-simplifying, even though I see your point, but don't want to hijack your new thread.

 
randall146 said:
I think a similar psychological need explains anti-immigration fever and other forms of virulent hate. People are dissatisfied with their lot and have a need to blame some other “tribe” for their woes. 
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See thats why liberals get such a bad name. No ONE is against legal immigrants. What people DON’T want is ILLEGAL migrants. Conflating the two makes you look foolish.

 
pinkham13 said:
See thats why liberals get such a bad name. No ONE is against legal immigrants. What people DON’T want is ILLEGAL migrants. Conflating the two makes you look foolish.
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I guess Laura Ingraham and President Trump look foolish as well? 

 
pinkham13 said:
Please don’t ask me to defend Trump. 
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You wrote that no one is against legal immigration. That’s simply untrue. A good chunk of the Republican Party, including the President, wants to severely restrict legal immigration and they conflate legal and illegal immigration all the time. 

 
I haven't seen any mention of my two favorite sports conspiracy theories (not saying I believe them, just that I enjoy hearing about them):

  • The NBA "froze" the Knicks' envelope in the 1984 draft lottery so that David Stern would be able to identify it, thereby ensuring Patrick Ewing went to the league's biggest market
  • Michael Jordan's first retirement in 1993 was actually a forced sabbatical due to his gambling problems
Here are some other sports-related ones.

 
pinkham13 said:
See thats why liberals get such a bad name. No ONE is against legal immigrants. What people DON’T want is ILLEGAL migrants. Conflating the two makes you look foolish.
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See that's why Trump took over the Republican party. Pro-business Establishment Republicans who thought the immigration debate was this logical thing where we could separate out the legal immigrants from the illegal, beef up enforcement against the latter, and then the whole problem would be go away were completely out of touch with what was going on in their party's base. For many people, this is a deeply visceral issue touching on cultural identity and differing visions of what "America" represents.

 
timschochet said:
You wrote that no one is against legal immigration. That’s simply untrue. A good chunk of the Republican Party, including the President, wants to severely restrict legal immigration and they conflate legal and illegal immigration all the time. 
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We should have new restrictions. Obviously, the current system is broken. That is not being against legal immigration. But thats how liberals operate. Someone says I don’t like black coffee and you turn it in to racism. Thats why the left will keep losing.

 
zftcg said:
See that's why Trump took over the Republican party. Pro-business Establishment Republicans who thought the immigration debate was this logical thing where we could separate out the legal immigrants from the illegal, beef up enforcement against the latter, and then the whole problem would be go away were completely out of touch with what was going on in their party's base. For many people, this is a deeply visceral issue touching on cultural identity and differing visions of what "America" represents.
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The media stirs this up too much. People are too touchy. You cant even say “nice dress” to someone without the worry of a sexual harrassment charge. Even legal immigrants support Trump. Why should illegals get away with it?

 
pinkham13 said:
The media stirs this up too much. People are too touchy. You cant even say “nice dress” to someone without the worry of a sexual harrassment charge. Even legal immigrants support Trump. Why should illegals get away with it?
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:confused:  

I must admit I'm at a loss for what this has to do with immigration.

 
pinkham13 said:
You said it’s a deeply visceral issue. I said the media overhypes it and people are too touchy.
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Still don't see what that has to do with sexual harassment.

In terms of immigration, I think if anything the media has historically underhyped the issue, which is why they were so surprised by Trump's win (to be fair, so was I). Members of the media tend to live in large cities where diversity is taken as a given, even celebrated. They totally missed the alienation felt by people in small, rural, previously homogeneous communities who looked up one day and saw a bunch of people in their town who didn't look, talk or act like them. When people complain about being told to press 1 for English and 2 for Spanish, it's hard to say they're only concerned with illegal immigration.

 
We lefties see the (declining) number of undocumented immigrants as a negligible issue. We mostly wonder why building a stupid wall that sends the wrong message to the world and putting the issue at the top of their lists is what concerns middle America so effing much. 

 
roadkill1292 said:
We lefties see the (declining) number of undocumented immigrants as a negligible issue. We mostly wonder why building a stupid wall that sends the wrong message to the world and putting the issue at the top of their lists is what concerns middle America so effing much. 
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Are you equally concerned about the wall seperating Palestinians? Because that’s a much more serious situation and under reported in comparison.

 
pinkham13 said:
Are you equally concerned about the wall seperating Palestinians? Because that’s a much more serious situation and under reported in comparison.
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Another odd comparison. Also apples and oranges. Whatever you think of Israeli policy, they weren't trying to stop immigration, they were trying to stop terrorist attacks. 

 
pinkham13 said:
Hmmm what about the fact that the Clintons were just as tough on immigration and Obama continued ithttps://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/08/tomdispatch-operation-streamline-immigration-enforcement-donald-trump-wall/
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Not trying to be rude, but I literally have no idea what you're talking about. Your original statement was that no one is opposed to legal immigration, only illegal, but when people tried to engage you on that issue, you veered wildly from sexual harassment to Israel to the enforcement policies of previous administrations. Maybe there's a connective thread running through all of that, but I fail to see it.

Considering that this ostensibly a thread about conspiracy theories, and there are plenty of other places on the site to discuss immigration, I'm going to bow out of this discussion.

 
pinkham13 said:
Just making the point that this whole my dad can beat up your dad stuff gets old. They are politicians and they both suck and seem to have the same agendas at their core.
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My original remark was pointing out that illegal immigration seems to be at the top of most conservatives' lists of important issues while barely registering as a problem with non-conservatives. It would be nice if you addressed that question, which is kind of an interesting one, instead of leading us on a nebulous road trip to the Holy Land.

 
roadkill1292 said:
My original remark was pointing out that illegal immigration seems to be at the top of most conservatives' lists of important issues while barely registering as a problem with non-conservatives. It would be nice if you addressed that question, which is kind of an interesting one, instead of leading us on a nebulous road trip to the Holy Land.
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I responded to it to another poster here

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/08/tomdispatch-operation-streamline-immigration-enforcement-donald-trump-wall/

The Clintons and Obamas had the same policy as Trump. 

 
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