DFS Scandals in E.F.F.E.C.T (1 Viewer)

[Apple Jack]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

What's worse is he is one of the smartest guys on this board and he is using that smart guy image to mislead people who don't know any better. Brings the credibilty of everything FBGs does in regard to DFS into question IMHO.

You guys are ridiculous.

Who needs evidence when you have speculation from such reputable sources as Ramblin' Wreck on the internet.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

I post my projections publicly. I've posted my ownership targets publicly. I've published and continue to publish my thoughts on strategy publicly. In my local league, every single person drafting with me is staring at my rankings as we draft. I built a tool to help me construct DFS lineups and then I posted it on the internet.

I have less secret FF info than anybody you've ever met.

 

[fantasycurse42]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

I post my projections publicly. I've posted my ownership targets publicly. I've published and continue to publish my thoughts on strategy publicly. In my local league, every single person drafting with me is staring at my rankings as we draft. I built a tool to help me construct DFS lineups and then I posted it on the internet.

I have less secret FF info than anybody you've ever met.

STOP CHEATING BUTTFACE!!

 

[fantasycurse42]

I need to find the post, but I said that 2015 would be a peak season for DFS. I think these cheating accusations are a little overblown, but regardless A) I think ti is gambling and will face harsher regulation B) Most users are realizing it isn't a lottery and they aren't as good as they think.

This will eventually be a group of sharks circling sharks passing money back and forth with the only real winner being the house.

 

[cheese]

No amount of research will affect my return on a given slot machine.

The expert poker player can do nothing which prevents me from completing my flush on the river.

If i invest a dollar and two hours and win $100, and another man invests 10,000 and a manmonth to win $12500, who is better off?

Was Mussolini popular at first?

A flush on the river is the same as a ball bouncing out of your WRs hands in the end zone. Good research and plan that should have worked out (probably will in long run) but bad result due to variance inherent in gambling.

 

[cockroach]

No amount of research will affect my return on a given slot machine.

The expert poker player can do nothing which prevents me from completing my flush on the river.

If i invest a dollar and two hours and win $100, and another man invests 10,000 and a manmonth to win $12500, who is better off?

Was Mussolini popular at first?

If you are arguing that DFS isn't gambling then why not compare it to the sportsbook? DFS is more like gambling on games as opposed to slot machines and poker.

Can you explain why you believe that to be true?

 

[cockroach]

B) Most users are realizing it isn't a lottery and they aren't as good as they think.

Wait, you think you have a better chance of winning $$ in the lottery than in DFS?

 

[fantasycurse42]

B) Most users are realizing it isn't a lottery and they aren't as good as they think.

Wait, you think you have a better chance of winning $$ in the lottery than in DFS?

The Draftkings marketing ploy is to make a user think they can make a lot of money playing fantasy sports. HTH

 

[massraider]

Does anyone think it shouldn't be regulated? I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

 

[Uncle Grandpa]

This will eventually be a group of sharks circling sharks passing money back and forth with the only real winner being the house.

Hopefully this occurs sooner rather than later.

 

[cheese]

Does anyone think it shouldn't be regulated? I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I don't know if I think it shouldn't be regulated, but I think regulation will accomplish nothing... So in that sense ya

 

[Leroy Hoard]

Was Mussolini popular at first?

DFS is worse than Mussolini, at least Mussolini made the trains run on time.

 

[Uncle Grandpa]

Does anyone think it shouldn't be regulated? I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I don't know if I think it shouldn't be regulated, but I think regulation will accomplish nothing... So in that sense ya

It will kill jobs. At least that's what Fox News says it will accomplish.

 

[cockroach]

B) Most users are realizing it isn't a lottery and they aren't as good as they think.

Wait, you think you have a better chance of winning $$ in the lottery than in DFS?

The Draftkings marketing ploy is to make a user think they can make a lot of money playing fantasy sports. HTH

Didn't someone's best friend's brother's cousin just win 1.2 million dollars on here? That seems like a lot of money

 

[Pipes]

No amount of research will affect my return on a given slot machine.

The expert poker player can do nothing which prevents me from completing my flush on the river.

If i invest a dollar and two hours and win $100, and another man invests 10,000 and a manmonth to win $12500, who is better off?

Was Mussolini popular at first?

If you are arguing that DFS isn't gambling then why not compare it to the sportsbook? DFS is more like gambling on games as opposed to slot machines and poker.

Can you explain why you believe that to be true?

Because it's similar analysis except with looking at individual player matchups as opposed to team matchups. I realize it's not exactly the same but alot closer than comparing it to slot machine where its completely random.

 

[snellman]

Story of a Minneapolis man who won draftkings last week.

http://www.startribune.com/twin-cities-man-s-25-online-fantasy-football-bet-earns-him-1m/335848151/

Unfortunately the headline calls it a bet. But does show that anyone can win because it doesn't sound like he played very much.

 

[Apple Jack]

I see this complaint about DK being misleading in their advertising come up here from time to time and it is utterly mind-boggling.

 

[addicted2ff]

So much fail in this thread. If anyone's actually looking for logical discussion on the matter the thread on 2+2 is much better.

 

[Fariq]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

I have questioned it for a while now. This Maurile guy is shady.

 

[tone1oc]

Pretty much every DFS schill (on twitter mainly) have come off as desperate strawmen. Who'd of thunk a group of professional gamblers who infiltrated fantasy football would be so self serving.

Not a good look and it's absolutely not helping their cause.

 

[32 Counter Pass]

No amount of research will affect my return on a given slot machine.

The expert poker player can do nothing which prevents me from completing my flush on the river.

If i invest a dollar and two hours and win $100, and another man invests 10,000 and a manmonth to win $12500, who is better off?

Was Mussolini popular at first?

If you are arguing that DFS isn't gambling then why not compare it to the sportsbook? DFS is more like gambling on games as opposed to slot machines and poker.

Can you explain why you believe that to be true?

I am of this mindset and the reason is because these are single week events making for a great deal of variance (which is a fancy way of saying luck IMO). Instead of betting on outcomes of a game, the players are betting of player performances of the game. The sharks understand this better than anyone, and mitigate the variance (luck) by entering hundreds of entries, which is what I would do if I had the financial means.

 

[Uncle Grandpa]

No amount of research will affect my return on a given slot machine.

The expert poker player can do nothing which prevents me from completing my flush on the river.

If i invest a dollar and two hours and win $100, and another man invests 10,000 and a manmonth to win $12500, who is better off?

Was Mussolini popular at first?

If you are arguing that DFS isn't gambling then why not compare it to the sportsbook? DFS is more like gambling on games as opposed to slot machines and poker.

Can you explain why you believe that to be true?

I am of this mindset and the reason is because these are single week events making for a great deal of variance (which is a fancy way of saying luck IMO). Instead of betting on outcomes of a game, the players are betting of player performances of the game. The sharks understand this better than anyone, and mitigate the variance (luck) by entering hundreds of entries, which is what I would do if I had the financial means.

It's gambling in the same way stock trading is gambling. You're placing bets on the short-term movement of assets. If enough of your assets move in the right direction, you can reap rewards. Anyone can get lucky and haphazardly pick a stock that does well one day just like any FF jamoke can accidently pick a winning team. However, to achieve long term success, you need the skill to choose the right assets and the pocketbook sufficient in size to diversify your portfolio and minimize risk.

I've used $1,000 portfolio optimization software to optimize the expected value of my positions on Fan Duel. Even that wasn't enough to be successful. I quickly realized I"m playing against guys that not only optimize the EV of their positions based on the player prices, but are using some sort of statistics algorithm on the front end to perfect the EV inputs (e.g. RB2 playing against Denver at home typically scores 8.3 points).

Unless you're extremely lucky or have the time and inclination to compete against these quants (professional gamblers and finance students in college), then there's a high probability you crap out.

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

What's worse is he is one of the smartest guys on this board and he is using that smart guy image to mislead people who don't know any better. Brings the credibilty of everything FBGs does in regard to DFS into question IMHO.

You guys are ridiculous.

Who needs evidence when you have speculation from such reputable sources as Ramblin' Wreck on the internet.

My stalker Apple Jerk is back.

 

[jonessed]

MT is really defending his cashcow in the shark pool

The idea that a firm hired by a corporation to investigate their own corporate malfeasance is "a neutral third-party" is completely absurd.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

No amount of research will affect my return on a given slot machine.

The expert poker player can do nothing which prevents me from completing my flush on the river.

If i invest a dollar and two hours and win $100, and another man invests 10,000 and a manmonth to win $12500, who is better off?

Was Mussolini popular at first?

If you are arguing that DFS isn't gambling then why not compare it to the sportsbook? DFS is more like gambling on games as opposed to slot machines and poker.

Can you explain why you believe that to be true?

I am of this mindset and the reason is because these are single week events making for a great deal of variance (which is a fancy way of saying luck IMO). Instead of betting on outcomes of a game, the players are betting of player performances of the game. The sharks understand this better than anyone, and mitigate the variance (luck) by entering hundreds of entries, which is what I would do if I had the financial means.

It's gambling in the same way stock trading is gambling. You're placing bets on the short-term movement of assets. If enough of your assets move in the right direction, you can reap rewards. Anyone can get lucky and haphazardly pick a stock that does well one day just like any FF jamoke can accidently pick a winning team. However, to achieve long term success, you need the skill to choose the right assets and the pocketbook sufficient in size to diversify your portfolio and minimize risk.

I've used $1,000 portfolio optimization software to optimize the expected value of my positions on Fan Duel. Even that wasn't enough to be successful. I quickly realized I"m playing against guys that not only optimize the EV of their positions based on the player prices, but are using some sort of statistics algorithm on the front end to perfect the EV inputs (e.g. RB2 playing against Denver at home typically scores 8.3 points).

Unless you're extremely lucky or have the time and inclination to compete against these quants (professional gamblers and finance students in college), then there's a high probability you crap out.

Your comparison to the stock market reminded me of a quote from John Maynard Keynes. It went something like "the markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent". Kinda feels like this quote can relate do the DFS industry. The vast majority of casual players with smaller bank rolls--come in--play in a market with sharks and whales--lose their bankrolls--until they are no longer solvent--while at the same time millions of advertising dollars kick in and bring in a new crop of "high hoping" dead money for the sharks and whales to feast upon. At the same time---those of which who are on the receiving end of DFS advertising dollars try to paint a picture of a market where any average Joe has a fair chance to prosper. We just had a member of the FBG try to convince us that the whales are working "harder" and it's becoming more difficult for them to win. Who cares? The market still favors the way they play and telling people otherwise is misleading at best.

 

[BassNBrew]

The Sky is Falling email sent out by DD is embarassing for everyone involved here.

This is something that I'm coming to resent -- DFS is not the basic, default kind of "fantasy football". Why are DFS and decades-old season-long leagues becoming synonymous?

Season-long leagues long predate the Internet and aren't going anywhere. Would be nice if DFS would just play in its own sandbox and be its own thing -- not 'Hey, we're a BETTER brand of 'fantasy football -- play us!'".

You guys are forgetting the big money in the FPC and other big money season long leagues. Once this gets blown up those cards will fall too. It will then cascade down to the MFL10s and may take under LeagueSafe because no one will want a public record of their home league. Remember Unlucky's leagues and the WCOFF, once congress gets involve those past failures will bubble up.

 

[eoMMan]

MT is really defending his cashcow in the shark pool

The idea that a firm hired by a corporation to investigate their own corporate malfeasance is "a neutral third-party" is completely absurd.

Well, most companies pick the CPA firm of their choice to do their audits.....this really isn't much different.

Definitely not absurd.

 

[BassNBrew]

No amount of research will affect my return on a given slot machine.

The expert poker player can do nothing which prevents me from completing my flush on the river.

If i invest a dollar and two hours and win $100, and another man invests 10,000 and a manmonth to win $12500, who is better off?

Was Mussolini popular at first?

If you are arguing that DFS isn't gambling then why not compare it to the sportsbook? DFS is more like gambling on games as opposed to slot machines and poker.

Can you explain why you believe that to be true?

I am of this mindset and the reason is because these are single week events making for a great deal of variance (which is a fancy way of saying luck IMO). Instead of betting on outcomes of a game, the players are betting of player performances of the game. The sharks understand this better than anyone, and mitigate the variance (luck) by entering hundreds of entries, which is what I would do if I had the financial means.

It's gambling in the same way stock trading is gambling. You're placing bets on the short-term movement of assets. If enough of your assets move in the right direction, you can reap rewards. Anyone can get lucky and haphazardly pick a stock that does well one day just like any FF jamoke can accidently pick a winning team. However, to achieve long term success, you need the skill to choose the right assets and the pocketbook sufficient in size to diversify your portfolio and minimize risk.

I've used $1,000 portfolio optimization software to optimize the expected value of my positions on Fan Duel. Even that wasn't enough to be successful. I quickly realized I"m playing against guys that not only optimize the EV of their positions based on the player prices, but are using some sort of statistics algorithm on the front end to perfect the EV inputs (e.g. RB2 playing against Denver at home typically scores 8.3 points).

Unless you're extremely lucky or have the time and inclination to compete against these quants (professional gamblers and finance students in college), then there's a high probability you crap out.

If your a paid FBG subscriber and stick to college football and NFL overlays you are going to make money. Maybe you should ditch your optimization software for the FBG IVCs. They seem to being performing quite well for the FBGs here that use them.

 

[BassNBrew]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

How so? MT has posted several tips on these boards that were pretty much free money to those who listened. He pointed me to 50/50 leagues that were paying 60% of the field and gpps that were only filling about 2/3s. Basically a 1000 person contest was only filling up to about 650. 250 of those were getting double their money back with the top finishers raking in nice prizes. MT could have keep his mouth shut and likely those contests would have been even easier for him to profit off of.

 

[JamieMurphy]

Does anyone think it shouldn't be regulated? I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Yes, if by regulated you mean there are laws against employees of DraftKings and Fanduel from betting on rival sites, and the passage of any insider information be punishable just as severely as insider trading on Wall Street.

 

[jonessed]

MT is really defending his cashcow in the shark pool

The idea that a firm hired by a corporation to investigate their own corporate malfeasance is "a neutral third-party" is completely absurd.

Well, most companies pick the CPA firm of their choice to do their audits.....this really isn't much different. Definitely not absurd.

There is a pretty big downside to getting caught fudging corporate financial numbers. There is no downside here. There are no regulations, no accountability. It's purely PR.Completely different.

 

[BassNBrew]

Does anyone think it shouldn't be regulated? I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Yes, if by regulated you mean there are laws against employees of DraftKings and Fanduel from betting on rival sites, and the passage of any insider information be punishable just as severely as insider trading on Wall Street.

Personally I don't see a problem with employees playing at other sites. Can't employees at MGM play at the Ceasars?

I would like to see them regulated to know that player funds are being held separate from operating funds and that they aren't using bots to fill their own contests.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

Does anyone think it shouldn't be regulated? I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Yes, if by regulated you mean there are laws against employees of DraftKings and Fanduel from betting on rival sites, and the passage of any insider information be punishable just as severely as insider trading on Wall Street.

Personally I don't see a problem with employees playing at other sites. Can't employees at MGM play at the Ceasars?

I would like to see them regulated to know that player funds are being held separate from operating funds and that they aren't using bots to fill their own contests.

Not the same thing at all. The gambling of employees at casinos is still regulated by the rules/laws of the gaming commissions of that state. Also--in a casino--you are playing against the house in most games--not against other gamblers. This is why if you count cards playing blackjack in a casino--that casino can and most likely will kick you out. Gaming commissions also regulate that there is truth in advertising. Have you been to a Vegas casino where near the slot machines they will post a percentage payout rate? The gaming commission helps regulate that these rates accurately reflect that those machines are programmed to pay that percentage out (over the lifespan of the machine). Also--casinos have to comply with rules/ordinances that gaming commissions put out. If I'm not mistaken--both Fanduel and Draftkings have language that says that they can change their terms of service at any time. Also--I'm not sure if there is any casino game where an employee would be privy to information that an average gambler in that casino wouldn't be privy to or have access to.

 

[Uncle Grandpa]

Yup. This should not be considered analogous to a casino. The stock market is much more appropriate. Markets are heavily regulated and attempt to vet unfair dealings and trading on insider information. This arena should be treated in the same manner.

 

[BassNBrew]

Yup. This should not be considered analogous to a casino. The stock market is much more appropriate. Markets are heavily regulated and attempt to vet unfair dealings and trading on insider information. This arena should be treated in the same manner.

I can go along with that. That aside, employees are not prohibited from investing in their own or competitors companies in the stock market.

 

[Uncle Grandpa]

Yup. This should not be considered analogous to a casino. The stock market is much more appropriate. Markets are heavily regulated and attempt to vet unfair dealings and trading on insider information. This arena should be treated in the same manner.

I can go along with that. That aside, employees are not prohibited from investing in their own or competitors companies in the stock market.

Passive investments, you're most likely right. Active trading of your company's or a competitor's stock by those that have access to sensitive nonpublic information would most likely be prohibited.

 

[LawFitz]

Bottom line for me is DFS should be treated like gambling. If gambling online isn't legal, neither should be DFS.

 

[eoMMan]

MT is really defending his cashcow in the shark pool

The idea that a firm hired by a corporation to investigate their own corporate malfeasance is "a neutral third-party" is completely absurd.

Well, most companies pick the CPA firm of their choice to do their audits.....this really isn't much different. Definitely not absurd.

There is a pretty big downside to getting caught fudging corporate financial numbers. There is no downside here. There are no regulations, no accountability. It's purely PR.Completely different.

So you really think this third party....independent party....would risk it's reputation and it's livelihood by possibly missing fraud or or other wrong doing solely for a quick payday from DK?

Sorry, but you are mistaken. It doesn't work that way.

 

[Squintz82]

MT is really defending his cashcow in the shark pool

The idea that a firm hired by a corporation to investigate their own corporate malfeasance is "a neutral third-party" is completely absurd.

Well, most companies pick the CPA firm of their choice to do their audits.....this really isn't much different. Definitely not absurd.

There is a pretty big downside to getting caught fudging corporate financial numbers. There is no downside here. There are no regulations, no accountability. It's purely PR.Completely different.

So you really think this third party....independent party....would risk it's reputation and it's livelihood by possibly missing fraud or or other wrong doing solely for a quick payday from DK?Sorry, but you are mistaken. It doesn't work that way.

This.

People are so incredibly delusional. These tinfoil hats are getting ridiculous.

 

[bagger]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

agree. Normally MT is very well reasoned and has valid points. This is honestly embarrassing.

 

[Apple Jack]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

agree. Normally MT is very well reasoned and has valid points. This is honestly embarrassing.

To which part are you agreeing? Because that post is way more embarrassing than anything I've seen from Maurile.

 

[cstu]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

agree. Normally MT is very well reasoned and has valid points. This is honestly embarrassing.

To which part are you agreeing? Because that post is way more embarrassing than anything I've seen from Maurile.

No offense to anyone else on the board, but I consider MT the smartest guy here. Shame to see him putting money first.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

Yup. This should not be considered analogous to a casino. The stock market is much more appropriate. Markets are heavily regulated and attempt to vet unfair dealings and trading on insider information. This arena should be treated in the same manner.

I can go along with that. That aside, employees are not prohibited from investing in their own or competitors companies in the stock market.

no but that stuff is declared. CEO has to report his holding and when he does transactions for his company

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

agree. Normally MT is very well reasoned and has valid points. This is honestly embarrassing.

To which part are you agreeing? Because that post is way more embarrassing than anything I've seen from Maurile.

LOL

 

[Apple Jack]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

agree. Normally MT is very well reasoned and has valid points. This is honestly embarrassing.

To which part are you agreeing? Because that post is way more embarrassing than anything I've seen from Maurile.

No offense to anyone else on the board, but I consider MT the smartest guy here. Shame to see him putting money first.

There is no evidence of wrongdoing. It's his business and there is a chorus of irresponsible and inappropriate accusations on his company's message board. Everything I've seen from Maurile has been reasonable and understandable. If they all remained silent there would be whining about that.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

agree. Normally MT is very well reasoned and has valid points. This is honestly embarrassing.

To which part are you agreeing? Because that post is way more embarrassing than anything I've seen from Maurile.

No offense to anyone else on the board, but I consider MT the smartest guy here. Shame to see him putting money first.

There is no evidence of wrongdoing. It's his business and there is a chorus of irresponsible and inappropriate accusations on his company's message board. Everything I've seen from Maurile has been reasonable and understandable. If they all remained silent there would be whining about that.

In my opinion--I think the only thing that Maurile is guilty of is painting an incomplete picture in order to paint the DFS landscape as a far friendlier place than it actually is. Nobody is accusing him of lying---but to me it certainly feels like a lot of facts are being left out by him--and this omission of information--is misleading in my opinion. He's tries to say that it's getting harder for the whales/sharks to win. If this is the case--please show me the breakdown of what percentage of DFS winnings are going to these high volume lineup-optimizing sharks--versus the average/good fantasy player. Let us digest those numbers to see how "hard" it is for them to win. Please tell us what percentage of DFS players actually turn a profit overall. Please show me any data that a regular/good fantasy player has a likelihood of winning in the world of DFS--like their advertisings claim. He has also referred to online poker as a "hobby" that should still be legal today. Really? So if I play poker in a casino--it's gambling--but if I play it online--it's now a "hobby". Calling it a hobby is a clear indication of self-serving semantics. How about online sports wagering---is that a "hobby" too? Not only that---I think that at this very moment in time--where any state could decide to ban or "temporarily" ban DFS--that any advice from an "authority" in the business should have a mention of saying "play DFS cautiously in these ambiguous times". Again---I want to make clear that I'm not trying to impune MT's or any of the FBG's character--as we are all self serving to a certain extent. However--I do think that painting an incomplete picture to motivate people to play DFS in these ambiguous times is worse than painting no picture at all.

 

[Apple Jack]

Something tells me you haven't read all of his posts on the subject. And I cannot believe it needs to be pointed out here of all places, but, newsflash...it's gambling. I speak for nobody but myself, but I will argue it's not in certain company because I want it to remain legal and I believe on a moral level it should remain legal. I'm not summarily an ends justify the means guy, but in this case a little white lie I can live with.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

He's tries to say that it's getting harder for the whales/sharks to win.

I didn't say that at all. I said any specific person should have a higher expected ROI if he enters just a few lineups or contests than if he enters hundreds or thousands. I'm right about that.

Is it getting harder for the sharks to win? I hope so. That's our explicit goal here at Footballguys. We want to educate the masses so effectively that the pros can't win anymore. Unfortunately, I've seen no evidence that we've succeeded. The games still seem eminently beatable to me.

He has also referred to online poker as a "hobby" that should still be legal today. Really? So if I play poker in a casino--it's gambling--but if I play it online--it's now a "hobby". Calling it a hobby is a clear indication of self-serving semantics.

It's a hobby either way. I don't see how that's debatable. Hobbies and gambling aren't mutually exclusive. (On my staff bio page, I've been listing poker as one of my hobbies for about 15 years now. How would it not be a hobby?)

 

[FairWarning]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

agree. Normally MT is very well reasoned and has valid points. This is honestly embarrassing.

To which part are you agreeing? Because that post is way more embarrassing than anything I've seen from Maurile.

No offense to anyone else on the board, but I consider MT the smartest guy here. Shame to see him putting money first.

There is no evidence of wrongdoing. It's his business and there is a chorus of irresponsible and inappropriate accusations on his company's message board. Everything I've seen from Maurile has been reasonable and understandable. If they all remained silent there would be whining about that.

In my opinion--I think the only thing that Maurile is guilty of is painting an incomplete picture in order to paint the DFS landscape as a far friendlier place than it actually is. Nobody is accusing him of lying---but to me it certainly feels like a lot of facts are being left out by him--and this omission of information--is misleading in my opinion. He's tries to say that it's getting harder for the whales/sharks to win. If this is the case--please show me the breakdown of what percentage of DFS winnings are going to these high volume lineup-optimizing sharks--versus the average/good fantasy player. Let us digest those numbers to see how "hard" it is for them to win. Please tell us what percentage of DFS players actually turn a profit overall. Please show me any data that a regular/good fantasy player has a likelihood of winning in the world of DFS--like their advertisings claim. He has also referred to online poker as a "hobby" that should still be legal today. Really? So if I play poker in a casino--it's gambling--but if I play it online--it's now a "hobby". Calling it a hobby is a clear indication of self-serving semantics. How about online sports wagering---is that a "hobby" too? Not only that---I think that at this very moment in time--where any state could decide to ban or "temporarily" ban DFS--that any advice from an "authority" in the business should have a mention of saying "play DFS cautiously in these ambiguous times". Again---I want to make clear that I'm not trying to impune MT's or any of the FBG's character--as we are all self serving to a certain extent. However--I do think that painting an incomplete picture to motivate people to play DFS in these ambiguous times is worse than painting no picture at all.

I'm no shark (play 3-5 lineups/week). I do believe it is harder for the longtime sharks to win because there are more people doing the same thing. You are bombarded by fantasy info at every turn. It reminds me of the wild west of internet gambling in the early 2000's. The sharks/books were making money hand over fist. The vast amount of info on every team did help the smaller player some. If people believe that all they can win $1 mil by submitting a lineup - thats true, I just don't like your chances. Where easy money can be made, the squares will follow. Some will evolve into winners thru trial and error.

 

[cockroach]

The way MT is defending The scandal here makes me wonder if FBG or others with a large financial stake in those companies don't have insider access to data the average user doesn't have. Because MT is certainly being disingenuous with his claims about the big fish in DFS.

agree. Normally MT is very well reasoned and has valid points. This is honestly embarrassing.

To which part are you agreeing? Because that post is way more embarrassing than anything I've seen from Maurile.

No offense to anyone else on the board, but I consider MT the smartest guy here. Shame to see him putting money first.

There is no evidence of wrongdoing. It's his business and there is a chorus of irresponsible and inappropriate accusations on his company's message board. Everything I've seen from Maurile has been reasonable and understandable. If they all remained silent there would be whining about that.

In my opinion--I think the only thing that Maurile is guilty of is painting an incomplete picture in order to paint the DFS landscape as a far friendlier place than it actually is. Nobody is accusing him of lying---but to me it certainly feels like a lot of facts are being left out by him--and this omission of information--is misleading in my opinion. He's tries to say that it's getting harder for the whales/sharks to win. If this is the case--please show me the breakdown of what percentage of DFS winnings are going to these high volume lineup-optimizing sharks--versus the average/good fantasy player. Let us digest those numbers to see how "hard" it is for them to win. Please tell us what percentage of DFS players actually turn a profit overall. Please show me any data that a regular/good fantasy player has a likelihood of winning in the world of DFS--like their advertisings claim. He has also referred to online poker as a "hobby" that should still be legal today. Really? So if I play poker in a casino--it's gambling--but if I play it online--it's now a "hobby". Calling it a hobby is a clear indication of self-serving semantics. How about online sports wagering---is that a "hobby" too? Not only that---I think that at this very moment in time--where any state could decide to ban or "temporarily" ban DFS--that any advice from an "authority" in the business should have a mention of saying "play DFS cautiously in these ambiguous times". Again---I want to make clear that I'm not trying to impune MT's or any of the FBG's character--as we are all self serving to a certain extent. However--I do think that painting an incomplete picture to motivate people to play DFS in these ambiguous times is worse than painting no picture at all.

This is what you've got? MT is a bad guy misleading people because he called DFS a hobby?!?!?! FFS

And people actually like and agree with this POV?